Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User in Road Runner http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r18916607 en Tue, 02 Dec 2008 21:07:04 EDT Tue, 02 Dec 2008 21:07:04 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19940217 anon : It's been about a week and my speeds remain high and stable. It looks like in my case, Road Runner fixed a problem with my building's tap and restored my speeds.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19940217 Tue, 05 Feb 2008 16:51:24 EDT Re: Is there something wrong with the NYC server for speedtest.n http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19911509 MacLeech :
said by pL86 :

So is something up with the NY server on speedtest?
Yes, the speedtest.net NY server has had issues with slow speeds for months.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19911509 Thu, 31 Jan 2008 18:54:44 EDT Is there something wrong with the NYC server for speedtest.n http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19911416 anon : So I decided to run some more speed tests just now since this was witching hour, when the speeds would typically drop dead. I remembered previously, I had run speed tests only using Road Runner's test at speedtest.nyc.rr.com so I decided to head over to speedtest.net (incidentally, there was other evidence that my speeds were fine like getting torrent downloads in the 700 kB/s range, which is fantastic). I used the New York server and pings were low but my downloads were only showing in the 3000-5000 range. Uh oh. Problem not fixed?

I went to speakeasy.net and it said I was getting 9000+, same as the Road Runner test. I returned to speedtest.net and ran a test using the Clifton, NJ server. It also reported 9000+ download. I even tried the San Francisco server and, although ping times were above 100ms, download transfers were in the 9000 kbps range. So is something up with the NY server on speedtest?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19911416 Thu, 31 Jan 2008 18:39:43 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19909968 jig : well, consistently, solidly bad over a long period of time replaced with at least some good usually means something has been fixed.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19909968 Thu, 31 Jan 2008 14:36:01 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19908932 wkpower : you've only tested this for one night? try testing it for a week or more and see what happens. my problems seem to fix themselves on its own sometimes and that lasts for about a day or two. usually a day. last week my entire cable service went out, tv and internet, for over 24 hours. this affected my entire block. when service was restored, i found my speeds to be in tip-top shape, even during peak hours. then the next day, it went back to crap. seems like the node gets congested after heavy use and it needs a reset every once in a while. either that or its just broken.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19908932 Thu, 31 Jan 2008 12:05:32 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19908596 anon : Knock on wood but my problems appear to have been fixed. Last time I posted over a week ago, the L3 techs who came to look at my apartment ended up booking a follow up to check my building's tap. They said the crew would probably be out by the end of last week. It appears the crew did come out and fix whatever problem has been killing my speeds. Last night I noticed that during the peak hours when my speed would degrade like clockwork, everything was fine. I ran some speedtests and they was maxing out. I hope I'm not jinxing this but Time Warner appears to have come through. My speculation that my connection was being throttled appears to have been wrong.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19908596 Thu, 31 Jan 2008 11:03:52 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19895583 sovere1gnty :
said by spissed off user :

I only demand what I was offered, and am paying for 4 mega bytes PER second down and 756 kilo bytes up. If they want to traffic shape my connection I feel I should be able to sue for fraud and false advertisement. That or I'll start money shaping my monthly payments. :P
Correct limits for upload and download are 4Mbps (Megabits) download and 384 Kbps upload (Kilobits). Never heard of a 756 Kbps plan so you may want to look into that to see if you have the correct numbers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19895583 Tue, 29 Jan 2008 11:36:33 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19894273 Pizz : very interesting events. please keep us posted. i have a feeling you got flagged, and the old cablevision throttling kicked in.

just my opinion :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19894273 Tue, 29 Jan 2008 07:00:52 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19894182 anon : I only demand what I was offered, and am paying for 4 mega bytes PER second down and 756 kilo bytes up. If they want to traffic shape my connection I feel I should be able to sue for fraud and false advertisement. That or I'll start money shaping my monthly payments. :P]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19894182 Tue, 29 Jan 2008 06:17:18 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19875251 jig : keep us updated]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19875251 Fri, 25 Jan 2008 19:35:35 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19873969 anon : Here's an update on my situation if you're interested:

Two Level 3 techs came to my apartment on Wednesday night. At first, they seemed stumped by my problem. They definitely saw the download speed problems I'm having - they ran speed tests from a number of sites, including the speedtest on DSL Reports - and I was getting 3000 kbits/sec downloads, a third of where it should be. But apparently, my signals tested fine. They ran a continuous ping test and saw some packet loss but not apparently at an excessive level. They speculated that maybe another user on my node was running a server during the evening hours. One tech said that happened with a case downtown, which took months to track down. The other tech was very frustrated and said they had many meetings about bandwidth usage but that management was sticking with its policy that Road Runner doesn't cap. He mentioned with approval that Cablevision did cap and seemed to wish Road Runner did as well. They seemed to be leaning to saying that while I had intermittent speed problems and some packet loss, it wasn't severe enough to trigger additional followup.

Eventually, they left my apartment to test the node in my building that I'm hooked up to. They weren't the most talkative pair but when they got back, it seems that they found something because they said they would book a ticket and another crew would come out to check the building's tap. One of them said that there was definitely a problem. So maybe my conviction that Road Runner was throttling was premature. Hopefully, the next crew will figure out exactly what's going on and fix it. I won't get a personal followup from the next crew but I will report if my problem clears up.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19873969 Fri, 25 Jan 2008 16:00:16 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19835551 anon :
said by Trinary :

And of course it could just be that the modem couldn't handle the amount of connection.

My router originally couldn't deal with high number of connection due to it's setting. After I flashed it with a new firmware and changed some settings (like to not keep remembering old connections), it becomes much more stable.
I just don't think that's it. I've had Road Runner at my present location for 2 1/2 years now. I had Road Runner before at other locations for another 2 1/2 years meaning I've been a Road Runner user for five years now. I've been using torrents for around 3 years now, using the same settings with the same RCA modem brand and I've never had the systemic problems that I'm having now. Sure, there have been days when the connection was slow or it went out because of a service problem. But it's only been recently, maybe the last two months or so, that I've started having the kind of problem that I described.

Plus, as I said in my original post, the throttling seems to be triggered by bittorrent use but it is applied to ALL internet traffic, including traffic that doesn't use multiple connections like bittorrent does. For example, last night at 3 o'clock in the morning, after I got connection errors in bittorrent and I suspected the traffic management had kicked in, I killed my torrents and tried to load the Google home page. My browser timed out! On Google, one of the simplest web pages out there! And it timed out on other very simple web sites. If the problem was the modem being overloaded by multiple connections, then stopping the torrents, rebooting the modem and loading up a simple web page shouldn't be affected. Yet, it was.

And yes, I've just returned from swapping out my modem again and my connection is perfect again. I do have a Level 3 tech coming next week to check out my line but I really don't think he's going to find anything. I'll post after he comes. Maybe I'm wrong, I sure hope I am. I'd rather it be a line issue than a policy change but I'm not so optimistic.

peter]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19835551 Sat, 19 Jan 2008 18:00:27 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19835457 anon : by that idiotic logic, 90% of users should be offered a lower package based on their needs.

Meanwhile, those who want faster speeds should pay for premium.

Oops! They already had that in place and are now just trying to put the screws to everyone.

Get over it, RR sucks. I used to have them in socal and the moment fios was available I left. I suggest everyone to do the same, you'll never look back. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19835457 Sat, 19 Jan 2008 17:40:13 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19833978 NiceGuyNY21 :
said by derk See Profile :

said by NiceGuyNY21 See Profile :

At least with all the TWC-RR Neo support folks, I have complained to as long as my line is up and running, NO ONE has offered to help. They treat me like I just want to download P2P (which isn't the case).
im sorry that you've been treated that way...its understandable why they would think that, most people that do just normal browsing/internet, downloads periodically will never really be effected by packetshaping...so 90% of the people that have the service will never likely even notice, the way it's designed is to only effect the top 5-10% of the users that cost 10x more than what they're paying for...i wish you luck with dsl...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19833978 Sat, 19 Jan 2008 12:39:28 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19829832 anon : And of course it could just be that the modem couldn't handle the amount of connection.

