PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
 ·CableOne
| Custom LED taillights
The taillight housing | 
Where I will cut the hole for the LED lamp | 
Backside of housing | 
Backside of housing | 
Hole in body where taillight housing goes | 
LED lamp I plan to use |
So, what I want to do is take my existing tails and cut elliptical holes in the back to mount LED taillamps that you can buy at any auto parts store. Why? I like my vehicle upgrades to be original, and I like them to look stock, and mostly, I am very picky. I have found dozens of different aftermarket tails for my Explorer, only a few did I like, and none did I like enough to shell out a Benjamin or two for.
Using the stock tails, you'd never know I stuffed them with big bright LEDs until I hit the brakes. Also, the only thing I'll have to buy are the lamps themselves, $10/ea at the most, so it keeps the wife happy.
To get technical, it does appear that there is plenty of clearance between the housing and the body of the rig. The biggest issue will be cutting the whole on such an uneven surface. I figure since it's on the back and you won't be able to see any mishaps once it's installed, I could use the foam door tape stuff you use to seal doors on houses and duct tape to overcome any sealing issues between the lamp and the housing (I know, my redneck is showing).
My biggest question is, what do I cut it with? I'm handy with a razor knife, but that's some thick plastic for a razor. Dremel maybe? I don't want to have to buy one (although I would love to own one). Could I possibly buy a Dremel bit designed for this application, and just stick it on my 18v cordless drill on high speed?
What do y'all think?
--
There comes a point in your life when you get tired of fixing everything and wiping everyone's ass. But it’s not giving up. It’s realizing that you don’t need certain people and the bullshit and drama they bring to your life. |
|
xj31
join:2005-09-25
Lake Villa, IL
| A dremel would probably be fine but using a drill might take a while.The real reason I replied is that if you use the leds,it might have an adverse affect on your turn signals.Assuming your car uses a typical flasher for the turn signals,(and this is coming from a jeep mechanic,so I really know nothing about your car),it needs the load from the bulbs for the proper current to flash at the right speed.So it might flash really fast or not at all. |
|
Sly
Premium
join:2004-02-20
Johnson City, TN
clubs: | That's simple to fix with an electronic flasher. They flash constantly regardless of load. |
|
sdgthy
@optonline.net
| reply to PolarBear
My experiments with LEDs have found them to be sadly lacking as replacements for an incandescent lamp. So before potentially trashing your taillights, you may want to experiment on a spare pair.
A Dremel would work great, just have to have a steady hand. I'd use a cut-off disk at a low dremel speed to avoid excessive melting of the plastic. But a low dremel speed is still much more than the speed of a drill. |
|
PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
·CableOne
| The type of LEDs I am referring to are the sealed ones you find on the rear of semi trucks. They are much brighter than their incandescent and halogen counterparts (just drive down the highway and find a semi with LED tails - they are much brighter than non-LEDs).
The entire reason I want to do this is because I have experimented with LED 1157s and 3157s before, and as you say, I have found them to be very dim. |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
| reply to PolarBear
With a Red Lenses you need bright White LEDs as those in that Orange Lense/Light Assembly are not going to be bright enough to see properly after passing two colored lenses.
Also, how are you going to handle the Running Light/Brake light Brightness difference that a dual element Brake Light provides by design?
This is what I suggest.
»superbrightleds.com/1157.htm
quote:
All of our LED bulbs feature
* Drop in Replacement * Low Heat Generation
* Low Power (wattage) draw * High Intensity (for LEDs)
* Built-in current limiting * Instant ON/OFF
resistors
* Shock & Vibration Resistant * Monochromatic (pure) Color
* Long Life (10,000+ hours)
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
THUD300
Part Of A Complete Breakfast
Premium
join:2002-06-07
Decatur, IL
1 edit | reply to PolarBear
Best tool I've found for accurately cutting plastic is a high speed air-powered recipro-saw. You could try some kind of a jab saw by hand.
This page on Doc's link is full of caveats on the use of LED's in automotive applications...it's worth a read.
»superbrightleds.com/carbulb-notes.htm
I have noticed that in those cars that do use factory LED taillights, such as Cadillac, the rear lenses are *full* of LED's, only a small portion are lit for taillamps, then all the rest are lit for brake/turn lamps.
