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KickMe
join:2001-10-03
Lancaster, OH
 ·RoadRunner Cable
·Earthlink Cable Mo..
| [Rant] Pseudoephedrine First, I'm not a meth dealer or user, in fact I don't smoke, drink or like taking any medication.
I do however have horrible allergies and sinus headaches and the ONLY medication I have found that gives me relief is pseudoephedrine (sudafed).
First they moved this med behind the counter and made me sign for it and show my drivers license, and that was fine. Then they started limiting the amount I could purchase at one time and although inconvenient it was okay too. Now they tell me at three pharmacies that they can only give me what amounts to a four day supply in any 30 day period.
I bitched and moaned everywhere about this and was told by the pharmacists that it was a federal regulation. I called B.S. at one store and the pharmacist held fast and stated that they would probably eventually make it an illegal drug. However I cannot find anything online to confirm what I am being told, in fact it looks to me like this is just store policy.
In addition, in the past I have discussed my sinus problems with my doctor and he has given me prescriptions for many meds that just were not very effective or had side effects. At one point I was told that sinus surgery was an option but it was temporary relief as the problem would reoccur.
I hope everyone of these SOB store policy makers gets a painful health problem and is unable to find relief! | |
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Rob
In Deo speramus, God Bless the USA
Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
·Comcast
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine quote:
The United States Congress has recognized the use of pseudoephedrine in the illicit manufacture of methamphetamine. In late 2005, the Committee on Education and the Workforce heard testimony concerning education programs and state legislation designed to curb the use and manufacture of methamphetamine with pseudoephedrine-containing products. State laws in Oregon and Kansas were particularly influential in the proposed legislation.[citation needed] The House passed the Combat Methamphetamine Epidemic Act of 2005 ("CMEA") as an amendment to the renewal of the Patriot Act. Signed into law by president George W. Bush on March 6, 2006, the act amended the US Code (21 USC 830) concerning the sale of pseudoephedrine-containing products. The Federal statute included the following requirements for merchants ("regulated seller") who sell these products (pseudoephedrine is defined as a "scheduled listed chemical product under 21 USC 802(45(A)):
* A retrievable record of all purchases identifying the name and address of each party to be kept for two years.
* Required verification of proof of identity of all purchasers
* Required protection and disclosure methods in the collection of personal information
* Reports to the Attorney General of any suspicious payments or disappearances of the regulated products
* Required training of employees with regard to the requirements of the CMEA; Retailer must self-certify as to training and compliance
* Non-liquid dose form of regulated product may only be sold in unit dose blister packs
* Regulated products are to be stored behind the counter or in a locked cabinet in such a way as to restrict public access
* Daily sales of regulated products not to exceed 3.6 grams without regard to the number of transactions
* 30 day (not monthly) sales limit not to exceed 7.5 grams if sold by mail-order or "mobile retail vendor"
* 30 day PURCHASE limit not to exceed 9 grams of pseudoephedrine base in regulated products (misdemeanor possession offense under 21 USC 844a for the individual who buys it)
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudoephedrine
Seems like you should be blaming our wonderful Congress.
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KickMe
join:2001-10-03
Lancaster, OH
·RoadRunner Cable
·Earthlink Cable Mo..
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Rob  :Seems like you should be blaming our wonderful Congress. Don't know how I missed wiki in the google search.
But all these stores would sell is 48 of the 30 mg in a 30 day period or 1.44 grams, far under fed law, so it is just store policy.
said by craig70130 :Your doctor can prescribe pseudoephedrine for you and those restrictions will be bypassed. Thanks for the heads up as I was concerned due to what the last pharmacist said, that they were just going to stop manufacture and make it an illegal substance. | |
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Duchess44
Premium
join:2001-10-24
Chattanooga, TN | Here in TN ,they are now asking for your DOB when you purchase things like Nyquil... | |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
 ·North State Commun..
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Duchess44 :Here in TN ,they are now asking for your DOB when you purchase things like Nyquil... Yep, I purchased Nyquil at Harris Teeter when I had the flu and I was carded ... just like I was buying alcohol. | |
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Nigh Quil
@totalink.net
| said by Duchess44 :Here in TN ,they are now asking for your DOB when you purchase things like Nyquil... I'll bite: is there an actual rationale given for their putting your tits through the wringer when buying cold medicine now?
I mean, is Nyquil-guzzling the latest Officially Recognized Problem? If so, the people doing it must be pretty hard up for a fix of some kind. I haven't taken Nyquil in years, but I recall it wasn't the most pleasant-tasting substance. | |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Nigh Quil :said by Duchess44 :Here in TN ,they are now asking for your DOB when you purchase things like Nyquil... I'll bite: is there an actual rationale given for their putting your tits through the wringer when buying cold medicine now? I mean, is Nyquil-guzzling the latest Officially Recognized Problem? If so, the people doing it must be pretty hard up for a fix of some kind. I haven't taken Nyquil in years, but I recall it wasn't the most pleasant-tasting substance. Nyquil has one of the most powerful hypnotics known to man in it, and it also used to have Pseudoephedrine. They changed the formula now though and you have to buy Nyquil D to get what used to be the original Nyquil. The new stuff doesn't work nearly as well.