My router originally couldn't deal with high number of connection due to it's setting. After I flashed it with a new firmware and changed some settings (like to not keep remembering old connections), it becomes much more stable.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19829832 Fri, 18 Jan 2008 18:22:35 EDT Re: Packeting shaping has arrived in NYC http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19810979 MacLeech :
said by pL86 :

I've had some problems recently with simple websites stalling, internet connection cutting off completely. I thought it was a problem with DNS servers. I ran ping tests with Road Runner support and one second, it would be fine, no packet loss, then literally a second later, complete 100% packet loss. Maybe it was my line so I scheduled a Level 3 tech to come out and investigate. Before the appointment, I decided to swap out my modem. Voila, problems fixed! So I thought it was a bad modem.

Over the weekend, I did some heavy bit torrent downloading. And the problems that I experienced before returned. I just started downloading a regular update to a program and in the middle of the download, the transfer rate simple zeroed out. I've never seen that before until very, very recently. The first time I started experiencing this problem, it also coincided with heavy bit torrent use. I believe these internet disruptions and the torrent downloading are not coincidences but causal.

I know there are people here who say the traffic shaping shouldn't affect regular surfing but I believe they're simply wrong, clinging to theory (should work) and refusing to listen to real world user reports (does work). I'm sure the shaping isn't SUPPOSED to affect regular traffic but I bet the software isn't perfect and it is overzealous. I'm never completely cut off for long, 30-60 seconds, but I am definitely cut off and regular surfing to sites like CNN or Microsoft stall, even during off-peak times like 3 a.m.

The good "news" is that the shaping appears to be applied to a specific modem, not your entire account, so exchanging your blocked modem for a new one removes the shaping, at least until you start downloading heavily again. I plan to exchange my modem and now that I've figured out what's going on, will be more careful about spacing out my downloads.
Shaping isn't applied to modems directly and swapping modems would have no effect on the shaping itself.

You really sound like you have a signal (likely) or local bandwidth issue (a little less likely)...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19810979 Wed, 16 Jan 2008 02:48:39 EDT Packeting shaping has arrived in NYC http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19810088 anon : I've had some problems recently with simple websites stalling, internet connection cutting off completely. I thought it was a problem with DNS servers. I ran ping tests with Road Runner support and one second, it would be fine, no packet loss, then literally a second later, complete 100% packet loss. Maybe it was my line so I scheduled a Level 3 tech to come out and investigate. Before the appointment, I decided to swap out my modem. Voila, problems fixed! So I thought it was a bad modem.

Over the weekend, I did some heavy bit torrent downloading. And the problems that I experienced before returned. I just started downloading a regular update to a program and in the middle of the download, the transfer rate simple zeroed out. I've never seen that before until very, very recently. The first time I started experiencing this problem, it also coincided with heavy bit torrent use. I believe these internet disruptions and the torrent downloading are not coincidences but causal.

I know there are people here who say the traffic shaping shouldn't affect regular surfing but I believe they're simply wrong, clinging to theory (should work) and refusing to listen to real world user reports (does work). I'm sure the shaping isn't SUPPOSED to affect regular traffic but I bet the software isn't perfect and it is overzealous. I'm never completely cut off for long, 30-60 seconds, but I am definitely cut off and regular surfing to sites like CNN or Microsoft stall, even during off-peak times like 3 a.m.

The good "news" is that the shaping appears to be applied to a specific modem, not your entire account, so exchanging your blocked modem for a new one removes the shaping, at least until you start downloading heavily again. I plan to exchange my modem and now that I've figured out what's going on, will be more careful about spacing out my downloads.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19810088 Tue, 15 Jan 2008 23:08:22 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19728361 derk :
said by NiceGuyNY21 See Profile :

its kind of funny i was only aware of one area officially using packetshaping, and its not in ohio period... anyhow neo is a sucky market to sub to cable internet as well as pretty much anywhere in ohio...i feel your pain...good luck with dsl.
You are probably right that it's a NEO overall problem and not packetshaping. When I moved to Cleveland in 2000, the cable service was Cablevision. Soon it was Adelphia and just last year, it became TWC-RR. The infrastructure I am betting in this area is a mess.

I guess there has been an equally crazy transition for Ohio bell to Ameritech to SBC to ATT. But really I have only witnessed the Ohio bell to Ameritech/SBC/ATT transition.

In July 2006, after a great year flawless ATT Yahoo DSL service, I had major problems. It took a lot of calls to fix an inside wiring problem, a problem with the line from NID to outside pole and ultimately getting a brand new circuit. They solved it.

At least with all the TWC-RR Neo support folks, I have complained to as long as my line is up and running, NO ONE has offered to help. They treat me like I just want to download P2P (which isn't the case).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19728361 Wed, 02 Jan 2008 23:17:07 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19714667 NiceGuyNY21 :
said by derk See Profile :

said by sovere1gnty See Profile :

said by derk See Profile :

I am cancelling TWC-RR NEO after having it for 18 months. This packet shaping is disturbing.
its kind of funny i was only aware of one area officially using packetshaping, and its not in ohio period... anyhow neo is a sucky market to sub to cable internet as well as pretty much anywhere in ohio...i feel your pain...good luck with dsl.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19714667 Mon, 31 Dec 2007 16:09:25 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19691336 derk :
said by sovere1gnty See Profile :

said by derk See Profile :

I am cancelling TWC-RR NEO after having it for 18 months. This packet shaping is disturbing. I can run a speedtest and get great speeds and latency. BUT when I try and download a big file (non p2p) from msdn.microsoft.com or from ftp.redhat.com it's dialup speeds.

I could be wrong maybe it's that my area (NEO) is oversold via cable modem service, but the download speeds are atrocious during the day. I definitely think the culprit is packet shaping.
You probably have some underlying problem. Start a thread, ask for help and post the requested info. Packetshaping is transparent and will not affect normal downloads such as updates from Microsoft.
Well, it's probably a widespread issue in my area (NEO). I have read other folks complaining of the same thing. Good web surfing speeds but downloading during off peak or peak hours is down to dial up speeds.

Anyhow, I am back to ATT DSL with a cheaper price than TWC-RR and at the advertised speeds. The only way TWC-RR would lower my price is if I chose another cable tv package (which I didn't want to do). ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19691336 Thu, 27 Dec 2007 08:23:55 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19688307 sovere1gnty :
said by derk See Profile :

I am cancelling TWC-RR NEO after having it for 18 months. This packet shaping is disturbing. I can run a speedtest and get great speeds and latency. BUT when I try and download a big file (non p2p) from msdn.microsoft.com or from ftp.redhat.com it's dialup speeds.

I could be wrong maybe it's that my area (NEO) is oversold via cable modem service, but the download speeds are atrocious during the day. I definitely think the culprit is packet shaping.
You probably have some underlying problem. Start a thread, ask for help and post the requested info. Packetshaping is transparent and will not affect normal downloads such as updates from Microsoft.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19688307 Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:57:21 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19688191 derk : I am cancelling TWC-RR NEO after having it for 18 months. This packet shaping is disturbing. I can run a speedtest and get great speeds and latency. BUT when I try and download a big file (non p2p) from msdn.microsoft.com or from ftp.redhat.com it's dialup speeds.

I could be wrong maybe it's that my area (NEO) is oversold via cable modem service, but the download speeds are atrocious during the day. I definitely think the culprit is packet shaping. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19688191 Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:32:46 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19637651 Selenia : Well I think my node is oversold these days, but this shaping seems to be fairly transparent now. Everything works fine but for ping spikes in the evening(they could be much worse, I used to have Rogers before I moved to the US). Everything works fine but for when BT is running. Encryption seems to beat that, as long as it's set to only initiate and accept such connections. If there is a lack of peers supporting it, a tunnel seems to do the trick.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19637651 Mon, 17 Dec 2007 11:44:19 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19582608 xNBKxZ3r0 : I've been a TWC customer since October. I had Cox back in Sept. and never got any notice providing any of that info. Of course Las Vegas has totally different rules and regulations than most other states. I'm not sure if Sandvine was aloud in Vegas but at this point anything is possible now.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19582608 Fri, 07 Dec 2007 17:10:26 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19575238 Xizer :
said by xNBKxZ3r0 See Profile :

I was a former Cox customer in Las Vegas before I moved to Moreno Valley, CA. Not once did I ever experience any issues with my connection. I would have to say that Cox had the most stable connection in Vegas than anyone else. I did use utorrent and never had problems with my downloads. But with TWC I've had nothing but problems from install date till present.
I was once a Cox customer as well. Things have changed in the past few months. Did you miss the notice that was posted in the news section a few weeks ago about them employing Sandvine?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19575238 Thu, 06 Dec 2007 14:18:49 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19574018 xNBKxZ3r0 : I was a former Cox customer in Las Vegas before I moved to Moreno Valley, CA. Not once did I ever experience any issues with my connection. I would have to say that Cox had the most stable connection in Vegas than anyone else. I did use utorrent and never had problems with my downloads. But with TWC I've had nothing but problems from install date till present. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19574018 Thu, 06 Dec 2007 10:51:41 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19573009 OB Kenobi :
said by ututman4 :

Will this explain the internet cutting off every 10 minutes?
No, that is just standard TWC service.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19573009 Thu, 06 Dec 2007 05:33:59 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19571412 Xizer : You people also seem to be forgetting about Cox and Comcast.

