tenpin784
I Went To The Dark Side?
join:2001-03-30
New Durham, NH | telephone service
Telephone service as we know it will now get worse then it was, which I didn't think was possible.
Sweet. |
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Mactron
el Camino Real
Premium
join:2001-12-16
CM94sv
| said by tenpin784  :Telephone service as we know it will now get worse then it was, which I didn't think was possible. Sweet. Yup, look how well Hawaiian Telcom (The Carlyle Group) did after VZ dumped Hawaii in 2005. Your future has has come before. 
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If only the Verizon CSRs worked this well.  |
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TK Junk Mail
Go ahead, make my day
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Margate City, NJ
clubs:
 ·Comcast
| reply to tenpin784
said by tenpin784 :Telephone service as we know it will now get worse then it was, which I didn't think was possible. Sweet. At least you have a company that WANTS TO do business in the area. Verizon wanted out. Service under Fairpoint should improve over what Verizon offered. The main opponents of this deal from the beginning were the overpaid union workers. Some of them may lose their jobs and costs should come down as a result.
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My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page |
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Covington, LA | reply to tenpin784
Americans always get what they truly want... or at least pay for. |
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RadioDoc
Sortofadog
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
Chicago, IL | reply to TK Junk Mail
Costs may come down, but you know prices won't.
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Toolmaster of La Grange. |
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slls
join:2007-01-28
Bangor, ME | When I can't afford Fairpoint then I will switch, I have other options. |
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viperlmw
Premium
join:2005-01-25
 ·Qwest.net
| reply to TK Junk Mail
said by TK Junk Mail :~snip~ The main opponents of this deal from the beginning were the overpaid union workers. Some of them may lose their jobs and costs should come down as a result. How the hell do you define overpaid? Do you know what the pay scale for techs there is? If so, please post it so we can be enlightened as to what you think overpaid is. Until then, please stop the passive-aggressive (or any other kind of) Union attacks! |
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Dolgan
Premium
join:2005-10-01
Sun Prairie, WI | reply to TK Junk Mail
quote:
The main proponents of this deal from the beginning were the overpaid Verizon Executives. Some of them should lose their jobs and costs would come down as a result
Corrected your post for errors. |
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PDXPLT
join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR
| reply to viperlmw
said by viperlmw :said by TK Junk Mail :~snip~ The main opponents of this deal from the beginning were the overpaid union workers. Some of them may lose their jobs and costs should come down as a result. How the hell do you define overpaid? Do you know what the pay scale for techs there is? If so, please post it so we can be enlightened as to what you think overpaid is. Until then, please stop the passive-aggressive (or any other kind of) Union attacks! Well, since the unions have monopoly power over the supply of labor to Verizon, many would consider them by definition "overpaid", i.e., Verizon is required to pay more in order to purchase labor, than they otherwise would have to, for what the market value of that labor would be in a free competitive market. |
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tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by PDXPLT : Well, since the unions have monopoly power over the supply of labor to Verizon, many would consider them by definition "overpaid", i.e., Verizon is required to pay more in order to purchase labor, than they otherwise would have to, for what the market value of that labor would be in a free competitive market. Why is it when Labor join together to increase power that is considered greedy.
When management positions a company to market dominance to maximize profitability that is considered great business acumen.
In a free market shouldn't all players continuously maneuver to increase competitive advantage?
/tom |
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tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to tenpin784
said by tenpin784 :Telephone service as we know it will now get worse I'm less concerned with voice phone service, which at least here in Milford is fine, then future investment.
DSL is a clever engineering kludge designed to extract additional value from existing copper cable plant but it is just an interim step to an all fiber network. FairPoint acts as if DSL is Broadband nirvana rather then just a stepping stone.
Having DSL rather then dialup will be great for rural areas not currently served by DSL. However DSL speed, limited by copper distance, will become increasingly marginalized in the future. An analogy is V.90 dialup modem technology. It represents clever engineering that extracts higher speed then most though possible over the PSTN. That said dialup performance is wholly unsatisfactory today for Internet access.
