IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA
| [General] Anyone denied call forwarding on busy from AT&T?
AT&T has been ripping me for years on my 2-line business phone lines. They say only way to roll to 2nd line on busy is their rollover/hunt group at $40/month. Asked to change to feature Call Forwarding on Busy and they said Georgia PSC had tariff laws that restricted them from doing it. Sounds like BS. Anyone heard of this??
Bottom line is that I want out of AT&T phone side, and use AT&T DSL only with VoIP which I have now. I have read all the forums here I can find regarding DSL Direct but it sounds very "iffy" on transferring.
Anyone had a good experience transferring to Direct DSL and how did you accomplish it. Especially the phone number porting.
Thanks |
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Canezoid
join:2001-02-16
Powder Springs, GA
 ·Comcast
| Call forwarding "busy" does not rollover to an open line as your indicating you want, that is a feature related to the voice mail service for residence and business line customers. Open line "hunt" is what your asking for.
As far as DSL direct, if that's what your interested in call into the business office and inquire there. |
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IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA
| reply to IHateATT8
The website states as follow:
Call Forwarding Busy Line
Call Forwarding Busy Line sends calls to voice mail or to another number when your line is busy.
Another number as stated above is where I want the Primary number to ring if the primary is busy. What am I missing here? thanks |
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Canezoid
join:2001-02-16
Powder Springs, GA
·Comcast
| Yes I see>
»smallbusiness.bellsouth.com/ls/c···features
States:
Call Forwarding Busy Line
Call Forwarding Busy Line sends calls to voice mail or to another number when your line is busy.
*This is one of the forwarding features compatible with Voice Mail Service.
You didn't state whether or not you actually have voice mail service? As the asterick and my response state it works in conjunction w/ that.
Not sure about the PSC thing, if it's of real concern for you, I'd just call the Boff back and relay the same question and point to what the website states, says nothing about "not valid" in Georgia, etc.
BTW, how's the butterflies in Pine Mountain, haven't been to Callaway in years.
Peace! |
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IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA
| reply to IHateATT8
Thanks for your input. Butterflies and Azaleas are going strong this time of year at Callaway.
I have requested an opinion from the PSC due to AT&T's attitude toward the whole thing. Simple rollover from line 1 to line 2 is $20/line/month and you have to pay the fee for both lines even when it only rolls one way. That's $40 monthly. Ridiculous.
The voice mail thing is a non issue with me. My Lucent Tech phone system handles that, I do not use AT&T voicemail. The CSR I spoke with agreed it would work, just declined to turn it on after I inquired about the past 8 years of rollover at $40 monthly.
I would still really like anyone's input as to whether Direct DSL has any hangups that is a problem for them.
Thanks again for your input |
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Old_Grouch
Don't just sit there silly DO something
Premium
join:2004-05-26
Greenwood, IN
clubs:
 ·AT&T Midwest
| I didn't feel curious enough to spend much time looking so I took a short-cut to see the other side of the "...ripping me off." contention you made.
While I prefer to read the retail tariff, sometimes the fast way to see what the regulations for a particular service are is to look in the wholesale tariff. The purchase of Bell South hasn't been long enough ago to allow them to fully integrate the tariff into the web site where they (at&t) maintain others.
Generally, the service they wholesale needs to be under rules similar to what they offer to retail users of their service. Fairness you know.
The part of the wholesale tariff covering call forwarding busy does show what the rules are and why you can not get the service under the description you offered in your original post.
You are welcome to look at the page I'm quoting from and it is found Here.
Or trust that I didn't fudge on the copy 'n paste and just take the following as the reason you can not have what you want:
Call Forwarding Busy Line
Description
Call Forwarding Busy Line (CFBL) is a central office feature which automatically forwards calls to a preselected telephone number on a different premise when the called telephone number is busy. May be used to forward calls in connection with Voice Message Service.
The tariff seems to require the forwarded-to number to be on a different premises. As such, the service representative was close to correct when (s)he said there were tariff laws that restricted it...the explanation should have been that the tariff approved by and on file with the PSC restricts the service to forward to any number at a different premises.
