openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA | reply to fiberguy
Re: I'm shocked, just shocked I say
So? |
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fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20 | So.. what? Enlighten us on on your "so"... Don't know how to respond. |
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openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA | I was commenting on your statement about telecoms owning and managing portions of the internet backbone. I didn't see the relevance. |
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fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| You said: "Fair enough...we'll agree to disagree because I'd say that the U.S broadband market is competitive."
The market is not really competitive when the majority of the data still travels over the same two or three people's lines, who in turn, make the rules and set the prices.
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"Complaining is the least path of resistance for the self-serving, the lazy, and I’m told it’s a woman’s prerogative..." |
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qworster
join:2001-11-25
Los Angeles, CA
 ·DSL EXTREME
·Brand X Internet
 ·RoadRunner Cable
 ·Vonage
| reply to openbox9
WHY?
Because the ILECs DIDN'T PAY FOR THEIR NETWORK!!!!!
WE DID!!!!!!!!!!
When the ILECs first existed, the government not only gave them substantial tax breaks and free access to PUBLIC rights of way, they GUARANTEED them HUGE RETURNS based upon the HUGE FEES THEY WERE ALLOWED TO CHARGE AS A MONOPOLY for over FIFTY YEARS!!!!!
THEN in the 1996 communications act, the ILECS were allowed into the long distance market IN RETURN FOR OPENING THEIR LAST MILE UP TO CLECS!! The ILECs GOT WHAT THEY WANTED, but NEVER FULFILLED THEIR PART OF THE BARGAIN!!!!!!
GET IT? |
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openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
·AT&T Southeast
| reply to fiberguy
Re: I'm shocked, just shocked I say
Are we not talking about consumer service? Consumers are far removed from the backbone and I don't think your rules and prices are that relevant. If you really want to go to the level you're talking about, don't forget about the companies providing electricity, router/switch manufactures, copper/fiber manufactures, unions and wage earners, etc, all "controlling" costs to consumers way down the path. |
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fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Electricity providers are regulated. Router/Switch manufacturers have PLENTY of competition and those providers have choices, same with copper and fiber manufacturers. Unions and wage earners are a non-starter in this picture as well... but, something that is controlled and was once regulated and split up over this very issue has been allowed to reform and regroup and here we are...
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"Complaining is the least path of resistance for the self-serving, the lazy, and I’m told it’s a woman’s prerogative..." |
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openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
·AT&T Southeast
| Telecom providers are regulated as well. So are cablecos. Router/Switch manufacturers have about as much serious competition on internet backbones as what your consumer broadband service providers do. Why are unions and wage earners non-starters? You can't seriously believe that unions don't drive up costs of products being sold can you? The "New AT&T" is not the same as the old AT&T and like I initially mentioned is still regulated. |
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fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Unions? You're talking about items that drive up costs.. and I'm talking about an industry or corporation holding people to pay what ever they want.. two different things.
Cable TV, so you know, isn't regulated. The only thing that has a rule is on the lowest tier of service.
I'm sorry to say, but your last message really shows that you don't have much experience in the industry so we'll leave it at that and end this here.
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"Complaining is the least path of resistance for the self-serving, the lazy, and I’m told it’s a woman’s prerogative..." |
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quetwo
That VoIP Guy
Premium
join:2004-09-04
East Lansing, MI | reply to openbox9
If it dosen't, then the the LECs are fools. The dry-run costs are to include the copper plant ONLY from the CLEC's cage to the customer's DMARC. This would include install + maintenance of the pair. |
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quetwo
That VoIP Guy
Premium
join:2004-09-04
East Lansing, MI
| reply to openbox9
Take a look at the history books, and turn to the pages where in New York, each "CLEC" or competitive phone company ran their own wires. The poles were 3 stories tall, with gobs and gobs of wires. People saw this as an assult of their public right-of-way, so new laws were enacted.
Could you imaging every CLEC having to have their own pole space in each metro they serviced? Just in my area, there is : AT&T, Old AT&T, TDS, Metrolink, Telecom USA, CheckPhone, McCloud USA, ACD, Arialink, Comcast... Those are just the ones on the top of my head. And I don't live in a very dense area!
The goverment subsidized the build out of a SINGLE telecom network to remove the issue of having every C/LEC have its own wire in the ground.
The copper plant in the ground is a natural monopoly. The service running on it, is a commodity market. |
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