pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
 ·Comcast
| reply to gaforces
Re: What Credibility?
said by gaforces  :Some people are content with 15th place for world broadband deployment. Others of which I am included, see that our future depends on it, and see that a few big companys are content with the status quo where they can still keep making billions with little effort. So what do you want Verizon to do?
The only way we can resolve this problem is to encourage more companies like Verizon to run fiber and to make other investments into infrastructure. You should be praising Verizon for making the risky investments needed to deliver better broadband.
If Verizon investors make billions off the deal, that only proves that they made the correct investment.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. |
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FactChecker
@cox.net
thumbs down from:
cdigioia
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :Please. The USA is the only country where people of lesser means are more likely to have obesity-related health problems than to die of starvation. Ignorance of the reasons why that is the case is clear on your part... Before you use that as a reason as to why the poor in America are so good off, perhaps you should understand why that is a case.
The fact that the poor are obese doesn't actually support your case at all and you would know that if you had a clue why it is that way instead of just blithely using an argument posed by talk show radio blow hards who don't have a clue. |
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rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
| reply to pnh102
I can't be sure (I didn't read all the replies) but I don't think anyone played the race card. The fact that people seem to associate certain races with welfare deserves its own topic.
To be clear, I'm not focusing on "social welfare". I'm asking for folks to open their eyes and realize how much money this government takes from us and gives to rich companies and, indirectly, rich people. I believe we generally do this with the best intentions but the abuse is sickening. And...at the end of the day these same welfare addicts rape us again with ridiculous prices, litigation if they cannot put a green refrigerator in your front yard and tear out your hedgerow and crappy, half-baked products. Somewhere there should be a REFUND button. |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| reply to FactChecker
said by FactChecker :
The fact that the poor are obese doesn't actually support your case at all ... Hello?
If you are obese, then there is a 99.999999999999999% chance you are not starving.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. |
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rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
| reply to FactChecker
said by FactChecker :said by pnh102 :Please. The USA is the only country where people of lesser means are more likely to have obesity-related health problems than to die of starvation. Ignorance of the reasons why that is the case is clear on your part... Before you use that as a reason as to why the poor in America are so good off, perhaps you should understand why that is a case. The fact that the poor are obese doesn't actually support your case at all and you would know that if you had a clue why it is that way instead of just blithely using an argument posed by talk show radio blow hards who don't have a clue. This is way off topic but we're so far from talking about corporate welfare (which is what I was talking about), what the hell....
I'm not a doctor so will someone who is please chime in? Can a person who is obese, provided their intestinal tract is normal, starve to death? Granted, if they go without food they may have a lot of problems from chemical imbalances since burning fat isn't very healthy but can we call this starving?
Lack of jobs or lack of government programs is not why there are a lot of homeless. Through no fault of their own I believe they create their own situation because of mental issues. Their mental state keeps them just unstable enough to fall through the cracks. Some of these issues might be fixable with various mental health medication. Other issues, whether due to life-long developmental challenges or self-inflicted drug addiction damage, cannot and will never be solved. The best we can do is institutionalize them. |
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bored_in_nh
join:2003-01-04
Stamping Ground, KY
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to pnh102
Years ago, we were that poor. My wife and I worked shoveling out horse stalls. With no advanced education, our employment opportunities were limited. We had 2 small children, which we had to pay daycare for. I remember lots of meals of powdered eggs, gov't cheese, rice, things like that. We never had enough money to buy lunch, and often we'd feed the kids and go to bed hungry ourselves.
The poor exist in this country. You may not want to admit it, but they do. I saw on the news today a report of a couple and their grandmother starving twin boys. Accompanying that piece was a report of hunger in the U.S. This was on Fox News. They said that 16% of American children don't get enough to eat. You say "If there are so many, surely we'd be hearing about it." Well today, anyone watching Fox News heard about it.
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In 2000, CEO pay was statistically 300:1 to minimum wage. In 2005, it's 431:1. If minimum wage matched growth rate with CEO pay from 1990 to 2005, it would now be $19.00/hr.
Is Ann Coulter a transexual? What's with that adams apple? |
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gaforces
United We Stand, Divided We Fall
join:2002-04-07
Santa Cruz, CA
4 edits | reply to pnh102
Other companys that could afford to invest arent, because they have no competition/reason to. For around 8 years we've had DSL here, I figure that is enough profit made by SBC/ATT to have upgraded our area 2x+ over.
I'll praise Verizon when they offer FIOS in my area, oh but they cant, this is SBC/ATT territory.
They are definitly smarter than SBC/ATT by investing into thier network to compete better with cable, small isp, and cell providers. Even at 20/20 it still would put us behind the world standings.
