varius
join:2003-02-22
Montreal, QC
| reply to Dr BG
Re: How "traffic shaping" will negatively impact neuroscience:
A bit off-topic, but I would be curious to know in what language people dream if they become bilingual in their early stage of language acquisition and what is activated in the brain when they dream in one language or another (if it's the case)? I do ask myself that sometimes, really! For some reason the first language I learned is spanish, even if my parents were french speakers (we were living in south america). Back in Canada, I lost my spanish because of a lack of practice, but I did make those dreams in spanish many years after. In the morning, I remembered complex sentences that I would not have been able to produce otherwise. A recording of my brain activity would have been great! 
Now the traffic shaping...My cancellation date is for tomorrow. I'm happy with the service I get already from my new provider. I'm just hoping the actual and definitive switch will go smoothly. I'm ready to see mistakes on my next bill from Bell...Be ready to go through that...The sure thing is don't let that bad experience distract you too long from your research. It's time to "re-forget" your Internet provider by trying another one that go the way you want...
Varius |
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yathefreaksaidya
@teksavvy.com
| reply to Deadpool
said by Deadpool  :I and others have suggested alternative solutions to you which would allow you and your research collegues to benefit from faster speeds and/or still be able to perform your research. I understand that BT is your preferred solution. What I and others are having a problem understanding is why you chose this solution compared to other more efficient and faster solutions, that's all. The "weak link" is, in this case, BitTorrent. I'd strongly suggest using one of those alternative solutions available to you. BT is great, it will seed without being 100% complete, so if he has say 200 people that need to download a certain project he has it's obvious Torrents is the way to go, They can all join into one pool and then seed/leech off one another without having to wait to download the file from a major seed or without having to wait for the thing to be 100% complete on a few different servers.. if one SEED in the pool has a massive amount of bandwidth and "super seeding" is enabled then it'll seed out the parts that's missing to people that need it and not what is allready out there.. I'm an idiot at times and I get what he's saying.
Deadpool, I've had many a battle with you but come on, some common sense would go a long way. as a company man you're always looking for the companies best interests and always looking at how the customer could be wrong whatever instead of actually taking things for face value.. It's easy to point out holes in things, any fool can do that, it's being able to look past that to see the big picture that you seem to have a problem with... |
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sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
H0H 0H0
 ·Rogers Hi-Speed
Host:
Rogers
Bell Canada
| If I have a scan done by Dr. Z.
Now participating are Drs A, B & C, The scan still has to come *in its entirity* at least once from from Dr Z ... say pulled by A. Now B can pull it half from Z and half from B. and finally C can get it in thirds from Z, A, B
The level of efficiency does not seem *that* much of an improvement over every one pulling it from Z. |
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ifZisslow
@teksavvy.com
1 edit | what if Z only has a 1mbit upload rate and you have 45 people downloading from him, so now his 1mbit just got a lot smaller.. So he seeds using super seeding and only connect to peers 1-10 and they 1-10 have a half megabit upload speed, now we've got 5megabit upload from peers and only 1 megabit from the actual seed, so now 11-45 have 5megs in download speed... |
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sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
H0H 0H0 | These are UNIVERSITY researchers and Hospitals we're talking here. |
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not Dr Z at home
@teksavvy.com
| I'm not going to make a chart to show how you're missing the point i have things to do, Lets assume for a minute,
they are all not at work/school but say 75% are at home like the good Dr. claims is a lot of the time.. So Who's to say the others are not @ home.. the problem with your last comment
said by sbrook :These are UNIVERSITY researchers and Hospitals we're talking here. Is the fact you're assuming they're all at work/school whatever.. |
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sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
H0H 0H0
·Rogers Hi-Speed
Host:
Rogers
Bell Canada
| reply to Dr Basil Ganglia
Re: How "traffic shaping" will negatively impact neuroscience:
This then comes back down to a business purpose on a residential line. Don't misunderstand, I don't have a problem with people DOING this on a residential line (although I'd certainly be a little concerned about medical records floating out on some doctors' home computers), but it still comes down to using the wrong tool for the job.
Would you try pounding in nails into concrete with a tackhammer? |
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bylo
Premium
join:2004-05-04
Waterloo, ON
1 edit | reply to not Dr Z at home
. |
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I Need Speed
join:2007-11-12
Richmond, TX
1 edit | reply to Dr Basil Ganglia
Re: How "traffic shaping" will negatively impact neuroscience:
Wow I can't believe I read this whole thing. 
So as I see it there are researchers all over the world doing studies on this and that, and have MRI information that they wish to share. One of them decided it would be easy enough to start there own Torrent site to catalog all the different research.
This Dr. heard about it from another and decided to use the system, to share his own research and is able to benefit from others.
So in theory if he has 150 subjects in his study he can pool that with say thousands of others around the world.
