Re: Where are the... in http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r19995936 en Fri, 04 Dec 2009 02:51:07 EDT Fri, 04 Dec 2009 02:51:07 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20000600 openbox9 : I'm not missing any point. You're missing mine. You would need to download a significant number of Apple's HD videos and mp4 files to come close to receiving a warning from more ISPs. Considering those items cost $5 and $1 a piece, unless you have money to waste, I doubt you'll have to worry about that potential problem. The same thing goes for uploading pics for grandma. You're stretching to think that you'll be labelled an abuser for uploading personal pics and vids to your website.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20000600 Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:08:41 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20000529 openbox9 : Why is this so difficult to understand? If I use my connection to download 20 iTunes songs, 20 Amazon MP3s, 4 Netflix movies, and upload 5 new videos and 50 new pics of my 1-year old to my website per month, in addition to normal e-mail checking and web surfing, I'd much rather use a 50/5 connection than a 10/1 connection assuming the same cost to me). I won't have any problems with caps and I'll complete my action quicker. I go back to my earlier comment that if you aren't abusing your connection 24/7, more throughput is good and your ISP shouldn't give you a problem.

And of course a simple 1.5 Mbps connection is a good broadband throughput for a vast majority of users. Now if the rest of the "I need fiber and a Gbps connection jacked directly into my head" accepted that, life would be pretty boring around the discussion threads on this site.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20000529 Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:58:40 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20000475 openbox9 : See my other post about not drinking kool-aid, despising American Idol, and being a Mac fan. Try thinking outside of your little box.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20000475 Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:48:13 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20000101 Thaler :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

My point is that more throughput is useful regardless of caps and other restrictions.
How so? Caps still remain the same. The faster your connection, the more downloads you can whizz through and reach caps quicker.

If anything, a simple 1.5 M connection is probably a good broadband speed to operate on, lest you accidentally bump into Comcast's invisi-caps.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20000101 Fri, 15 Feb 2008 09:39:20 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19999885 fuziwuzi :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

You posted previously that a 1.5 Mbps is more than capable of downloading music, videos, patches, etc. You're playing both sides of the discussion. My point is that more throughput is useful regardless of caps and other restrictions. Normal users don't download/upload 24/7 and therefore more likely won't be affected, i.e. downloading legal music, video, software patches, Linux distros, etc.
Comcast thanks you for drinking their kool-aid.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19999885 Fri, 15 Feb 2008 08:51:03 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19999878 fuziwuzi :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

How about quickly handling Microsoft's patch Tuesday? How about purchasing all of those mp3/mp4 files from Amazon or iTunes? How about Apple's new HD aTV rental mechanism? How about downloading all of those hi-rez pictures and video clips from your grandchildrens' website? Anyway, you get my point.
You miss the point. Download too much of Apple's HD content and you get hit with the "abuse" label and your account is terminated. Download too many mp3/mp4 files from Amazon or iTunes, you get terminated. And how do you UPLOAD those hi-rez pictures and video clips for grandma to download if your account gets terminated because you are labeled an abuser for using it to upload those pictures and video clips?

If Comcast can't deliver what they sell, then they shouldn't sell it. Don't sell a 50Mbps pipe that can only handle that speed for a brief millisecond before you throttle it down to dialup speed.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19999878 Fri, 15 Feb 2008 08:49:25 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19999639 openbox9 : You posted previously that a 1.5 Mbps is more than capable of downloading music, videos, patches, etc. You're playing both sides of the discussion. My point is that more throughput is useful regardless of caps and other restrictions. Normal users don't download/upload 24/7 and therefore more likely won't be affected, i.e. downloading legal music, video, software patches, Linux distros, etc.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19999639 Fri, 15 Feb 2008 07:18:03 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19998210 Thaler :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

Give me examples of routine, legitimate large file transfers that will be considered abusive.
Music, Video, Patches, Software, files, distros, etc.

All those uses are legitimate, and the use/files will begin to add up in terms of GB/month. That's just the thing about bandwidth caps. Any user can it hit, and they can do so downloading legally OR illegaly - it doesn't discriminate for or against file legitimacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19998210 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 21:57:16 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19997952 openbox9 :
said by Thaler See Profile :

How quick do you really need them?
Reading the posts in this forum, you'd think you need them as quick as possible. Isn't that one of the big arguments for having "fat pipes" into homes?
said by Thaler See Profile :

What, people on 1.5M connections can't use Amazon or iTunes?
Of course they can. People with 1.5 Mbps connections can do almost anything they want on the 'net. See my previous point...besides, I'm not the one begging for 50 Mbps connections that I won't use.
said by Thaler See Profile :

