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Geebo

join:2004-10-18
Fort Wayne, IN
reply to rodrod5

Re: Vonage needs to realize

You don't get it ....huh.?? how about saving lots of money while getting more phone features.

rodrod5

join:2001-02-28
Houston, TX

1 recommendation

well i just never got real excited about a "feature filled phone"

I just like to pick it up and make a few calls.....sometimes im even ok when it rings

If my residence was a business then im sure I would need many more features on a phone.....many more than vonage would deliver.....and with much more reliability...and I would be willing to pay a bit more for that

as for a home phone....just don't need "features".....I have enough other cool crap to learn about than a phone

Enlightener

join:2006-01-28
Cedar Park, TX

3 recommendations

Here is why I think VoIP is a very big deal... It has nothing to do with saving $20/mo.

If you go back to networking 101, there are three basic types of networks: Circuit Switched, Packet Switched and Mail Switched ( Any one here remember Fidonet?? )

POTS/PSTN used to be all circuit switched. Now the backbone is primarily packet switched providing virtual circuits. But the individual lines from the CO/RT to the house are still circuit switch.

VoIP extends this concept by basically turning the phone line from a circuit to an application session. In turn this abstraction allows the phone to run as a service over a generic dumb fat pipe just like any other application you use.

This is a big deal because we are seeing all our various applications ( IPTV for one ) all converge over a single package based network. In the long run I think this is a very big deal and very important to how we design our networks in the future. One big network instead of dedicated silo'd networks that can't interop.

The phone companies hate this because they aren't sure how to base a business model on it, but it's going to happen anyways. There are just too many reasons to go this way


Derspankster
Premium
join:2003-02-12
Marion, OH
reply to Geebo
said by Geebo:

You don't get it ....huh.?? how about saving lots of money while getting more phone features.
Skype is even cheaper.
--
I thought I made a mistake once but I was wrong


Chinabound
Premium
join:2002-12-21
Antioch, IL
kudos:3
reply to rodrod5
said by rodrod5 :
.....sometimes im even ok when it rings
The sentence of the century.


La Luna
RIP Lisa
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
kudos:3

1 edit

2 recommendations

reply to rodrod5
said by rodrod5:

well i just never got real excited about a "feature filled phone"

I just like to pick it up and make a few calls.....sometimes im even ok when it rings

If my residence was a business then im sure I would need many more features on a phone.....many more than vonage would deliver.....and with much more reliability...and I would be willing to pay a bit more for that

as for a home phone....just don't need "features".....I have enough other cool crap to learn about than a phone
It's not about "learning the phone", whatever that means. My Vonage line works just like any other phone. The service has been rock solid for the 3 years I've had it. Of course, it's dependent on the quality of internet service, but if that's good (which mine is), most people have no issues. Cell phones provide backup for that rare internet or power outage.

In addition to what Enlightener See Profile said, it's also about cost. Maybe YOU don't make a lot of long distance calls that providers like Verizon charge an arm and a leg for, but many of us do. Before I got Vonage, my phone bill was running, at a minimum, anywhere from $250-$300 per MONTH from LD calls to the UK. I got Vonage, paying about $32/Mo. (including taxes) for the unlimited plan and my bill dropped to 1/3 of what it was. Then Vonage started including Europe in their calling area for free and it dropped to the base rate of $32.....for the same amount of calls.

There's no way traditional POTS providers can, or would even want to, compete with that. And don't they know it. This isn't about patent infringement, that's only the excuse. It's about killing competition that Verizon can't compete with.
--
~~"As long as America is an infidel enemy, terrorizing it is a duty." Sayed Imam Abdul-Aziz el-Sheriff~~



Jeffrey
Connoisseur of leisurely things
Premium
join:2002-12-24
Long Island
kudos:3
Reviews:
·voip.ms
·Verizon FiOS
·Vonage
reply to Enlightener
said by Enlightener:

Here is why I think VoIP is a very big deal... It has nothing to do with saving $20/mo.