Your request, if I understand it, would break the rotary strap (old-speak) on your two lines and use call forwarding - busy to forward from your first line to a second line on the same premises.
If you follow the link you will find a number of charts or examples of how the service restrictions are applied to various scenarios.
Find one that fits the requirements under which the service is offered and I am fairly sure they'd sell it to you.
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At Team Discovery we know how to get more outta that danged 'puter of yours!
If you paid taxes it's a rebate. If you didn't, it's welfare. |
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IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA
| reply to IHateATT8
Hey, thanks that's 100% better than the answer I got from Bellsouth rep directly. You got me interested though, so I took a look at other published tariffs around the country. This AT&T wholesale post you provided is the only one that uses the language "on a different premise" when searching for Call Forward Busy Line features.
You seem to be knowledgeable on the subject. Is it reasonable to use a hunt group for simply a 2-line system and charge such extraordinary amount when a simple call feature could do the same thing? How is that justified by the tariff law? Any opinion?
I have asked the PSC for an opinion also. I will post the reply for all when I get it. Thanks |
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Old_Grouch
Don't just sit there silly DO something
Premium
join:2004-05-26
Greenwood, IN
clubs:
·AT&T Midwest
| [begin soap box]
Reasonable doesn't matter. It is what the tariff calls for and the tariff is approved by the PSC. Therefore, it is what it is. You won't get the PSC to offer an opinion that they approved something "unfair"...ain't gonna happen.
Lines that work in rotary are priced at $x whether you use two or whatever number (bigger numbers will draw discounts but I'm talking smaller here). If you break the rotary or hunt group relationship of the lines, their individual prices usually are quite different (less).
Is the price reasonable? You pay it don't you? If you use it that little, maybe you should have two lines and voice mail on both but not have them work in rotary or look for something on the market that would take your two individual lines and bridge them on the premises (by the way, they incorrectly say premise in the tariff). If there is something as an alternative...go for it. If there isn't, keep what you've got and pay the man.
Tariffs evolve. As different services come out, they are individually tariffed. There are different services that do a same thing but do it differently....the marketeers know that and suffer some cross-elasticity when they bring new junk to the table (xxx people will buy but a percent of them will abandon another of "our" product to buy it). Some of the way they try to maintain revenue streams is with rules that nudge buying decisions or provisioning decisions one way or the other.
Legal? It's business or capitalism 1-0-1.
Your challenge is to find a way to get the service you want at a price that doesn't annoy you and send you to places like this.
Keep in mind that the service reps you call are trying to change and be the same. They are wrestling with tariffs that are being normalized across too many jurisdictions. Sometimes their explanation could be confusing because what they are doing is confusing. They do not wake each morning asking themselves what they can do to screw-up your life.
I might sound knowledgeable on the subject but be careful of that too. I used to be a service representative...I trained service representatives and I managed business offices before I fell through the secret door into I/T. BUT, I retired from the mess eight years ago.
Understanding is knowing where the rules are and being able to read them. Nothing more. You just needed to know where to go read.
[end soap box]
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At Team Discovery we know how to get more outta that danged 'puter of yours!
If you paid taxes it's a rebate. If you didn't, it's welfare. |
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IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA
| reply to IHateATT8
Thanks again. I wish I had gotten you on the phone years ago instead. I appreciate your candidness. I am going to find a solution that fits my needs. I may switch to a single line from Maw Bell and have that single line go to my VoIP system which would solve my problems anyway. And save a bunch of money. I think I will give it a test run for a month or two before I cut the second line loose. VoIP has it skeletons also.
Enjoy retirement...ain't there yet.. |
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Mizzat
Will post for thumbs
Premium
join:2003-05-03
Atlanta, GA | reply to IHateATT8
Did you ask if there are promotions where you can get the hunting included or for free?
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-M |
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IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA
| Yes, I asked all the questions regarding promotions, over and over, with multiple reps for AT&T. The only way to get group hunting (rollover) waived is to get at least 3 lines or more and then they waive the fees. And yes that still costs more than I pay now, which is too much.
