Re: Monthly Download rate limits in Comcast HSI http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r2054009 en Sat, 28 Nov 2009 23:18:24 EDT Sat, 28 Nov 2009 23:18:24 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2062477 LiLTizz : dAM I FELL FOR IT AND SWITCHED TO COMCAST PHONELINE LAST MONTH!!! aMERITECH IS CALLING BEGGING ME BACK WITH A HUNDRED DOLLAR CHECK, i THINK I BETTER IN CASE I NEED DSL,BET THERE WOULD BE PROBLEMS BRINGING IT THRU A COMCAST DIGITAL PHONELINE! :)
kEVIN
MEDIAONE.NET HAVE TILL THE 28TH TO DO THE TRANSITION OR LOSE SERVICE TO COMCAST.NET]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2062477 Sun, 23 Dec 2001 10:57:00 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2057710 jcerra : Of all the ideas that Comcast might be working with to raise revenues, this is the least likely, in my opinion.
This merger like just about every major corporate merger, needs to gain government approval, from the Federal Trade Commission. When industry leaders merge, all sorts of questions get asked, and all sorts of constituencies get their day. This will be a biggie in terms of constituencies.

Let's start with the FCC (Federal Communications Commission.) The FCC commissioner (Kennard is his name, I think) has already stepped forth. He gave "Friend of the Court" testimony in the Excite@Home bankruptcy case, with the view that the developments were not good for the development of broadband. He is now faced with an oligopoly (that is, a few large competitors that in aggregate control a large percent of the market) that will behave as if it has significant pricing power. More on this later.

What is broadband anyway? What is telecommunications capacity anyway. I recently read that 97% of the new coast-to-coast telecommunications capacity that was built in the late 90's is unused, we only use 3% of capacity.
Guess who financed it? The same bondholders that owned Excite@Home bonds. And what do you think they tell the management of the dying telco's that they financed? Go fight that merger.

It's an interesting strategy. ATT/Comcast will own the end of the links, and can bottleneck them and extract a higher price to open the valves. DSL is a reasonable substitute for most people, but the price is a bit high if Speed is your game. ATT/Comcast will have to prove to the FCC that the merger isn't anti-competitive. Where will it all shake out?

Predications:

1. The data limit theory is a pure bluff by the ATT officials who think it is leverage against the telco's who might argue against the merger to the FCC. It doesn't serve national interests, it doesn't help promote new and valuable uses and technologies in the WEB, it isn't a existing, commonly accepted business practice-the FTC will punt the merger if these words are ever said to them. Meanwhile, the DSL crowd are likely to run lots of advertising to the effect of "NO DATA LIMITS" appealing to many who have big volume needs but aren't speed critical.

ATT/Comcast will lose this line of discussion as soon as the champagne hangover clears up.

2. Tiered Pricing. This is an accepted business practice, and is generally allowed when capacity is limited. By charging higher prices to users who want "more" or "faster" or "better" it is a good way to allocate resources to those who can justify paying a higher price. In theory, the highest price is "the highest and best usage" of the good.

But wait! Is there a shortage of the resource? 97% of the national infrastructure lies unused. No shortage, by my standards. What is in shortage is the cable line into the house. That access is generally granted by the local municipality. It is, defacto, a monopoly. And monopolies generally are regulated and closely monitored to prevent abuse of the pricing power inherent in a monopoly.

I would argue that tiered pricing would not be allowed unless ATT/Comcast allows third party ISP's access to the system. (Like Excite@Home) At least then there is competion, and with competition a stronger ability to defend tiered pricing.

Since it is not in the national interest to restrict usage, I predict that there will be no tiered pricing plans until third party ISP's can offer products on the network.

Now, what will tiered pricing actually tier? Since I have argued that data limits are an idea whose time has passed, Speed would be the next item to be tiered, right? Well, I'm not sure. If speed is an item that will be improved by new capital spending, then the FTC might go along with allowing higher prices for higher speeds. But, if the tiering is created by a signal that caps your download speed (an artificial restraint) then I'm not so sure the FTC will buy in. Again, the capacity is there, and the national interest isn't served by slower vs faster.

