Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. in http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r19200782 en Tue, 08 Dec 2009 18:42:29 EDT Tue, 08 Dec 2009 18:42:29 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19866442 Gruesome :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by Hangmn See Profile :

Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
If more bankers were in Jail I might agree]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19866442 Thu, 24 Jan 2008 14:10:16 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196270 TScheisskopf : HEY KARL!!! Kaaarrrrlll!!!

Please, can we have a demerit system in these threads about the RIAA? One that automatically hits any poster that brings up the specious equivalency between pirated anything and child porn, child rape, child molestation and child auto seats with a negative score?

God weeps and a kitty dies every time this half-a**ed argument is put forth. ;-)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196270 Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:24:47 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19579654 fatness : Is not.

Is too.

Is not.

Is too.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19579654 Fri, 07 Dec 2007 08:46:10 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19579091 nekkidtruth :
said by Yauch See Profile :

And I have a M.A. in basic reading comprehension. When someone prefaces their statements with "one would assume" that means that they are making an assumption and stating an opinion. And my M.A. in 3rd grade vocab words would tell me that opinion means that it cannot be backed up by fact because it is a personally held belief.
Clearly your "basic reading comprehension" skills are no better than you claim mine are. I was calling B.S. on his statement that he probably ends up paying in the end for my pirating blah blah blah, to which I responded with "prove it".

Maybe we should move down to 2nd grade vocabulary to ensure we both understand ;)
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Weeeeeee]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19579091 Fri, 07 Dec 2007 02:44:49 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19574266 NormanS :
said by BF69 See Profile :

Yes and what change are you effecting by pirating?
Ah, there is the rub. I don't trade in pirated **AA content. If it isn't worth paying to see it, it isn't worth seeing at all.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19574266 Thu, 06 Dec 2007 11:35:38 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19574241 NormanS :
said by BF69 See Profile :

Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
How would you design a metric to determine what the **AA is losing to piracy? Do you assume that every pirated copy of a movie is a lost sale? On what basis do you make that assumption? What if nobody offered pirated content, and sales remained at their current levels?

The **AA estimates their losses by first taking a WAG at how many copies of Titanic the public would buy, if they couldn't get a pirated copy. Then they take a WAG at how many pirated copies are floating around on the Internet. They subtract the second WAG from the first WAG, and derive the dollar amount of sales not made; but the result of their wagging is: WAG/A - WAG/B = WAG/X.

A WAG is still a WAG, no matter how the **AA spins it.

NOTE: WAG = Wild Assessed Guess
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19574241 Thu, 06 Dec 2007 11:32:14 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19573184 madrhino :
said by BF69 See Profile :
cheap or porr to have amore .... See I have a M.A in REALITY,


Porr amore?You are talking about grain cereal love??Huh?

Didn't that degree require any English classes?
--
Get Verizon FIOS,The Anti-DIOS]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19573184 Thu, 06 Dec 2007 07:46:09 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19569842 TScheisskopf :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by Hangmn See Profile :

Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
Because incarceration is big business and big profits?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19569842 Wed, 05 Dec 2007 18:05:36 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19212714 zachary1 : Because he is a right-wing dork sporking the Pigman Limbaugh party line.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19212714 Sun, 07 Oct 2007 15:29:13 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19210409 russotto :
said by Bas :

The problem with your little theory is that in most suburban areas next to a MAJOR CITY a 1200 square foot house on a postage stamp sized lawn costs $250,000.00. So where do you suppose people should live, a cardboard box?
Plenty of larger and cheaper places are available, in places like North Philadelphia, Camden, East St. Louis, Anacostia, etc....]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19210409 Sun, 07 Oct 2007 00:55:54 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19208171 voiplover : Makes me want to go POP some CORN now! :p]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19208171 Sat, 06 Oct 2007 16:34:36 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19203152 anon :
said by superdog See Profile :

said by Draxsr :

