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TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
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join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
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| reply to Hehe
Re: Immunity
said by Hehe :
9/11? Only about 3000 people died! Car crashes kill more than 40,000 people every year (more than 3000 every month)! More than 50% of those are alcohol related!
So what.
Only 2400 people died at Pearl Harbor. I guess the US should have just stood by and said "car crashes killed 40,000 people last year so lets give Japan a pass"
Your point is meaningless.
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jc100
join:2002-04-10
1 edit | There's a huge difference. It's called blaming the REAL ENEMY (IE. Japan) and wrongly pointing the finger at a country who had nothing to do with said attack (IRAQ). Obviously, you failed geography and English to not know that the attackers were 90 Percent Saudi, with the others being from Yemen and Omen. Guess what, there wasn't a single Iraqi on that list. So while all problems must be dealt with, destabilizing the wrong country, and being responsible for over a few hundred thousands deaths, is not a response. It's called ignorance and poor leadership that was looking for someone to blame, without going after the real culprit. If you think terrorism was a problem post 9/11, you now have a country that serves as a rallying call for all who do want to do us harm, be it the small minority. Yet, like any fundamental sect, this minority has the power to do harm. Look at Christianity's wonderful history. Just ten years ago, the Christian Serbs slaughtered 1-200,000 Muslims. So let's not fool ourselves into thinking it's everyone. If you want to believe that, then we have more to fear from Christians and their past than Muslims. That point just needs to be made, since I got a gut feeling you will spin this to mean all Muslims are bad. Wrong. Anyhow, that aside, Congratulations Bush on your overwhelming failures and turning a region into crap. What else do you do for encores? We're all are sitting back at the edge of our seats to see the next idiotic move that will harm us for generations to come. | |
moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| said by jc100  :There's a huge difference. It's called blaming the REAL ENEMY (IE. Japan) and wrongly pointing the finger at a country who had nothing to do with said attack (IRAQ). Obviously, you failed geography and English to not know that the attackers were 90 Percent Saudi, with the others being from Yemen and Omen. And you failed history.
Japan attacked us but why was the focus of the war against Germany and NOT Japan? Maybe you forgot or didn't know that FDR a DEMOCRATIC President put out massive rumors that Germany was going to ally itself with Mexico and attack us from the south. FDR was desperate to get into WW2 in Europe but was not allowed to by Congress.
Germany NEVER attacked us. They merely declared war on us. BIG DEAL! Iran has declared war on us when they took our embassy hostage. Remember, embassy grounds are part of the country they represent. They invaded our territory.
As for Iraq, they continually violated UN resolutions. Should we just ignore UN resolutions? Why not kick them out and let them set up shop back in Geneva.
As for Muslims, if they refuse to chastise their more radical brothers, then their silence is their acceptance of terrorist actions. | |
jc100
join:2002-04-10
| Moon,
Ignorance is bliss bud. First, JAPAN was the focus of WW2. Do you not recall the Atomic Bomb. The first time such device was EVER used in history. Obviously not. WW2 was a World War. Hence, a war on all fronts. Obviously, you skipped WORLD HISTORY. We had FULL SCALE invasions on the Japanese. What naive world are you living in? My grandfather was in that war! I guess he just made up his whole service of being on an air craft carrier attacking the Japanese.... Amazing, people like you still exist.
As for the Germans. We attacked them only after our allies were being hammered. A matter of fact, we ignored the war for several years. Hitler had started his campaign in 1937 with the bombing of Guernica. It wasn't until 1941 when Europe was in FULL FLEDGED WAR and our allies needed help did we enter. Obviously, we stuck out of it because it had nothing to do with us in the beginning. However, when we saw our allies needed our help, we did react. Yet, there still lies a difference. GERMANS WERE COMMITTING GENOCIDE! That's something that should NEVER be tolerated. Now, if you would have said we should have entered Iraq in the 1980s when Saddam was, you would have had my full support and I'm sure the worlds. However, to make Saddam a scapegoat for 9/11 twenty years later DOESN'T WORK. SORRY! Obviously, Bush wanted to blame someone for the attacks, and he failed geography when trying to do so. Once again, there were like 17 Saudis and a few from Yemen and Omen. NOT A SINGLE IRAQI. Simply violating the UN resolutions didn't amount to going to war. Guess what, we found nothing when we did enter. Surprise Surprise. I guess he had nothing after all. So my point stands. Two different wars and two different circumstances. The fact of the matter, you need to learn history better, so you don't try to meld the two together like they are the least bit similar.