--
Your actual mileage may vary. Operators are standing by. |
|
PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
·CableOne
| reply to Doctor Olds
Apparently nobody here understands what I am talking about. Have you EVER driven down the highway and seen the back of a semi trailer? See the big bright taillights on it? They are brake AND taillights (two levels of brightness). That is what I am planning on using.
Not only will they work for brake AND tail purposes (they have TWO levels of brightness), but if you've ever seen a semi with a combination of LEDs and incandescent tails, you know that the LEDs are MUCH brighter. |
|
PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
·CableOne
| reply to THUD300
said by THUD300  :I have noticed that in those cars that do use factory LED taillights, such as Cadillac, the rear lenses are *full* of LED's, only a small portion are lit for taillamps, then all the rest are lit for brake/turn lamps. That's why I want to use the semi truck tails; the 1157/3157 replacement lamps simply don't have enough LEDs and aren't bright enough. |
|
Sly
Premium
join:2004-02-20
Johnson City, TN
clubs:
 ·Packet8
·Callcentric
·Comcast Formerly ..
| reply to PolarBear
said by PolarBear :Not only will they work for brake AND tail purposes (they have TWO levels of brightness), but if you've ever seen a semi with a combination of LEDs and incandescent tails, you know that the LEDs are MUCH brighter. Only because they mount about 30 of them in an array (which, I know, you are wanting to do). Individually, they are much dimmer than incandescent lights. |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
| reply to PolarBear
said by PolarBear :Apparently nobody here understands what I am talking about. Have you EVER driven down the highway and seen the back of a semi trailer? See the big bright taillights on it? They are brake AND taillights (two levels of brightness). That is what I am planning on using. I fully understand what you are wanting to do and then some. Plus you posted an image of a single brightness side marker light with a orange lenses. Don't underestimate other's knowledge on Automotive. Some of us in this Forum have 30 - 40 years of professional experience and training from the factories/manufacturers.
I will lay odds the customization you have planed based on the images you have provided will be way too dark and you will end up with tickets from the Highway Patrol or local LEO for unsafe, too dark Running and Brake lights.
I suggest you let the manufacturer worry about DOT approval and Safety certifications as it will cost you a whole lot more if you get rear ended because of those homemade lights using side marker LEDs being hard to see. You likely would get sued to bankruptcy and never get automotive insurance again.
I recommend looking at getting Hella LED Tail Lights.
To be even close to what you would need to install on a homemade setup, you would need a minimum of two of these in each taillight lenses or it will not be bright enough for safety. At $21.49 each, that would be $86.00 and then some to modify the rear lenses properly.
LED 6" Oval Red w/Clear Lens Trailer Tail Light
»shop.easternmarine.com/index.cfm···ryID=282
quote:
OPTRONICS STL-82RCB RED DIODE w/Clear Lens Sealed, Recessed Grommet Mount Stop / Turn / Tail Light. Commonly used on Commercial Vehicles, Heavy Duty Trucks & Cargo Trailers.
Regards,
Doctor Olds
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
·CableOne
| I greatly appreciate your concern for safety and legality; if I feel that they aren't bright enough, I will scrap them and buy a replacement pair. The reason I don't use replacement LED 3157s is because I feel they are too dim.
The image of the LED I posted was simply an example to give an idea (it was the closest image I could find), what I plan on using is the one YOU posted. However, I did NOT realize they would be so expensive (AHHH!).
I would LOVE the LED tails you posted on that F-150, however, I have yet to find similar ones for an 02-05 Explorer. If you know where some are, please let me know!
--
There comes a point in your life when you get tired of fixing everything and wiping everyone's ass. But it’s not giving up. It’s realizing that you don’t need certain people and the bullshit and drama they bring to your life. |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
1 edit | Best I can do is give you who to contact and request more info.