I think everyone interested should go to the Bellsouth website for small business:
»smallbusiness.bellsouth.com/ls/c···oice.asp
and tell me why you can not get call forwarding to another number at the same premise with just the features that are included in the plan. Its the same thing as hunting/rollover when you have only 2 lines. Remember hunting on 2 lines is $40/month.
Anyone who can tell me why it won't work without quoting from another entirely different website would get a "hats off" to them thanks from me. I have been told it is against the law. I have been told it will not work without voicemail. I have been told you can not forward a number to the same premise. Well read the information provided on their site, and particularly read the help and instructions on how to make it activate call forwarding.
If it doesn't work, then whatever happened to false advertising? Any other comments welcome. I still hate AT&T. No change in opinion yet. |
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NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
Murfreesboro, TN
 ·Vonage
·AT&T Southeast
 ·Cingular Wireless
·AT&T CallVantage
1 edit | Your situation is not clear to me.
Do you currently have the Complete Choice® for Business plan and AT&T is refusing to activate the Call Forwarding Busy Line feature?
Are you trying to change to the Complete Choice® for Business plan in order to be able to use the Call Forwarding Busy Line feature, and AT&T is refusing to change your plan?
Are you trying to replace an existing stand-alone hunt group feature with a stand-alone Call Forwarding Busy Line feature?
The above three scenarios would be covered by different tariffs. In the past I have had the Complete Choice® for Business plan and I was able to use the Call Forwarding Busy Line feature to transfer to a second phone in the same location, and the second phone was setup to forward to voice mail if no answer or busy. I don't live in GA, so the TN tariffs would be different, and this was also several years ago, but the problem may lie with the method rather than the final result.
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We can never have enough of nature.
We need to witness our own limits transgressed, and some life pasturing freely where we never wander.
Test your firewall. |
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jtudor
Xm 60's On 6 Freak
Premium,MVM
join:2002-12-07
Morganton, NC
| reply to IHateATT8
said by IHateATT8  :Anyone who can tell me why it won't work without quoting from another entirely different website would get a "hats off" to them thanks from me. I have been told it is against the law. I have been told it will not work without voicemail. I have been told you can not forward a number to the same premise. Well read the information provided on their site, and particularly read the help and instructions on how to make it activate call forwarding. This is just my opinion because this has jumped on one of my "pet peeves". That is say what you mean and mean what you say. Don't tell me you can't do something when you really mean you won't.
The solution you want will technically work. There is no reason "technically" that the switch cannot be programmed to do as you wish, in reality, it already is. AT&T could offer you the service but they have basically chosen not to offer it. If they wanted to offer the service you want to their customer, then they would file a request with the PSC asking for permission to offer the service an most likely the tariff would be set up so they could sell you what you want.
AT&T most likely prefers things just as they are now because they make more profit from this way of doing things. It's the way most business work these days, they do things in whatever way maximizes their profits.
Good luck with a solution.
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Best of luck
"Do, or Do not, there is no try!" Yoda
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IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA
| reply to IHateATT8
Reply to Netfixer and all:
This is as clear as I can make it:
I have and have had for 8 years Complete Choice for Business 2 lines with unlimited long distance and hunt group rollover from the primary number to a secondary number on my 2-line phone system at my premise in Georgia. I do not use or need Bellsouth voice messaging (voicemail)since my Lucent Partner phone system handles the voice mail. I assume I have all the included call forwarding features mentioned on the Bellsouth website listed in my last post.I just do not use them.
My needs are very simple. As stated to Bellsouth many times: I need 2 lines, the primary published number needs to roll (transfer) to the second non-published number (that I also use as an auto-FAX number) if the primary number is BUSY. That is it...that's all I need.
Bellsouth's position is simple also: The only way to save any money is to get 3 lines with Complete Choice and then they do not charge anything for hunt group and that would save a little over 2 lines with hunt group where they charge $40 month for the hunt group feature.
My 36 month contract is coming up for renewal this month. I have been contacted by at least three independent agents selling for AT&T. All say the same the thing above and try to sell me 3 lines.
I have contacted AT&T directly 2 times in the last 2 weeks myself. I have stated my needs as simply as above. They have told me 2 different stories.