That just sounds like a good idea to me. First of all it saves money and secondly it allows for a more detailed study.
Why is it so hard to believe that researchers would want to be able to share and expand there own research beyond what there particular means are?
How would FTP from one site allow all the researchers to share information easily? Who will host it? Who will pay?
Isn't the original point to p2p and Torrents that it displaces the bandwidth across all users and not on one entity?
Now I have read both sides of this argument and I just don't understand all the nay sayers that wish attack the system that WAS NOT set up by this Dr. Why should he have to defend a system started by someone else? Why is it his job to start a sharing system for the rest of the world?
I will finish with this information.
I have a fellow IT geek who happens to work at the local University. I asked him about BT and this particular thread.
After he asked around he called me back and confirmed that research is OFTEN SHARED.
I have asked him to have one of the researchers read this thread. I will let you know what he finds out. |
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I Need Speed
join:2007-11-12
Richmond, TX
2 edits | reply to Dr Basil Ganglia
Re: How "traffic shaping" will negatively impact neuroscience:
In my own research I have found this
»hms.harvard.edu/ec_res/nt/77428A···licy.pdf
This is the Harvard Medical School
Information Security Policy.
It states all the p2p that is not allowed on there network but there is an exception for BitTorent only.
to quote "Of these applications, BitTorrent has value in the scientific community"
Page 10 |
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Dr BG
@bell.ca
| reply to Dr Basil Ganglia
For context:
In order to comply with the letter and intent of the University DMCA policy (» dmca.harvard.edu), Peer-to-Peer applications are restricted on the HMS network, the HMS wireless network and the HMS VPN. Examples of P2P applications are BitTorrent, Gnutella, Limewire, eMule and Ares Galaxy. Of these applications, BitTorrent has value in the scientific community. If your work requires the use of BitTorrent, an exception may be made for your system. A request for an exemption may be made by submitting a support request form or by contacting the HMS IT Help Desk at 617-432-2000.
It ain't MIT, but Harvard Med. has some clever people working there I suppose. |
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Dr BG
@bell.ca
| reply to sbrook
said by sbrook :This then comes back down to a business purpose on a residential line. Don't misunderstand, I don't have a problem with people DOING this on a residential line (although I'd certainly be a little concerned about medical records floating out on some doctors' home computers), but it still comes down to using the wrong tool for the job. I think it's my decision which tool I use for what purpose. In fact, since CONTENT is not within the purview of my ISP, it's no one's business how I use my residential connection. Surely that point hasn't been lost in this discussion? Otherwise, every time I post on an academic newsgroup or send a work-related email from home, I'm "using the wrong tool". Unless you want to start talking about relative KB amounts - which would be silly.
I think I've been clear enough here. "Medical records" are not floating around on my home computer. Patients would be lucky if they were; my home PC is a lot safer than some hospital networks I've seen - especially in Canada. Also, as I said before (why do I keep having to repeat myself - this stuff is written down) I'm not in clinical research.
What is on my computer: thousands and thousands of tiny files, which (when compiled in certain ways by certain programs) make pictures, or Gaussian messes, or hopeless attempts at variable analysis. Maybe not exciting, but well-suited for torrenting to be sure. |
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sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
H0H 0H0
·Rogers Hi-Speed
Host:
Rogers
Bell Canada
| What you're missing is that it's NOT your decision, but rather the ISP's decision about what is done with their network.
Once they have established their connection, how you use their network is defined by them. "Our Network, Our Rules". It's not necessarily fair, but it's fact.
You use my path to get to the beach behind my house, I set the rules across my path. |
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Dr BG
@bell.ca | You are endearingly fond of finishing your posts with an untenable metaphor. I love it.
If the ISP overpromised the width of the path to the beach, then my only recourse is to take a tackhammer and pound-out a nice, new concrete sidewalk. |
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sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
H0H 0H0
·Rogers Hi-Speed
Host:
Rogers
Bell Canada
| No, you have no recourse. My path, my rules. Don't like it, so sad, too bad.
I'm not saying that's fair ... it's the reality of the situation. All this griping in this forum isn't going to change things one bit. That's been shown many times with ISPs in the past. |
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Rastan
join:2007-04-25
Canada
 ·VBUZZER
 ·TekSavvy Solutions..
| reply to Dr Basil Ganglia
Those who say "if you don't like it that's too bad, there's nothing you can do", have a defeatist attitude. Write your M.P. and let them know that your ISP is abusing their position.
If you don't believe ISP's should act as a gatekeeper and make decisions for you then let them know that you support net neutrality. If enough people make this an election issue then perhaps something will be done.
A class action suit might work as well since Bell's throttling affects applications such as voip and online gaming. It would be nice if voip companies would sue Bell for tampering with their business. |
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