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NyQuil#Reformulation
I agree with what they say about phenylephrine being nothing more than a placebo. When I had the flu, I kept wondering why Nyquil wasn't doing a damn thing for my runny nose like it used to. When I researched why my Claritin D (taken in desperation one night during said flu episode so I could get some sleep) worked and Nyquil didn't, I found out about the reformulation. | |
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cvrefugee
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Corona, CA
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Matt :I agree with what they say about phenylephrine being nothing more than a placebo. When I had the flu, I kept wondering why Nyquil wasn't doing a damn thing for my runny nose like it used to. When I researched why my Claritin D (taken in desperation one night during said flu episode so I could get some sleep) worked and Nyquil didn't, I found out about the reformulation. Why would you take a decongestant for a runny nose? You should take an anti-histamine. Also, Claritin D would not allow you to sleep because the psuedoephedrine would keep you awake (it is a stimulant). You should have taken Benadryl if you wanted to fall asleep and dry up your runny nose. | |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by cvrefugee :said by Matt :I agree with what they say about phenylephrine being nothing more than a placebo. When I had the flu, I kept wondering why Nyquil wasn't doing a damn thing for my runny nose like it used to. When I researched why my Claritin D (taken in desperation one night during said flu episode so I could get some sleep) worked and Nyquil didn't, I found out about the reformulation. Why would you take a decongestant for a runny nose? You should take an anti-histamine. Also, Claritin D would not allow you to sleep because the psuedoephedrine would keep you awake (it is a stimulant). You should have taken Benadryl if you wanted to fall asleep and dry up your runny nose. I was so tired I didn't care about the stimulant, but I kept "almost" falling asleep and waking up gasping because I couldn't breath through my nose.
I'm not sure why, but the Claritin D worked and dried my nose up so I could sleep.
I'll remember the Benadryl tip the next time I need something to clear up a runny nose because I hate the way Claritin D makes me feel. | |
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CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County
| said by Matt :said by Nigh Quil :said by Duchess44 :Here in TN ,they are now asking for your DOB when you purchase things like Nyquil... I'll bite: is there an actual rationale given for their putting your tits through the wringer when buying cold medicine now? I mean, is Nyquil-guzzling the latest Officially Recognized Problem? If so, the people doing it must be pretty hard up for a fix of some kind. I haven't taken Nyquil in years, but I recall it wasn't the most pleasant-tasting substance. Nyquil has one of the most powerful hypnotics known to man in it, and it also used to have Pseudoephedrine. They changed the formula now though and you have to buy Nyquil D to get what used to be the original Nyquil. The new stuff doesn't work nearly as well. Doesn't Nyquil have a lot of alcohol as well? drunks and kids under the legal age can buy Nyquil and Listerine and drink it fast to get a buzz (drunk).
quote:
Allegra-D = antihistamime + Sudafed (pseudoephedrine)
claritin-D is the same as well. Any of the allergy medications that have the -D uses Sudafed.
I loved Seldane when it was available... | |
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craig70130
Premium
join:2004-04-27
New Orleans, LA | Your doctor can prescribe pseudoephedrine for you and those restrictions will be bypassed. | |
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cvrefugee
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Corona, CA
1 edit | It's not the store's fault, they're just complying with the law. | |
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craig70130
Premium
join:2004-04-27
New Orleans, LA | Let's see, if you take the maximum recommended dose, every day for an entire month, you are still under 8 grams. The legal limit is 9 grams. If you are taking more than that, your doctor definitely should be involved. | |
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Jim Gurd
Premium
join:2000-07-08
Plymouth, MI
·Comcast
| I've said this before but it bears repeating. You are collateral damage in the "war" on drugs. I call it the war on freedom.
If people want to kill themselves with meth that's their problem and their choice to suffer the consequences. It isn't the government's responsibility to protect people from their own foolishness.
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Calling an illegal alien an undocumented worker is like calling a crack dealer an unlicensed pharmacist. | |
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tower29
Premium
join:2002-02-12
Loveland, CO
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine I have my wife buy some at the same time. She does not use it so it saves having to go pick up more every two weeks or so. You can still buy it on line though without the limitation. Google is a wonderful tool for that. And of course the meth heads know that too. | |
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MadMANN
Premium
join:2005-08-19
·Comcast
| said by Jim Gurd :If people want to kill themselves with meth that's their problem and their choice to suffer the consequences. It isn't the government's responsibility to protect people from their own foolishness. I agree with you in that the war on drugs is a waste of money and resources.
However, with meth, it isn't just about people killing themselves with the drug. The people who manufacture the drugs often do so in places close to where other people reside, which endangers the lives of anyone within a few blocks of them. A home meth lab is a very toxic environment and can cause a chemical explosion that can poison the air and potentially kill any man, woman, or child around.
There was a meth lab discovered nearby to me in a motel and the HazMat team was quoted as saying that they couldn't believe that the motel wasn't a pile of rubble because of the way the chemicals were stored and handled. I don't know about you, but that is a scary thought to me.
All that said, it is a sad day when you can't go to the pharmacy to get medicine that works well for your allergies because of the few that use it in ways that for which it was not intended. However, there are many prescription and non-prescription alternatives to Pseudoephedrine these days that tend to work just as well or better without the speed. It's kind of like when they took morphine off the shelves back in the day. There were people who said, "But it worked so well! Why do I have to suffer for it?". . . .Er, cause taking Morphine for a headache is like using dynamite to get rid of a bees nest? | |
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Jim Gurd
Premium
join:2000-07-08
Plymouth, MI
·Comcast
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by MadMANN :A home meth lab is a very toxic environment and can cause a chemical explosion that can poison the air and potentially kill any man, woman, or child around. Yes, but if it was legal then it could be made openly in a factory with proper precautions taken and procedures for disposing of the hazardous waste. The very fact that it is illegal is contributing to the dangerous conditions you list.