Both of these ISPs employ Sandvine, and I have personally experienced problems trying to download from a torrent with solely Comcast and Cox users seeding. I could usually download for about 15 seconds and then the connection would drop. I had to keep stopping and starting the torrent to inch my way along to completion.

This might not even be a problem on Time Warner's end, it could be a problem like I have described.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19571412 Wed, 05 Dec 2007 21:57:24 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19554922 SB7785 : Selenia, I use Utorrent. What are some suggested settings for max half open connections etc?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19554922 Mon, 03 Dec 2007 13:36:14 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19554390 Selenia :
said by Xizer See Profile :

said by Tom_S See Profile :

For several months I have been a customer of Time Warner Cable. I had a standard RR account. Around the middle of June this year, I began having problems using Bit Comet.
Problem found. At this point the post should end.
lol well Bitcomet is not the problem in respect to this, though that client is a problem for the sharing community at large. Neither is TWC. I have experienced TWC shaping and while it really sucks, it does not cut your connection. It's likely one of a few things. A) Your modem cannot handle lots of connections gracefully and lags or crashes. B) Your router cannot gracefully handle lots of connection, then lags or crashes. C) You have the max half open and/or max connections set way too high for your client and either the hardware can't handle it or you're getting snubbed for spreading your upload too thin. The solution to those 3 is turning down your max connections and max half-open in the client. It could also be D) You run Service Pack 2 and have not patched tcp.sys to handle the half open connections, causing Windows not to allow any new connections. As old ones die and are not detected right away, you may have no room for useful connections, D) Part 2 is you run Vista and have the client's max set too high.

Anyways, the Windows network stack sucks and so do alot of cheap modems and routers. If you want to be hardcore, use a Linux box, buy a good modem, and use an old pc running smoothwall through a hub as your router(you can even build a little underclocked box that uses little power and needs no fans). Otherwise, just chill on the number of connections you make. They are useless beyond a certain number anyways,]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19554390 Mon, 03 Dec 2007 12:08:20 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19505146 Stem Bolt : I posted this info over in the filesharing forum but looks like it could be of use here. For those who are considering looking for an alternative to bittorrents or new usenet providers. The providers offer unlimited accounts, have at least 100 days retention, and charge less then $15. Several offer free SSL.

»www.megabitz.net/

110 days retention, free SSL, $13.95 a month- unlimited, 8 connections with quarterly plan, 5 connections on the month to month plan.

»www.newsrazor.net/

100+ days retention, $10.95 for the first 3 months - then $14.95 there after, 10 connections

»www.blocknews.net/

100+ days retention, free SSL, $14.89 a month- unlimited, 12 connections

»eweka.nl/en/home//

Located in The Netherlands.
120 days retention, 7.50 Euro a month- which converts to $11.12 U.S.- unlimited, 8 connections,

»www.hitnews.eu/english/

Also located in The Netherlands.
100 days retention, free SSL, 6.50 Euro a month- which converts to $9.65 U.S. - unlimited, 8 connections]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19505146 Sun, 25 Nov 2007 12:13:49 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19505053 GTaylor : My only other option here is AT&T and they're just as bad, but at the pace RR is going they're looking better every day.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19505053 Sun, 25 Nov 2007 11:56:48 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19503521 Xizer :
said by Tom_S See Profile :

For several months I have been a customer of Time Warner Cable. I had a standard RR account. Around the middle of June this year, I began having problems using Bit Comet.
Problem found. At this point the post should end.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19503521 Sun, 25 Nov 2007 00:21:57 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19503507 Tom_S : For several months I have been a customer of Time Warner Cable. I had a standard RR account. Around the middle of June this year, I began having problems using Bit Comet. I would start downloading several torrents, and when coming back to check on them, would notice both the DL and UL rates had degenerated to 0. Also, when I tried to access any other other Internet facet (Http/Instant Messengers/etc) it appeared as though I had no connection, although the on-line light was still on. I originally thought it was because I had recently upgraded my version of Bit Comet, but it was also happening, if not nearly so often, to my roommate. Unfortunately, I had no knowledge of any sort of traffic maintenance technology. I could still get max DL/UL speed for several hours at a time, so I just considered it a minor inconvenience and dealt with it. Earlier this month, I moved to another location, and had RR installed there. Several days of the same, then suddenly, I was getting disconnected in a matter of minutes. I downloaded Azureus, thinking maybe it was just a problem with Bit Comet. For about a day, it seemed to work. Then I came home after staying at a friend's house one night, and again, my internet was still connected, I could access nothing. I reset my modem, and the torrents started downloading again, but went down to 0K/s in a matter of minutes. It was at this time that I started looking for answers on help forums. I soon found out about traffic shaping, and used all the prescribed fixes to try and bypass it (encryption,port forwarding,etc), and notice little improvement. I happened upon an obscure page on the TW website showing that there was a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. Finally, I called TW and cancelled my account.

I returned the equipment immediately and requested a refund as I was within the 30 day period. The desk secretary said she would have to leave a memo for her supervisor, as she did not know as to whether or not I was entitled to a refund. I went home, called tech support, and explained my situation. Amazingly, the technician knew what I was talking about, and told me that "virtually every ISP now uses traffic shaping.' After trying to con me into upgrading to the Turbo account, he realised I was not changing my mind, and informed me that I would be receiving a check in the mail for a full refund. That was yesterday, so it may be a while before I receive it.

My friend, who also has RR, was not as badly affected as me. Though she still suffers low speeds, her connection is not completely frozen like mine. This might be attributable to the fact that she has a different modem than me.

So to all the skeptics. Time Warner IS and HAS BEEN using traffic shaping. Some people may not be affected as strongly, or, at all by it, if they are lucky, but if you get a knowledgeable enough technician, they will tell you it is FACT, not speculation.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19503507 Sun, 25 Nov 2007 00:18:39 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19121842 djrobx : If traffic shaping is implemented at all, and if it's implemented properly, it's supposed to only affect certain types of "chronically high consumption" services like usenet and torrents during high traffic periods. In theory, it would protect other types of traffic (web, gaming, etc) from slowing down due to the former types of activities when their network is peaked out.

--
Laser eye surgery rocks! I love frickin' laser beams.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19121842 Fri, 21 Sep 2007 21:48:22 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19116176 anon : I read the first three pages, and that's what I got out of it. There's not way I'm reading all 28 pages.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19116176 Thu, 20 Sep 2007 23:39:58 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19116150 hobgoblin :
said by ututman4 :

So the whole thing will just end up slowing down our internet to a speed much less than we pay for?
No...Read the thread.

Hob
--
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19116150 Thu, 20 Sep 2007 23:33:55 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19116129 anon : So the whole thing will just end up slowing down our internet to a speed much less than we pay for?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19116129 Thu, 20 Sep 2007 23:28:03 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19115884 hobgoblin :
said by ututman4 :

Will this explain the internet cutting off every 10 minutes? Often times websites won't load and AIM cuts off. Could this explain it all? Plus, online gaming is sucking it up.
No its nothing to do with it.

Hob
--
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19115884 Thu, 20 Sep 2007 22:46:02 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19115819 anon : Will this explain the internet cutting off every 10 minutes? Often times websites won't load and AIM cuts off. Could this explain it all? Plus, online gaming is sucking it up.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19115819 Thu, 20 Sep 2007 22:35:34 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19071896 Mele20 : Hmmm...so it is not just Hawaii seeing a disappearance of ATDN. I wonder what is going on...