As for Muslims condemning the attacks, you speak for them all? Strange. I do recall several Arab nations condemning 9/11. Egypt is one of our strongest allies as is Saudi Arabia. Then again, when did Christianity Condemn Bosnia? Christian Serbs slaughtered 200,000 Muslims and buried them in mass graves. Please remind me where the church spoke on that. Better yet, Christianity has the Holocaust as Hitler was a Catholic. He used the Church to his benefit when killing the Jews. Let's not forget the Spanish Inquisition where 100s of thousands were slaughtered in the name of Christianity. Best yet, and most famous, the crusades had the Christians Murdering Muslims yet again. Ah yes, good old Christianity and its blood filled past. I don't remember reading too many condemnations by the Church on these acts either. Should I conclude then that all of Christianity supports this barbarity and I have more to fear from them than the Muslims. After all, Christianity has murdered millions in the name of it's religion, too. | |
still2lazy2login
@comcast.net
| reply to moonpuppy
said by moonpuppy :Maybe you forgot or didn't know that FDR a DEMOCRATIC President put out massive rumors that Germany was going to ally itself with Mexico and attack us from the south. FDR was desperate to get into WW2 in Europe but was not allowed to by Congress. Please, leave parties out of this. Democrats and republicans have changed views countless times. I currently consider myself a Democrat, but I would have fully supported Lincoln in his era on his anti-slavery position (not so much his suspension of habeas corpus (much like our current President), though...) | |
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| reply to jc100
So if we follow your logic, we should not have invaded Northern Africa and Europe after Pearl Harbor?
Maybe we shouldn't have attacked Afghanistan either? There were no Afghans involved in 9/11 either, right?
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
1 edit | reply to jc100
said by jc100 :Moon, Ignorance is bliss bud. First, JAPAN was the focus of WW2. Do you not recall the Atomic Bomb. The first time such device was EVER used in history. Obviously not. WW2 was a World War. Hence, a war on all fronts. Obviously, you skipped WORLD HISTORY. We had FULL SCALE invasions on the Japanese. What naive world are you living in? My grandfather was in that war! I guess he just made up his whole service of being on an air craft carrier attacking the Japanese.... Amazing, people like you still exist. Japan was not the focus at the beginning. It was Europe. We merely held the Japanese at bay. It wasn't until the Battle of Midway did we have any luck and even the Navy was being stretched mighty thin. Why did MacArthur have to leave the Philippines? Why did we abandon Wake Island?
As for the atomic bomb, maybe you should study history a bit more. Why was it used? Two reasons. After the defeat of Germany, Russia now wanted a shot at their old nemesis of Japan. We already knew how bad Stalin could be so we needed to keep him out.
The main reason was the fanaticism of the Japanese people and how they would defend their homeland. If the US had attempted ANY invasion of the home islands, it would have been worse than Okinawa where civilians killed themselves rather than live under American occupation (as they were told by the Japanese military that we would rape their women and eat their children.) Many of those killed in the blasts were already declared dead by the Japanese military as defenders of the homeland. We merely saved our own soldiers.
said by jc100 :As for the Germans. We attacked them only after our allies were being hammered. A matter of fact, we ignored the war for several years. Hitler had started his campaign in 1937 with the bombing of Guernica. It wasn't until 1941 when Europe was in FULL FLEDGED WAR and our allies needed help did we enter. Obviously, we stuck out of it because it had nothing to do with us in the beginning. However, when we saw our allies needed our help, we did react. Yet, there still lies a difference. GERMANS WERE COMMITTING GENOCIDE! That's something that should NEVER be tolerated. We ignored the war because it had nothing to do with us. Our allies were being hammered since 1939 with the invasion of Poland. Yes, we sent military arms to England but we stayed out of it.
As for your genocide comment, no one really knew about the death camps until we found them. Plus, you forget that this country was anti-Semitic at the time. Try looking up the case of the SS St. Louis before you talk about entering the war because of genocide.
said by jc100 :Now, if you would have said we should have entered Iraq in the 1980s when Saddam was, you would have had my full support and I'm sure the worlds. However, to make Saddam a scapegoat for 9/11 twenty years later DOESN'T WORK. SORRY! Obviously, Bush wanted to blame someone for the attacks, and he failed geography when trying to do so. Once again, there were like 17 Saudis and a few from Yemen and Omen. NOT A SINGLE IRAQI. Simply violating the UN resolutions didn't amount to going to war. Guess what, we found nothing when we did enter. Surprise Surprise. I guess he had nothing after all. So my point stands. Two different wars and two different circumstances. The fact of the matter, you need to learn history better, so you don't try to meld the two together like they are the least bit similar. How about we bomb ourselves because so far we have a few who supported terrorism and actively fought for al-queda. Let's add England in there for Richard Reid and France for Zacarias Moussaoui.
