ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA
2 edits | Union doesn't give a crap about the customers
Aside from median and average being different and in most instances the median is irrelevent. Only getting their membership more money (which is why it exists) and all of this is just a smokescreen to aid in that end.
It's not a matter of FairPoint not being able to deliver to customers what they need. It's a matter of FairPoint not delivering to the Union what they may want.
Then there is the issue of median and average being different. The median is completely irrelavant. If you have 100 people and 99 of them get 10Mb and 1 gets 1Mb, the median is 5Mb. What "average" available speeds are is more relevant.
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Macintosh Users Group Serving the Inland Empire |
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
 ·Comcast
| It didn't take long.....mention a union and have some jamoke bash it with with what he or she hears on talk radio. Know this; if it wasn't for the underlying threat of collective bargaining, no corporation would voluntarilly offer the benefits that they do. Not to mention, if you get rid of the union, it will be illegal aliens or Z-Visa "guest workers" getting these jobs rather than the US citizen.
We're already heading towards a Walmart society that sells nothing but crap made from China. Why push us over? |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA
2 edits | Thanks for making my point.
I don't give a crap about the Union getting more dough for the membership...just these stupid astroturf-like smokescreens. The Union doesn't give two squits of piss about the customers.
They should just say they don't believe they can get a good deal for the workers if they're dealing with FairPoint versus a bigger company instead of these red herrings.
Meanwhile if you don't like Wal*Mart, don't shop there.
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Macintosh Users Group Serving the Inland Empire |
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TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ
 ·Sprint Broadband D..
| reply to S_engineer
Don't mind them. Years of ingrained reactions from watching Billo and then practicing His Lofty Words in front of the mirror have left them incapable of any other reaction.
Showing them the good things that unions have done, both for citizens in the workplace and in the communities at large just doesn't register at all.
They hate unions because The High Priests of Loofah have told them to hate them. I mean, how dare ANYONE stand up for consumers, if it has the merest hint of detriment to our lords, masters and betters, the corporations?  |
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
·Comcast
| reply to ColorBASIC
Actually your point is ill-informed. A union member has to go through an apprenticeship (at a lower wage) where he or she learns every facet of that particular trade. This make the worker a more efficient, better trained technician than that of worker with no or limited training. This should be reflected in the network. Now even you can comprehend this.
Why don't you ask the workers what FairPoint is neglecting to give them! |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA | Nice troll. |
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL | VICIUOS COMEBACK.....STOP IT
mCfLY! |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA
4 edits | Come on. Read the thread instead of going 'shields up' for the Union bosses and running off on these off-topic attempts to argue the merits of union members.
No one gives a crap about union member training as we see in the case of FiOS, non-union west coast installs going faster than east coast union installs. This is about the union boss smokescreen...similar to the one last week about Verizon neglecting its copper.
The union doesn't want to deal with FairPoint because they won't be able to cut as good a deals as they could with a larger company like Verizon. Anyone with a brain can see that.
They should just SAY that instead of wasting everyone's time with all the bullcrap. The union doesn't give a damn about the customers, nor should they. They represent the union membership.
And before getting all bent, realize that not all criticism of a union is directed at union members.
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Macintosh Users Group Serving the Inland Empire |
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chemaupr
join:2005-06-06
Alexandria, VA
| my experiences with union as a past union member is that all they care is to protect the lazy a** members. I had to work my b** off because the lazy a** union has some idiot negotiations that only benefit the lazy people. Sure it give me good benefits but the other as**le that worked 1/5 of his time had the same benefits and it was hard for mngmt to get rid of him. So I have no sympathy for what ever the union says.
Further, the union role is to seek for the benefits of its members and as far as I know the customers are not unionized |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA | Again, this has ZERO to do with union membership. |
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
·Comcast
| fist of all, union membership relies on a good product, which is good for the consumer. The union knows this because without a decent product, it's dead. This is self preservation.
