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<title>Canadian bill to target illegal downloads in Canadian Chat</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r20629140</link>
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<language>en</language>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 03:03:49 EDT</pubDate>
<lastBuildDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 03:03:49 EDT</lastBuildDate>

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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20655339</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : Here's a good read by someone who is better at putting words to the problem than I am:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.brendonwilson.com/blog/2008/06/16/talking-points-to-defeat-bill-c-61/" >www.brendonwilson.com/blog/2008/&middot;&middot;&middot;ll-c-61/</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The bill is bad for Canadians for a number of reasons:<br><br>   1. It reduces your rights: Consumers will continue to be able to use copyrighted materials for research, private study, criticism, review or news reporting, but will no longer have the means to exercise those rights when the copyrighted materials are protected by DRM.<br><br>   2. It reduces reduces the usefulness of your media: Consumers will no longer have the right to take commonly purchased physical media, such as DVDs, or downloaded DRM-protected files, such as digital music, and make copies for their personal use.<br><br>   3. It forces you to buy media you&#146;ve already purchased: Consumers will be unable to unlock media they&#146;ve legally purchased in the past for use on new devices, and hence will be forced to buy the same content again and again.<br><br>   4. It makes your devices less useful: Consumers will be able to do less, not more, with new devices they purchase, as many of these device may, at any time, limit the user&#146;s access to media they have a legal right to view, modify, or redistribute.<br><br>   5. It reduces competition and innovation: Consumers will be unable to influence the market by finding new uses for their existing media and copyrighted materials, limiting the application of ingenuity that can lead to the creation of new applications and markets for Canadians and the world.<br><br>   6. It makes the public domain works inaccessible: Consumers will have the right to re-use works in the public domain, but in cases where those public domain works are protected by DRM consumers will not have the means to exercise those rights and hence lose access to their own heritage.<hr></blockquote><br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 10:51:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20655125</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : &raquo;<A HREF="http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20080617" >ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20080617</A><br><br>"no mashups, no criticism and no satire"]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:55:38 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650719</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/833344"><b>Cliffy</b></A> : And don't forget for almost 10 years consumers were asking media companies for the ability to purchase content online. They were willing to hand over money, but no one took them up on the offer. Imagine if big media got on this bandwagon as soon as they could have. I bet they would have been rolling in money.<br><br>And once we did start getting the ability to purchase digital content the ugly head of DRM appeared. I personally don't think DRM does anything more than annoy and "criminalize" the honest person. Like you mention, people that try and do the right thing get screwed over. It is the people that don't pay that are not inconvenienced at all. ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 12:30:42 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650666</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1388405"><b>elwoodblues</b></A> : I originally posted this in the Rogers forum , where there are mainly folks who are upset that their torrenting will be disrupted :<br><br>Here is what I have an issue with.<br><br>I'm not going to get into downloading or P2P of content or sharing that content with friends and family, we all know it's illegal.<br><br>My nephew recently got an IPod Nano for this birthday, my sister (his Aunt) decided it would be really cool to get him a couple of Star Wars movies he could watch on his Nano.<br><br>She bought them from the Itunes store and downloaded them to her Mac, burned them to a DVD and tried to put it on his NANO via his PC. NO SUCH LUCK, the DRM Prevents such an action.<br><br>She knows I can get it for her in a heartbeat, but I got an email from here ranting about trying to be legal and getting screwed over.<br><br>So now we have two choices (one currently illegal, the other would be illegal under Bill 61).<br><br>One I can download either a DVD(or find a version that will play on his Ipod) and compress it to QVGA (x264) or I can rip the DRM out of the movies.<br><br>In the case above she has have bought and paid for the content but due to "digtal locks" she's SOL trying to give him the movies.<br><br>Now you could argue, just install Itunes on his PC and buy it there, yes you are correct, but now I've had to buy the movies TWICE because of the DRM (and at the same time would ruin the surprise,but thats not the concern of Media Giants and remember most people aren't savvy enough to realize the content is only licensed for that one PC).<br><br>Also look at this:<br>The DVD is currently some 13yrs old. I am going to assume that most of you here have seen a video cassette tape?<br><br>Pretty durable right? Unless you rip the tape out of the cartridge,not much is going to happen to it.<br><br>Now a DVD can be scratched, or rendered useless due to mishandling (by young kids), so a technologically savvy parent would backup the DVD or burn a copy for the kids to use, while preserving the original. Teach the kids how to handle the disc? Sure (and I have taught my oldest nephew how do to so), but accidents happen.<br><br>Preserving your investment in the content, you aren't stealing anything, but if Bill 61 became law, such parent could be considered a criminal and subject to a 20K fine.<br><br>Again you could argue, well if the kids have wrecked the DVD go out and buy another one. (and lets not get into the analogy of wrecked toys.. I can't make copies of those) Why? I have the ways and means of making a copy (for MY PERSONAL USE).<br><br>So ask yourself what have I done wrong? What have I done thats so wrong that warrants a large fine or imprisonment (in a Federal Penitentiary)<br><br>The Government, and the media giants will spin it in such a way that its about downloading (and that is an issue), but I have just shown you two perfectly legitimate ways in which a person or persons could (if caught) could be subject to large fines for breaking "digital locks"<br><br>What about background music for a video you made for YouTube? I'm not making a buck off that video (Google on the other hand.....) so unless I've gotten clearance, I could be subject to that same 20K fine. (and lets be honest what teen is going to be able to get clearance on a tune for<br>free)<br><br>I'm all for intellectual property rights, but this law is just badly written (probably written my the same Media giants and comprises their wet dream wish list) that it just cries to be left on the order paper to die.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 12:20:09 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650640</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1388405"><b>elwoodblues</b></A> : It's not fair to the consumer, but Big Media doesn't give a flying hoot about the consumer (You really gotta watch  <A HREF="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0096256/plotsummary"> They Live </a>It may be dated, but boy does it it hit close to home today), they want us to consume.. and by consume, they  mean buy a copy of the content for each platform we want to use it on.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 12:14:54 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650603</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1388405"><b>elwoodblues</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Tyreman <A HREF="/useremail/u/700900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Maybe they'll water down the bill to appease people who purchased the cd or dvd. allow them to move it to differing digital playback devices<br> </div>IF this bill goes forward, the reformists will take a page out of Mulroney's playbook. He introduced GST at 9%, people screamed, they howled (not unlike this bill). He dropped it to 7% and everything was silent.<br><br>I suspect they'll take some of the more ostentatious parts of the bill out (while remaing rather draconian) and all will be quiet.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 12:06:42 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650579</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1388405"><b>elwoodblues</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Hydraglass <A HREF="/useremail/u/627680"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>(I could go on and on here) - in essence they want things to act like they did in the 1950s and 1960s.  You couldn't copy vinyl records - you could only use them on record players. You couldn't record radio broadcasts or tv broadcasts - you had to watch them when they sent them - they knew best when you should sit down and listen to a radio or tv show afterall.  There was no internet. There was no digital distribution. There was no time shifting. If you wanted "high def" you had to go to a theatre and watch content on 35mm or 70mm cellulose - when they wanted you to. </div>Wrong. You could copy and LP or 45 to tape. You could record OTA TV to tape (if you have the money). If you lived in many parts of Canada you could easily timeshift, as shows were run at different times in Canada and the US. Sometimes episodes were seen only in Canada and not in the US at all (anyone remember the Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour?). And there were lots of other things we did  of watching TV and surfing the internet.  ;)<br> </div>You've hit the nail on the wall, if the broadcast flag does indeed start preventing me from recording shows(time shifting) then I will putting up that Antenna, and watching my HD content Over the Air)and end up recording to my computer]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 12:03:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650523</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1388405"><b>elwoodblues</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  StEC <A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Under the terms of purchase you only own the medium, not the content. Ownership of the content remains with the copyright holder. The EULA governs how you can use that content, including approved devices.  Read up on what copyright means.<br><br>If you don't like the copyright terms, don't buy the content.<br> </div>WOW your a piece of work you sound suspiciously like them RIAA/MPAA dudes...how much they paying you!? LMFAO<br> </div>That's actually true, even with DVD's , you don't "own" that movie, you are granted a license to view in a private setting (which dosn't mean inviting ten of your friends over.. thats a "Public" viewing")]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650523</guid>
<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 11:52:17 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650499</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1388405"><b>elwoodblues</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Airwolf <A HREF="/useremail/u/506168"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>What about if it was a DVD from a yard sale?<br>Supposed to ask if they take Master Card?<br> </div>In this case you would have the original DVD, so there is nothing to worry about]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 11:48:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20650071</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : Thank you advocat - I'd sent out some feelers to friends in the know in order to get that info and you beat them to the punch.<br><br>So - again - since it is legal _now_ to make copies for personal use or to format shift... is it wrong?<br><br>BTW, EULAs and edicts from copyright holders do _not_ overrule the letter of law unless they give additional permissions - not take them away.<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 10:20:48 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20649851</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><b>Clipper</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  dirtyjeffer <A HREF="/useremail/u/589128"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>i don't understand why they don't understand that taking the music/videos/software/whatever and not paying for it is wrong...i am not trying to preach to anyone, hell, i have a bunch of mp3's i downloaded a while ago too...but you can't complain about possible changes when they attempt to fix something that is clearly broken. </div>We're not talking about downloading music, which should, 100%, be illegal.  <br><br>We're not talking about making a copy of a DVD and sharing it with your friends, which should, 100%, be illegal.<br><br>We are talking about format shifting content purchased through one medium, to use on another.  With the current form of the Bill, this would be illegal.  An individual would have to purchase a second copy of the EXACT same content to use on an alternate media, for personal use ONLY. <br><br>That's wrong and borders on criminal.  <br><br>The current copyright act has multiple provisions for the fair personal use exceptions.  Interpret that as, fair dealings for the consumer.  The entire copyright act exists to protect the copyright holders.  <br><br>To summarize, the copyright act protects the copyright holders by it's mere existance, and the exceptions and fair dealing provisions of the act protect the consumer.<br><br>Both parties are protected and both parties have their interests taken into account.<br><br>Jim Prentice even said this himself:  The spirit of the amendments are to bring it up to speed with the current technological capabilities, to make it fair for copyright holders and consumers alike.<br><br>This encryption bypass provision does not make it fair for consumers and is the only part of the amendments I have a severe issue with.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 09:21:59 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20649678</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/661652"><b>Advocat</b></A> : It's interesting, but probably not surprising, that we essentially have two groups posting.  One says they agree with the new bill.  The other says they agree that copyright holders should be paid, but that criminalizing actions which were specifically legal up till this bill is an excessive act by a government caving in to US pressure.