Plus, you forget that Iraq was also practicing genocide against the Kurds which is one of your main reasons to go to war with Germany.
As for finding nothing, we do know Iraq buried some fighter jets in the sand and they were only found because of some local who pointed them out. As for the weapons, my theory is that Sadam thought he could rally the arab world to help him if the Americans attacked. Had he not tried to bully Iran, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and a few others, he might have had success. Sadam was not a rational person as shown in his own actions.
said by jc100 :As for Muslims condemning the attacks, you speak for them all? Strange. I do recall several Arab nations condemning 9/11. Egypt is one of our strongest allies as is Saudi Arabia. Then again, when did Christianity Condemn Bosnia? Christian Serbs slaughtered 200,000 Muslims and buried them in mass graves. Please remind me where the church spoke on that. Better yet, Christianity has the Holocaust as Hitler was a Catholic. He used the Church to his benefit when killing the Jews. Let's not forget the Spanish Inquisition where 100s of thousands were slaughtered in the name of Christianity. Best yet, and most famous, the crusades had the Christians Murdering Muslims yet again. Ah yes, good old Christianity and its blood filled past. I don't remember reading too many condemnations by the Church on these acts either. Should I conclude then that all of Christianity supports this barbarity and I have more to fear from them than the Muslims. After all, Christianity has murdered millions in the name of it's religion, too. Sure countries make condemn the attacks but why don't they do more to stop them?
As for Christians condemning Bosnia, I do recall the US sending air support and bombing the Serbs. You might also recall that was another debacle brought to you by the UN who can't decide if they want to stop war or just keep people at bay with useless sanctions and resolutions.
Hitler was more into the occult of Germany's past legends than a Catholic. And you may want to research Meir Kahane about how Jewish people can be just as bad.
Try again. | |
moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to still2lazy2login
said by still2lazy2login :
Please, leave parties out of this. Democrats and republicans have changed views countless times. I currently consider myself a Democrat, but I would have fully supported Lincoln in his era on his anti-slavery position (not so much his suspension of habeas corpus (much like our current President), though...)
Sure, when people stop blaming the Republican Party for everything and start blaming politicians in general.  | |
jc100
join:2002-04-10
| reply to moonpuppy
Moon,
What planet are you from? It's not earth. First, Let me provide you with a nice pretty timeline of WW2. Your history teachers failed you so I'll do my best to fix that problem. Look at December 1941.
»www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/t···time.htm
First, JAPAN attacked us BEFORE Germany declared war on the U.S. While Europe was a focus, so was Japan. It wasn't called a World War for nothing. However, Japan obviously became the main focus when they attacked Pearl Harbor on Dec 8, 1941. Shortly after (Dec 11), Germany declared war on us and we entered Europe (Jan, 26th 1942). Both of these were due to a culmination of events in prior years. Mostly sanctions and freezing assets. However, you need to get your dates straight.
Now for the atomic bomb. You make me laugh. We did not use it to prevent Russia from doing anything. The atomic bomb was being developed by both Germany and the U.S. However, the Germans never finished theirs because they lost the war. As for our usage in Japan, it was to prevent mass amounts of casualties on our side by having to drop on the mainland. Some predictions estimated there would be millions. Obviously, someone slept during history. It's called research, please try some and you will find this to be the ACTUAL reason we used the bomb.
As for ignoring the war, we used sanctions. There's a saying Diplomacy first. War Second. You have to try other methods before you send millions of people to war. Obviously, that's not logical to you. We didn't completely ignore, but nor did we help much. However, in 1941 we did enter and that's the point.
On the topic of Genocide, we had reports early on. How naive do you think this country is? WOW. While we never knew the extent of these camps until we liberated the people, we KNEW they existed. How could we not? Germany was deporting millions to such camps. Once again, research is paramount. Try it.
Side note... Let's not forget America's wonderful past of Japanese Internment Camps where many died as well from disease....
"Plus, you forget that Iraq was also practicing genocide against the Kurds which is one of your main reasons to go to war with Germany."
I mentioned that. Stop trying to flip things around. However, that was in the mid 1980s. I TOLD YOU ALREADY, had we entered then to stop Saddam, you would have had world support. Regan and Bush Sr. Chose to ignore it. Bush Sr's reaction was to liberate the Kuwaiti oil fields and leave. Obviously, he wasn't too concerned about the issue of genocide. However, more should have been done. Go blame Regan and Bush.