So, what conclusion do I draw? Comcast had already made noises about not providing IRC and news servers. (Think HBO & Showtime.) Betcha they offer those services for a few extra bucks. Where they can, they will tier by speed and throw in the other basic services as premiums. It will be tricky though. Despite the macho speed talk, most users can live with 768/128, and I predict that DSL will soon be competitive there at $39 per month, all services provided. Once it gets there it provides meaningful competition to ATT/Comcast.

The only new product they might be able to deliver is widely available telephony by cable. I haven't thought much about it, since I don't understand it well. But this is potentially a high value added service that gives cable a significant advantage over DSL.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2057710 Sat, 22 Dec 2001 15:07:22 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2054973 rpcohen :
said by andrewe77:
Watching a streaming video is not against the service agreement that you abide to as a user, running a server IS!


I thought this discussion was about monthly download limits not uploads.

said by andrewe77:
Doesn't matter which consumes more bandwidth.


Of course it does! Isn't bandwidth the ultimate limiting factor? If Comcast is considering limiting downloads then isn't it bandwidth on which they are placing the value?[/QUOTE]

said by andrewe77:
I can guanantee you that with over 1 megabit upload speeds that I see in my area, that many people are taking advantage of running servers and saturating the pipe.


I would imagine that an area that has over 1Mb upload speeds probably doesn't have very many people "saturating" the pipe with unsanctioned servers. Isn't it the nature of cable that the more people that would try to take advantage of high speed uploads the less bandwidth there is for everyone?

Please don't misunderstand, me, I do understand the potential for problems with unsanctioned servers. However, Comcast seems to be in the process of slapping on 128k upload caps throughout their system so those 1Mb uploads will likely soon disappear. The point I was trying to make, is that the type of content Comcast wants to push through their system requires high speed unlimited downloads. If you can't get that from them, then there's little need to purchase what they're selling.
[text was edited by author 2001-12-22 01:17:58]
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2054973 Sat, 22 Dec 2001 01:14:16 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2054146 cmc0 : analogx is a good program.i found out last month i downloaded 6.7GB of data.how is the limit gonna be on the download rate?I hope it is at least 7.0GB a month :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2054146 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 22:50:48 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2054009 newview : Here's the very first email I received in my new comcast.net inbox . . . (private information munged)

Note the "-A constant connection to provide you with unlimited usage"

I think I'll hold on to this email . . .

-----Original Message-----
From: Mail Administrator [mailto:Postmaster@msgstore01.icomcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2001 3:12 AM
To: xxxxxxxxxx@comcast.net
Subject: Welcome!

MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Welcome!
To: xxxxxxxxxx@comcast.net
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 03:11:42 -0500
From: Mail Administrator

Welcome to your new Comcast High-Speed Internet service! We look forward to bringing you the latest in Internet technology-Super-fast speed and access to exciting content services.

Here are some more features of your new service:

-A super fast Internet experience, streaming video and high-quality audio

-A constant connection to provide you with unlimited usage

-An express lane to your favorite Web sites and content from around the World

-An easy-to-navigate browser that gets you where you want to go...FAST

-Remote access to your e-mail account through the Web from virtually anywhere*

-"My File Locker" Personal and secure file storage on the Web*

-Customizable Web space to design your own Web pages*

For customer service and technical support, please contact us at »www.comcastonline.com/contactus.asp or call 1-888-793-0800, 24 hours a day, 7grous a week.

Welcome to ComcHT=1High-Speed Internet! The way the Internet should be.

*visit »www.comcast.net for a preview of coming attractions.
--
Where are we going? And what's with the hand basket?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2054009 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 22:27:20 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2053676 GotNoRice : Download this program
»www.analogx.com/contents/downloa···/nsl.htm

It will keep a record of just how much information goes through your line. After a month check it and you'll be surprised just how much information went through your connection by just doing normal web surfing.

It’s the biggest lie of all, that power users hog bandwidth. We may use more bandwidth than other people, but…

HELLO?!?