Second, most corps. try to eliminate union members because this is they're greatest expense. A lower waged worker will give them a greater profit margin. This is never filtered down to the consumer. It is only reflected in
8 digit paychecks to board members. Once the union members are gone, you better believe they'll be gunning for the rest!
Look at what ATT did here in the midwest, slashed the workforce by roughly 1/3rd. Now they're offering IPTV, VOIP, and internet. How can I truly believe this network will not fail at multiple juctures with that much less staff to deal with the added workload.
Finally, unions like non-union entities have lazy people.
All you have to do to find anti union and pro union laziness is look at congress.\
and CB, it what you whos gut reaction was to bash union bosses from the getgo! |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| reply to TScheisskopf
said by TScheisskopf  :I mean, how dare ANYONE stand up for consumers ... Why do you assume a union stands up for consumers? A union's job is to stand up for its membership, just like a business' job is to stand up for its shareholders.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. |
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kneedeep
join:2000-10-01
Springfield, MA
clubs: | reply to ColorBASIC
In your example the median would be the 50th sample which is 10Mb and it's not irrelevant. |
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TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ
·Sprint Broadband D..
| reply to pnh102
Last I looked, union members ARE consumers. Also, the points they raise are valid parts of the debate for ALL consumers and would never be raised if their voices weren't out there.
Surely, the corporations are not going to catch a bad case of the honests and issue a press release that says "Oh, and our copper plants are falling apart like a cheap suit in a spin cycle, because we have cut staff and focused all our investment away from maintenance".
No, the other folks on the front lines, the unions, are gonna do that, and we are better off for it. Even if what they are saying is half-true, we need to know it, for WE are the ones paying the nut. |
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BernieLyons
join:2004-02-28
Paramus, NJ
| reply to ColorBASIC
Unfortunately, the communications customer has no other choice in Comm. suppliers, whereas with Walmart you have many other choices.
As for anti union, consider the source, a Mac user, and we all know they are mad at the world because they will always be No. 2 |
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mocycler
Premium
join:2001-01-22
Naperville, IL
 ·AT&T U-Verse
 ·AT&T Midwest
4 edits | reply to ColorBASIC
I saw this story and before even reading the threads I knew this would come up.
Labor will never admit it, but it's true: Unions exist for the betterment of the members, not consumers. Any union claiming to be pro-customer is either lying or doesn't deserve to represent their members.
By definition, unions are self-serving organizations. If you're not one of them, they don't care about you and will play the "customer card" only to the degree they need to in order to protect their jobs.
So don't buy CWA'a "working families" pablum and the illusion they are fighting for the greater good. This is all about protecting their own, period. If tossing customers under the bus would get them what they want, they'd cheerfully do it.
mocycler |
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ashworth
join:2001-10-06
Pittsburgh, PA | reply to ColorBASIC
I think you hit this one the head :
It's not a matter of FairPoint not being able to deliver to customers what they need. It's a matter of FairPoint not delivering to the Union what they may want. |
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hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| reply to TScheisskopf
What I don't get is why is the union having a cow over what is going on now with broadband and services that Fairpoint won't/can't offer. VZ doesn't offer them now so now that they want to sell the customers to someone who wants them they think they can get them? Fairpoint and VZ needs to tell the Unions to take a hike and get on with business. |
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hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | reply to ashworth
I agree with what you said 10000%. Why is the Union bitching about it now and never did before? That is what should be asked? |
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mocycler
Premium
join:2001-01-22
Naperville, IL
·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T Midwest
| said by hottboiinnc :I agree with what you said 10000%. Why is the Union bitching about it now and never did before? That is what should be asked? Yeah, no kidding.
According to the union's own propaganda, Maine already has some of the worst service in the nation, so how can FairPoint do any worse? They should be glad Verizon wants to bail and hand the business over to someone who actually wants it.
See my previous post...this has utterly nothing to do with what's best for customers.
mocycler |
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