Again, you make me laugh. Saddam HATED IRAN. Do you not recall the Iran / Iraq wall? Saddam was pretty much disliked in the middle east. He wasn't rallying ANYONE. Do you enjoy inventing history? Once again, breaking sanctions was not cause for war. He had NOTHING. He NEVER ATTACKED the U.S. and the genocide happened 2 decades prior to us entering. 9/11 HAD NOTHING to do with SADDAM. You can try to spin it any way you want but no Iraqis were involved. Saddam didn't fund 9/11. So try again and stop misconstruing history for your own benefit.
"Sure countries make condemn the attacks but why don't they do more to stop them?"
Um... it already happened. How can you do more to stop something that happened? I doubt their leaders were privy to the plan. As for stopping future events, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, UAE, Egypt, Turkey are all very committed to rooting out fundamentalism in their country. While more could be done, they are making a valiant effort.
Last, I had to just bang my head before typing this. First, Christians MURDERED MILLIONS during the Crusades. A religious war against the Muslims. Second, CHRISTIANS MURDERED MILLIONS during the Spanish Inquisition as they forced their way to convert people. Convert or Die was the slogan... As for modern times, go read Mein Kempf. Hitler was a Catholic and based many of his Third Reich actions off the structure of the church. However, early on the Protestant Church broke rank with Hitler. However, he still had support of the Catholic and Methodist church. The Methodist being one of his stronger allies. Now, thats actual history versus your contrived one.
On the topic of Bosnia, Please tell me where the Churches condemned it or did more to stop it? You want to harp on Islam, let's harp on Christianity.... O wait, they didn't do anything. As for the U.S. entering and stopping it, Clinton did just that. Nato stopped the Serbs and we still have troops there at this moment. While the situation is not resolved, the violence is mostly gone. The Serbs aren't killing the Muslims and the Muslims aren't attacking the Serbs. What's left now is deciding how to divide the land. Yet, Clinton's Dayton Peace Accord ended the war officially.
As the G.I. Joe's said. Knowing is half the battle, and now you got an ACCURATE history lesson. | |
moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| I know history. If anyone has failed anyone, it was your teachers.
Again, when did Germany DIRECTLY attack us? Answer that. Only after we went over did they directly attack us. We had, according to the same definitions you use for the Iraq War, we had no business being over their.
And you better do a bit more reading. Russia was very interested in Japan and even went into Manchuria. One reason Germany never got the bomb was because they lost a shipment of D20 (heavy water) in Norway and was never able to make more without taking resources from other projects (such as the V1 and V2, jets, etc.)
Sanctions failed. Why? Because the UN failed to do anything. Food for Oil ring a bell? Even the son of the Secretary General was in on the fraud.
As for reports of genocide in Germany, there was no way to confirm it and even so, this country was anti-Semitic enough to not care. Again, I bring up the SS ST. Louis if you want to see how much we cared about Jews back then. It's not like we had reconnaissance planes over Germany like we have spy satellites now. And those being deported couldn't tell their side of the story and many in Germany supported it. Look up "Kristallnacht". That happened in 1938 and we waited until 1941 to go in?
Let's not forget the Japanese atrocities. Wake Island, Philippines, POW camps.
As for Kuwait, why did we stop at the border? That's right, the good old UN stopped us after the "Highway of Death" incident.
Your knowledge of history is severely lacking. Keep trying. | |
wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
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New York, NY
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| reply to moonpuppy
said by moonpuppy :As for Iraq, they continually violated UN resolutions. Should we just ignore UN resolutions? OF COURSE WE SHOULD IGNORE THEM, HAVENT YOU LISTENED TO A THING JC100 HAS BEEN SAYING?? I mean come on, there are car crashes happening in this country!!! Who has time to worry about little things like UN resolutions while our citizens continue to have automobile accidents?
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я люблю Денди! | |
jc100
join:2002-04-10
| reply to moonpuppy
I WILL TRY ONE LAST TIME with you.
First, Germany never attacked us but they made an official declaration of war after we embargoed them for oil and assets. Hence, after being attacked by Japan just a few days earlier, why the hell WOULD we wait for Germany to decimate Europe further and make it to our soil? Once again, you make connections that don't exist. IRAQ NEVER declared war on the U.S. formally or unofficially. There was NEVER a declaration by Saddam to Attack the U.S. with military might. The only time he ever made threats were when WE ATTACKED HIM. Try getting your history straight. It really isn't going well for you.
