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 GuspazGuspazPremium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:16 | reply to wifi4milez
Re: There is more to it... As has been said earlier, there is one way to do it without ISP support; create two PPP tunnels to a remote box (operated by sharedband), and use mlppp. The downside is that you're adding extra latency to your connection, since your internet connection now effectively terminates at sharedband's box. Your public-facing IP would also now be a sharedband IP.
But as has been said, anybody can set this up themselves if they have a VPS/colo/dedi server somewhere. | |
 wifi4milezBig Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY | said by Guspaz:As has been said earlier, there is one way to do it without ISP support; create two PPP tunnels to a remote box (operated by sharedband), and use mlppp. The downside is that you're adding extra latency to your connection, since your internet connection now effectively terminates at sharedband's box. Your public-facing IP would also now be a sharedband IP. Ok, however that assumes Shareband has enough bandwidth available at their side since they in essence become the ISP. This is fine if you are a single user creating a virtual tunnel to your own private colo fed off a DS3, however how will Shareband handle this on a larger scale? Do they play on purchasing a few Gigs of IP (at least) just to support this application? Lets assume for a minute that only 1000 customers "bond" two 1.5Mbps DSL lines through Sharebands servers/equipment/whatever, that comes out to a total of 3000Mbps or 3Gbps of bandwidth that Shareband needs to provide. The lowest wholesale cost of a Gig of bandwidth is $10k, with most carriers paying between $15k and $20k per gig. Assuming Shareband gets the IP access for $10k per gig, then they are paying $10 per customer to provide this service. The question is, how much will they charge for this service to make a profit? $20? $30? How much are people willing to pay for this? After you factor in equipment, staff, advertising, and many other expenses I would bet that they need to charge at least $50 to $100 per customer in order to even break even. I simply question the business model here......
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GuspazGuspazPremium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:16
2 edits | It shouldn't be a problem. Any ISP that is a wholesaler of Bell Canada's DSL services (TekSavvy included) has about $9 to play with as far as bandwidth, equipment, staff, etc.
Bell charges $20.50 for the line, and $1300 for the GigE to connect the DSL clients to the ISP's network (this is not transit, just a connection to Bell's ATM network, IIRC). That leaves about $9 per customer to pay for everything else when you consider that TekSavvy charges $29.95 for their normal 5/800 service.
In that $9, TekSavvy is able to provide 200GB/mth of bandwidth (5mbit DSL), and cover all other expenses, and still turn a profit. I don't see why a company like Sharebond can't make a profit on $10 or $20 per customer, as their actual bandwidth costs would be lower due to average usage. TekSavvy has proven that you can act as an ISP on those kinds of margins, turn a profit, and still manage to become the highest rated DSL ISP in North America (by DSLR's rating) :P | |
wifi4milezBig Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY | said by Guspaz:It shouldn't be a problem. Any ISP that is a wholesaler of Bell Canada's DSL services (TekSavvy included) has about $9 to play with as far as bandwidth, equipment, staff, etc. Bell charges $20.50 for the line, and $1300 for the GigE to connect the DSL clients to the ISP's network (this is not transit, just a connection to Bell's ATM network, IIRC). That leaves about $9 per customer to pay for everything else when you consider that TekSavvy charges $29.95 for their normal 5/800 service. In that $9, TekSavvy is able to provide 200GB/mth of bandwidth (5mbit DSL), and cover all other expenses, and still turn a profit. I don't see why a company like Sharebond can't make a profit on $10 or $20 per customer, as their actual bandwidth costs would be lower due to average usage. TekSavvy has proven that you can act as an ISP on those kinds of margins, turn a profit, and still manage to become the highest rated DSL ISP in North America (by DSLR's rating) :P Well you are comparing two different things. Assuming I understand this correctly, Shareband isnt leasing any LEC facilities or using any LEC infrastructure. They arent an ISP, but are an ancillary service you purchase in addition to paying your ISP. Given that Shareband operates at the end of a virtual tunnel, they in turn need to purchase wholesale IP access (not a connection to the LEC as TekSavvy does) in order to combine your pipes and provide and IP address to the end user. IP access, as I mentioned before, is far more expensive than a metro loop and can run up to $20k per gig. My question is how their pricing (which we dont yet know) and business model will keep them afloat!
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GuspazGuspazPremium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:16 | That's the thing though, Bell wholesalers are responsible for maintaining their own connection. The $20.50 connection fee and $1300 GigE to Bell only gets the user's packets to the ISP (TekSavvy)'s network. From there, the ISP is responsible for getting the packets out to the internet at large.
They currently have six GigE lines to various providers (Cogent, Teleglobe, Internap, Peer1, etc) for that purpose.
My point was that if you eliminate the two Bell-related charges, and possibly some of the equipment costs required to connect to Bell, you're left with TekSavvy's $9 per month or so. Inside of that, they're able to cover all expenses and provide 200GB of actual IP transit. For $19 ($39.95 to customer, $19 is roughly left over after Bell takes their cut), they're able to provide unlimited services, targeted at users who use over 300GB per month (300-500 is probably typical).
If TekSavvy can make a profit, I fail to see why Shareband, with very similar costs once Bell is removed from the equation, couldn't do the same thing. | |
wifi4milezBig Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY | said by Guspaz:That's the thing though, Bell wholesalers are responsible for maintaining their own connection. The $20.50 connection fee and $1300 GigE to Bell only gets the user's packets to the ISP (TekSavvy)'s network. From there, the ISP is responsible for getting the packets out to the internet at large. They currently have six GigE lines to various providers (Cogent, Teleglobe, Internap, Peer1, etc) for that purpose. My point was that if you eliminate the two Bell-related charges, and possibly some of the equipment costs required to connect to Bell, you're left with TekSavvy's $9 per month or so. Inside of that, they're able to cover all expenses and provide 200GB of actual IP transit. For $19 ($39.95 to customer, $19 is roughly left over after Bell takes their cut), they're able to provide unlimited services, targeted at users who use over 300GB per month (300-500 is probably typical). If TekSavvy can make a profit, I fail to see why Shareband, with very similar costs once Bell is removed from the equation, couldn't do the same thing. Well, it remains to be seen. Lets see how this develops.
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