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Gettina Dell
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| reply to cocothebean
Re: new laptop for teacher
said by cocothebean :DO NOT EVER BUY ANY USED ELECTRONIC EQUIPMENT!!! Not if you don't know what you're doing, no.
said by cocothebean :Yes, a few people get lucky, but, most get screwed!!! So no one ever buys used cars, used bicycles, or used clothes, either, out of fear they will "get screwed?" Please.
Buying used computing gear is the same as buying "used" anything: you have to be willing to do your homework in order to get a good result.
But claiming that a few people "get lucky" is balderdash: "luck" has nothing at all to do with making an intelligent purchase of any kind of good, either new or used. You simply need to take the time and trouble to school yourself (or have a knowledgeable friend help you out) on what it is you'll be looking at.
said by cocothebean :Do you get a one year warranty with any USED elecronic equipment??? No, and when you're paying, say, 1/3 the price that a brand new unit would cost you shouldn't expect one, either.
There was a poster on here a couple of weeks ago that had a problem with a laptop. And she was bemoaning that fact that the insurance company she was dealing with required her to pack it up and ship it off.
Well, if you purchase new equipment, and need it serviced, chances are you can look forward to going through that same process: packing up the gear and shipping it off to be serviced or replaced. Unless, of course, you're lucky enough to have a local shop the manufacturer works with for their warranty repairs (i.e. by lucky coincidence, you just happen to live in Bangladesh, too).
And the fact that your new doodad is going on a vacation of (likely) indeterminate length means that, if you're smart, you will have made it a point to have a backup unit standing by for just such an eventuality. And the need for having such "backups" on hand might well help to explain why a sizeable market exists for used computing gear.
said by cocothebean : While Craigslist is very popular it is a joke, people selling junk no one they know would buy from them!!! If Craigslist were indeed a joke, then it would hardly continue to be a popular venue for buying and selling used gear, would it? I mean, eBay gets called on the carpet all the time in these forums. Do you really think that Craigslist is totally shady, but manages to keep it a secret?
The reason I mentioned Craigslist as a possible source for a used laptop earlier is because Craigslist (unlike eBay) gives you an opportunity to see (and smell) what you're buying before any cash changes hands.
But if you don't know what you're doing, then, yes: stay away from Craigslist, or eBay, or your local classifieds, or anywhere else that used computing gear is offered for sale. If you are incapable of distinguishing between, say, a MacBook Pro and a Timex Sinclair, then all of these venues are far more likely to bring you frustration than satisfaction.
Because let's face it: taking the time and trouble to educate yourself and seek advice on a possible purchase is not for everyone. Admittedly, it is far easier, instead, to just show up at your local computer store, hand over your credit card, close your eyes, and.....pray.....hard.....that you come out of the store with something that vaguely resembles what you went in for.
Unfortunately, whether you're buying used gear, or a shiny new box, it is up to you, the consumer, to do the appropriate research so that you don't spend any more money than you have to to get what you need. You know, what with money being in finite supply for most (though certainly not all) people (e.g. if your last name happens to be "Gates" or "Winfrey" you can stop reading right here).
And performing due diligence is, frankly, not something that everyone is necessarily capable of. I mean, there's actual reading involved and thinking involved, and everything. And speaking for myself, numbers and letters make my brain hurt.
said by cocothebean :If you don't want a Dell, buy a HP or other popular brand, sure there are discount coupons for all computer companies on the above links!!! Or, you can create your own discount by doing your homework, and buying used computing gear.
Some people do indeed buy new gear, all the time. And, quite often, they're easy to spot: they start looking all mournful right around the time their credit card statement rolls in. That pained expression they wear is really quite unmistakable.
What it all comes down to is this: to make an intelligent purchase of either new or used gear, you have to do the legwork. In this particular case, the purchaser needs to talk to the end user and find out the sorts of applications they typically run during their workday (or playday).
But honestly, if all you're doing is surfing and mail, chances are you don't absolutely need a (relatively) late-model 1GHz machine to do that on. Instead, you might be able to look around a bit and find an older, admittedly slower unit that will still meet the needs of the end user.
At any rate, no one in the forum is doing a potential laptop purchaser any favors by making dramatic, blanket statements about how no one in their right mind ever buys used computing gear. If you're willing to take the time and trouble to look around and ask some intelligent questions, chances are good that you can come away with a machine that you'll be happy with. And you'll be able to think of what you paid for it without getting that pained expression referred to earlier.
