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TK Junk Mail
Go ahead, make my day
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Margate City, NJ
clubs:
·Comcast

reply to jc100
Re: Immunity

said by jc100 See Profile :

Now our rights being pissed. NSA wiretapping under Bush. Patriot Act. Military Commissions act denying a trial to anyone Bush rules an enemy combatant (american or foreigner).
Ever hear of 9/11? Never happened right? The Congress gave the authority to the President 98-0 and 100-0 after 9/11. So he is using it. Thank god he is. No attacks on US soil since then. I wonder why?
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MacWin

join:2003-06-26
Imperial, MO
And I have a wand that keeps Tigers away, how do I know it works, well I've never seen a Tiger around here so there you go it must work.



Vertickle

join:2003-08-05
Madison, AL
·Knology

said by MacWin See Profile :

And I have a wand that keeps Tigers away, how do I know it works, well I've never seen a Tiger around here so there you go it must work.


Can you back that statement up? Got a link?


Hehe

@ssa.gov

thumbs down from:
TK Junk Mail See Profile

reply to TK Junk Mail
9/11? Only about 3000 people died! Car crashes kill more than 40,000 people every year (more than 3000 every month)! More than 50% of those are alcohol related!

amungus
Premium
join:2004-11-26
America
clubs:
·Cox HSI

reply to TK Junk Mail
Your narrow train of thought doesn't seem to even have the capacity to entertain any other reasons, so why would you even ask the question?

Not that you'd care, but there could be several reasons besides having a bunch of people sifting through mostly meaningless data about who called who. "Oh look, so-and-so just called his mom and said happy birthday" ...wow that's useful. Time wasted = time gained by the other side. Surely that tidbit of reasoning resonates some brain cells somewhere.

I am always amazed when people can so blindly agree with whatever their television tells them, but then I realize that so many folks haven't got the gumption to even get off the couch for one minute and turn the thing off.

"Thinking is the hardest work there is, which is the probable reason why so few engage in it." - Henry Ford

"It’s not an exaggeration to say the U.S. intelligence community is in a near-panic about this,"

Why? Because they know that they've been doing something illegal by tapping completely useless lines?

Fine by me if we have people who actually tap what they need to tap and get some results. Not fine if they're 1)wasting time, money, resources 2)tapping innocent people for no reason.

They deserve no immunity from this. We deserve the truth. Sadly, even if we get it, I'm certain there'll be so much spin everywhere that by the time people get TOLD what to think, it'll be like cotton candy and they'll eat it up gladly - forgetting that any of it ever really mattered anyway...

[.sarcasm.]You don't matter, we've got people who love gps systems in their cars, 'onstar' to listen to everything, cell phones that'll follow you everywhere (and can also listen to everything unless you rip the battery out), and big brother - who really does love you![\sarcasm]


TK Junk Mail
Go ahead, make my day
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Margate City, NJ
clubs:
·Comcast

reply to Hehe
said by Hehe :

9/11? Only about 3000 people died! Car crashes kill more than 40,000 people every year (more than 3000 every month)! More than 50% of those are alcohol related!
So what.

Only 2400 people died at Pearl Harbor. I guess the US should have just stood by and said "car crashes killed 40,000 people last year so lets give Japan a pass"

Your point is meaningless.
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AtlGuy

join:2000-10-17
Marietta, GA

reply to TK Junk Mail
said by TK Junk Mail See Profile :

said by jc100 See Profile :

Now our rights being pissed. NSA wiretapping under Bush. Patriot Act. Military Commissions act denying a trial to anyone Bush rules an enemy combatant (american or foreigner).
Ever hear of 9/11? Never happened right? The Congress gave the authority to the President 98-0 and 100-0 after 9/11. So he is using it. Thank god he is. No attacks on US soil since then. I wonder why?
Because of our ultra secure borders?

jc100

join:2002-04-10
·RoadRunner Cable


edit:
September 20th, @06:17PM

reply to TK Junk Mail
No Attacks? They happen every day right? Do you not recall that there have been school shootings? Wait, those are domestic terrorism. Ah damn, I guess there have been. You damn well know if it was an Arab kid, it would be called that. Every news agency would have been on that like a pack of wolves. So give me a break. Let's not forget the second worst terrorist attack was committed by a White, Christian, American named Timothy Mcveigh. Still, these events are the oddity. We have more problems to deal with in this country when it comes to 20-22,000 Americans are murdered PER YEAR. Crime outweighs terrorism 100 to 1 on any day of the week, considering in the last 20 years, we've had 4000 deaths to do it. In that same timespan, around 500,000 Americans have been murdered. Therefore, Go do some math and you my friend will realize how foolish your statement sounds....Hence, we need to focus our efforts on real problems and not turning small ones into a way to fear monger the public into a drooling stupor.

jc100

join:2002-04-10
·RoadRunner Cable


edit:
September 20th, @06:13PM

reply to TK Junk Mail
There's a huge difference. It's called blaming the REAL ENEMY (IE. Japan) and wrongly pointing the finger at a country who had nothing to do with said attack (IRAQ). Obviously, you failed geography and English to not know that the attackers were 90 Percent Saudi, with the others being from Yemen and Omen. Guess what, there wasn't a single Iraqi on that list. So while all problems must be dealt with, destabilizing the wrong country, and being responsible for over a few hundred thousands deaths, is not a response. It's called ignorance and poor leadership that was looking for someone to blame, without going after the real culprit. If you think terrorism was a problem post 9/11, you now have a country that serves as a rallying call for all who do want to do us harm, be it the small minority. Yet, like any fundamental sect, this minority has the power to do harm. Look at Christianity's wonderful history. Just ten years ago, the Christian Serbs slaughtered 1-200,000 Muslims. So let's not fool ourselves into thinking it's everyone. If you want to believe that, then we have more to fear from Christians and their past than Muslims. That point just needs to be made, since I got a gut feeling you will spin this to mean all Muslims are bad. Wrong. Anyhow, that aside, Congratulations Bush on your overwhelming failures and turning a region into crap. What else do you do for encores? We're all are sitting back at the edge of our seats to see the next idiotic move that will harm us for generations to come.

jc100

join:2002-04-10

edit:
September 20th, @06:10PM

reply to TK Junk Mail
delete me. double post.


wilbarger

join:2001-06-06
Quinlan, TX
·Verizon FIOS

reply to TK Junk Mail
I believe that it was Franklin that wrote "people willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both"

Sadly, our panic over 9/11 has led our nation to this point. We have turned over our rights to the government of the fat cats and we will likely never get rid of the terrorism act and all that it has taken away from us. I want to puke when I think of what we have allowed ourselves to become.
--
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wifi4milez
In Need Of Garbage Pail Kids 1st Series

join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·RoadRunner Cable
·BroadVoice

reply to jc100
said by jc100 See Profile :

We have more problems to deal with in this country when it comes to 20-22,000 Americans are murdered PER YEAR. Crime outweighs terrorism 100 to 1 on any day of the week, considering in the last 20 years, we've had 4000 deaths to do it. In that same timespan, around 500,000 Americans have been murdered. Therefore, Go do some math and you my friend will realize how foolish your statement sounds....Hence, we need to focus our efforts on real problems and not turning small ones into a way to fear monger the public into a drooling stupor.
So you are suggesting that we ignore terrorism because there are "car crashes" and "crime" in this country?? That argument sounds like it was made by a two year old. As adults, we realize that the "ignore it and it will go away" outlook on life stopped being realistic when we were in kindergarten. Which coincidentally shows the mental capacity of anyone who still believes it.....
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jc100

join:2002-04-10
·RoadRunner Cable


edit:
September 20th, @06:52PM

I'm not suggesting we ignore the problem at all. Merely, I am suggestion we focus more of our efforts where they belong. IE, dealing with crime, poverty, car crashes, and other issues that warrant our attention. This is not to say some actions are not worthwhile in terms of REALISTIC security measures in response to recent events. These include increased airport security, having barriers between certain buildings, and metal detectors. These actions are considered common sense and apply to all sorts of issues across the board. However, stripping away our rights, telling us how everyone's out get us, and crap like that simply shouldn't fly. It's one thing to act, it's another to over react and sell people on overzealous stupidity. As adults, we ALSO realize this, too. Obviously, you must have never left kindergarten since you don't, by your own accord.

moonpuppy

join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL

reply to jc100
said by jc100 See Profile :

There's a huge difference. It's called blaming the REAL ENEMY (IE. Japan) and wrongly pointing the finger at a country who had nothing to do with said attack (IRAQ). Obviously, you failed geography and English to not know that the attackers were 90 Percent Saudi, with the others being from Yemen and Omen.
And you failed history.

Japan attacked us but why was the focus of the war against Germany and NOT Japan? Maybe you forgot or didn't know that FDR a DEMOCRATIC President put out massive rumors that Germany was going to ally itself with Mexico and attack us from the south. FDR was desperate to get into WW2 in Europe but was not allowed to by Congress.

Germany NEVER attacked us. They merely declared war on us. BIG DEAL! Iran has declared war on us when they took our embassy hostage. Remember, embassy grounds are part of the country they represent. They invaded our territory.

As for Iraq, they continually violated UN resolutions. Should we just ignore UN resolutions? Why not kick them out and let them set up shop back in Geneva.

As for Muslims, if they refuse to chastise their more radical brothers, then their silence is their acceptance of terrorist actions.

jc100

join:2002-04-10
·RoadRunner Cable

Moon,

Ignorance is bliss bud. First, JAPAN was the focus of WW2. Do you not recall the Atomic Bomb. The first time such device was EVER used in history. Obviously not. WW2 was a World War. Hence, a war on all fronts. Obviously, you skipped WORLD HISTORY. We had FULL SCALE invasions on the Japanese. What naive world are you living in? My grandfather was in that war! I guess he just made up his whole service of being on an air craft carrier attacking the Japanese.... Amazing, people like you still exist.

As for the Germans. We attacked them only after our allies were being hammered. A matter of fact, we ignored the war for several years. Hitler had started his campaign in 1937 with the bombing of Guernica. It wasn't until 1941 when Europe was in FULL FLEDGED WAR and our allies needed help did we enter. Obviously, we stuck out of it because it had nothing to do with us in the beginning. However, when we saw our allies needed our help, we did react. Yet, there still lies a difference. GERMANS WERE COMMITTING GENOCIDE! That's something that should NEVER be tolerated. Now, if you would have said we should have entered Iraq in the 1980s when Saddam was, you would have had my full support and I'm sure the worlds. However, to make Saddam a scapegoat for 9/11 twenty years later DOESN'T WORK. SORRY! Obviously, Bush wanted to blame someone for the attacks, and he failed geography when trying to do so. Once again, there were like 17 Saudis and a few from Yemen and Omen. NOT A SINGLE IRAQI. Simply violating the UN resolutions didn't amount to going to war. Guess what, we found nothing when we did enter. Surprise Surprise. I guess he had nothing after all. So my point stands. Two different wars and two different circumstances. The fact of the matter, you need to learn history better, so you don't try to meld the two together like they are the least bit similar.

As for Muslims condemning the attacks, you speak for them all? Strange. I do recall several Arab nations condemning 9/11. Egypt is one of our strongest allies as is Saudi Arabia. Then again, when did Christianity Condemn Bosnia? Christian Serbs slaughtered 200,000 Muslims and buried them in mass graves. Please remind me where the church spoke on that. Better yet, Christianity has the Holocaust as Hitler was a Catholic. He used the Church to his benefit when killing the Jews. Let's not forget the Spanish Inquisition where 100s of thousands were slaughtered in the name of Christianity. Best yet, and most famous, the crusades had the Christians Murdering Muslims yet again. Ah yes, good old Christianity and its blood filled past. I don't remember reading too many condemnations by the Church on these acts either. Should I conclude then that all of Christianity supports this barbarity and I have more to fear from them than the Muslims. After all, Christianity has murdered millions in the name of it's religion, too.


still2lazy2login

@comcast.net

reply to moonpuppy
said by moonpuppy See Profile :

Maybe you forgot or didn't know that FDR a DEMOCRATIC President put out massive rumors that Germany was going to ally itself with Mexico and attack us from the south. FDR was desperate to get into WW2 in Europe but was not allowed to by Congress.
Please, leave parties out of this. Democrats and republicans have changed views countless times. I currently consider myself a Democrat, but I would have fully supported Lincoln in his era on his anti-slavery position (not so much his suspension of habeas corpus (much like our current President), though...)


Ha

@charter.com
reply to MacWin
I'll give you $20 for this wand of yours


pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

reply to jc100
So if we follow your logic, we should not have invaded Northern Africa and Europe after Pearl Harbor?

Maybe we shouldn't have attacked Afghanistan either? There were no Afghans involved in 9/11 either, right?
--
Only SHATNER is Kirk.

moonpuppy

join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL


edit:
September 21st, @08:13AM

reply to jc100
said by jc100 See Profile :

Moon,

Ignorance is bliss bud. First, JAPAN was the focus of WW2. Do you not recall the Atomic Bomb. The first time such device was EVER used in history. Obviously not. WW2 was a World War. Hence, a war on all fronts. Obviously, you skipped WORLD HISTORY. We had FULL SCALE invasions on the Japanese. What naive world are you living in? My grandfather was in that war! I guess he just made up his whole service of being on an air craft carrier attacking the Japanese.... Amazing, people like you still exist.
Japan was not the focus at the beginning. It was Europe. We merely held the Japanese at bay. It wasn't until the Battle of Midway did we have any luck and even the Navy was being stretched mighty thin. Why did MacArthur have to leave the Philippines? Why did we abandon Wake Island?

