pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| reply to Noah Vail
Re: I used to see it that way...
said by Noah Vail  :I have moved from support of my government to defending myself from my government. I think too many people in the USA have no idea what it like to live under a tyrannical, repressive government. I still stand by my view that no one's rights have been violated on a scale major enough to make the claim that we have no rights.
It isn't like the government is rounding up all the people in this country who disagree with the government and making them disappear. The government isn't shutting down websites or newspapers critical of it. The government isn't doing anything infringing more than it has in recent years. I don't see any systemic, prolonged violation of our rights under this administration compared to previous administrations.
I do think though that the Democrat party, in its neverending quest to secure our defeat, is doing everything it can to embolden our enemies. By putting a stop to the government's ability to wiretap, it enables people who would want to do us harm to use another means of communication to do so.
--
This isn't fair! I was only supposed to hate just ONE presidential candidate! |
|
en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | What other country have you lived in to experience this ?
--
Canada = Hollywood North |
|
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| said by en102 :What other country have you lived in to experience this ? I don't have to live anywhere else to know.
I do however, read about the daily lives of people living in places like the old Soviet bloc, North Korea, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Zimbabwe, Venezuela, and Cuba to know that in the USA, we have it very good.
You don't have to pee on an electric fence to know that it is generally a bad idea.
--
This isn't fair! I was only supposed to hate just ONE presidential candidate! |
|
en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | Most G8 countries have it pretty good.
And not to sidetrack, but if the U.S. could cut its oil consumption to it being an export commodity, it would be even better.
--
Canada = Hollywood North |
|
Red Dawn
join:2004-12-13
Dallas, TX
| reply to pnh102
I think it's sad when people such as yourself go to "extremes" to try to equate this to what North Korea, Iran, or other countries do. It is not the same. I will say this though, you DO NOT know what information the government has on you, nor how it affects your life. Nor do you know who has access to that information, who you call, what sites you visit, who all of your family, friends are, what you like to eat, etc, etc. All of this in the wrong hands, could hurt you in some way. As to our government not rounding up people with no due process, uh, have you heard of "Rendition", this is very real and the CIA does it every day. If they even think for a sec you got something they want, they take you and whisk you away to some foreign land to "extract" whatever information they can. This isn't hollywood, this is real, being done to american citizens and those aboard with NO oversight. There are many government programs being run by the NSA, again with little to no oversight, to get as much information, no matter how small, on every single person living in this country. So even if you don't have a red flag, they want everything on you, no matter what it is, why? Power corrupts my friend, you should know that, look how our government run's itself. With no oversight, you do not know what could, or will happen with all of this information nor how many people could be hurt through the process. Don't we learn from mistakes? Everyday innocent people are thrown to prison for crimes they did not do. Yes back in the day it was a joke to say they were all guilty, but now days, all of us know a good number of people behind bars shouldn't be there, never did anything. That line will also be broken if we continue to allow agencies full reign over anything they want. Not a matter of if, but when. |
|
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| Yawn.
There's this key, it's called "Enter." Use it.
As for your post, it is perfectly valid to illustrate how repressive regimes operate and then compare them to what is going on in the USA to conclude that we still have our rights.
When people like you begin to disappear or are otherwise censored on a mass scale, then I will agree that we have have a serious problem.
--
This isn't fair! I was only supposed to hate just ONE presidential candidate! |
|
CableConvert
Premium
join:2003-12-05
Atlanta, GA
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :said by Noah Vail :I have moved from support of my government to defending myself from my government. I think too many people in the USA have no idea what it like to live under a tyrannical, repressive government. I still stand by my view that no one's rights have been violated on a scale major enough to make the claim that we have no rights. It isn't like the government is rounding up all the people in this country who disagree with the government and making them disappear. The government isn't shutting down websites or newspapers critical of it. The government isn't doing anything infringing more than it has in recent years. I don't see any systemic, prolonged violation of our rights under this administration compared to previous administrations. I do think though that the Democrat party, in its neverending quest to secure our defeat, is doing everything it can to embolden our enemies. By putting a stop to the government's ability to wiretap, it enables people who would want to do us harm to use another means of communication to do so. Yet |
|
Kevin Dupuy
join:2007-04-07
Addis, LA
| reply to pnh102
1st: No one is saying US citizens have 'no rights'. And we are lucky and fortunate to live an a mostly free country. Here's the thing: In America, there should be NO way th government should be able to take away any rights, especially those written into the Bill of Rights!
By the way, I've been seeing 'scare-mongering' ads on TV like "THe Senate approved the bill to hear what terrorists are planning. Why hasn't the House? Call your representative and tell them to pass the "Terrorist Surveillances Act". I wanted to call my Rep. and thank him for not approving the spy program, but of course he's retired and we're in the middle of an election for a new one.
--
Because there is no patch for human stupidity. Or my DIRECTV Plus DVR. |
|
amigo_boy
join:2005-07-22
Tempe, AZ
 ·Cox HSI
 ·magicjack.com
 ·EarthLink
| said by Kevin Dupuy :th government should be able to take away any rights, especially those written into the Bill of Rights! The right under discussion is privacy which doesn't exist in the Constitution. It wasn't recognized until 1964 as part of a case involving a woman's right to access birth control, and it was based upon a relatively new concept of imposing the Bill of Rights against state infringement which began around 1924.
The protection against search and seizure only says "unreasonable" searches and seizures. Obviously some are reasonable.
I'm not arguing against privacy or better protections against searches. Just that it's not as simple as some people wish it were.
Mark |
|
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| reply to Kevin Dupuy
said by Kevin Dupuy :By the way, I've been seeing 'scare-mongering' ads on TV like "THe Senate approved the bill to hear what terrorists are planning. What is wrong with the ad? What it says is completely true.
