drslash
Goya Asma
Premium
join:2002-02-18
Marion, IA
| [HVAC Help] AC fan motor going out
I have a 15 year old Lennox central air unit. The unit outside has the fan motor going out.  The tech says $414. I have no idea what the going rate is for a whole new unit. I have a 2300 sq ft 2 story home plus a basement. I don't know if I have a 1/2, 3/4, or 1 ton unit.
I am inclined to just have the fan motor replaced. My guess is a new unit would run $3000+.
What's the scoop? Thanks.
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Save water...drink beer! |
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Jimdaboe
join:2001-01-16
Corpus Christi, TX
| 2,300 sq ft you should have at least a 4 ton unit probably 5 ton. Condenser fan motor for that size unit about 2 to 3 hundred plus install. 15 years old very inefficient but if you replace outside unit, replace the inside air-handler and evaporator. For that size unit you are looking at 6,000+. |
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robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
| Sounds expensive to me. I replaced one on a 4 ton in 2001 and on a 2 ton in 04. In both cases I took the motor off and took it to the local electric motor store. Each motor cost $40 including tax.
It's a real easy job to do yourself. Those motors are generic so you don't need to replace it with one from Lennox. |
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SandShark
So it goes
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-23
Santa Fe, TX
clubs:
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to drslash
It's difficult to say based on the information you've posted as to what the motor should cost. OEM motors are a lot higher than general replacement off-the-shelf motors, plus if it's an 825 RPM motor, it's going to be more expensive than a 1075 RPM motor. I'm guessing, but they're probably using flat-rate pricing.
As to what a new system would cost, that's difficult to answer because there are many variables involved. Ask them if they can give you a bid on changing out your system. They should do that for no charge. If you are serious about changing out your present system, I would recommend going with an R-410A refrigerant system. R-22 refrigerant is in the process of being phased out.
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Drex
Beer..It's What's For Dinner
Premium
join:2000-02-24
La Place, LA
·AT&T Southeast
| said by SandShark  :R-22 refrigerant is in the process of being phased out. Not to get off topic, but how long have they been phasing out R-22?
I can remember many moons ago, you could go to Walmart and buy the stuff. Now I believe you have to have some sort of license to buy it.
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I gave up drinking and eating bad food. And in 14 days, I had lost 2 weeks. |
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SandShark
So it goes
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-23
Santa Fe, TX
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by Drex :said by SandShark :R-22 refrigerant is in the process of being phased out. Not to get off topic, but how long have they been phasing out R-22? I can remember many moons ago, you could go to Walmart and buy the stuff. Now I believe you have to have some sort of license to buy it. »www.epa.gov/ozone/title6/phaseou···out.html
January 1, 2004:
In accordance with the terms of the Montreal Protocol, the amount of all HCFCs that can be produced nationwide must be reduced by 35% by 2004. In order to achieve this goal, the U.S. is ceasing production of HCFC-141b, the most ozone-damaging of this class of chemicals, on January 1, 2003. This production ban will greatly reduce nationwide use of HCFCs as a group, making it likely that the 2004 deadline will have a minimal effect on R-22 supplies.
January 1, 2010:
After 2010, chemical manufacturers may still produce R-22 to service existing equipment, but not for use in new equipment. As a result, heating, ventilation and air-conditioning (HVAC) system manufacturers will only be able to use pre-existing supplies of R-22 to produce new air conditioners and heat pumps. These existing supplies would include R-22 recovered from existing equipment and recycled.
January 1, 2020:
Use of existing refrigerant, including refrigerant that has been recovered and recycled, will be allowed beyond 2020 to service existing systems, but chemical manufacturers will no longer be able to produce R-22 to service existing air conditioners and heat pumps.
You have to hold an EPA Certification to purchase R-22 and other refrigerants.
»www.epa.gov/ozone/title6/608/sal···les.html
Who can buy refrigerant under the sales restriction?
