seagreen
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 ·Rock Island Commun..
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3 edits | reply to GeekJedi
Re: Centurytel drops NebuAd
Well, I got the email today from CTel:
said by email :
CenturyTel is not currently using online behavioral advertising tools in any of its markets, and we are delaying our plans to move forward with the deployment of online behavioral advertising services - either through NebuAd or any other vendor - at this time. CenturyTel is delaying its implementation plans so that Congress can spend additional time addressing the privacy issues and policies associated with online behavioral advertising.
This is, in no way, particularly reassuring. They clearly are not renouncing the concept. I believe the company suits continue to look at this potential revenue stream with great longing and that our privacy will once again be for sale once they figure out a way to implement this scheme in a way that won't come back to bite them legally.
edit to add: It's also clear that NebuAd isn't giving up and will be looking at ways to "educate" our lawmakers and privacy advocates. NebuAD Responds To ISP Backlash. In other words, they'll throw some money around where they think it will do them some good.
What is particularly telling is that they are not simply going to an "opt-in" setup which would likely fail spectacularly. It continues to be an "opt-out" scenario which clearly they assume the average person connecting to the Internet will not do. |
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GeekJedi
RF is Good For You
Premium
join:2001-06-21
Mukwonago, WI
clubs: | reply to funchords
Yeah, but you really can't compare the two... |
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funchords
Hello
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join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
 ·Skype
| reply to GeekJedi
That's fine, but -- especially in the TelCo world -- there's stupidity and there's criminal wiretapping.
I've checked 18 USC 2511 and I can't find the Stupidity defense.      |
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GeekJedi
RF is Good For You
Premium
join:2001-06-21
Mukwonago, WI
clubs:
·CenturyLink
·VOIPo
·Vonage
 ·RoadRunner Cable
1 edit | reply to seagreen
I understand, but to quote Hanlon:
"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity."
I don't think the people involved thought for a minute that what they were doing was nefarious. They simply were offered a way to potentially generate a new revenue stream. For companies, it's easy to see things the way you want to see them when there is money involved.
Believe me, I'm not defending them, but I do understand how big business works. Many times, the "evil plot" was simply hatched by some middle manager who doesn't know any better.
--
The goal of the broadcast engineer is to get all the meters on the transmitter to go as far to the right as possible!! |
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funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC | reply to seagreen
Your skepticism is healthy -- keep it.
That said, corporations don't admit that they were wrong. Something being suspended indefinitely is probably the best we're ever going to get from Charter, CenturyTel, or Embarq. |
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seagreen
Premium,Mod
join:2001-05-14
out there | reply to GeekJedi
I guess I'm just skeptical because, (to me), any company who has once shown their willingness to engage in nefarious behavior will likely do so again. |
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GeekJedi
RF is Good For You
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Mukwonago, WI
clubs:
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2 edits | reply to seagreen
Sounds to me like they've given it up. Seeing as they're telling anyone who asks as much, and changing their privacy policy is pretty concrete proof.
If they were simply waiting on congress, why go through the trouble of changing anything? It would be much better from a PR standpoint to say nothing and continue on as usual. That way, if they decide to actually continue, they wouldn't have to tip their hand, since the wording would already be there. It seems to me that they realize that it isn't going anywhere, and instead of saying "oops" they're using this as an out - "delaying" it forever, essentially.
It makes little sense to go as far as to openly say they aren't going to do it *and* change their privacy policy to reflect that, only to flip-flop down the road.
--
The goal of the broadcast engineer is to get all the meters on the transmitter to go as far to the right as possible!! |
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seagreen
Premium,Mod
join:2001-05-14
out there
·Rock Island Commun..
Host:
CenturyTel
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Southern California
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1 edit | reply to GeekJedi
said by GeekJedi  :The proof is there - NebuAd is history. I think that that conclusion is premature, at best. They apparently are waiting to see which way the congressional winds are blowing before proceeding. No where do they state that they figured out it was a really bad idea to be spying on their customers.  |
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GeekJedi
RF is Good For You
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Mukwonago, WI
clubs:
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| reply to BigVe
said by BigVe :I am a Centurytel subsciber with 2 accounts and i have not seen ANY email from them even slightly mentioning any changes either way so i still assume that they use NebuAd or something similar.The change in Privacy Policy don't mean nothing.Besides, if you read a little closer you will find that Nothing is really changed what it goes for 'spying' on your browsing habits.Spying is 1 thing but using a place snooping around that is worse than a Trojan.To bad i don't have any other choice for ISP or i would drop them really fast. Don't assume...it's dangerous.
Anyway, they won't be sending you anything, because you didn't ask them to. The proof is there - NebuAd is history.
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The goal of the broadcast engineer is to get all the meters on the transmitter to go as far to the right as possible!! |
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funchords
Hello
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join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
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| reply to funchords
Here is the text that they appear to be sending to people who write in to ask about NebuAd:
CenturyTel is not currently using online behavioral advertising tools in any of its markets, and we are delaying our plans to move forward with the deployment of online behavioral advertising services - either through NebuAd or any other vendor - at this time. CenturyTel is delaying its implementation plans so that Congress can spend additional time addressing the privacy issues and policies associated with online behavioral advertising.
