how-to block ads
|
Uniqs:
546 |
Share Topic
 |
 |
|
|
| | Like Bioshock It will be instantly cracked. Ever tried to install Bioshock without an internet connection. If you using a legitimate version, YOU CAN'T. however, download the same game from your local pirate bay, and you can just mount both images and install it no problem.
DRM brings the value of the product down to ZERO. So if it has ZERO value, then when you download a copy, you aren't really stealing.
--
The happiest countries are the most secular. The struggle AGAINST corporations is the struggle FOR humanity! | |
|   BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Like Bioshock said by karlmarx:DRM brings the value of the product down to ZERO. So if it has ZERO value, then when you download a copy, you aren't really stealing. Nice way to justify your illegal activities. That is tupid logic. So if I feel something in your house has "zero value" I can come in and take it? The fact you want to play teh game gives it value. It's something you WANT. Therefor it has value.
Hey I think the whole DRM thing is useless and stupid but the answer is not to steal it. If you're against the DRM just don't buy the game. When there are no sales they'll know how stupid the DRM is. If they see it being pirated they'll know it's popular and encourage them to try even harder to put some form of DRM on their next game. | |
| |  ThalerPremium
join:2004-02-02
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:3
 ·DSL EXTREME
| Re: Like Bioshock said by BF69:If they see it being pirated they'll know it's popular and encourage them to try even harder to put some form of DRM on their next game. I think you give them too much credit. Its hard to estimate the amount of pirated copies out at any given point in time. Instead, piracy becomes a scapegoat as to why sales didn't meet projections. Then, "the dance" begins:
•Game companies do the knee-jerk reaction of adding more restricting DRMs.
•Increasingly tight DRMs turn off legitimate customers from buying the game, or turning to piracy (which still remains unaffected).
Rinse, lather, and repeat. | |
| | | | | Re: Like Bioshock I have seen Bioshock played on friends computers, read the reviews and really would like to purchase it. But because of the DRM it has I refuse to purchase it. Same will be with Spore and other EA games. | |
| | | | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Like Bioshock said by ddevilduck:I have seen Bioshock played on friends computers, read the reviews and really would like to purchase it. But because of the DRM it has I refuse to purchase it. Same will be with Spore and other EA games. And that's your right. But just because you don't like DRM doesn't mean you have a right to use a bootleg copy either. | |
| | | | | ThalerPremium
join:2004-02-02
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·DSL EXTREME
| Re: Like Bioshock said by BF69:But just because you don't like DRM doesn't mean you have a right to use a bootleg copy either. No, but its avaliable, and avaliable for every game that's come out, or will come out, DRM or no. Its just retarded that pirates who pay nothing get a better game experience than the actual paying customers. | |
| | | | | | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Like Bioshock said by Thaler:said by BF69:But just because you don't like DRM doesn't mean you have a right to use a bootleg copy either. No, but its avaliable, and avaliable for every game that's come out, or will come out, DRM or no. Its just retarded that pirates who pay nothing get a better game experience than the actual paying customers. It sucks that con men that prey on old people and steal their money get to live in nice houses drive nice cars and do whatever they want. Doesn't mean I'm going to choose to be like them. | |
| | | | | | | ThalerPremium
join:2004-02-02
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·DSL EXTREME
1 edit | Re: Like Bioshock Last I checked, con men were never trying to operate a real business. However, EA is. (some might disagree that point even though, lol) As a business, it should behoove them to actually encourage customers to buy their product.
EA should quit giving their customers even more reasons to not buy their product. Some pirates will always steal, however, there are many legitimate customers that will trade convenience for money. (ie. see iTunes) Having customers jump through install/uninstall hoops to get their product to work isn't conductive to sucessful sales. | |
|
| Reviews:
 ·Mediacom
| said by BF69:said by karlmarx:DRM brings the value of the product down to ZERO. So if it has ZERO value, then when you download a copy, you aren't really stealing. Nice way to justify your illegal activities. That is tupid logic. So if I feel something in your house has "zero value" I can come in and take it? The fact you want to play teh game gives it value. It's something you WANT. Therefor it has value. Hey I think the whole DRM thing is useless and stupid but the answer is not to steal it. If you're against the DRM just don't buy the game. When there are no sales they'll know how stupid the DRM is. If they see it being pirated they'll know it's popular and encourage them to try even harder to put some form of DRM on their next game. If a pirated product works better than a paid for copy, WHY PAY FOR IT?
DRM simply dos not work. It does not deter 'casual pirates' as they call them. The simple fact is - person not willing to buy your game will not do it. He will get it for free and you need to accept that. Focus on making a good product and people that will buy it. Meaning don't piss them off and push them to 'the dark side'.
I'll pay $50-$60 for a good game ANYTIME but if you think I will put up with this SHIT and be treated like a criminal and give you my $50 for this *privilege* you are dead wrong!