<br><br>Very few people are saying breaking or copying everything and placing on the Net should be legal... but each side just keeps repeating their mantra without listening to the other side.<br><br>Has the making copies of digital material, or converting it for use in other formats, been legal according to the Copyright Act?<br><br>Absolutely, under Section 30.6 of the Act, which was deemed to cover electronic media:<br><br>"Permitted acts<br><br>30.6 It is not an infringement of copyright in a computer program for a person who owns a copy of the computer program that is authorized by the owner of the copyright to<br><br>(a) make a single reproduction of the copy by adapting, modifying or converting the computer program or translating it into another computer language if the person proves that the reproduced copy is<br><br>(i) essential for the compatibility of the computer program with a particular computer,<br><br>(ii) solely for the person&#146;s own use, and<br><br>(iii) destroyed immediately after the person ceases to be the owner of the copy; or<br><br>(b) make a single reproduction for backup purposes of the copy or of a reproduced copy referred to in paragraph (a) if the person proves that the reproduction for backup purposes is destroyed immediately when the person ceases to be the owner of the copy of the computer program."<br><br>On the flip side, under Moral Rights Infrigement, Section 28.1, "<br><br>(a) a change in the location of a work, <b>the physical means by which a work is exposed or the physical structure containing a work</b>, <br><br>or<br><br>(b) steps taken in good faith to restore or preserve the work<br><br>shall not, by that act alone, constitute a distortion, mutilation or other modification of the work."<br><br>In other words, the new bill does indeed take actions which had been fully legal and make them illegal. It also seeks to stand a copyright holder's moral rights on it's head, giving them total and permanent control of not only the original work, but container of the work and how it can be viewed.  I'm just waiting for a major electronics company to announce a new DVD which <b>must</b> be played on their player, which <b>must</b> be hooked to one of their monitors of no less than "x" size, can only be viewed by the purchaser (not friends or family members), it can't be transported away from the place it was first played, etc. etc.  Hey, if the new law gives copyrights holders total control of how the media can be viewed, the sky's the limit, depending only on court challenges and what the market will bear.<br><br>Truthfully, we've been using the wrong analogy.  The media companies don't want to turn the clocks back to the 60's.  They want to go back to pre-radio days, where -- if you wanted entertainment -- you went to the theatre.  Every single person had to pay every time they viewed the play, it could only be viewed at a place and time of the right-holder's choosing, in a venue where the right-holder had total control over the viewer.  <br><small>--<br>Credulous: having views about the world, the universe and humanity's place in it that are shared only by very unsophisticated people and the most intelligent and advanced mathematicians and physicists.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 08:23:15 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20649575</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/589128"><b>dirtyjeffer</b></A> : sorry...i have to agree with DKS on this...while i don't particularly agree with parts of the proposed legislation (which probably won't go anywhere anyway), i can completely understand the need for it...back before the days of the internet, if you wanted music, you went to the record store and bought it...if you didn't have the money to buy maybe as much as you wanted, you did what i did, taped it off the radio station (albeit, this was short lived)...today's generation feels the world owes them everything, and that they shouldn't have to pay a dime for anything...i don't understand why they don't understand that taking the music/videos/software/whatever and not paying for it is wrong...i am not trying to preach to anyone, hell, i have a bunch of mp3's i downloaded a while ago too...but you can't complain about possible changes when they attempt to fix something that is clearly broken.<br><small>--<br>Best Marketplace Ever: &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.cbc.ca/marketplace/speed_bumps/" >www.cbc.ca/marketplace/speed_bumps/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 07:31:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Copyright bill protests surge online</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20649539</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/627680"><b>Hydraglass</b></A> : As a content creator myself (web back-end s/w and content developer) I lean the other way - copyright laws should protect my customers and the consumers, and if I don't like the game I take my ball and go home and stop developing content.  Copyright laws are supposed to encourage people to be creative while providing something useful to consumers. If the laws piss off consumers so much they don't want my warez, then I'm out of a job anyway.  For the most part I publish the vast majority of my work under either a creative commons or a public domain notice -- if I create something useful others can use 5 or 10 or 15 years from now - so be it - I don't want them to have to contact me, or feel encumbered in how they use it.  <br><br>I don't lean as far left as the "FSF/GPL" type licences - they try to use copyright against the content creators essentially telling you that you can do anything with their created works as long as you do it in a way that's "good for society" in their eyes.  To me that's just as encumbering as telling them they can't do anything with what I've created.  My goal is to create a solution for a single customer on their demand when there's no other solution out there - once that solution is created my personally created work is free for the taking - I just ask to be paid *one time* by the person who requested me to make said content - certainly not over and over by anyone who wants to use it in the future -- that would encourage me to stop creating content once I built up a small library of work.<br><br>Sure my situation is different than music and movies - but in return I don't begrudge them getting paid *once* by each customer who wants their content either - but once that customer has their content they should be free to do what they want with it - just as my customers are.  For all I care my customers could charge other people to look at what I created and make a fortune -- if their customers are so gullible so be it - if they look close enough they can find everything I've created to this day for free (as in beer and speech) somewhere however.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 07:16:33 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20649518</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Hydraglass <A HREF="/useremail/u/627680"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Right of First Sale. Right of Fair Dealing.<br>(edit to add:)<br>Here's the deal on Fair Dealing in Canada:<br> </div>Actually, <A HREF="http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/sc_mrksv/cipo/cp/copy_gd_protect-e.html"> here</a> is what Fair Dealing is. And it's not exactly as you suggest. In fact, fair dealing in copyright matters isn't what we are discussing at all.  <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 06:58:59 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Copyright bill protests surge online</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20649510</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by happylurk :</small><br><br> Critics of the proposed legislation say the clause invalidates all of the other rights granted, thus heavily skewing the bill in favour of copyright holders.<br> </div>And as a creator of copyright content, I have no difficulty with this provision. as I said, <i>It's not about you. It's about fair return for the creator.</i><br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 06:52:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Copyright bill protests surge online</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648850</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2008/06/13/tech-copyright.html?ref=rss" >www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2008&middot;&middot;&middot;?ref=rss</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Copyright bill protests surge online</b><br><br>Last Updated: Friday, June 13, 2008 | 6:20 PM ET <br><br>By Peter Nowak CBC News<br><br>More than 7,000 new members joined a Facebook group protesting the government's copyright bill on Friday.More than 7,000 new members joined a Facebook group protesting the government's copyright bill on Friday.<br><br>Thousands of Canadians wasted no time protesting the government's copyright reform bill, piling on to websites and joining internet-based letter-writing campaigns on Friday.<br><br>More than 7,000 people joined a Facebook group within a day of the bill's introduction on Thursday morning, bringing its total membership to more than 48,000 people.<br><br>The group &#151; started on the popular social-networking site late last year by Michael Geist, a University of Ottawa internet law professor &#151; is credited for scaring the Conservatives out of introducing the bill in December after initially attracting more than 20,000 members.<br><br>Many of the members of the group posted messages on Friday saying they were taking political action in an effort to prevent the controversial legislation from becoming law.<br><br>"I just phoned the Liberal Party of Canada and said I would vote Liberal for the first time in my life if they brought down the government over this bill," Ray Klassen wrote.<br><br>"I've requested a in person meeting with Dawn Black, MP for Coquitlam/New Westminster. I live only 1 minute from her office up on Austin," wrote Brian B of Vancouver.<br><br>Bill C-61, introduced Thursday by Industry Minister Jim Prentice and Heritage Minister Jos&eacute;e Verner, seeks to update Canada's copyright rules and bring it in line with the country's obligations under the World Intellectual Property Organization treaty signed more than a decade ago. The bill spells out Canadians' rights with respect to digital copying of content, granting permissions to make copies of books, photographs, music and other media.<br><br>It found support with a number of entertainment industry groups, including the Entertainment Software Association of Canada and the Canadian Recording Industry Association, who praised it for proposing methods of stopping illegal piracy of copyrighted works.<br><br>However, the source of most of the protests is the bill's anti-circumvention clause, which would allow copyright holders to place digital locks on content and thus prevent copies from being made. Critics of the proposed legislation say the clause invalidates all of the other rights granted, thus heavily skewing the bill in favour of copyright holders.<br><br><b>Website sends e-mails to MPs</b><br><br>The Facebook group has also splintered into regional sub-groups, each with hundreds of members. Most of the groups pointed members to Copyright For Canadians, a website run by the Ottawa-based Canadian Internet Policy & Public Interest Clinic, and the San Francisco-based Electronic Frontier Foundation. The website has an automated system that allows visitors to send protest e-mails to their respective MPs. As of Friday afternoon, more than 3,200 messages had been sent.<br><br>The copyright bill has set off an unprecedented wave of political activism on the internet in Canada, Geist said.<br><br>"What we've seen over the past 24 hours has been nothing short of remarkable," he said. "Literally tens of thousands of Canadians are speaking out with an element of shock that the government would introduce this legislation in the manner that it has."<br><br>One reader of Geist's blog e-mailed him to say that the bill's introduction had awakened their sense of political activism.<br><br>"Besides voting, I've never taken action politically, but I've now got a face-to-face meeting set up with Guy Lauzon, our MP for [Stormont&#150;Dundas&#150;South Glengarry] on the 24th," the reader wrote. "He'll know first-hand that this bill, if passed, will cause him to lose votes."<br><br>Other bloggers also tore into the proposed legislation and the government.<br><br><b>Harper campaigner outraged at bill</b><br><br>Robert Phillips, who said he has campaigned on behalf of Prime Minister Stephen Harper and was a former executive of the Brock University Conservative Club, wrote on Friday that he has turned his back on the party.<br><br>"Whether it does or does not pass, the fact remains that the party and whatever candidate happens to be in my riding will receive one less vote come the next election," he wrote.<br><br>Many members of the Facebook groups called for rallies to be organized over the summer. A possible focal point will be the Ontario riding of Guelph, where a by-election must be called by September. Brenda Chamberlain, a Liberal, currently holds the riding but the Conservatives have targeted her seat.<br><br>Students at the nearby University of Waterloo, a hotspot of Canadian technology, could turn the by-election into a proxy battle over the copyright bill.<br><br>Geist said the sheer number of people protesting online is likely to translate into protests in the real world.<br><br>"You're going to see the concern and protests build over the summer rather than go away," he said.<br><br><b>The bill is unlikely to progress much over the next few months as Parliament is due to soon break for its summer session. When it resumes, the bill will receive its second reading and then be sent off to a committee for closer scrutiny. The Conservatives could make it a confidence bill, meaning that if opposition parties voted it down, they would force an election.<br><br>Members of the Facebook protest group mused over the possibility of the government being brought down by its copyright bill.<br><br>"Wouldn't it be funny if an election was fought over iPods?" wrote Charles Troster of Vancouver.</b><br><br><hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 23:54:22 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648626</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/627680"><b>Hydraglass</b></A> : It sounds to me like in your opinion the only thing copyright  for is control of how someone uses something created by another. Reality is much different - let's use the ole' Car analogy here:<br>Copyright is akin to a patent on a car in many ways:<br>1a. I buy a BMW 335i, I can't make duplicate BMW 335i's and sell them as BMW 335i's - that's granted.<br>1b. I buy a DVD of the movie Shawshank Redemption. I can't make copies of that DVD and sell them as Shawshank Redemption.<br>2a. I can take my BMW 335i and drive it on any road in any country I want. I can leave it in my garage for 15 years if I want. I can paint it purple with yellow polka dots if I want. I can take the tires and wheels off it and fit it with wheel-track systems if I want.  