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Calling an illegal alien an undocumented worker is like calling a crack dealer an unlicensed pharmacist. | |
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MadMANN
Premium
join:2005-08-19
·Comcast
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine No, the people who break the law are the ones who create the dangerous conditions. You can't blame the law for those who break it.
Are we going to blame the violence that individuals commit for drugs on the fact that it was illegal to begin with? If so, then we are telling people that they are not responsible for their own actions.
The fact is, is that crack is illegal. The act of ingesting it is an individual choice, knowing that it is illegal and that it is potentially dangerous. Yet, if some addict kills someone to get money for it, the blame doesn't fall on the law for making it illegal in my eyes. | |
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cvrefugee
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Corona, CA
| said by Jim Gurd :Yes, but if it was legal then it could be made openly in a factory with proper precautions taken and procedures for disposing of the hazardous waste. The very fact that it is illegal is contributing to the dangerous conditions you list. That's the worse exercise in logic I've ever seen. You want the creation of methamphetamine to be legal? Why? For what purpose? So you can get your psuedoephedrine fix without hassle at the pharmacy? | |
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Jim Gurd
Premium
join:2000-07-08
Plymouth, MI
·Comcast
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by cvrefugee :said by Jim Gurd :Yes, but if it was legal then it could be made openly in a factory with proper precautions taken and procedures for disposing of the hazardous waste. The very fact that it is illegal is contributing to the dangerous conditions you list. That's the worse exercise in logic I've ever seen. You want the creation of methamphetamine to be legal? Why? For what purpose? So you can get your psuedoephedrine fix without hassle at the pharmacy? I think all drugs should be legal. If people want to kill themselves then let them. Punish them only when they infringe on the rights of others.
»www.lp.org/issues/platform_all.shtml#drugwar
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Calling an illegal alien an undocumented worker is like calling a crack dealer an unlicensed pharmacist. | |
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footballdude
Premium
join:2002-08-13
Imperial, MO
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Jim Gurd :I think all drugs should be legal. If people want to kill themselves then let them. Before you could implement a policy like that, you'd have to completely disconnect these 'victims' from the government welfare and health care system. Otherwise they'll just sit around getting high all the time and expect Uncle Sam to pay their bills. Then call an ambulance every time they get the jitters.
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What's certain about Darwinism is that it would take less time for (1) a single-celled organism to evolve into a human being through mutation and natural selection than for (2) Darwinists to admit they have no proof of (1) - Ann Coulter | |
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Jim Gurd
Premium
join:2000-07-08
Plymouth, MI
·Comcast
1 edit | Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by footballdude :Before you could implement a policy like that, you'd have to completely disconnect these 'victims' from the government welfare and health care system. I agree with that 100%. I'm opposed to welfare, both individual and corporate.
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Calling an illegal alien an undocumented worker is like calling a crack dealer an unlicensed pharmacist. | |
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Pseudo Effndream
@247realmedia.com
| said by footballdude :said by Jim Gurd :I think all drugs should be legal. If people want to kill themselves then let them. Before you could implement a policy like that, you'd have to completely disconnect these 'victims' from the government welfare and health care system. Otherwise they'll just sit around getting high all the time and expect Uncle Sam to pay their bills. Then call an ambulance every time they get the jitters. You've hit the nail right on the head there.
As near as I can figure it, the problem is really twofold:
1) The State has largely replaced the family as the guiding force in people's lives and
2) America has changed from a culture of self-reliance to a culture of entitlement (i.e. people feel they have a "right" to health care and other services that are paid for by money taken from other people).
Every time someone brings up socialized medicine, and what a "good idea" it is, I simply head to the nearest grocery store. I do this in order to get an idea of how people are currently taking care of themselves before I am allowed the "privilege" of paying for their health care (and vice-versa).
There, I can easily find people who are (no offense) nearly as wide as the aisle they're pushing their shopping cart down. If you think I'm exaggerating, I invite you to pay a visit to your own local grocery store, where chances are good you will see the exact same thing.
And while I respect the "right" of someone to live however they want, and stuff their body with the Junk of the Month, (be it Twinkies, BLTs, heroin, or what-have-you) I hope that they, in turn, will respect my right not to have to pay for their poor choices and lack of judgment.
The kicker here is that I really don't blame the people pushing those jam-packed shopping carts filled with frozen pizzas, microwave food, etc. Because I'm under the impression that these folks, for the most part, just don't know any better, and were never taught by their parents how to eat properly and take care of themselves.
Be that as it may, I also don't feel it's right for these same folks to ask me to pay for their mistakes. The problem is that things like welfare and health care now come under the heading of "entitlements," and anyone who talks about how wrong it is to socialize the cost of one's poor choices is dismissed out of hand as some sort of crank.
Well, that's fair enough, I suppose. But this crank can't help but notice that things like obesity did not become "epidemics" until relatively recently. That is, people were expected to bear the cost of taking care of their own bodies and not have someone else (i.e. the State) do it for them for "free."
Everyone talks about how America is no longer a free country, but perhaps we're simply getting what we've asked for (and deserve). We seem to be fond of talking about "freedom" a lot, but I rarely hear folks talk about the corollary to freedom: responsibility. I guess the government is supposed to take care of that part for us.