--
This isn't fair! I was only supposed to hate just ONE presidential candidate! |
|
SilentMan
join:2002-07-15
New York, NY
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :said by en102 :What other country have you lived in to experience this ? I don't have to live anywhere else to know. I do however, read about the daily lives of people living in places like the old Soviet bloc, North Korea, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Zimbabwe, Venezuela, and Cuba to know that in the USA, we have it very good. You don't have to pee on an electric fence to know that it is generally a bad idea. Venezuela? You have been watching too much Faux News.
Oh! Millions of energy saving light bulbs have been installed in Venezuelan homes and every single one of them contains a microphone so that the Government can listen in to what people say in their houses. /sarcasm  |
|
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| said by SilentMan :Venezuela? You have been watching too much Faux News. And if you watched any news at all you might not sound like such an idiot when you say that. Perhaps you should try googling for criticisms of Hugo Chavez's human rights record before you spew more verbal diarrhea.
Oh, and I'm adding Bolivia to that list. The fact that 4 eastern states of that country want to secede from the rest of Bolivia is also telling.
--
This isn't fair! I was only supposed to hate just ONE presidential candidate! |
|
ackman
join:2000-10-04
Acworth, GA
·AT&T Southeast
| said by pnh102 :said by SilentMan :Venezuela? You have been watching too much Faux News. And if you watched any news at all you might not sound like such an idiot when you say that. Perhaps you should try googling for criticisms of Hugo Chavez's human rights record before you spew more verbal diarrhea. Oh, and I'm adding Bolivia to that list. The fact that 4 eastern states of that country want to secede from the rest of Bolivia is also telling. Any you're feeling pretty confident in the United States' record on human rights? When did we let women start to vote? How about how we treat people of color? Slavery really wasn't that long ago. More recently, we unilaterally invaded another sovereign country and killed their leader, violating international law. How many hundreds of thousands of people of Iraqis did we kill in that one? Estimates are as high as 1 million and as low as 300,000. I don't think those were all Bush's "terrorists". Oh, and Chavez? Yep, he was giving low cost heating oil to the poor in our country. You might say he was doing it to shove a stick in devil Bush's eye. But the difference between Chavez and Bush is at least Chavez was helping people in the US. Did you know the US has more people in prison than any other country in the world? Let's not even talk about the alleged "terrorists" we have kept in prison without any right to a trial. How about the ones we rendered and tortured, then let go when we found out they were innocent. Yep, we're just a pillar of human rights.
I'm proud to be an American, I'm ashamed and embarrassed of our government. |
|
jc100
join:2002-04-10
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to pnh102
Damn.. there was this site.. hummm that the government shut down in violation of first amendment rights.. Let's see.. Wikileaks... O ya, guess they are targeting people.
Or how about that group... let's see... Peace Fresno, where the government sent a cop to spy on Teachers and Professionals who spoke up against the government. I guess that doesn't constitute targeting everyone?
Ah ya, it must be nice living in your delusional world. Does it come with blanket bliss and ignorance? |
|
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| reply to ackman
said by ackman :Any you're feeling pretty confident in the United States' record on human rights? When did we let women start to vote? How about how we treat people of color? Absolutely. I would never say we are a perfect country, but we do better for people here than just about every other country. Anyone who feels different is free to leave, which unlike the countries I listed, we make very easy to do.
said by ackman :I'm proud to be an American, I'm ashamed and embarrassed of our government. Sure you are. If you are that proud, you would go read up on the facts surrounding the Iraq War as well as Hugo Chavez before you take the Simon Cowell approach to sticking up for "your" country.
--
This isn't fair! I was only supposed to hate just ONE presidential candidate! |
|
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| reply to jc100
said by jc100 :Damn.. there was this site.. hummm that the government shut down in violation of first amendment rights.. Let's see.. Wikileaks... O ya, guess they are targeting people. Ahh yes... and if you actually bothered to read up on the case, it was not the Bush administration that did this, but an idiot judge in California. The ruling was also reversed and the site is back up.
--
This isn't fair! I was only supposed to hate just ONE presidential candidate! |
|
SilentMan
join:2002-07-15
New York, NY
| reply to pnh102
said by pnh102 :said by SilentMan :Venezuela? You have been watching too much Faux News. And if you watched any news at all you might not sound like such an idiot when you say that. Perhaps you should try googling for criticisms of Hugo Chavez's human rights record before you spew more verbal diarrhea. Oh, and I'm adding Bolivia to that list. The fact that 4 eastern states of that country want to secede from the rest of Bolivia is also telling. Watching such news is what makes you write comments so stupid. Unlike you who only watch Faux News or google criticism of Chavez made by ignorants, I go to Venezuela quite often and get involved with the education missions that the Government has instituted there which gives me an opportunity to travel throughout the country teaching people how to read and write; that gives me first hand experience of the Revolutionary process being conducted there. You, on the other hand, know nothing about Chavez or Venezuela or Bolivia (probably can't even find them on a map) except what the ignorants in the corporate press tell you, so you should get educated first before making such illiterate and ridiculous comments about those countries. |
|
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| said by SilentMan :Watching such news is what makes you write comments so stupid. ... I go to Venezuela quite often ... Again, you clearly have no idea what you are talking about regarding Hugo Chavez. I can go to Cuba too and see for myself all the wonderful things that Fidel Castro would want an ignorant westerner to see, and then leave the place thinking that he's God's gift to humanity.
Of course, I know better than that. And until you learn more about Hugo Chavez, then there is no point in you attempting to "school" me with regards to what a nice man he might actually be.
--
This isn't fair! I was only supposed to hate just ONE presidential candidate! |
|
jc100
join:2002-04-10 | reply to pnh102
But peace Fresno WAS the Bush administration... =) |
|