Its risky not to invest in infrastructure, even if they can only make more profit (Urban), and less profit (rural areas) they should still have to serve areas in thier "territory" or give up the urban areas near where they wont deploy.
If you want your cake, you must eat more vegetables and meat like substance. UK translation, How can ye have any pudding if ye dont eat yer meat?
Having 1 company that is better than the rest of our lousy 15th place standing is better than nothing, so "atta boy" Verizon.
I can almost hear ye now.
--
‘Do ye, quieting in your bosoms your strong hearts,
Who of many good things have had your fill even to surfeit,
With what is moderate nourish your mighty desire; for neither will
We yield, nor shall you have all else as you wish.’
Solon |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
 ·DSL EXTREME
| reply to Ahrenl
Somewhat true...
Rich do more spending, in general (yeah they buy a lot of stuff), however, much of it is purchased through corporate resources, or as a method of tax reduction where possible (i.e. tax advisor/CPA will help to funnel cash into a purchase into a tax deductable item).
The poor can't afford anything (which is why corporations are ALWAYS giving items to the poor - gotta get them into the 'system' of spending to make money, credit/debt, etc. ). Gov't healthcare, bicycling, walking, rabbit ears, shelters, soup kitchens do not generate money.
Middle class is already there.. spending on daycare, clothes, sports, vehicles, insurance, TV, cable, phone, blah blah blah..
Middle class is '2 paychecks from bankruptcy'. In So-Cal, there were ~70k homes that were lost to the banks as many purchased homes they couldn't afford.
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Canada = Hollywood North |
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FAQFixer
Premium
join:2004-06-28
Powder Springs, GA | reply to bored_in_nh
Why did you have kids if you were knowningly not able to responsibly care for them? Please don't tell me that was Verizon's fault...or anyone other than yours. |
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thevorpal
join:2007-11-16
Alexandria, VA
| reply to pnh102
Are you familiar with what these people have to eat? Subsidized food from the government is often all they have. Our government takes care of them, and that is the only reason they aren't starving to death.
You can quickly become obese from eating the food available to the truly destitute in America. It is well known that the food these people receive from support groups is often little more than pure carbohydrates with little to no nutritional value.
It is a sad state of affairs that they are provided plenty of 'food' but are still actually starving. |
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IT Guy
Ow, My Balls
Premium
join:2004-07-29
Las Cruces, NM
clubs:
·Comcast
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :said by FiL :its poor people getting welfare, and theres LOTS of them in the richest country in the world. "Poor" people in the USA have a much better standard of living than most people in the rest of the world. We have no truly "poor" people here... All it takes is one trip to a third world country to see true poverty. Wow! what a heartless thing to say... Come to New Mexico if you want to get a real picture of how poor people in the U.S. live. |
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marigolds
Gainfully employed, finally
Premium,MVM
join:2002-05-13
Saint Louis, MO
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :said by viperlmw :Maybe not in Mt Airy, but go to downtown DC, or Baltimore, or Philly and check out the homeless, and tell me they aren't poor. However, even those people have access to shelters, food banks, charities, and emergency rooms for healthcare. Poor people in third world countries don't get anything like that. But the initial discussion revolved around the idea of removing all welfare...
i.e. getting rid of shelters, food banks, free medical, etc.
Poor people in 3rd world countries do have far better access to subsistence living than those living in poverty in the United States. Remove those social supports, and you will see the poverty class dying off quicker than the subsistence poor in the third world.
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marigolds
Gainfully employed, finally
Premium,MVM
join:2002-05-13
Saint Louis, MO
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :said by FactChecker :
The fact that the poor are obese doesn't actually support your case at all ... Hello? If you are obese, then there is a 99.999999999999999% chance you are not starving. But there is a pretty high chance that you are malnourished, which will kill you just as readily as starvation.
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ISCABBS - the oldest and largest BBS on the Internet
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Geographic Information Science researcher |
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marigolds
Gainfully employed, finally
Premium,MVM
join:2002-05-13
Saint Louis, MO
| reply to rradina
said by rradina :I'm not a doctor so will someone who is please chime in? Can a person who is obese, provided their intestinal tract is normal, starve to death? Granted, if they go without food they may have a lot of problems from chemical imbalances since burning fat isn't very healthy but can we call this starving? They can die of malnutrition, in particular protein energy malnutrition. In one form (more likely in the U.S.) a child receives normal caloric intake but insufficient protein intake. There are also issues with deficiencies in iron, zinc, and vitamins C, D, and B vitamins (A and iodine deficiencies are not very likely in the U.S.).
The malnutrition results in immune suppression and eventually an immune deficiency syndrome that leads to chronic infections and chronic diarrhea that can kill the child.