The following people can buy any type of refrigerant under the sales restriction (for instance, R-11, R-12, R-123, R-22, and R-12), except for "small cans" containing less than 20 pounds of R-12:
* technicians certified to service stationary appliances (i.e., Type I,
Type II, Type III, or Universal certification) by a Section 608
EPA-certified testing organization;
* employers of a Section 608 certified technicians (or the employer's
authorized representative) if the employer provides the wholesaler
with written evidence that he or she employs at least one properly
certified technician; and
* manufacturers of air-conditioning and refrigeration equipment, where
the refrigerant is used in the original manufacture of the equipment
The following people can only buy refrigerant found suitable for use in a motor vehicle air conditioner (for example, R-12, R-406A, R-414A, R-414B, etc.), including "small cans" containing less than 20 pounds of R-12:
* technicians certified to service motor vehicle air-conditioners
(MVACs) by a Section 609 EPA-certified testing organization
* persons who buy refrigerant only for the purpose of resale to Section
609 certified technicians, such persons must provide written
documentation (that includes the purchaser's name and address) to the
seller stating that the refrigerant is only intended for resale.
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Drex
Beer..It's What's For Dinner
Premium
join:2000-02-24
La Place, LA | Thanks for the info! |
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drslash
Goya Asma
Premium
join:2002-02-18
Marion, IA
| reply to drslash
The tech said it was an odd ball motor and he did not have one in his truck. He will replace it today. I wish I had the time or the inclination to fix it myself but this is smack dab in the middle of the hot season, so I guess I'll have to pay what they're charging. The $414 was the installed price. Based on doing some other checking this price is probably less than 10% of a new system. I'll go with the repair and hope I get a few more years out of this unit. I like the idea of knowing that I may need to spend $6000 to $8000 a few years from now rather than today!
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Save water...drink beer! |
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SandShark
So it goes
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-23
Santa Fe, TX
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by drslash :The tech said it was an odd ball motor and he did not have one in his truck. The higher efficiency Lennox models use 825 RPM motors. Sure, you can buy a similar motor off-the-shelf and pay a lot less, but experience has proven that these motors don't last as long as OEM motors do. Having it done by them, you'll get a warranty. Most HVAC parts suppliers will not warranty motors that they sell to homeowners.
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robbin
Premium,MVM
join:2000-09-21
Leander, TX
1 edit | A quick search shows 825 rpm condenser motors available at prices of $130 - $190 on the web. That is a lot of markup and labor to get to $414. Personally I would take the chance on not using OEM. After all, the unit is already 15 years old, I doubt the fan will need to last another 15.
[edit] I sincerely doubt that the Lennox replacement is actually manufactured by Lennox anyways!  |
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wth
Premium
join:2002-02-20
Iowa City, IA
 ·Mediacom
| reply to drslash
May want to look at the new motor and see if it's one that has sealed bearings, or the type you have to pull out a couple of plastic plugs and oil the bearings once every couple of years, like mine ('83 model-side discharge) Come to think of it, I'm overdue.  |
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NOCMan
Verizon Fios User
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Flower Mound, TX
| reply to drslash
We'll know that you'll be saving money when the time comes as well. The system you have now probably performs at 8 seer due to it's age. Assuming it's a 10 seer system. When you upgrade shoot for 16 seer variable speed heat and cool. That way you get the full savings in winter and summer.
I hope to upgrade my outdoor goodman unit to a variable speed unit. Problem is the current one is new and the wife probably would not approve. |
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Iwannabeanerd
@sbcglobal.net
| reply to drslash
I agree with the DIY approach if you have the tools and know-how it will be cheaper. My motor died on me also and all I did was take out the motor and bought a new at my local HVAC shop, although I did a lil negotiating because here they only sell parts to HVAC contractors. Only was like 50-60 bux, compared to what the tech was charging.
Also, one time my main A/C unit failed to start and a tech estimated the fix at $1000, the nerd in me looked into it and it turned out to be a 15 dollar transformer that fried on the circuit board, replaced it and worked again.
So my advice is if you can handle the job DIY. |
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SandShark
So it goes
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-23
Santa Fe, TX
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to robbin
said by robbin :A quick search shows 825 rpm condenser motors available at prices of $130 - $190 on the web. That is a lot of markup and labor to get to $414. Personally I would take the chance on not using OEM. After all, the unit is already 15 years old, I doubt the fan will need to last another 15. [edit] I sincerely doubt that the Lennox replacement is actually manufactured by Lennox anyways! I urge anyone to repair their own stuff. I do. Replacing a motor isn't exactly brain surgery. Just make sure not to let the smoke out. Motors run on smoke. I'll bet you didn't know that.
