 dynodb Premium,VIP join:2004-04-21 Minneapolis, MN
| What do you people expect?!?
Gee, the Federal government let politics dictate where the money would go instead of actual need? Unthinkable! That's never happened before...
...what's that you say? The USF? Well, yeah, there's that... AND ALMOST EVERY OTHER SUCH PROGRAM THEY TOUCH.
But hey, never mind that! We need a National Broadband Policy administered by the Federal Government! This time it'll be different! Really! Our problems will be solved!
/sarc
It never ceases to amaze me how people witness time and again the Federal government act in a wasteful, politically-driven manner on matters that would be better handled locally, yet they insist on yet MORE, not less Federal government intervention on everything from broadband service to what gets played on the radio. |
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 Nuts
join:2006-04-27 Forest, OH | States are starting to make a grab for the local issues also, since they allowed the feds to take state issues. |
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  KrK Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy Premium join:2000-01-17 Tulsa, OK
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| reply to dynodb said by dynodb :Gee, the Federal government let politics dictate where the money would go instead of actual need? Unthinkable! That's never happened before... Gee, the Federal government let the interests and lobbying of large telecommunications companies dictate how much of the money would go to them where they want it instead of areas with actual need? Unthinkable! That's never happened before... -- "Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) |
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 Time4aNAP Premium join:2007-04-09 Des Plaines, IL
| reply to dynodb Gentle reminder: It's citizens such as yourself (I presume) who determine, either by voting or failing to, who sits at the seat of power. Rather than curse your own creation (in the collective sense, of course), perhaps you might endeavor to do better the next time around.
Oh, and by the way: The US federal system of government is composed of three separate branches. Similarly those branches are composed of smaller units of organization; the names vary based on which branch it is. Take this to its logical conclusion, and you end up with individual people as the leaves.
While it is convenient to heap blame onto a single, faceless monolithic entity, doing so solves no problems. In fact, sweeping generalizations like that are the seeds from which prejudice and bigotry are grown. We don't want that, do we? |
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 dynodb Premium,VIP join:2004-04-21 Minneapolis, MN
1 edit | Thanks, but I don't need a civics lesson- I'm pretty familar with how the US government is structured.
This sort of thing goes on regardless of which party controls the White House or either house of Congress. The problem lies with consolidation of power; as individual Congressmen or executive branch officials have more power, it's a given that this power is going to be used to their own benefit, be it financial or political.
If you're a lobbyist, it's much easier to influence a few key Congressional committee members than thousands of individual state lawmakers across the country.
As for the "prejudice and bigotry" bit... I have to admit you've completely lost me... or more likely completely lost it. |
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 dynodb Premium,VIP join:2004-04-21 Minneapolis, MN
| reply to KrK said by KrK :said by dynodb :Gee, the Federal government let politics dictate where the money would go instead of actual need? Unthinkable! That's never happened before... Gee, the Federal government let the interests and lobbying of large telecommunications companies dictate how much of the money would go to them where they want it instead of areas with actual need? Unthinkable! That's never happened before... No, it certainly wouldn't be the first time a special interest had undue influence.
Neither would it be the first time that a Congressman directed that funding would go to his own district regardless of actual need in order to build political capital for the next election.
Does anyone really think the Federal Government in Washington, DC is better suited to determine which neighborhoods in Texas (or anywhere else) are lacking broadband and which aren't and are thus more deserving of funding? Isn't it remotely possible that the lawmakers of that state might be a bit more familiar with the needs of that state than a DC bureaucrat? |
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 Time4aNAP Premium join:2007-04-09 Des Plaines, IL
| reply to dynodb said by dynodb :Thanks, but I don't need a civics lesson- I'm pretty familar with how the US government is structured. Well, then feel free to use that knowledge when posting!
This sort of thing goes on regardless of which party controls the White House or either house of Congress. The problem lies with consolidation of power; as individual Congressmen or executive branch officials have more power, it's a given that this power is going to be used to their own benefit, be it financial or political. Which party? That's not the point. The point is that the voter / constituent is responsible for choosing and guiding their elected representatives.
If you're a lobbyist, it's much easier to influence a few key Congressional committee members than thousands of individual state lawmakers across the country. And your point is...?
As for the "prejudice and bigotry" bit... I have to admit you've completely lost me... or more likely completely lost it. No, it seems that you have it down pat. Case-in-point. |
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  hitman_001 Premium join:2006-11-20 Laredo, TX
| reply to Time4aNAP I find these types of threads amusing. They generally turn into a slanderfest between those that live in rural communities, and those that live in metro areas. In all honesty, why would someone in a metro area care if someone in a rural area got access to broadband? Afraid its going to somehow make everyones broadband cost more? Pfft..