If you go back to networking 101, there are three basic types of networks: Circuit Switched, Packet Switched and Mail Switched ( Any one here remember Fidonet?? )
Every once in a while, someone here will mention something about the 'old days' that really gives me a good flashback. A few months ago, someone mentioned the term "US Robotics Host Dual Standard" which really threw me back a number of years for a few seconds. Today, you mentioned Fidonet, which I haven't heard in a long time. Excercise for the brain, I love it.
--
"When you get lost in your imaginatory vagueness, your foresight becomes a nimble vagrant."

[Ramblings] [RIP Millie 1993-2006]


CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County
reply to rodrod5
I certainly understand the feeling as well. To get decent VOIP I would have to upgrade my DSL and spend more money per month, then I would have to get a UPS to keep the router and VOIP hardware running during a power outage (hopefully it is short) and heaven forbid my CLEC has any issue that causes the line to go down (luckily only down for a total of 2 weeks right after 9/11/01 - but the possibility is there) and then I personally do NOT trust the 911 service as well and with 2 young kids - that is a deal breaker for me.

Not to mention - I would not save huge amounts - we don't do a lot of long distance calling and if I do then it is on the cell.

I personally don't want everything running where one point of failure takes everything out. While the internet is stable - not all of the ISP's, ILEC/CLEC's are and hardware issues will happen...
--
Brian

"Some people are like Slinkies...
Not really good for anything......
But they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down a flight of stairs."


calvoiper

join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA
When, oh when, are people going to learn that the world is not JUST ABOUT THEM?

All this "I see no need for Vonage" talk reminds me of the wife of a former colleague who said "I don't see why all the guys are so excited about the first Home Depot to open in town. Alfred at the hardware store sells me all the nails I need...."

You want to keep paying too much for century old technology? Fine. Quit bitching about the rest of us who prefer to drive modern cars instead of Model T's.

calvoiper
--
VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies!

gh4456
Premium
join:2004-04-07
Beverly Hills, CA
reply to Enlightener
Actually,

Embarq is pushing for all packet switched lines. Currently there are over 1 million access lines in the network that are completely packet switched.


CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County
reply to calvoiper
I was not "bitching' about anyone...

rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
reply to CylonRed
I hear the UPS thing all the time. If you have a cell phone, quit worrying about power outages. In fact, I'll bet a lot of people don't even realize that their POTS lines work when the power goes out. Why? Cordless phones don't work without power.

What I'd really like is for WiMax to eliminate the last mile physical connection. Imagine having video, network and voice with no wires or fiber. Now imagine how that would potentially create competition like never before.


RadioDoc
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
La Grange, IL
kudos:2

1 recommendation

said by rradina:

Imagine having video, network and voice with no wires or fiber. Now imagine how that would potentially create competition like never before.
Now imagine how that would potentially create congestion like never before.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange.


CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County
reply to rradina
said by rradina:

I hear the UPS thing all the time. If you have a cell phone, quit worrying about power outages. In fact, I'll bet a lot of people don't even realize that their POTS lines work when the power goes out. Why? Cordless phones don't work without power.

What I'd really like is for WiMax to eliminate the last mile physical connection. Imagine having video, network and voice with no wires or fiber. Now imagine how that would potentially create competition like never before.
It mainly goes back to 911 - I trust cell 911 and VOIP 911 and that is of utmost importance to me. Main reason we have one regular phone is to use during a blackout. Cell is somewhat limited - there are areas still where cells still don't work great with poor/no signal so for me - that is not a great solution.
--
Brian

"Some people are like Slinkies...
Not really good for anything......
But they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down a flight of stairs."

dentman42
Premium
join:2001-10-02
Columbus, OH
reply to Chinabound
said by Chinabound:

said by rodrod5 :
.....sometimes im even ok when it rings
The sentence of the century.
I hate when it rings. But then again, working in a call centre can do that to ya...

dentman42
Premium
join:2001-10-02
Columbus, OH
reply to calvoiper
said by calvoiper:

When, oh when, are people going to learn that the world is not JUST ABOUT THEM?