I can rip every body panel off it and drive it like a dune buggy through the desert if I want. I can sell the original BMW as I bought it to someone and the factory warranty will even still cover it. I can build a duplicate BMW in my garage piece by piece and drive that vehicle on any road I want - I just can't sell it.<br>2b. I *should* be able to take my DVD of Shawshank Redemption and watch it on any DVD player I want. I should be able to take the bits from that disk and put them on my computer to watch it. I should be able to take the bits from that disk and load them into my 3" screen iPod which I can carry with me, and use the A/V cable to plug same iPod into my TV in my hotel room in Tokyo (as we all know Cable TV in Tokyo sucks) and watch the movie there. I should be able to put the DVD of the movie into the movie player in my SUV and watch it.  I should be able to take the DVD and sell it to someone down the street and they should have the same rights I should have while I had that DVD.<br><br>Right of First Sale. Right of Fair Dealing.<br>(edit to add:)<br>Here's the deal on Fair Dealing in Canada:<br>The Six principal criteria for evaluating fair dealing.<br><br>   1. The Purpose of the Dealing Is it for research, private study, criticism, review or news reporting? It expresses that "these allowable purposes should not be given a restrictive interpretation or this could result in the undue restriction of users' rights."<br>   2. The Character of the Dealing How were the works dealt with? Was there a single copy or were multiple copies made? Were these copies distributed widely or to a limited group of people? Was the copy destroyed after its purpose was accomplished? What are the normal practices of the industry?<br>   3. The Amount of the Dealing How much of the work was used? What was the importance of the infringed work? Quoting trivial amounts may alone sufficiently establish fair dealing. In some cases even quoting the entire work may be fair dealing.<br>   4. Alternatives to the Dealing Was a "non-copyrighted equivalent of the work" available to the user? Could the work have been properly criticized without being copied?<br>   5. The Nature of the Work Copying from a work that has never been published could be more fair than from a published work "in that its reproduction with acknowledgement could lead to a wider public dissemination of the work - one of the goals of copyright law. If, however, the work in question was confidential, this may tip the scales towards finding that the dealing was unfair."<br>   6. Effect of the Dealing on the Work Is it likely to affect the market of the original work? "Although the effect of the dealing on the market of the copyright owner is an important factor, it is neither the only factor nor the most important factor that a court must consider in deciding if the dealing is fair." A statement that a dealing infringes may not be sufficient, but evidence will often be required.<br><br>Being able to format shift media for personal use is covered  as said by Clipper above, under current laws (just checked... as per my lawyer-in-law I just emailed this question to.)]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:49:53 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648614</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><b>Clipper</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Because the content was not delivered in the particular medium you want. You do not have the right to alter the delivery method. That is controlled by the copyright owner. Again, It's not about you. It's the rights of the owner of the intellectual property which are being defended here. <br> </div>Here's where you are wrong.<br><br>Taken from the current Copyright Act &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.cb-cda.gc.ca/info/act-e.html#rid-33770" >www.cb-cda.gc.ca/info/act-e.html#rid-33770</A><br><br>80. 1) Subject to subsection (2), the act of reproducing all or any substantial part of<br><br>    (a) a musical work embodied in a sound recording,<br><br>    (b) a performer's performance of a musical work embodied in a sound recording, or<br><br>    (c) a sound recording in which a musical work, or a performer's performance of a musical work, is embodied<br><br>onto an audio recording medium for the private use of the person who makes the copy does not constitute an infringement of the copyright in the musical work, the performer's performance or the sound recording.<br><br>And this part is not being amended by Bill C-61.<br><br>I have a right to make copy, yet Bill c-61 says I can't.  That's what's wrong.<br><br>What the f*** is the purpose of an iPod if you can't move music to it?  Oh ya, I have to buy the music from iTunes, then again from a music store if I want it on a CD. <br><br>How is that fair to the consumer?<br><br>This law needs to be fair to both consumers and copyright holders.  The interests of both, not just one.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:46:53 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648611</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : I'm using the wrong part of the copyright law and you are being purposely obtuse... we are currently allowed to format-shift and make backup copies of DVDs... for personal use only.<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:46:26 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648591</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  harwoodr <A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>So, do you think it is wrong now, while we have the right to do so under "Fair Dealing"?<br> </div>We don't. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:43:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648588</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  harwoodr <A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Because the content was not delivered in the particular medium you want. You do not have the right to alter the delivery method. That is controlled by the copyright owner. Again, It's not about you. It's the rights of the owner of the intellectual property which are being defended here. </div>Ah!  Here's the thing... currently, in Canada, you do have those rights - called "Fair Dealing"... this is taking them away.<br> </div>That is not Fair Dealing. Individuals can't use Fair Dealing provisions. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:43:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648571</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Feets <A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>I don't own an iPod, nor do I intend to buy one. Watching a movie on a 3" screen is something I did as a child. I have no desire to revisit those days.  </div>With all due respect, that doesn't answer my question. <br><br>Assuming that some people (who aren't you) want to do that, do you think it's wrong?  How about ripping my entire DVD library to a media server that I can access from any TV in my house without putting a physical disc in a player?  Is that wrong, if I paid for the disc?  <br> </div>I think you already know the answer to that question. <br> </div>So, do you think it is wrong now, while we have the right to do so under "Fair Dealing"?<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:38:19 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648562</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Feets <A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>I don't own an iPod, nor do I intend to buy one. Watching a movie on a 3" screen is something I did as a child. I have no desire to revisit those days.  </div>With all due respect, that doesn't answer my question. <br><br>Assuming that some people (who aren't you) want to do that, do you think it's wrong?  How about ripping my entire DVD library to a media server that I can access from any TV in my house without putting a physical disc in a player?  Is that wrong, if I paid for the disc?  <br> </div>I think you already know the answer to that question. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:36:46 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648552</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><b>Feets</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I don't own an iPod, nor do I intend to buy one. Watching a movie on a 3" screen is something I did as a child. I have no desire to revisit those days.  </div>With all due respect, that doesn't answer my question. <br><br>Assuming that some people (who aren't you) want to do that, do you think it's wrong?  How about ripping my entire DVD library to a media server that I can access from any TV in my house without putting a physical disc in a player?  Is that wrong, if I paid for the disc?  ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:35:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648529</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Because the content was not delivered in the particular medium you want. You do not have the right to alter the delivery method. That is controlled by the copyright owner. Again, It's not about you. It's the rights of the owner of the intellectual property which are being defended here. </div>Ah!  Here's the thing... currently, in Canada, you do have those rights - called "Fair Dealing"... this is taking them away.<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:32:23 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648521</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Feets <A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>Is the form changed from the original? If it's without permission, it's not going to be legal. </div>Legal is one thing, moral/right/correct is another.  Do you think it's immoral or wrong to watch a (paid for) DVD movie on an iPod?  <br> </div>I don't own an iPod, nor do I intend to buy one. Watching a movie on a 3" screen is something I did as a child. I have no desire to revisit those days. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:30:50 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648511</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Clipper <A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>Is the form changed from the original? If it's without permission, it's not going to be legal. <br> </div>I understand the bill in it's current form would result in this.<br><br>What I'm saying is that it shouldn't.  <br><br>From the copyright holder's perspective, they've received their payment from me when I purchase the DVD or CD.  Why should I be limited from enjoying that product on whatever medium I choose?  </div>Because the content was not delivered in the particular medium you want. You do not have the right to alter the delivery method. That is controlled by the copyright owner. Again, It's not about you. It's the rights of the owner of the intellectual property which are being defended here. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:28:45 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648475</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : Unless of course you're using a non-standard PVR... like a myth-tv box.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 22:20:05 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648352</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/833344"><b>Cliffy</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  harwoodr <A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Under this bill, you would only be allowed to keep that tape for a short period of time... keeping it without erasing it would be against the law.<br> </div>And of course digital broadcasts and PVR's are able to use flags to set these limits, with the consumer having no recourse.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 21:54:31 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648251</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>You could record OTA TV to tape</div>Under this bill, you would only be allowed to keep that tape for a short period of time... keeping it without erasing it would be against the law.<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 21:25:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648236</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>No, it's theft.</div>Actually, no - it's circumvention of a copy protection mechanism... you're allowed to do it with CDs because there's no copy protection.<br><br>Now, the copy protection with DVDs is lame and has been cracked since the late 90s... but that's neither here nor there.<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 21:22:31 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648188</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><b>Feets</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Is the form changed from the original? If it's without permission, it's not going to be legal. </div>Legal is one thing, moral/right/correct is another.  Do you think it's immoral or wrong to watch a (paid for) DVD movie on an iPod?  ]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648188</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 21:14:50 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648024</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/661652"><b>Advocat</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Clipper <A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The copyright holder gets his pay;  That's all that matters here.  If any individual decrypts it and provides for P2P uploading, then that should be illegal, definitely.  But transferring it to an ipod to watch on vacation or on a long road trip should not.<br> </div>This is the crux of why so many people are upset, what they consider to be fair usage of materials they have purchased.  We aren't intending to sell it cut-rate across the Internet, or put it on a P2P network.  Thus, the reaction to a bill which effectively criminalizes an inoffensive behaviour without criminal intent.<br><br>Why then is it in the bill in the first place?  Because law enforcement and the copyright holders have recognized they cannot effectively locate and/or stop the hackers who break and share illegal programs, nor can they control the Internet through which the material is shared.<br><br>Thus, they are left with going after the only people they can catch, which are ordinary people with stable online accounts, through which they can be easily located.  Rather than admit they really can't control the new environment and then go on to develop new business models, these interest groups, in combination with our politicians, have decided it would be better to criminalize citizens for indulging in behaviour which has been common since the invention of the tape recorder, video recorder, and dvd burner... they're effectively turning back the clock 30 or more years. <br><br>They wish the act of copying to be illegal, rather than the act of distribution.  They aren't interested in fair use with no criminal intent by the purchaser, they're interested in creating extra profits by forcing people to re-buy the item over, and over, and over, and over.  As they've done in the US, by threatening a few people with lawsuits and horrendous fines, they hope the majority of citizens will be scared off from copying/sharing materials... and go back to buying from them.<br><br>Effectively, the bill is a business-sponsored exercise in creating a national climate of fear... for the sole purpose of increasing the bottom line of corporate interests.  