The sub-prime "screw up's" aren't a government problem. It's a greed problem. The people in this country have issues with living within their means. No one forces one to sign a mortgage without giving it your own due diligance. Opting for an absurd, adjustable rate rests solely on the moron signing the paperwork. And I'd love to meet the moron who signs up for an 'interest only' mortgage where their payments pay ONLY the interest and nothing on the principle. It's what happens when someone making 30K/year thinks they need to live in a 300K house. It's sad and those morons do not deserve to be bailed out by the taxes others, who know how to live within their means, shell out. IMHO, YMMV.
That is a perfect statement, and one I wish I made myself. ;)
The problem with your little theory is that in most suburban areas next to a MAJOR CITY a 1200 square foot house on a postage stamp sized lawn costs $250,000.00. So where do you suppose people should live, a cardboard box?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19203152 Fri, 05 Oct 2007 18:25:41 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19200782 anon : Your screen name is amazingly appropriate ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19200782 Fri, 05 Oct 2007 10:15:02 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19200602 superdog :
said by Draxsr :

The sub-prime "screw up's" aren't a government problem. It's a greed problem. The people in this country have issues with living within their means. No one forces one to sign a mortgage without giving it your own due diligance. Opting for an absurd, adjustable rate rests solely on the moron signing the paperwork. And I'd love to meet the moron who signs up for an 'interest only' mortgage where their payments pay ONLY the interest and nothing on the principle. It's what happens when someone making 30K/year thinks they need to live in a 300K house. It's sad and those morons do not deserve to be bailed out by the taxes others, who know how to live within their means, shell out. IMHO, YMMV.
That is a perfect statement, and one I wish I made myself. ;)
--
»www.wavecrazy.net Join WISPA today! »www.wispa.org/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19200602 Fri, 05 Oct 2007 09:18:50 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19200313 anon : The sub-prime "screw up's" aren't a government problem. It's a greed problem. The people in this country have issues with living within their means. No one forces one to sign a mortgage without giving it your own due diligance. Opting for an absurd, adjustable rate rests solely on the moron signing the paperwork. And I'd love to meet the moron who signs up for an 'interest only' mortgage where their payments pay ONLY the interest and nothing on the principle. It's what happens when someone making 30K/year thinks they need to live in a 300K house. It's sad and those morons do not deserve to be bailed out by the taxes others, who know how to live within their means, shell out. IMHO, YMMV.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19200313 Fri, 05 Oct 2007 08:24:49 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19198825 Maranello :
said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
It said I lost 730 million this year by not playing the lottery every week. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19198825 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 22:04:53 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19198645 justin147 :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by Hangmn See Profile :

Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
NO, NO, NO, people are not that stupid. Most educated people don't wonder, but rather lament the fact so many people are in prison in the US. The vast majority of U.S. prisoners are non violent offenders. You Wana lock someone up now and force me to pay my taxes to in-prison a broke college student who likes to listen to music and shares his collection with other like minded students? Get Real. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19198645 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 21:33:37 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19198352 Kearnstd : the DVD thing has merit, if i have $20 in my hand and a choice between a DVD and a CD im going to buy the movie as its overall reusable entertainment value is greater.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19198352 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 20:43:00 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19197253 ross :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

The NEW study being discussed here isn't just MUSIC ONLY like the studies you quote. It also includes movies, books, etc.
From ArsTechnica:

"Study: P2P effect on legal music sales "not statistically distinguishable from zero"

By Ken Fisher | Published: February 12, 2007 - 08:49AM CT

A new study in the Journal of Political Economy by Felix Oberholzer-Gee and Koleman Strumpf has found that illegal music downloads have had no noticeable effects on the sale of music, contrary to the claims of the recording industry.

Entitled "The Effect of File Sharing on Record Sales: An Empirical Analysis," the study matched an extensive sample of music downloads to American music sales data in order to search for causality between illicit downloading and album sales. Analyzing data from the final four months of 2002, the researchers estimated that P2P affected no more than 0.7% of sales in that timeframe.

