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Forums » Reports On 90GB Comcast Caps Incorrect » I still don't agree that knowledge = Greater use
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« Can't find anything to tell me how much I've used!  
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wispagod

join:2001-06-28
House Springs, MO
reply to KrK
Re: I still don't agree that knowledge = Greater use

Well, it seems like fals advertising to me if they say unlimited usage, then try to enforce a cap, or complain when you use it to much, that's not right either


KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest

I'd tend to agree. These days they have shied away from using the word "Unlimited" to avoid the legal consequences but have done nothing to disperse the public misconception that it is unlimited, and since they don't tell you it's capped, in fact, they deny it if asked, people DO assume it's unlimited.

Thus the bad press every time a heavy user gets stomped on.
--
"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!)


Rob
In Deo speramus
Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
·Comcast
·AT&T Southeast

reply to wispagod
said by wispagod See Profile :

Well, it seems like fals advertising to me if they say unlimited usage, then try to enforce a cap, or complain when you use it to much, that's not right either
Comcast isn't advertising their service as unlimited, therefore, they aren't guilty of false advertising.


Rob
In Deo speramus
Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
·Comcast
·AT&T Southeast


edit:
September 18th, @02:31PM

reply to KrK
said by KrK See Profile :

I'd tend to agree. These days they have shied away from using the word "Unlimited" to avoid the legal consequences but have done nothing to disperse the public misconception that it is unlimited, and since they don't tell you it's capped, in fact, they deny it if asked, people DO assume it's unlimited.

Thus the bad press every time a heavy user gets stomped on.
Bad press by who? By DSLReports? By the Washington Post? Other than DSLReports, most news outlets that report the bad press have no clue what they are talking about. They only see 1 side of the story.

Every time a user comes here complaining they got cut off from Comcast because they downloaded 500GB .. or even worse, 1 TB in a month.. I smile, pat my cable modem, and enjoy watching them whine how they called and threatened to leave and go to DSL.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
clubs:
·Site5.com
·AT&T Midwest
·Comcast

reply to wispagod
said by wispagod See Profile :

Well, it seems like fals advertising to me if they say unlimited usage, then try to enforce a cap, or complain when you use it to much, that's not right either
Where have they advertised unlimited usage? I keep hearing this from various people here, and in the last 3-4 years there hasn't been a single print or TV ad that has been released that says "unlimited usage". Please provide some kind of proof.

lesopp

join:2001-06-27
Land O Lakes, FL


edit:
September 18th, @02:51PM

reply to Rob
They also aren't advertising it as "limited".

This is from the fine print on the "Select a Package" web page:

Comcast High-Speed Internet: Equipment fees not included in monthly service charge. Prices do not include applicable taxes, installation or franchise fees. Pricing, content, and features may change and may vary by area. Call your local Comcast office for restrictions and complete details about service, prices, and equipment in your area. Pricing and service offerings displayed on this site are for residential Comcast customers only. Commercial and business pricing and service offerings differ. Prices are subject to change. Speed comparisons are for downloads only and are compared to 768Kbps DSL and 56Kbps dial-up. Maximum download speed of 4Mbps (or 6 Mbps) and upload speeds of 384Kbps (or 768Kbps) depending on the product that is selected. Increased speeds not yet available in all areas. Actual speeds may vary and are not guaranteed. Many factors affect download speed.

Based on what is on their website, a subscriber should be able to learn about limitations from their local office. Them not providing a definition for that local limitation is all the more reason to embrace competition.


morbo
Complete Your Transaction

join:2002-01-22
00000
clubs:
reply to Nightfall
if you signed up under the "unlimited" banner 4+ years ago, they are on questionable legal ground if they try limiting it now.


funchords
Robb
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Hillsboro, OR
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
·Comcast


edit:
September 18th, @05:29PM

reply to Nightfall
said by Nightfall See Profile :

said by wispagod See Profile :

Well, it seems like fals advertising to me if they say unlimited usage, then try to enforce a cap, or complain when you use it to much, that's not right either
Where have they advertised unlimited usage? I keep hearing this from various people here, and in the last 3-4 years there hasn't been a single print or TV ad that has been released that says "unlimited usage". Please provide some kind of proof.
They have implied unlimited use by not advertising limited use. Remember, they are head-to-head in competition with DSL and FIOS. Comcast's tiers are set to make the customer believe that Comcast HSI is superior (to DSL) or equal (to FIOS).