The big question is will FairPoint be able to raise enough Capital, in face of falling land line revenue to invest in DSL and next generation broadband?
/tom |
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tshirt
Premium
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
| reply to TK Junk Mail
said by TK Junk Mail :said by tenpin784 :Telephone service as we know it will now get worse then it was, which I didn't think was possible. Sweet. .....Service under Fairpoint should improve over what Verizon offered. The main opponents of this deal from the beginning were the overpaid union workers. Some of them may lose their jobs and costs should come down as a result. Overpaid? or competant trained professionals, who by experience have learned that what you consider overstaffed, they need to do the job promptly, and SAFELY.
considering that fairpoint inc. just bought a customer base 5-1/2 times their existing size, and the usual confusion/ineffiencies of a transition. I'd assume they will actually need more people at least temporarily to provide equal or better service. |
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Vox
@verizon.net
| reply to TK Junk Mail
Yeah, you know what you're are talking about. Consumer opposition runs about 90%. I live in NH...Google the local papers and read the consumer comments before posting such nonsense. "Service under FairPointshould improve"...we are going from fiber to DSL connection speeds. If you think that is an improvement, I got a bridge to sell you. |
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xsiddalx
join:2005-03-11
Chicago, IL
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to tenpin784
said by tenpin784 :Telephone service as we know it will now get worse then it was, which I didn't think was possible. Sweet. Service will likely remain the same, why would you believe it would get worse?
Customer service *might* go down, who knows.
Telco service is predominantly a function of capital investments, secondly maintenance (not so much). No different really than cable, satellite, cellular, isp, electric, natural gas, etc..
My hunch is that fairpoint is investing in a "bond" (telco customer) with a regular payment (monthly service). They aren't going to make service worse, but might make it better (if the return on the incremental investment makes sense).
They'll likely follow the same rules as verizon in terms of investment.
Back to my original question, how do you think it can get worse? |
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xsiddalx
join:2005-03-11
Chicago, IL
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to Mactron
said by Mactron Yup, look how well Hawaiian Telcom (The Carlyle Group) did after VZ dumped Hawaii in 2005. Your future has has come before.
[/BQUOTE :Do you have a cite? How did they do (or not)? I believe I have read not long ago that the HI Telecom deal didn't produce the margins that Carlyle wanted. I haven't read anything that says that they couldn't provide telephone service at the same level as verizon had previously. |
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xsiddalx
join:2005-03-11
Chicago, IL
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to Vox
said by Vox :
Yeah, you know what you're are talking about. Consumer opposition runs about 90%. I live in NH...Google the local papers and read the consumer comments before posting such nonsense. "Service under FairPointshould improve"...we are going from fiber to DSL connection speeds. If you think that is an improvement, I got a bridge to sell you.
It's a point well taken, but if VZ was putting the property up for sale is indicative that the property wasn't in the ftth project list.
Secondly, posting links always helps support a position.
Let's say fairpoint does ftth, what does that mean to you?
The way I see it, you now have fiber instead of copper or wireless or coax to the house. It's all just a connection.
Was there a memo distributed that said VZ was doing fiber to your home but fairpoint won't?
I'm not sure I get why one company or the other is inherently better. They are both public corporations...
Future shareholder of Fairpoint (not really excited about it myself). |
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xsiddalx
join:2005-03-11
Chicago, IL
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to tschmidt
said by tschmidt
DSL is a clever engineering kludge designed to extract additional value from existing copper cable plant but it is just an interim step to an all fiber network. FairPoint acts as if DSL is Broadband nirvana rather then just a stepping stone.
