how-to block ads
|
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
 ·Verizon Online DSL
 ·Skype
| reply to alexfalkenberg
Re: [TWC] Throttling in Milwaukee?
No, you came across fine. I just wanted to reassure you, but the 99% line I used came across incorrectly.
I do agree with you that the unusual -- like a news "Consumer Reporter" -- might be the next step. Other phones to ring --
1. President/CEO
2. Member of the Board of Directors
3. Consumerist
4. BBB
You're a blogger, so you don't mind a little attention. Get attention to your issue by buying a week or two on a billboard and use that space to complain, get the billboard covered on the local news (for free), and do some AM radio interviews. In all cases, get the word out that you'll be tracking progress on your blog. It's a guerrilla-marketing way to get someone from TWC to pay attention.
When do you get that press, then write in to news@dslreports.com, post vidoes of the stories on video sites, etc. etc..
Basically, become not just a squeaky wheel, but a royal (but righteous) PITA.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
"We don't throttle any traffic," -Charlie Douglas, Comcast spokesman, on this report. | |
MacLeech
The one and only
Premium
join:2001-07-14
SoCal
| reply to alexfalkenberg
Please post the signal levels, when the connection is good and when it's bad.
Also if you can, try PingPlotter and run a trace to a known good site like 209.244.0.3
That PingPlotter program will show packetloss over time at each hop in a trace route. It logs the results and can run for hours, days, weeks, or forever.
With concrete info like signal levels and packetloss graphed out specifically showing an issue and where things start to fail, it gets very difficult for the techs and local management to ignore it if they get it. | |
alexfalkenberg
@rr.com
| reply to funchords
funchords: I wasn't trying to be defensive about it; sorry if it came across that way. I do understand what you're saying, and I agree with it.
I'm left wondering what productive steps I can take to get them to UNfail me now. I don't know anyone at TW-Milwaukee and all attempts thus far to contact "the right people" (as provided to me by CS reps both in the local offices and over the phone) have always ended in no response at all.
So I'm all for sticking to my guns until it's resolved, but I'm totally unable to get any traction with them. All I get is ignored; the only thing they're fairly quick about is sending automated letters threatening me with nonpayment when I try to withhold money. Go figure, right?
I suspect contacting a local television station's "consumer done wrong" person might be all I've got left at this point...short of just riding it out, cutting my losses, and praying the situation doesn't exist at our new address once we've moved. I don't necessarily want that kind of attention--for either party--but desperate times...
-alex
»alexfalkenberg.com | |
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to alexfalkenberg
Even before your reply, you very well established that customer service problem you are having. My message to you was mainly to point out that 99% of the causes of restarting modems fall on the TWC side.
The 4-5 things I mentioned weren't to put the onus on you at all. Instead, it was more of a Hail-Mary shot that maybe, just maybe here's a not-so-obvious item that both you and TWC overlooked.
You might want to lookup Mona Shaw for help with TWC. She's the Comcast Hammer Lady. It sounds like you need her more than we do.
In short: I don't think your technical problem at that address will get fixed until someone at TWC steps up and assumes ownership of it -- someone who is willing to keep your account at the top of their "to do" list and who sticks to it trying make some progress toward finding and fixing the problem every day. The bigger the company, the more difficult those people are to find.
The lack of any changes inside your house help to rule out, but do not completely rule out problems that are exacerbated by heat or season (my signals used to go through the roof whenever it hit 100F, yet for a few weeks I could only get techs to my house on cooler days -- and they, naturally, couldn't see the problem). Likewise, heaters and cooling fans tend to run on a seasonal basis. These things -- if they're happening at all -- are difficult to detect.
That's part of the frustration -- you've got to be willing to keep sticking this back on TWC even though you can't ever by 100% sure it's not something on your end. But that's one of the reasons you pay half-a-C-note for Cable Internet. It's an advanced technology and they're supposed to have the knowledge and the tools to find and fix these problems.
So far, they have failed you miserably.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
"We don't throttle any traffic," -Charlie Douglas, Comcast spokesman, on this report. | |
alexfalkenberg
@rr.com
| reply to funchords
I appreciate the feedback, wherever you might post it.
AC: I've actually run a cord from the next-door neighbor's place since I've seen it mentioned that it could be that (but honestly, TW themselves have blamed sunspots, overpowered ham radio, CB radio from semi traffic nearby, every network and phone and cable-using device ever made...and on and on, no lie). Anyway, it made no difference.
The cable modem is currently connected just inside my foundation where the line enters the house (albeit currently with a splitter (also replaced by them) so we can watch TV). The problem still occurs with just the CM connected, sans splitter, btw. Literally every cable and connector from the cable modem's current location 3 feet from my basement wall, all the way back to the pole behind our house, has been replaced by TW since this started. None of that has fixed anything.