This issue is illustrating, in bright lights, that Comcast HSI is not what it seems.

See my post here: »Re: Comcast Bandwidth Abuse/Limits - Discuss here only
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon USA
Are you affected by Comcast's RST forging? How to test it! -or- Read my original report.


Ebolla

join:2005-09-28
Dracut, MA
reply to morbo
at that time it was more likely saying unlimited access with fine print indicating 24hour connection unlike many dial-up services.


Richard B
Fur It Up

join:2007-06-22
Portland, OR
·Comcast

reply to wispagod
The problem is you do not have a right to redefine unlimited. If Unlimited access the Comcasts is being true to the word compared to the bad old days of Mom and Pop ISP where one could be bumped offline for inactivity or being connect too long.

I do not recall Comcast offer unlimited bandwidth.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
clubs:
·Site5.com
·AT&T Midwest
·Comcast


edit:
September 18th, @05:36PM

reply to funchords
said by funchords See Profile :

said by Nightfall See Profile :

said by wispagod See Profile :

Well, it seems like fals advertising to me if they say unlimited usage, then try to enforce a cap, or complain when you use it to much, that's not right either
Where have they advertised unlimited usage? I keep hearing this from various people here, and in the last 3-4 years there hasn't been a single print or TV ad that has been released that says "unlimited usage". Please provide some kind of proof.
They have advertised unlimited use by not advertising limited use. Remember, they are head-to-head in competition with DSL and FIOS. Comcast's tiers are set to make the customer believe that Comcast HSI is superior (to DSL) or equal (to FIOS).

This issue is illustrating, in bright lights, that Comcast HSI is not what it seems.

See my post here: »Re: Comcast Bandwidth Abuse/Limits - Discuss here only
They advertise it by not advertising it? Sorry man, but that really is reaching. They could be comparing speeds, uptime, services such as antivirus, or spam filtering. To say that they don't advertise it, but since they are comparing services, they are saying its unlimited is a load of crap statement.

Now, I will say that Comcast should come out with some kind of set limit in the news. For that matter, all companies like Charter and other providers should do the same thing. Either publish your limits or don't complain if someone uses their connection full bore. At the same time though, there is a very big difference between saying "unlimited use" and not saying it.

As I said before, provide some proof. It seems that a bunch of people here believe that Comcast advertises unlimited access. I would like to see that for myself. So far, no one has come forward with that proof.


funchords
Robb
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Hillsboro, OR
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
·Comcast


edit:
September 18th, @05:59PM

I fixed my earlier post to say that they imply it by not advertising it. But you were too fast!

said by Nightfall See Profile :

It seems that a bunch of people here believe that Comcast advertises unlimited access. I would like to see that for myself. So far, no one has come forward with that proof.
I haven't seen it, either.

But it does stand to reason that if my tier is 6 Mbps, that I'm allowed to use up to 6 Mbps (Megabits per second) ... or 360 Megabits per minute ... 21,600 Megabits per hour ... 518,400 Megabits per day ... and so on.

And if that's not the deal -- then what is the deal? What am I forking my hard-earned money for?

The only reason that I can fathom that Comcast has an invisible cap is because of the shared nature of Cable Internet service. There are plenty of other shared Internet services that have solved this problem -- EDVO, WISPs, Satellite ISPs.

Comcast DOES NOT WANT to be known as a shared service. They're in competition with FIOS and DSL which doesn't have to impose such restrictions.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon USA
Are you affected by Comcast's RST forging? How to test it! -or- Read my original report.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
clubs:
·Site5.com
·AT&T Midwest
·Comcast

said by funchords See Profile :

I fixed my earlier post to say that they imply it by not advertising it. But you were too fast!

said by Nightfall See Profile :

It seems that a bunch of people here believe that Comcast advertises unlimited access. I would like to see that for myself. So far, no one has come forward with that proof.
I haven't seen it, either.

But it does stand to reason that if my tier is 6 Mbps, that I'm allowed to use up to 6 Mbps (Megabits per second) ... or 360 Megabits per minute ... 21,600 Megabits per hour ... 518,400 Megabits per day ... and so on.

And if that's not the deal -- then what is the deal? What am I forking my hard-earned money for?

The only reason that I can fathom that Comcast has an invisible cap is because of the shared nature of Cable Internet service. There are plenty of other shared Internet services that have solved this problem -- EDVO, WISPs, Satellite ISPs.