People pay extreme amounts of money to rent and buy in metro areas. A studio apt with bare necessities and minimal floor space go for 800-1600 dollars a month. Moving just out of those large metro areas into "rural" areas would yield a person a beautifull home, yard and hell probably pay your utilities in the process. Yet people are against moving into rural areas because they dont have the same "comforts" as metro.
Bringing broadband would be one of those comforts. I dont want to come across as saying bringing broadband into rural america would cure all ails and woes and make all areas of the country happy and prosperous, that wouldnt be true.. But by serving rural areas with those extra comforts it would promote growth outward from metro areas, instead of inward and I think that would be better for everyone. -- Hn7000s Small Office plan/.74m dish & 1Watt Trans on Satmex 5 Signal: 86/Win XP Pro SP2/P4 3gig, 2Gigs Ram, Radeon X1300 500meg video |
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 dynodb Premium,VIP join:2004-04-21 Minneapolis, MN
| reply to Time4aNAP said by Time4aNAP :said by dynodb :If you're a lobbyist, it's much easier to influence a few key Congressional committee members than thousands of individual state lawmakers across the country. And your point is...? I thought my point was obvious, but I'll spell it out for you:
Issues like rural broadband availability are local issues that should be handled at the state level, not the federal level where decisions are more likely to be influenced by politics, lobbying or simple bureaucratic inefficiency. The story that is the subject of this thread is but one example. |
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 Time4aNAP Premium join:2007-04-09 Des Plaines, IL
| reply to hitman_001 said by hitman_001 : I find these types of threads amusing. They generally turn into a slanderfest between those that live in rural communities, and those that live in metro areas. This one seems to have gone the way of partisan politics, and with only one side at that. I'm amused to see posts that slam unmade points.
In all honesty, why would someone in a metro area care if someone in a rural area got access to broadband? For one, a lot of my family lives in rural areas. It's nice to stay in touch.
serving rural areas with those extra comforts it would promote growth outward from metro areas, instead of inward and I think that would be better for everyone. I'm not so sure about that. As an urban refugee, the last thing that I want is for all of those jerks who have invaded downtown Chicago recently to follow me back to the suburbs. And the last thing I want to see is what's left of America's unspoiled wilderness paved-over to make way for more densely-spaced cookie-cutter mansions! |
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 Time4aNAP Premium join:2007-04-09 Des Plaines, IL
| reply to dynodb For reference:
said by dynodb :If you're a lobbyist, it's much easier to influence a few key Congressional committee members than thousands of individual state lawmakers across the country. Issues like rural broadband availability are local issues that should be handled at the state level, not the federal level where decisions are more likely to be influenced by politics, lobbying or simple bureaucratic inefficiency. The story that is the subject of this thread is but one example. How does that, and your previous out-of-the-blue comment about lobbying relate to the execution of the RAS legislation?
Although it's getting off-topic, I don't agree that the solution to the PAC problem is to shuffle jurisdictions.
As for "local issues", I don't follow the logic at all. There is a very obvious third option for local issues: local government. But that's not on-topic either... |
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 dynodb Premium,VIP join:2004-04-21 Minneapolis, MN
| said by Time4aNAP :For reference: said by dynodb :If you're a lobbyist, it's much easier to influence a few key Congressional committee members than thousands of individual state lawmakers across the country. Issues like rural broadband availability are local issues that should be handled at the state level, not the federal level where decisions are more likely to be influenced by politics, lobbying or simple bureaucratic inefficiency. The story that is the subject of this thread is but one example. How does that, and your previous out-of-the-blue comment about lobbying relate to the execution of the RAS legislation? Just who would administer the execution of the legislation? Do you really think they'd be politically insulated in a place like Washington DC?Although it's getting off-topic, I don't agree that the solution to the PAC problem is to shuffle jurisdictions.
As for "local issues", I don't follow the logic at all. There is a very obvious third option for local issues: local government. But that's not on-topic either... Local government is also an alternative; just keep it out of the hands of the feds, who should concentrate on things that only the federal government can do.
Point is- let's keep this example of mismanagement in mind next time someone mentions "national broadband policy". |
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 Time4aNAP Premium join:2007-04-09 Des Plaines, IL
| said by dynodb :Just who would administer the execution of the legislation? According to the Constitution of the United States of America, that duty goes to the executive branch of the government. (I gave you a mighty big hint before.)
Do you really think they'd be politically insulated in a place like Washington DC? As a one-time resident and frequent visitor of the District of Columbia, I might be able to answer your question. But I need to know who "they" are, and what they're supposedly "insulated" from before I can have any opinion on whatever it is that you're thinking of.
Local government is also an alternative; just keep it out of the hands of the feds, who should concentrate on things that only the federal government can do. Precisely what "it", and which "feds" are you referring to?