[/BQUOTE :How is it really a kludge? A rock solid T1 is still tons more than a DSL circuit (price and throughput but very different markets and uses). It makes sense though if you believe that the telcos are no longer telephone companies but internet providers with telephone service on the side (makes sense to me). FTTH doesn't pay for itself (IMO) on internet access alone. DSL is a card swap, ftth is a physical build out. Big dollar difference (all initial sunk cost, but a gamble in cost depreciation and profit I imagine). said by tschmidt
Having DSL rather then dialup will be great for rural areas not currently served by DSL. However DSL speed, limited by copper distance, will become increasingly marginalized in the future. An analogy is V.90 dialup modem technology. It represents clever engineering that extracts higher speed then most though possible over the PSTN. That said dialup performance is wholly unsatisfactory today for Internet access.
[/BQUOTE :DSL might well be the new dial-up. Depending on configuration, it is effectively a dial-up service (at higher speeds). Although I agree with you in principle, every technology that exists today is obsolete, or as you politely put it, marginalized. It's all a matter of time. Are you willing to fund the acceleration of technology without expectation of a profit? I hate to admit, the way I use the internet, I discovered dial up was quite fine for the games I play and the web sites I visit with my current browser configuration. I am fully aware that doesn't reduce the BW delivered to my ISP, but then again, they have agreements in place...dial up has a place, but it is likely cheaper for telephone companies to provide DSL than tie up circuit switches. said by tschmidt
The big question is will FairPoint be able to raise enough Capital, in face of falling land line revenue to invest in DSL and next generation broadband?
/tom
[/BQUOTE :A good question for Wall Street! Then again, to turn the tables, the big question is will Verizon be able to raise more Capital, in face of falling land line revenue to invest in DSL and next generation broadband after they sell off properties? Using your metrics of capital, where is the Capital best invested for a return? Maybe NH isn't the best place (though you can certainly start a company to prove wall street wrong). Welcome to deregulation 2.0 How much electric choice do you have since deregulation? How much natural gas choice do you have since deregulation? How much cable choice do you expect since deregulation? How much telco choice do you expect since deregulation? Hell, let me throw in the roads that we are selling off under lease to private investors such as fairpoint. It's America, love or leave it, right? Given that the Cable and Telcos (and cellular affiliates) are ISPs now, what are you expecting? There are certainly small pockets of competition out there though! |
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workingman
@verizon.net
moderated:
February 27th, @12:21AM
|  reply to viperlmw
You don't even know the facts! Shame on you! The Public Advocate in the state of New Hampshire has always been opposed and still is. Every independent company hired by regulatory to analize the deal has denounced it stating that there are no stipulations both Verizon and Fairpoint could agree to that would outweigh the risk involved for the state also 122 state reps from New Hampshire sent letters to the board denouncing the deal. There is more if you'd like me to go on but I won't because you don't care about the hard working laborers in the country that have been getting the shaft by corporate America for many years now. You don't care about the jobs we are losing to other countries or the south, at least not until it's you're own. |
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FastiBook
join:2003-01-08
Newtown, PA | reply to TK Junk Mail
So, a decent living wage is being overpaid? Interesting. |
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viperlmw
Premium
join:2005-01-25
·Qwest.net
| reply to PDXPLT
said by PDXPLT :Well, since the unions have monopoly power over the supply of labor to Verizon, many would consider them by definition "overpaid", i.e., Verizon is required to pay more in order to purchase labor, than they otherwise would have to, for what the market value of that labor would be in a free competitive market. If it's a monopoly, than it's one sanctioned by the Company, because a Collective Bargaining Agreement is an AGREEMENT, reached by BOTH sides. Believe me, management wouldn't agree to it if it didn't benefit them (stable, trained, qualified workforce invested in the Company, highly structured working conditions, highly structured pay scales and disciplinary processes, assured thru the life of the contract, etc.). So if the Company doesn't consider their labor force to be overpaid (by definition, as they reached an AGREEMENT), then why would anyone else? BTW, remember your 'market value of that labor' when you recommend the NFL fire Eli Manning, or the NBA fire Shaq, etc. as they are all card carrying Union members. |
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