Why do you think us power users got broadband in the first place? I can’t believe there are people that actually believe this incredibly misleading lie that AT&T/Comcast has planted in your heads. If all some people do is surf the web and check emails then why the hell do they have a cable modem?!? I would even argue that it’s more their fault than any of ours, because they’ve implanted the idea into our ISP’s head that they can reduce our internet connection to scrap and impose horrible limitations on the service, and not have “99%” of the people care about it. I cannot fathom why there are people out there that actually think monthly download limits are a good thing! Why, because they don’t use that much of the service anyway? It doesn’t even matter! Just because there are some people that don’t use their connection as much as others, doesn’t mean they should sit idly by as the connection is slashed and gored from under them, because once we’re out of the way, who’s next? Who else are they going to try to blame for their sub-standard network? Who else are they going to shove aside in order to make another quick Dollar? Who? WHO!?!? Don’t be so naive to think that just because it’s not you this time it won’t be in the future.

And that filthy lie, which they keep repeating… Over and over again, that it’s us, the downloader’s of MP3’s and programs that slow down the network. LIES!

Do you know what the #1 cause of network slowdown is? Do you think it has anything to do with people who download files? NOT THE SLIGHTEST BIT!

Sit back from you computer and don’t touch anything, in fact, turn your computer off. Look at your cable modem, is the data light blinking? What could that possibly be from? Are you downloading Pr0n again? With your computer off? No? It’s all those damn viruses! Did you know that at this very moment there are countless viruses spreading across the cable modem network, infecting people’s computers and using them as platforms to spread it or to attack other computers? Every time that light blinks, that’s someone’s computer sending a packet in your direction, possibly and probably from a virus. Do you have any idea what kind of bandwidth that uses? When code-red came out, it slowed down the network slower than I’ve seen it in the 3 years I’ve had the service. Had nothing to do with anyone downloading files, running servers, or any other of that crap.

And do you know what the best part about it is? With monthly download limits, every time one of those viruses decides to try and see if it can infect your computer, it’s going to count against your monthly bandwidth! You’ll have the privilege of gazing at your cable modem in the middle of the night and seeing your monthly download quota waste away. I don’t see AT&T/Comcast trying to fix this either! It’s easier to use it as an excuse to crap on the service and charge you more, don’t be another ignorant zombie, stop believing these lies! ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2053676 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 21:44:05 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2052804 andrewe77 : Watching a streaming video is not against the service agreement that you abide to as a user, running a server IS! Doesn't matter which consumes more bandwidth. I can guanantee you that with over 1 megabit upload speeds that I see in my area, that many people are taking advantage of running servers and saturating the pipe.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2052804 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 19:54:24 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2052547 rpcohen :
said by andrewe77:
The problem is that some jerks run various servers, which is against your agreement with @home. Too bad they don't enforce it because that causes the rest of us that follow the rules to suffer.


No, the problem is more likely "jerks" like me who keep a 300kbs streaming video window open for hours at a time watching NASA broadcasts of ISS missions, etc. However, streaming video is precisely the type of thing that Comcast is betting on to attract even more people to broadband - something that download limits would discourage.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2052547 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 19:16:03 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2052162 gomer1701ems :
said by andrewe77:
The problem is that some jerks run various servers, which is against your agreement with @home. Too bad they don't enforce it because that causes the rest of us that follow the rules to suffer.


*sigh* Don't bash all people that run servers. Many hardly consume noticeable bandwith.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2052162 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 18:22:43 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051752 andrewe77 : The problem is that some jerks run various servers, which is against your agreement with @home. Too bad they don't enforce it because that causes the rest of us that follow the rules to suffer.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051752 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 17:13:50 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051661 anon : I include myself in the streamin video, download hog group. I download game demos, I play online, I watch news videos, I do most of my daily business online, I use the Internet for a phone book, etc.

None of us are NOT "bandwidth hogs." If we did not want the speed and volume that cable offers we would all be on some $5 dialup.