Also if you can *make a copy* of any item from my home and take it with you, fell free. | |
|
| | said by karlmarx:DRM brings the value of the product down to ZERO. So if it has ZERO value, then when you download a copy, you aren't really stealing. Requiring the keys brings the vaule of your car to me down to ZERO. So if your car has ZERO value, then when I take it from your driveway, I'm really not stealing. | |
| |  dadkinsCan you do Blu?Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18 | Re: Like Bioshock said by skibby :said by karlmarx:DRM brings the value of the product down to ZERO. So if it has ZERO value, then when you download a copy, you aren't really stealing. Requiring the keys brings the vaule of your car to me down to ZERO. So if your car has ZERO value, then when I take it from your driveway, I'm really not stealing. *IF* you can make an exact digital copy of my car, have at it!
When one copies a game(or any other digital media), nothing is taken - it is copied!
Welcome to the digital world. 
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Like Bioshock said by dadkins:said by skibby :said by karlmarx:DRM brings the value of the product down to ZERO. So if it has ZERO value, then when you download a copy, you aren't really stealing. Requiring the keys brings the vaule of your car to me down to ZERO. So if your car has ZERO value, then when I take it from your driveway, I'm really not stealing. *IF* you can make an exact digital copy of my car, have at it! When one copies a game(or any other digital media), nothing is taken - it is copied! Welcome to the digital world. Really. Ok say a record sells 1,000,000 copies. Now say instead only 1 person bought a copy and those other 999,999 got a copy of that one instead of buying it. Are you telling me there isn't any difference to the record company in terms of profit? I beg to differ.
Oh and before someone says "well those 999,999 wouldn't have bought that record anyways". Well that's not an excuse to steal. I mean why should I have to PAY for that record and you get to enjoy it for FREE because you aren't willing to pay for it like me? Sorry no way. If it's worth having it's worth paying for it. And I don't want to hear "Well it's crap so I should get it for free" Well if something is crap why would you want it in the first place? Free or not. I mean if I put a pile of dog crap on a plate and said it was free would you eat it? | |
| | | | ThalerPremium
join:2004-02-02
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·DSL EXTREME
| Re: Like Bioshock said by BF69:Well that's not an excuse to steal. It's not stealing, otherwise, you would be prosecuted for theft, not copyright violations.
said by BF69:I mean why should I have to PAY for that record and you get to enjoy it for FREE because you aren't willing to pay for it like me? Because they're willing to take the risk of getting caught/charged, and you're not. People pirating software/music don't interfere with your enjoyment whatsoever.
said by BF69:Well if something is crap why would you want it in the first place? Nobody says that they don't want said pirated software/music, but they're just not willing to pay for the prices being offered them. For true pirates, this price is zero, and any amount of protection isn't going to stop them.
There is, however, a growing portion of consumers who feel that the product is genuinely too expensive, or that the customer service is lacking for the price being offered. These are the sales the music/game industries should try and pursue with vigor. Some companies get this (ie. see iTunes, Steam), and then there's EA who believes "forcing" these customers into their outdated pricing and/or shoddy service will do the trick.
Again, if anything the music DRM fiascos have proven, is that forcing people just doesn't work. Pirates will get around any protection they put out, and consumers will seek other channels, even outright boycott the brand itself if the DRM implementation is fubared enough.
Times change. Technology changes. Consumers change. Trying to force dated profit models on these changing markets just doesn't work. | |
| | | | | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Like Bioshock said by Thaler:Nobody says that they don't want said pirated software/music, but they're just not willing to pay for the prices being offered them. For true pirates, this price is zero, and any amount of protection isn't going to stop them. There is, however, a growing portion of consumers who feel that the product is genuinely too expensive, or that the customer service is lacking for the price being offered. These are the sales the music/game industries should try and pursue with vigor. Some companies get this (ie. see iTunes, Steam), and then there's EA who believes "forcing" these customers into their outdated pricing and/or shoddy service will do the trick. Again, if anything the music DRM fiascos have proven, is that forcing people just doesn't work. Pirates will get around any protection they put out, and consumers will seek other channels, even outright boycott the brand itself if the DRM implementation is fubared enough. Times change. Technology changes. Consumers change. Trying to force dated profit models on these changing markets just doesn't work. That is still not an excuse to pirate something. People really lack morals today. Sad sad. I see lot's of stuff I think is priced too high. Guess what I just don't use that product. I don't pirate it and still use it. I've been at people's houses that pull out bootleg copies of movies still in theaters and of course everyone else doesn't care as long as they get to see the movie. I walk out the door. | |
|
| | | | | Why should you have to pay? Well, because you choose to. What if you copied that SAME SONG from satellite radio? The quality is exactly the same as if you downloaded an MP3. Is that 'stealing'.
