Apple Disappoints with MacBook Air > Growing Pains

reply to dadkins

Re: Growing Pains

*I* am not reporting them! I am reading about them - just like everyone else here!

Apple is trying to copy wafer laptops where others have been doing it for years - literally!
This thing will sell, no doubt!
Stevie boy can sell sewage to the fans.

I'm no fan of Toshiba, but the R500 will wax the MBA! LOL!
2.4 lbs with a HDD and a DVD drive!

Naw, this MBA thing is a conversation peice, nothing more.
With these pointed out issues, well... yeah.

Vista? ROFL! Fuck Vista!
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera

Mac users aren't drones. The failure of Apple TV is proof enough of that.

And absolutely, Apple is entering a highly competitive and long existing market segment, sub-notebooks. But given they went to Intel for a resigned Core2Duo they're resetting the performance benchmark of sub-notebooks.

The R500 you mention would have its ass HANDED to it by the significantly faster Core 2 Duo processors in the MacBook Airs. The R500's 1.2GHz Core2Duo isn't going to hang even close to the 1.6 or 1.8GHz 800MHz FSB Core 2 Duo in the Air. Then there is the R500's smaller screen, smaller keyboard, weaker graphics and other issues. Same with the Sony TZ150, a great notebook, but at this point soundly beaten by the Air in terms of virtually every performance category.

There is nothing revolutionary about a sub-notebook, but Apple's first try is damn good. Their product is not only the world's thinest but has the largest screen, full size keyboard, best graphics and fastest processor in the entire class (for the moment anyway).

The R500 may sell better, but it's certainly not the better performer, not by a long-shot.

I'll take an OQO model02 over either of those

reply to Dogfather
*cough* DVD drive *cough*
An optical drive in general.
Install... what? Sure! No problem!

MBA? Uhm, wait! I have to get the external and pplu it in(more weight, more bulk, less convienient).

Processor, I'll give you that!
Weight, MBA loses!
Ethernet, Sorry!
3 USB ports, ouch!

Form is useless without function.
MBA is a sexy machine!
Too bad it needs extras just to work like a - computer.
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera

reply to dadkins
Fair enough. I would argue that statements like "Stevie boy can sell sewage to the fans" are inflammatory and do nothing to add to the conversation, but that would get me nowhere. I still don't understand why you can't acknowledge that this laptop is *exactly* what some people have been waiting for. And I'll never understand why you're basing a large portion of your complaints against this laptop on hypothetical problems that, at this point, are pure speculation.

Clearly heat is a major concern in *any* laptop, but I don't understand why you think this laptop is guaranteed to have issues in that area. The entire back hinge is a vent, and there is a CPU fan that exhausts air through that vent. Add to that the fact that the aluminum casing won't seal in heat like a plastic laptop, and I really don't see why you expect heat to be such a problem here.

Personally, I don't use a laptop as my main machine; I have a desktop computer. *If* I did have a laptop, hell yes I'd seriously consider the MacBook Air. Why? Because I don't need an optical drive or fully-accessible USB port for a laptop. I don't need extra garbage like an optical drive weighing me down. That's all for my home machine. My laptop will be used to connect wirelessly to available networks. If I *must* have a mouse (which I don't), I'll use Bluetooth. I don't use CDs or DVDs unless I'm installing the OS, which can be done wirelessly with the MacBook Air. So, for me, this is a perfect mobile machine. What you call a shortcoming, I call an advantage *for my uses.* I don't have any devices I would ever want to plug in while on the go with this particular laptop.

We'll have to agree to disagree, I suppose! I don't enjoy discussions that devolve to inflammatory comments and sweeping stereotypes.
--
A man without religion is like a fish without a bicycle.

reply to dadkins
Remember the segment. Road-warriors, at least me and everyone like me that I know don't need DVD drives out in the field. We load our Powerpoint and Keynote presentations, software is already installed, etc...we don't need internal optical drives in these super sub-notebook machines. And for anything else I have 8GB USB keys that would fit the MBA just fine.

Thinness, MBA wins by a mile, the thickest part of the MBA is thinner that the thinnest part of the R500
Screen size MBA wins
Keyboard size MBA wins
Processor performance MBA wins by a mile
Video performance MBA wins
Illuminated keyboard, MBA wins
Ambient light sensors, MBA wins
LED Backlight, MBA wins
Standard memory MBA wins by a mile
Multi-touch trackpad MBA wins
Web cam MBA wins
Price MBA wins by a mile

MBA loses
No wired ethernet
No swappable battery
Only 1 USB obstructed USB port
Weight, SLIGHTLY heavier because of it's FULL SIZE components in the world's thinnest notebook.

Optical drive in a sub-notebook? For what? You don't need it, MBA can take over other optical drives in other computers wirelessly and with sub-notebooks, you'll already have a "main" machine.

Wired ethernet? Why bother when you have 802.11n, but if you want it, you use USB ethernet for $30.

3 USB ports, again, why all the external prefrials when you're trying to be as portable as possible but if you need that, you can get a dirt cheap hub and use it only when you need it.

What you're complaining about doesn't make much sense. If you want USB ports for all this extra junk, why bother buying a sub-notebook. If you want wired ethernet, why do you need the extreme portability offered by this class of computer. The things you're complaining about are for desktop replacement notebooks, not sub-notebooks.