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ISCABBS - the oldest and largest BBS on the Internet
telnet://bbs.iscabbs.com
Professional Geographer
Geographic Information Science researcher |
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rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
| But this is because they eat the wrong food over a long time period, not because they have no food. I look at this like the leading a horse to water situation. No government program is going to fix the fact that someone ends up eating food that makes them fat rather than food that keeps them alive. |
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Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
join:2004-01-06
Sweden
 ·Verizon FIOS
·Optimum Online
| reply to gaforces
said by gaforces :said by pnh102 :said by FiL :its poor people getting welfare, and theres LOTS of them in the richest country in the world. "Poor" people in the USA have a much better standard of living than most people in the rest of the world. We have no truly "poor" people here... All it takes is one trip to a third world country to see true poverty. Bullshit, tell your crock of shit to the people who are 1 paycheck away from the streets, poor is poor, dead is dead. No matter where you are. The only difference is that the "poor" people here have thousands of "rich" people for each of themselves... Therefore, it isn't as "bad" as it would be if EVERYONE was "poor."
-Tzale |
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Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
join:2004-01-06
Sweden
·Verizon FIOS
·Optimum Online
| reply to gaforces
said by gaforces :Some people are content with 15th place for world broadband deployment. Others of which I am included, see that our future depends on it, and see that a few big companys are content with the status quo where they can still keep making billions with little effort. Looking to thier shareholder profit at the detriment to the whole country, and getting away with it by bribes through a corrupt lobbying system where only the people with money have a say. All the while, other countrys who are interested in leading technology in the future, without thinking of selfish short term money grubbing, are way ahead of us in tech with the ability to jump ahead in leaps faster than we can. Leaving the US as bottom of the world barrel. WTF do you want Verizon to do????? Verizon is a public company, they ARE going to want to turn a profit at the end of the quarter... What don't you get????? Verizon is not going to wire up the hood just so they can have their lines cut or their workers shot at.... And no one will want it or be able to afford it there anyway.... Someday, YES... But for now, it is expensive and Verizon is only going to deploy to places that they are guaranteed a good return.... And I've seen VZ deploying in lower income places here in NJ, so I think that the entire conspiracy theory is complete BS... I'd say they are avoiding deploying their heavily, but it's not avoided completely!
-Tzale
--
Hello Verizon FIOS 12.03.07!
457,000,000 miles of fiber optics placed and counting!
~THANK YOU MY ANONYMOUS FRIEND~ |
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rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
| reply to bored_in_nh
But how did you get that poor? Why did you increase your burden by having children if you were that poor? Did you lose your job(s) as a result of a business closing or relocating? Where is your family? Mother? Father? Sister? Brother?
If anyone in my extended family were in need, my door would be open. Food, clothes, shelter -- anything they need for as long as they need it. I'm by no means rich but I spend (waste) a lot of "disposable" income and that could be diverted to help family in need.
The difference is I choose to help rather than have socialists take it from me because I happen to be, as they put it, a winner in life's lottery. And I'm not just talking about social welfare but corporate welfare. It's ridiculous that I pay fees on my phone service to fund wires running in Timbuktu. Funding broadband deployment in this same manner is just a different shade of gray.
If we think it's such a good policy, why don't the people in these areas pass a property tax or sales tax and give it to mega-corporation X to bring service to their area? I'll tell you why this isn't done. Lots of small piles of money disperses power. If a central government body can collect billions, they have a lot of control. With control comes power -- what every human from the bottom-feeder cops (not all but too many) who revel in beating the shit out of someone because of the power trip to high-profile politicians who treat us like they own us.
Regarding your signature, it disappoints me when people point out CEO pay without also considering professional athletes and entertainers. It's like crying about social welfare without considering corporate welfare.
I don't disagree that CEO pay is ridiculous, especially when a lot of them are paid millions to leave after they make the company worse. However, entertainers, pro athletes and just about any celebrity all have exorbitant salaries with astronomical growth well beyond that which they deserve. It's not just CEOs making a money grab. |
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factchecker
@cox.net
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :Hello? If you are obese, then there is a 99.999999999999999% chance you are not starving. You have missed the point and further illustrated a lack of knowledge on the topic of why under-priviledged people have a higher incidence of obesity.
When you have a clue about the how and why of obesity among the poor, you can talk about it. |
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factchecker
@cox.net
| reply to rradina
said by rradina :No government program is going to fix the fact that someone ends up eating food that makes them fat rather than food that keeps them alive. The problem is that they aren't choosing food the same way person with more money would. Think cheap... Think fast - need to work more.
What is cheap and fast ? Food that typically is not good for you - McDonald's, Burger King, etc. This is why poorer people are obese. |
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