I was told initially that they would turn on the Call Forward Busy Line feature and forward to my 2nd number at my premise when I complained enough about the hunt group cost. They put me on hold said they tried it and said OK, its implemented and they would drop the $40 month hunt group feature in lew of a free feature that my package already had. Great...until I asked to speak with a super. about the fact that they had been charging me for 8 years for something that I had stated I did not need. The rep then went on hold and came back and said she was sorry that she was incorrect, she could not offer me the feature of Call Forward Busy Line at all, that it was against the tariff laws in Georgia to forward the first line to the second line via Call Forward and that she was reinstating my hunt group feature to get the primary line to roll to the second as it was. I complained, she said sorry, it was out of AT&T's hands.
Now the second call to AT&T. I stated the same things and told the gentlemen the story above. He researched and said that in reality, the reason Call Forward Busy Line would not work was that it is a feature of VOICE MESSAGING and would not work without voice messaging activated, which I do not need, but do not care if activated as long as my internal system picks up the calls before Bell did. He said the only way, AGAIN, to get out of the hunt group fees was to go to a 3 line Complete Choice package, which is only a little less than I am paying now. So in essence, the same thing in the end...no call forwarding on busy without hunt group.
If you just act plain dumb and just read the English on the Bellsouth web for small business. It is in plain language of the benefits of Call Forwarding to a second number that they say is of your chosing. On premise or not on premise is not stated or denied. They even go on to make statements of use like and I quote "Callers are sent to the number you specified and assign a co-worker to answer incoming calls when you’re in a meeting". Well where the %($& do you think that co-worker is located, across the street in a phone booth... give me a break... they are in the same premise...exactly where AT&T says they can not by law forward the second line to.
OK, lets see now, potential false advertising, potential fraud, unfair charging practices based on advertised pricing....I should have had a V-8 this morning...no I should have contacted that class action attorney I saw on TV early this morning looking for something to do!!! Maybe I should start a complaint list here.
Help me here guys and tell me where I am wrong??
Thanks for the forum and interest. I a just a fair, poor, small business owner trying to save a buck with AT&T. Wow, does that sound like an oxymorone or what??? |
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brandon
Some truth included in this post.
Premium
join:2003-03-31
Hurley, MS
1 edit | reply to IHateATT8
Have you ever thought of a PBX? Perhaps a lot for two lines, but then again, it's a one-time investment. |
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Mizzat
Will post for thumbs
Premium
join:2003-05-03
Atlanta, GA | reply to IHateATT8
What discount are you getting on your current term? There are discount agreements that waive hunt charges, but the max discount on those is 25%. |
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IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA
| reply to IHateATT8
The problem as it stands today is that Bellsouth (AT&T) says that when utilizing the feature Call Forward Busy Line the feature only works with Voice Messaging and will not forward to any live number either on the premises or off, only to voice mail. This is hard to believe when the Bellsouth web says:
Provide callers with a live person or your voice mail message instead of a busy signal
• Callers automatically sent to the number you specified
• Perfect for businesses with multiple employees answering the phone
• Never miss an important call again
• Customer Control of Call Forwarding Busy Line
• Activate and disable your Call Forwarding Busy Line feature
• Choose when your callers will be sent to a specified number
• Works in tandem with Call Forwarding Busy Line (see above)
• Give your business the flexibility of routing calls when and where you want
Anyone out there every utilized the feature Call Forward Busy Line and made it work??
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Mizzat
Will post for thumbs
Premium
join:2003-05-03
Atlanta, GA
·AT&T Southeast
| said by IHateATT8 :Anyone out there every utilized the feature Call Forward Busy Line and made it work?? Yes, I had it go to my cell phone. I also had Call Forwarding No answer at the same time doing the same thing. |
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IHateATT8
join:2008-03-29
Pine Mountain, GA | reply to IHateATT8
Mizzat:
Since tariffs can be a little, could you tell me if you were forwarding on busy a business line or a residential line?
Thanks |
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Mizzat
Will post for thumbs
Premium
join:2003-05-03
Atlanta, GA | reply to IHateATT8
I was on a residential line, but I've seen it done on a business line.
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-M |
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