morbo
Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000
clubs: | reply to Maxo
Re: Would you like an extended warranty with your DSL?
my mistake. they should have to provide unlimited support for their product. anything else, i can understand making people pay something. however, i think a pay per use model is better for consumers. |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
 ·Embarq
| said by morbo  :my mistake. they should have to provide unlimited support for their product. Agreed. |
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Camelot One
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Sarasota, FL
clubs:
| reply to morbo
If you've ever had the misfortune of having to call Verizon tech support, the first thing you'd know is that they try to find ANYTHING else to blame the problem on, just to get you off the phone. "What, you have a router...we don't support that, even though you are sure the DSL modem is the problem. Goodbye"
I see this as a way to force people to pay more just to get a straight answer out of them.
But even if that isn't the case......anyone who has ever dealt with Verizon's DSL Tech Support think you want to subject yourself to them troubleshooting other hardware issues? If you think GeekSquad is bad.......
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AMD X2 4800+ @2700Mhz/ MSI K8N Neo 4 Platinum SLI/ 4x 1024Mb Corsair XMS PC4000/ WD 74Gb Raptor/ PNY 7800GTs SLI/ Antec 550 True Control/Custom water cooler |
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ph03n1x
join:2003-02-15
Sanford, FL
| reply to morbo
said by morbo :my mistake. they should have to provide unlimited support for their product. Having worked in technical support for nearly 10 years now, I am forced to strongly disagree with this statement. Especially in regards to ISP technical support. Service prices have come down so much and technical support is so expensive that ISPs dont start making a profit on a good customer until after having their service for 6 months. Each call to tech support on average costs the company $8-10. So frequently I've seen people who call in two to three times per month becuase their service stops working. All it takes each time is to powercycle the modem or router. at $25 per month if you call in 3 times, the chances of an ISP making a profit on your account are erased. This same issue occurs for hundereds of users. I feel that ISPs should have the right to limit what they support, especially for customers who are chronic callers who dont seem to learn. |
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morbo
Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000
clubs: | then the ISPs should educate users of their service OR charge more for what they are providing.
it's not my problem that they aren't doing the things needed to make a profit for 6 months. |
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Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA | Not to mention they SHOULD be providing that support if you have to power cycle your modem 2-3 times a month. Wtf is that? The only time you should have to power cycle is to update the MAC address for the directly connected device. 2-3 times?! |
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ph03n1x
join:2003-02-15
Sanford, FL
| reply to morbo
said by morbo :then the ISPs should educate users of their service OR charge more for what they are providing. it's not my problem that they aren't doing the things needed to make a profit for 6 months. I believe you misunderstand my point. Firstly, educating customers who cant even fathom how to navigate their Start Menu on even the basic functions of an ethernet device let alone anything about their computer is nigh on impossible. Customers want everything for nothing, but in general are not willing to pay attention or learn. Customers want competition which includes lower prices but arent willing to understand the business aspect of how extreme competition can affect changes to the service provided. |
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ph03n1x
join:2003-02-15
Sanford, FL
| reply to Ahrenl
We're talking about customers who run their modem and router through extension cables, 30-50 foot phone cables, daisy chain dsl filters, or generally hose up the way things are supposed to be connected in hundereds of unimaginable ways. Ethernet devices are solid when they are used properly. However, they are also fairly sensitive electronics. Power fluctuations because they are using a cheap-o Walmart power strip or a 30 foot power extension cable can cause you to have to powercycle. Signal fluctuations because your cable is too long from the wall to the modem or it's looped up in 30 coils can cause the signal to generate it's own EMI. In these cases, the lights on the modems dont normally change, everything looks good, but the connection is still dorked. These situations require powercycling frequently unless they are corrected. What my point is is that at least 85 - 90% of the calls I've ever gotten at an ISP help desk are user error not service error. This gets expensive for companies because customers dont want to learn. The onus for correcting these types of problems should be on the customer because they should bother to learn at least a little bit about what they are dealing with first before subscribing. |
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morbo
Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000
clubs:
 ·Charter Pipeline
·AT&T Southwest
| reply to ph03n1x
No, I understood your point. I stand by my earlier comment that the burden is on the ISP to either price the product/service correctly, considering that there is a range of users, including those extremely ignorant of all things internet, AND/OR educate users on what to do.
This trend by corporations to try and nickle and dime consumers to death is not a welcome change. It is particularly disturbing that this trend seems to be encroaching more and more into everyday life. |
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ph03n1x
join:2003-02-15
Sanford, FL
| said by morbo :No, I understood your point. I stand by my earlier comment that the burden is on the ISP to either price the product/service correctly, considering that there is a range of users, including those extremely ignorant of all things internet, AND/OR educate users on what to do. I suppose we must agree to disagree. I feel that the onus of learning what is supported by whom and what kind of problems are caused by what should be on the customer. While I agree that companies want to nickel and dime, it's unrealistic in the current market to price a service correctly based on it's cost. There is a larger attitude, at least in the USA of people feeling entitled to everything for nothing and being unwilling to learn anything about what they are buying. Everything starts at a loss to be competitive. To do otherwise would mean internet service would be $50-60 a month (a decent starting point if you consider the $10 per tech support call cost) still for basic speeds. If a company priced their service at this rate, say for a 1.5 line, then they would not have very many subscribers. |
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guitarzan
Premium
join:2004-05-04
Skytop, PA
·epix
| reply to Camelot One
Hello DSL Tech support? Yes: On a tracert, I have ping times of 500+ ms on the tenth hop and plenty of lag.