Which is why so much of the bill seems targeted at ordinary individuals rather than large-scale hackers/distributors.<br><br>Why would our politicians support this bill?  Pressure from the US, pressure from Canadian media outlets, and, let us not forget the fact that every time Canadians download or copy something they could be forced to re-buy, the Federal and Provincial governments lose tax revenue... something that most people overlook.<br><br>Seeing our own politician's combination of spinelessness, bowing to pressure from interest groups rather than discussing fair use with stakeholders, its obvious that that the bill will be allowed to die only <b>if a large portion of Canadians stand up and let it loudly be known this is not acceptable</b>... there isn't much doubt the announcement of this bill is by way of a trial balloon by Harper and his business cronies... oops, I meant "supporters". ;)<br><small>--<br>Credulous: having views about the world, the universe and humanity's place in it that are shared only by very unsophisticated people and the most intelligent and advanced mathematicians and physicists.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20648024</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 20:37:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647955</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/700900"><b>Tyreman</b></A> : Maybe they'll water down the bill to appease people who purchased the cd or dvd. allow them to move it to differing digital playback devices]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647955</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 20:19:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647919</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><b>Clipper</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Is the form changed from the original? If it's without permission, it's not going to be legal. <br> </div>I understand the bill in it's current form would result in this.<br><br>What I'm saying is that it shouldn't.  <br><br>From the copyright holder's perspective, they've received their payment from me when I purchase the DVD or CD.  Why should I be limited from enjoying that product on whatever medium I choose?  I paid for the content.  How I enjoy the content is not any of the copyright holder's business.<br><br>The copyright holder gets his pay;  That's all that matters here.<br><br>If any individual decrypts it and provides for P2P uploading, then that should be illegal, definitely.  But transferring it to an ipod to watch on vacation or on a long road trip should not.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647919</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 20:10:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647868</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Clipper <A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>Modifying content beyond the intent of the original owner of the copyright. <br> </div>Encryption isn't content.<br><br>The content doesn't get changed.  <br> </div>Is the form changed from the original? If it's without permission, it's not going to be legal. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647868</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:54:48 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647862</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Hydraglass <A HREF="/useremail/u/627680"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I'm referring to a time before any home users could do this - it feels to me like the level of control most of the media and content companies are looking for was before what you are referring to.  In 1959 no home user could tape a TV show.</div>If they had the money, they could. <br><br><div class="bquote"> In 1959 no home user could tape a radio broadcast without some serious expensive equipment.</div>Not true. My uncle's Phillips AM/FM/SW radio had a Tape Out jack that went to his Phillips reel to reel tape recorder<br><br><div class="bquote"> In 1959 no one could time-shift or place-shift any media.</div>Not true. Depending on your location, you could time shift between US and Canadian broadcasts and in adjacent time zones. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647862</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:53:49 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647841</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><b>Clipper</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Modifying content beyond the intent of the original owner of the copyright. <br> </div>Encryption isn't content.<br><br>The content doesn't get changed.  ]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647841</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 19:46:24 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647566</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/627680"><b>Hydraglass</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Wrong. You could copy and LP or 45 to tape. You could record OTA TV to tape (if you have the money). If you lived in many parts of Canada you could easily timeshift, as shows were run at different times in Canada and the US. Sometimes episodes were seen only in Canada and not in the US at all (anyone remember the Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour?). And there were lots of other things we did  of watching TV and surfing the internet.  ;)<br> </div>I'm referring to a time before any home users could do this - it feels to me like the level of control most of the media and content companies are looking for was before what you are referring to.  In 1959 no home user could tape a TV show. In 1959 no home user could tape a radio broadcast without some serious expensive equipment. In 1959 no one could time-shift or place-shift any media.  This is the "golden days of media" that the likes of RIAA and MPAA ache for -- we were a 100% captive audience, and even if we could afford the equipment to record some sort of media, there was a noticeable amount of degradation even in a first generation copy - thus making the "original" still the best -- if you managed to have $10k in recording equipment in your house and could record copies of a record or a radio broadcast, no one else would have the equipment to listen, and even yourself, when listening would find the copy to have noticeable loss.<br><br>That's the "time and place" media companies yearn for.  Digital duplication blew them away - the first, 5th, and 100th copy was identical to the first.  If you have a DVD and rip it into and ISO, bit for bit it's 7-8GB of data usually - you can then burn 100 DVD's from that ISO file. Each of those 100 DVD's could source 100 more DVD's burned to identical ISO's... you now have 10,000 DVD's from one - and no one could tell the difference.  That's bad for a media company.  You could record from a HD radio, satellite radio, or rip from a CD in 384kb Ogg or VBR Mpeg4 - and 100,000 people could get that same 10 meg file and have the exact same content as the first person. That's bad for a media company.  That means there's NO control once something is out there.  There's no control.  If you're used to the model I just outlined - that's a killer.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647566</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:23:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647530</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Feets <A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  harwoodr <A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>DKS - personally, this isn't about stealing.<br><br>Yes, people who download music/movies/whatever are stealing - fine.<br><br>However, I don't feel that someone who rips a DVD, that they bought, in order to put it on their ipod is stealing.<br><br>Under this bill, they are liable for a $20k fine... per incident.<br><br>That's just wrong.<br> </div>No, it's theft.  </div>I would honestly like to hear the reasoning behind that statement.  I can't fathom how it could be construed as theft. <br> </div>Modifying content beyond the intent of the original owner of the copyright. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647530</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:15:15 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647477</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><b>Feets</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  harwoodr <A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>DKS - personally, this isn't about stealing.<br><br>Yes, people who download music/movies/whatever are stealing - fine.<br><br>However, I don't feel that someone who rips a DVD, that they bought, in order to put it on their ipod is stealing.<br><br>Under this bill, they are liable for a $20k fine... per incident.<br><br>That's just wrong.<br> </div>No, it's theft.  </div>I would honestly like to hear the reasoning behind that statement.  I can't fathom how it could be construed as theft. ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:00:33 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647456</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/700900"><b>Tyreman</b></A> : How the world has shifted.<br>in 1970 to '73 I had a panasonic 5" reel to reel battery /ac recorder playback unit.<br>in about 72 I got the top load pany portable high quality cassette.<br>Had every Doors, Led Zep, procul harum,blah blah and on and on taped.<br>being an electronics major we had patch panels built into our parents stereos. <br>at the time we made them to allow taping off the units at the pre amp out stage then to a mini mono 1/8' jack to the recorders input.<br>we could by the patch panel(switches installed) have the "sound" directed to our headphones not to the entertainment sets speakers.<br>as of course if you had strict military parents it wasn't music but dysfunctional noise to weaken the taken.<br>Though my parents tolerated it with my patch panel.<br>They didn't even complain about me taping the stuff though my dad did lament don't be letting a bunch of other listeners tape off your machine.<br>he did notice i had a patch cord made up correctly to do just this.<br>You see back in those days it was cheaper to make it up than buy it unlike today sometimes.<br>You often couldn't buy exactly what you needed pre made. unless radio shack had it quite often Lafayette Electronics did in the US so we ordered from them sometimes.<br>Boy we'd be locked up today. :D]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:56:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20647343</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Hydraglass <A HREF="/useremail/u/627680"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>(I could go on and on here) - in essence they want things to act like they did in the 1950s and 1960s.  You couldn't copy vinyl records - you could only use them on record players. You couldn't record radio broadcasts or tv broadcasts - you had to watch them when they sent them - they knew best when you should sit down and listen to a radio or tv show afterall.  There was no internet. There was no digital distribution. There was no time shifting. If you wanted "high def" you had to go to a theatre and watch content on 35mm or 70mm cellulose - when they wanted you to. </div>Wrong. You could copy and LP or 45 to tape. You could record OTA TV to tape (if you have the money). If you lived in many parts of Canada you could easily timeshift, as shows were run at different times in Canada and the US. Sometimes episodes were seen only in Canada and not in the US at all (anyone remember the Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour?). And there were lots of other things we did  of watching TV and surfing the internet.  ;)<br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:22:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646912</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/627680"><b>Hydraglass</b></A> : I think DKS is of the same school as many of these media folks and others in that industry:<br>Pay every single time you view/watch/interact with/enjoy content.<br><br>In their world these are what they would like to see:<br>1. You buy a DVD for the cost of the plastic disc plus some minimal fee for promoting/marketing/shipping.  You pay some incremental fee every single time you watch that disc.<br>2. You want your media in "portable digital" format you pay for separately on every single device you want to use media on.<br>3. Your buy software and it can only be used on the computer you buy it for - it can never be sold or transferred to anyone - any time you want to use a different computer you buy the software, from them, directly again (even if the old computer it was on has been destroyed or "reformatted".)<br>4. Your "online" or "streaming" media must be watched when it's sent to you by the content distributor as they know best when it's time for you to watch their content.<br>5. Television content can only be time shifted if the distributor wants you to be able to - ads can't be skipped - and you can only watch your "shifted" content once and it's deleted - just like if it was on the air.<br><br>(I could go on and on here) - in essence they want things to act like they did in the 1950s and 1960s.  You couldn't copy vinyl records - you could only use them on record players. You couldn't record radio broadcasts or tv broadcasts - you had to watch them when they sent them - they knew best when you should sit down and listen to a radio or tv show afterall.  There was no internet. There was no digital distribution. There was no time shifting. If you wanted "high def" you had to go to a theatre and watch content on 35mm or 70mm cellulose - when they wanted you to.<br><br>I guess there's arguments for both sides - to some - those were the "good times and simple times" of media and entertainment... the family gathered around the house when The Honeymooners came on - watched them as a family and laughed - watched their forced advertising - and moved on... to others - the world moves on and we're not all technological luddites - and think things should change to meet modern means. Perhaps there shouldn't be 4 layers of people making money between content creator and consumer - maybe only 1 (i.e. You Tube, etc.).<br><br>In the end - all we can do is try and convince the gov't we don't want things like they used to be.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 15:14:07 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646583</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><b>Clipper</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>No, it's theft. <br> </div>How is it theft when they already paid for it and aren't giving it to someone else to use?]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646583</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 13:41:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646473</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><b>BigSensFan</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  harwoodr <A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>DKS - personally, this isn't about stealing.<br><br>Yes, people who download music/movies/whatever are stealing - fine.<br><br>However, I don't feel that someone who rips a DVD, that they bought, in order to put it on their ipod is stealing.