As for the atomic bomb, maybe you should study history a bit more. Why was it used? Two reasons. After the defeat of Germany, Russia now wanted a shot at their old nemesis of Japan. We already knew how bad Stalin could be so we needed to keep him out.

The main reason was the fanaticism of the Japanese people and how they would defend their homeland. If the US had attempted ANY invasion of the home islands, it would have been worse than Okinawa where civilians killed themselves rather than live under American occupation (as they were told by the Japanese military that we would rape their women and eat their children.) Many of those killed in the blasts were already declared dead by the Japanese military as defenders of the homeland. We merely saved our own soldiers.

said by jc100 See Profile :

As for the Germans. We attacked them only after our allies were being hammered. A matter of fact, we ignored the war for several years. Hitler had started his campaign in 1937 with the bombing of Guernica. It wasn't until 1941 when Europe was in FULL FLEDGED WAR and our allies needed help did we enter. Obviously, we stuck out of it because it had nothing to do with us in the beginning. However, when we saw our allies needed our help, we did react. Yet, there still lies a difference. GERMANS WERE COMMITTING GENOCIDE! That's something that should NEVER be tolerated.
We ignored the war because it had nothing to do with us. Our allies were being hammered since 1939 with the invasion of Poland. Yes, we sent military arms to England but we stayed out of it.

As for your genocide comment, no one really knew about the death camps until we found them. Plus, you forget that this country was anti-Semitic at the time. Try looking up the case of the SS St. Louis before you talk about entering the war because of genocide.

said by jc100 See Profile :

Now, if you would have said we should have entered Iraq in the 1980s when Saddam was, you would have had my full support and I'm sure the worlds. However, to make Saddam a scapegoat for 9/11 twenty years later DOESN'T WORK. SORRY! Obviously, Bush wanted to blame someone for the attacks, and he failed geography when trying to do so. Once again, there were like 17 Saudis and a few from Yemen and Omen. NOT A SINGLE IRAQI. Simply violating the UN resolutions didn't amount to going to war. Guess what, we found nothing when we did enter. Surprise Surprise. I guess he had nothing after all. So my point stands. Two different wars and two different circumstances. The fact of the matter, you need to learn history better, so you don't try to meld the two together like they are the least bit similar.
How about we bomb ourselves because so far we have a few who supported terrorism and actively fought for al-queda. Let's add England in there for Richard Reid and France for Zacarias Moussaoui.

Plus, you forget that Iraq was also practicing genocide against the Kurds which is one of your main reasons to go to war with Germany.

As for finding nothing, we do know Iraq buried some fighter jets in the sand and they were only found because of some local who pointed them out. As for the weapons, my theory is that Sadam thought he could rally the arab world to help him if the Americans attacked. Had he not tried to bully Iran, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and a few others, he might have had success. Sadam was not a rational person as shown in his own actions.

said by jc100 See Profile :

As for Muslims condemning the attacks, you speak for them all? Strange. I do recall several Arab nations condemning 9/11. Egypt is one of our strongest allies as is Saudi Arabia. Then again, when did Christianity Condemn Bosnia? Christian Serbs slaughtered 200,000 Muslims and buried them in mass graves. Please remind me where the church spoke on that. Better yet, Christianity has the Holocaust as Hitler was a Catholic. He used the Church to his benefit when killing the Jews. Let's not forget the Spanish Inquisition where 100s of thousands were slaughtered in the name of Christianity. Best yet, and most famous, the crusades had the Christians Murdering Muslims yet again. Ah yes, good old Christianity and its blood filled past. I don't remember reading too many condemnations by the Church on these acts either. Should I conclude then that all of Christianity supports this barbarity and I have more to fear from them than the Muslims. After all, Christianity has murdered millions in the name of it's religion, too.
Sure countries make condemn the attacks but why don't they do more to stop them?

As for Christians condemning Bosnia, I do recall the US sending air support and bombing the Serbs. You might also recall that was another debacle brought to you by the UN who can't decide if they want to stop war or just keep people at bay with useless sanctions and resolutions.

Hitler was more into the occult of Germany's past legends than a Catholic. And you may want to research Meir Kahane about how Jewish people can be just as bad.

Try again.

moonpuppy

join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL

reply to still2lazy2login
said by still2lazy2login :

Please, leave parties out of this. Democrats and republicans have changed views countless times. I currently consider myself a Democrat, but I would have fully supported Lincoln in his era on his anti-slavery position (not so much his suspension of habeas corpus (much like our current President), though...)
Sure, when people stop blaming the Republican Party for everything and start blaming politicians in general.
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