DataDoc
My avatar looks like me, if I was 2D.
Premium
join:2000-05-14
Greenville, NC
 ·Suddenlink
1 edit | I'd pay just to not have to fight the packaging.
Not all of those downloads were kept after listening, and it's a whole lot nicer to find out you hate the album and delete it than kiss your cash goodbye because you can't return it.
Like I just deleted the Saul William's album.
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Strappin’ the ol’ yowza-pow milk truck to grampappy’s riverside wikka-wokka. |
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NOCMan
Verizon Fios User
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Flower Mound, TX
| My thought's exactly. People are forced to buy music and if they do not like it can not return it because we could of made a copy. Talk about captive buyers.
I believe that's a unfair practice, but my complaints have fallen on deaf ears every time I've complained to those who can change the laws. |
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fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
1 edit | said by NOCMan  :My thought's exactly. People are forced to buy music and if they do not like it can not return it because we could of made a copy. Talk about captive buyers. This isn't a new release movie you know...
I can't buy that argument for the simple fact that people CAN and MOST OFTEN do know if they like the song. They've either listened to it on the radio, streaming through the web, digital music, etc. I would have to guess that damn near 99% of people that go to buy a song have already heard it in some sort.
So you think buying music with out a trial is unfair? So you'd want the laws changed? Sweet!
While you're at it.. I have a few other laws I want changed in the free market society too..
I want to live in my house before I decide to buy it.
I want to try the airline first to make sure I like the flight before I pay for it.
I want to have that flat screen in my home before I buy it.
I also want to take that cruise first before I buy it.. you never know, I may not like the view or the room.
And don't forget dinner.. restaurants vary so much. I may not like the food.. I CERTAINLY want to eat first before I decide IF I will pay for it.
Where is this notion coming from that if we don't like the way the free market works, we can just, by use of the courts or law makers, force those who sell a product to sell it in a specific way...
Talk about socialism at it's best!
Your post makes it sound like you have a right to music.. I won't address other topics because this only addresses music. But seriously.. I would be even MORE pissed is Barbara Boxer felt she could force the music industry to let people have a copy of their work first, by law, before they buy. Technically you already have it.. the radio is still free.
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"Complaining is the least path of resistance for the self-serving, the lazy, and I’m told it’s a woman’s prerogative..." |
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SilverSurfer
join:2007-08-19
1 edit | said by fiberguy : I have a few other laws I want changed in the free market society too.. I want to live in my house before I decide to buy it. I want to try the airline first to make sure I like the flight before I pay for it. I want to have that flat screen in my home before I buy it. I also want to take that cruise first before I buy it.. you never know, I may not like the view or the room. And don't forget dinner.. restaurants vary so much. I may not like the food.. I CERTAINLY want to eat first before I decide IF I will pay for it. Where is this notion coming from that if we don't like the way the free market works, we can just, by use of the courts or law makers, force those who sell a product to sell it in a specific way... Talk about socialism at it's best! Whoa. Step away from Rush radio and turn off the Hand Jobbity and Loofah O'Reilly show...you are hallucinating "socialism," under your bed just like you hallucinate terrarists under your bed. We're talking about an intangible item>>>HELLO! Music is not something you touch. Oh and comparing wanting to hear music before a consumer buys it with wanting to live in your house before you buy it and all of your other insipid examples of "socialism"? Society has already addressed that problem. It's called renting. |
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karlmarx
join:2006-09-18
iraq
 ·Fairpoint Communic..
| reply to fiberguy
YES, technically we STILL HAVE IT. THE RADIO IS FREE. I choose to listen to it on a different medium however, but it's still FREE.
Remember the old days, when you would record your favorite songs off the radio, and make you own tape mix? You'd trade with your friends to build up your collection...
Nothing MORALLY has changed. We STILL get access to our TV shows, our MUSIC, and other 'intangibles' for FREE. The fact, which goads you apparently, is that now we are using technology to DO THE SAME THING WE'VE ALWAYS DONE!
We haven't changed, but the medium hasn't evolved with the times. Fact of the matter is, just because you USED to make a lot of money, doesn't mean you are ENTITLED to make a lot of money. If 'technology' makes your business model obsolete, well that's just too bad. Find a different business model.
It's NOT SOCIALISM, it's PROGRESS. Progress stops for no man.
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Stick it to the MAN. Support your local torrent sites. Proudly providing 100mb of upstream for all your TV, Movie, and MP3 needs. |
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djrobx
join:2000-05-31
Valencia, CA
 ·PHONE POWER
 ·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T CallVantage
·Time Warner VOIP
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to fiberguy
quote:
I can't buy that argument for the simple fact that people CAN and MOST OFTEN do know if they like the song.
Song yes, album no.
Your analogies all fail because they all involve tangibles. If I record songs I hear on the radio and listen to them it has no negative impact on the artist. I can't occupy a home, fly on a plane, use a flatscreen, or eat food without a material cost.
The law even protects my right to do that, through fair use laws.
As much as the recording industry fears Mp3, it's really not much different from recording broadcasts from a radio. It doesn't directly cost the artist anything.
With lots of high quality radio options available now (commercial free digital music in your car from XM and Sirius, or from your television service), I rarely find the need to "own" music. They will play a song plenty until I'm tired of it. There are some songs I do want, and $.99 is a good value for them, but it's generally not worth $20 for a whole album.
The point is - people want value. Overpriced CDs and DRM are examples of how the recording industry has forgotten that they are selling products to paying customers and should be catering to them if they want their money.