Point is- let's keep this example of mismanagement in mind next time someone mentions "national broadband policy". I don't see any direct correlation between the two. But since the 2008 Presidential race is already underway, I'll certainly keep this example of mismanagement, along with much more serious examples of mismanagement, in mind during the upcoming elections. |
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 patcat88
join:2002-04-05 Jamaica, NY
| reply to Time4aNAP said by Time4aNAP :Gentle reminder: It's citizens such as yourself (I presume) who determine, either by voting or failing to, who sits at the seat of power. Rather than curse your own creation (in the collective sense, of course), perhaps you might endeavor to do better the next time around. 2 party system. Period. Vote for one, [then you] vote for the other, vote for another, and its pointless since everyone else thinks there is a 2 party system and black helicopters will come at night to kill them for being unpatriotic if they dont vote for one or the other. |
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  hitman_001 Premium join:2006-11-20 Laredo, TX
| reply to Time4aNAP said by Time4aNAP :said by hitman_001 : I find these types of threads amusing. They generally turn into a slanderfest between those that live in rural communities, and those that live in metro areas. This one seems to have gone the way of partisan politics, and with only one side at that. I'm amused to see posts that slam unmade points. Unmade points? I just figured it would be nicer to say it in that fashion, instead of Joe_Cityjerk001 spouting out that people in rural areas are paupers and all they do is squeeze cow tits all day or pick vegetables, and why should country bumpkin inbreeds need broadband in the first place.. and other similar stereotypical horse shit  In all honesty, why would someone in a metro area care if someone in a rural area got access to broadband? For one, a lot of my family lives in rural areas. It's nice to stay in touch. said by Time4aNAP :said by rodrod5 :why the USDA has become the catch all for all things "rural" is beyond me Think about who dwells out in the middle of nowhere. There are farmers. There are wealthy Hollywood types who own palatial rural getaways. And there's the occasional hermit. The hermits don't want the utilities, and the wealthy don't deserve the subsidies. Who does that leave? Farmers, Hermits or Wealthy folks? serving rural areas with those extra comforts it would promote growth outward from metro areas, instead of inward and I think that would be better for everyone. I'm not so sure about that. As an urban refugee, the last thing that I want is for all of those jerks who have invaded downtown Chicago recently to follow me back to the suburbs. And the last thing I want to see is what's left of America's unspoiled wilderness paved-over to make way for more densely-spaced cookie-cutter mansions! Oh so thats why rural america cant have broadband! Lord forbid someone else move near you, lol, I like you.. you make me laugh. -- Hn7000s Small Office plan/.74m dish & 1Watt Trans on Satmex 5 Signal: 86/Win XP Pro SP2/P4 3gig, 2Gigs Ram, Radeon X1300 500meg video |
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 Time4aNAP Premium join:2007-04-09 Des Plaines, IL
| said by hitman_001 :Oh so thats why rural america cant have broadband! Lord forbid someone else move near you, lol, I like you.. you make me laugh. Thanks. Nice to see that somebody here knows how to laugh. For a while there I was really wondering!  |
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 Time4aNAP Premium join:2007-04-09 Des Plaines, IL
| reply to dynodb said by dynodb :Does anyone really think the Federal Government in Washington, DC is better suited to determine which neighborhoods in Texas (or anywhere else) are lacking broadband and which aren't and are thus more deserving of funding? Show me one neighborhood in Texas that has more and better independent resources than the US government's own Economic Research Service (USDA), Forest Service (USDA), Rural Development (USDA), Bureau of Economic Analysis (DOC), Census Bureau (DOC), National Institute of Standards & Technology (DOC), National Oceanic & Atmospheric Administration (DOC), National Technical Information Service (DOC), National Telecommunications and Information Administration (DOC), National Weather Service (DOC), Educational Resources Information Center (DOEd), Institute of Education Sciences (DOEd), The Department of Health and Human Services, Office of Public and Indian Housing (HUD), Bureau of Indian Affairs (DOI), Bureau of Land Management (DOI), National Park Service (DOI), United States Geological Survey (DOI), Bureau of Labor Statistics (DOL), Occupational Safety & Health Administration (DOL), Bureau of Transportation Statistics (DOT), The Environmental Protection Agency, Federal Citizen Information Center (GSA), The Small Business Administration, The Tennessee Valley Authority, The Consumer Product Safety Commission, The Federal Communications Commission, The Federal Laboratory Consortium for Technology Transfer, The Federal Trade Commission, and many other offices that I omitted to avoid political cheap-shots, and I'll show you a community that doesn't qualify for RUS money.
On the other side of the coin, we have the glaringly obvious fact that numerous state, county and local governmental agencies in Texas, who had oversight of the building of that luxury subdivision, overlooked the fraud. That's not exactly a glowing recommendation, if you ask me! |
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