As for interference, wouldn't that be an ongoing problem anyway? We've been in a pretty steady weather pattern lately, so no real changes as far as furnace use or anything else. Heat is a gas furnace on opposite side of the house from the coax and cat6 runs. As for cables running near anything electrical, they're where they've always been for the last three years we've lived here (with the exception of a recent move of the CM to the basement to test the house-wiring-of-some-sort-is-mucking-things-up theory), so the lack of any changes inside our house would seem to rule out it being a problem inside our house, imo...right? We've not added any new electronics or phones or anything of the sort since this started again.
I'm really at a loss about how to even explain this to anyone at TW, when we can even GET anyone to talk to us about it. NO one I've talked to seems to really 'get' that it could be a problem anywhere but inside my house. The last tech they sent out did the smallest/fastest local speedtest possible, which runs quite quickly...and that passed, so he called everything OK. Before he left, I hopped online right after that, and it's same-as-it-ever-was. He shrugged, said he didn't know, and to let them know if it continued!
I've lost all patience for service calls involving my home interior at this point, because they've all proven to be complete wastes of time. I've literally tried everything I know to try/test, eliminating other equipment, etc.
So clearly there's something wacky _somewhere_, but it seems like a ghost in their machine "out there" and I would love to be able to direct them to some specific part or location or something--anything--to get them to take a look. It seems like they're monkeying around with something, and it's wreaking havoc on us here.
What does it take to get TW to take this seriously, and do some good testing? I'd think they could bring their own cable modem, sit out at the pole 100 feet behind my house, try to download something--anything--and watch the CM reboot... Keep tracing it backwards from our pole, until it goes away. With only one guy (me) noticing and complaining, though, they apparently don't feel particularly pressured to take the time and spend the money investigating this. Meanwhile, I'm out $55/month for Roadrunner service I might as well not even have for as much as I can rely on it.
As for CM levels, they are always within the limits I've seem mentioned around online. Nothing weird there. Very rarely I'll see some "No FEC lock" errors in the log, but for the most part, nothing weird in the logs or admin UI at all except for the constant spontaneous rebooting I see listed.
The most frustrating part of this whole thing seems like it's being blown off and not taken seriously by TW. Literally zero response to long letters, long explanations to techs, etc. Promises of CM monitoring with eventual callbacks...none of which ever happen, etc. But they're always right on top of the bill! *sigh*
We're moving 50 miles or so north eventually (month or two from now), but not out of the TW-Milw. service area... so if it's a bad line or connection in a neighborhood junction box or something, maybe the problem won't follow us and we'll eventually be fine. Who knows. The lack of comparable options is quite frustrating. I'll still worry for our current neighbors and the next family that lives in this house.
Thanks again.
-alex
»alexfalkenberg.com | |
MacLeech
The one and only
Premium
join:2001-07-14
SoCal
4 edits | reply to funchords
said by funchords  :What is CPD? CPD = common path distortion. It's caused when forward signals are "reflected" back onto the return path. It's more common on the coax distribution system where the forward signals are high (20 dBmV or higher) and the return attenuation is low.
It causes the return noise floor to jump up quite a bit (some times more than 20 dB). It kills the upstream SNR and causes "codeword" errors on the upstream. It usually affects every modem on the upstream CMTS port, but can be VERY intermittent and difficult to track down because it often disappears for hours or days due to being disturbed during the troubleshooting process.
If CPD is strong enough, it'll knock modems offline, if it's not it could just slow things down and cause "hiccups" occasionally because of the upstream errors.
It has a lot of possible causes: corrosion of distribution equipment, loose connectors, bad termination, faulty amplifiers, kinked cable, customer wiring issues, etc.... I've seen alot of it first hand.
This may interest you:
»cable.doit.wisc.edu/cpd/cpd2.v2.html
[edit]Posted better link. | |
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC | reply to MacLeech
What is CPD? | |
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to mooosenix
said by mooosenix :Mine is not rebooting. The modem "config" page is still accessable, and all the lights are still on with the activity light happily blinking away.... ...no new logs on the modem config page Agreed, your modem is not rebooting.
said by mooosenix :Sometimes the connection will restore itself after ~30 seconds or so by itself without a reboot. The next time this happens, do not manually restart the modem. Instead, check your system logs or router's logs for a message indicating some kind of a DHCP event. (Restarting the modem would force such an event, which is why I'd like you to avoid it.)
said by mooosenix :Just for kicks, I'll probably have my modem swapped out in hope that's the problem, but I doubt it. Despite the lack of log entries, the modem is still in play as a possible cause for your issue. I would think that if a modem was requiring a signal, that too would be logged. Swapping it would be a quick way to rule in or rule out a major player in making a successful connection.
My gut tells me it's your computer or your router, and not your modem and not ISP throttling.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
"We don't throttle any traffic," -Charlie Douglas, Comcast spokesman, on this report. | |
MacLeech
The one and only
Premium
join:2001-07-14
SoCal
3 edits | reply to mooosenix
said by mooosenix :The modem "config" page is still accessable, and all the lights are still on with the activity light happily blinking away. However, any outbound traffic will fail to reach its destination. How are the modem signal levels during all of this?