I realize I'm starting to sound like my granddad, so I'll stop now. | |
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tapeloop
1959. I try to kick the ball. I miss.
Premium
join:2004-06-27
Airstrip One | Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine You forgot to throw the terrorists, illegal immigrants, Hollywood and the liberal media in there chief. | |
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Da Chief
@247realmedia.com
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by tapeloop :You forgot to throw the terrorists, illegal immigrants, Hollywood and the liberal media in there chief. Perhaps that's because none of those things you mention has anything even remotely to do with Americans who feel they're automatically entitled to be treated like adults, yet insist on behaving exactly as children do (by expecting someone else to step in and clean up their messes for them).
Of course, living in Airstrip One, I expect you know all about that as well, eh? It would be snobbish of me to insist that we in the US have a lock on that kind of behaviour (more's the pity). | |
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tapeloop
1959. I try to kick the ball. I miss.
Premium
join:2004-06-27
Airstrip One
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Da Chief :
Perhaps that's because none of those things you mention has anything even remotely to do with Americans who feel they're automatically entitled to be treated like adults, yet insist on behaving exactly as children do (by expecting someone else to step in and clean up their messes for them).
Of course, living in Airstrip One, I expect you know all about that as well, eh? It would be snobbish of me to insist that we in the US have a lock on that kind of behaviour (more's the pity).
»This Country is Going Down The Shitter !
But then you'd have to register. | |
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Da Chief
@MBL.EDU
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine Sadly, I don't think registering will help: I get a "Board does not exist" message when I click on the link you thoughtfully provided.
So perhaps it's not the country that's going down the shitter after all, but DSLR. | |
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craig70130
Premium
join:2004-04-27
New Orleans, LA | Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine You have to be registered to access that board. | |
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Da Chief
@MBL.EDU
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by craig70130 :You have to be registered to access that board. I thought that if you we're trying to access of forum that requires registration, you were prompted to register, not presented with a "Board does not exist" message?
Oh, well.
At any rate, when the government starts regulating the amount of cold medicine you can buy, I'm not convinced it's a sign that Happy Days Are Here Again. To say nothing of the latest round of Keynesian economic nonsense. | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| said by craig70130 :You have to be registered to access that board. I believe you have to have at least one star(level 1) hence the old names stars pub and stars watercooler.
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fatness
subtle
Janitor
join:2000-11-17
fishing |  (topic move) [Rant] Pseudoephedrine
The post that was here (and all 48 followups to it), has been moved to a new topic .. »Health Care | |
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Meth Mouth
@totalink.net
 from:
Jim Gurd
| said by cvrefugee :said by Jim Gurd :Yes, but if it was legal then it could be made openly in a factory with proper precautions taken and procedures for disposing of the hazardous waste. The very fact that it is illegal is contributing to the dangerous conditions you list. That's the worse exercise in logic I've ever seen. You want the creation of methamphetamine to be legal? Why? For what purpose? If you'll pardon my saying so, I don't think you're quite grasping the logic here.
The whole reason why people do things like setting up drug labs in hotel rooms is because drugs are illegal. Therefore, criminals will do things to set up portable labs in an effort to stay one step ahead of the law: they can set up a lab in a motel room, stay there for a day or two, then pack up and move on.
If, on the other hand, drugs like methamphetamine were legalized, they could be made under controlled conditions, and in industrial quantities (i.e. cheaper and purer).
So, who do you think would be able to produce more and purer methamphetamine: some guy operating out of a hotel room, looking over his shoulder every five minutes? Or someone with a full-blown, legitimate factory employing a staff of chemists, same as anyone would in the legal drug trade?
Now, the thought of someone destroying themselves through methamphetamine use horrifies me (and you, too, probably). But we need to stop pretending that banning something serves to actually get rid of that "something," because it's been demonstrated, time and again, that the world just doesn't work that way.
If you'd like an historical example, you need look no farther than Prohibition. Prohibition lasted 13 years, was widely acknowledged as a complete failure, and was finally repealed, but not before making the Mafia an enormous amount of money.
The phrase "war on drugs" was first used in 1971 during the Nixon Administration. If you think that, thirty-seven years later, drugs are now more costly, of poorer quality, and harder to obtain than ever, then all I can tell you is you need to get out of the house more often.
said by cvrefugee :So you can get your psuedoephedrine fix without hassle at the pharmacy? The hassles that people now endure at the pharmacy to get their cold medicine are entirely pointless. There are huge profits to be made in the drug trade, particularly in cheap, easy-to-make drugs like methamphetamine.
Anyone who thinks that illegal drug manufacturers simply threw up their hands the day they started limiting the amount of cold medicine you could buy at Wal-Mart doesn't understand the drug trade very well. All the bad guys did was turn to alternative sources to get the chemicals they need to make the drugs. The drugs that, you guessed it, they can sell and make enormous sums of money doing so. Likewise, the people who supply illegal drug manufacturers with the chemicals they need to make the drugs also stand to make a lot of money.
The people who claim to be fighting the "war on drugs" fail to acknowledge that what they are in fact fighting are...market forces. When they bust a drug dealer, (or a meth lab) their doing so temporarily increases the price of illegal drugs (decreased supply + steady demand = higher prices). Which means that when they bust a dealer/lab, (and therefore drive the price up by reducing the supply) their actions serve to make getting into the drug trade more attractive to people who like to make money.
It's a process we've seen repeated, ad nauseum, for thirty-seven years now. And yet, strangely enough, we don't seem to be any closer to reducing the supply of illegal drugs than we were in 1971.