I do believe ATDN is dead or almost so. Site has a copywrite date of 2003. The Server certificate is outdated as June 28, 2007. One page on the site has a more recent date of Feb 2006. Looking at the map there, there are (were) FOUR connections from Hawaii to two locations in Los Angeles, one in San Jose and one in Sunnyvale. No wonder that I had perfect speed to everywhere on the Mainland from summer 2003-Jan 2005 (with a few trouble times that fixed). My speed then, when the cap was 3000kbps was 3100-3200 even on nac.net speed test.
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19071896 Fri, 14 Sep 2007 02:18:18 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19070386 Selenia :
said by Mele20 See Profile :

So are you seeing a lot of traffic on L3 rather than on ATDN? ATDN is so much better than L3 and I can't figure out why ATDN has been almost dropped from any usage here in Hawaii. I far preferred it to L3...especially the mess with L3 in Los Angeles that all routing is forced through now from Hawaii.
Almost all my traffic is on level3 these days and only very rare sites use ATDN. This used to be the opposite. Even this site used to route through ATDN but now it routes through level3 for me. Even all servers internationally handoff through level3 to the foreign backbone, though in the case of Europe, it usually hands off to level3 over there then hands over to a direct peer of X host. In the case of my torrent server I told you about, it goes RR->level3 USA, level3 Europe-> Tiscali(a direct peer of theirs)-> my host. Almost all in Europe follow the same kind of path, except a few don't leave level3 at all before reaching the host, which probably means level3 peers directly with them.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19070386 Thu, 13 Sep 2007 21:23:03 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19068034 dbmaven : "PINGS" and "LATENCY" have nothing whatsoever to do with packet shaping.

From this point forward, any posts that are not diretly related to packet shaping and the original topic will be deleted.

If you're having a "problem" with latency/pings/line quality, look for a recent thread that's dealing with your geographic area, or start a new thread.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19068034 Thu, 13 Sep 2007 14:43:30 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19067981 anon : WEll, I have been getting really high pings lateley. My latency for NYC gaming servers is usually between 20-40. Around 7:30EST, my ping gradually increases. By 9:00 i have over 200ms. I am so fed up, and FIoS is not in my neighborhood yet. They are sending someone out to take a look at this. They denied that it had anything to do with the packet shaping, and said it is most likely caused by a weak signal. I have been living in the same place for 4 years, and have never had this problem before the last 3 weeks. Hmmm ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19067981 Thu, 13 Sep 2007 14:33:55 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19062376 Mele20 : So are you seeing a lot of traffic on L3 rather than on ATDN? ATDN is so much better than L3 and I can't figure out why ATDN has been almost dropped from any usage here in Hawaii. I far preferred it to L3...especially the mess with L3 in Los Angeles that all routing is forced through now from Hawaii.
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19062376 Wed, 12 Sep 2007 17:54:12 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19061293 Selenia : Hob is trying to say to redo it on another server because the one in NY is not operating correctly, which could also make it measure a bad ping falsely. btw @ Matt123, was this taken on Monday? I was having a crap time on almost anything Monday, which seems to be becoming a trend. Tuesday it was fine, today fine as well. It seems very local servers are fine on Monday as well, but nothing else is, even just several states away, nevermind international. I am beginning to possibly blame level3 and not Time Warner as I look at latency at different hops, mainly the variance being greater than normal highs and lows.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19061293 Wed, 12 Sep 2007 15:23:49 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19059540 alienstout : Well it may not affect speed tests but look at his ping! Good luck trying to game for long with that lag.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19059540 Wed, 12 Sep 2007 10:55:10 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19056748 hobgoblin :
said by Matt123 :

Hi its peak time right now and this is what i am getting.



So much for my 10mbps down
Two points:

Packet shaping does not affect speed tests
the speedtest server in NY has been forked for weeks.
--
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19056748 Tue, 11 Sep 2007 21:48:00 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19056611 punker : i would have an bad ass Ratio with that 10Gig/

is that up or down]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19056611 Tue, 11 Sep 2007 21:31:28 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19056124 anon : Hi its peak time right now and this is what i am getting.



So much for my 10mbps down]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19056124 Tue, 11 Sep 2007 20:23:10 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19040666 MacLeech :
said by Xizer See Profile :

Where does Time Warner offer 80 Mbps service?!!
Check here:
»twcbc.com/corporate/products/dat···?menu=85
said by Time Warner Business Class website :
Bandwidth available from 1 Mbps to 10 Gbps.
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19040666 Sun, 09 Sep 2007 13:19:34 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19040544 Xizer :
said by FTW :

I pay for 10MB I should get 10MB period!
Holy shit! Where does Time Warner offer 80 Mbps service?!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19040544 Sun, 09 Sep 2007 12:50:55 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19039373 punker : :
said by Mele20 See Profile :

That would be useful. Thank you.

Having made the comment I did about Linux downloads always being slow, I just downloaded Ubuntu from »www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/downloa···Download
at 550KB/sec. I was quite surprised as about six months ago, ubuntu was very slow downloading.
i am only getting 500KByte/s

Nice Try..... :uhh:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19039373 Sun, 09 Sep 2007 05:23:03 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19039371 punker :
said by FTW :

I pay for 10MBit/s I should get 10MBit/s period!

fixed it for you]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19039371 Sun, 09 Sep 2007 05:21:37 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19039011 anon : I pay for 10MB I should get 10MB period!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19039011 Sun, 09 Sep 2007 01:33:38 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19037145 anon : TWC has no reason to upgrade... In 90%+ of the cities TWC operates in, there is not competition that offers anything higher than what they do... So wheres the reasoning?

I would think that the real answer is for more competition of reliable HSD connections be established before we see anything new from TWC.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19037145 Sat, 08 Sep 2007 19:09:26 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19036792 anon : I pay almost $200 a month for 10/1 with a static and TV I should be able to do what I want, they make enough money to upgrade!

Look at FIOS from Verizon 35/5 for $180 and 15/2 for $50

TW needs to F'N wake the h*ll up!

The internet is growing not slowing!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19036792 Sat, 08 Sep 2007 18:07:24 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18973113 anon : if you wish to defeat the packet shaping on news servers using port 119, just enable SSL encryption and move to a non standard nntp port. this way you will go back up to full speed ahead ;-)

they wont be able to prove what the data is your moving across their lines... so your safe ;-)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18973113 Wed, 29 Aug 2007 12:55:02 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18963979 Mele20 : That would be useful. Thank you.

Having made the comment I did about Linux downloads always being slow, I just downloaded Ubuntu from »www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/downloa···Download
at 550KB/sec. I was quite surprised as about six months ago, ubuntu was very slow downloading.
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18963979 Tue, 28 Aug 2007 02:44:17 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18947503 Selenia : It's not where the site is, it's where the peers are. I have a seedbox for torrents in EU and could pass you a .torrent of legal content so you can see how your speed is. This box is optimally tuned to the point that I max out from it here on the East Coast when I'm not being shaped. I still get about 600 KB/sec off it when I am.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18947503 Sat, 25 Aug 2007 11:26:26 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18946787 Mele20 : The node is not congested. I get excellent speed and pings on Ping Plotter to the "mini" Hawaii RR RDC at Mililani, Oahu. The problem I suspect is from the main RDC at Orange Road Runner in California. Hawaii has taken a beating from all that mess there in Los Angeles.

U. Hawaii Web100 based Network Diagnostic Tool (NDT)
TCP/Web100 Network Diagnostic Tool v5.3.3a
click START to begin
Checking for Middleboxes . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Done
running 10s outbound test (client to server) . . . . . 368.94Kb/s
running 10s inbound test (server to client) . . . . . . 4.90Mb/s
Your PC is connected to a Cable/DSL modem

Oceanic: using Sun Java on XP Pro SP1 on a VMWare virtual machine:
4.92/410
QOS 97%, RTT 21ms, max pause 115ms

Oceanic: using MSJVM on XP Pro SP2 on my host machine:
4.86/420
QOS 99%, RTT 17ms, max pause 16ms

"Maximum pause" says VisualWare's MySpeed Help should ALWAYS be below 100ms.
I think that 115ms is falsely inflated because it was on a virtual machine.
On the host machine it is usually about 16ms doing the Oceanic test. When
Oceanic is having problems it shoots way up to maybe 600-1000ms.