I'd imagine it streams well enough over slower "standard" broadband connections.
Most streams will work fine after a buffering period.
said by Thaler See Profile :

It caters more to those who're going to use the internet for lots of large file transfers - the exact same users Comcast labels as "abusive" once they hit the invisible bandwidth cap.
Give me examples of routine, legitimate large file transfers that will be considered abusive.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19997952 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 21:14:45 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19997832 openbox9 : Is it that easy for you to put words in my mouth? Where did I say that Skype, OpenOffice, or Linux were "ISP abuse"?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19997832 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 20:55:59 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996483 knightmb :
said by Karl Bode See Profile :

quote:
You only need to worry about alleged caps/restrictions if you want to abuse the system 24/7

Technically Comcast's traffic shaping throttles upstream p2p traffic for all users regardless of consumption.
Except for business customers I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I can turn lose my BT and keep a 24/7 max upload all week then one would assume either I'm the only person in my city with Comcast (unlikely) or they are only doing this to residential customers and not business customers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996483 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 17:08:36 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996406 espaeth :
said by RARPSL See Profile :

So is your DOCSIS 1.1 Download speed max being the same as DOCSIS 2.0 max since for me to get BOOST (DOCSIS 2.0) my DOCSIS 1.1 modem had to be replaced with a DOCSIS 2.0 modem (since the old one did not have the download speed capability).
Comcast ran into the same problem with PowerBoost with certain older modems, particularly the earlier Surfboards and RCA modems where not capable of delivering speeds at the full DOCSIS 1.1 rates. As for the download speeds being the same, that's a fact. See:

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Docsis

or read the Cablelabs specs yourself here:

»www.cablelabs.com/specifications/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996406 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 16:55:00 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996297 Thaler :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

How about quickly handling Microsoft's patch Tuesday?
How quick do you really need them? You only need a basic broadband connection to be set for "first day downloads". Wether or not you're running the first patches from "patch Tuesday" within the first 20 minutes of release means *nothing*.

said by openbox9 See Profile :

How about purchasing all of those mp3/mp4 files from Amazon or iTunes?
What, people on 1.5M connections can't use Amazon or iTunes?

said by openbox9 See Profile :

How about Apple's new HD aTV rental mechanism?
I'd imagine it streams well enough over slower "standard" broadband connections.

etc., etc. Again, your average "surfing" grannie isn't going to benefit didly squat from a massive pipe connection. It caters more to those who're going to use the internet for lots of large file transfers - the exact same users Comcast labels as "abusive" once they hit the invisible bandwidth cap.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996297 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 16:41:32 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996211 Thaler :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

Ok. You only need to worry about caps and P2P restrictions if you want to abuse the system 24/7 and seed files via P2P.
I wasn't aware Skype, OpenOffice, and Linux distros fell into the range of "ISP abuse". Thanks for clearing that up!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996211 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 16:29:19 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996170 openbox9 : Why can't you upload?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996170 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 16:23:28 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996080 RARPSL :
said by espaeth See Profile :

said by hopeflicker See Profile :

Still on DOCSIS 1.xx??
Long over due for "upgrading their infrastructure" :o
What would they upgrade to? DOCSIS 2.0 has the same download channel capacity as 1.x, only the upstream gets improved from 9mbps to 27mbps. It provides no gains in video distribution, no significant gains in signal quality, and still required a complete CMTS card replacement.

The cable companies that have DOCSIS 2.0 only have it from initial deployments, no company in the industry upgraded because the ROI for 2.0 was crap.
CableVision (who is my connectivity provider) was DOCSIS 1.1 at 10/1. They DID spend the money to offer DOCSIS 2.0 (BOOST) at initially 30/2 (now 30/5) and bumped their DOCSIS 1.1 to 10/2 (and now 15/2). Thus your "Spend the ROI Money" claim is inaccurate. So is your DOCSIS 1.1 Download speed max being the same as DOCSIS 2.0 max since for me to get BOOST (DOCSIS 2.0) my DOCSIS 1.1 modem had to be replaced with a DOCSIS 2.0 modem (since the old one did not have the download speed capability).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996080 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 16:12:21 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996077 hopeflicker : How are people supposed to download those hirez pix/vids of their grandkids if you cant upload these large files.
--
Man created God in his image : intolerant, sexist, homophobic and violent.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19996077 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 16:11:56 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995980 openbox9 : How about quickly handling Microsoft's patch Tuesday? How about purchasing all of those mp3/mp4 files from Amazon or iTunes? How about Apple's new HD aTV rental mechanism? How about downloading all of those hi-rez pictures and video clips from your grandchildrens' website? Anyway, you get my point.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995980 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 16:00:04 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995936 openbox9 : Ok. You only need to worry about caps and P2P restrictions if you want to abuse the system 24/7 and seed files via P2P.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995936 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 15:55:11 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995758 BillRoland : Cox has been 2.0 for a long time.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995758 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 15:29:30 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995641 fuziwuzi :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