Stop the "I use less than you so I am better" crap. You are not better. It is just that your family drags you off the computer more often than the rest of us!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051661 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 16:56:31 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051483 anon : People who think game players are at risk are stupid, games take no more then 3-4 k/ sec each way. 24/7 gaming will not get you over 3gigs probably.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051483 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 16:22:33 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051203 andrewe77 : When you go to a buffet, you get one plate at a time. That's the upload/download caps. That is sufficient to keep the warez/ftp server jerks from eating more than their share.

It's not like we're "keeping" what we download. This is information and there's no need to limit how much of it I want to get per month, just limit how fast I can get it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051203 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 15:39:23 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051078 NPire : Not that I agree with this whole thing, but to play devil's advocate: If you go to a $4 all you can eat buffet, do you expect fine steak, veal, or lobster?? No, if you want fine dining you go to a nice sit down restaurant where you pay based on how much you eat. If you want a premium service, be prepared to pay for it. If not, well then stick with the mystery meat and dust off that dial-up modem... If they make it cheaper for those of us that aren't warez/mp3/streaming video freaks, it will benefit 99% of the users... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2051078 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 15:16:33 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2049528 Elrod8 : This is unbelieveable! I have always concidered myself lucky to be able to get broadband. I will, however, dust off that old 56K modem if these things are true. What are these people thinking? I am dumbfounded!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2049528 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 11:16:29 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2049160 Zhen-Xjell : Funny.. last year broadband was booming, it was soaring to new heights in all the threads we had here. Today? 180 degree turn in discussions.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2049160 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 10:12:39 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2049130 seaquake : Don't be surprised when the DSL companies decide to do the same thing with limits. It is a domino effect. When one airline lowers ticket prices, all airlines follow suit.

I hope common sense gets to these people before this happens. Otherwise, we'll all be back on dial up and broadband will indeed be dead.
--
After a time you may come to realize that having is not such a pleasing thing as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2049130 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 10:08:12 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2049077 Zhen-Xjell : Oh I missed the boat in earlier threads.. downloading LIMIT!!! Oh that's bad.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2049077 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 09:57:46 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2048487 MojoBromley9 : If they do that well....... Hello DSL....you look good now!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2048487 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 07:25:28 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2048363 pete25 : I think everyone just needs to wait and see for themselves. All these rumors are just crap.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2048363 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 06:10:46 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2047987 GotNoRice : I don't have any other real form of broadband available here, if they do monthly download limits i'm screwed]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2047987 Fri, 21 Dec 2001 02:33:19 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046741 nanofever : Well I'm glad that comcast doesn't have contracts or I might actually have to think for an extra split second before I call and order dsl from sbc. If this is more than a rumor att just shot themselfs in the foot with a elephant gun.

dsl level caps on download with 1/4 level uploads + download limits NO other broadband company in the US has + overloaded nodes = an empty att network]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046741 Thu, 20 Dec 2001 22:50:40 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046468 krazykulguy : I agree, this is worse then download and upload caps and hourly dialup fees combined.

I hope they implment tierd pricing instead of this crap.

here comes 1000 more petitions about cable BB]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046468 Thu, 20 Dec 2001 22:22:30 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046446 ferretwoman : I can't see how this would work. The first month someone got capped like this and either had to pay more money, or just didn't have access, I wouldn't be surprised if they would be looking elsewhere for their internet service, such as DSL or even satellite. Might be slower, but at least you have access whenever you want for the same price per month. This is a way to drive customers AWAY from your service, not provide more income!