Comcast DOES NOT WANT to be known as a shared service. They're in competition with FIOS and DSL which doesn't have to impose such restrictions.
I do see your point and I do have to agree with it in some sense. The problem is that there is oversubscribing done on every ISP. If everyone was given permission to use their line full bore all the time and everyone did, can you imagine the bandwidth issues?

At least now I know why Comcast isn't complaining about usage to everyone and there is no set cap in some areas. I suspect that its all about usage on a specific node and if people are complaining.

And if you don't think that any of those other services are not shared, then you are sadly mistaken. It isn't like you are sitting right on the backbone with ANY residential based ISP. Heck, even business based ones for that matter don't sit right on the internet backbone. So I really don't subscribe to the "shared service" arguement since all ISPs have shared service. You wouldn't believe the amount of people here who say that DSL isn't a shared service and think its a dedicated circuit when that just isn't the case. Its just a different kind of sharing.

moonpuppy

join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL

reply to Rob
said by Rob See Profile :

Bad press by who? By DSLReports? By the Washington Post? Other than DSLReports, most news outlets that report the bad press have no clue what they are talking about. They only see 1 side of the story.
It's not about the facts but perception. My local TV channel did a story about Comcast cutting off people. There were some facts but I'll bet money that people only heard "Comcast cut off someone's internet."

Here is the story:

»www.wbaltv.com/money/14067825/detail.html


funchords
Robb
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Hillsboro, OR
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
·Comcast

reply to Nightfall
said by Nightfall See Profile :

I do see your point and I do have to agree with it in some sense. The problem is that there is oversubscribing done on every ISP. If everyone was given permission to use their line full bore all the time and everyone did, can you imagine the bandwidth issues?
Everyone won't. C'mon!

said by Nightfall See Profile :

At least now I know why Comcast isn't complaining about usage to everyone and there is no set cap in some areas. I suspect that its all about usage on a specific node and if people are complaining.
Agree.

said by Nightfall See Profile :

And if you don't think that any of those other services are not shared, then you are sadly mistaken. It isn't like you are sitting right on the backbone with ANY residential based ISP.
Yes, they're all shared. But they are starkly different.

DSL/FIOS generally have a much bigger pool of bandwidth and a much bigger pool of customers that divide it. The actions of a few will not affect so many with DSL/FIOS, because the larger group can absorb it.

With Cable (DOCSIS), the pool of bandwidth is limited by the technology, and the ability to divide it is also constrained by the way that the neighborhood was wired. At some point with cable, you reach the maximum amount of bandwidth you can deliver and you have already divided the neighborhood into the smallest groups possible.

Unlike DSL/FIOS, CATV providers reach a point where they cannot add bandwidth and they cannot divide the neighborhood any further (without rewiring it).
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon USA
Are you affected by Comcast's RST forging? How to test it! -or- Read my original report.


Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
clubs:
·Site5.com
·AT&T Midwest
·Comcast

said by funchords See Profile :

DSL/FIOS generally have a much bigger pool of bandwidth and a much bigger pool of customers that divide it. The actions of a few will not affect so many with DSL/FIOS, because the larger group can absorb it.

With Cable (DOCSIS), the pool of bandwidth is limited by the technology, and the ability to divide it is also constrained by the way that the neighborhood was wired. At some point with cable, you reach the maximum amount of bandwidth you can deliver and you have already divided the neighborhood into the smallest groups possible.

Unlike DSL/FIOS, CATV providers reach a point where they cannot add bandwidth and they cannot divide the neighborhood any further (without rewiring it).
As you said, they are starkly different technologies when it comes to sharing. Lets be honest here though, one technology is not starkly better than the other. I have seen some DSL providers oversubscribe on their central point and I have seen the same from Cable providers. You are right that it is probably easier to oversubscribe on a cable segment, but at the same time, there is much less of a distance or speed limitation when compared to DSL. IMHO, its a wash as to which technology is "better". Which is why both you and I probably agree that having multiple choices for broadband is key.

The unfortunate part is that most of us only have 1.


funchords
Robb
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Hillsboro, OR
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
·Comcast

Me, too.

FIOS is literally 2 blocks away. They painted up my neighborhood, then we had a few weeks of rain, and when the sun shone again, the FIOS contractors had moved on.

That was 18 months ago. We've pretty-much have been forgotton.
-
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