Second, I know why Germany didn't get the bomb. A large part was them losing their materials but they also lost the war before it was finished. However, that's an aside note. What you STILL DON'T UNDERSTAND is that we used the atomic bomb on Japan to save millions of our soldiers lives. Russia had NOTHING to do with us dropping the bomb. The justification for using it was that the amount of troops it would take to secure the Japanese mainland would be in the millions, a high cost seeing we lost so many in Europe. Before you speak further, GOOGLE a reputable site and not some contrived version of history. Russia only went into japan AFTER we dropped the bombs. Neither the U.S. or Russia wanted to enter ground warfare due to the amount of lives that would have been lost.. Who was your history teacher, the Emperor of Japan? You definitely DO NOT know your facts.
As for Genocide in Europe, we had reports. Yet, we didn't act swiftly. We knew it was happening, just not to what extent. You can argue what you wish, but obviously, you don't research your statements. Second, we did turn away the Jews and that was a big mistake on our part. Then again, we also interned the Japanese in pseudo concentration camps. Our actions really weren't at their peak back them. However, we did get our ducks in a row. Then again, we had Japan attacking us first and Germany to deal with. I see you stopped making your baseless allegations about Japan being a minor player in the war...
Also, I completely noticed you dropped your argument about Christianity. I knew REALITY an ACTUAL facts would put an end to your arguments. So if you wish to claim Muslims are out to get you, then by far Christians are too. Christianity's past is so tainted, one might think the sacrament is the blood of the people they've killed in history and not of Jesus..... | |
jc100
join:2002-04-10
1 edit | reply to wifi4milez
Wifi,
Your wit and sarcasm make light of my argument. I am not saying ignore the problem. However, many countries violate sanctions. However, that doesn't call for war. Saddam was not being hostile to his neighbors and nor was genocide taking place again. In all respect, his evasiveness was a thorn in the U.N's side but nothing more. Hell look at Castro / Cuba, Venezuela, Sudan, and many other countries. Many countries don't follow our mandates. Should we start systematically entering every last one of them whenever they fail to agree with us? By your justification alone, we should just declare war on everyone and occupy the world. That'll work well, seeing how successful we've been in Iraq and all. Let me tell you something. It's called PICKING AND CHOOSING your battles wisely. You can't go after everyone for everything. It simply won't work. War should be a decision of last results. In the case of Iraq, war would have been justified in the 1980s to stop Saddam of genocide. Yet, twenty years later, the rationale to enter was a MISTAKE. He had no WMDS, he hadn't attacked his neighbors, and genocide had ceased. Bush just needed someone to blame for 9/11 and Iraq seemed to be the easy target. Please find me the Iraqi hijacker in 9/11. I'm still waiting. Guess what, there were none and we knew that early on. Therefore, the mess we've created in Iraq is far from being justified.
As for dealing with problems in this country, charity starts at home. Before we go and invade countries needlessly, maybe we should solve our own problems. After all, crime, car crashes, poverty, take more lives than terrorism has in this country. I said it before. We shouldn't just ignore the threat. However, STRIPPING Americans of their rights via fear mongering (terrorists out to get you) is neither a justified response either. Merely, increased airport security, barriers in front of federal buildings, and metal detectors would be more reasonable responses. NOT THE PATRIOT ACT, NSA WIRETAPPING, and an overzealous government hell bent on destroying the foundation of this country! | |
jc100
join:2002-04-10
| reply to pnh102
Follow what logic? I never said we shouldn't have invaded in WW2. There's a difference between WW2 and now. ARE YOU NOT READING what I wrote. I'm not going to rehash the argument 50 times. WW2 the Japanese attacked US. Germany FORMALLY declared war on us a few days later. Hence, we reacted, instead of waiting for another country to hit our soil a second time in the same week.
As for 9/11. Iraq HAD nothing to do with it. On the other hand, the Taliban did. There's your constructive difference. The Taliban is in cohoots with Al Qaeda who directly perpetrated the attack. Saddam was not. Very simple. Need I said more? | |
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| said by jc100 :There's a difference between WW2 and now. ARE YOU NOT READING what I wrote. There's nothing to read, your apologies for the enemy are at best an incoherent, nonsensical rant.