<br><br>Under this bill, they are liable for a $20k fine... per incident.<br><br>That's just wrong.<br> </div>I would be facing a fine for copying the DVD that came with my NAV unit (GPS) in my Jeep. I use a copy in it instead of the original, but I still own the original]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646473</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 13:08:33 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646455</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  harwoodr <A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>DKS - personally, this isn't about stealing.<br><br>Yes, people who download music/movies/whatever are stealing - fine.<br><br>However, I don't feel that someone who rips a DVD, that they bought, in order to put it on their ipod is stealing.<br><br>Under this bill, they are liable for a $20k fine... per incident.<br><br>That's just wrong.<br> </div>No, it's theft. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646455</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 13:02:49 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646450</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by happylurk :</small><br><br>Well good for you :p<br><br>I've had a couple of DVDs destroyed by my niece over the years.  Collectable stuff that's gone out of print.  My rule as of now is to give the kid a burned copy when she wants to watch a movie and keep my originals intact!  Does that make me a criminal now?  :mad:  :mad: :mad:<br> </div>Never give your children something you value. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 13:02:06 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646019</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by happylurk :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>The copy protection on movie DVDs is more stringent, but I've never had a DVD become unplayable through normal use. </div>You've never had Kids in your home or loaned out a DVD only to have them use it as a coaster and destroy it beyond playability?<br> </div>No. And I have teen-aged children. <br> </div>Well good for you :p<br><br>I've had a couple of DVDs destroyed by my niece over the years.  Collectable stuff that's gone out of print.  My rule as of now is to give the kid a burned copy when she wants to watch a movie and keep my originals intact!  Does that make me a criminal now?  :mad:  :mad: :mad:]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 11:18:01 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20646007</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : It's not about recouping a loss - these fines will not be disbursed to the copyright holders - it's about penalizing those who break the law and deterring others from doing the same.<br><br>The copyright holders will have to sue you after the fact and pick the corpse for whatever might be left over.<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 11:14:44 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645994</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/899733"><b>Roop</b></A> : $20k per incident - that means I would owe roughly 400 million dollars?<br><br>this doesn't even make sense. Even If I were a major distributor of content, I would never have made that much. If I cost the recording industry that much money, their business needs to be restructured.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 11:11:52 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645983</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : DKS - personally, this isn't about stealing.<br><br>Yes, people who download music/movies/whatever are stealing - fine.<br><br>However, I don't feel that someone who rips a DVD, that they bought, in order to put it on their ipod is stealing.<br><br>Under this bill, they are liable for a $20k fine... per incident.<br><br>That's just wrong.<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645983</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 11:08:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645418</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  LaZ3R <A HREF="/useremail/u/754916"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Yes... and university students will be screaming the most. DC++ will essentially be completely useless and illegal in every possible way. <br><br>Unlocking / owning unlocked phones = illegal.<br><br>Modding consoles / owning modded consoles = illegal.<br> </div>Somehow they have to learn morals and ethics. "Don't steal" seems to be a good place to start. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645418</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 06:46:17 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645417</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by happylurk :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>The copy protection on movie DVDs is more stringent, but I've never had a DVD become unplayable through normal use. </div>You've never had Kids in your home or loaned out a DVD only to have them use it as a coaster and destroy it beyond playability?<br> </div>No. And I have teen-aged children. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645417</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 06:44:47 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645276</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/700900"><b>Tyreman</b></A> : Hopefully this conservative appeasement of American entertainment interests will just languish and die.<br><br>Heck the cats been out of the bag for years now.<br><br>with the interent somebody had to know this was going to happen]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20645276</guid>
<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 03:15:33 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644832</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/754916"><b>LaZ3R</b></A> : Yes... and university students will be screaming the most. DC++ will essentially be completely useless and illegal in every possible way. <br><br>Unlocking / owning unlocked phones = illegal.<br><br>Modding consoles / owning modded consoles = illegal.<br><small>--<br><b>Life is a game of blackjack. You keep playing until you bust.</b></small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644832</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 23:50:17 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644668</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><b>Feets</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>How is copy protection unfair to the consumer?  It's not like you can't watch it.  Content creators are not stupid, they want to make money by selling their works.  So they aren't going to prevent you from enjoying their works. </div>What if I want to rip all my (legally purchased) DVDs to a digital movie library on a media server that I can access via my remote control without having to switch discs?  What if I want to put a copy on my iPod video for a plane trip?  I think those are fair uses of paid-for content.  I don't think it's fair to have to pay again for the same content in order to watch it on a different device. <br><br>I may just stop buying DVDs if copying them to my iPod is going to make me a criminal. ]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644668</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 22:53:56 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644575</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : Actually what exactly does this bill mean for lending libraries and schools and non profit organizations that wish to use excerpts for instructional purposes?<br><br>What does this bill mean for students who wish to include reference or multimedia information in a powerpoint presentation?<br><br>What does this bill mean for joe schmuck who just spent $800 on Adobe Photoshop and had his 4 year old stick the CD in the toaster?<br><br>What does this bill mean for joe schmoe who has every episode of Gilligan's Island recorded off of TV and then lovingly transferred from VHS to DVD as technology progressed?<br><br>There's a lot of fair use applications here we can all simply kiss goodbye.  How Prentice can stand there with a straight face and even PRETEND that this bill addresses consumer's rights totally escapes me...]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644575</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 22:27:23 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644553</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The copy protection on movie DVDs is more stringent, but I've never had a DVD become unplayable through normal use. </div>You've never had Kids in your home or loaned out a DVD only to have them use it as a coaster and destroy it beyond playability?]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644553</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 22:20:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644392</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><b>BigSensFan</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  BigSensFan <A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>as do I<br><br>But personally I dont think there is a high demand for my stuff or DKS stuff for that matter, considering  what it is intended for<br> </div>Depends. Some of my work will be on the Internet, if Rogers finishes what they have started. <br> </div>Stop being so cryptic ;)<br><br>What is it you are doing?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 21:25:26 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644337</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><b>digitalfutur</b></A> : How is copy protection unfair to the consumer?  It's not like you can't watch it.  Content creators are not stupid, they want to make money by selling their works.  So they aren't going to prevent you from enjoying their works.<br><br>What they will do, and should do, is prevent someone from enjoying their works without the copyright holder's consent.  This has to include unauthorized copying because that unauthorized copy is the first step to illegal distribution.  If you're concerned about backup, most songs can be copied a limited number of times to CD or portable device.  But they can't be copied to a file distribution network. <br><br>I don't agree with iTunes proprietary encoding that functions only an overpriced iPod.  So I buy mp3 or DRM wma songfiles instead.  I know the copy restrictions that come with each format.  I can live with them.  But because I don't agree with iTunes copyright, I'm not about to break their code in the name of "rights", or support such behaviour by others.<br><br>The copy protection on movie DVDs is more stringent, but I've never had a DVD become unplayable through normal use.  Are you doing to stop buying movies because you don't think they should be copy-protected?<br><small>--<br>All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing - Edmund Burke.  "Walk the Talk".</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 21:09:00 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20644010</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  BigSensFan <A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>as do I<br><br>But personally I dont think there is a high demand for my stuff or DKS stuff for that matter, considering  what it is intended for<br> </div>Depends. Some of my work will be on the Internet, if Rogers finishes what they have started. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 19:19:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20643671</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><b>BigSensFan</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Feets <A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  StEC <A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>OMG people like you.......!  :huh:<br> </div>Yes, I make my living on the creation of intellectual property.  </div>So do I. <br> </div>as do I<br><br>But personally I dont think there is a high demand for my stuff or DKS stuff for that matter, considering  what it is intended for<br><small>--<br>"I am not an abnormal person living in a normal world, I am a normal person living in an abnormal world" Rod Parsley<br><br><A HREF="http://www.canadianrevival.com">Canadian Revival News</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 17:31:31 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642881</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1095016"><b>urbanriot</b></A> : I haven't read the bill's fine print... is there any mention of what will happen to the current levies we're already paying on optical media and ipods, or did they try to sneak that one by us? <br><br>To elaborate, we're currently paying a tax on optical media and ipods to cover the cost of our assumed pirating. If the DMCA is passed, then it's illegal to be circumventing copy protections, it then shouldn't be assumed that everyone is going to use optical media and ipods to pirate? ]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642881</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 14:01:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642733</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><b>Feets</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  StEC <A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>OMG people like you.......!  :huh:<br> </div>Yes, I make my living on the creation of intellectual property.  </div>So do I. ]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642733</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 13:15:53 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642729</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><b>Feets</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>This bill and any copyright question is not about you and your rights (what a self-centered bunch of yobs carping in this thread  :uhh:). It's about creators of intellectual property and their rights. </div>Au contraire,  it is very much about defining where one party's rights end and the other begins.  Questions of space/device shifting and time shifting are legitimate if the content has been paid for in one fashion or another.  In the US you can't legally rip DVDs you've paid for to watch them on your iPod (or laptop, or media PC, etc) because they used crummy encryption on the disk and decrypting that violates the law.  In many people's opinions, including my own, that is unfair to the consumer. <br><br>You and  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> might think that content creators' rights are absolute, but many do not, and that's why this debate continues.  Certainly there are plenty who do want a free lunch, but there are many others that would like to see a reasonable middle ground solution achieved. I don't think the proposed bill is that solution. ]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642729</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 13:15:19 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642701</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  StEC <A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>OMG people like you.......!  :huh:<br> </div>Yes, I make my living on the creation of intellectual property. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642701</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 13:08:37 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642437</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><b>StEC</b></A> : OMG people like you.......!  :huh:]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642437</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 12:00:03 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642404</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  chronoss2008 <A HREF="/useremail/u/1541022"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Essentially this bill gives unlimited copyright and is thusly an abuse of human rights.<br> </div>Huh? Copyright is legal protection of intellectual property. It's how artists make a living. How can it be a violation of human rights? Wake up. <b>It's not about you</b>. It's about creative people's rights being protected. And yes, those rights exist after death. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642404</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:51:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642363</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/349292"><b>Kalford</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  BigSensFan <A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>My question is this. <br><br>I download Television shows that are free to download in the USA but you can not download  them here in Canada. Would I be charged under this law?<br><br>Also, what about shows that dont even show in Canada (i.e Burn Notice)<br> </div>There is practically zero probability of that as long as you yourself are not sharing copyrighted files via a P2P network, uploading content to the web or any other similar method of distribution.<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.abitoftheweb.com/gallery/">Through My Eyes</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:38:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20642123</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1541022"><b>chronoss2008</b></A> : OK smart ones tell me how a disabled person with 200$ after rent that pays his 15$ a month phone and 31$ with TSI <br>can afford to pay more and afford a digital cable box ( 80+)<br>or satellite (80+)<br>NOW when you have both rogers and bell breaking contracts all the time with no consequences cause i cant afford to civily sue them. This is what you get:<br>ME DOWNLOADING ME FRAKING TV.<br>NOW i have only one download i get thats what i call recent tv<br>battle star galactica, <br>ill stop that now.<br>I am and have been focusing on getting entire tv seasons of OLDER shows.<br><br>TELL ME how me getting <br>a 1965 ...get smart is a financial loss to anyone.<br>Are half the actors still even alive?<br>how is 1972 -SPACE 1999 going to hurt you?<br>and<br> THIS NEW LAW MAKES MY 1933 MAX BROTHERS DVDR XVID  that has apparently no copyright , a 500$ fine for downloading, and 20000 fine for dvdr - xvid<br><br>I WILL SUE THE MINISTER ON GROUNDS OF ABUSE OF COPYRIGHT and use a CHARTER VIOLATION of my RIGHTS if this is not corrected.<br><br>Essentially this bill gives unlimited copyright and is thusly an abuse of human rights.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 10:24:47 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20641702</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Cliffy <A HREF="/useremail/u/833344"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Just because a copyright holder claims to place limits on their content doesn't mean that it is lawful.</div>Not true. The moment content is created (not the moment it is copied) creates copyright protection. And you as the purchaser, have to agree to those rights if you choose to purchase the content. If, however, you do not pay for the content, then you are violating the law. <br><br><div class="bquote">There are doctrines in US and Canadian law that covers fair use.</div>And those laws are very, very different. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20641702</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 06:41:36 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20641698</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Feets <A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  BigSensFan <A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>My question is this. <br><br>I download Television shows that are free to download in the USA but you can not download  them here in Canada. Would I be charged under this law?<br><br>Also, what about shows that dont even show in Canada (i.e Burn Notice)<br> </div>Yeah, there are lots of (IMO) gray areas: <br><br>- I subscribe to the channel that the show is on, but missed it and forgot to record it with my PVR.  <br><br>- The show isn't aired at all in Canada<br><br>- The show is aired in Canada but not in HD (e.g. Battlestar Galactica) <br><br>- The show airs in Canada, I subscribe to the channel that airs it, but it is shown in another jurisdiction days/weeks/months earlier. <br> </div>Yes. you could be. You are describing areas that are not grey at all.<br><br>If you miss a broadcast and forget to record it, tough. <br><br>If you watch a show that is not broadcast in Canada because someone else owns the broadcasting rights or they have not been sold, tough. That's what copyright is all about. <br><br>If you watch a show earlier than it is broadcast in Canada,  then yes, that's a violation. The broadcasting rights do not include Canada. You are violating copyright by downloading. <br><br>This bill and any copyright question is not about you and your rights (what a self-centered bunch of yobs carping in this thread  :uhh:). It's about creators of intellectual property and their rights. What's not clear about that? Creators of intellectual property have the right to a modicum of protection under law so as to be able to reap the fruits of their work. Actors, writers, producers, directors all have the right to fair compensation. There is no such thing as a free lunch here, folks. That's reality. <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20641698</guid>
<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 06:37:03 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20641687</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Under the terms of purchase you only own the medium, not the content. Ownership of the content remains with the copyright holder. The EULA governs how you can use that content, including approved devices.  Read up on what copyright means.<br><br>If you don't like the copyright terms, don't buy the content.<br> </div>My goodness. The world is about to end. I agree with  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>.  :o<br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 06:24:27 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20641616</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1556160"><b>josey wales</b></A> : For those wondering how they will enforce this, the answer is the Anti-Counterfeiting-Trade-Agreement(ACTA) which is secretly being negotiated. Combined, these legislations will effectively bring us under the wrathfull eye of big brother harper and his cronies. This "copyright reform" + ACTA is nothing more than a veiled excuse to gain absolute control over the internet and increase surveillance of its citizens. How the hell did copyright reform suddenly warrant the loss of Canadian freedoms and trump privacy rights? The time to get involved and oust this fascist regime is now.<br><br><b>Links to ACTA articles and the leaked acta draft</b><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7446280.stm" >news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7446280.stm</A><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://ipjustice.org/wp/campaigns/acta/" >ipjustice.org/wp/campaigns/acta/</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Jun 2008 04:45:42 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20640245</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Feets <A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  BigSensFan <A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>My question is this. <br><br>I download Television shows that are free to download in the USA but you can not download  them here in Canada. Would I be charged under this law?<br><br>Also, what about shows that dont even show in Canada (i.e Burn Notice)<br> </div>Yeah, there are lots of (IMO) gray areas: <br><br>- I subscribe to the channel that the show is on, but missed it and forgot to record it with my PVR.  <br><br>- The show isn't aired at all in Canada<br><br>- The show is aired in Canada but not in HD (e.g. Battlestar Galactica) <br><br>- The show airs in Canada, I subscribe to the channel that airs it, but it is shown in another jurisdiction days/weeks/months earlier. <br><br>Considering I watch 99% of everything that I watch time-shifted with my PVR and skip commercials, it's hard to prove that the rights holder is damaged in any measurable way if I use the Internet to download the show in any of those above cases. <br><br>Time shifting and commercial skipping has become my way of life.  Live TV feels like arcane now.<br> </div>The way I read it, if you download anything via P2P you're liable for the whole $20 K enchilada no matter what kind of rationalization you try and explain it with...<br><br>Likewise simply possessing a bunch of VHS tapes recorded from TV over the past 30 years or a bunch of audio cassettes recorded from vinyl constitutes breach of copyright as well...<br><br>Forget about any sort of fair use or archival rights.  This law effectively bans ALL personal copies from existing for more than a heartbeat...<br><br>Like I said, I think this law is either going to fail in the senate, or be repealed if the Libs get in the next election, or simply prove to be unenforceable.<br><br>What scares me these days is that more often than not these days ordinary citizens are being forced into being labeled criminals simply for pursuing the habits which we've all led for decades, be it smoking in a car with a minor or be it recording a cassette for the car stereo...<br><br>These jackasses in gov't today simply have to keep passing more and more restrictive and inane laws simply to justify their existence as legislators and their 6 figure salaries and pensions at taxpayer expense...]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:29:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20640196</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : Email sent, though I've probably only succeeded in putting my name on a watchlist :p]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:18:19 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20639819</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/876144"><b>Reactance</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Stojko <A HREF="/useremail/u/1496487"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Everyone should go here and send the letter to their MP:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.copyrightforcanadians.ca/action/firstlook/" >www.copyrightforcanadians.ca/act&middot;&middot;&middot;rstlook/</A><br> </div>Yep. I sent my letter.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 18:51:35 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20639532</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1496487"><b>Stojko</b></A> : Everyone should go here and send the letter to their MP:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.copyrightforcanadians.ca/action/firstlook/" >www.copyrightforcanadians.ca/act&middot;&middot;&middot;rstlook/</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 17:49:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20639439</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1210586"><b>mordin</b></A> : &raquo;<A HREF="http://neil.eton.ca/copylevy.shtml" >neil.eton.ca/copylevy.shtml</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 17:33:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20639333</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/735093"><b>Feets</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  BigSensFan <A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>My question is this. <br><br>I download Television shows that are free to download in the USA but you can not download  them here in Canada. Would I be charged under this law?<br><br>Also, what about shows that dont even show in Canada (i.e Burn Notice)<br> </div>Yeah, there are lots of (IMO) gray areas: <br><br>- I subscribe to the channel that the show is on, but missed it and forgot to record it with my PVR.  <br><br>- The show isn't aired at all in Canada<br><br>- The show is aired in Canada but not in HD (e.g. Battlestar Galactica) <br><br>- The show airs in Canada, I subscribe to the channel that airs it, but it is shown in another jurisdiction days/weeks/months earlier. <br><br>Considering I watch 99% of everything that I watch time-shifted with my PVR and skip commercials, it's hard to prove that the rights holder is damaged in any measurable way if I use the Internet to download the show in any of those above cases. <br><br>Time shifting and commercial skipping has become my way of life.  Live TV feels like arcane now.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 17:08:21 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20639143</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : Well, if it works like it does in the states - the ISPs must turn over records to the artists associations when the AAs assert that a given IP has been downloading pirated materials.<br><br>Then the AAs can complain through proper channels (or in the states - they sue).<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:30:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20639066</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/532661"><b>FusionGuy</b></A> : So who will be enforcing this, ISP's?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:15:23 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20638715</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : Probably end up in general coffers where all taxes end up lol]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:18:36 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20638710</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/841174"><b>BigSensFan</b></A> : My question is this. <br><br>I download Television shows that are free to download in the USA but you can not download  them here in Canada. Would I be charged under this law?<br><br>Also, what about shows that dont even show in Canada (i.e Burn Notice)<br><small>--<br>"I am not an abnormal person living in a normal world, I am a normal person living in an abnormal world" Rod Parsley<br><br><A HREF="http://www.canadianrevival.com">Canadian Revival News</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:18:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20638692</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/684031"><b>harwoodr</b></A> : I wonder what happens with the levy we were paying on digital media in order to compensate the recording industry for copying...