I'm using the Java version of the tests:
Megapath SanFranciso:
3714 / 140 (Kbps)

Speakeasy, Palo Alto:
4625 / 331 (Kbps)

Linkline, Los Angeles:
4625 / 350 (Kbps)

NetAccess New Jersey:
2411 / 342

Speakeasy New York:
3391 / 343

DSL Extreme: (chose Southern California)
4223 / 360 (Kbps)

UC Santa Cruz Web100 based Network Diagnostic Tool (NDT)
4.57ms/358kbps

:::.. testmy.net test results ..:::
Download Connection is:: 5076 Kbps about 5.08 Mbps (tested with 5983 kB)
Download Speed is:: 620 kB/s
Upload Connection is:: 343 Kbps about 0.3 Mbps (tested with 579 kB)
Upload Speed is:: 42 kB/s
Tested From:: »testmy.net (Main)
Test Time:: 2007/08/12 - 2:34am
D-Validation Link:: »testmy.net/stats/id-XFB471YOE
U-Validation Link:: »testmy.net/stats/id-UOHQ0LC53
User Agent:: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; ; rv:1.8.1)
Gecko/20061010 Firefox/1.9.0.1 [!]

ANL Web100 based Network Diagnostic Tester (NDT)
National Science Foundation - VA
4.32ms/361kbps

Those are mostly good speeds (except for East Coast) but I don't see the equivalent when I download from websites or from BitTorrent. Except I get good download speed sometimes from Pirate's Bay. Why I don't know since that is in Europe. I have only downloaded a few times from there and once was extremely slow but the last time was fast. I almost never get above 300KB/sec from website downloads no matter where the website is located. Most downloads are at around 150-200KB/sec. When we had a 3ms cap (before Jan 2005), I got 365-370KB/sec on almost any download anywhere in the USA at any time of day or night. That changed drastically and immediately upon upgrade to 5ms down and while speed tests generally look ok (especially late at night when I did those above), actual download speeds are lousy from most every site (or via BitTorrent). Ironic that I had better download speed when the cap was 3ms than I do with it at 5ms.
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18946787 Sat, 25 Aug 2007 07:12:13 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18946466 Selenia : @Mele20, your speeds are much worse than the shaping here, how congested is your node? Try off people from japan, it's probably the closest routing for you, given how my traceroutes from servers I run go and it's almost the only Asian country with a few ISPs that do not throttle.

@vick04 Not really true. Hawaii usually bounces straight to California on RR due to their network setup. This has been proven by people here in the past who submitted traceroutes. So actually downloading from CA peers might be ok for mele20 as well but Japan has fatter pipes(I download some Japanese content myself). EU would likely be horrible going over the stretch from HI to CA then likely over level 3 to above.net before hitting Global Crossing(glbx) or ATDN, depending seemingly on the server's peering on the other end.(RR generally prefers ATDN if something can be routed directly, but this is in the hands of its peers to an extent).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18946466 Sat, 25 Aug 2007 03:33:34 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18940182 vick04 : Mele20 your problem is not packet shapping. Your problem is simply your location. You are getting slow speeds downloading linux distros because most of the seeds are people in the us. You got better speeds on pirate bay because most seeds on there are from european countrys. The way time warner routeing is setup you would be better off downloading from sites outside of the us.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18940182 Fri, 24 Aug 2007 09:27:26 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18939879 Mele20 : I turned off the router, unplugged the modem, rebooted and plogged the modem directly to the computer. No difference in download speed of that Linux distro. The problem is NOT the router and it not because I won't use that patch because both Bit Torrent and the link you provided state that the patch is totally unnecessary. I already proved it isn't ICF.

Linux distros are the very slowest of anything to get on BitTorrent. Anything Linux is going to be extremely slow. I have gotten with the router running, and ICF on, and no tcpip patch, 350KB/sec from Pirate's Bay so I think the problem is that you told me to try a very slow download...Linux stuff is always slow...I never want to get Linux on BitTorrent.
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18939879 Fri, 24 Aug 2007 08:19:56 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18938436 Mele20 : That's not my router. :) I enabled UPnP in the router some time ago for Microsoft live folders and my reward was to get locked out of the router interface. (I later learned here that this has happened to most everyone using this particular Linksy router due to a bug Linksy never bothered fixing and the only solution is to reset it to factory defaults which is a hassle because I use beta firmware). At any rate, UpnP is enabled in the router.

BitTorrent does not list my router as problematic for a large number of connections (it lists ver 4 only of my router).

According to those links you gave me it is unnecessary to apply that tcpip patch if using utorrent and I would assume the same for BitTorrent and there are dangers in using it plus my AV alerts on it and excluding in Avira is the pits (I just complained again about that in their forum).

ICF has BitTorrent in the exceptions list so it should not causing any problems.

I'll install BitTorrent on my virtual XP Pro SP1 machine and see if it is the 10 connection attempt limit in Service Pack 2 that is causing a problem on the host machine.

EDIT: I installed BitTorrent on my virtual machine on XP Pro SP1 with no connection attempt limits and that made no difference. I was getting no higher than 125KB/sec on that Linux download after an hour. Most of the time it was around 50KB/sec.

--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18938436 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 23:33:10 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18937834 war59312 : They where not, it was a bug with the packet shaping. That's all. Not everyone was effected, in fact I was told only a handful of people in my area where.
--
GOD BLESS THE U.S.A]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18937834 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 22:09:06 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18937513 punker : well

your running an firewall

a router that is not port forwarded -----see this Guide »www.portforward.com/english/rout···rent.htm

and your using xp sp2 with out tcpip patch (EventID 4226)
got to fix these if you want it to work

»utorrent.com/faq.php#I_get_a_soc···nt_halts

»utorrent.com/faq.php#Why_are_my_···_slow.3F]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18937513 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 21:30:17 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18937481 Mele20 :
said by punker See Profile :

Well your in HI maybe that is why?
maybe too many Peers ?
slow seeds?

try that linux iso
Yeah...I got 7KB today for the linux iso. Last night, for about two minutes it went as high as 560KB then dropped to 120KB and down again to 84KB until I paused it. I have never gotten decent download on any BitTorrent. BitTorrent is MUCH slower download always than downloading from a website or FTP.
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18937481 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 21:25:47 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18935034 Selenia :
said by djrobx See Profile :

Why would they start shaping XBox 360 traffic then stop later?

This thread is making it abundantly clear to me why ISPs are so secretive about policy changes. At this rate someone's going claim Traffic Shaping gave them gonorrhea! :)
But it did I tell you! No but seriously, it could have been a mistake at their end. Many might recall the traffic shaping case in the UK with Talk Talk where World of Warcraft was accidentally all but blocked. My friend had pings from 2000-5000 ms until they finally fixed that(since then he's dumped that ISP). I can give some indisputables. I never had issues with peak time speeds but now the most I can get off Usenet during peak(and it's a sharp dropoff) is about 600-650 KB/sec unsteady. During the day, I get what I used to get which is my full 10 mbps or about 1.2 MB/sec steady. This has been repeated and consistent, unlike torrents where seeders could simply be blamed unless you know a particular seeder's normal line performance. TWC isn't shutting off torrents as my speeds are sometimes comparable to Usenet on well seeded torrents with seedboxes. I tested off my box to determine torrent speed results and it seems no more shaped than Usenet, though encryption gives me full speed back.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18935034 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 15:22:59 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18933806 djrobx : Why would they start shaping XBox 360 traffic then stop later?

This thread is making it abundantly clear to me why ISPs are so secretive about policy changes. At this rate someone's going claim Traffic Shaping gave them gonorrhea! :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18933806 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 12:15:50 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18932209 punker : Well your in HI maybe that is why?
maybe too many Peers ?
slow seeds?

try that linux iso]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18932209 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 05:03:43 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18932166 Mele20 : Hmph...I can't download more than one torrent at a time and never get above 250KB/sec and usually more like 40KB/sec. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18932166 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 04:25:50 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18931860 punker : were talking about upload
(Seeding)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18931860 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 01:34:20 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18931532 Xizer : Meh, I think the problem is being exaggerated. I haven't experienced any problems with torrents.
Click for full size
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18931532 Thu, 23 Aug 2007 00:19:53 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18930626 Selenia : Slow down guys, the problem only lasted a few days as I thought my post implied. As I said, packet shaping even in the worst implementations is not meant to affect that kind of traffic, but I think there was an aberration around here they fixed. I was on Rogers when they just started doing this heavily(yes, I'm from Canada) and my XBL pings were fine on them. Seemed to be some kind of control, if not the shaping itself, as my pings and speeds on some other things were fine during the evenings I was having an issue,]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18930626 Wed, 22 Aug 2007 21:49:25 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18930604 Baseline : They're shaping XBlive traffic now?