There has been a huge success, however, in reducing things like civil liberties and the ability of law-abiding cold sufferers to get the medicine they need to feel better. If these strike you as being worthy goals, then I guess you can count the War on Drugs as at least a partial success. | |
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cvrefugee
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Corona, CA
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Meth Mouth :
If you'll pardon my saying so, I don't think you're quite grasping the logic here... What else should be legalized in your opinion? What other toxic substance should the U.S. allow law-abiding citizens to purchase? Cocaine? Marijuana? Heroin? | |
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Legal Eyes
@247realmedia.com
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by cvrefugee :said by Meth Mouth :
If you'll pardon my saying so, I don't think you're quite grasping the logic here... What else should be legalized in your opinion? What other toxic substance should the U.S. allow law-abiding citizens to purchase? Cocaine? Marijuana? Heroin? Insecticides? Gasoline? Disinfectants? The drain cleaner you keep under the sink? Do you go around drinking (or bathing in) any of these? I hope not, because those are toxic substances, too, and readily available. The problem here is not the availability of "toxic substances."
(As an aside, I'm sure that people who have cocaine and marijuana habits will be surprised to learn that they've been ingesting a "toxic substance" all this time. Just because taking too much of a given plant (marijuana) or plant extract (cocaine) is Not A Good Idea, that doesn't necessarily make it toxic.)
Look, if you want to pretend that politicians passing laws against "bad things" makes those bad things go away, despite a proven demand (market) for those "bad things," go right ahead: politicians do it all the time.
But our drug policy has yet to show the first sign of working and has served to make us the laughingstock of the world. It's high time that the drug problem stop being treated as a criminal problem (and relatively late in our history at that, with 1914 marking the passage of the Harrison Act) and started being treated as a health problem, (both physical and mental) which is what it actually is.
Of course, changing direction like this won't help keep the prisons full, or allow law enforcement to buy newer and shinier toys with the proceeds gotten from confiscating property from "drug dealers" (real or imagined). Which is why it will never happen: there's too much money to be made in fighting a never-ending "war" that provides a convenient cover to steal property from people and toss them into prison on the flimsiest of pretexts, allowing these now-impoverished people to be used as slave labor (allowing yet more money to be wrung out of them).
If, on the other hand, you think the War on Drugs is on the verge of being won after thirty-seven years of non-results, well, I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinion. | |
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Jim Gurd
Premium
join:2000-07-08
Plymouth, MI
·Comcast
| said by MadMANN :All that said, it is a sad day when you can't go to the pharmacy to get medicine that works That reminds me of something else. I remember back 15-20 years ago you could go into most pharmacies and ask for cough medicine with codeine in it or diarrhea medicine that contained opiates. All you had to do was sign a book giving your name, address and age. Now it's impossible to get those types of medications without a doctor visit and a prescription. A needless expense just to fight the "war" on drugs.
I keep a bottle of cough medicine in my medicine cabinet at home. I don't need it very often but when I do it is the only thing I find that actually works. The over the counter stuff is useless. If I start to get low I just ask the doctor for a script the next time I visit him. It's a hassle but I see no other alternative the way things are now.
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Calling an illegal alien an undocumented worker is like calling a crack dealer an unlicensed pharmacist. | |
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Count Zero
MD2Be
Premium
join:2007-01-18
Warner Robins, GA
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine You can still get codeine OTC legally.
A lot of pharmacies just don't stock it because it is extra paperwork for them. Luckily my wife is a pharmacist.
As for making meth legal... haha. That's one drug that does NOT need to be made legal.
I'm OK with marijuana being legal, and OK with something like codeine or even a stronger variant being made legal... but things like meth, cocaine, etc. can cause people to have SERIOUS psychological and physiological problems. | |
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ykronic
Premium
join:2006-01-31
Canada
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Count Zero :I'm OK with marijuana being legal, and OK with something like codeine or even a stronger variant being made legal... but things like meth, cocaine, etc. can cause people to have SERIOUS psychological and physiological problems. If you don't think pot causes long term psychological and physiological problems then you've never met my friends/coworkers  | |
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Count Zero
MD2Be
Premium
join:2007-01-18
Warner Robins, GA | Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine Not saying it doesn't - but meth and coke are a lot more dangerous. Heck cigarettes probably have roughly the same long-term health effect as cigarettes in terms of # of debilitating diseases and such, but they are legal. | |
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joako
Premium
join:2000-09-07
/dev/null
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| said by MadMANN :said by Jim Gurd :If people want to kill themselves with meth that's their problem and their choice to suffer the consequences. It isn't the government's responsibility to protect people from their own foolishness. I agree with you in that the war on drugs is a waste of money and resources. However, with meth, it isn't just about people killing themselves with the drug. The people who manufacture the drugs often do so in places close to where other people reside, which endangers the lives of anyone within a few blocks of them. A home meth lab is a very toxic environment and can cause a chemical explosion that can poison the air and potentially kill any man, woman, or child around. There was a meth lab discovered nearby to me in a motel and the HazMat team was quoted as saying that they couldn't believe that the motel wasn't a pile of rubble because of the way the chemicals were stored and handled. I don't know about you, but that is a scary thought to me. All that said, it is a sad day when you can't go to the pharmacy to get medicine that works well for your allergies because of the few that use it in ways that for which it was not intended. However, there are many prescription and non-prescription alternatives to Pseudoephedrine these days that tend to work just as well or better without the speed. It's kind of like when they took morphine off the shelves back in the day. There were people who said, "But it worked so well! Why do I have to suffer for it?". . . .Er, cause taking Morphine for a headache is like using dynamite to get rid of a bees nest? Which is a result of meth being illegal. If it was legal they could safely manufacture it in a factory instead of in a clandestine lab by an inexperienced person just trying to make quick buck (they obviously have no regards for safety, the law or anything except making a quick buck)