You can't 'steal' anything if you don't take the original away. If the Record company only SOLD 1 copy, then that means only ONE person thought it was worth the price. The fact that 999,999 other people have it means simply that the PRICE they were charging was too high. In your scenario, the CD was priced at $400.00. Only one person was willing to spend $400.00, everyone else didn't see the VALUE of that. It's exactly the same with games. If you lock it down with opressive DRM, that doesn't mean the game isn't good, it means that the VALUE of the game approaches ZERO. What if you couldn't PLAY a game until you entered a credit card number every time. How many people do you think would pay for that game? None at all.
If the game stops working for ANY reason, today, or at some undefined point in the future, then exactly what VALUE does that have. We live in a society where we BUY software, we don't RENT it. Sure, there are very tiny segments of the market where they RENT the software, but that market pales in comparison to the size of the market that is for SOLD software. I don't care WHAT the EULA says, If I freaking pay money for something, it's MINE. Period. And if you have the ability to take away what's MINE at some point in the future, then YOU are STEALING from ME.
That's right, STEALING from me, because unlike a copy, you are DENYING me the right to use what I purchased. Ergo, the VALUE placed on any item that can be revoked at the whim of a company is.... ZERO.
--
The happiest countries are the most secular. The struggle AGAINST corporations is the struggle FOR humanity! | |
| | | | | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Like Bioshock said by karlmarx:Why should you have to pay? Well, because you choose to. What if you copied that SAME SONG from satellite radio? The quality is exactly the same as if you downloaded an MP3. Is that 'stealing'. You can't 'steal' anything if you don't take the original away. If the Record company only SOLD 1 copy, then that means only ONE person thought it was worth the price. The fact that 999,999 other people have it means simply that the PRICE they were charging was too high. In your scenario, the CD was priced at $400.00. Only one person was willing to spend $400.00, everyone else didn't see the VALUE of that. It's exactly the same with games. If you lock it down with opressive DRM, that doesn't mean the game isn't good, it means that the VALUE of the game approaches ZERO. What if you couldn't PLAY a game until you entered a credit card number every time. How many people do you think would pay for that game? None at all. If the game stops working for ANY reason, today, or at some undefined point in the future, then exactly what VALUE does that have. We live in a society where we BUY software, we don't RENT it. Sure, there are very tiny segments of the market where they RENT the software, but that market pales in comparison to the size of the market that is for SOLD software. I don't care WHAT the EULA says, If I freaking pay money for something, it's MINE. Period. And if you have the ability to take away what's MINE at some point in the future, then YOU are STEALING from ME. That's right, STEALING from me, because unlike a copy, you are DENYING me the right to use what I purchased. Ergo, the VALUE placed on any item that can be revoked at the whim of a company is.... ZERO. You are stupid. So if I think the price of a Porche is too high I can just take one. That is your logic. Don't try to use the "it's a digital copy" so it doesn't matter crap excuse. Can I use your credit card and order stuff online? why not? I'm not actually stealing PHYSICAL money. I'm merely transfering DATA. If you feel something is not worth the price being charge then you have ZERO right to that product, PERIOD. If you can't see that then ther is no use tlalking to you anymore. The lack of even basic morals in this country today saddens me. | |
| | | | | | ThalerPremium
join:2004-02-02
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·DSL EXTREME
| Re: Like Bioshock said by BF69:Don't try to use the "it's a digital copy" so it doesn't matter crap excuse. Why, because it makes all the reteric you dish out totally null and void? That doesn't sound like a good reason.
Again, stealing != pirating. If you can't get past legal & logic basics 101, then its kind of hard to get any kind of discussion going.
So you feel "moral" doing your business, kudos. I'm sure he feels likewise. Sorry to say, not everyone in the world is going to come to a consensus on the same set of morals. Personally, I can't remember there ever being the 11th commandment, "Thou shall not Xerox other people's stuff."
Must've been on the "other" slab:
»www.youtube.com/watch?v=L940yIeVZzE | |
|
KearnstdElf WizardPremium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | buy the game and play the pirate version, it means you stay legal because you do own a license but you avoid the draconian DRM.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
| | | Bioshock wasn't "instantly" cracked. The Scene groups like Reloaded, Deviance, Vitality refused to touch it and some guy on P2P named Dark Coder cracked it 9 days after release. Not that it was any reason to celebrate since the game was buggy as hell and wasn't really playable until after the 1st patch a month later. | |
| KearnstdElf WizardPremium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | content providers invest in DRM because they generally hate the consumer once your credit card clears, and fear loss of control. They define control as basicly fully closed media format so riddled with DRM that making copies requires more work then an hour of OT in your job to simply buy a second copy.
of course as with any DRM lock, the consumer has to have both the lock and the key, so its hacked in a week.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
|
| |
|
