how-to block ads
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| reply to Tetchy
Re: Do I understand this correctly? Hope it's okay if I jump in here for a second? Here are a few answers, and more is available on www.webwise.com and www.phorm.com, and you can ask questions directly on our blogs there if you like.
said by Tetchy :
every HTTP requests is countered with a redirect onto Phorms domain, then redirected back to the actual domain, before the request gets sent to the target website.
Nope - Roughly 99% of the stream is untouched, with no redirect at all.
said by Tetchy :
so if I'm searching for an engagement ring and my partner then uses my computer, she may be bombarded with adverts for weddings
That assumes you're only ever looking at wedding pages, and that every site you and your partner go to are partners in the OIX so an ad could be delivered. In reality, each user would have scores of potential advertising category matches, and then, there are all the irrelevant ads that you would see that don't come from the OIX. And anyway - if you think you're being bombarded with irrelevant ads now, wouldn't it be better to get relevant ones with NO DATA leaking your privacy all over the internet?
said by Tetchy :
opt-out is by setting a cookie on your browser, but you still need to be redirected via Phorm's servers to read the value of the opt-out cookie! Also the cookie could be wiped if you have a monthly clean-out like I do. Then you'd be opted back in.
second part is true, but concerned people who delete cookies can simply set webwise.net as a blocked cookie in their browser, and they will never be opted back in or seen by any Phorm server. First part is definitely not true - if you're opted out, either by Opt Out cookie or by blocking the cookie, the ISP-located (not Phorm in any case) server ignores the computer altogether. No data is ever analyzed or passed to Phorm if you're opted out.
said by Tetchy :
what if a rogue employee or a hacker got in? Clearly, somebody's not reading up on the product and just reading the misinformation out there, or is worried that Phorm is like all the search companies out there storing your search history for years. Anyone who hacked in and stole the entire database would get random numbers associated with Advertising Categories and timestamps. Nothing personal, no IP addresses, nothing to identify the user or sensitive product categories (that's right, you can't actually have a category for adult or gambling or medical, etc.). Here's an answer from the CEO himself:
»www.phorm.com/videos/Is_the_data···ked.html | |
| Hello Phorm Comms.
Some facts:
Internet browsers only return cookies to the original domain.
To retrieve the webwise.com "opt-out" cookie, Phorm hijack every EVERY SINGLE WEB REQUEST to trick the browser into temporarily thinking that the request comes from webwise.com.
This is the basis of Phorm's technology.
This hijack happens even if you "opt out".
How certain are you that this is not warrantless interception and therefore in breach of RIPA? | |
| reply to Phorm Comms
said by Phorm Comms :
Hope it's okay if I jump in here for a second?
Hi Comms Team - thought you'd pop up.
said by Phorm Comms :said by Tetchy :
every HTTP requests is countered with a redirect onto Phorms domain, then redirected back to the actual domain, before the request gets sent to the target website.
Nope - Roughly 99% of the stream is untouched, with no redirect at all. Thats interesting. So you only watch 1% of my browsing? Not what Virasb Vahidi said in the NY Times:
»www.nytimes.com/2008/03/20/busin···f=slogin
“As you browse, we’re able to categorize all of your Internet actions,” said Virasb Vahidi, the chief operating officer of Phorm. “We actually can see the entire Internet.”
said by Phorm Comms :said by Tetchy :
opt-out is by setting a cookie on your browser, but you still need to be redirected via Phorm's servers to read the value of the opt-out cookie! Also the cookie could be wiped if you have a monthly clean-out like I do. Then you'd be opted back in.
second part is true, but concerned people who delete cookies can simply set webwise.net as a blocked cookie in their browser, and they will never be opted back in or seen by any Phorm server. First part is definitely not true - if you're opted out, either by Opt Out cookie or by blocking the cookie, the ISP-located (not Phorm in any case) server ignores the computer altogether. No data is ever analyzed or passed to Phorm if you're opted out. But the redirects to the Phorm server just to read the cookie take a finite time. So even if you opt out, you've still got the system messing with your connection.
said by Phorm Comms :said by Tetchy :
what if a rogue employee or a hacker got in? Clearly, somebody's not reading up on the product and just reading the misinformation out there, or is worried that Phorm is like all the search companies out there storing your search history for years. Anyone who hacked in and stole the entire database would get random numbers associated with Advertising Categories and timestamps. Nothing personal, no IP addresses, nothing to identify the user or sensitive product categories (that's right, you can't actually have a category for adult or gambling or medical, etc.). Here's an answer from the CEO himself: » www.phorm.com/videos/Is_the_data···ked.html You just don't get it, do you? What you say is true, but what I as a software security professional am concerned with is what if someone ALTERS the phorm software? The Phorm system is so invasive, it sits there at the heart of the ISP and is a basic security risk. In the UK it's illegal under RIPA, according to respected academic think tank FIPR. Did someone at their ISP fail in their due dilligence? I can't speak for the states but you're not wanted in the UK.
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| reply to clanger9
quote:
I can't speak for the states but you're not wanted in the UK.
Since only very small ISPs are using such service over here, nobody has been ringing many alarm bells...yet...that will change once a major carrier signs up.
The main behavioral ad outfit over here (NebuAD) doesn't have the shady spyware/rootkit history, and they're not trying to insult user intelligence by pretending their product is an anti-phishing service. | |
| reply to Phorm Comms
said by Tetchy :
opt-out is by setting a cookie on your browser, but you still need to be redirected via Phorm's servers to read the value of the opt-out cookie! Also the cookie could be wiped if you have a monthly clean-out like I do. Then you'd be opted back in.
said by Phorm Comms :
second part is true, but concerned people who delete cookies can simply set webwise.net as a blocked cookie in their browser, and they will never be opted back in or seen by any Phorm server. First part is definitely not true - if you're opted out, either by Opt Out cookie or by blocking the cookie, the ISP-located (not Phorm in any case) server ignores the computer altogether. No data is ever analyzed or passed to Phorm if you're opted out.
First part definitely IS true, contrary to the assertion by Phorm Comms. Please check your facts.
A browser will ONLY return the webwise.com cookie if it thinks it is visiting webwise.com. To get the opt in/out status, Phorm uses a redirect trick to fool the browser into thinking it is visiting webwise.com (regardless of the final destination). So redirection is carried out on *every single request*, regardless of whether you opt in or out.
You are also being extremely dishonest by claiming that the "ISP-located server" is not a Phorm server. Of course it is! It's supplied by Phorm, it runs software written by Phorm, it's maintained by Phorm and exists solely to provide profiling data to the Phorm network. Peeling the "Phorm" label off does not change this. | |
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