--
Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to jc100
said by jc100 :I WILL TRY ONE LAST TIME with you. First, Germany never attacked us but they made an official declaration of war after we embargoed them for oil and assets. Hence, after being attacked by Japan just a few days earlier, why the hell WOULD we wait for Germany to decimate Europe further and make it to our soil? Once again, you make connections that don't exist. IRAQ NEVER declared war on the U.S. formally or unofficially. There was NEVER a declaration by Saddam to Attack the U.S. with military might. The only time he ever made threats were when WE ATTACKED HIM. Try getting your history straight. It really isn't going well for you. Why would we wait for Iraq to attack us since we had sanctions on them?
said by jc100 :Second, I know why Germany didn't get the bomb. A large part was them losing their materials but they also lost the war before it was finished. However, that's an aside note. What you STILL DON'T UNDERSTAND is that we used the atomic bomb on Japan to save millions of our soldiers lives. Russia had NOTHING to do with us dropping the bomb. The justification for using it was that the amount of troops it would take to secure the Japanese mainland would be in the millions, a high cost seeing we lost so many in Europe. Before you speak further, GOOGLE a reputable site and not some contrived version of history. Russia only went into japan AFTER we dropped the bombs. Neither the U.S. or Russia wanted to enter ground warfare due to the amount of lives that would have been lost.. Who was your history teacher, the Emperor of Japan? You definitely DO NOT know your facts. Look up Operation August Storm and tell me Russia had no plans for Japan. They went in on August 8th. Little Boy was dropped on Hiroshima on the 6th.
said by jc100 :As for Genocide in Europe, we had reports. Yet, we didn't act swiftly. We knew it was happening, just not to what extent. You can argue what you wish, but obviously, you don't research your statements. Second, we did turn away the Jews and that was a big mistake on our part. Then again, we also interned the Japanese in pseudo concentration camps. Our actions really weren't at their peak back them. However, we did get our ducks in a row. Then again, we had Japan attacking us first and Germany to deal with. I see you stopped making your baseless allegations about Japan being a minor player in the war... You forgot Germans and German-Americans were also interred in camps. Not many of them but some were.
Also, I never said Japan was a minor player. The focus of the war was Europe first and Japan second. From December 7th, 1941 until June 6th, 1942, the Japanese were gaining ground.
said by jc100 :Also, I completely noticed you dropped your argument about Christianity. I knew REALITY an ACTUAL facts would put an end to your arguments. So if you wish to claim Muslims are out to get you, then by far Christians are too. Christianity's past is so tainted, one might think the sacrament is the blood of the people they've killed in history and not of Jesus..... Didn't drop the argument. You merely used it but I will answer your question. Other than Eric Rudolph (who killed abortion doctors), where are all the Christian suicide bombers? Can't use McViegh since he was not very religious and he lived. Where are the massive Christian suicide bombers supported by a government?
Every single argument you put forth as a reason to attack Germany can be used in the same context to attack Iraq. You've got sanctions, genocide and you even had declarations of war (against the west in general.)
Keep trying. | |
jc100
join:2002-04-10
| Iraq to attack us? They never even hinted at the fact they plan to. Hell, we attacked them first, on two seperate occasions. This latest one didn't even have cuase. Still, why don't we invade Sweden, England, Norway. They MIGHT attack us in the distant future for some reason or another. Let's be pre-emptive. Better yet, let's just go into venezuela and knock out Chavez. He's not willing to share his Oil and has formed agreements with other South American Countries. Damn him to hell. Let's just go invade them as they keep talking too much. While we're at it, how about Cuba? Hell, why not everyone in the world. At some point or another, someone has said bad things against us. Why not just make the world the U.S. confederacy. You know, take over everyone and make them our territories while we at it. We're just so damn good at controlling Iraq (more sarcasm), why dont we bring our joy of destruction to everyone!! GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO USA!!!... Sarcasm aside, what are you smoking? You seriously amaze me.
Next topic, do you like repeating me or you really bored? "Look up Operation August Storm and tell me Russia had no plans for Japan. They went in on August 8th. Little Boy was dropped on Hiroshima on the 6th." DIDN'T I say ten times over THAT no one wanted to enter Japan with ground forces, not even Russia. You proceeded to tell me that Russia was going to beat us to the punch. NOW, you state exactly what I stated. RUSSIA only entered AFTER we dropped the bomb. My god man, your history sucks. The bomb ended the war with Japan, and the troops cleaned up the mess on all sides. Russia also Entered Berlin and other areas. What's your point?