The thing with the price is more than just marking up a motor 100% and having it look like the company is taking advantage of their customers. If you run a legitimate company with overhead (labor, trucks, fuel, insurance, taxes, electricity, etc.), you have to make something, don't you?. Plus, don't forget when it's 100+ degrees outside and it's something you can't repair yourself, who's going to come to the rescue, the next door neighbor?
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normat
Premium
join:2000-08-02
Boynton Beach, FL
clubs:
| I just had a motor replaced on a new unit today. I think this motor may have had some sort of special tach wiring to indicate if it was spinning because it tripped the protection switch when it failed.
If the unit hadn't been two months old I would have tried to replace it myself. |
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DataDoc
My avatar looks like me, if I was 2D.
Premium
join:2000-05-14
Greenville, NC
·Suddenlink
| reply to Drex
said by Drex :said by SandShark :R-22 refrigerant is in the process of being phased out. Not to get off topic, but how long have they been phasing out R-22? I can remember many moons ago, you could go to Walmart and buy the stuff. Now I believe you have to have some sort of license to buy it. I used to buy small cans of Freon and use them to power my BB machine gun. Now I use compressed air, cheaper, envio-friendly, and doesn't freeze my hand to the gun.
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If you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the precipitate.
That Snows the Goat & Craig's Crafts |
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Greg_Z
Premium
join:2001-08-08
Springfield, IL
·Comcast
1 edit | reply to drslash
You could check out the pricing @ »www.alpinehomeair.com For the Price, I may end up ordering the A/C equipment for my place next year, due to when we got our furnace, we never got the A/C.
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I threw out the map a long time ago. Now I follow my own direction! |
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DataDoc
My avatar looks like me, if I was 2D.
Premium
join:2000-05-14
Greenville, NC
·Suddenlink
| Broken link, »www.alpinehomeair.com/ works.  |
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Majestik
World Traveler
Premium
join:2001-05-11
Tulsa, OK
clubs: 
| reply to robbin
said by robbin :Sounds expensive to me. I replaced one on a 4 ton in 2001 and on a 2 ton in 04. In both cases I took the motor off and took it to the local electric motor store. Each motor cost $40 including tax. It's a real easy job to do yourself. Those motors are generic so you don't need to replace it with one from Lennox. That is true.
Installed one in my old Lennox long ago. Took it out, went to Grainger and they gave me generic brand. Installed it in 2 hours.
Cost me around $40 as well.
Unit was 20yrs old at the time. Ran ten more years until replacement this year.
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The adventure continues......2006 so far- Switzerland,Oahu,Macau,Hong Kong,Rome,Maui.........Dec 06- Hong Kong,India,Dubai,Iran,Paris,Rio de Janeiro,Rome,Acapulco,Switzerland.... |
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warlock56
Premium
join:2002-07-31
Arlington, TX
| reply to Jimdaboe
said by Jimdaboe :2,300 sq ft you should have at least a 4 ton unit probably 5 ton. This is terrible advice. Do you personally know the layout of the OP's house? Do you have stats on its air infiltration? Shading? Insulation? No? Well then, "advice" like this isn't worth paying attention to, just the same as any contractor who comes to your home for a replacement bid, takes a quick 5 second look at your house and determines "Yep, you need a 4 ton" or whatever.
The reason the price to replace a simple fan motor is so high is because Lennox doesn't let other manufacturers make parts for their stuff. They are essentially the same way Sony was with Beta. For example, take a look at a somewhat modern Trane compressor and pull out the fan. Guess what...GE! And it's made in Mexico.
OP: Remove the fan, write down manufacturer, model, part, serial numbers and everything else you can think of then start shopping that information around. It may be possible to find an exact replacement since it is just a motor, but with Lennox it is always hard to tell.
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The moment the idea is admitted into society, that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, and that there is not a force of law and public justice to protect it, anarchy and tyranny commence. -John Adams, 1787 |
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