The study compared the logs of two OpenNAP P2P servers with sales data from Nielsen SoundScan, tracking the effects of 1.75 million songs downloads on 680 different albums sold during that same period. The study then took a surprising twist. Popular music will often have both high downloads and high sales figures, so what the researchers wanted was a way to test for effects on albums sales when file-sharing activity was increased on account of something other than US song popularity. Does the occasionally increased availability of music from Germany affect US sales?

The study looked at time periods when German students were on holiday after demonstrating that P2P use increases at these times. German users collectively are the #2 P2P suppliers, providing "about one out of every six U.S. downloads," according to the study. Yet the effects on American sales were not large enough to be statistically significant. Using this and several other methods, the study's authors could find no meaningful causality. The availability and even increased downloads of music on P2P networks did not correlate to a negative effect on music sales.

"Using detailed records of transfers of digital music files, we find that file sharing has had no statistically significant effect on purchases of the average album in our sample," the study reports. "Even our most negative point estimate implies that a one-standard-deviation increase in file sharing reduces an album's weekly sales by a mere 368 copies, an effect that is too small to be statistically distinguishable from zero."

The study reports that 803 million CDs were sold in 2002, which was a decrease of about 80 million from the previous year. The RIAA has blamed the majority of the decrease on piracy, and has maintained that argument in recent years as music sales have faltered. Yet according to the study, the impact from file sharing could not have been more than 6 million albums total in 2002, leaving 74 million unsold CDs without an excuse for sitting on shelves.

So what's the problem with music? The study echoes many of the observations you've read here at Ars. First, because the recording industry focuses on units shipped rather than sold, the decline can be attributed in part to reduced inventory. Gone are the days when Best Buy and others wanted a ton of unsold stock sitting around, so they order less CDs. The study also highlighted the growth in DVD sales during that same period as a possible explanation for why customers weren't opening their wallets: they were busy buying DVDs."

I think it's likely the above referenced study is equally applicable to movies, books, etc.. Other independent studies have established file sharing has aided, rather than sapped, industry profitability through these transitional times. It is high time the industry embraced the futility of DRM, and the success of file sharing as a low cost distribution channel.

Astro-turf "think tanks" like IPI are the handmaidens of industry propaganda machines, cheerfully creating, for a fee, fallacious fantasy-fulfilling "reports/studies" in support of the illogical and unbelievable spew of industry PR departments.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19197253 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 17:13:48 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19197073 Kearnstd : if piracy is so bad then why did NBC pull their content from the most popular source of legal downloaded content(iTunes).

and downloading TV shows isnt really much different then watching it on your Tivo, both ways you dont see the ads.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19197073 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:46:10 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195745 anon : Move to Denver. If the cops find an ounce or less it's legal.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195745 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:44:38 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196952 jp10558 : Even if people are quite poor, especially if people do not have gobs of discretionary income, they will spend or invest their money they do not spend on a particular product. Unless you think very poor or very cheap people just stuff cash in their mattress?

If they do not, there are basically 2 things you *can* do with money. Spend it or Invest it (A savings account is still money invested in the economy - banks can use it as a basis to lend money to people who are spending it).
--
Opera 9.23(Build 8808); Windows XP Pro SP2;Athlon 64 X2 4600+; 2.5GB PC3200 DDR; 1M/128k DSL; NOD32(Version 2.5.25); Outpost Pro 3;Proxomitron 4.5j Grypen 5/23/07(Opera mod),GPG ID:0x0A1C6EE3]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196952 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:26:01 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196948 Yauch : And I have a M.A. in basic reading comprehension. When someone prefaces their statements with "one would assume" that means that they are making an assumption and stating an opinion. And my M.A. in 3rd grade vocab words would tell me that opinion means that it cannot be backed up by fact because it is a personally held belief.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196948 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:25:16 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196860 russotto : NBC is still available over the air. You could get it that way. (that's what I do... and big criminal that I am, I skip the commercials. And I've got an automatic thing set up so when Hiro or Claire flogs a car, it replaces what they say with "Porsche". BWAHAHAHAHA)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196860 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:10:56 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196855 Yauch : I'd vote for it, lets do it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196855 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 16:10:29 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196762 TKJunkMail :
said by ross See Profile :

said by datreic See Profile :

I would like to contribute to this post.