Are they stable or does the SNR or Tx level fluctuate more than 1-2 dB?
Is there packet loss during this time?
Can you ping your gateway IP during these times?
Can you ping 192.168.100.1 during these times?
Can you ping 127.0.0.1 during these times?
.
It sounds like a return signal issue from the symptoms listed so far, possibly caused by noise, CPD, transient hum modulation, or return signal reflections... none of which phone support or the techs field techs assigned to service calls can see very well, if at all. Maintenance/line techs can see some or all of it depending on the training and/or tools they have access to. The return issues can cause intermittent upstream interruptions without causing the modem to reset. | |
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to MacLeech
said by MacLeech :The cable company can ALWAYS reboot your modem remotely, either through SNMP command to the modem, CMTS command, or physically turning off the signal to/from the modems forcing a reboot to reaquire the signal. Right. But only the last one is sure to work, and the last one affects everyone on that frequency -- so it wouldn't be a good way to perform throttling.
If challenged, I couldn't tell you which modems respond to an SNMP command to restart or if there are different "deepnesses" of restart. And I don't know if you can reboot a modem from the CMTS outside of SNMP or interrupting the signal to a whole group. However, none of that applies to this guy's problem.
Good metaphor about the TV & kids.  I found that Nyquil worked wonders. 
PS: to answer your next question -- both.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
"We don't throttle any traffic," -Charlie Douglas, Comcast spokesman, on this report. | |
mooosenix
join:2004-01-09
Milwaukee, WI
1 edit | reply to funchords
said by funchords :said by alexfalkenberg :
I'm tired of the BS of my cable modem constantly rebooting... I responded on his blog with the following...Alex, Your modem is rebooting. That nearly eliminates purposeful ISP throttling as a cause as many DOCSIS modems cannot be rebooted from the headend. This is why most ISPs tell you to reboot your router when a network upgrade happens so that it can phone home and download and apply its new config file. Mine is not rebooting.
The modem "config" page is still accessable, and all the lights are still on with the activity light happily blinking away. However, any outbound traffic will fail to
reach its destination.
In addition, there are no new logs on the modem config page after this happens. If the modem would have rebooted, it would have some logs about the startup process, right?
Sometimes the connection will restore itself after ~30 seconds or so by itself without a reboot. However, most of the time I have to manually restart the modem.
Just for kicks, I'll probably have my modem swapped out in hope that's the problem, but I doubt it. | |
MacLeech
The one and only
Premium
join:2001-07-14
SoCal
3 edits | reply to funchords
said by funchords :Your modem is rebooting. That nearly eliminates purposeful ISP throttling as a cause as many DOCSIS modems cannot be rebooted from the headend. This is why most ISPs tell you to reboot your router when a network upgrade happens so that it can phone home and download and apply its new config file. The cable company can ALWAYS reboot your modem remotely, either through SNMP command to the modem, CMTS command, or physically turning off the signal to/from the modems forcing a reboot to reaquire the signal.
Why the ISP doesn't use it is often because they want to roll out an upgrade slowly over the course of days or weeks. Usually to ease into the change so resources aren't suddenly slammed with demand from one thing or another (i.e. hundreds or thousands of modems all trying to aquire IPs or use 3 extra mbit of bandwidth each or customers calling when something fails).
ISPs don't use modem resets to purposely throttle connections though, it's not exactly resource friendly. It'd be akin to controlling your kids TV watching by flipping the TV on and off while they're watching it, what's the point when there are much easier and less disruptive ways. | |
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to alexfalkenberg
said by alexfalkenberg :
I'm tired of the BS of my cable modem constantly rebooting... I responded on his blog with the following...
Alex,
Your modem is rebooting. That nearly eliminates purposeful ISP throttling as a cause as many DOCSIS modems cannot be rebooted from the headend. This is why most ISPs tell you to reboot your router when a network upgrade happens so that it can phone home and download and apply its new config file.
Now -- I'm the guy holding Comcast's feet to the fire for throttling. So if I thought it was TWC + throttling, I'd certainly tell you.
It still is TWC who owns everything from your rented modem up to the node at the CMTS. If the cablemodem loses contact with the headend, a "watchdog" function in the modem will cause it to reboot in hopes to reestablish communications. There are several reasons that can happen -- 99% of those reasons are TWC issues. The modem normally won't reboot if it loses connectivity with your router or computer -- so if the modem is rebooting, it's because of an issue on the DOCSIS side.
That said, there are some "you" things you can check -- is the AC supply a clean one? Have you added any cables or splitters that might weaken the signal? Do your cables run near any electrically "noisy" sources that might dampen the modem's link to the headend -- such as an electric baseboard heater?
Thanks for letting me visit your blog. I might be back to your blog from time to time, but I read DSLReports every day or two. If there is anything I can do to help, please contact me on DSLReports.
--Robb (aka funchords)
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
"We don't throttle any traffic," -Charlie Douglas, Comcast spokesman, on this report. | |
|