Seems the things that you're complaining about are the LEAST important factors (aside from weight) in the class. In this class, battery life, physical dimensions, usability (in terms of screen, keyboard and performance) are king.

But it's what I said, if you need DVD in the field, don't buy the MBA. If you hate Apple, don't buy the Air. Have something against owning the world's thinnest, and fastest sub-notebook, don't buy the Air.

reply to gattaca
I am repeating what was posted above, nothing more.
Many machines are magnesium... and?

NOWHERE did I say guarantee, so please quit trying to make false claims against me, thanks!

Wait my friend. When/if you ever do get a laptop, and you decide that it might be semi-advantageous to have a way of installing software and there is no optical drive - go get the USB drive.

*I* do use laptops - that's all I have.
I was looking at a sub-notebook, but not a wafer.
It does have a smaller form factor.
It does have a DVD drive.
It does have *ACCESSIBLE* USB port*s*.

Most people will, at some point, want or need things that this MBA does not have.
MBA is for what? Portability? Light? Thin?
Ok, now go to use the poor thing.
All that processor for - what?
How do you plan on getting video or data into it?

This thing is pretty. That's it!
This thing is a sexy notebook! Agreed!
This thing is borked from the factory if you cannot use the ports that are provided!

*ALL* thin and light notebooks are susceptible to heat - ALL OF THEM!
It is a result if being so thin, there is no room for airflow - simple physics.
Run something taxing - heat and battery depletion.
What do you think the processor, in ALL thin and light laptops, will do if it gets too hot? Clock down - bye bye performance!
Apple is not exempt from this!

It has been pointed out to you all. If you refuse to see common sense as it shows itself to you, and disregard people pointing it out to you... have at it friend!
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera

And most people actually want performance from a sub-notebook and so far no competitors have stepped up. All other sub-notebooks are slow to the point they're unusable by "most" people.

It's a good thing no one puts a gun to anyone's head forcing them to buy stuff they don't want.

reply to dadkins
As a previous owner of a MacBook Pro with an Intel Core 2 Duo processor, I can inform you that even under full load, the processor did NOT scale back its clock speed. So in that case, you are wrong.

How do I plan on getting video or data onto it?
The magic of a 100 Mbps wireless network. What else? I rarely transfer *anything* to a computer using the optical drive. It's too slow and inconvenient.

Again, statements like "This thing is pretty. That's it!" show your inability to recognize that this product is not for YOU. And again, I'll state that when I did have a MacBook Pro, I *didn't* use the optical drive or USB ports hardly ever. That was for my desktop. Multimedia was transfered over my network.

I'm not talking about *most people.* I never said the MBA would suit *most people.* But why should I, a desktop owner in want of a thin-and-light laptop, be forced to settle on an "ultra"-portable that tries to be all things to all people. Some people don't want a laptop with all that extra garbage, and this is for them. Why is that hard to understand.

QUESTION:
Tell me why someone who already has a desktop and needs an incredibly portable machine shouldn't buy the MacBook Air. Keep in mind they already have a desktop, prefer 802.11 to wired ethernet, and have no use for an optical drive. And also keep in mind that your assumption that the processor will throttle-back is an *assumption.* (It has to be, because my MBP never throttled back even after hours of having both cores at 100%)
--
A man without religion is like a fish without a bicycle.

What's my point? You stated that your "MBP never throttled back". Since variable CPU clock rate is an integral part of any intelligent battery management system, and since the MacBook Air is intended primarily to be used on the go, untethered from AC power, and definitely not as a desktop replacement, your comment is irrelevant. The only way your MBP never throttled back is if it were always on AC power.

If it does not "throttle back" the battery life will be horrid and it will fail miserably as "an incredibly portable machine", if only for the fact that you can't swap a discharged battery out for a charged one.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange.

reply to Dogfather
I use my subnotebook as my main and only machine.
Business people need an optical drive.
Gamers need an optical drive.
Other need an optical drive to watch movies.

Who does not need an optical drive?
--
»www.ryanoneill.us

reply to dadkins
let me see,

Toshiba r500.. plastic piece of junk screen that bends even when closed. heavier, no backlit keyboard, using the card slot blocks the cd drive, only a 1.2 mhz processor, scores a whopping 858 pcmark score (lol), including a hd brings price to over $2000.00 (can cost upto 3000.00), many complaints on screen brightness, viewing angle, gradient...etc. , many complaints about wifi cutting in and out.. and last but not least.... it comes with vista.

reply to r81984
me

reply to attengineer
Are you sure your nick isn't appleengineer?

What a load of crap. You folks really need to wake up.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange.

reply to r81984
And who says you can't use an optical drive with the MacBook Air?

If you want to watch movies, buy a MacBook or other competitor or for the MBA you can rent from iTunes.

Business people aren't buying the MBA for gaming and no they don't need optical drives. Their software is already installed and they have USB keys if they need removable storage. And if you MUST have an optical drive you can use the bus powered one available from Apple for under $100.

reply to Dogfather
I agree with nearly everything you said, particularly about ethernet (I'm considering moving my desktops to 802.11n to reduce wire clutter!) and USB (you should NEVER use USB in a laptop for anything other than connectivity at the very most).

I do, however, disagree about weight. I'm not very strong and with a small laptop, I'd like to be able to hold it with 1 hand. Maybe that's just me, though.
--
Faerie Blessings,
Stephanie - www.GlitterFaerie.com