Please read:

»www.informationweek.com/news/sho···01801704

»arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20···813.html

$58 billion is likely a gross exaggeration.
OUTSTANDING summary of the imaginary vs actual impact of file sharing. Thank you for posting!
The NEW study being discussed here isn't just MUSIC ONLY like the studies you quote. It also includes movies, books, etc.
--
--
Internet News
My BLOG
My Web Page]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196762 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 15:55:29 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196751 ross :
said by datreic See Profile :

I would like to contribute to this post.

Please read:

»www.informationweek.com/news/sho···01801704

»arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20···813.html

$58 billion is likely a gross exaggeration.
OUTSTANDING summary of the imaginary vs actual impact of file sharing. Thank you for posting!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196751 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 15:53:30 EDT Re: Full study can be found at links included below http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196743 jester121 : Still too long.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196743 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 15:51:46 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196285 ieolus : Isn't that how trickle down theory works?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196285 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 14:29:09 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196273 ieolus : Small businesses create the jobs that provide Americans with the money they need to live. Big businesses just fuck that up.
--
"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196273 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 14:27:25 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196265 sporkme :
said by elios See Profile :

and only i download House becouse i work nights so i miss it when its on and i want to watch it HD and my PCs monitor is much better then my TV
So who's the bigger criminal? You for "illegally" downloading free tv (and likely fast forwarding commercials) or me for using Tivo to save it and watch it later (and likely fast forwarding commercials)?

On paper, I'm legal and you're not. In principle, we're doing the exact same thing (skipping commericals).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196265 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 14:25:38 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196150 datreic : I would like to contribute to this post.

Please read:

»www.informationweek.com/news/sho···01801704

»arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20···813.html

$58 billion is likely a gross exaggeration.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19196150 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 14:04:07 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195805 yabos : Yeah it's illegal and I won't argue about whether it should be or not but it'd really dumb they would throw someone in jail for such a small amount when the person isn't hurting anything. If they have 10lbs in their trunk then throw the book at them but when the person isn't hurting anyone except perhaps themselves it's not a good thing to throw someone in jail for that.

I don't live in the States but I do watch Cops and they arrest people for things like that. They say "oh it's not a big deal but we're arresting you.." ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195805 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 13:04:24 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195749 ph03n1x : Yeah right laws against child molestation. What a fucking joke those laws have been made into lately. People that do that should be put down like rabid dogs, but these days we have people in jail for longer for copying DVDs or possessing a little bit of weed. Child rapists are constantly being let out of jail early or given light sentences. Disgusting.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195749 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:56:32 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195746 en102 : People are buying laws so that they can send people (others) to prison :p
--
Canada = Hollywood North]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195746 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:56:19 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195721 ph03n1x : The rampant piracy of content, while it has caused a bunch of bullshit spin and lawsuits has also led to the creation of:

iTunes
Yahoo Music
Real Rhapsody
eMusic
Napster (legal version)
MTV Urge
Zune
Movielink
CinemaNow
BitTorrent Store (legal version)
Vongo
Amazon UnBox
Netflix
Blockbuster Online

Are these options all good ones? Most certainly not. Some are absolutely unusable and are no real step in the right direction. Some however, are quite popular and pretty good (iTunes, Netflix) alternatives to piracy.

Sure, the content "mafiaa" should abandon DRM and get with the program full force instead of pushing out more asinine half-hearted attempts like Vongo, but the fact remains that if there was no rampant piracy of content, digital download services either would be far far worse or would not even exist at all.