It's all up to the consumer: the amount of satisfaction they will get for their money is directly proportional to the amount of forethought and attention they give to the purchase. But anyone who thinks that buying brand new gear somehow magically insulates you from the consequences of making stupid and wasteful purchasing decisions either hasn't bought much computing gear, or has more money than sense and can afford to keep flinging money at a problem until it simply goes away.
And if anyone reading this happens to fall into the latter category, please be sure to PM me. Because I certainly want to talk to you. | |
auto
join:2000-12-21
Chester, NY
| wow i havn't been on this site in a while and i miss it!...
well most important point i think was missed is this: this is a gift, a graduation gift and i dont think it would be cool to give a used laptop as a gift.
it should be new. Went to s few stores yesterday and it is hard to get win xp now. staples only has vista. gonna check circut city in a few hours.found a nice looking hp 15 inch display 3 gig ram 250 gig HD for 850. gonna see if circut city has the same one and will beat staples price
so you think i should get XP? | |
tschmidt
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Milford, NH
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| I bought my daughter a HP Vista desktop last year and it has been OK. Vista needs a lot of memory and there are still compatibility issues.
I think on Dell site they offer XP (downgrade).
The ideal situation is to get a laptop with Vista, and downgrade to XP. That way if Vista does not work out downgrading to XP is free.
/tom | |
poppster
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edit:
April 23rd, @12:26PM
| reply to Gettina Dell
said by Gettina Dell :
And if anyone reading this happens to fall into the latter category, please be sure to PM me.
You might want to recheck that statement.
since your not a dslr member, and posting as anonymous, you have no IM privaleges. | |
cocothebean
You Are My Nightmare
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edit:
April 23rd, @12:45PM
| reply to Gettina Dell
said by Gettina Dell :said by cocothebean :DO NOT EVER BUY ANY USED ELECTRONIC EQUIPMENT!!! Not if you don't know what you're doing, no. Your replies to all the quotes was some of the dumbest I ever read!!!
Tell me how can you tell if a used computer is in good WORKING condition???
How can you be sure a USED car will last more then 3 months???
Bicycles???
Used clothes-can you ever know if the seller didn't puke on pee on them after a night of partying???
and baby clothes you are surely buying stuff the baby puked on.
said by Gettina Dell :
Craigslist (unlike eBay) gives you an opportunity to see (and smell) what you're buying before any cash changes hands. I guess that's OK if you don't mind paying shipping charges back and forth (you know the seller isn't). | |
cocothebean
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| reply to auto
said by auto :wow i havn't been on this site in a while and i miss it!... well most important point i think was missed is this: this is a gift, a graduation gift and i dont think it would be cool to give a used laptop as a gift. it should be new. Went to s few stores yesterday and it is hard to get win xp now. staples only has vista. gonna check circut city in a few hours.found a nice looking hp 15 inch display 3 gig ram 250 gig HD for 850. gonna see if circut city has the same one and will beat staples price so you think i should get XP? Dells small business sells XP!!! | |
tschmidt
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Milford, NH
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to cocothebean
said by cocothebean :I guess that's OK if you don't mind paying shipping charges back and forth. Not to beat this to death but I have purchased several computers/peripherals advertised by local folks on Craigslist and have been very pleased with the transaction. Get to play with the widget before you buy it and no shipping charges. I've also bought a few things on eBay without problem. I was also looking to buy a used car for our son and decided, for the reasons you mentioned, to buy a new car and give our old one to him.
Buying anything used has risks, it is up to each of us to decide for a particular transaction if risks are worth it.
/tom | |
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| reply to auto
said by auto :found a nice looking hp 15 inch display 3 gig ram 250 gig HD for 850. gonna see if circut city has the same one and will beat staples price so you think i should get XP? It's a matter of opinion -- I've set up half a dozen laptops with Vista, and have not had any problems whatsoever. You will, however, need at least 2GB RAM to make it run smoothly. I use 4GB in my personal systems, though I suspect that this is overkill for most. | |
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| reply to cocothebean
said by cocothebean :Your replies to all the quotes was some of the dumbest I ever read!!! Your responses aren't exactly works of art, either.
said by cocothebean :Tell me how can you tell if a used computer is in good WORKING condition??? Very easily. If you're buying from somewhere like eBay, look for a seller who has great feedback... most "Powersellers" won't screw you over on used stuff. I've bought more used laptops than I can count on eBay and have never had issues with any of them.
We also have a "For Sale" forum here on DSLR where site members sell used computer equipment. I haven't been burned there yet, either, nor have I seen a lot of major issues from other users. Most deals seem to go down quite nicely.
