lostinthewest
@QWEST.NET | Aw Come on
The automobile (fill in ftth) will never take off. Why when you all already have a horse (fill in copper pair). |
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lostintheeast
@pacbell.net
| said by lostinthewest :
The automobile (fill in ftth) will never take off. Why when you all already have a horse (fill in copper pair).
lol, I agree.  |
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here | reply to lostinthewest
So you believe that in the late 1800s it would have been economically feasible and worthwhile to produce a 70mph roadster? |
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BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
 ·Comcast
| said by bogey780  :So you believe that in the late 1800s it would have been economically feasible and worthwhile to produce a 70mph roadster? No but a 40 mph roadster would have been great. oh wait people of the times said no one would ever need an auto too.
Oh my the world is a changing.
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"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" |
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here | But even then with the lack of roadways, gas stations, and the cheapness of a horse...why pour a huge amount of money into making them? |
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tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
 ·Hollis Hosting
 ·Verizon Online DSL
·Fairpoint Communic..
| reply to bogey780
said by bogey780 :So you believe that in the late 1800s it would have been economically feasible and worthwhile to produce a 70mph roadster? There are lots of risks being too early to market and there are also lots more being too late.
Seems to me Fiber is more mature then Automobiles were in at the turn of 2oth century. Cost per residence passed is pretty low. It is already cost effective in greenfield sites. The difficulty for Telcos is deciding when to transition from copper to fiber outside plant.
The downside risk of not building out with fiber is severe as first player in the market will most likely dominate it. Cost is high enough to discourage second and third entrants into a particular market.
/tom |
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BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs: | reply to bogey780
natural progress. The fact that what was a luxury before has become a standard part of life. |
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here | Well why not invest in dropping 100GB feeds to every house? Economies of scale and ROI just don't disappear instantly based upon a fraction of the market. |
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BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
·Comcast
| If that is the case then why did we even bother bringing broadband to the world ? Or telephone service to all.
Now your arguing on a different scale. Hows it said ? Rome wasn't built in a day ? Jumping ahead like that isn't really a progression as much as it is pushing the boundaries. There is no reason to push the boundaries that far. It's not proven yet. I would be all for pushing gig fiber to peoples homes. It would drastically bring down costs and provide a uniform environment for development of our country.
It's like asking why not give every one a porsche. That is pushing it. Copper has it's limits and people are starting to hit them. the next progression has to be fiber. The costs are going to be to high to keep copper on the poles. Thieves and maintenance are the biggest costs.
If you look at what our country has become you will notice we are not developing new technology , we are merely tweaking what we already had. It doesn't help push us forward in natural progression if we don't keep on innovating. FTTH is a progression but not a break through , just like the change from horses to autos , that was not a huge breakthrough but a tweaking of what we had.
We just really need to realize we need subsidies or a nationwide network that will support our nations need for both information and entertainment.
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"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" |
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here
| So you're saying that we shouldn't allow the natural demand or edonomy push out the product but we need to spend way more than we really should to guarantee that it gets done. Like building a 70mph roadster in the 1800s.
None of these companies are saying that they'll always run copper. Just that they'll run less.
And besides, Americans cheered in the 1980s when the world's best telecom network got put on cruise control. So we're getting right now everything we demanded. |
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MichaelWacey
OwlSaver
Premium
join:2005-01-30
Berwyn, PA
 ·Verizon FIOS
·Comcast
| reply to tschmidt
said by tschmidt :said by bogey780 :So you believe that in the late 1800s it would have been economically feasible and worthwhile to produce a 70mph roadster? There are lots of risks being too early to market and there are also lots more being too late. Seems to me Fiber is more mature then Automobiles were in at the turn of 2oth century. Cost per residence passed is pretty low. It is already cost effective in greenfield sites. The difficulty for Telcos is deciding when to transition from copper to fiber outside plant. The downside risk of not building out with fiber is severe as first player in the market will most likely dominate it. Cost is high enough to discourage second and third entrants into a particular market. /tom The telecom industry has used Fibre to connect central offices since the mid 1980's. The technology is well understood and stable. The only reason to not do it is that it costs investors now for a payoff in the future. Without competion (or government subsidy) FTTH would never happen. Verizon has done it because of competion from Cable. I am lucky to live in a Verizon area that has FiOS. |
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tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Hollis Hosting
·Verizon Online DSL
·Fairpoint Communic..
| reply to bogey780
said by bogey780 :So you're saying that we shouldn't allow the natural demand or edonomy push out the product but we need to spend way more than we really should to guarantee that it gets done. I do not think that is a good analogy.
There are times market forces are effective. In that case there is no reason for government to interfere.
There are other times market forces are not viable. In that case government steps in and changes the rules in an attempt to maximize to public good.
Examples of the latter are initial creation of the Internet. It was very risky, the incumbent AT&T had no interest in creating a potential competitor. Another example was rural electrification in the 1930's. Federal government stepped in to address markets not deemed profitable enough for private enterprise.
These calls are never black or white, but always shades of grey.
/tom |
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jtudor
Xm 60's On 6 Freak
Premium,MVM
join:2002-12-07
Morganton, NC
| reply to lostinthewest
Anyone remember Thomas Watson, former chairman of IBM who said that he could foresee the need for maybe 5 computers in the whole world??
»thinkexist.com/quotation/i-think···049.html
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Best of luck
"Do, or Do not, there is no try!" Yoda
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK | reply to lostinthewest
Maybe better:
Why should we build an interstate system of roadways? We have plenty of dirt tracks for those automobiles to use....
Kinda like, "We don't need Telephones, we have the Telegraph already..." |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
| reply to bogey780
said by bogey780 :And besides, Americans cheered in the 1980s when the world's best telecom network got put on cruise control. So we're getting right now everything we demanded. Not even close. Seem's like they still think it's the 80's.... they hanker for the monopoly ways and the end to all competition.
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"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) |
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old_dawg
"I Know Noting..."
join:2001-09-22
Westminster, MD
| reply to BosstonesOwn
said by BosstonesOwn :We just really need to realize we need subsidies Are you footing the bill for these (ahem) subsidies?
Will they be anything like the subsidies, i.e., kickbacks companies like ADM are getting for ethanol production?. Curious minds want to know. 
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"Our network engineers are aware of the problem..." |
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BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
·Comcast
| said by old_dawg :said by BosstonesOwn :We just really need to realize we need subsidies Are you footing the bill for these (ahem) subsidies? Will they be anything like the subsidies, i.e., kickbacks companies like ADM are getting for ethanol production?. Curious minds want to know. Define subsidies and define scumbags.
First off this nation pays people not to grow crops at times. Sorry but that is just not right , if we would stop doing this and stop just giving out money like we are , we could be ok. Growing excessive amounts of corn for ethanol production would be a better idea.
I hate hand outs , but its government needs to be run more like a business , not a welfare line. Give out tax breaks to the companies producing fiber , and the companies laying it. Not the telco's. I want the government to own the lines not the telco's. I want things in place so the normal people in the country can see what the government is doing to these lines.
I want the country to actually lease carriage rights to the providers who want to provide us with bandwidth and such. To help pay off the lines and help pay maintenance , and other things which may come up. Who knows maybe then profit could be funneled into things we need like say healthcare or bridge building , or maybe even servicing rural areas with fiber , you know the things that could benefit society as a whole , not just the share holders of 1 company ?
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"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" |
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