Tech support agent: Sorry there is nothing we can do, it's outside our network. Please hold while I transfer you to our billing department. Cha-Ching. 
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Its the Democrats fault. In fact it is the Speaker of House Polosi fault. Everything is the Democrats fault. Everything. Just like Everything was the Republicans Fault when they were in power. |
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ipsofacto
@swbell.net | reply to Camelot One
If verizon didnt outsource the work to telvista, where the draconian management insists you have your calls finished in 12 minutes . You might have 1/2 a chance at getting quality support |
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ipsofacto
@swbell.net | reply to guitarzan
and that rep is absolutely correct. there is NOTHING they can do. Pay for a t1 connection then you can expect anything other then entertainment value connection |
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morbo
Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000
clubs:
·Charter Pipeline
·AT&T Southwest
| reply to ph03n1x
I guess we do agree to disagree.
If products or services cannot be priced correctly based on cost, then those companies will go out of business and those services will not or should not be provided. Capitalism, eh?
There is a personal entitlement issue in the USA, but I don't see it in this case. If anything, I see your view as a corporate entitlement issue. Your position comes off as Corporations are unable to price correctly due to over demanding consumers. In reality, DSL and cable internet are huge cash cows for these corporations. I don't for one minute feel that I should feel like I should pay more for these services. It's like feeling sorry for the poor car salesman that is only making $2500 commission off my new car versus $2800. Enough profit is being made that the issue isn't relevant.
Obviously, if my ISP has to raise the price to stay in business or because they feel that they have consumers on hook (common with cable tv), I, as a consumer, decide if I want to stay with that provider or go to another, if there is even an option.
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notwrth10
join:2007-03-03
1001EB
| reply to guitarzan
Depending on what the 10th hop is or who owns it you might deserve to be billed. Ever thought about bothering the hop owner instead of your tech support?
"Were sorry you have 500+ms pings to glbx.net, how is this verizon.net's problem?"
For you we decided you should pay $85 a month with a $100 fine for innudating tech support with a useless question (depending on hop domain name as proof). |
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notwrth10
join:2007-03-03
1001EB
| reply to morbo
said by morbo :then the ISPs should educate users of their service OR charge more for what they are providing. Can I have some of what you smoke? apparently that's some really good stuff! Send me an IM on the price please!
said by morbo :it's not my problem that they aren't doing the things needed to make a profit for 6 months. Ok why is it an ISP's problem if you decide to plug in a router between you and your cable/dsl modem and can't get on the internet? Then the audacity to expect the ISP's tech support to help you fix the problem?
Yea You should pay, no questions asked. I still think computers should be like cars and drivers licenses should be issued. Fines for innundating the wrong/incorrect tech support. |
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guitarzan
Premium
join:2004-05-04
Skytop, PA
·epix
| reply to ipsofacto
said by ipsofacto :
and that rep is absolutely correct. there is NOTHING they can do. Pay for a t1 connection then you can expect anything other then entertainment value connection
Even with a T-1 or T-3 connect, outside the network, there is nothing which can be done to remedy the latency. You and the rep would be absolutely correct in that situation.
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Its the Democrats fault. In fact it is the Speaker of House Polosi fault. Everything is the Democrats fault. Everything. Just like Everything was the Republicans Fault when they were in power. |
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sivran
Long Live The Suite
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Arlington, TX
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to ph03n1x
Ten years?! Good god man (or woman), tell me you haven't spent all of that time on the phone. You must be a supervisor now, right?
Oh, I used to do Verizon tech support. DSL. Then FIOS. FIOS was quite a bit easier to support.
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Think outside the fox...Seamonkey |
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guitarzan
Premium
join:2004-05-04
Skytop, PA
·epix
| reply to notwrth10
said by notwrth10 :Depending on what the 10th hop is or who owns it you might deserve to be billed. Ever thought about bothering the hop owner instead of your tech support? Paying the $10.00 extra per month is as useful as calling the tenth hop owner and secondly I know better than to call tech support, because of an congested or bottle necked router outside of Verizon's network. I should bill you $10.00 for assuming I didn't know that.
said by notwrth10 :"Were sorry you have 500+ms pings to glbx.net, how is this verizon.net's problem?" Its not, however I would be willing to wager many DSL users, will in fact call tech support for that very issue, thinking the extra $10.00 paid will fix the lag.
said by notwrth10 :"For you we decided you should pay $85 a month with a $100 fine for innudating tech support with a useless question (depending on hop domain name as proof) I have decided you shall be billed a $200 fine for missing the sarcasm of my post.... Pay up... Cha-Ching $$$$$$$$ :P
Earning a living as a call center tech support agent must be hell.
BTW: Its an extra $25 for misspelling inundating... Cha-Ching
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Its the Democrats fault. In fact it is the Speaker of House Polosi fault. Everything is the Democrats fault. Everything. Just like Everything was the Republicans Fault when they were in power. |
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ph03n1x
join:2003-02-15
Sanford, FL | reply to sivran
No, I've only spent about 4.5 of those years on the phones. Moved back and forth between different positions. Back on the phones now for awhile since I switched jobs to work directly for a telco instead of for a crappy outsource outfit. |
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