As for the statement of $58b in "piracy losses" per year, that's 100% pure bullshit.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195721 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:53:16 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195629 nekkidtruth :
said by BF69 See Profile :

One would assume if you are so cheap to pirate something you fail to pay for other things too. And face it you're too cheap or porr to have amore expensive car. See I have a M.A in REALITY, not on economic theories base on fanciful hypothetical situations. Down the line SOMEONE pays for all that pirating and it's probably me. So yeah color me ticked off.
I have an M.A. in B.S. Which I'm calling on this. Where is your proof?
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Weeeeeee]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195629 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 12:39:00 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195365 bmn :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
(bolding mine)

Call us when you actually have some data to back that supposed theory you have outlined here since, as the facts would stand, it is wrong.

Maybe we should start locking people up who state things as fact without data to back it up... Hmmm.
--
Prove it...
Save the Internet Time (NTP) service, use the pool.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195365 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:56:26 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195342 bmn :
said by BF69 See Profile :

First of all pot is ILLEGAL.
Which does not make it wrong, only illegal.
--
Prove it...
Save the Internet Time (NTP) service, use the pool.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195342 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:52:19 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195339 bmn : You were doing so well until you threw "drug dealing" into the mix... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195339 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:51:22 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195319 dodgetech2 :
said by BF69 See Profile :

said by nasadude See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
apparently not quite random, as the number gets higher with every new "study".
People that probably collect welfare and food stamps yet have money to buy cigs are pirating more and more each day.
why does almost every single post by you have a reference to welfare in it?

are you that much of a troll that you just post that stupid crap in every thread? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195319 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:46:20 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195308 dodgetech2 :
said by BF69 See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
Um....is that what I said? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195308 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:44:10 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195270 kfsutops :
said by BF69 See Profile :

urely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
I would suggest it..and stop calling me surely.
--
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a LOT of inquisitive idiots"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195270 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:38:00 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195249 BF69 :
said by yabos See Profile :

Yeah, it's because you can go to jail for having a roach in your ash tray.
First of all pot is ILLEGAL. If you wish it not to be do something about it or move to Canada or Alaska. Secondly in most states just having a roach in your ashtray won't get you any jail time. Maybe a years probabtion at most. Thirdly if you are that dumb to leave a roach in your ashtry for the cops to find maybe you deserve jail.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195249 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:34:40 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195223 Hangmn :
said by BF69 See Profile :

You're right! Damn those laws against murder, rape, child molestation and drug dealing!!!!!!!!
You are truley showing your ignorance son
--
»davescustompc.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195223 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:30:26 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195218 BF69 :
said by nasadude See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
apparently not quite random, as the number gets higher with every new "study".
People that probably collect welfare and food stamps yet have money to buy cigs are pirating more and more each day.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195218 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:29:59 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195215 Hangmn :
said by BF69 See Profile :

Yes and what change are you effecting by pirating? I'm 100% sure that when people enjoying their pirated versions of movies and music that are doing it for the "greater good" and are thinking about their contribution to your so called "revolution" and not doing it for their own selfish desires.
And I suppose you are going out to Best Buy every week and buying this swill like a good little consumer?
--
»davescustompc.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195215 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:29:11 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195209 BF69 :
said by Hangmn See Profile :

said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by Hangmn See Profile :

Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
So many people are in prison in the US because the Laws are out of control, and the legislatures are bought and sold every day...
You're right! Damn those laws against murder, rape, child molestation and drug dealing!!!!!!!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195209 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:28:32 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195198 BF69 :
said by Hangmn See Profile :

said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by Hangmn See Profile :

Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
So should we effect change..or just take it?
The Revolutionary Army was "criminal"...until they won.
Yes and what change are you effecting by pirating? I'm 100% sure that when people enjoying their pirated versions of movies and music that are doing it for the "greater good" and are thinking about their contribution to your so called "revolution" and not doing it for their own selfish desires.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195198 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:27:01 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195181 BF69 :
said by Hangmn See Profile :

said by BF69 See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. What about the money businesses are costing families? With no congressional oversite on health care..the sub prime mortgage screw ups, which buy the way the middle class will be bailing out and so on. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
So you're the "cut your nose to spite you face" kind of guy huh? Yes screw big business which only provide the JOBS that provide Americans with the moeny they need to live. Real fricken smart. I am assuming you know what a JOB is.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195181 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:23:04 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195179 swhx7 : I've about had enough of the popular press repeating whatever bogus "piracy" numbers the copyright holders make up, without any question or analysis, implying to the public that they're valid.