All this "I see no need for Vonage" talk reminds me of the wife of a former colleague who said "I don't see why all the guys are so excited about the first Home Depot to open in town. Alfred at the hardware store sells me all the nails I need...."

You want to keep paying too much for century old technology? Fine. Quit bitching about the rest of us who prefer to drive modern cars instead of Model T's.

calvoiper
So you're saying Home Depot is new technology?

dentman42
Premium
join:2001-10-02
Columbus, OH
reply to CylonRed
said by CylonRed:

said by rradina:

I hear the UPS thing all the time. If you have a cell phone, quit worrying about power outages. In fact, I'll bet a lot of people don't even realize that their POTS lines work when the power goes out. Why? Cordless phones don't work without power.

What I'd really like is for WiMax to eliminate the last mile physical connection. Imagine having video, network and voice with no wires or fiber. Now imagine how that would potentially create competition like never before.
It mainly goes back to 911 - I trust cell 911 and VOIP 911 and that is of utmost importance to me. Main reason we have one regular phone is to use during a blackout. Cell is somewhat limited - there are areas still where cells still don't work great with poor/no signal so for me - that is not a great solution.
In a situation with a widespread power outage, cell serivces are likely to be overloaded too. I've been in a situation where the power was out, my cell couldn't hold a signal or the network was busy (same with my GF's cell, different provider), and POTS was my only option. (Didn't have time to put the cable modem or a TV on a UPS and see if the cable was still up and didn't have DSL yet, but DSL depends on the POTS lines anyway...)


ieolus
Support The Clecs

join:2001-06-19
Danbury, CT
reply to calvoiper
Uhh, you ARE paying too much for century old technology... what do you think runs in that modern car of yours and ran in that Model-T... an internal combustion engine.
--
"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp


RadioDoc
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
La Grange, IL
kudos:2
Not to mention that ancient electricity.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange.


ieolus
Support The Clecs

join:2001-06-19
Danbury, CT
Yes, good retort but do you really think that 100+ years later noone has or could invent something better, cleaner, more efficient to run automobiles than the internal combustion engine based off of fossil fuels? Come on...
--
"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp


RadioDoc
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
La Grange, IL
kudos:2
I thought we were having fun here. Sorry to laugh during your church service.

Sheesh.

Loosen up.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange.


ieolus
Support The Clecs

join:2001-06-19
Danbury, CT
Sorry, easy to miscontrue replies on here. Loose now.
--
"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp


RadioDoc
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
La Grange, IL
kudos:2

rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

1 recommendation

reply to dentman42
I guess my experience has been different. I live in St. Louis and four times over the past nine months we experienced power outages that for some, lasted up to a week. (Twice last summer because of wind storms and twice this past winter due to ice storms. The local utility is in the frying pan because they have not been trimming the trees!)

Luckily only the last outage affected my house. I lost power for three days in early January due to an ice storm. I have Vonage as the primary line and it automatically forwards to my wife's cell when it's down. We always had service even though hundreds of thousands of customers in the area were also without power. I have to assume some or most were also relying on their cell phones.

After the first day network congestion may have been eased due to the temperature (20s) and duration of the outage. Some folks were forced to leave their home and stay with relatives and friends. Luckily we have a gas fireplace in our basement. Amazingly, it kept the entire house warm -- 85 in the basement, 70 on the first floor and 62 on the second floor.

Generators were instantly sold out so I bought a power inverter for the car that provided 400watts. Enough for a couple lamps and 14" TV. I was stunned that we never lost analog cable! I even hooked the cable modem up to my laptop and it worked!


calvoiper

join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA
reply to dentman42
No, I'm saying just because YOU PERSONALLY do not need or desire something is no reason to think it is worthless or a bad business idea.

calvoiper
--
VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies!


batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
reply to Enlightener
said by Enlightener:

One big network instead of dedicated silo'd networks that can't interop.

