they lie? and we're suprised because? in http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r17795086 en Sun, 29 Nov 2009 04:35:53 EDT Sun, 29 Nov 2009 04:35:53 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17806610 vpoko :
said by xsiddalx See Profile :

Again, can you clarify what the business classification have to do with broadband deployment?
Sorry if I was unclear. A corporation is a practical way to have a business with a large number of partners (investors). Corporations are able to to raise capital by selling stock (bringing more partners into the mix by giving them an ownership stake). Without that mechanism, the only way to raise capital would be to borrow (bonds), and for the large investments needed for infrastructure, companies need all the capital they can get. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17806610 Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:15:14 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17805342 xsiddalx :
said by vpoko See Profile :

said by xsiddalx See Profile :

Why do you believe Corporations are necessary for broadband?
Corporations exist so that lots of people can pool their resources into a business entity. Can you imagine a single person, or even a small partnership, being able to raise capital to build infrastructure? I'll be the first to say that there are lots of imperfections and abuses in our corporate system that need to be addressed, but saying we're anti-corporate while using corporations' services is like a 4-year old saying they're anti-parents.
I can imagine anyone building capital, Corporations are necessary to raise venture capital, but I will not deny that they might be a necessity for reasons other than a profit producing product.

Nevertheless, anyone can build infrastructure. Why can't any of your examples make a go at it? Does incorpration have a magic "profitability" wand?

I think I messed up my quoting...button....are you sure you aren't responding to my quote? Interestingly enough, you seem to lean on the "corporation" as a saviour as much as the original poster used "anti corporation". Both examples are 4 or 50 year old "anti-parents".

Again, can you clarify what the business classification have to do with broadband deployment?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17805342 Sat, 10 Feb 2007 00:27:47 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17802469 bmn :
said by halfband See Profile :

said by bmn See Profile :

"It takes money, to make money."
Absolutely true. The trick of course is to borrow someone elses money to do it. That is where the investors come in.
Vicious circle... :) Just got to remember, how many low income people have credit ratings that give them oppurtunity to get loans for investments, etc. ?
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Prove it...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17802469 Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:58:46 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17797876 vpoko :
said by xsiddalx See Profile :

Why do you believe Corporations are necessary for broadband?
Corporations exist so that lots of people can pool their resources into a business entity. Can you imagine a single person, or even a small partnership, being able to raise capital to build infrastructure? I'll be the first to say that there are lots of imperfections and abuses in our corporate system that need to be addressed, but saying we're anti-corporate while using corporations' services is like a 4-year old saying they're anti-parents.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17797876 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 19:26:23 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17797261 xsiddalx : Why do you believe Corporations are necessary for broadband?

As for the good/evil debate...it is debatable and not really related to broadband...

If there were NO corporations, there would be NO broadband. It's not corporations that are evil to you, it's the whole notion of business. After all, a rich person can go into business and make themselves richer without needing to incorporate.
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17797261 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 17:54:54 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17796826 halfband :
said by bmn See Profile :

"It takes money, to make money."
Absolutely true. The trick of course is to borrow someone elses money to do it. That is where the investors come in.
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Registered Bandwidth Offender #40812]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17796826 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 16:37:27 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17796493 Nuts : they can also end up totally broke also. :p]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17796493 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 15:47:20 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795977 bmn :
said by halfband See Profile :

Of course if the poor owned the corporation, they would become the rich through the profits of the corporation. In the US you are supposed to be able to get your slice of the pie by buying your part of the corporations in the stock market.
Yeah, but I think they've got things like health care, eating their next meal and such on their mind first, so investing in the stock market isn't exactly a luxury for most for most of them. Like the old saying goes...

"It takes money, to make money."
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Prove it...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795977 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 14:08:34 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795873 bmn : If you change the cloths and modernize the implements and tools the people are each carrying, it can likely be shown that such a structure exists...

You can call it propaganda all you want. The structure is aptly constructed, albeit somewhat exaggerated, unless you can point out an error someplace in there.

And this comes from some one who isn't a Marxist.
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Prove it...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795873 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 13:48:24 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795316 vpoko :
said by karlmarx See Profile :

Of course the megacorps are going to lie about it. For them, the ONLY thing that matters is to provide the least amount of service, at the highest price they can charge. Look at comcast, the so called 'BMW' of internet access. Comcast is a rip-off by any measure. Compare the 65.00 comcraptic access charges vs the 29.00 100mb full duplex charges overseas. Comcast rapes the customer BECAUSE THEY CAN. A corporation is not a living, breathing person. A corporation is a mindless construct of pure evil, whose sole purpose is to take from the poor, and give to the rich. It's high time we stop listening to the lies and half-truths these bastards keep crying, and FORCE them to work for the COMMON GOOD. That's what the FCC's original mandate was, but it's been corrupted by corporate greed and malfeasance
If there were NO corporations, there would be NO broadband. It's not corporations that are evil to you, it's the whole notion of business. After all, a rich person can go into business and make themselves richer without needing to incorporate.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795316 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 12:26:53 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795303 TKJunkMail :
said by karlmarx See Profile :

A corporation is a mindless construct of pure evil, whose sole purpose is to take from the poor, and give to the rich.
LOL. You should learn some new Marxist propaganda. [att=1]Your usual sayings are tiresome and old fashioned quotes from 100 yrs ago.
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]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795303 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 12:24:19 EDT Re: they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795165 halfband :
said by karlmarx See Profile :

Comcast is a rip-off by any measure. Compare the 65.00 comcraptic access charges vs the 29.00 100mb full duplex charges overseas.
I think you will find the $29 for 100mb systems are subsidised. Infrastructure is not free, somebody paid for or invested money to put it up.

said by karlmarx See Profile :

Comcast rapes the customer BECAUSE THEY CAN. A corporation is not a living, breathing person. A corporation is a mindless construct of pure evil, whose sole purpose is to take from the poor, and give to the rich.
You give the corporations too much credit. They are generally truly mindless single purpose entities. But they are not inherently evil, they just act in an evil manner in a competitive environment. They are not out to take from the poor and give to the rich, they would willingly take from the rich an poor alike. Of course if the poor owned the corporation, they would become the rich through the profits of the corporation. In the US you are supposed to be able to get your slice of the pie by buying your part of the corporations in the stock market.
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Registered Bandwidth Offender #40812]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795165 Thu, 08 Feb 2007 12:01:16 EDT they lie? and we're suprised because? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17795086 karlmarx : Of course the megacorps are going to lie about it. For them, the ONLY thing that matters is to provide the least amount of service, at the highest price they can charge. Look at comcast, the so called 'BMW' of internet access. Comcast is a rip-off by any measure. Compare the 65.00 comcraptic access charges vs the 29.00 100mb full duplex charges overseas. Comcast rapes the customer BECAUSE THEY CAN. A corporation is not a living, breathing person. A corporation is a mindless construct of pure evil, whose sole purpose is to take from the poor, and give to the rich. It's high time we stop listening to the lies and half-truths these bastards keep crying, and FORCE them to work for the COMMON GOOD. That's what the FCC's original mandate was, but it's been corrupted by corporate greed and malfeasance
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