A supposed lack of sales that hypothetically might have happened under conditions contrary to fact, is not a "loss" under any reasonable or recognized accounting principles. If a company put such an item on its financial statements as a "loss", the stockholders could sue for fraud and the SEC would punish the management and force a re-accounting. That's because it's fiction.

Of course as everyone knows, too, they assume every infringer would have bought a copy at full retail price, so it's becoming a question of whether reporters are complicit in foisting this BS on the readers, or how bizarre and preposterous the claims can be before the media will start questioning them.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195179 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:22:49 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195164 BF69 :
said by drdaleemille See Profile :

said by BF69 See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
I have an M.A. in economics and I still need someone to explain to me what economic loss means in this context. Suppose that I pirate TV shows, and because I don't spend my money on cable I am able to make bigger car payments, so I buy a more expensive car. Or I am able to invest more, which gives businesses more capital. Has the national economy lost anything, or is it a wash? NBC may have lost, but does the U.S. lose?
One would assume if you are so cheap to pirate something you fail to pay for other things too. And face it you're too cheap or porr to have amore expensive car. See I have a M.A in REALITY, not on economic theories base on fanciful hypothetical situations. Down the line SOMEONE pays for all that pirating and it's probably me. So yeah color me ticked off.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195164 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:20:44 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195159 yabos : Yeah, it's because you can go to jail for having a roach in your ash tray.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195159 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 11:19:44 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195009 hopeflicker :
said by Hangmn See Profile :

said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by Hangmn See Profile :

, and the legislatures are bought and sold every day...
And that there is the main reason. Buying laws should send people to prison.
--
People pray to God because they're told to.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19195009 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:52:35 EDT Full study can be found at links included below http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194941 TKJunkMail : Executive Summary for those who have short attention spans:
»www.ipi.org/ipi%5CIPIPublication···005AD5D4

Full article in HTML:
»www.ipi.org/ipi%5CIPIPublication···005B0C79

Full article in Acrobat PDF format:
»www.ipi.org/ipi%5CIPIPublication···nElement
--
--
Internet News
My BLOG
My Web Page]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194941 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:41:07 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194940 drdaleemille : One of two things happens to the money that we spend overseas. One is that it comes back to us in some form, if not via other countries buying U.S. exports then via foreign investments (including purchases of government bonds, i.e., the budget deficit). The other is that it doesn't come back. If it doesn't come back, then that effectively means that other countries are sending us their wealth for free, which is a huge gain for the national economy. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194940 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:41:03 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194881 Hangmn :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by Hangmn See Profile :

Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
So many people are in prison in the US because the Laws are out of control, and the legislatures are bought and sold every day...
--
»davescustompc.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194881 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:31:27 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194858 Hangmn :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by Hangmn See Profile :

Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
So should we effect change..or just take it?
The Revolutionary Army was "criminal"...until they won.
--
»davescustompc.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194858 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:28:18 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194835 madeyex : Hey... I was more than happy to pay $1.99 on iTunes every week just to watch Heroes. I do not have cable and this was a great alternative. The only shows that I really follow are Heroes and Battlestar. I work 6 days a week so cable tv is out of the question since I spend most of my time online after work. All that NBC did was screw themselves over. My friends and I cannot get them on iTunes so where will we go to get them? Its as if they are pushing us to pirate their tv shows. Fking morons. /slow clap]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194835 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:24:17 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194824 John Galt :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
;)
--
A is A]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194824 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:22:15 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194815 elios : the US entertainment industry hasnt made any thing worth my money in a long time well aside from House but every thing else is crap

id pay good money for the REAL BBC, Sky, NHK and the like in the US

edit and only i download House becouse i work nights so i miss it when its on and i want to watch it HD and my PCs monitor is much better then my TV]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194815 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:20:13 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194790 st7860 :
said by Hangmn See Profile :

said by BF69 See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. What about the money businesses are costing families? With no congressional oversite on health care..the sub prime mortgage screw ups, which buy the way the middle class will be bailing out and so on. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
I couldn't agree with you more.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194790 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:14:49 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194787 TKJunkMail :
said by drdaleemille See Profile :

