Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive in http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r20439498 en Fri, 04 Dec 2009 06:01:56 EDT Fri, 04 Dec 2009 06:01:56 EDT Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20441137 Kylemaul :
said by openbox9 See Profile :

...push to control P2P types of applications and what goes on the ISP's networks...
I read this as "My (P2P) way, or the highway" AKA Stifling competiton, development, innovation, privacy, neutrality, et. al...
If I had more than two thumbs, they'd all be down at Concast over this.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20441137 Tue, 06 May 2008 16:49:32 EDT Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20440359 TechieZero : In other words...money talks, BS walks.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20440359 Tue, 06 May 2008 14:36:36 EDT Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439796 anon : Saying consumer advocates will be disruptive is just a biased way of saying that consumer advocates will seek to enhance the interests of their own constituency and that those interests are different from the interests of most of the industries participating.

Of course its true that negotiations are always more difficult if you truly try to bring together all the different interests involved, rather than only bringing together a subset of interests that start with agreement on basic philosophy.

I applaud them for bringing some companies that develop p2p apps into the fold.
They admit, however, that they only want to bring in other competing interests after they have reached a consensus, as to tactical approach, with those who largely share their interests.
Obviously one only goes on the offensive at the point at which one has built an army of alliances that can overwhelm those with competing interests.

One should remain suspicious given the vastly disproportionate power of the isp and content provider interests involved and the clear intent to exclude the influence of broad public sentiment.

"their usual anti-corporate bias"

Call it whatever you like. The interests of corporations are generally well looked after in this society. There are other interests that are generally less well tended to.
The internet did not begin with corporations and the internet is not simply the sum total of corporate interests. There are many non-corporate and non-commercial interests that are part of the network of networks. There are key corporations who would like to dominate by using their control over choke points on the network. There are others, like myself, who are content to let corporations utilize these networks for their agendas but are not content to let particular corporate interests dominate the development of the internet. We are in the middle of a process where socially disruptive technological developments are being tamed and absorbed by status quo interests to minimize their disruptive nature.
Non-corporate interests are not nearly as easily coordinated or well organized as corporate interests. Corporations, being top-down hierarchical structures have an advantage here. This doesn't mean those non-corporate interests are illegitimate. I don't think it is evil to want a counterbalance to offset that advantage. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439796 Tue, 06 May 2008 13:07:32 EDT Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439829 SilverSurfer :
said by TScheisskopf See Profile :

I love how "consumer advocacy" translates to "anti-corporate bias" in your mind.

You are just so cute and cuddly sometimes. ;-)
Second that.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439829 Tue, 06 May 2008 13:00:22 EDT Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439453 anon : Sir, you are a liar unless you can provide one single piece of evidence that Free Press has advocated for stealing music and movies, or that they have ever said illegal content should be protected from network management.

Shame on you.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439453 Tue, 06 May 2008 12:07:16 EDT Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439523 anon :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

And that plays to their usual anti-corporate bias and their usual advocacy for stealing music and movies.
Which is some how worse that your usual anti-consumer, corporations do no wrong stance ?

To say that consumer advocates _advocate_ file sharing of copyrighted materials because the oppose ISPs playing content censors and copyright police is like saying that people who support the first amendment rights of organizations like the KKK advocate racism and hate. All that does is serve to cloud the debate and stear the dicussion away from the facts and into BS political and social commentary. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439523 Tue, 06 May 2008 12:03:15 EDT Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439498 TScheisskopf : I love how "consumer advocacy" translates to "anti-corporate bias" in your mind.

You are just so cute and cuddly sometimes. ;-)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439498 Tue, 06 May 2008 11:58:34 EDT Re: Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439437 openbox9 : Not to mention that nothing productive comes from those types of discussions and the "consumer advocates" will leave the table pouting because they can't have their way on a network that doesn't belong to them.

The alleged illegality of some of the content that's distributed through P2P is really irrelevant unless you're a member of some of the trade groups that may be realizing losses. IMO, this is a bigger push to control P2P types of applications and what goes on the ISP's networks. What this most likely means is the demise of P2P. The question is, what will replace it and how will ISPs deal with the new threat?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439437 Tue, 06 May 2008 11:48:04 EDT Consumer Advocates would be intentionally disruptive http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20439382 TKJunkMail :
Why not involve consumer advocates in the process from the ground up? ... My guess is that once they've polished up a proposal, they can bring the plan to consumer advocates, who'll look unethical if they suggest that illegal P2P traffic should be treated equally.
I think your guess is pretty good. Because if involved from the beginning, these consumer advocates would push for hands off all traffic - even illegal traffic. And that plays to their usual anti-corporate bias and their usual advocacy for stealing music and movies.
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