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09:F9:11:02:9D:74:E3:5B:D8:41:56:C5:63:56:88:C0 | |
| | | | Kain
join:2003-05-01
Portland, OR
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by joako :Which is a result of meth being illegal. If it was legal they could safely manufacture it in a factory instead of in a clandestine lab by an inexperienced person just trying to make quick buck (they obviously have no regards for safety, the law or anything except making a quick buck) I would go so far to say that clandestine labs generally put out a relatively safe product. The problem is in the unknown concentration of the product. To be a responsible drug user you need kits to tell you how concentrated the drug is to use it safely. Imagine if every time you drank a beer you could get anywhere from 1 - 5 shot equivalents. Drink 5 beers (or shots or whatever) and you could be tipsy or you could be dead. Legalizing currently illicit drugs would go a long ways towards reducing the number of deaths and hospitalizations from drugs. | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ | you can still get these pseudoephedrine tabs by the bucketful[if you want] in canada(of course getting them back into america might be a problem)
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You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
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ykronic
Premium
join:2006-01-31
Canada
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by dvd536 :you can still get these pseudoephedrine tabs by the bucketful[if you want] in canada(of course getting them back into america might be a problem) Yep customs has really been cracking down on the whole black market cold and sinus medication/smuggling ring  | |
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mareastrum
join:2006-09-10
Saint Louis, MO
1 edit | Well, you can always do what people are doing here:
1) visit drug store
2) purchase the amount that you can legally have in a 30 day period
3) visit completely different drug store not affiliated with store 1
4) repeat step 1
5) continue with steps 1-4 until you have a nice healthy stash
Or you can recruit several of your friends to be your patsies and do your dirty work for you.
Otherwise, convince your doctor to write you a prescription. And don't believe everything the pharmacists tell you. They won't stop manufacturing the drug as long as the drug companies have the government in their pockets. | |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by mareastrum :Well, you can always do what people are doing here: 1) visit drug store 2) purchase the amount that you can legally have in a 30 day period 3) visit completely different drug store not affiliated with store 1 4) repeat step 1 5) continue with steps 1-4 until you have a nice healthy stash Or you can recruit several of your friends to be your patsies and do your dirty work for you. Otherwise, convince your doctor to write you a prescription. And don't believe everything the pharmacists tell you. They won't stop manufacturing the drug as long as the drug companies have the government in their pockets. This is a *VERY* bad idea. Why do you think they take your driver's license, walk away, punch it into a computer, wait for the result, then come back and ring you up?
All the stores are tied into the same system. If you do this, you'll have a nice, late night, "knock" on your door by masked men yelling at you rather rudely.  | |
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Corona
It's cool, I'm takin it back
Premium
join:2000-03-14
Aubrey, TX
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Matt :said by mareastrum :Well, you can always do what people are doing here: 1) visit drug store 2) purchase the amount that you can legally have in a 30 day period 3) visit completely different drug store not affiliated with store 1 4) repeat step 1 5) continue with steps 1-4 until you have a nice healthy stash Or you can recruit several of your friends to be your patsies and do your dirty work for you. Otherwise, convince your doctor to write you a prescription. And don't believe everything the pharmacists tell you. They won't stop manufacturing the drug as long as the drug companies have the government in their pockets. This is a *VERY* bad idea. Why do you think they take your driver's license, walk away, punch it into a computer, wait for the result, then come back and ring you up? All the stores are tied into the same system. If you do this, you'll have a nice, late night, "knock" on your door by masked men yelling at you rather rudely. Not here they're not. Only chain stores are connected to their same chain. That includes Wal*greens and our grocery HEB. I bought the large supply of mucinex with psuedophed at Walgreens. then drove down the street to HEB and bought another larger supply. Each store told me that they were only hooked into their own database, that there was no national or state level (texas) database tracking these purchases. | |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by Corona :said by Matt :said by mareastrum :Well, you can always do what people are doing here: 1) visit drug store 2) purchase the amount that you can legally have in a 30 day period 3) visit completely different drug store not affiliated with store 1 4) repeat step 1 5) continue with steps 1-4 until you have a nice healthy stash Or you can recruit several of your friends to be your patsies and do your dirty work for you. Otherwise, convince your doctor to write you a prescription. And don't believe everything the pharmacists tell you. They won't stop manufacturing the drug as long as the drug companies have the government in their pockets. This is a *VERY* bad idea. Why do you think they take your driver's license, walk away, punch it into a computer, wait for the result, then come back and ring you up? All the stores are tied into the same system. If you do this, you'll have a nice, late night, "knock" on your door by masked men yelling at you rather rudely. Not here they're not. Only chain stores are connected to their same chain. That includes Wal*greens and our grocery HEB. I bought the large supply of mucinex with psuedophed at Walgreens. then drove down the street to HEB and bought another larger supply. Each store told me that they were only hooked into their own database, that there was no national or state level (texas) database tracking these purchases. You are correct. I was told by the Walgreen's girl that it was a federal program, but if you do a Google search it looks like it's been left up to the individual states. North Carolina does have a statewide tracking system.
So, I'll amend my above post to reflect that you better check your local state tracking capabilities before attempting this.
Thanks Corona. | |
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craig70130
Premium
join:2004-04-27
New Orleans, LA | Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine Many states were restricting the sale before the feds stepped in. And yes, in many states it is tracked statewide. Definitely is in my state. | |
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craig70130
Premium
join:2004-04-27
New Orleans, LA
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by tapeloop :Have you tried Amazon? They sell 4-packs of the 24ct. extra strength allergy. That is Sudafed PE - different drug entirely and doesn't work near as well for most people. | |
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tapeloop
1959. I try to kick the ball. I miss.
Premium
join:2004-06-27
Airstrip One
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by craig70130 :said by tapeloop :Have you tried Amazon? They sell 4-packs of the 24ct. extra strength allergy. That is Sudafed PE - different drug entirely and doesn't work near as well for most people. Ingredients
Chlorpheniramine maleate 4mg, Phenylephrine HCI 10mg
Gotcha. I picked that link since it said "allergy formula."
They have the pseudoephedrine HCl stuff for sale too:
»www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw?ur···&x=0&y=0
»www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_kk_1?ie=···phedrine | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| All of this hassle and there really hasn't been a drop in meth sales/lab busts.
only hurting the legit users, i buy it when i don't need it so i'll have a decent amount for when i do.
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When I gez aju zavateh na nalechoo more new yonooz tonigh molinigh - Ken Lee | |
| joeblow
join:2007-07-14
Knoxville, TN
| Need to be wary of long time and over use of Sudafed. It is really hard on your blood pressure and later your heart. My heart Dr. said there might be long term effects from taking it long periods.
Have you tried Allegra and all the others. That really worked for me. as well as I just moved away from winter weather. | |
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craig70130
Premium
join:2004-04-27
New Orleans, LA | Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine Allegra = antihistamime
Sudafed = decongestant
apples & oranges
Allegra-D = antihistamime + Sudafed (pseudoephedrine) | |
| | | joeblow
join:2007-07-14
Knoxville, TN
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine said by craig70130 :Allegra = antihistamime Sudafed = decongestant apples & oranges Allegra-D = antihistamime + Sudafed (pseudoephedrine) well in my case alergies gave me a runny nose and long term snius infections (many) so if you eliminate the first you dont get the second. But you needed me to type that all out I bet just for a laugh. | |
| | CipherDias
join:2006-05-16
USA | **IF** you have a LEGITIMATE need for more than you can get over the counter then just get a prescription for it from your Doctor. | |
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Corona
It's cool, I'm takin it back
Premium
join:2000-03-14
Aubrey, TX
| I have a few thoughts. It is difficult to segregate the "health care" crisis from several other things happening today.
First, malpractice insurance coverage is skyrocketing.
Much of this is due to the many frivolous and baseless lawsuits that are allowed to proceed. They clog our legal system and increase costs for the health care industry. One step is to pass legislation that protects providers from frivolous lawsuits. Stabilization and tort reform will help bring down operating costs.
For example, if you're told before a procedure that there is significant risk, and you elect to have the procedure anyway, and it doesn't work, if the doctor is not negligent you shouldn't be able to sue.
Second, who is covered.
Those who cannot afford private health insurance should get basic coverage. Illegal immigrants should be denied coverage. That may seem cruel to some, but honestly, I don't give a fuck. I'm pro immigration, just do it legally. Legal immigrants should get the same benefits as citizens. How do we figure out who is covered? I'm not sure, there's way too many variables here to just arbitrarily throw out a number. Maybe some sort of health care voucher system, that is phased out as your income increases.
If someone is wealthy and wants to pay privately for their health care themselves - LET THEM.
Third, funding.
The US spends incredibly insane amounts of money on foreign aid, helping 3rd and 4th world countries and regions. That needs to be cut back severely. I don't believe that we should be sending money overseas to help others while we have Vets living on the streets, getting denied coverage. Let the UN do that. I'm all for philanthropy as long as our own are taken care of first. Cruel? Maybe. Responsible? yes.
We also need to hurry the hell up and GFTO of Iraq. Either that, or make Iraq start funding the effort. They could pay the US military like private contractors.
Anything the fed pays for is paid for by us, through our taxes. The graduated system of federal income tax is broken. I believe there should be a flat income tax, across the board for all. Just like sales tax. You buy a $500 TV instead of the $1000 TV, then you pay less in sales tax. The tax code could be reduced to a single sheet of paper. No loopholes, no tax exempt. Everyone pays the same.
I would also eliminate automatic employer withholding. I think taxes should be paid at every paycheck, to the fed, by the person owing the tax. Write the check, or send the e-payment, or whatever. Maybe if people have to actually do that, then they might wake up and realize exactly what they're forking over.
I would also create a way for those that feel guilty about how much money they make, to pay "extra" to the federal government. Do you know that right now, you cannot do that? You cannot pay more taxes than you owe. How absurd. If only there was a way to assuage the guilt they're carrying by letting them pay more than their "share".
Where to go?
I would much rather see us move to a mass "free market" type system. Our current system is not a free market system. Employers control our choices and it is exceedingly difficult to switch plans. There is this concept of "in" and "out" of network providers. We need to get rid of that. Small business owners also don't have the "buying" power as large companies do with insurance companies. Policies seem to change with each open enrollment (why are we locked into that anyway), and it can be highly confusing to Joe Consumer.
Like I mentioned above, maybe the fed should provide some sort of graduated voucher system for low income to help them pay for their coverages.
