Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA
| Getting it here in Albany, NY
Ugh. Looks like I'll have to opt out.
If I want DNS redirection, I'll use a plugin like FireFix ( »https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/501 ). This gives users something better than a standard 404 not found page, but without the page full of ads that RR and the other ISPs are using. |
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vasta
join:2003-04-07
Orlando, FL | i never type in URLs, i have bookmarks |
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Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA | I type in URLs many times and will sometimes mistype them. But if I type in "dslrepor" and hit Control+Enter (to add in the "http://www." and the ".com"), then I should be taken to a 404 page, not to a Time Warner ad page. |
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china crisis
join:2003-05-28
1 edit | Is DNS redirection any worse than viewing a TV commercial when watching your favorite program on TV. You don't even have to look at the crap on a redirected page. Look at your URL typo and retype it. How hard can that be. |
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Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA
| The problem is that it breaks programs that expect an HTTP 404 response when the page can't be found. With DNS redirection, suddenly all domain names are "registered and active" either by the legitimate domain name holder or by the operator of the redirection program.
A plugin like FireFix can give you the benefits of DNS redirection (sans ads) in the browser, while letting your anti-spam program get a 404 response on the domain to let you know that the e-mail you received is spam.
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-Jason Levine
Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar. Shooting For A Cause
Jason's Toolbox | PCQandA.com |
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cghh
join:2001-01-15
Milpitas, CA
1 edit | said by Jason Levine  :The problem is that it breaks programs that expect an HTTP 404 response when the page can't be found. With DNS redirection, suddenly all domain names are "registered and active" either by the legitimate domain name holder or by the operator of the redirection program. Actually, what is breaks is programs that expect the NXDOMAIN response from the DNS request. It is the NXDOMAIN response that HTTP clients like browsers map into a 404 error at the HTTP level. DNS servers don't know anything about HTTP or browsers. The evil with the DNS redirection is how it breaks non-HTTP applications that expect DNS servers to operate per Internet standards. The Internet consists of a lot more than HTTP clients(i.e., browsers). |
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Jodokast96
R.I.P Bassman442
Premium
join:2005-11-23
Erial, NJ
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| I see this mentioned every single time this subject comes up. I don't doubt it, yet no one has yet to show an actual case where it "breaks" anything. Lots of theory and speculation, but nothing actually backing it up. It's been mentioned how it could be implemented without affecting those things, yet nobody has bothered to show anything that's been affected in real life. |
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BAF
Baffles
Premium
join:2004-02-22
South Glens Falls, NY
clubs: | reply to Jason Levine
We don't appear to be getting it up here in South Glens Falls, ex-Adelphia. |
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SkellBasher
Yes Sorto, I'll take my Prozac
join:2000-10-22
North Tonawanda, NY
| reply to cghh
said by cghh : It is the NXDOMAIN response that HTTP clients like browsers map into a 404 error at the HTTP level. Sorry to break it to you, but you're 100% wrong.
404 and other HTTP error pages are returned by a web server, not generated by a browser, and certainly not dependent on an NXDOMAIN response. In fact, a browser receiving NXDOMAIN from a query would simply provide the 'page cannot be displayed' message. |
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patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY | Correct. |
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cghh
join:2001-01-15
Milpitas, CA
| reply to SkellBasher
said by SkellBasher :said by cghh : It is the NXDOMAIN response that HTTP clients like browsers map into a 404 error at the HTTP level. Sorry to break it to you, but you're 100% wrong. 404 and other HTTP error pages are returned by a web server, not generated by a browser, and certainly not dependent on an NXDOMAIN response. In fact, a browser receiving NXDOMAIN from a query would simply provide the 'page cannot be displayed' message. My oops. I was confusing "server not found", which could come from NXDOMAIN (among other reasons), and "page not found", which comes from the HTTP server. In the first case, the browser could not even connect to a server, whereas in the second, it connected, but the requested page wasn't found. But with the broken DNS being discussed in this thread, you won't get either error. |
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cghh
join:2001-01-15
Milpitas, CA
| reply to Jodokast96
said by Jodokast96 :I see this mentioned every single time this subject comes up. I don't doubt it, yet no one has yet to show an actual case where it "breaks" anything. Lots of theory and speculation, but nothing actually backing it up. It's been mentioned how it could be implemented without affecting those things, yet nobody has bothered to show anything that's been affected in real life. A big thing that gets broken is a first-line anti-spam technique, of verifying that the sender's address has a valid domain. With the broken DNS, all domains come back valid.
Another is tools that have a list of hosts at which they want to get service, but the list may contain currently not valid host names, so they want to contact only currently valid ones. All names will come back as valid, breaking search algorithm in the tool. For example, a tool used in a company may want to contact a corporate server via an internal name when on the company intranet, but use a public name when used outside. It is depending on the fact that the public DNS server won't know about the internal name.
And suppose you want to use your own browser URL mis-spelling utility, not your ISP's? Your browser will never know to activate your chosen tool. |
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Jodokast96
R.I.P Bassman442
Premium
join:2005-11-23
Erial, NJ
·Verizon Online DSL
| I understand that (somewhat anyway, lol). But do you have real world examples of it actually not working? Not examples of when it shouldn't[i/], but when it actually [i]doesn't due to the redirects? Nobody has ever shown that here as far as I can tell. But to be fair, that's the question that keeps coming up, and I have yet to see any ISP respond to it either. I take no sides on this issue, but nobody has yet to prove any points on either side. |
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