Geez. 360 users just can't get a break. It's bad enough the vast majority are gonna get a RROD and have to go into the vicious service cycle if they haven't already.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18930604 Wed, 22 Aug 2007 21:47:24 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18924491 war59312 : They where! It has been fixed. Was a "bug". Yeah right, but either way working fine now...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18924491 Wed, 22 Aug 2007 04:20:32 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18917338 kshymkiw : How do you know they are packet shaping your XBL connection? My PS3 connection works just fine. OH NOES THAT MEANS TWC HATES MICROSOFT BUT LOOOOOOOOVES SONY.

seriously now.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18917338 Tue, 21 Aug 2007 08:29:14 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916607 punker : »Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User

Packet Shaping

is a myth

and is Busted

Terayon TJ715x Would not break 125KByte/s
Moto SB5100 would not go any faster then 500KByte/s
Ambit SpeedStrem u10C018 900KByte/s to 1.1MByte/s

Upload At 85KByte/s

using 10/1 on RoadRunner]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916607 Tue, 21 Aug 2007 01:47:11 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916471 hayabusa3303 :
said by Selenia See Profile :

It was but now it doesn't seem to. Maybe TWC got the shaper properly allowing XBox Live traffic. It wasn't meant to slow down XBL at all, but unfortunately it did. Hopefully things stay good now and a few other things improve.
Not here in Sc live is running with no lag or and 54 ms ping time. Wife is on live no as i type this out and she is seeing no lag anywhere. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916471 Tue, 21 Aug 2007 01:01:39 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916329 hobgoblin :
said by war59312 See Profile :

Indeed, but they still should have read it and would have realized that users hate packet shaping for good reasons and that its just going to piss their users off and that their are better options out there...
Ok go get them.......]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916329 Tue, 21 Aug 2007 00:23:35 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916186 war59312 : Indeed, but they still should have read it and would have realized that users hate packet shaping for good reasons and that its just going to piss their users off and that their are better options out there...
--
GOD BLESS THE U.S.A]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916186 Mon, 20 Aug 2007 23:55:04 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916180 war59312 : No because they are still packet shaping my xbox 360. :(

Cant even host a game of Gears of War. I called today and they said its a known issue and they are working on it... Whatever that means... Tech guy was not willing to give details...
--
GOD BLESS THE U.S.A]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18916180 Mon, 20 Aug 2007 23:53:58 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18915720 hobgoblin :
said by Selenia See Profile :

It was but now it doesn't seem to. Maybe TWC got the shaper properly allowing XBox Live traffic. It wasn't meant to slow down XBL at all, but unfortunately it did. Hopefully things stay good now and a few other things improve.
Or maybe it was another issue.

:)
--
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18915720 Mon, 20 Aug 2007 22:38:33 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18915676 Selenia : It was but now it doesn't seem to. Maybe TWC got the shaper properly allowing XBox Live traffic. It wasn't meant to slow down XBL at all, but unfortunately it did. Hopefully things stay good now and a few other things improve.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18915676 Mon, 20 Aug 2007 22:33:05 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18911590 anon : does anybody know if this affects xbox live?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18911590 Mon, 20 Aug 2007 11:51:58 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18910840 swhx7 : The Sandvine technique that Comcast is using (see that thread) is not just throttling (limiting amount of transfer). It's selective sabotage using forged packets to prevent seeding on bittorrent.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18910840 Mon, 20 Aug 2007 09:33:02 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18907602 fsmartin1 : I don't understand where packet shaping is going to improve a thing either for the consumer or RR.
full throttle = 20 minutes of use.
half throttle = 40 minutes of use.
The more the throttle the more time spent for the download.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18907602 Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:46:49 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18900259 war59312 : But your not in SC... Anyone out there?

Interesting read:

»www.sandvine.com/general/getfile···ILEID=16

TWC should have read this before they took action...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18900259 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 11:25:04 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18900250 Selenia : I noticed I had a typo. I can download at full speed at *off-peak* times. Anyways, I pretty well know the time warner system in this area as 2 relatives that work for them(unfortunately they have no power over this, I already asked lol). The node I'm on is very small.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18900250 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 11:23:02 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18900246 war59312 : OK after all night torrent download the average is 26.5 kB/s. :( Pretty darn sad...

By the way the node is siting in my front yard. And only two people on my street have RR. I am the only heavy user. It took them 5+ years to bring RR to me. I had to beg basically.

Oh and OMG I still cant get DSL for some reason. Even though a family friend right down the street can. And he is further away from the hub than I am. According to the bell south home page DSL is not available for my phone number. :( I could have sworn it was just months ago.

Update: oh wait perhaps its because I have RR Digital phone?

See that is the problem I have cable, phone, and internet all from TMC. There is no other cable or VOIP provider in my area either. So really I am shit out of luck. TWC is the only option.

And no I can not get satellite either. We tried!
--
GOD BLESS THE U.S.A]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18900246 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 11:22:33 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18899809 plat2on1 :
said by Selenia See Profile :

Must be according to load as they say. I am throttled bad at peak times, but not quite that bad. I know my node has no people who are heavy users though, which is what makes me sick. I live in an area where neighbors know neighbors well. In fact, few of them have RR period. Most have Verizon dsl now that they have extended to this area. I might have to look into it(most of them upgraded from dial up because they held off on getting RR since Time Warner is so hated here). At least I can download full speed at peak times. I seldom use RR for torrents except Linux distros. I am more concerned with their throttling impacting games, sftp, and Usenet.
unless you know everyone in the entire area your headend covers that means nothing. multiple nodes can be combined on to the same port.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18899809 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 09:29:37 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18899807 anon : After experiencing the same issues as everyone else, I've started a blog on the very issue. I think it's going to take a petition or a huge number of customers/press shaking the tree to get back our "High Speed Internet" rather than high speed web browsing and email. =)

If you'd like to help with the blog by making posts, email me.

»slow-roadrunner-timewarner.blogspot.com/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18899807 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 09:28:43 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18899452 punker : useable rates for me @ 8mbps or 1megabyte/s]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18899452 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 06:16:31 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18899081 Selenia : Must be according to load as they say. I am throttled bad at peak times, but not quite that bad. I know my node has no people who are heavy users though, which is what makes me sick. I live in an area where neighbors know neighbors well. In fact, few of them have RR period. Most have Verizon dsl now that they have extended to this area. I might have to look into it(most of them upgraded from dial up because they held off on getting RR since Time Warner is so hated here). At least I can download full speed at peak times. I seldom use RR for torrents except Linux distros. I am more concerned with their throttling impacting games, sftp, and Usenet.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18899081 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 02:24:31 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18898687 war59312 : Downloading a torrent:

3.4 kB/s (avg. 5.5 kB/s)

Oh my God. This sucks big time. This is downloading a linux distro with over 2000 seeds.

Connected to over 84 seeds and 60 other people atm and going this slow. :(

Tried many different torrents and same thing.

Using uTorrent and encryption is enabled... Port is successfully forwarded. Running Windows XP SP2. Yes tried different client and without encryption and same result.

Yes tried on different computer and same thing.

Stupid RR is 100% throttling torrents to basically unusable rates. God I really hate RR!!!!!!!!
--
GOD BLESS THE U.S.A]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18898687 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 00:12:40 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18890831 Baseline :
said by Nocturnal01 See Profile :

said by Baseline See Profile :

said by Nocturnal01 See Profile :

You have to wonder how all the newsgroup companies like Giganews and the like are feeling. I wonder if they'll take a significant hit? I know I'm cancelling my Giganews account as soon as I find out for certain that RR shapes my traffic and can no longer download at max speeds. I will give up on my account and I'm sure many others will to. There's no point in using Usenet if they cap it at 30KBps. That would be stupid. I wonder though how the newsgroup companies are going to take this. I hope they say something and not just take it up the ass.
Might be a little quick OT, but, don't you have access to the RR free newsgroup access included with your service? If so, why do you continue to pay for giganews? Is it just for the extra retention time?
Personally it's the speed I get (20 connections) and also the retention.
Ah I see. I get my full speed with 15 connections here on the RR newsgroups, which is typically around 1750 KB/s. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18890831 Thu, 16 Aug 2007 22:31:44 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18889252 war59312 : Well, my connection is now back to where it is suppose to be after talking to a RR rep for over an hour. Idiots! Damn hub down the street completely overloaded.