You say "you have a right to music" - the converse of your argument is that recording industry seems to think they have a right to people's pocketbooks. People don't NEED to buy music to function. They want cuts of internet ISP profits and CD media - whether I buy their product or not. With very new and recent exceptions, they still don't unilaterally offer the product I want, which is around a buck or two for an industry-standard MP3 file that works in my car, my iPod, and my Windows smartphone. |
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o2cool8
join:2002-04-19
Miami, FL | reply to karlmarx
Problem is that now, mp3 are high quality and close to full CD quality. When you record of the radio, you sometimes get the DJ at the begging or end of the song, some static and its recorded to a tape, which isn't the best quality. |
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fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| reply to djrobx
"Song yes, album no."
Give me the name of an album, and there is most likely a number of places on line where you can at least hear a 30 to 60 second sampling of the song. If in 30 to 60 seconds you can't tell you if like a song.. well..
As for your radio argument - any of them not talk over the lead in and lead out? Kinda destroys the value of free and clear ownership, huh?
You don't think the people delivering the music to you don't have a cost involved? This is the biggest problem people don't get. There is A LOT of money behind making music on a wide scale.
Fair use laws come in after the fact once you've licensed or purchased your copy. You do not have the right to do with as you please with the music before and after purchase.. especially before. Even music recorded from the radio still is protected by copyright.
And yes - MP3s being recorded DO directly cost the artists as there is now less people purchasing their work. Consumption revenue models are often forgotten over production and material models.
I agree with you that 99 cents per song is value especially when you can pick and chose. However, today, there are still people who out right don't want to pay for the very music that you and I will. THAT ALONE should anger you that there are people who believe they don't need to pay. When more and more people don't pay, those of us that do will likely pay more. For that, I am all for them protecting their content more and more.
I wish people would stop stealing so much so that all the DRM protection, limited access options, and other restrictions would slow down. It's thieves that are making it harder for everyone else.
Ever downloaded and paid for a lot of music, lose your keys in a crash and be with out your music because of it? Gotta love licensing!
The music industry does not have a right to your pocket book. That's absurd! BUT, they have a right to have their product purchased when you consume, and they have a right to be paid the price they ask. If you aren't willing to pay the price they put on it, then don't buy it. It's not up to the consumer to decide what they will pay for something - other than to pass it up and not buy it if they don't find it a value. To simply take is stealing.
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"Complaining is the least path of resistance for the self-serving, the lazy, and I’m told it’s a woman’s prerogative..." |
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SilverSurfer
join:2007-08-19
| said by fiberguy :Give me the name of an album, and there is most likely a number of places on line where you can at least hear a 30 to 60 second sampling of the song. If in 30 to 60 seconds you can't tell you if like a song.. well.. Ok, champ. Put your money where your big yap is. I see your "most likely" theory and raise you the effort of finding all those "number" of places online where a 30 to 60 second sampling exists so that I can hear it before I buy it. And oh BTW, I'm not talking about a BT file.
Die Ashanti by Zen Lemonade.
I could name numerous others, but I'm taking it easy on you and asking you to demonstrate your theory of "most likely". |
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birdfeedr
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-11
Warwick, RI
·Verizon FIOS
| said by SilverSurfer :said by fiberguy : Ok, champ. Put your money where your big yap is. I see your "most likely" theory and raise you the effort of finding all those "number" of places online where a 30 to 60 second sampling exists so that I can hear it before I buy it. And oh BTW, I'm not talking about a BT file. Die Ashanti by Zen Lemonade. I could name numerous others, but I'm taking it easy on you and asking you to demonstrate your theory of "most likely". sign up for a no-pay rhapsody account, and you can play 25 songs in full glory for each month. Like the tune and you can buy the song (with DRM) for $0.89.
including Die Ashanti by Zen Lemonade. |
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PHOENIXZERO
join:2006-07-11
Beaverton, MI | reply to SilverSurfer
I feel dirty doing it, but Amazon.com usually has samples.. |
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hobgoblin
Sortof Agoblin
Premium
join:2001-11-25
Orchard Park, NY
clubs:
| reply to SilverSurfer
Die Ashanti by Zen Lemonade.
»www.electronic-mp3.com/medicine/alb13028/
»www.all-mp3-online.com/medicine/alb13028/
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"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
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fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| reply to SilverSurfer
Sounds like everyone has helped my big yap there bucko...
Apple iTunes, Rhapsody, their own MySpace, ... need some more?
You don't even need a free Rhapsody account to hear the songs.. they will always let you hear the 30 seconds.. as it was stated, the 25 free plays per month still works. And yes, I said "most likely" meaning there are going to be SOME that may not be available...
So, honestly... congratulate yourself on this one. I gave you a wide open example of being able to sample music.. I even stated that MOST, meaning "not all", would be available, and yet you try to pick something that you'd think MAY NOT be available, and not only myself but others threw it in your face...
.. how's that egg on your face working? Is your skin any younger? :P
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"Complaining is the least path of resistance for the self-serving, the lazy, and I’m told it’s a woman’s prerogative..." |
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sivran
Long Live The Suite
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Arlington, TX
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to fiberguy
Fallacy. Just because he wants "try before you buy" for music, doesn't mean he also wants to "try" that house before he buys it. Although I suppose you could try and convince the seller to let you rent it for a while. 
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Think outside the fox...Seamonkey |
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