Tehuno
join:2005-01-18
Bartlesville, OK
| reply to Sithra
Re: Best Talent build for a rogue
i levelled combat fists(AR/Prep) since 58, and i really like fists > swords, while leveling, as your crit rate is still pretty low at that gear/level.
i respecced shadowstep when i hit 66, and went from 130-140k xp an hour to 90-100k an hour, combat is definately the way to go for leveling, choice of weapon up to you. |
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Sithra
join:2008-02-07
3 edits | reply to SSX4life
#1. Yup. As you say though it's minor, the only poison immune mob I encounter atm is the robots in trash.
#2. Positioning can be an issue, but not really on those encounters. The worst fight for positioning? Magtheridon! The quakes put you in front of the boss way too often. Aside from that, I can't think of any particularly nasty encounters, you want to be behind the boss all the time anyway for obvious reasons.
#3. The issue with windfury, is unless you're always stacking groups you won't always have it, if you have a hunter or druid in your group then it's wasted on them so you go GoA. GoA also produces more DPS at Karazhan-ish gear levels, but WF scales a lot better with gear and overtakes fairly soon after.
And, when you get stuck with GoA, Mutilate benefits more due to the crit profile increase.
As for "Not to mention that an extra attack with mute spec won't hit as hard."... No it won't, but daggers swing faster and thus get more WF procs. The whole point of nerfing WF to not proc from instants was to balance swords and daggers.
Anyway, I agree, Combat Swords IS indeed the jewel as you say, but it really isn't the only one in that crown, and unless the OP intends to be fighting Brutallus within a month I think he can choose whatever he finds most enjoyable, rather than being herded into Combat Swords. |
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SSX4life
Premium
join:2004-02-13
 ·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to Sithra
I saw mute spec push 2K dps on a fight such as Brutallus.
Again not to break a broken record (and I'm getting off topic here)... but there are a few issues with mute spec.
#1. Poison immune mobs (not a big deal now but it needs to be mentioned)
#2. Positioning is huge when it comes to fights, I can't even think about trying to stay on the tail of something on a fight such as Kael or Supremus etc.
#3. Sword spec > Mute Spec > Dagger spec The extra 5% chance for an extra attack only stacks better with windfury in your party. Not to mention that an extra attack with mute spec won't hit as hardor for as much as sword spec when you look at top end and bottom end dmg.
Again nothing inherently "wrong" with mute spec and it can do a very nice ammount of damage in PVE, but you gotta think that blizz considers sword spec to be the crown jewel when you take into consideration the fact that Warglaves are for rogues and warriors. There are not ledgendary daggers at level 70 nor will there be.
Just my .02 cents
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»www.google.com is your best friend... please use it before asking your question. |
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Sithra
join:2008-02-07
4 edits | reply to Mike
You're losing me, I can't see how Windfury is any different for Swords compared to daggers. It used to be different pre-nerf when it could proc from specials.
WWS it is then, the other rogues aside from me are Combat Swords except Morth who is Combat Fist. This is from the last raid I did with wws running.
Naj'entus »wowwebstats.com/zzpnjtw4sesh1?s=3164-3542
Shade of Akama »wowwebstats.com/zzpnjtw4sesh1?s=8462-8506
Anetheron »wowwebstats.com/zzpnjtw4sesh1?s=11875-12199
The other reports on that night have early rogue deaths.
I can go on, Kaz'rogal
»wowwebstats.com/wil43gadpbngu?s=12844-13106
Another Anetheron
»wowwebstats.com/wil43gadpbngu?s=10837-11129
You get the idea, only a fool would write mutilate off in it's current form. Please note I never said it was better, I said it competes. Clearly combat sword isn't "the" dps spec at all.
So, to summarise Mr OP, play whatever you find is most fun. The difference between specs is nowhere near as large as people like to make out, I should know, I've played all of them.
The one thing swords has going for it other others is Warglaives, once again itemisation forces a certain spec, WD blizz. |
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SSX4life
Premium
join:2004-02-13
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to Mike
said by Mike  :Combat is good if you have the gear since you can just OP someone. If you want mini-shield wall, a cheat death spec would work. Speaking of over powering someone I love my white swing crits of almost 2k on someone in world pvp or a dual  Now granted it takes gear and I don't live as long as someone with talents in other trees but when I hit you you damn well feel it. |
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CultofSkaro
join:2008-05-06
Wallingford, CT
| reply to CultofSkaro
i think for leveling I'll do a combo assassinate mix and re spec at 70 for either mutilate or shadow step. I'll try both and see which fits me better.
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Learning to fly is not so hard. The hard part is learning to hurl yourself towards the ground at break neck speeds and missing. |
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Mike
Premium,Mod
join:2000-09-17
Pittsburgh, PA
clubs:   | reply to drew
Combat is good if you have the gear since you can just OP someone.
If you want mini-shield wall, a cheat death spec would work. |
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drew
Reformation
Premium
join:2002-07-10
Port Orchard, WA
clubs: | reply to CultofSkaro
combat kind of sucks for PVP.
But if you're just doing it as you level and aren't going to be in brackets very long, go with combat. |
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CultofSkaro
join:2008-05-06
Wallingford, CT
| reply to CultofSkaro
so don't waste time putting points into improved poison and all that stuff while leveling? If combat is as good as you say then that's probably the way to go. I am on a pvp server and plan on doing bgs alot, is combat okay for pvp or no?
--
Learning to fly is not so hard. The hard part is learning to hurl yourself towards the ground at break neck speeds and missing. |
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Shatter
join:2006-07-24
Waterford, MI
| reply to CultofSkaro
As combat swords you get blade flurry and AR which allows you to kill 4 mobs in about 15 seconds with evasion up the whole time. You cant do that with Mutilate. You also get the +hit and expertise which means you miss less. Combat swords is the fastest way to level especially if you plan to do alot of your leveling via kills. BF has like a 2 minute cooldown as well which allows you to takeout an additional couple of mobs of 2 minutes. That experience adds up over levels. |
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Mike
Premium,Mod
join:2000-09-17
Pittsburgh, PA
clubs:
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 ·Verizon Online DSL
Host:
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W.O.W.
FairPoint
World of Warcraft
Alltel Axcess
1 edit | reply to Sithra
You get better results from Slice and Dice and Windfury procs with a sword.
Archimonde is an awful example for a dps test because of doomfire.
Daggers are too fast for it to function optimally with the current windfury and frankly forgotten about on blizzard's part.
As of now, combat swords IS the dps spec. |
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drew
Reformation
Premium
join:2002-07-10
Port Orchard, WA
clubs:
·wavebroadband
| reply to Sithra
I've felt that the bandaging cost was worth it for the ability to drop mobs just that much faster. With the amount of gold/cloth thrown around these days...
Oh, and if you're alliance, get these for your combat swords build: »www.wowhead.com/?item=25825 |
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ERogerC
Premium
join:2001-07-31
Brooklyn, NY | reply to CultofSkaro
then go Combat Swords. If you just want to go through Mobs as quickly as possible then thats the way to go. when you get to 70 respec to whatever you like Mutilate, Shadowstep try a few Off specs for the fun of it |
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Sithra
join:2008-02-07 | reply to CultofSkaro
I've levelled 2 rogues, both as daggers. Personal preference, I never found swords to be any faster and it resulted in more downtime bandaging/eating.
As mutilate you'll generally kill things of the same level without getting hit. |
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CultofSkaro
join:2008-05-06
Wallingford, CT
| reply to CultofSkaro
I was thiking mutiliate myslef. I kinda like the shadowstep apporach but as they say on the wow forums, you hit like you're swinging pillows. While leveling I figure the faster I kill it the better.
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Learning to fly is not so hard. The hard part is learning to hurl yourself towards the ground at break neck speeds and missing. |
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Sithra
join:2008-02-07
1 edit | reply to Mike
said by Mike :Windfury. What about it?
Anyway, I was (partially) messing. Combat swords has the best sustained DPS but on fights where it's impossible to keep a steady rotation mutilate really shines. On Archimonde fights I'm usually 15% clear of the nearest combat rogue.
That said with a druid in my group I can certainly keep up on any fight. Brutallus will be the ultimate test. |
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Mike
Premium,Mod
join:2000-09-17
Pittsburgh, PA
clubs: | reply to Sithra
Windfury. |
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Sithra
join:2008-02-07 | reply to SSX4life
Pft, mutilate is where it's at
»eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet···n=Sithra |
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SSX4life
Premium
join:2004-02-13
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to Mike
Mike hit it on the head, it's the exact build of my rogue - »www.wowarmory.com/character-shee···=Tactial
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»www.google.com is your best friend... please use it before asking your question. |
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