But now I am capped at 50 KB/s for newsgroups. Still sucks! Always got over 900 KB/s. :(

Very lame!
--
GOD BLESS THE U.S.A]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18889252 Thu, 16 Aug 2007 18:32:08 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18888962 Selenia : I will say that Giganews has the best retention, which is a big benefit for the big downloaders or those who don't check regularly. There is no reason not to recommend it and I wasn't saying anything bad about it myself(not sure about this guy though),
More on topic, I can get my full 10 mbps on RR's server when not shaped, which was only recently, I still get about 600 KB/sec when the peak time traffic shaping kicks in, but still full speed during the day. I'm not sure where your speed problems may lie. Have you tried pinging the server when the traffic shaper is off? How about a traceroute? I have a feeling you might have a latency spike somewhere, which can be worked around to a decent extent. I don't think it's your line if you're doing well on Giganews,]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18888962 Thu, 16 Aug 2007 17:45:58 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18888801 Nocturnal01 :
said by Baseline See Profile :

said by Nocturnal01 See Profile :

You have to wonder how all the newsgroup companies like Giganews and the like are feeling. I wonder if they'll take a significant hit? I know I'm cancelling my Giganews account as soon as I find out for certain that RR shapes my traffic and can no longer download at max speeds. I will give up on my account and I'm sure many others will to. There's no point in using Usenet if they cap it at 30KBps. That would be stupid. I wonder though how the newsgroup companies are going to take this. I hope they say something and not just take it up the ass.
Might be a little quick OT, but, don't you have access to the RR free newsgroup access included with your service? If so, why do you continue to pay for giganews? Is it just for the extra retention time?
Personally it's the speed I get (20 connections) and also the retention.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18888801 Thu, 16 Aug 2007 17:20:59 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18887783 Selenia : All I can say is RR sucks even more now, This goes with their general way of thinking though.

said by The Roadrunner wigs' thoughts :
Let's see...we'll speed up page loads with traffic shaping by 10 ms because people get broadband to show off how fast they can load pages! Duh! It don't matter we trash not only LEGAL torrents because that's the only method of piracy. It don't matter we also trash Usenet speeds and ping times in various MMORPG and other games because people shouldn't be using their broadband connections for that. They don't pay enough.


Now to the facts. It's just TWC cheaping out on upgrading. In fact, they don't even hurt piracy that much for those who know about things other than torrents. What they are mainly hurting is 2 of the biggest broadband consumers outside pirates, whom actually use relatively little bandwidth-Linux users and online gamers.

They even shape their own Usenet server during the evening hours. Why Time Warner? I see no real purpose in this, After all, it is your own server that you don't have to pay alot in peering for. Also, Usenet connections are far fewer than torrents and other services. I would at least think you would be encouraging its use to bring down network strain from downloaders, especially considering they don't have to upload anywhere, including people on your own network. No, it's not my computer. I get full speed off TWC's great free Usenet server(I have no problem giving them credit for what they do right, I even dropped Giganews since I'm not a huge downloader and this Usenet meets my needs) all hours of the morning until evening hours if I want it, but it drops to about half speed during "peak" hours. It's workable, unlike some other things, but why?

ISPs need to view BitTorrent in a better light perhaps, since it's not the final frontier of pirates and is quite useful. Much of bigger free Linux content, including distros, are distributed using this method. They are even working on an updater for apt to relieve strain on their servers and financial resources, which can be limited. Yes, torrents can stick it to the man, but not because of piracy. They allow small developers to distribute things as widely as Microsoft could at a fraction of the cost. I am not arguing that this doesn't put on a decent amount of network strain. It just calls for infrastructure. I don't agree with shaping not just because I see it as a soft form of censorship. Time Warner has even touched on the subject in the past that it's not the bandwidth, but the amount of connections. Well, keeping people on a torrent 3x as long will cause a rise in the amount of sustained network connections as people wait 3x as long for their downloads due to the slow pool of uploaders this creates and the shaping on the end user as well. It's common sense. A better system might be to only shape when X number of concurrent connections are reached, perhaps more aggressively. This will attack the issue at hand without people feeling they are being too restricted because it will encourage allowing less connections to avoid the shaping.

OK gaming. This is where it gets tricky as some resemble BT protocols(see above solution) and some are just very dynamic as to source and destination ports with a combination of TCP and UDP packets. I will admit my ping times improved on maybe 2 games in the evening, but not too significantly. The rest plainly stink. This is too complicated of issue for general shaping but fact is this uses very little bandwidth and maybe a max of 10 connections. If the shaping were triggered by say 100+ concurrent connections, this would be no issue at all. This is something TWC must fix or they may lose 50% of their subscriber base to alternatives once considered lesser ones in the past. I did hook my pc to my friend's wireless dsl just to see and my ping times are fine on the wireless. Also, [ping times were fine during the day on Roadrunner, just horrendous during peak hours, which I'm not sure if peak is really until 2-3 AM.

Bottom line RR is you need to look at not infringing your customers' activities. You'll need upgrades from time to time, but as you saw by my examples, there are much less invasive but effective methods of shaping traffic. Please consider your customers' individuality and don't assume we all get a high speed connection for e-mail. Other things seemed shaped to, like sftp, which causes almost no network load and is almost never used by pirates. I use it for downloading off the servers at work, if you must know, so I can take some home with me, burn it, and continue with it the next day at work. You can see, however, why I'd use an encrypted protocol for that.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18887783 Thu, 16 Aug 2007 15:02:19 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18886272 Baseline :
said by Nocturnal01 See Profile :

You have to wonder how all the newsgroup companies like Giganews and the like are feeling. I wonder if they'll take a significant hit? I know I'm cancelling my Giganews account as soon as I find out for certain that RR shapes my traffic and can no longer download at max speeds. I will give up on my account and I'm sure many others will to. There's no point in using Usenet if they cap it at 30KBps. That would be stupid. I wonder though how the newsgroup companies are going to take this. I hope they say something and not just take it up the ass.
Might be a little quick OT, but, don't you have access to the RR free newsgroup access included with your service? If so, why do you continue to pay for giganews? Is it just for the extra retention time?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18886272 Thu, 16 Aug 2007 11:23:02 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18884563 Rook008 : That's odd. When I use RR's news servers I get around 900 during peak times and 1100 during non-peak times. And I've never used a whole lot of upload to download at my connection's max speed.
--
You've crossed the finish line. Won the race but lost your mind. Was it worth it, after all?
"Superman" -Lazlo Bane]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18884563 Thu, 16 Aug 2007 01:44:39 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18884442 Nocturnal01 : You have to wonder how all the newsgroup companies like Giganews and the like are feeling. I wonder if they'll take a significant hit? I know I'm cancelling my Giganews account as soon as I find out for certain that RR shapes my traffic and can no longer download at max speeds. I will give up on my account and I'm sure many others will to. There's no point in using Usenet if they cap it at 30KBps. That would be stupid. I wonder though how the newsgroup companies are going to take this. I hope they say something and not just take it up the ass.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18884442 Thu, 16 Aug 2007 01:17:50 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18883272 swhx7 :
said by hobgoblin See Profile :

said by swhx7 See Profile :

"There's a big controversy about network neutrality. Traffic discrimination has a bad reputation among a large and influential sector of the public. This provides a natural incentive for big ISPs to conceal or play down any such policies they may have going on."
Actually packet shaping has nothing to do with network Neutrality.

If you are serious, read from the beginning. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18883272 Wed, 15 Aug 2007 22:10:46 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18882709 punker : yea you need 200Kbit/s upload to get 10.0 mbps down

i get over 800KByte/s on download (torrent) with upload at 90Kbyte/s
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Note to MOD: that file is a Linux iso
Click for full size
Torrent FTW
Click for full size
800Kbyte/s
Click for full size
Linux torrent FTW
Click for full size
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18882709 Wed, 15 Aug 2007 20:51:23 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18882625 sovere1gnty :
said by jamesarm97 :

I have had a problem for the last week and just came across this. I noticed that one night when I was trying to download one file (torrent), page loads took forever. DNS lookups took forever. I thought it was my firewall / server so I rebooted it repeatedly and restarted the modem.

I have the small business tier and should not be limited like this. Once I stopped the torrent my speed magically jumped up. Same thing happened tonight and I guy at work complained about the same thing.

While torrenting 1 file which was only downloading at 27k/sec I did a speed test:

170kbps down, 17kbps up.

It would take near a minute to load one website. I stoped the torrent and did a speed test again:

4338kbps down, 187kbps up.