Charles Taylor - It doesn't matter how you die, just that you are dead. Who gives a flying "F*CK" if the Christians used suicide bombers, guns, or spears. THEY STILL MURDERED MILLIONS IN HISTORY. The end result is the same, they killed people in the name of their religion. So what if it's not by a suicide bomb. Those people are dead. You my friend have just lost any and all my respect. My god. I didn't think people of your caliber still existed, but I guess they do. Do me a favor, go to someone who has just died and try speaking with them. They don't answer, RIGHT? Why? They are dead, whether it be from a heart attack, cancer, or a gunshot. The results the same. WHO CARES the method used!
Last, NO. Every argument I gave cannot apply to Iraq. WHERE did Iraq formally declare war on the U.S. Where was Iraqs involvement in 9/11. Answer those two with some hard facts. You won't find them. Hence, my argument for Germany is FAR DIFFERENT than Iraq. Sanctions do not just give cause to go to war. Actions do. Iraq didn't do anything aggressive towards us. As for the genocide, GET IT THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULL. It was twenty plus years ago. Apparently Regan and Bush didn't care about it. Bush entered to save Kuwait, not to depose Saddam for Genocide. So to use that as an argument for today's war is not even valid. GROW UP! | |
moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by jc100 :Iraq to attack us? They never even hinted at the fact they plan to. Hell, we attacked them first, on two seperate occasions. This latest one didn't even have cuase. Still, why don't we invade Sweden, England, Norway. They MIGHT attack us in the distant future for some reason or another. Let's be pre-emptive. Better yet, let's just go into venezuela and knock out Chavez. He's not willing to share his Oil and has formed agreements with other South American Countries. Damn him to hell. Let's just go invade them as they keep talking too much. While we're at it, how about Cuba? Hell, why not everyone in the world. At some point or another, someone has said bad things against us. Why not just make the world the U.S. confederacy. You know, take over everyone and make them our territories while we at it. We're just so damn good at controlling Iraq (more sarcasm), why dont we bring our joy of destruction to everyone!! GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO USA!!!... Sarcasm aside, what are you smoking? You seriously amaze me. So why did we attack Germany? A declaration of war? Iran attacked our soil. In case you don't realize it, embassies are sovereign soil of the countries that run them. Sweden, England and Norway have made no moves towards us. Venezuela on the other hand has made threats and if you knew anything about their mentality, you would know he is all talk. And, yes, I know people from Venezuela and other South American countries and I can tell you, some of those leaders have told Chavez to STFU.
said by jc100 :Next topic, do you like repeating me or you really bored? "Look up Operation August Storm and tell me Russia had no plans for Japan. They went in on August 8th. Little Boy was dropped on Hiroshima on the 6th." DIDN'T I say ten times over THAT no one wanted to enter Japan with ground forces, not even Russia. You proceeded to tell me that Russia was going to beat us to the punch. NOW, you state exactly what I stated. RUSSIA only entered AFTER we dropped the bomb. My god man, your history sucks. The bomb ended the war with Japan, and the troops cleaned up the mess on all sides. Russia also Entered Berlin and other areas. What's your point? And what did Russia do with their part of Germany? The Russians were looking for more territory as a buffer zone. We wanted a quick end to the war and the bombs helped that. Kind of funny that Russia finally comes in after he thought Japan was going to lose and thought they could get some extra land out of it.
said by jc100 :Charles Taylor - It doesn't matter how you die, just that you are dead. Who gives a flying "F*CK" if the Christians used suicide bombers, guns, or spears. THEY STILL MURDERED MILLIONS IN HISTORY. The end result is the same, they killed people in the name of their religion. So what if it's not by a suicide bomb. Those people are dead. You my friend have just lost any and all my respect. My god. I didn't think people of your caliber still existed, but I guess they do. Do me a favor, go to someone who has just died and try speaking with them. They don't answer, RIGHT? Why? They are dead, whether it be from a heart attack, cancer, or a gunshot. The results the same. WHO CARES the method used! Show me where Christians now are killing massive amounts of people?
You trying to rationalize this shows your complete ignorance and willingness to absolve muslims of killing because they are righting some wrong. Muslims did their fair share of murder too but you seem to think that is o.k.
said by jc100 :Last, NO. Every argument I gave cannot apply to Iraq. WHERE did Iraq formally declare war on the U.S. Where was Iraqs involvement in 9/11. Answer those two with some hard facts. You won't find them. Hence, my argument for Germany is FAR DIFFERENT than Iraq. Sanctions do not just give cause to go to war. Actions do. Iraq didn't do anything aggressive towards us. As for the genocide, GET IT THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULL. It was twenty plus years ago. Apparently Regan and Bush didn't care about it. Bush entered to save Kuwait, not to depose Saddam for Genocide. So to use that as an argument for today's war is not even valid. GROW UP! Iraq did support terrorism.