Just because you don't know what you're doing doesn't mean that others should be discouraged from buying used items at great discounts. 
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cocothebean
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edit:
April 23rd, @04:26PM
| said by removed :said by cocothebean :Your replies to all the quotes was some of the dumbest I ever read!!! Your responses aren't exactly works of art, either. said by cocothebean :Tell me how can you tell if a used computer is in good WORKING condition??? Very easily. If you're buying from somewhere like eBay, look for a seller who has great feedback... most "Powersellers" won't screw you over on used stuff. I've bought more used laptops than I can count on eBay and have never had issues with any of them. We also have a "For Sale" forum here on DSLR where site members sell used computer equipment. I haven't been burned there yet, either, nor have I seen a lot of major issues from other users. Most deals seem to go down quite nicely. Just because you don't know what you're doing doesn't mean that others should be discouraged from buying used items at great discounts. Your both right, go spend your money on other peoples stuff!!!
But, feedback doesn't mean your box is going to work more then a month!!!
| |
Gettina Dell
@247realmedia.com
| reply to auto
said by auto :wow i havn't been on this site in a while and i miss it!... well most important point i think was missed is this: this is a gift, a graduation gift and i dont think it would be cool to give a used laptop as a gift.it should be new. I understood entirely that this laptop was meant as a gift. If you'll pardon my saying so, there is nothing intrinsically wrong with a used laptop. All used laptops were "new" laptops at some point in time. And I think you'll find it doesn't take long for a laptop to go from being considered the former to falling into the latter category.
It's really a matter of your personal priorities. Are you trying to teach your stepdaughter that appearances are important? Or that money (and the value you get for the money you spend) is important?
When I was growing up, my parents often bought their clothes (and mine) from thrift stores. And I must say that when I was a young child, I hated the fact that they did this.
However, when I had to make my own way in the world, I discovered that Wow! Clothes sure are expensive! And also that money tends to be in short supply when you're first starting out. That being the case, I quickly learned that if I wanted to have money left over for all the other things I needed, it would prolly be a good idea to buy a lot of my clothes from thrift stores, too.
I had a choice of either buying all the latest gear and being broke, or buying somewhat older clothes (taking care to choose those items that would always be in style) and having more money left over for things like dates. Cutie-pies are not all that impressed when you take them to McDonalds, even if you do tell the guy behind the counter that, yes, you would like fried with that.
Some folks, of course, refuse to buy used clothing. And that's fair enough. But I don't think it's a stretch to say that when you insist on buying nothing but new stuff, even when a used item might meet the purpose, your bank balance is going to reflect that fact.
said by auto :Went to s few stores yesterday and it is hard to get win xp now. staples only has vista. gonna check circut city in a few hours.found a nice looking hp 15 inch display 3 gig ram 250 gig HD for 850. gonna see if circut city has the same one and will beat staples price so you think i should get XP? So you haven't made the effort to talk with your stepdaughter, first, to find out what tasks she typically needs to perform on her computer?
Because if you haven't, you might well end up spending $1000 when $500 worth of laptop will do. If I'm surfing and doing mail, I don't need 3 gigs of RAM stuffed into the machine to do it with. As I mentioned earlier, any money you save could then be given to your stepdaughter. People who have just gotten out of school always seem to be concerned with money for some reason.
At any rate, I think this is the part where I throw up my hands and let you go your own way.
There's an old saying, "Money goes where it's wanted...and stays where it's cared for." And I have to admit that I never really grasped what the person who came up with that maxim was trying to say.
But I do now. And I'm quite serious when I say: thank you for opening my eyes and educating me. It's obvious that not everyone thinks the way I do. Which I suppose is just as well, because if they did, the credit card companies would starve to death. | |
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| reply to cocothebean
said by cocothebean :Your both right, go spend your money on other peoples stuff!!! Thanks for your blessing, cocothebean . I have spent my money on "other peoples stuff!!!" for a few years now, and have no intentions of stopping anytime soon. None of the used stuff I've bought over the years has had anything major go wrong. As stated previously, it's all a matter of knowing what you're doing -- a skill that you do not appear to possess.
said by cocothebean :But, feedback doesn't mean your box is going to work more then a month!!! It either works or it doesn't. The laptop I am typing this post on right now was bought from a seller on eBay whose company bought a bunch, used them for a few weeks, and decided that they wanted a different model. I've been using it daily since September -- no issues whatsoever
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cocothebean
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| said by removed :Thanks for your blessing, 
No problem!!!
 | |
PeteC2
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| reply to auto
said by auto :wow i havn't been on this site in a while and i miss it!... well most important point i think was missed is this: this is a gift, a graduation gift and i dont think it would be cool to give a used laptop as a gift. it should be new. Went to s few stores yesterday and it is hard to get win xp now. staples only has vista. gonna check circut city in a few hours.found a nice looking hp 15 inch display 3 gig ram 250 gig HD for 850. gonna see if circut city has the same one and will beat staples price so you think i should get XP? Well, as you can see, we all got opinions!