<br><small>--<br>"Yahoo Dor&eacute;" is Who-speak for "Where the hell is my stuff?" - Howard Tayler - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.schlockmercenary.com/" >www.schlockmercenary.com/</A></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:15:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20638211</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><b>StEC</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  MarkAW <A HREF="/useremail/u/461572"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by happylurk :</small><br><br>Now in principle, this will turn anyone with a DVD Burner or PVR style recorder or MP3 player into the same kind of criminal, but nobody's actually gonna ever be busted unless Big Brother wants to really make an example of him...      </div>...and if this does ever happen then they better go after these manufactures (JVC, SONY, LG, SHARP,etc) as well for making DVD Burners and (Bell, Rogers, Cogeco, Star Choice, etc)for having PVRs made for their customers to use.<br> </div>And the blank media manufactures (Maxell, Verbatim, Memorex, Fugifilm, Kodak, etc) also Hard Drive/Solid State Drive manufacturers (Seagate, Fujitsu, Maxtor, Western Digital, SanDisk, etc)<br><small>--<br><b><A HREF="http://www.stecnet.org">Stec-Net</a> Online Community!</b></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 13:42:09 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20638043</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/461572"><b>MarkAW</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by happylurk :</small><br><br>Now in principle, this will turn anyone with a DVD Burner or PVR style recorder or MP3 player into the same kind of criminal, but nobody's actually gonna ever be busted unless Big Brother wants to really make an example of him...      </div>...and if this does ever happen then they better go after these manufactures (JVC, SONY, LG, SHARP,etc) as well for making DVD Burners and (Bell, Rogers, Cogeco, Star Choice, etc)for having PVRs made for their customers to use.<br><small>--<br>Advertising is legalized lying. - H.G. Wells<br>Pleasure in the job puts perfection in the work. - Aristotle</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 13:05:05 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20637985</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><b>Clipper</b></A> : &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/442677" >www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/442677</A><br><br>Yet, they also warn about the implications.<br><br>One is an editorial, another is analysis.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:54:58 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20637880</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><b>digitalfutur</b></A> : You're all SOL now.  The Toronto Star supports the bill.<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The proposed changes to the Copyright Act &#150; introduced yesterday &#150; are sure to bring to a boil long-simmering tensions between artists, businesses and other "creators" who have seen their ability to control and profit from their works eroded by the Internet, and consumers and users who fear the measures will unduly restrict their rights. <br><br>But without an updated law to account for new technologies, Canada risks stifling creativity and innovation among artists who are not being fairly compensated for their work. We are also offside with some major trading partners and international copyright treaties.<br><br>That's why Industry Minister Jim Prentice and Heritage Minister Jos&eacute;e Verner deserve credit for finally wading into this contentious area and putting concrete proposals on the table.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/442594" >www.thestar.com/comment/article/442594</A><br><small>--<br>All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing - Edmund Burke.  "Walk the Talk".</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:33:43 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20637720</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : "Canadian bill to target illegal downloads"<br><br>The topic is wrong. It doesn't just target "illegal downloads"]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:03:45 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20637436</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/231981"><b>capdjq</b></A> : I doubt the Government is going to waste money and time prosecuting Joe Blow downloading a few TV Shows for personal use. Plus without co-operation from the ISPs it going to be difficult.<br><br>The US has a much tougher legislation and prosecutions are rare. They can't even shut down the illegal Torrent sites.<br><br>The Govt hopes to throw a scare into consumers by making it illegal. But, like exceeding the speed limit, its illegal but we all do it daily. <br><small>--<br>Religious War - The battle for best imaginary friend</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:10:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20637207</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><b>StEC</b></A> : Here is the biggest and best group on Facebook on the subject called Fair Copyright for Canada &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=6315846683" >www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=6315846683</A><br><small>--<br><b><A HREF="http://www.stecnet.org">Stec-Net</a> Online Community!</b></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:30:35 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20637183</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Clipper <A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I know a fella who got brought to court by microsoft...of course, he was selling software not just copying it.</div>Yeah, and one should expect something like this.  Microsoft doesn't even really go after businesses that give away illegitimate copies, it's only when they represent them as legitimate or charge for them that Microsoft gets pissed off.  The RCMP/locals don't bother wasting resources on personal swapping, and I doubt they will if the law changes, either.<br><small>--<br>I swear that I will faithfully and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:25:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20637171</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><b>StEC</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Under the terms of purchase you only own the medium, not the content. Ownership of the content remains with the copyright holder. The EULA governs how you can use that content, including approved devices.  Read up on what copyright means.<br><br>If you don't like the copyright terms, don't buy the content.<br> </div>WOW your a piece of work you sound suspiciously like them RIAA/MPAA dudes...how much they paying you!? LMFAO<br><small>--<br><b><A HREF="http://www.stecnet.org">Stec-Net</a> Online Community!</b></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:23:00 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20636803</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634603"><b>Clipper</b></A> : I know a fella who got brought to court by microsoft...of course, he was selling software not just copying it.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 09:02:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20636340</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : PS...<br><br>Btw, if they ever come for me?  I'm ratting out every single other soccer mom and pop out there I know with anything in violation of the law... :)  I certainly won't lie down and take it alone...  Misery loves company :D :D :D ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 03:52:15 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20636328</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : I think, truth be told, even if it passes in the senate and becomes a law, things will remain pretty much business as usual in Canada.<br><br>For a fact I dunno anyone who runs a legit and uncracked version of M$ Office or Adobe Photoshop, yet somehow those programs seem to miraculously appear on every machine I see.<br><br>:D :D :D<br><br>When's the last time you saw the neighbour's kid hauled off to copyright court for all the cracked and illegal software that he runs?<br><br>Now in principle, this will turn anyone with a DVD Burner or PVR style recorder or MP3 player into the same kind of criminal, but nobody's actually gonna ever be busted unless Big Brother wants to really make an example of him...<br><br>So eat, drink and be merry while the Sword of Damocles hangs over your heads...   It's a law which in all practicality will probably never be enforced, unless you piss everyone off so much they simply HAVE to turn you into Bonnie and Clyde for appearance's sake :)<br><br>Ultimately, who knows?  Charter challenges may even render the law unconstitutional, though that would prove cold comfort to the poor sap who gets dragged thru the muck trying to prove so to the supreme court :D :D :D]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 03:40:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635970</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/876144"><b>Reactance</b></A> : Hmm....<br><br>Ok. We know that Rogers and Bell have the D.I.P technology implemented in their systems right? <br><br>That they can inspect each single packet as its comes along its network and goes to the respective client address node.<br><br>So, I am thinking with this new law to be taken into effect somebody out there should come up with a 'software solution' for encrypting the packets..  Is this possible?<br><br>Lets say the above is possible.<br><br>Is the ISP responsible for decrypting the individual packets to see their content inside?? By Law would they be required to do it?<br><br>[DISCUSS]<br><small>--<br>Too Much To Know Too Much To Understand</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 00:46:35 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635963</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1558502"><b>upantsmaster</b></A> : When DMCA becomes legit, I don't think I will continue to have internet in my house. I'll just revert back to buying Chinese movies TV series from the bootleggers. My internet provider loses my business, and PIRACY CONTINUES UNDERGROUND. Life gets push back a few years ....from 1998-2003 where I was still renting stuff to burn.....haaaaa...actually before this bill was introduced,  I am somewhat of a customer, I joined many forums and paid money to them. Right now? I'll never buy any media again from those stupid crooks who thinks they can control me. Yes DMCA angers me, so I better prepare to counterattack. Both the liberals and the conservatives are getting paid off for bringing this crap on board. ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 00:43:27 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635763</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/833344"><b>Cliffy</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>No, you have a right to use the way the copyright holder says you do.  If you can't live with that, don't buy the product. If you're going to acquire the product illegally because you just must have it despite the copyright restrictions, expect to pay the consequences.<br><br>If I buy a movie on DVD, I have the right to view in private, nothing more. If I buy or download music, I have the right to copy it x times or not copy it, depending on the DRM rights that come with the CD or file.<br> </div>How did I acquire the product illegally?<br><br>Just because a copyright holder claims to place limits on their content doesn't mean that it is lawful. There are doctrines in US and Canadian law that covers fair use. This practice would allow for someone to do exactly what I said. It isn't until a DMCA type law would close this loophole. What I am speaking about is not stealing from them. They got their money and now someone would like to watch the DVD in the manner in which they want.<br><br> A recent example is a case in the US. A ruling against Universal Music that said that just because they say a promotional cd is not for resale, they have no right to make that claim.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.dmwmedia.com/news/2008/06/12/judge-tosses-universal-music-lawsuit-against-promo-cd-seller" >www.dmwmedia.com/news/2008/06/12&middot;&middot;&middot;d-seller</A><br><br>Also I don't know about you, but I am not about to give up my legal rights here in Canada so our politicians can placate some foreign interests. Not only that, but these big record labels want things both ways to suit their needs.<br><br>Once again UMG (a RIAA member who is suing all those people for thousands of dollars a song) is involved in a case and forced to pay punitive damages. They argued that it was excessive. And won. How's that for hypocrisy?<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080514-double-standard-umg-fights-excessive-infringement-damages.html" >arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20&middot;&middot;&middot;ges.html</A><br><br>Edit: I found a great blog post on this topic.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://cultureofownership.org/?p=43" >cultureofownership.org/?p=43</A><br><br><small>--<br>there's a fine line between a rut and a groove.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 23:39:17 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635638</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1000066"><b>mazhurg</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Show me a law that allows unlimited file sharing of copyrighted material.  Or allows you to break file protection so you can do that.<br> </div>He, with the blinds.. He's not talking about unlimited sharing; he is talking about making a copy or a legally bought product for his own use (e.g. media shifting). No sharing is done.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635638</guid>
<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 23:05:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635529</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/506168"><b>Airwolf</b></A> : If this passes, not only will have to worry about people trafficking drugs and guns, no, it will be a crack down on MP3s and AVIs. Oh yes, little Liz walking to school with an iPod shuffle she got for her birthday listening to Miley Cyrus, OH WATCH OUT! DANGA! DANGA! CRIKEY!<br><br>*rolls eyes*<br><br>Lets move on and focus on the real dangerous people at large.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 22:41:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635470</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/876144"><b>Reactance</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  andyb <A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I remember reading about resale of copywright materials and if I'm not mistaken thats not allowed either.<br> </div>But, what if you want to give that DVD away for free??<br><br>What if i borrow my brother's DVD from his house and bring it to watch in my house? Allowed? or is it going to be a severe criminal activity? LOL]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635470</guid>
