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FFH
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5

What if pirates don't use the new friendlier BitTorrent S/W?

"In the spirit of openness and fostering innovative
solutions, BitTorrent will take the first step in enhancing our client
applications to optimize them for a new broadband network architecture.
Furthermore, we will publish these optimizations in open forums and
standard bodies for all application developers to benefit from," said
Ashwin Navin, co-founder and president of BitTorrent, Inc.
And what if the pirates don''t use the new friendlier versions of BitTorrent and continue to use versions that don't play nice with the ISPs? What then?
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page


dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18
Click for full size
If I rent this for $0.99, that makes me a pirate?
What about not calling all BT users pirates?
I use BT and it's for LEGAL items...
See pic.

If my friend is playing WoW and there is a patch or update... he's a pirate?
If I want to download the latest Knoppix, I'm "stealing"?

Yeah, you're right... I better stop, huh?
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera


JasonD

@comcast.net
said by dadkins:

....If my friend is playing WoW and there is a patch or update... he's a pirate?
If I want to download the latest Knoppix, I'm "stealing"?...
YES! At minimum it's stealing bandwidth without paying for it, regardless if the content is legal or not. The argument "I already paid for that bandwidth" doesn't fly when it clearly is an extension of someone elses business model.

Even these legal 'content' providers can't expect to use a business model that trounces over someone elses network for free.


dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18

1 recommendation

Stealing bandwidth?
WTF is it that I am paying Comcast for each month then friend?

I am paying for______ to come across that coax.
Now, explain for everyone that reads this... what is coming across that coax that I pay $52.95 each month for.



Are you saying that DSLReports getting requests from me to display this very page is stealing too?
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera

nasadude

join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
reply to FFH
said by FFH:

And what if the pirates don''t use the new friendlier versions of BitTorrent and continue to use versions that don't play nice with the ISPs? What then?
we will obviously have to shut down the internet to save the movie and music industries' archaic business model. It will be a sad day, but clearly well worth it to rid the world of bandwidth hogging, illegal content pirating, thieving, infringing, no-good P2P users.

besides, it will give people more time to spend with their children and play outdoors without the internet to distract them.


FFH
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
said by nasadude:

we will obviously have to shut down the internet to save the movie and music industries' archaic business model. It will be a sad day, but clearly well worth it to rid the world of bandwidth hogging, illegal content pirating, thieving, infringing, no-good P2P users.
Very well put!!
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page


JasonD

@comcast.net

1 recommendation

reply to dadkins
You're not stealing bandwidth. They (the content providers using bt or p2p) are. In fact, you've been duped. They're using you to get free access to your ISP's bandwidth and make a buck.

Think about it.


factchecker

@cox.net
reply to JasonD
said by JasonD :

YES! At minimum it's stealing bandwidth without paying for it, regardless if the content is legal or not. The argument "I already paid for that bandwidth" doesn't fly when it clearly is an extension of someone elses business model.
That argument falls flat when the FACT is presented that EVERYONE on the internet pays for bandwidth. Come back when you've had to purchase bandwidth for corporate environments and a myriad of business users before you talk about "stealing" bandwidth, because such a thing does not exist in the real world.


pokesph
It Is Almost Fast
Premium
join:2001-06-25
Sacramento, CA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Comcast

1 recommendation

reply to dadkins
said by dadkins:

Stealing bandwidth?
WTF is it that I am paying Comcast for each month then friend?

I am paying for______ to come across that coax.
Now, explain for everyone that reads this... what is coming across that coax that I pay $52.95 each month for.



Are you saying that DSLReports getting requests from me to display this very page is stealing too?
EXACTLY!
I pay Comcast to provide me with a connection.. it's up to me how I use it. Period.

nasadude

join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD

2 recommendations

reply to FFH
didn't know you actually wanted to go that far, but what the heck, go for it.

I recommend you to lead the way and stop using the internet for good to show your solidarity with the forces of anti-P2P.


factchecker

@cox.net
reply to JasonD
said by JasonD :

You're not stealing bandwidth. They (the content providers using bt or p2p) are. In fact, you've been duped. They're using you to get free access to your ISP's bandwidth and make a buck.
OKay, JasonD, no one has been duped. Almost everyone who uses BT is aware of how it works. Everyone who uses BT does so willingly, knowing exactly what is going on. To say that people are being duped is false.

Additionally, people are willing to share content in order to get content because, in reality, everyone using the system benefits. The downloads are faster and the content distribution system is more resilient to network interruptions.

Yes, I agree that content providers should be seeding to the cloud themselves, but to say that people are being duped and are getting nothing in return when content providers use BT is false.


Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12
reply to FFH
said by FFH:

"In the spirit of openness and fostering innovative
solutions, BitTorrent will take the first step in enhancing our client
applications to optimize them for a new broadband network architecture.
Furthermore, we will publish these optimizations in open forums and
standard bodies for all application developers to benefit from," said
Ashwin Navin, co-founder and president of BitTorrent, Inc.
And what if the pirates don''t use the new friendlier versions of BitTorrent and continue to use versions that don't play nice with the ISPs? What then?
Pirates WANT to hide. If the cops issue a press release saying they aren't stopping blue cars anymore for traffic violations, the criminals aren't going to drive red cars. They will be the first ones to make a better blue.


funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Yarmouth Port, MA
kudos:6

2 edits
reply to FFH
said by FFH:

And what if the pirates don''t use the new friendlier versions of BitTorrent and continue to use versions that don't play nice with the ISPs? What then?
That's an excellent question.

The current version is not unfriendly. The real question is whether a "smarter" location-aware version provides a better overall experience for P2P users.

IMHO:

I've used BitTorrent DNA. I've also used some of the other emerging features in Vuze and uTorrent. Ninety percent of the time, these features do provide at least the same or better performance for the end-user with no expense to privacy or coexistence with other uses.

"Better" will always win. "The Same" will take longer to adopt, but it does mean that these features that are normally turned off by default in current versions have been tested and can be turned on by default in later releases.

Part of the challenge will be to convince the ISPs that peer data caching will never catch on with users who feel that it may invade upon their privacy. Regardless, it is still a good idea as it will offload a significant portion.

Much of today's P2P traffic is clear to download (example: Open-source software) and much is copyrighted but of little concern of the copyright holder toward enforcement (example: the latest OTA broadcast of the soap-opera "One Life to Live").

Downloaders have got to get over some things, too:

    •The hoarding mentality -- no, you don't need to download every file you can find on a private tracker somewhere. These will always be available. If you're eventually going to use them without paying, you can just download it later.
    •The 1:1 or 100% ratio as a measure of fairness -- no 'sharing' relationship is accounted for so closely as the relationship between file sharers. In Real Life (IRL), sharing relationships are often quite lopsided, with those that have more sharing more.
    •Ignoring copyright does not make it go away. The law has been lobbied and stretched to the point it is broken. Copyright was designed so that Walt Disney (now dead 40 years) could make a living on his creations. Mickey Mouse, now 80 years old, has fifteen years to go before he 'retires' into the public domain. Copyright is a good idea gone bad. Don't ignore it, fix it!

--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
"We don't throttle any traffic," -Charlie Douglas, Comcast spokesman, on this report.

TIGERON

join:2008-03-11
Pacifica, CA
Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service

1 recommendation

reply to JasonD
Explain how is it stealing bandwidth when:

1. Comcast has stated record profits just last year even though their stock is down,
2. At almost $60 a month for each of the 12 million subscribers, Comcast is simply the conduit and it should NOT matter what is being is traveling on their network LEGAL OR NOT. It is not their responsibility to play traffic cop. That is law enforcement's job.
3. If you want to attack Bittorrent and its business model saying that its trouncing on some else's network for free, then you might as well attack iTUNES, Amazon.com (which sells digital downloads of audio and video) the ZUNE store, and many many others out there.


LeftOfSanity
People Suck.

join:2005-11-06
Dover, DE
reply to pokesph
The point being the content providers should provide the servers and bandwith to serve/host their content themselves.


dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18
reply to JasonD
Think about this... FREE content.
No one nowhere is making a cent off of free content.
It's - FREE!

So, me wanting to get this free content, I understand that I have to use my PAID FOR connection to get it.
At some point in time, whomever made this free content, or someone they know, had to have used their PAID FOR connection to upload it to somewhere or someone, right?

I know full well, that when using BT, that if I were to kill uploading, my download would dwindle and maybe even stop.
I know that if my share ratio gets too low, people(other BT users) will boot me and even ban me.
All my life, I have had it pounded into me to "share".
Well, duh!

So you see my friend, no one is "stealing bandwidth".
Peer 1 - 1000 are paying for their connection(that means bandwidth BTW) and are sending me small parts and bits of a LEGAL file I request.
Since I am a nice person, and realize that others might want to see fine women in bikinis, I have NO PROBLEM letting my upload send out the various episodes of MariposaHD...

»www.mariposahd.tv/

"Welcome to the future of television!

mariposaHD is the world's first High Definition TV series distributed directly on the Internet. And it's free. mariposaHD is recorded, edited, and distributed in the full 1920x1080 pixel resolution of the 1080i standard. We distribute mariposaHD using the BitTorrent peer-to-peer software. With a broadband Internet connection, you can download and watch mariposaHD on your PC, your HDTV, or even a video iPod."

.. to ANYONE that happens to request it via the BT protocol.
My shit is paid for, period!
Pretty sure, 99.99999% of the peers I happen to pull from are also paid for connections and they are willing to help make my downloads max out.

Learning is fun!
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera