Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? in General Questions

Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? in General Questions http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r20443593 en Tue, 02 Dec 2008 20:05:37 EDT Tue, 02 Dec 2008 20:05:37 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20474097 waldoooo : I didn't have time to read everyone's reply so if this is a duplicate just ignore me. A couple weeks back I saw one of the higher ups from OPEC interviewed and his answer was pretty much related to the weakening of the American dollar internationally. The US is a huge oil consumer, the OPEC producers want to make XXX amount for their product..since the
dollar has depreciated so much the price needs to go up for them to put XXX in their pocket. That along with normal market fluctuation kinda made sense to me. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20474097 Tue, 13 May 2008 07:50:04 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20473813 TexasPlus :

said by disconnected :

I've been rear ended five times in four years,

With bad luck like that, they will get you eventually, nothing is going to save you. :huh:
--
"The world is a book; those who do not travel read but a single page." -St. Augustine]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20473813 Tue, 13 May 2008 03:50:01 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20473540 Hayward : And then there is the PURE BASIC FACT....

Some debate we have actually reached it... but VERY SOON if not... and that is GLOBAL PEAK PRODUCTION, its all down hill from here.... ant at the same time you have India and China (Just the two half the world...that were never in the equation before, getting into the fray BIG TIME.

And why US Coastal Gulf or AK ANWAR drilling isn't going to make more than a few month drop in the bucket.... WE MUST find an alternative to OIL... Corn Ethanol is CLEARLY no it... BUT it can be made from prairie grass and many other things....then there is the simple thing that drives the entire planet called the SUN...many areas wind too.

Just plain damn time to get of this oil IV we are so blindly addicted to.

--
»haywardm.com (Hayward's Key West)
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20473540 Tue, 13 May 2008 01:24:47 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20473267 anon :

said by dippledop :

market forces,
if it worked as logical as in theory

Since markets are all about people (not robots) making decisions for themselves, they do not necessarily conform to logical principles. I don't know who told you that markets work according to "logic," but whoever it was, they demonstrated that they don't have a complete understanding of how it is that markets work by making such a remark.

Markets are all about buyers and sellers coming together and agreeing to buy and sell. Selling doesn't take place unless the buyer feels that they are getting as much as they can for a given good or service. And no buying will take place if the buyers participating in a given market cannot find goods or services that that they feel will meet their needs, at a price that they are willing to pay.

The "market forces" you speak of are simply the factors that go into the decision-making process. For example, if I am a seller, and I get wind that a competitor will have a new and better product hitting the market soon, I may feel compelled to drop the price for the goods that I am currently offering in an effort to get them off my hands before no one wants them due to a newer, shinier doodad being available at a similar (or possibly cheaper) price point.

Likewise, if I, as a buyer, am led to understand that the cost of a given good or service is due to go up shortly, I may feel compelled to buy that good or service right now before the price moves upward.

But regardless of whether buying or selling is taking place, we're dealing with people here. People who are making decisions based on incomplete (versus perfect) information and who, like people everywhere, do not necessarily work according to logical principles.

If people did indeed work according to a given set of logical principles, it would be a heck of a lot easier to sell them stuff. But as any ad man can tell you, it's impossible to design an ad campaign that will appeal to everyone and get them all to buy a particular product.

Because what might motivate me to buy a given product might not motivate you. Likewise, when it comes to activities like buying and selling, there are some folks who buy and sell on the merest hint of a rumor, while other people might take more of a "wait and see" attitude.

So markets do not work according to "logic." All that actually takes place is that a point of equilibrium is reached. "Equilibrium" merely describes the point at which sellers are willing to sell, and buyers are willing to part with their money. If markets were not capable of reaching equilibrium, sellers everywhere would be stuck with warehouses full of unsold goods, while buyers would have bank accounts filled to overflowing as they wouldn't be spending their money on anything.

When buying and selling does takes place, (and it takes place all the time) it is evidence that equilibrium has been reached. But no one in their right mind is ever going to claim that buyers and sellers act solely according to logic and are never affected by things like fear, uncertainty, and doubt. Or desire, altruism, love, or any one of the infinite number of things that move people to act.

Because if they did, it would be far easier to predict where markets are headed. And as anyone who spends their time trying to predict markets can tell you, the only thing you can be sure of when it comes to predicting markets is that there's nothing that you can be sure of.

said by dippledop :

this is my favorite force:
"today oil prices went up on fears that (insert something scary that didn't happen)..."

Well it sure is easy to make snotty remarks about scary events that didn't happen with the benefit of hindsight, isn't it?

But unless you happen to possess a crystal ball, there is no way of predicting with absolute certainty which possible events will actually happen and which will not.

Since most people do not happen to own a crystal ball, they have to base their decisions on what they think is most likely to happen. And because we are dealing with human beings who do not behave exclusively according to rational principles and are forced to make decisions based on the incomplete information they have available to them at a particular point in time, you can fully expect to see decisions made that, in retrospect, look completely silly.

I agree that it's a lot of fun pointing and laughing at the people who "got it all wrong." As long as you don't happen to be one of them yourself, of course.

But the point I'm trying to make here is that these "silly" decisions did not appear to be silly at the time they were made to the people who were making them. They look silly only after time has passed, events have played out, and the predictions that these folks made and acted on weren't bourne out by what actually happened.

So markets do work. But it cannot be said that the buyers and sellers who participate in markets will always act in a manner that appears to be rational to an outsider. An outsider cannot get inside their heads and see exactly what it was they were faced with at the time, nor can an outsider have a complete understanding of the values at play and what compels these particular people to act as they do.

In fact, what makes the study of markets so fascinating is that buyers and sellers still manage to come together and reach agreement in spite of all of the irrationalities that are present.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20473267 Mon, 12 May 2008 23:53:24 EDT Re: Gas is Actually Cheaper Today Than in 1951 - Analysis http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20471193 joako :

said by drslash

:

It is irrelevant what an individuals wages are, given this example. The same ratios would apply no matter what a persons hourly wage was from 1974 to 2008. For the time period covered the inflation rate for gasoline was about 2% over and above the base inflation rate. If your wages have increased at base inflation plus 2% then gas costs the same today for you as in 1974. If your wages have gone up at a greater rate than base inflation plus 2% gas costs less today for you than in 1974.

Up until 9/11/2001 the price of gas on average since 1974 had not increased at all adjusted for inflation. The example given doesn't apply if you entered the workforce in 2001. Inflation for gasoline from 2001 to today is about 10% over base inflation. A persons wages would have to rise at base inflation plus 10% since 2001 for gas to cost them the same.

Adjusted for inflation, gas is at or about at it's historical high.

Since its irrelevant why not compare something more typical -- say minimum wage?
--
09:F9:11:02:9D:74:E3:5B:D8:41:56:C5:63:56:88:C0]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20471193 Mon, 12 May 2008 17:20:33 EDT Re: Gas is Actually Cheaper Today Than in 1951 - Analysis http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20471054 drslash : A bit of simple reasoning points out that this "1 dude's" wages have grown faster than inflation. If this dude's wages increased about 2% higher than base inflation then he would be working for 6 minutes to pay for a gallon of gas as he did in 1974. Therefore this dude's wages grew faster than gasoline inflation thus allowing him to work less for a gallon of gasoline today.

I think it is quite obvious that I was not trying to use 1 dude's example to illustrate the relative cost of gasoline over the last 35 years for everyone in the USA. I went on to point out another example of a person entering the workforce in 2001 and what gasoline inflation did in that case.

I used a base inflation rate of about 4.5% over the last 35 years and an additional 2% above that for gasoline inflation. For illustrative purposes I can't be exact since I don't know the exact inflation rate over the last 35 years and since gasoline is already part of the base inflation rate.

Suffice to say that in 2001 the cost of a gallon of gas was about the same as the cost of a gallon of gas in 1974 adjusted for inflation. If your wages kept pace with inflation then the relative cost for you in 1974 and 2001 was the same. In general, since 2001 most people's wages have not kept up with the pace of gasoline inflation making the relative cost for a gallon of gasoline 10% per year higher than a base inflation rate from 2001 to 2008 of 3%.
--
Save water...drink beer!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20471054 Mon, 12 May 2008 16:56:04 EDT Re: Gas is Actually Cheaper Today Than in 1951 - Analysis http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20470662 anon : given which example ?
because this example:
disconnected :

My friend and I decided to test the theory. So we calculated how long he works today to pay for a gallon of gas. Then he calculated how long it took in 1974. He worked 6 minutes to pay for a gallon in '74 and only 4-1/2 minutes today for the same gallon of gas.

is 1 dude.

is this 1 person representative of the entire USA working population?
can you generalize the entire USA population's wages from this 1 person?
without details? such as: is this person in the same job since 1974? receives just the exact dollar amount in the year's dollar? no raise above inflation and dollar adjustment for 30+ years? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20470662 Mon, 12 May 2008 15:50:05 EDT Re: Gas is Actually Cheaper Today Than in 1951 - Analysis http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20470470 drslash :

said by joako

said by disconnected :

My friend and I decided to test the theory. So we calculated how long he works today to pay for a gallon of gas. Then he calculated how long it took in 1974. He worked 6 minutes to pay for a gallon in '74 and only 4-1/2 minutes today for the same gallon of gas.

Most people don't make $50-55/hr these days.

It is irrelevant what an individuals wages are, given this example. The same ratios would apply no matter what a persons hourly wage was from 1974 to 2008. For the time period covered the inflation rate for gasoline was about 2% over and above the base inflation rate. If your wages have increased at base inflation plus 2% then gas costs the same today for you as in 1974. If your wages have gone up at a greater rate than base inflation plus 2% gas costs less today for you than in 1974.

Up until 9/11/2001 the price of gas on average since 1974 had not increased at all adjusted for inflation. The example given doesn't apply if you entered the workforce in 2001. Inflation for gasoline from 2001 to today is about 10% over base inflation. A persons wages would have to rise at base inflation plus 10% since 2001 for gas to cost them the same.

Adjusted for inflation, gas is at or about at it's historical high.
--
Save water...drink beer!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20470470 Mon, 12 May 2008 15:17:32 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20470093 anon : market forces,
if it worked as logical as in theory

this is my favorite force:
"today oil prices went up on fears that (insert something scary that didn't happen)..."]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20470093 Mon, 12 May 2008 14:02:48 EDT Re: Gas is Actually Cheaper Today Than in 1951 - Analysis http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20470014 joako :

Most people don't make $50-55/hr these days.
--
09:F9:11:02:9D:74:E3:5B:D8:41:56:C5:63:56:88:C0]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20470014 Mon, 12 May 2008 13:45:03 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20469820 anon :

said by TexasPlus

said by punker

:

hey but if you get in an crash in an small car you are DEAD

now if you got an BIG SUV you will not be dead

Pay attention, learn to drive, don't get in a crash.

Not when you're stopped at a red light--you're a sitting duck. I've been rear ended five times in four years, while waiting in a line of traffic, but people who we're thinking about driving, but were either upset about personal problems or talking on cell phones. The last one put me in the hospital. Lucky I was driving a big SUV. A smaller car and I might have become a quadraplegic.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20469820 Mon, 12 May 2008 13:09:17 EDT Gas is Actually Cheaper Today Than in 1951 - Analysis http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20469775 anon : The real cause of high gas prices is monetary depreciation.
We should gauge the price based on how long we have to work in order to pay for a gallon of gas.

I read an analysis on this, and the writer posited that gas is cheaper today than in '51. He cited the amount of labor required to earn a gallon of gas--it's less today.

My friend and I decided to test the theory. So we calculated how long he works today to pay for a gallon of gas. Then he calculated how long it took in 1974. He worked 6 minutes to pay for a gallon in '74 and only 4-1/2 minutes today for the same gallon of gas.

The real answer is monetary depreciation--the conversion of valuable gold-backed currency, to pure paper fiat money.

There is a good documentary that a fellow video producer I know from the Adobe forums had a hand in putting together. It is called Fiat Empire (on Google video) and it describes how economics works, how the fed has devalued and defrauded the currency and how we are losing our buying power in this game to transfer wealth from the workers to the bankers.

Another good resource is a book called The Creature from Jekyll Island. Both are about the federal reserve. A good education on economics.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20469775 Mon, 12 May 2008 13:00:57 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20469707 joako :

said by dippledop :

"smart moves"...?!

getting rich doesn't imply "smart"
in fact alot of the "rich" make moves which are detrimental to many others.

You make it sound like oil prices are a massive consipiracy. It's not. The oil prices are a result of market forces.

said by Dude111

:

I believe its 1 of 2 reasons.....

1) BUSH HAS A DEAL WITH THE OIL COMPANIES TO BEEF UP THE PRICE AND HE POCKETS THE TAX $$$ TO USE FOR THE STUPID WAR.

Then explain the deficit.

2) THE OIL COMPANIES ARE DOING THIS AS A PAY BACK FOR WHAT BUSH IS DOING (And we all have to suffer (Even those of us that are againt this shit))

Oil companies don't arbitrarily control the prices like that. What is Bush doing and why do the oil companies care so much?
--
09:F9:11:02:9D:74:E3:5B:D8:41:56:C5:63:56:88:C0]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20469707 Mon, 12 May 2008 12:43:24 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466773 anon : says I: " rich doesn't imply "smart" "

says Smrt Moves: you "claim that getting rich and being smart are mutually exclusive"

Me explaining my words:
i implied that rich/got rich/made money doesn't suggest smarts.
Not all rich people are smart. Just like not all smart people are rich.
Not all rich people make "smart" choices.
People who make money make/made good (business) choices that augments/augmented their wealth.
Making good/smart choices on one front doesn't automatically imply good/smart choices on ALL fronts.

You chose to confer a more extreme angle upon my words. Your choice of thought. I simply implied that RICH does NOT automatically mean "ALL" SMART = the opposite extreme of what you're trying to say i implied-which i'm not implying such extreme.

as for "examples" ...I personally know a couple people who are rich, and only a few i can say are "smart". One can look at the news/read up on "rich" people and see what other kinds of choices they made besides the ones that got them money. If you want to get into a long discussion i'll sign up and we can debate on that...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466773 Sun, 11 May 2008 19:44:55 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466446 CylonRed :

said by PrntRhd

:

Some speculators are doing what comes naturally, if the dollar is becoming devalued they take their money out of stocks and bonds and buy commodities, in the form of oil futures.
This raises oil prices and devalues the currency until the Fed decides to raise interest rates to tame the resulting inflation which will raise the value of the currency.
It is best to get your loans locked in while the interest rate is low because they won't stay low when inflation kicks up.

Same goes for precious metals - gold, silver etc... which have also hit record prices.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466446 Sun, 11 May 2008 18:12:27 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466444 CylonRed : And neither is the least bit correct.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466444 Sun, 11 May 2008 18:11:53 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466399 Dude111 : I believe its 1 of 2 reasons.....

1) BUSH HAS A DEAL WITH THE OIL COMPANIES TO BEEF UP THE PRICE AND HE POCKETS THE TAX $$$ TO USE FOR THE STUPID WAR.

or

2) THE OIL COMPANIES ARE DOING THIS AS A PAY BACK FOR WHAT BUSH IS DOING (And we all have to suffer (Even those of us that are againt this shit))]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466399 Sun, 11 May 2008 18:02:34 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466295 TexasPlus :

said by Smrt Moves :

said by dippledop :

"smart moves"...?!

getting rich doesn't imply "smart"

What, exactly, leads you to make such a comment? Are you making the claim that getting rich and being smart are mutually exclusive conditions?

said by dippledop :

in fact alot of the "rich" make moves which are detrimental to many others.

Oh I would not worry too much about comments like that, 99% of the time they come from professional victims, that would rather blame others than take control of their own lives.
--
"The world is a book; those who do not travel read but a single page." -St. Augustine]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466295 Sun, 11 May 2008 17:28:02 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466050 PrntRhd : Some speculators are doing what comes naturally, if the dollar is becoming devalued they take their money out of stocks and bonds and buy commodities, in the form of oil futures.
This raises oil prices and devalues the currency until the Fed decides to raise interest rates to tame the resulting inflation which will raise the value of the currency.
It is best to get your loans locked in while the interest rate is low because they won't stay low when inflation kicks up.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20466050 Sun, 11 May 2008 16:13:28 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20465810 KingWaffle : Gas is cheaper in the US because it is PROCESSED in the United States...which means it saves a trip back across the ocean.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20465810 Sun, 11 May 2008 15:18:50 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20465583 anon :

said by dippledop :

"smart moves"...?!

getting rich doesn't imply "smart"

What, exactly, leads you to make such a comment? Are you making the claim that getting rich and being smart are mutually exclusive conditions?

said by dippledop :

in fact alot of the "rich" make moves which are detrimental to many others.

How about furnishing us with some examples, please?

On the face of it this sounds too much like a "rich people are evil"-type comment to be taken seriously. Perhaps if you were to tell us just what it is the rich do that goes against the "little guy," we might be able to take steps to guard ourselves against those actions.

So help us out here.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20465583 Sun, 11 May 2008 14:11:01 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20465256 anon : "smart moves"...?!

getting rich doesn't imply "smart"
in fact alot of the "rich" make moves which are detrimental to many others.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20465256 Sun, 11 May 2008 12:31:16 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20462855 CylonRed : And if the dollar drops more - the price still goes up]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20462855 Sat, 10 May 2008 19:59:12 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20462079 joako :

said by Lwilliams

:

As far as I can tell there is no logical reason for it. It just shows me that in this country (and maybe many countries), the rich get richer & the poor get poorer.
Linda ...

There is a logical reason. The "rich" people are making smart moves to get "rich" while the "poor" people are doing the same thing "poor" people do, hence why they aren't becoming "rich."
--
09:F9:11:02:9D:74:E3:5B:D8:41:56:C5:63:56:88:C0]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20462079 Sat, 10 May 2008 16:02:28 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20461902 Siko : Time to drill in our own soil and kill some alaska animals. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20461902 Sat, 10 May 2008 15:03:08 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20461577 CylonRed :

said by Lwilliams

:

As far as I can tell there is no logical reason for it. It just shows me that in this country (and maybe many countries), the rich get richer & the poor get poorer.
Linda ...

Actually there are plenty of logical reasons - you just refuse to believe the economic facts or refuse to read them...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20461577 Sat, 10 May 2008 13:31:58 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20461134 anon : What irritates me is news TV shows who say it like :

" the price of gas went up today "
...
making it sound like it goes up by itself or what?
No,no, its some arsewholes are making the price of gas go up]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20461134 Sat, 10 May 2008 11:32:06 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20460991 TexasPlus :

said by safe driver :

@ Texas Plus

There's no way you can possibly see every situation that could occur on the road. Ever hear of drunk drivers for example? Many accidents happen to people who are very very safe drivers. Just because you pay attention doesn't mean you can't have an accident on the road.

What you said is true. I look at this from the optimistic point of view, it is obvious from your tone that your looking at it from the fatalistic point of view. Every choice we make in life is a gamble, and odds are we will both get our wish. ;)

Now what do you suppose the odds are if one does not pay attention?
--
"The world is a book; those who do not travel read but a single page." -St. Augustine]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20460991 Sat, 10 May 2008 10:50:05 EDT Small car safety. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20459225 DracoFelis :

said by safe driver :

There's no way you can possibly see every situation that could occur on the road. Ever hear of drunk drivers for example? Many accidents happen to people who are very very safe drivers. Just because you pay attention doesn't mean you can't have an accident on the road.

True. However:

1) As others have pointed out, smaller cars are generally much more maneuverable, and otherwise LESS LIKELY to get into accidents in the first place. And the best way to survive an accident, is to not get in it to begin with!

2) As others have said, it's not true that small cars don't have safety features that work amazingly well in a crash. And while I'm not proud of this experience by any mean, I can give you one small example from my own experience:

Many years ago (back when I was an inexperienced teen driver), I survived with little more than a few bruises an almost head on HIGHWAY SPEED (Winter) crash between the family COMPACT CAR (sliding over the dividing line and) hitting a full size pickup! Yes, the whole front end (i.e. the engine compartment) of the small car was collapsed to less than 1/2 it's normal size, and the car I was in was TOTALED. But the COMPACT CAR I was in was designed (as many small cars are designed) to sacrifice the engine compartment (i.e. everything in front of the so-called "firewall" in the car) in a crash, in order to protect the car occupants from harm. And that worked so well, that my only "injuries" were minor bruises from my safety belt keeping me with the car, during these very violent forces in play. Sadly the driver of the pickup (a vehicle MUCH BIGGER than the one I was driving) didn't fare so well. While he recovered, he had to go to the hospital for is injuries (which included broken bones)! And my story is by no means unique.

So really, while the auto makers have been parading that myth of the big vehicles being safer for years (in part, because it helps them sell bigger, higher profit, vehicles), small cars can still do a good job of protecting the occupants should a crash occur. Sadly, I know first hand about this little fact!

3) And while it is true that all other things being equal (and as already pointed out, all other things may not be equal), the vehicles with the crash advantage in a collision is the bigger/heaver one, that DOES NOT mean that bigger heaver vehicles are "safer". Remember, the only reason why a bigger/heaver vehicle might make you SLIGHTLY SAFER in a crash, is because your vehicle may be the bigger/heaver one. i.e. any increased "safety" for you, comes at the cost of making other drivers "less safe" (more likely to suffer injury in an accident, due to your big/heavy truck ramming into them)!

But (and this is key), it's not the extra weight per se that may make you "safer", it's the weight differential between your vehicle and the other vehicle in the crash. As surprising as it sounds to some, two heaver trucks hitting each other are noticeably more likely to have everyone involved in the crash hurt, than two light cars hitting each other (under the same road conditions and speed). And the reason is simple, adding weight to the vehicles actually increases the damaging forces involved in a crash!

[SOAPBOX]
So if you really want to make it safer for people on the road to survive crashes, work to get those big heavy (so-called "safe") trucks/SUVs/etc off the road, so that most crashes occur between light (more fuel effect) vehicles, and therefore are less serious (and more likely to be survived) crashes! Because (as surprising as it is to some, given the prevalence of "the big vehicle is safe" myth, our highways would actually be MUCH SAFER if many of those vans/SUVs/pickups/etc were replaced with smaller commuter cars...
[/SOAPBOX]]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20459225 Fri, 09 May 2008 21:16:59 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20458358 anon : @ Texas Plus

There's no way you can possibly see every situation that could occur on the road. Ever hear of drunk drivers for example? Many accidents happen to people who are very very safe drivers. Just because you pay attention doesn't mean you can't have an accident on the road.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20458358 Fri, 09 May 2008 17:42:56 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20453184 Lwilliams : As far as I can tell there is no logical reason for it. It just shows me that in this country (and maybe many countries), the rich get richer & the poor get poorer.
Linda ... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20453184 Thu, 08 May 2008 22:26:36 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20453690 Mchart :

said by M3 Me :

said by alternate energy :

I heard the other day the arabs plan to raise the cost of a barrel of oil to $200 US dollars. That would equate to approx $10. a gallon for gas! I don't think that will happen this summer, but it still will probably hit somewhere between $4 and $5 dollars a gallon this summer (East Coast - probably over $5 West Coast). So why is this happening? And what do you people plan to do about it?

You forgot the best part about this 'free' money too; The majority of people are spending this money to purchase items overseas - mainly China. So not only is the government drastically increasing the rate of inflation, the citizens of this country are then throwing this money straight into China which further de-values our economy and strengthens theirs.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20453690 Thu, 08 May 2008 20:16:13 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20452012 GunnarDanne : Yea, pretty much. All the extra weight in SUVS that make you feel so "safe" makes you more likely to get into in accident or not be able to avoid one. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20452012 Thu, 08 May 2008 14:30:25 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20451922 TexasPlus :

said by punker

:

hey but if you get in an crash in an small car you are DEAD

now if you got an BIG SUV you will not be dead

Pay attention, learn to drive, don't get in a crash.
--
"The world is a book; those who do not travel read but a single page." -St. Augustine]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20451922 Thu, 08 May 2008 14:13:18 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20451838 cocothebean :

said by Cabal

said by punker

said by lennyCrane :

It is a governmental program to help fat, overweight American cows to lose weight. The theory is they will spend less on food, lose weight, get healthy, which will result in car manufacturers to make smaller cars.
Cars have to be made big otherwise the springs and tires blow out from fat tubs.
Have you seen how American woman have declined in beauty in the past 20 years ? Who wants to mate with a fat cow ? Do you ?
The Arabs have America's best interest at heart, have faith, praise Allah.

hey but if you get in an crash in an small car you are DEAD

now if you got an BIG SUV you will not be dead

Completely false. Some of the safest cars on the roads are small cars, because they're built like tanks.

And they feel like you're riding in a tank too!!!
:p]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20451838 Thu, 08 May 2008 13:51:18 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20451133 Cabal :

said by punker

hey but if you get in an crash in an small car you are DEAD

now if you got an BIG SUV you will not be dead

Completely false. Some of the safest cars on the roads are small cars, because they're built like tanks. Start your research here. For example, the Subaru B-pillar is so strong, the Jaws of Life can't cut through it, and neither will your SUV. (This has lead to revised approaches by fire departments on these cars.)
--
Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20451133 Thu, 08 May 2008 11:48:11 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20450196 CylonRed : Hardly true - sorry but this is basic, unadulterated FUD. Plenty of folks live from crashes in small cars and plenty die in large cars. If cars were smaller and the differences were smaller it would be a complete non-issue.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20450196 Thu, 08 May 2008 08:11:52 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20449952 punker :

hey but if you get in an crash in an small car you are DEAD

now if you got an BIG SUV you will not be dead]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20449952 Thu, 08 May 2008 04:41:07 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20449868 Hayward : nm]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20449868 Thu, 08 May 2008 03:11:33 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20449861 anon : It is a governmental program to help fat, overweight American cows to lose weight. The theory is they will spend less on food, lose weight, get healthy, which will result in car manufacturers to make smaller cars.
Cars have to be made big otherwise the springs and tires blow out from fat tubs.
Have you seen how American woman have declined in beauty in the past 20 years ? Who wants to mate with a fat cow ? Do you ?
The Arabs have America's best interest at heart, have faith, praise Allah.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20449861 Thu, 08 May 2008 03:03:24 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20444378 CylonRed : No - they don't decide the price and the story you say merely said that Goldman Sachs could see a super spike possibly coming down the line: »www.cnbc.com/id/24481509

The official estimate, barring any unusual circumstances, is a more reasonable $3.66/gal average for the US. This is more inline with what will happen and a better estimate than they have had for the last couple of years.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20444378 Wed, 07 May 2008 08:47:21 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20444103 anon :

There's an aspect of this that I'm surprised no one has mentioned yet. And that is that the assholes who keep printing money....keep printing money.

People don't seem to pick up on the fact that money is like anything else: as the supply of it increases, it's value diminishes.

So while I'm sure we're all grateful for those $600 checks we're getting, it might be a good idea to examine just how it's possible for a government that's $9 Trillion in the hole to suddenly cut everyone a check for six small.

Anyway, to answer your question: the reason it takes more US Dollars than ever to buy gas is because there are now more US Dollars than ever in circulation.

(I'm sure it's just a coincidence that M3 [money supply] is no longer reported.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20444103 Wed, 07 May 2008 06:43:03 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443884 Hayward : And we no longer have the reserves to back up the BS for more than a few months we have gotten so gluttonous....

For a while went to small efficient cars (late 70-early 80'2.... but right back to the gluttonous 2 ton SUV/no really day to day fuctional pickup BS.

Though this is mine... 24mpg+ putting around town and rated to carry just under its own weight 1/2 ton (dog is well under that ;) )

This done up for the KW Conch Republic Celebration Parade.... CR K9... not a real one... though the vehicle fit the role.... when I got it steering wheel had definately been chewed up by a bored NYC K9 put in th cab rather than bin!!!
--
»haywardm.com (Hayward's Key West)

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443884 Wed, 07 May 2008 03:26:21 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443875 bcfromfl : I'm a futures trader. Your question has a complex answer, but can be boiled down somewhat.

Increased international wealth has pretty much exhausted conventional investment into new large businesses and industries. There is a "laziness" to this new wealth, such that wealthy investors don't want to actively manage their funds or be involved in creating something new. Thus, it gets funneled largely into hedge funds which "guarantee" a better-than-average rate of return from existing investment vehicles.

A huge influx of buy-side capital into any futures market, without corresponding sell-side pressure, will force prices higher. While it is true that these hedge funds must close out their positions (i.e. sell their long contracts) when that contract month closes, the upward pressure from forward months keeps the prices up.

Crude is also priced using the U.S. Dollar as a standard. Since the relative strength of the U.S. Dollar has been falling against foreign currencies, this devalues the purchasing power of the Dollar for a barrel of crude. In some markets, the Euro is now being used as the new standard because the Dollar is so pitiful. (So much for the "strong Dollar policy" by the U.S. Treasury...)

Now, for the conspiratorial side of things...

There is some suspicion that governments such as Nigeria back the militants that attack oil concerns, which spike prices higher with a "terrorist premium". These premiums don't entirely back out of the futures markets when the violence subsides. So, by giving some hoodlums a relatively small sum of money, the government can benefit from millions in increased revenues.

It's also possible that oil-rich countries are manipulating oil futures for their benefit. Similar to the above example, by taking a relatively "small" amount of money (say, $25 million) and buying futures contracts, they can boost prices a few cents, or even a dollar or two, and reap many millions -- or even billions -- in increased revenues.

Even with increased demand from India and China, I've heard several knowledgeable analysts claim that considering the present international supply and demand, crude should only be trading in the $50-$55 range.

Publicly-traded oil companies only account for about 10% of the world's oil production...the rest are government-owned. The increased cost of a gallon of gas is essentially a "tax" that benefits shareholders of oil companies, pensions and hedge funds that invest in energy stocks and/or futures markets, and oil-rich nations. Since the poor and middle-class are hit hardest by such increased weekly expenditures, this becomes yet another example of the funneling of wealth to the rich.

The disparity between the amount of wealth controlled by the top 1% of the population and the rest of us, is indeed getting larger and larger.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443875 Wed, 07 May 2008 03:20:32 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443772 cocothebean : Driving up oil so the price will justify proccessing corn That is just as bad for the ozone layer as regular oil is!!!
And the people in government could care less what the price is, as they have a credit card issued to them from their propective states, Free gas for them and the family!!!
What a wonder life!!!
;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443772 Wed, 07 May 2008 02:31:16 EDT Re: Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443593 GunnarDanne : Crusade]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443593 Wed, 07 May 2008 01:33:08 EDT Why is gas/oil going so high? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443576 anon : I heard the other day the arabs plan to raise the cost of a barrel of oil to $200 US dollars. That would equate to approx $10. a gallon for gas! I don't think that will happen this summer, but it still will probably hit somewhere between $4 and $5 dollars a gallon this summer (East Coast - probably over $5 West Coast). So why is this happening? And what do you people plan to do about it? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20443576 Wed, 07 May 2008 01:27:32 EDT