»www.cfr.org/publication/9513/
Maybe you need to stop wearing those liberal blinders and open up your eyes.
Funny how you never bring up Clinton when he bombed some supposed terrorist camps after Monica Lewinsky came out in the news. "Wag the Dog."  | |
jc100
join:2002-04-10
| You know what. I'm done rehashing the same argument with you. A declaration of war after being attacked four days prior has serious ground. We got surprised attack by Japan and now Germany is threatening us with military action. Yet, you don't seem to get it and I'm not going to explain. Read my post again.
As for those other countries, why not. You are advocating going after the world. Why not just take down everyone. Hell, friend can turn enemy in no time. What's that saying, keep your enemies close and you friends closer. They are the ones who have access to do harm. By your rationale, anyone speaking rhetoric should be taken down by military action. We've seen how well the wars this century have gone with Korea, Vietnam, and Now Iraq. Venezuela, Iran, and Cuba next. Rhetoric or not, they are threatening us, so let's go bomb the hell out of them. O wait, rhetoric counts for squat. None have officially declared war. As per Irans actions, you keep bringing up events twenty and thirty years ago. It's 2007 bud, not 1981. Different leadership. While you use the past in making a decision, you don't use it as the sole basis for stupid decisions. IE IRAQ.
On the Russians. Sure they partitioned land. They also fought beside us. What's your point? You don't have one other than misconstrue facts over and over. We dropped the bomb. NO ONE WENT IN BEFORE we did. You made the claim Russia was power hungry over land. Well gee, I don't care what battle you refer to. Please refresh my memory on east and west Japan under Russia or where we fought Russia in Japan? We didn't. Great. So stop spitting out crap you have no understanding about. The atomic bomb was used to stop Japan and prevent millions of casualties on our end. Only after dropping the bomb did the U.S. and Russia Enter. Obviously, Russia wasn't too concerned with taking Japan. I'll await your wonderful "mispoken facts" response telling me the heroic battle between Russia and the U.S. On Japanese Soil.
"Show me where Christians now are killing massive amounts of people?"
You trying to rationalize this shows your complete ignorance and willingness to absolve muslims of killing because they are righting some wrong. Muslims did their fair share of murder too but you seem to think that is o.k.
Now? Who cares about now. 1995 with 100-200,000 Dead Muslims at Christian Serb Hands not good enough? Hell in the last 100 years they've been responsible for around Eight million Deaths. I am not justifying ANYONE's actions for murder. I am merely saying your IGNORANT Racism towards Muslims is no more justified than it should be towards Christians. After all, Christians have killed more people in the last Hundred years than Muslims in the last several centuries. Hence, if you want to make the argument Muslims are Terrorists, it so can be made towards Christians too.
Nice pseudo link on Iraq. Now get me a real source with RELIABLE facts. CFR, who the hell are they? Second, the article you pointed to is from 2005 when WE CLAIMED there were links to terror. We found out otherwise, haven't we? So cut the crap. Want me to find a link from 1981 where Regan states Star Wars will be an overwhelming success? | |
jc100
join:2002-04-10
| reply to pnh102
Apologies for what enemies? The Christians who have Murdered around 7 or so Million people this very century. I should consider all Christians to be terrorists by your rationale. After all, the Methodist and Catholic Church sponsored a Catholic Named Hitler with the Holocaust. Let's not forget the Bosnian War where 100-200,000 Christian Serbs murdered the Muslims and buried them in Mass graves. Gruesome enough for you? There's nothing incoherent about the genocidal past of Christians. I don't remember too many Condemnations by the Church on Bosnia either. Better yet, I remember a total and complete oversight of the whole situation until the U.N. stepped in. So no, facts aren't rambling. I'm merely pointing out that BIGOTS like yourself seem to make history one sided. I am not trying to justify anyone's actions. I am merely trying to point out history has more sides that you'd like us to believe. As for dealing with issues at home, my point stands. 4000 Dead in America do to terrorism pales in comparison to the millions dead due to murder, car crashes, poverty, and other issues this country faces. While I do not advocating turning a blind eye (some security measures such as Metal Detectors, airport security, barriers in front of federal buildings are warranted), I also don't advocate turning this country into a hysterical panic by claiming the boogy man is out to get you. We all know this rhetoric has led people like yourself into believing that losing rights has justified the means. False. Losing rights is simply losing rights. It doesn't make us any more safe, JUST LESS FREE. | |
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