quote:
Consumer Contact:
Hella, Inc. USA
201 Kelly Drive
Peachtree City, GA 30269 USA
E-Mail: hella.faq@hinc.hella.com
Toll free #:1-877-224-3552
Main phone #: 770-631-7500
Fax #: 770-631-7575
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
tcope
Premium
join:2003-05-07
Sandy, UT
·Comcast
2 edits | reply to Doctor Olds
said by Doctor Olds :
I suggest you let the manufacturer worry about DOT approval and Safety certifications as it will cost you a whole lot more if you get rear ended because of those homemade lights using side marker LEDs being hard to see. You likely would get sued to bankruptcy and never get automotive insurance again. While handling claims in Florida I had the occasion to look into the laws on this. At least in Florida the law is that tail lights have to be visible from 1000 feet away. A candle could be seen from that far away so almost any light would do in that situation. I'm betting most state laws are similar. I'm not saying I agree with the law, just stating what it is. |
|
sdgthy
@optonline.net
| reply to PolarBear
said by PolarBear :Apparently nobody here understands what I am talking about. Have you EVER driven down the highway and seen the back of a semi trailer? See the big bright taillights on it? They are brake AND taillights (two levels of brightness). That is what I am planning on using. I understand exactly what you are talking about and have tried it. I think you may not understand that the housing assembly has a rear reflector and a lens surface is not smooth, it has a series of prisms designed to work with the reflector to direct the light from a point source incandescent lamp. The results of putting an LED array in there will be unpredictable at best.
I not saying don't try it, just be prepared to be disappointed with the results. The taillights of many trucks have been more standardized for many years, so LED replacements for those where relatively easy to make. |
|
onehuman
Wish You Were Here.
Premium
join:2001-12-13
Muggle
·Comcast
| reply to PolarBear
I have the replacement LED's from »autolumination.com/1156_1157.htm that utilize the high-power LED bulbs (up at the top of the page). They are VERY bright and evenly-lit inside the tail housing of my '02 Altima, with a clear difference during braking. I also put them in my rear turns. A little expensive, but you will never need to replace them.
--
Respect each other, everyone makes choices. |
|
onehuman
Wish You Were Here.
Premium
join:2001-12-13
Muggle
·Comcast
| reply to PolarBear
Here is the link for the Hella LED tails, btw: »www.tirerack.com/accessories/hel···aillight
--
Respect each other, everyone makes choices. |
|
Splitpair
Premium
join:2000-07-29
Cow Towne | reply to PolarBear
This might help.
»www.mpja.com/prodinfo.asp?number=11017+OP
Wayne |
|
Splitpair
Premium
join:2000-07-29
Cow Towne
 ·T-Mobile US
| reply to PolarBear
BTW I sent you the link for the LED’s as I seriously believe you will not be able to adapt a pre assembled LED array into an incandescent tail lamp housing. Many have tried with aftermarket LED arrays in various configurations but the problem of the rather narrow window of illumination out of most common LED’s remains to be a roadblock to the simple one to one swap out.
The second lesser problem is the color of the LED itself as the tail light lens unless it is clear will only pass a certain wavelength remember it’s a filter fed by a bulb rich in low end “red” power and it only passes the color it is designed for and it may not pass very much illumination of an LED that is outside of it’s pass-band.
The other problem you will run into if you push forward with the idea of adapting a pre assembled LED array into the rear of the assembly of the tail light lens itself.
Look closely at the lens and you will see many smaller lenses molded into the lens these are designed to take a rather non-coherent source and assemble it into a directed source of illumination. Now cut a hole in the back of the housing insert a pre made LED assembly and light it up. What happens from the outside is one sees what looks like a small rectangular light but no where near what the incandescent bulb produces.
Why?
The LED’s produce a very narrow angle of illumination unlike an old fashioned bulb that produces an almost 360 degree angle. If each and every LED is not properly aimed through the tail light lens as in factory designed lens performance of the LED regardless of power is greatly reduced.
Can it be done? The answer to that is yes but not the way you’re going.
First if you are going to modify a lens buy an aftermarket on e-bay to play with that cut it open and consider where you can place LED’ to make it work.
Good luck
Wayne
--
Yeah, there's a storm on the loose, sirens in my head
Wrapped up in silence, all circuits are dead
Cannot decode - my whole life spins into a frenzy
|
|
onehuman
Wish You Were Here.
Premium
join:2001-12-13
Muggle
·Comcast
| With all due respect, you're wrong. It's not just a small rectangle of light, the bulbs I linked to fire off anywhere from 0.5-3 watts of light in all directions. My taillights are fully illuminated, brighter and more clearly than before, in fact, and light approximately 0.25 seconds faster than incandescent bulbs (subjectively observed after inserting the LED in one side only and pressing the brake). This improves safety, as it gives whoever's behind me that much more time to brake when I am braking.
While I appreciate that you have some expertise in LED lighting, next time I would suggest that you talk to someone who actually has these preconfigured bulbs before making a generalized statement that they don't work. Visit the link in my previous post and you will see the bulbs to which I refer.
--
Respect each other, everyone makes choices. |
|