I can understand limiting the download, but what happens when I want to download a new Fedora Core or something? I can understand the torrent limit, but it seems to limit everything once that kicks in.
You were downloading at 27KBps. At what rate were you uploading with the torrent? Cable is not symmetrical. Uploading at too high a rate can take away from your downloads and cause surfing and most on-line tasks to be sluggish. Limit your upload speed and then try it again.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18882625 Wed, 15 Aug 2007 20:37:33 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18882457 anon : I have had a problem for the last week and just came across this. I noticed that one night when I was trying to download one file (torrent), page loads took forever. DNS lookups took forever. I thought it was my firewall / server so I rebooted it repeatedly and restarted the modem.

I have the small business tier and should not be limited like this. Once I stopped the torrent my speed magically jumped up. Same thing happened tonight and I guy at work complained about the same thing.

While torrenting 1 file which was only downloading at 27k/sec I did a speed test:

170kbps down, 17kbps up.

It would take near a minute to load one website. I stoped the torrent and did a speed test again:

4338kbps down, 187kbps up.

I can understand limiting the download, but what happens when I want to download a new Fedora Core or something? I can understand the torrent limit, but it seems to limit everything once that kicks in.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18882457 Wed, 15 Aug 2007 20:08:26 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18878722 hobgoblin : "There's a big controversy about network neutrality. Traffic discrimination has a bad reputation among a large and influential sector of the public. This provides a natural incentive for big ISPs to conceal or play down any such policies they may have going on."

Actually packet shaping has nothing to do with network Neutrality.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18878722 Wed, 15 Aug 2007 11:11:01 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18878471 swhx7 : OK we're getting closer. I'm going to try one more time.

said by kshymkiw See Profile :

A "letter" may have been leaked or distributed. This doesn't mean the letter has any validity to it at all.

Right. As I said, e.g. "may or may not have been correct or reliable".

said by kshymkiw See Profile :

You assume because people see a "decrease" in performance that it is this new packet shaping.

Nope. Check my posts, I haven't declared any definite conclusions based on perceived slowdowns. Maybe you've got me mixed up with other posters here.

said by kshymkiw See Profile :

In all honesty what does TWC have to hide? If they want to packet shape you then they do.

There's a big controversy about network neutrality. Traffic discrimination has a bad reputation among a large and influential sector of the public. This provides a natural incentive for big ISPs to conceal or play down any such policies they may have going on.

said by kshymkiw See Profile :

If you don't like it go somewhere else.

It must be nice to have so much broadband competition in Columbus, OH that you can "go somewhere else" and find broadband with different policies on offer. In most of the USA, broadband customers have only two choices at most, cable and telco, and for a large proportion only one of these. This lack of competition is the cause of this whole controversy; it's the only thing that lets ISPs get away with poor service and closely similar, onerous policies.

said by kshymkiw See Profile :

So the point is this....until you can PROVE WITHOUT A SHADOW OF A DOUBT it is packet shaping, then don't blame it.

Why do you demand stronger evidence for one alternative than for another? Do you work for TW or own a lot of shares or something? Such a double standard is a sign of bias.

The rational approach is to assign probabilities in proportion to the evidence. There is some evidence in this thread of a new traffic shaping policy at RR/TW. It is less than absolute proof and more than zero. The rational conclusion therefore is some probability that it's true, less than 100% and more than zero.

"Black or white" thinking is a kind of irrationality. Tolerance for ambiguity is a sign of intelligence. Give it a try sometime.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18878471 Wed, 15 Aug 2007 10:34:43 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18876649 punker : Fells so good to be on my own node
as it's unused

every one got suckered it to that d**h network package with the dsl/phone

ahh

node ratio is 200 houses to 1 node
there is about 186 houses in the HOA

were i used to live it was node# 176

this node is 178 :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18876649 Tue, 14 Aug 2007 23:47:19 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18876366 war59312 : Yeah this sucks. Getting 30 KB/s now for newsgroups. :(

No matter what service I use. This sucks big time!

Time Warner is only cable provider in town. Only other "high" bandwidth ISP is DSL which I can not get due to distance and besides everyone tells me it sucks anyways.

Test 2007-08-14 23:06:54 EST @ speedtest.dslreports.com
1112 / 267 (Kbps)
(135.7 / 32.6 KB/sec)
Compared to the average of 1786 tests from rr.com:
* download is 80% worse, upload is 56% worse


So lame! I am suppose to have 8/512. But only choice I got really, besides dial up...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18876366 Tue, 14 Aug 2007 23:02:51 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18875229 pcmodem : I was the original person who asked if there *could* be a link between the two problems.

The post everyone is going crazy referencing from the WoW forums is about... tada... NYC RR problems... I am not sure what info blizzard has to "suspect" packet shaping, but I suspect they know theres some problem for their users in the NY area and just said anything in the hopes they could stir up people on time warner to get the issue resolved. No idea why, just a suspicion.

here is a repost of a MTR session I ran to a game site thats NOT world of warcraft. I, and my family living on the other side of this god-forsaken staten island have seen this same severe lag (described as packet loss) in world of warcraft as well. It is a size of 1500 with 10 packets per second
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18875229 Tue, 14 Aug 2007 20:18:21 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18874709 Pure :
said by dbmaven See Profile :

I will add one other comment:
I find it highly amusing that Blizzard/WOW would suggest that all issues with TWC users and their 'products' are related to 'packet shaping'. Highly amusing....
The typical pass the buck as happens too commonly in business. Noone wants to own up to what is really happening.
Being that so many play particular game Blizzard feels most will listen to them and urge on their complaints to swarm towards Time Warner. Just because they can in todays world of forums/chat talk.
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I'm just a youngster so what would I know! - LMAOROFL! -=)--=Pure OUT!=--(=-]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18874709 Tue, 14 Aug 2007 19:07:57 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18874064 dbmaven : This has been explained 40 times in 40 different ways by 40 different people.

The "other thread" being referred to does show a specific TWC piece of equipment that is causing a issue - and this issue DOES NOT SHOW UP ON TRACEROUTES or PINGS.

It appears that anyone who happens to route through that piece of equipment is experiencing dropouts and delays on a frequent basis. The route APPEARS to be specifically related to TWC users in the NEW YORK METRO AREA, including parts of NEW JERSEY and the MID-HUDSON VALLEY.

Those of you in that area should certainly stick to that thread.

I will add one other comment:
I find it highly amusing that Blizzard/WOW would suggest that all issues with TWC users and their 'products' are related to 'packet shaping'. Highly amusing....
--
If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?
Living in "an optimized state of temporary chaos"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18874064 Tue, 14 Aug 2007 17:51:31 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18873721 Thundolfe :
said by TWC is GREAT :

said by kshymkiw See Profile :

said by Thundolfe See Profile :

I believe it is a TWC issue because myself and many others in the NYC area have found PL on certain routers within the RR network, and these routes are the ones that have problems. I have internet routes that do not use at&t or level3 with this problem.
It isn't Packet Loss it is QoS choosing to not respond to your ICMP requests.
Exactly, * * * in a trace do not mean packet loss, it's like kshymkiw said, that hop is just not responding to ICMP reqeusts.
That is not what is happening, but just forget it. Look, pretty flowers. :)
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MOO@(*&^*@&]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18873721 Tue, 14 Aug 2007 17:07:27 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18873635 smcallah : Unless the packet loss in your traceroutes starts at one hop and appears at EVERY hop after that, the packet loss is not along the route.

Routers have control planes, these control planes are what are responding to your ICMP requests. If a router is busy at the time, and can't respond to your ping, it will either drop it, or respond later, showing latency. If that packet loss and latency doesn't appear at the next hop, then there is no packet loss between those 2 hops.

Some providers also rate-limit ICMP to their routers, because they want their routers to be busy ROUTING, and not responding to everyone trying to traceroute though there.

If the server at the end of your traceroute pings fine, then the connection all the way through to the server is fine.

Packet loss to one hop in the middle of a traceroute with 15 hops is not a problem.

[Edit] - I should add, the control plane on most backbone routers is separate from its line cards. Meaning, traffic passing through the router does not go through the control plane, the linecards know where to send the traffic and are designed for higher speed traffic than the control plane. So your normal traffic destined for hosts beyond the router never touches the control plane.

Any traffic you send directly to the router's IP addresses hits the control plane and is subject to different QoS and policies depending on the router and the provider.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18873635 Tue, 14 Aug 2007 16:56:03 EDT Re: [TWC] TW Officially Announces Packet Shaping for All RR User http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18873573 anon :
said by kshymkiw See Profile :

said by Thundolfe