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FFH5
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
reply to dadkins

Re: I don't like France's proposed policy

said by dadkins:

*NO* ISP should be a cop!
Well then who should be the cop, in your opinion?

Because god knows one is needed, given all the criminals on the internet.
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page

SilverSurfer1

join:2007-08-19
said by FFH5:

Well then who should be the cop, in your opinion?

Because god knows one is needed, given all the criminals on the internet.
We need "cops" to patrol the Internet the same way we need law enforcement to patrol Times Square and strip search everyone they stumble across just to "make sure" nobody is carrying/doing anything "illegal."


dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18
reply to FFH5
Uhm... I can't answer that, can you?
Is Caltrans the cops that write you a ticket for speeding on the roads they build and maintain? No!

Should the ISP that builds and maintains the line you & I use be the cops? No!
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera


FFH5
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
said by dadkins:

Uhm... I can't answer that, can you?
Is Caltrans the cops that write you a ticket for speeding on the roads they build and maintain? No!

Should the ISP that builds and maintains the line you & I use be the cops? No!
NYC, Philadelphia, etc all have their own transit cops and railroads have their own railroad cops(paid by the railroads). Why shouldn't ISPs have their own internet cops?
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page


Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA

2 recommendations

reply to FFH5
I'm reaching here, but maybe.... the police?

It's their jobs to track down criminals (be they online or offline) and prosecute them.

When it comes to copyright offenses, however, these are civil offenses, not criminal ones. (At least until the MPAA/RIAA push through legislation making them criminal cases.) This means that the copyright holder has to file suit themselves against the copyright violator. Sometimes this takes the form of a John Doe lawsuit until the violator's identity can be determined (or until the copyright holder has proven to a judge that they have enough of a case to pierce the accused's privacy).

The problem is that the RIAA is lazy. They don't want to file their lawsuits separately in the correct jurisdiction. They just want to file a huge batch of them all at once (as if they were related). They don't want to *actually* sue the person, just strong-arm them into a highly one-sided settlement. And they don't want to keep an eye out for copyright violators themselves, they want the ISPs to do their job for them.
--
-Jason Levine
Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar. Shooting For A Cause
Jason's Toolbox | PCQandA.com


dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18

1 recommendation

reply to FFH5
Ok, but they themselves are not the cops. See the difference here?

Seeing as it is not the ISPs bitching about the illegal transfers of material(s), then it should not be the ISPs (or you and I) footing the bill for police type services.

Are you willing to have more restrictions applied to your connection *AND* pay more each month so some private company/entity can dictate what the ISPs should do?

Fuck that!
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera


nipseyrussel
Nipsey Russell, yo

join:2002-02-22
Philadelphia, PA

1 recommendation

reply to FFH5
railroads hire transit cops because (a) if they dont their customers are in danger and are less likely to ride -thus they would lose customers and (b) they are protecting the actual physical safety of their customers

with respect to (a) the ISPs stand to lose customers if they police content, and re (b) no one is going to get stabbed or raped in kazaa like they might on the subway.

here we have a situation where most of the ISPs and their customers have no desire to have themselves policed, so let them keep up their dumass lawsuits


Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA

1 recommendation

Not to mention that filtering content opens ISPs up to liability. No filter is going to be 100% perfect. If they block some copyrighted material from being transferred without permission, but don't block others, then they might be sued by the owners of the non-filtered items. If they don't filter at all, they can claim Common Carrier and are shielded from being sued.


81399672
Premium
join:2006-05-17
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:2
reply to FFH5
said by FFH5:

said by dadkins:

*NO* ISP should be a cop!
Well then who should be the cop, in your opinion?

Because god knows one is needed, given all the criminals on the internet.
We don't need cops on the internet. When music industry start releasing music that is worth to buy, people will start buying. Till then pirating will continue and regardless of what you try it will not stop it.


81399672
Premium
join:2006-05-17
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:2
reply to FFH5
said by FFH5:

said by dadkins:

Uhm... I can't answer that, can you?
Is Caltrans the cops that write you a ticket for speeding on the roads they build and maintain? No!

Should the ISP that builds and maintains the line you & I use be the cops? No!
NYC, Philadelphia, etc all have their own transit cops and railroads have their own railroad cops(paid by the railroads). Why shouldn't ISPs have their own internet cops?
You talking about government, isp is not government. RIAA soon will be out of existence, as they refuse to adapt to new reality. Make all songs cheap to download, say 50c and it will not worth for people to pirate. Till then people will pirate and their is nothing RIAA can do about it


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:12
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
reply to FFH5
said by FFH5:

Well then who should be the cop, in your opinion?
The F.B.I.? Or your state police? We already have cops, and they have rules, regulations, and procedures to follow to act on complaints. Let them do it. And pass the costs on to the taxpayers as they do it. Yeah; levy an Internet tax to pay for Internet cops. That should do it.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum


bassjunky

join:2005-05-12
Aubrey, TX

1 edit
reply to 81399672
said by 81399672 See ProfileWhen music industry start releasing music that is worth to buy, people will start buying. Till then pirating will continue and regardless of what you try it will not stop it.


That's the lamest excuse, I've never understood it. If it's not worth buying or having, why steal it? It's good enough to obtain freely in whatever means, but not if you have to spend money on it? If it's 'shitty' music, why have it in your music library at all?