Health Spending Accounts and Flexible Spending Accounts are a step in the right direction, however they need to be improved. I would very much like to see it expanded to preventative care and not just reactive care. For example, why can't I use my FSA for my gym membership? It seems idiotic that I cannot.
Now, not being expert in the health care field, I can assure you this is not foolproof. However, I think this starts to address some of the issues plaguing our current situation. My opinion is my own. Your mileage my vary. Call now while supplies last.
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Corona "No, make no mistake. It's not revenge he's after; it's a reckoning."
Check out the band 1000 Miles From Home | |
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Johnny
Premium
join:2001-06-27
Atlanta, GA
·Comcast
| Re: [Rant] Pseudoephedrine Amazing. See - we agree.
Regarding the malpractice - I agree. I would pay $250K a year if I were doing private OB.
The best and simplest solution to baseless suits is to make the loser pay if it goes to trial.
As long as everyone is covered, that's all I want. Sliding scale, fine.
Also agree with stopping sending money for ungrateful Iraquis and spend it here on our veterans. Anything it takes to give our soldiers the Cadillac of care, should be provided.
Private insurance should of course still be available. This ain't Cuba.
Actually, those who feel guilty CAN send in a check to reduce the national debt.
We should pay for the veterans and the uninsured by revoking the ridiculous tax cuts on the wealthy and removing the income limit for Social Security, and repealing the non-negotiation clause of Medicare Part D.
Also, tax corporations a little bit to fund the health care, but cancel the tax increases if a corporation employs American workers instead of outsourcing the jobs. | |
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Count Zero
MD2Be
Premium
join:2007-01-18
Warner Robins, GA
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
4 edits | We have some middle ground here - though you're still not completely getting the need for Universal Healthcare.
I agree - Tort reform is long over-due, and where it has been enacted it has been helpful in reducing the amount doctors are paying towards malpractice insurance and legal fees.
Let me ask why you feel a system that gives poor(er) people a set standard of care but excludes wealthy would be cheaper for the wealthy than just having everyone covered under the same plan?
Keeping everyone under a common umbrella means that hospitals and doctors have less paperwork to do, less overhead, and can afford to accept a smaller reimbursement for their services and still receive a globally competitive paycheck (which is important since we want to keep the brightest minds in healthcare). It also allows for the power of collective buying (especially important with drug companies) to keep prices lower across the board (meaning either a doctor and hospital takes what the insurance rate is or works on a cash-only basis (which is entirely their prerogative). So you come into my office and you need an echocardiogram, I know exactly what I'll receive for that procedure and I know I won't have to dance through hoops to receive my payment since your insurance company doesn't automatically deny my initial request for payment and instead ask for extra paperwork to receive my compensation.
I don't see why anyone would want private insurance when they could have a public one that didn't involve loop-holes and deductibles (or at least very low ones) and the like and was cheaper since they were already paying taxes to support a base level of care for everyone... but as long as doctors aren't allowed to accept private insurance without also accepting the public system then I have NO problem allowing private insurance to co-exist.
I'd have to agree about the statement we give too much of our money to foreign countries while we have problems at home.
I also agree that we should make the Iraqi government pay ALL of the costs associated with the military occupation of Iraq since they're reaping a windfall from oil prices. In fact I think that we should even go so far as to receive compensation for all this previous time we've spent in their country.
Taxes - I don't know if a flat tax is really the best option, though I think it's a LOT better than the fair tax. We desperately need to simplify our tax code though, and close a lot of loop holes that are currently being used to evade paying. Perhaps a simpler progressive system in which people earning $5,000 or more would pay 0.1% of their income and then for every extra $1000 you earned the percentage would go up by .01% and then have a max cap at 50 or 60% (which means a 5th grader to do the math to see how much was owed based on a certain income. Those numbers are obviously subject to changed based on what would amount to (in the real world) paying for our government's operating expenses.
You are free to pay more than you owe in taxes:
If you want to contribute toward reducing the national debt, write a check to the Bureau of the Public Debt, the federal agency within the Treasury Department that's responsible for accounting for and reporting the national debt.
Attn Dept G
Bureau of the Public Debt
P.O. Box 2188
Parkersburg, WV 26106-2188
The problem with HSAs and the like is that you have to have money to put into them in the first place. People who lack money in the primary sense will always be in trouble, and people who are barely keeping themselves afloat - living month to month due to bills such as mortgage, car payments and ever more expensive food bills - will never truly benefit from such a system.
A universal healthcare system has it's downsides, but when you consider just how many people you're helping it is well worth it.
I agree that we need to emphasize preventative care - and if we had a Universal System then EVERYONE can see a physician on a regular basis - maybe they could even stipulate that if you don't see your physician for an annual check-up you can be fined? Something like $100, enough that everyone will go see their doctor once a year just to check for the regular stuff.
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Check out my site: »web.mac.com/jwsmiths
Play Mafia!: »Pub Games | |
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sivran
Long Live The Suite
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Arlington, TX
clubs: | Can your doctor not.. write you an actual prescription for sudafed? | |
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sunshine121
@charter.com
| I am dealing with this very problem today. Nobody carries good ol fashioned pseudoephedrine. Today I am on the quest for that plus acetaminophen combined, like Sinutab used to be. That PE ingredient doesn't work. I think this is a scam to get our money, but I even read an article online that the PE ingredient only works in nasal spray form, not pill form. So why sell it?
Pseudoephedrine is the only thing that will bring me sinus relief on a bad allergy day like today! It is May in N. Texas and I am miserable. I take flonase, allegra, but on a really bad day like today I need something else. | |
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