CenturyTel highly values our customers' personal privacy, and we are committed to protecting our customers' personal information. More detailed information about CenturyTel's data collection and use practices can be obtained by reviewing our Privacy Policy at »www.centurytel.com/Pages/PrivacyPolicy/. --
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
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BigVe
join:2005-07-15
Gulliver, MI
·CenturyLink
1 edit | reply to funchords
said by funchords :I'm happy to report that CenturyTel has dropped NebuAd. In a private email to me from a CenturyTel subscriber, the company told him today that it is no longer using NebuAd or any other Behavioral Targeting service. The subscriber also observed, and I have confirmed, that the paragraph mentioning the service and the links to Opt Out of it, have been removed from CenturyTel's Privacy Policy page. (pdf files attached for historical reference) --Robb I am a Centurytel subsciber with 2 accounts and i have not seen ANY email from them even slightly mentioning any changes either way so i still assume that they use NebuAd or something similar.The change in Privacy Policy don't mean nothing.Besides, if you read a little closer you will find that Nothing is really changed what it goes for 'spying' on your browsing habits.Spying is 1 thing but using a place snooping around that is worse than a Trojan.To bad i don't have any other choice for ISP or i would drop them really fast. |
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funchords
Hello
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join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
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1 edit |  reply to seagreen
I'm happy to report that CenturyTel has dropped NebuAd. In a private email to me from a CenturyTel subscriber, the company told him today that it is no longer using NebuAd or any other Behavioral Targeting service.
The subscriber also observed, and I have confirmed, that the paragraph mentioning the service and the links to Opt Out of it, have been removed from CenturyTel's Privacy Policy page. (pdf files attached for historical reference)
--Robb
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
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seagreen
Premium,Mod
join:2001-05-14
out there
·Rock Island Commun..
Host:
CenturyTel
Wireless Service P..
Southern California
HughesNet Satellite
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| reply to nunya
Re: Centurytel and NebuAd
said by nunya :I'd like to know how NebuAd works Read the article linked in my post directly above yours. In it is a very good description about how NebuAd works.
I don't think there is much the end user can directly do to thwart the tracking.
What users of other ISP's have done is get their congressmen/women involved and looking into the wiretap & privacy laws relative to this technology. Charter, one of the other ISPs who had planned to make use of this technology has seemingly backed off on it now: »After Charter's Decision To Drop NebuAD, Will Other ISPs Follow? |
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nunya
SEE ROCK CITY 475 MILES
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join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
clubs:
·AT&T CallVantage
| reply to seagreen
If enough people were to use Track Me Not, I wonder if it would help obfuscate the mining of information?
I'd like to know how NebuAd works and if there is any grassroots effort to combat it or render it useless.
--
All we need now is a car that runs on milk. |
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seagreen
Premium,Mod
join:2001-05-14
out there
·Rock Island Commun..
Host:
CenturyTel
Wireless Service P..
Southern California
HughesNet Satellite
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| reply to drkllpnt94
Source: NebuAd and Partner ISPs:
Wiretapping, Forgery and Browser Hijacking
said by report :
1. Unique Identification: The NebuAd device ties a customer’s individual record maintained by the ISP to an alphanumeric code (called a “hash code”). This method allows NebuAd to uniquely and persistently to identify individuals without ISPs needing to release data from billing records.
A man-in-the-middle (MITM) attack: MITM is a form of active eavesdropping in which the attacker makes independent connections with the victims and relays messages between them. The MITM intercepts and conveys messages going between the two victims and injects convincing replacement messages.
This attack is a MITM because NebuAd is inserted into the network between end points. To cause the browser to load cookies, it inserts code by impersonating the end-point server and adding JavaScript at a time when the real end-point server would end its transmission.
NebuAd exploits normal browser and platform security behaviors by forging IP packets, allowing their own JavaScript code to be written into source code trusted by the Web browser. NebuAd and ISPs together cooperate in this attack against the intentions of the consumers, the designers of their software and the owners of the servers that they visit.
Furthermore, the so-called opt-out in no way assures the Centurytel customer that their movements are not being tracked. |
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drkllpnt94
drkllpnt
Premium
join:2007-10-04
Jena, LA
1 edit | reply to seagreen
tstolze,
Why do you think there is an "Opt-in" link as well? Are they just teasing CenturyTel customers because by default they are already being monitored... |
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chd176
join:2003-01-10
Winfield, AL | reply to dsldude08
At least those (with AT&T anyway) are free I was refering to ad's via third party that would charge you if you aren't on a messaging package. Fun stuff... |
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dsldude08
Premium,VIP
join:2008-01-03
La Crosse, WI | reply to chd176
I have US Cellular and I already get ads sent to me via text messaging. Mostly they are advertising trivia games and things you can win, but yes, you are right. |
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chd176
join:2003-01-10
Winfield, AL
·CenturyLink
| reply to seagreen
Wow this is just as bad as the "ads" DirecTV injects into the HR20 for new channels and what not. I'm just glad we haven't gotten to the point (yet but it's very close) that we get ad's sent via MMS and SMS to our cell phones.
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10,000/768 CenturyTel PPPoE DSL line (really 5,000/768 ) |
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seagreen
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join:2001-05-14
out there
·Rock Island Commun..
Host:
CenturyTel
Wireless Service P..
Southern California
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| reply to tstolze
said by tstolze :I have not done any investigating on how this works. Will it still work if you don't use CT's DNS servers?. I don't know precisely how it works other than it is hardware wired in to the ISP's network and which uses deep packet inspection. It's doubtful that it could bypassed so simply as using other DNS servers.
FWIW: I haven't used Centurytel DNS servers for a long time because they are so slow and often unreachable. I use treewalk and OpenDNS. |
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