Not to disagree with anyone's opinion, but when it comes to notebook computers, I would be leery of buying used. Even with the best of intentions, some folks simply do not have good habits with their notebooks, and even if they sincerely believe their laptop is in "perfect/good" condition, you may wind up with issues that you don't want to deal with.
Besides, I might be "old school" here, but I could not get very enthused about buying a used anything as a gift?
auto, to me, the question really should be this: What is she going to use the laptop for, and how will she be using it? In other words: Does she need a tremendous amount of portability, some portability, but a screen large enough to spend hours with, or even a "desktop replacement" type (17" or larger LCD)?
Without too many specifics, a notebook with a 15.4" widescreen, 3gb ram, 250gb drive, for $850 is likely enough a decent, "all-around" type notebook, suitable for a wide variety of tasks, probably short of "gaming", as the higher-end graphics cards generally will make it pricier than what you've quoted.
auto, this is a real competitive price/features level, and I would definitely take a real good look around before buying. From $600 - $900 there are a lot of choices, and with some judicious shopping, some darn good deals.
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auto
join:2000-12-21
Chester, NY
| thanks pete. yea new is the only option. how can you get a used gift? geesh!
as I only have a week or so left im gonna go to circut city and see what they got. bought my HP there. just have to be careful cause they like to charge crazy money to load software ! just gimma the computer guys.LOL! | |
X Man
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USA
| Well, Vista blows, is the popular consensus. XP is almost a decade old, and pretty piss poor, truth be known.
OS X, is the Holy Grail. OS X is the best Desktop OS, bar none. And, if you get her a Mac... She can run Windows XP or Vista, via a Dual Boot scenario, or more elegantly via Parallels or Fusion. Clearly, a Mac is the best of both worlds and a Certified Apple Re-Furb is indistinguishable from new sans the pretty box. An Apple re-furb is even eligible for AppleCare within the first year of ownership.
For God's sake if you insist on buying a Windows based laptop, just buy the cheapest one you can find... A $399 special. Because all Windows based PCs suffer from the same pitfalls... They run Windows... Exclusively... Ick...
Besides, Macs enjoy a very strong presence in the field of Education.
Regards,
Mike | |
PeteC2
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edit:
April 26th, @08:16AM
| said by X Man :Well, Vista blows, is the popular consensus. XP is almost a decade old, and pretty piss poor, truth be known. Everyone has an opinion, but there are a few things here:
1. There is no sub $1K mac notebook, and their lower-cost notebooks are not great bargains from a hardware point of view. Least expensive MacBook at Best Buy gets you a 120gb drive (minimal), 1gb ram, and a lousy DVD ROM/CDRW drive...for $1099...not a good value. Again, read the OP's post, this is a gift...he is not looking to buy her a used computer. Refurbished is still "used".
2. "Vista blows" may be the popular consensus amongst certain corners (many more folks use it with no complaint!)...but it works absolutely fine on my notebook. Most folks who have issues with Vista are running it as an upgrade on older systems...never a prime move, as newer OS's are designed for newer hardware. On a dual-core AMD/Intel cpu with 2gb ram, there is not a thing wrong with Vista.
3. XP is piss poor? Look, you can't have it both ways! It has been around all this time because it has met so many user's needs well. I've been running the same installation of XP on my desktop P-4 for years now, with nary a hiccup.
Nothing wrong with a Mac...but they aren't the Holy Grail by any means. Over-priced hardware so that you can run OS X? Hmmm, ok if that floats your boat, but for all the hoopla, it remains a PC world...
BTW, read the Mac forums some time...I see all the same yaks and complaints about MacBooks that I see about every other notebook brand.
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X Man
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| said by PeteC2 :said by X Man :Well, Vista blows, is the popular consensus. XP is almost a decade old, and pretty piss poor, truth be known. Everyone has an opinion, but there are a few things here: 1. There is no sub $1K mac notebook, and their lower-cost notebooks are not great bargains from a hardware point of view. Least expensive MacBook at Best Buy gets you a 120gb drive (minimal), 1gb ram, and a lousy DVD ROM/CDRW drive...for $1099...not a good value. Again, read the OP's post, this is a gift...he is not looking to buy her a used computer. Refurbished is still "used". Refurbished via Apple's website are not "used". Used, doesn't come with a factory warranty that is exactly the same as a new retail boxed Mac. But, if an Apple refurb isn't good enough for her, he can get a new one. No Mac user who's not a newbie buys a Mac from BestBuy. Hell, nobody in their right minds buys anything of real value from BestBuy. Also, the OP said "around $1,000".
As to those suggesting a Vostro, well lets Google that up...
The most portable would be the 14"er. O.K, and it starts at $499 Wow, a bargain! oops, that's with a DeCeleron, not a C2D... and an 80gig drive as standard, no wireless, no camera, no good... Well, lets try and get it up to the MacBook specs... Uh Oh! When I add Bluetooth I get a WARNING that it requires VISTA, so XP isn't an option...
Wow, that sucked and I don't even think I'm getting any Firewire ports and I don't know if I have Gig-E... Oh well, it's at least close to the MacBook in specs.
Damn! I just realized the Vostro only has a 10/100 NEC not Gig-E... So, no Firewire and no Gig-E. 
Well, the damage to equip the Vostro 1400 to bring it up to the MacBook specs is... $1037 And, if we could add Gig-E and Firewire we would be at exactly the same price as the Mac!
Now, what was that you were saying about "value"?
said by PeteC2 :2. "Vista blows" Hey Man, don't shoot the messenger. That's what I've heard. I have ZERO desire to run any Windows OS.said by PeteC2 :3. XP is piss poor? Look, you can't have it both ways! It has been around all this time because it has met so many user's needs well. Both ways? They both "blow". I know for a fact that XP blows, because I've had the misfortune to use it for thousands of hours. IMHO, it's a hot mess.
said by PeteC2 :Nothing wrong with a Mac...but they aren't the Holy Grail by any means. Over-priced hardware so that you can run OS X? Hmmm, ok if that floats your boat, but for all the hoopla, it remains a PC world... Well, I just showed that the Mac isn't over-priced but don't let facts stand in your way.
Regards,
Mike | |
PeteC2
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| Mike, no offense, but that Vostro configuration is one that I would not recommend to anybody, too much CPU, with too little ram, a lousy CD burner (why?)...BlueTooth? For the most part, who needs it? If one specifically needs it, great, but most folks simply don't.
All you did there was customize a PC to be as over-priced and under-value as the MacBook I mentioned. Thankfully, most PC notebooks are not configured that way!
The OP can go to any B&M store, and find a myriad of PC notebooks with 2-3gb ram, 160-250gb hard drive, a real DVD Writer, a perfectly capable dual-core Intel or AMD CPU...anywhere from $600 - $850. Short of being a "gaming" laptop, it will do any normal productiviy work, web surfing, email, video/photo/audio entertainment, etc., and do it well. Unless his daughter has some very complex uses that the OP has not suggested, it makes little sense paying a grand or more at today's prices. Even $850 is well at the high end of what most people need to spend to get a laptop capable of meeting their needs!
Now, don't get me wrong, there is a market for high end gaming, business (especially "ruggedized" machines), and scientific notebooks that cost much more...but not for some 95%+ of users.
I was not trying to start a MAC vs. PC flame, and if I did, my apologies. I really don't argue with those who prefer one OS (or brand) over another...however, if XP was so reprehensible, how did it last this long? I understand that you may have had issues with it...but I have used it from it's inception, and have done everything that I have any need for an OS to do, with few complaints...and so have many millions of other folks! So far, I find Vista to be every bit as reliable and easy to use. OS X is a fine OS, and yes, I have used it, frankly, I find it no "better or worse" than Windows...just different.
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X Man
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| said by PeteC2 : All you did there was customize a PC to be as over-priced and under-value as the MacBook I mentioned. Thankfully, most PC notebooks are not configured that way! No, what I did was configure the Dell to be as equal as possible to the MacBook. It's still lacking, BTW. A computer without Firewire is dead to me. I didn't go apeshit @ Dell. I did the bare minimum to try and equalize the thing with the MacBook and surprise! The MacBook turns out to be an excellent value.
Firewire? Bluetooth? A fast processor? Gigabit Ethernet? Yeah, who would want that crap? I'd much rather have a desktop sized 20X Dual Layer SuperDrive, Parallel Ports and a Floppy Drive.
Regards,
Mike | |
|