I have an M.A. in economics and I still need someone to explain to me what economic loss means in this context. Suppose that I pirate TV shows, and because I don't spend my money on cable I am able to make bigger car payments, so I buy a more expensive car. Or I am able to invest more, which gives businesses more capital. Has the national economy lost anything, or is it a wash? NBC may have lost, but does the U.S. lose?
You are making an assumption that the dollars spent elsewhere go to U.S. businesses and create U.S. jobs and wealth, which clearly isn't the case. Given the U.S. balance of trade, a big piece of your posited alternate spending goes overseas. While the entertainment industry (most hurt by piracy) is still an industry dominated by US companies and workers. So yes, piracy does hurt the U.S.
--
--
Internet News
My BLOG
My Web Page]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194787 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:14:39 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194757 TKJunkMail :
said by Hangmn See Profile :

Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
Ah, the philosophy of every criminal that goes thru the criminal justice system. And people wonder why so many people are in prison in the US.
--
--
Internet News
My BLOG
My Web Page]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194757 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:10:09 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194718 fatness : »arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20···pit.html

quote:
One of the biggest bombshells from the cross-examination was Pariser's admission that the RIAA's legal campaign isn't making the labels any money, and that, furthermore, the industry has no idea of the actual damages it suffers due to file-sharing.

The admission came during questioning over the amount of damages the RIAA is seeking in the case. Toder asked Pariser how much Sony was suing the defendant for, and she replied that the amount was for the jury to decide and that the labels weren't suing for actual damages. As is the case with the other file-sharing lawsuits, the record industry is only seeking the punitive damages available via the Copyright Act, which can range from $750 to $150,000 per song. "What are your actual damages?" asked Toder.

"We haven't stopped to calculate the amount of damages we've suffered due to downloading, but that's not what's at issue here," replied Pariser, who was reminded by Judge Michael Davis to answer the questions actually asked by Toder, not hypotheticals.

--
Sure, that'll work..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194718 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 10:03:28 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194683 drdaleemille :
said by BF69 See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
I have an M.A. in economics and I still need someone to explain to me what economic loss means in this context. Suppose that I pirate TV shows, and because I don't spend my money on cable I am able to make bigger car payments, so I buy a more expensive car. Or I am able to invest more, which gives businesses more capital. Has the national economy lost anything, or is it a wash? NBC may have lost, but does the U.S. lose?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194683 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:55:48 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194669 nasadude :
said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
apparently not quite random, as the number gets higher with every new "study".]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194669 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:54:13 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194665 Hangmn :
said by BF69 See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
Who cares what it costs businesses. These idiots are in an arena where they are obviously out classed. If it can be done it will be done period. What about the money businesses are costing families? With no congressional oversite on health care..the sub prime mortgage screw ups, which buy the way the middle class will be bailing out and so on. F'k em I screw em every chance I get
--
»davescustompc.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194665 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:53:18 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194638 Vertickle :
said by BF69 See Profile :

said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?
Surely you are not suggesting that pirating costs businesses $58,000,000,000?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194638 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:49:45 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194628 anon : when people with no money and no plans to buy the material take it, how would you value it? 58 billion?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194628 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:47:37 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194625 53059959 : its logical to conclude that if they were losing vast amounts of money to piracy, they would do more then just give out a press release stating that we shouldn't pirate their shows.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194625 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:47:11 EDT Re: U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194608 BF69 :
said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

Random number generator?
Surely you are not suggesting that priratng cost businesses NOTHING?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194608 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:43:26 EDT U.S. economy loses $58 billion from piracy every year. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194590 dodgetech2 : Random number generator? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19194590 Thu, 04 Oct 2007 09:39:38 EDT