Linda]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046446 Thu, 20 Dec 2001 22:20:45 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046413 GotNoRice : you would think, but AT&T has a bad habit of making everything "rumors" until it smacks you right in the face. Keep in mind that the day before they switched the @Home users over to their own network, they were calling the Email address change a "Rumor".]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046413 Thu, 20 Dec 2001 22:17:20 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046333 NPire : Is this all still just speculation by the CEO of a company that just got bought out? How do they plan to implement this Fair Access Policy? Will users purchasing the higher package be exempt from being FAP'ed? Will they sell extra bandwidth by the gigabyte, or is it a free for all once you pay the extra fee? Those of you that are familiar with the policies of DirecWAY know of their FAP methods. They currently slow down the speed of a user temporarily after a download limit has been exceeded. Although my friends with this service say it is a pain, it is tolerable compared to 56k. I have never heard of a reputable company that simply cuts users off.... Before everyone goes off on a tangent about switching to DSL, is there any real information available on this subject??? Not to belittle this issue, but remember last month when we were all worried about being cut off? Nobody seems to have any real facts yet and their is no point in squabbling over rumors and speculation...
[text was edited by author 2001-12-20 22:13:48]
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046333 Thu, 20 Dec 2001 22:08:10 EDT Re: Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046174 teddystacker : I totally agree - all this is designed to Screw extra money out of us.I am a "power user" as I Video confrence EVERY day with my daughter in England for about 60 mins - this is the whole reason I got cable in the first place.Looks like Comcast are gonna force her only to see her Daddy a couple of Days a week in future - how the **** am I gonna explain that sort of stuff to a 9 year old? ...But I doubt the policy makers at Comcast EVEN consider or think about these sort of uses that their service gets...

If this is true and they do limit useage - then this is a black day for sure...

This sort of thing (along with the D/l speed cap) is going to put Broadband back FIVE years NOT draw more customers - why cant they see this??? dont these people have any brains?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046174 Thu, 20 Dec 2001 21:52:01 EDT Monthly Download rate limits http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046050 GotNoRice : Monthly download limits.

An idea so stupid, so ill conceived that most people that have heard of it scoff at it like it couldn’t happen. So what are Monthly Download limits? Well, former users of Roseville, California’s RCS internet DSL service and other similar services need no introduction. They experienced it for a long time up until their service was bought out by a company that had more intellect. Monthly Download limits limit the amount of data that is transmitted to and from your computer in a given month. Unlike download caps, which simply limit the amount of data per second you can receive, monthly download limits impair functionality.

Every time you do something over the internet, whether it’s basic web surfing or downloading massive files from fast servers, you’re transferring data over your connection. This isn’t just downloading files, no sir; this is anything, anything at all that you do with your internet connection. Imagine that you are a person that uses your computer a lot, which I imagine many of you do. You download a lot, play a lot of online games, and download a lot of songs from the internet, listen to online radio. This is the very reason why you bought a “High-Speed” Connection isn’t it? Currently you can do this as much as you want, as many times as you want, with no limitations what so ever except for the recent speed cap which only limits the speed at which you do these things. About the 10th of the month, 1/3rd of the way through the billing cycle, your modem stops working. You call tech support and describe the problem to them. They reply that since the 1st of the month, you have transferred 3Gigabytes of information to your computer (the combination of everything you’ve done on your connection since the 1st), and that if you want to keep using the service for the rest of the month, you will be forced to pay an additional fee.

You have just become a victim of a monthly download limit. A step in the wrong direction. something not done by any respectable company in the last 5 years. Not only now, are you limited by how fast you can use your internet connection, now you are limited as to how much you can use your internet connection. This is the reality of monthly download limits. The result of the never ending quest of broadband ISP’s to get more bang for their buck at the customers expense. Their ideal customer is 85 years old, and simply checks their email once every other day. Why do they even have a fast connection? There may not be a good answer for that. Now days if you do more than casual web surfing and checking your email, you are no longer an innocent Broadband customer. That Video you just downloaded of your kids wedding, that security patch you just downloaded from windows update, those Anti-Virus update files, that picture of your newborn child that your wife accidentally left in bitmap format, that radio station you listen to over the internet, those songs you like to play, those chat rooms you like to visit, Those messages you like to send to your friends, that webpage you like to visit with all those funny pictures, and those stock quotes you check every few minutes. No you’re not an innocent user at all. You’re a bandwidth hog now, and your ISP is going to make you pay.

Welcome to the world of AT&T-Comcast.

»www.computerworld.com/storyba/0,···,00.html

"Eder added that the company intends to sharply limit the amount of data a user can download in a month without paying a higher fee. "We're in the a la carte business now," Eder said, adding that AT&T Broadband can no longer support At Home's "all you can eat" policies that led to abuse of the system."]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,2046050 Thu, 20 Dec 2001 21:37:07 EDT