Furthermore, regardless of the quality or how much people like it, people are going to steal it anyway.

edited for screwing up the quote.


81399672
Premium
join:2006-05-17
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:2
said by bassjunky:

said by 81399672 See ProfileWhen music industry start releasing music that is worth to buy, people will start buying. Till then pirating will continue and regardless of what you try it will not stop it.


That's the lamest excuse, I've never understood it. If it's not worth buying or having, why steal it? It's good enough to obtain freely in whatever means, but not if you have to spend money on it? If it's 'shitty' music, why have it in your music library at all?

Furthermore, regardless of the quality or how much people like it, people are going to steal it anyway.

edited for screwing up the quote.
Let me clarify my statement. Most cd's that are released contain one good song out of all of them. People are not willing to pay $20 or $30 just to listen to that one good song. RIAA seems not to understand that and soon they will be out of business as their lawsuit will stop nothing.
--
i am not a lawyer but I do play one on the internet


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:12
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
reply to bassjunky
said by bassjunky:

said by 81399672 See ProfileWhen music industry start releasing music that is worth to buy, people will start buying. Till then pirating will continue and regardless of what you try it will not stop it.


That's the lamest excuse, I've never understood it. If it's not worth buying or having, why steal it? It's good enough to obtain freely in whatever means, but not if you have to spend money on it? If it's 'shitty' music, why have it in your music library at all?
I won't have it in my library. If it isn't worth paying for, I don't download it. I have downloaded exactly 46 .mp3 tracks; all of them using HTTP. None of them were available in retail shops (I looked; I was willing to buy them at the inflated prices charged for imports from Japan). Other than that, and some AMVs (Anime Music Videos), which I got for the animation as much as the music, I have not grabbed any RIAA stuff from the Internet.

I don't know how to measure what percentage of "lost" sales the RIAA claims is actually due to piracy, and what percentage is due to consumer resistance to a trashy product. I am not buying nearly as much as I used to buy; but I am not "stealing" it (downloading .mp3s), either. As you said, if it isn't worth paying for, it isn't worth stealing.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum
Expand your moderator at work


Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA
reply to NormanS

Re: I don't like France's proposed policy

I hate to make an "I Agree" post, but... well, I Agree.

I've never understood the rationale of the file sharers who claimed that the music was garbage, but somehow it was worth pirating.

Then there's the constantly moving goal post of what the music is worth. Back in the Napster days, I heard that $1 per song would be worth it. Then, when iTunes came about, some folks suddenly decided that $1 was too much money and it should be $0.50 - $0.75.

I don't buy those arguments. Especially now that the $0.99 songs are coming DRM-free (via Amazon.com, for example). Even if the price was reduced to a dime per song for CD quality, non-DRM-ed MP3 files, there would be a group of people claiming that it was too pricey.
--
-Jason Levine
Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar. Shooting For A Cause
Jason's Toolbox | PCQandA.com


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:12
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
It seems that I forgot the tunes I grabbed on a free trial product. 99 tunes? Anyway, I give the company a credit card number, and had 30 days to grab the tunes. The problem I had with that scheme was that it was a kind of book club deal; you authorized a monthly charge. Whether you found anything worth grabbing from one month to the next, or not, you had to pay. I think it was $5 a month, or so. So after I grabbed the authorized tunes, I quit the service.

Actually, I do think $1 per tune is a fair price for many that I have collected over the years; on vinyl and CD.

Toward the end of the 90's I fell in with a weird crowd; fans of Japanese animation and comics. They have wonderful music with their animated shows. I wound up preferring to spend $32 a pop for CD anime soundtracks instead of $17 a pop for what passes for music in the U.S. So the RIAA has missed out on a thousand dollars, or so, not because I have pirated their stuff, but because I found a competing (if more expensive) product I liked better.

They whine so hard about not making sales; but, in my case, the money was theirs for the taking, if only they offered a product I wanted.

So I have no sympathy for them.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

vannyx
Premium
join:2003-07-07
Bronx, NY
reply to 81399672
All i can say is amazing, when people complain about something, like isps blocking stuff and ask for some kind of regular from the government to stop it these guys come out o the wood work and argue that the free market should decided , let the free market handle it, if you dont like it dont subscribe to that isp, these are citizens asking for help from the government to fix something they feel will become a problem. So now we have a private entity that wants another private entity to impose restrictions and to violate there customers privacy for this private entities gain. So why dont i see anyone saying that the free market should decide this, but guess what the free market has decided this. According to the RIAA/MPAA they are loosing sales, which if this is true then the free market has chosen not to support your outdated model, so stop trying to force 3rd parties to bend to your will. ( dont get started on this whole piracy thing). If you feel someone is stealing from you then go through the due process and charge them a reasonable fee for the violation and actually prove your case. The market has spoken now evolve or die.

vannyx
Premium
join:2003-07-07
Bronx, NY
reply to NormanS
OMG i love listening to OST from Japanese anime , it either makes me happy, sad , or just energetic especially when i am driving. Its not often you find music that just grabs you and affects you on such a level. yes it can be expensive but i find that its worth it.


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:12
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

1 edit
OST and Image. If the RIAA wants my money, they need to give me comparable tunes. Else let them whine their way into bankruptcy. As they are, now, they don't even produce anything worth stealing.

--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum