National Helpdesk's Outsourcing in Road Runner http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r20348793 en Sun, 12 Oct 2008 10:55:34 EDT Sun, 12 Oct 2008 10:55:34 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20567395 anon : We didn't know for sure if RR was leaving from the Canadian NHD offices for the longest time. If you have issues with the phillipines support people or the support you recieve from them you can always email complaints to customercare@ndc.rr.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20567395 Sat, 31 May 2008 01:19:28 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20537328 MacLeech :
said by Kingcarcas See Profile :

when they just need to reset my connection.
What exactly do you mean by that? What would you want them "reset" exactly?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20537328 Sun, 25 May 2008 12:52:26 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20537208 Kingcarcas : What took them so long? :D Well i hope it doesn't suck having to jump through the basic windows troubleshooting hoops when they just need to reset my connection.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20537208 Sun, 25 May 2008 12:20:11 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20534898 bufbandit :
said by hobgoblin See Profile :

said by bufbandit See Profile :

so do we

Hob
Thanks alot!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20534898 Sat, 24 May 2008 19:16:35 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20533279 hobgoblin :
said by bufbandit See Profile :

I wish i worked in Hawaii
so do we

Hob
--
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20533279 Sat, 24 May 2008 11:13:54 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20532984 bufbandit : I wish i worked in Hawaii]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20532984 Sat, 24 May 2008 09:27:19 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20531854 anon : Don't be an idiot! They speak English!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20531854 Fri, 23 May 2008 22:32:37 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20485303 Baseline : Great... How do you say "put the freebie newsgroups max connections back at 15 please" in that language?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20485303 Thu, 15 May 2008 02:34:52 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20455796 bobjohnson :
said by hobgoblin See Profile :

"Maybe in your area tier 3 is regional, but it is not in Hawaii."

The Islands of Hawaii would probably count as a region. A tier Three group based in Hawaii would support the region of Hawaii.

Hob
Agreed and I will clarify for you... For example here in FL, if I call tier 1 support i get the bright house call center in melbourne which is for our county, if it is escalated to tier 2 I get the RR NHD in various areas, and if it is escalated to tier 3 I would get the regional call center in Orlando.. In Hawaii Oceanic Time Warner is the region which is all of Hawaii and you most likely would be calling the same center for tiers 1 and 3 support ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20455796 Fri, 09 May 2008 09:34:58 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20453850 Mele20 :
said by hobgoblin See Profile :

"Maybe in your area tier 3 is regional, but it is not in Hawaii."

The Islands of Hawaii would probably count as a region. A tier Three group based in Hawaii would support the region of Hawaii.

Hob
LOL That sounds like "nit pickin" to me. ;)
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20453850 Thu, 08 May 2008 20:59:18 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20453780 hobgoblin : "Maybe in your area tier 3 is regional, but it is not in Hawaii."

The Islands of Hawaii would probably count as a region. A tier Three group based in Hawaii would support the region of Hawaii.

Hob
--
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20453780 Thu, 08 May 2008 20:42:27 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20450178 Mele20 : Tier 3 is NOT regional. It is located at Mililani, Oahu where Oceanic TW has its offices. The Tech Support manager is a former tier 3 tech whom I got to know well years ago. He is now a friend. I used to know 90% of the tier 3 techs...now there are newer ones I don't know. But they all live on Oahu and work in Mililani.

We never had to go through tier 2 or the ticket thingy. I was designated a special Power User right after I got RR in June 2001. There were three of us on the Big Island so designated and we were given a special toll free number to call tier 3 in Honolulu. Everyone else on this island (and the other islands) had to call tier 2 and go through the ticketing thing. The three of us did not have to do that. About a year later, the toll free number to tier 3 was given to anyone who knew to ask for it and the three of us were released from our promise to not give the number out. (The toll free number for the neighbor islands to tier 3 on Oahu was promised by Oceanic when RR expanded beyond Oahu. It was advertised and part of what one got when they got RR but not really. The number was not given to neighbor island folks...we were second class citizens but paying the same price for RR that the Oahu folks paid who could call tier 3 free of interisland long distance charges. So, a subscriber on the Kona side of this island protested this with the State of Hawaii Dept. of Commerce and Consumer Affairs Cable TV division. The outcome was that he and and another person on the Kona side and I on the Hilo side were designated Power Users and allowed to have a toll free number to tier 3).

In recent years, Oceanic has beefed up tier 1 and 3 right after beginning offering digital phone. When they added a lot of tier 1, and some new tier 3 employees, they centralized the phone number for the entire state (I can't call the local office anymore) and tier 3 answers all calls to that automatically routed to internet trouble number. If all tier 3 techs are busy then tier 1 answers and tier 1 may or may not patch you to tier 3. An inexperienced tier 1 tech will patch you to tier 2 who gets irritated because they have to patch back to tier 3. Tier 2 does nothing other than help with email, passwords, RR dialup and answer questions about getting Rhapsody, etc. Tier 2 never uses tickets since at least a year ago. If you have a connection problem and tier 1 patched to tier 2, they will confirm the problem and patch you back to tier 3 and the tier 1 person will be told to not use tier 2 but to transfer directly to tier 3. But usually what happens is tier 1 sees a connection problem and wants to roll a truck. UGH. I have complained to the tech support manager about this. Even when I have explained to tier 1 that I don't need a truck as the problem is not something a truck roll can fix, they don't understand at all and they still want to roll a truck. I hang up and call back and usually get tier 3 immediately and I tell them what happened and they cancel the truck roll and then we talk about what I am seeing on the network here on the Big Island.

Maybe in your area tier 3 is regional, but it is not in Hawaii. Remember, Oceanic is not totally owned by TW. Oceanic is our own homegrown cable company and we are allowed to do some things OUR way...such as the name of the company...it is OCEANIC Time Warner not Time Warner of Hawaii which is what corporate tried to force on us and was floored by the outpouring of anger from Hawaii citizens.
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20450178 Thu, 08 May 2008 08:01:13 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20450006 anon : I'm sorry but Tier 3 is not divisional it is regional. Tier 2 is intermediate level support. Tier 3 handles digital phone, Home networking issue's and escalated modem/internet support. You should never bypass NHD they open the trouble tickets Tier 3 works off of, it's how everything is kept track of for the customer. Tier 1 is not to transfer directly to Tier 3 without meeting specific criteria, they can be and are held accountable.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20450006 Thu, 08 May 2008 05:33:49 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20420116 oldbuzzard :
said by MacLeech See Profile :

said by Mele20 See Profile :

I believe a lot of the reason for moving support out of the USA and Canada for RR or Dell, etc. is to drastically cut down on support because many will not call when they know they won't be able to understand the person.
It doesn't save costs because many people call repeatedly, while others just give up and DEMAND a tech to come to their home.

Anybody involved in tech support knows the way to cut costs on tech support is to fix the problem as quick as possible. (easier said than done though)

The reason to move tech support overseas is LOTS of CHEAPER labor. With a GROWING customer base and more franchises cracking down on call wait times, more help is needed.
Cheaper seems to be the watchword of all consumer oriented business. I've found that so far, the Asian tech support knows virtually nothing. Four different calls netted four different answers as to when the channel changes (a bit OT, I know) will take effect in my area. Further, they seem way to quick to order a truck roll.

In ten years of having broadband, I have NEVER had a level one tech support call solve ANYTHING. That's because I always reboot modem/router before I call, my settings are correct and clearing my browser cache has never solved anything. Virtually avery problem I've experienced, whether on the Internet or TV side can be attributed to under-capacity or "just plain cheap" issues.

Currently, I get about 2/3 of advertised speeds during the day, about 1/5 at night, I have to reboot my cable box a few times a week, the DVR drops sound and sometimes doesn't record things that are selected and my HD signal locks up every night at least once (on box number 4 now). Nothing there that a level one person in Asia or a truck roll can fix. If the new firmware that accompanies the channel change doesn't fix the TV issues I'll switch to Satellite. No other option for Internet, sadly. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20420116 Fri, 02 May 2008 08:56:50 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20412614 MacLeech :
said by Mele20 See Profile :

I believe a lot of the reason for moving support out of the USA and Canada for RR or Dell, etc. is to drastically cut down on support because many will not call when they know they won't be able to understand the person.
It doesn't save costs because many people call repeatedly, while others just give up and DEMAND a tech to come to their home.

Anybody involved in tech support knows the way to cut costs on tech support is to fix the problem as quick as possible. (easier said than done though)

The reason to move tech support overseas is LOTS of CHEAPER labor. With a GROWING customer base and more franchises cracking down on call wait times, more help is needed.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20412614 Wed, 30 Apr 2008 18:54:24 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20412562 Mele20 : I think Filipinos are wonderful folks. I know many Filipinos who are here in Hawaii and I have spoken a few times to a Dell support desk in the Philippines.

But I think language is by far the biggest barrier to good support. I have trouble understanding anyone with even a modest accent when speaking on the phone! I can't easily understand someone from Boston, or the Bronx, over the phone or someone in England. In person, where I can read their lips and see visual cues, I'm usually fine. On the phone though the person ideally needs to speak General American which is what is taught to anyone wishing to become a tv news reporter, stage or movie actor, radio disk jockey, etc.

I had to learn General American speech many years ago because I had the thickest of Southern drawls (Mississippi delta drawl with some Texas twang added for good measure :D). The further the deviation from General American speech the more difficult it is to understand the person especially on the phone. And the last thing someone needing technical support for their computer/ISP needs is to not be able to understand the support tech and have to ask them to repeat and when they do you still can't understand.

I believe a lot of the reason for moving support out of the USA and Canada for RR or Dell, etc. is to drastically cut down on support because many will not call when they know they won't be able to understand the person.
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20412562 Wed, 30 Apr 2008 18:44:27 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20412451 K Patterson : I've had the opportunity to make three trips to the Philippines, and I have to say it is a great place. Pollution in Metro Manila is not nice, but the people are wonderful.

The issue with foreign support is not language - it's culture. Filipinos have a culture similar to America, for better or worse. They do a great job on tech support.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20412451 Wed, 30 Apr 2008 18:22:02 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20409252 TWCdude : Some of my thoughts from the other end of the calls

The incoming calls from the Philippines have been ok so far. Ill get some calls where all I have to do roll a truck or fix something minor on the acct and all is good. Then there are some calls that are really bad where is like no one helped the customers at all even some cases made things worse. I think most of this is due to everyone being new. Once the feedback starts flowing in I'm sure things will get better. The accent thing isn't too bad I have to ask to repeat once in a while other than that its nothing new. I have dealt with some customers whose accents are much worse. The only noticeable thing is the conversations are all business it doesn't seem very friendly compared to the people in the north American call centers. The voices are very monotone and you have this feeling like you did something bad. I don't know if it's just me or the culture or the stupid rules that might be in place. But either way I have respect for anyone who puts up with the abuse from working tech support.

btw

tier 1 mainly checks to see if the modem online

tier 2 mainly does minor trouble shooting for offline modems and all the software stuff

tier 3 does the wireless and all the other messed up things that tier 1 and 2 cant fix ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20409252 Wed, 30 Apr 2008 03:07:31 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20408007 luwi : I love the Philippines.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20408007 Tue, 29 Apr 2008 21:13:49 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20392315 Mele20 :
said by Xsk8er See Profile :

My understanding from being a Road Runner Customer for many years is they have always outsourced the basic level of Road Runner HSI Support.. I remember back in early 2000ish calling and speaking to someone who told me they where in Canada. It was not until my issue was escalated at the time to level 3 that I spoke with someone in the local office.
The BASIC level for support is TIER 1. Tier 1 is located in your division along with tier 3.
Tier 2 is NHD. It is NOT basic level support.

If I call Oceanic TW and put the menu choice for Road Runner, I get Tier 1 which is located at Oceanic TW's offices in Mililani, Oahu. Tier 1 can answer basic questions and even roll a truck if the problem is obvious. If the problem is less obvious, etc. then Tier 1 will transfer me to Tier 3 bypassing Tier 2 but that is because I know how to get directly to Tier 3 which is also located at Oceanic TW offices in Mililani, Oahu. If I need to to talk to Tier 2 (because I forgot my password, have a question about RR email, etc), or want a shorter wait time than is usual with Oceanic, then I call NHD directly on the 800 number I have.

Tier 2, NHD, handles mostly email problems, password problems, RR Dialup questions and problems, and can do basic modem testing and helps with questions regarding RR Rhapsody, and other offerings from RR. They can also tell you the network status if you get a repeated busy signal trying to call Tier 1. Tier 2 can transfer you to Tier 3 which is your local RR techs but, at least here, going through Tier 2 first is not necessary any more. Tier 1 can transfer directly to tier 3 and does if you can convince them (with proper information) that is who you need to speak with. In fact, Tier 3 answers all calls to Oceanic that pass to Road Runner. Tier one gets in the act only when all Tier 3 techs are busy with other calls.

The last time I spoke to Tier 2 NHD there was a much longer than usual wait time but I still got Canada and was told that NHD is not going anywhere. But who knows?
--
"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20392315 Sat, 26 Apr 2008 18:54:55 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20385153 cable1969 : I'm glad with your broad experience of a short time with the company you have made a statement for all of Road Runner. This is great for newsgroup readers who believe anything they read. A majority of Road Runner calls are still outsourced to Canada. They aren't going anywhere as far as I know and I have a silly feeling I would know before you. I'm also proud you have great knowledge of the Phillipines and what languages they can speak.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20385153 Fri, 25 Apr 2008 11:22:32 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20383241 Xsk8er : I have friends in the Philippines and most of them that choose to work in the call centers over there are very smart, some of them have massive college backgrounds and the call center work is all that is avail due their economy.

Most of these folks are very smart and honestly are doing the best they can at their jobs with what they are provided. With calling any tech support line (I experenced this with SBC trying to cancel DSL) the rep on the other end is only able to do so much within the guidelines that the company they are providing support for gives them.

My understanding from being a Road Runner Customer for many years is they have always outsourced the basic level of Road Runner HSI Support.. I remember back in early 2000ish calling and speaking to someone who told me they where in Canada. It was not until my issue was escalated at the time to level 3 that I spoke with someone in the local office.

Sorry to hear about Indiana's loss. Wish you all the best. I am sure you all did your best... with our encomony on a downturn right now everyone is trying to a penny here and there.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20383241 Thu, 24 Apr 2008 23:37:23 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20381202 anon : I work for the Hobart (Indiana) NHD.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20381202 Thu, 24 Apr 2008 17:15:21 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20371323 Scifience : Actually, most people in the Philippines do speak English quite well as a result of the legacy of American colonization.

Personally, I don't really care where the call center is located as long as they can fix my problem quickly. I've not had a whole lot of luck with this with wherever the current call centers are located, and I doubt it will be any different when they're moved to the Philippines.

Sorry to hear about your impending layoff though, and I wish you the best in finding a new position. :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20371323 Tue, 22 Apr 2008 21:52:23 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20349563 anon : For the same reason people outsource other jobs and use child labour - it's cheaper.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20349563 Thu, 17 Apr 2008 17:58:23 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20349530 pcdebb :
said by bufbandit See Profile :

Which NHD do you work for?
back in the day, i thought all NHD was in Canada (2002'ish time frame)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20349530 Thu, 17 Apr 2008 17:52:38 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20349417 anon : Some Socal Customer Service has moved to Costa Rica recently. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20349417 Thu, 17 Apr 2008 17:33:11 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20349373 Weatherlover : That would make sense, as I spoke with a help desk person about an hour ago with some Asian (sounded more Indian though) accent. Very hard to understand.

Why not keep them in the US and Canada??? :huh: :mad:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20349373 Thu, 17 Apr 2008 17:24:22 EDT Re: National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20348837 bufbandit : Which NHD do you work for?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20348837 Thu, 17 Apr 2008 11:30:26 EDT National Helpdesk's Outsourcing http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20348793 anon : I work for a TWC Roadrunner national helpdesk.Just got word from my supervisor. All NHD's are being outsourced to the Philippines, so if you're a Roadrunner customer and you need tech support, be aware when you call for basic tech support you will be speaking with someone that doesn't know english.

I'd also like to thank all of our Roadrunner customers for being so awesome and providing me with a paycheck for the short time I was with the company.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20348793 Thu, 17 Apr 2008 11:21:41 EDT