Are you saying *One System, It Works*. Like Ma Bell? That is what you just said.

patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1
reply to ieolus
said by ieolus:

Yes, good retort but do you really think that 100+ years later noone has or could invent something better, cleaner, more efficient to run automobiles than the internal combustion engine based off of fossil fuels? Come on...
Incumbants protecting themselves......


T1 Rocky

join:2002-11-15
Dallas, TX
reply to calvoiper
said by calvoiper:

You want to keep paying too much for century old technology? Fine. Quit bitching about the rest of us who prefer to drive modern cars instead of Model T's.

calvoiper
Listen here sonny, my telegraph has gotten me along just fine. So you and the Kaiser just go back to Russia you commies!

But seriously, I couldn't agree more. Even if your not on the edge of technology you should still be in favor of it. Verizon and the phone companies have spent the last 15 years spending literally BILLIONS lobbying the government to tax phone lines and then the phone companies collect those taxes. Think about it. The phone line to your house is $5 worth of copper that was rolled out 30 years ago. And how much are you paying for that line? After taxes probably $25 per month not including long distance. And they probably havent been to your house in or serviced that line for 10 years right? What's their return on investment on that?

That's what happens when there is no competition. Now that VOIP has come along they realize that they have shot themselves in the foot. By getting the govnt to "force" them to collect all of those taxes, their copper line can not compete with VOIP.

Plus the technology of voip offers a very promising future. It's really disgusting that Verizon has lobbied so extensively that they can snuff out technologies now just to preserve their monopoly. When was the last time a piece of legislation or a court ruling was not in their favor? I guarantee its been more than 10 years.

Time4aNAP
Premium
join:2007-04-09
Des Plaines, IL
reply to CylonRed
said by CylonRed:

To get decent VOIP I would have to upgrade my DSL and spend more money per month...
Holy carp, just how slow is your DSL service? Codecs have improved a lot since the original 56kbps ISDN service came out. If your DSL service is slower than the slowest BRI, then you need to go shopping! Maybe what you're getting is free. If that's the case, consider the cost of monthly POTS compared to the cost of the lowest tier of pay-for DSL service. Surely you can find one that's a better deal than $50 a month for just a dial tone?

And what about cable?

...I would have to get a UPS to keep the router and VOIP hardware running during a power outage (hopefully it is short)
From what I've read on these pages, some of the bundled VoIP services have hardware with built-in battery backup. You could look into that option, or spend the princely sum of $30 for APC's smallest UPS (even less for other brands).

Don't you have a UPS for your computer? Seems to me that anyone who experiences frequent power outages would be wise to spend a few bucks protecting their big electronic investments from all of the transients that come down the AC line every time power goes out, and every time it's restored. A true cheapskate isn't penny wise and pound foolish!

...and heaven forbid my CLEC has any issue that causes the line to go down...
That would leave you SOL when it comes to POTS too. What's your point?

I personally do NOT trust the 911 service as well and with 2 young kids - that is a deal breaker for me.
I don't see what your beef with 911 services has to do with this.

It is beginning to look like you simply aren't ready to move up to the 19th century, with its newfangled electricity and telephony. That's your right. But isn't it a little ironic that you're using a 21st century Internet to rail against them?

Not to mention - I would not save huge amounts - we don't do a lot of long distance calling and if I do then it is on the cell.
Whoa there! Back up a minute. You have a cellphone? All this time, you've been dreaming up ways that VoIP could leave you stranded, and you own a cellphone???

Oh brother!

I smell a mega-Bell shill...

Time4aNAP
Premium
join:2007-04-09
Des Plaines, IL
reply to La Luna
Features, not unlike atom bombs, do not need to be used to get your message across.