You only need to worry about alleged caps/restrictions if you want to abuse the system 24/7. There are plenty of users that will be ecstatic about upgraded throughput tiers that won't have any problems with caps/restrictions that Comcast places on their network.
How fast of a connection do you need if all you feel safe doing is sending an email to your grandma with a couple of pictures of the kids attached? Oops, don't attach too many pictures and heaven forbid you send a video clip, you might be accused of "abuse" and have your service terminated.

If having that awesome 50Mbps connection can't get you the stuff you want at awesome speed, but instead you're still limited to casual web browsing and sending/receiving a few emails, then what use is that 50Mbps connection when a 1Mbps connection would do that same thing with no noticeable difference?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995641 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 15:08:24 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995593 hopeflicker :
said by espaeth See Profile :

said by hopeflicker See Profile :

Still on DOCSIS 1.xx??
Long over due for "upgrading their infrastructure" :o
What would they upgrade to? DOCSIS 2.0 has the same download channel capacity as 1.x, only the upstream gets improved from 9mbps to 27mbps. It provides no gains in video distribution, no significant gains in signal quality, and still required a complete CMTS card replacement.

The cable companies that have DOCSIS 2.0 only have it from initial deployments, no company in the industry upgraded because the ROI for 2.0 was crap.

3.0's big advantage is it allows MSOs to start deploying things like Switched Digital Video, which matters even more to cable companies than HSI speeds.
oh, that's right, customers don't need upstream. :(
--
Man created God in his image : intolerant, sexist, homophobic and violent.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995593 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:59:29 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995547 Karl Bode :
quote:
You only need to worry about alleged caps/restrictions if you want to abuse the system 24/7
Technically Comcast's traffic shaping throttles upstream p2p traffic for all users regardless of consumption.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995547 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:54:21 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995546 espaeth :
said by hopeflicker See Profile :

Still on DOCSIS 1.xx??
Long over due for "upgrading their infrastructure" :o
What would they upgrade to? DOCSIS 2.0 has the same download channel capacity as 1.x, only the upstream gets improved from 9mbps to 27mbps. It provides no gains in video distribution, no significant gains in signal quality, and still required a complete CMTS card replacement.

The cable companies that have DOCSIS 2.0 only have it from initial deployments, no company in the industry upgraded because the ROI for 2.0 was crap.

3.0's big advantage is it allows MSOs to start deploying things like Switched Digital Video, which matters even more to cable companies than HSI speeds.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995546 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:54:06 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995542 openbox9 : I'm not drinking any kool-aid, I despise American Idol, and I am a Mac fan. I do have expectations for services that I pay money for, and for the most part, I'm satisfied. I do appreciate your genuine concern though.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995542 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:53:28 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995534 openbox9 : There are many cablecos still utilizing DOCSIS 1.x that are operating just fine...mine included.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995534 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:51:07 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995530 openbox9 : You only need to worry about alleged caps/restrictions if you want to abuse the system 24/7. There are plenty of users that will be ecstatic about upgraded throughput tiers that won't have any problems with caps/restrictions that Comcast places on their network.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995530 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:50:22 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995493 BosstonesOwn : Sir I ask you to step to the left side of the counter. Your Comcast kool-aid is there. The middle and right sides are reserved for the American Idol and Apple fans.

Sir I also ask you to leave your expectations for service at the door. Thank you... Comcast Managem.... err Bosstonesown
--
"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995493 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:42:53 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995484 hopeflicker :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

Whiners complaining about all of the money that Comcast is raking in, but not upgrading their infrastructure?
for at least a few more years, by the speeds currently provided by DOCSIS 1.x (or in Cablevision's case 2.0) networks.


Still on DOCSIS 1.xx??
Long over due for "upgrading their infrastructure" :o
--
Man created God in his image : intolerant, sexist, homophobic and violent.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995484 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:40:41 EDT Re: Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995437 SilverSurfer :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

Whiners complaining about all of the money that Comcast is raking in, but not upgrading their infrastructure?
What good is this alleged upgrade if you're capped/restricted as to what you can download? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995437 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:31:49 EDT Where are the... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995403 openbox9 : Whiners complaining about all of the money that Comcast is raking in, but not upgrading their infrastructure?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19995403 Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:28:06 EDT