<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 22:31:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635425</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/876144"><b>Reactance</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Airwolf <A HREF="/useremail/u/506168"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>What about if it was a DVD from a yard sale?<br>Supposed to ask if they take Master Card?<br> </div>Hmm.. in that case, request the seller to write an 'official' note that you purchased the DVD from him. And both your thumb prints should be on the note, not your signatures. That way the document is secure! hahahahahahah <br><br>Just kidding.. <br><br>For some reason, this law is bugging me..]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 22:20:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635411</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/506168"><b>Airwolf</b></A> : Ha ha. Wow.<br><br>So if I don't want it anymore, I have to throw it out?<br><br>That's going green. *thumbs up*]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 22:17:38 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635398</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : I remember reading about resale of copywright materials and if I'm not mistaken thats not allowed either.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 22:15:42 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635380</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/506168"><b>Airwolf</b></A> : What about if it was a DVD from a yard sale?<br>Supposed to ask if they take Master Card?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 22:12:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635357</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1336030"><b>TI POIL</b></A> : How can you prove that???  what is it that it's copyrighted??   It's a bunch of 0001 0002.  <br>Encrypter and decryptper will have to be hack on all portable devices.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 22:07:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635302</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : True but if it were to pass you are guilty till YOU prove yourself innocent..Say for example at airport(goverment says cant happen but its in the bill)your listening to song/watching a movie,it just so happens the guy at the gate is havin a bad day and decides you need to have one too.Prove those files belong to you.<br><br>Better if it never makes it here.Probably Congressmen in the states goin holly shit batman,we wanted to retract some things from our's and we got ourselves another whole stupid bunch of idiots  dumber than we are livin right next door.<br><br>Edit.Changed the word wrong to innocent.Gettin my self all confused.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:58:09 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635220</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1336030"><b>TI POIL</b></A> : That will be a mess   Imagine all the paperwork and extra work that "they" will have to do???]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:43:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635210</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/231981"><b>capdjq</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  andyb <A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Snickerdo <A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  andyb <A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>RTFA's! you have no idea what your saying.This is communism for christ sake.</div>... you mean fascism.  If it were communism, it would totally be free and the artists would get absolutely nothing for their work ;)<br> </div>Yea lol.I get carried when I believe in something and this is one thing Canadians from all over should be taking notice of.Toss out those PVR's lol   <br> </div>Its one thing passing these regulations its another thing trying to enforce. I doubt the Courts will want to be tied up with a 100,000 defendents downloading "Desperate Housewives". <br><small>--<br>Religious War - The battle for best imaginary friend</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:41:38 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635144</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Snickerdo <A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  andyb <A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>RTFA's! you have no idea what your saying.This is communism for christ sake.</div>... you mean fascism.  If it were communism, it would totally be free and the artists would get absolutely nothing for their work ;)<br> </div>Yea lol.I get carried when I believe in something and this is one thing Canadians from all over should be taking notice of.Toss out those PVR's lol   ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:27:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635114</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/506168"><b>Airwolf</b></A> : Still there after deletion. Eventually it will be overwritten too much to be recovered.<br><br>What I could see happening is these approved devices will have a format time bomb in the firmware. You can put your songs on the player, but after a designated time or some sort of counter, the device will format itself.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:21:02 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635081</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225914"><b>leer</b></A> : I think I understadn this now...kinda.<br><br>Download torrent.. watch movie... delete movie.<br><br>evidence? movie? nope don't have anything on my HD.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635081</guid>
<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:14:33 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635066</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Under the terms of purchase you only own the medium, not the content. Ownership of the content remains with the copyright holder. The EULA governs how you can use that content, including approved devices.  Read up on what copyright means.</div>You of all people should know that an EULA (or whatever the content publisher decides to call it, "EULA" is specific to Microsoft), regardless of what it contains, does not trump law.  End of story.<br><small>--<br>I swear that I will faithfully and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635066</guid>
<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:11:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635057</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><b>digitalfutur</b></A> : Under the terms of purchase you only own the medium, not the content. Ownership of the content remains with the copyright holder. The EULA governs how you can use that content, including approved devices.  Read up on what copyright means.<br><br>If you don't like the copyright terms, don't buy the content.<br><small>--<br>All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing - Edmund Burke.  "Walk the Talk".</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:09:23 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635026</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : See you still havent read a damn thing.This has nothing to do with piracy.Were talking about things we own.I own a cd/movie and some ass from goverment tellin me I cant watch it unless an approved device?You are as clueless as yoyo.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:02:40 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20635018</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1210586"><b>mordin</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Show me a law that allows unlimited file sharing of copyrighted material.  Or allows you to break file protection so you can do that.<br> </div>This should cover the 1st point. As for breaking file protection - it's not illegal in Canada.....YET!!!<br><br># Section 80(1) (Copying for Private Use) of the Copyright Act provides:"the act of reproducing all or any substantial part of a musical work &#133; onto an audio recording medium for the private use of the person who makes the copy does not constitute an infringement in the musical work" and, as such, "the downloading of a song for personal use does not amount to infringement".<br># Merely placing personal copies of songs into shared directories which are accessible by others via a P2P services does not constitute either: (i) the distribution or unauthorized copies or (ii) authorization of the reproduction; of sound recordings which is prohibited under the Copyright Act.<br><small>--<br>Intel P4 2.8 800 fsb, Asus P4P800 w/1GB PC3200 DDR RAM, 512 MB GeForce 7600GT, SB Audigy Gamer, DVD-Rom/CD-R Burner & LG Duel layer DVD Burner, 320 & 120 GB Internal & 2x 250 & 3x 500 GB External hard drives & Samsung 226BW 22" LCD Monitor</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:01:22 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634997</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  andyb <A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>RTFA's! you have no idea what your saying.This is communism for christ sake.</div>... you mean fascism.  If it were communism, it would totally be free and the artists would get absolutely nothing for their work ;)<br><small>--<br>I swear that I will faithfully and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 20:57:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634990</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><b>digitalfutur</b></A> : You misjudge human nature.  If there's no copyright protection or penalties for illegal copying, copyrighted material will be illegally copied and distributed.<br><br>You can put something from an iPod onto a CD because the DRM for iPod downlaods allows for limited copying to CDs.<br><small>--<br>All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing - Edmund Burke.  "Walk the Talk".</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 20:56:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634980</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : You obviously havent read the bill either.Even a goddamn cd I own will be illegal to put on my ipod because of this shit.<br>RTFA's! you have no idea what your saying.This is communism for christ sake.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 20:54:37 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634962</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><b>digitalfutur</b></A> : Show me a law that allows unlimited file sharing of copyrighted material.  Or allows you to break file protection so you can do that.<br><small>--<br>All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing - Edmund Burke.  "Walk the Talk".</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 20:51:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634689</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/715487"><b>m0x</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>No, you have a right to use the way the copyright holder says you do.</div>No you don't.  You have the right to use it according to the laws.  It's not because a copyright holder says something that it's the law.<br><br>For example, even if it's written "Not For Resale" on a product, you're still allowed to resale it.<br><small>--<br>Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:54:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634679</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : I think I smell a lawer allready drawing up papers]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:53:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634665</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/592593"><b>mr weather</b></A> : Hmm, smells like this could eventually make its way to the SCC.<br><small>--<br>"It's all coming down!!" - Mike Holmes</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:51:01 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634581</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/911204"><b>Devanchya</b></A> : Wake me up when the GG signs this...<br><br>I'll put in $10 for the Charter of Freedoms challenge.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:33:09 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634573</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><b>digitalfutur</b></A> : No, you have a right to use the way the copyright holder says you do.  If you can't live with that, don't buy the product. If you're going to acquire the product illegally because you just must have it despite the copyright restrictions, expect to pay the consequences.<br><br>If I buy a movie on DVD, I have the right to view in private, nothing more. If I buy or download music, I have the right to copy it x times or not copy it, depending on the DRM rights that come with the CD or file.<br><small>--<br>All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing - Edmund Burke.  "Walk the Talk".</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:30:17 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634527</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1210586"><b>mordin</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Tikker_LoS <A HREF="/useremail/u/998508"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>* expressly allow you to record TV shows for later viewing; copy legally purchased music onto other devices, such as MP3 players or cell phones; make back-up copies of legally purchased books, newspapers, videocassettes and photographs onto devices you own; and limit the "statutory damages" a court could award for all private use copyright infringements<br> </div>Except it states...Also, as long as consumers don't attempt to circumvent the digital rights management (DRM) technology, they can transfer media files from their personal computer to their portable device without worrying. The new bill would make it illegal to provide market or import tools &#147;designed to enable circumvention.&#148; So we're getting a double sided law like the US where you have the right to make a copy but it's illegal to crack the DRM to make the copy!!<br><small>--<br>Intel P4 2.8 800 fsb, Asus P4P800 w/1GB PC3200 DDR RAM, 512 MB GeForce 7600GT, SB Audigy Gamer, DVD-Rom/CD-R Burner & LG Duel layer DVD Burner, 320 & 120 GB Internal & 2x 250 & 3x 500 GB External hard drives & Samsung 226BW 22" LCD Monitor</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:23:20 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634472</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/472242"><b>dennilfloss</b></A> : Here's another interesting site that has the whole bill.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://excesscopyright.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2008-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-05%3A00&updated-max=2009-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-05%3A00&max-results=50" >excesscopyright.blogspot.com/sea&middot;&middot;&middot;sults=50</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:12:45 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634276</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/578590"><b>Mashiki</b></A> : Standard copyright laws apply including fines and imprisonment.  This is an amendment that's excessively harsher on people even if you buy a product, and do something with it for your own use.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 18:32:56 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634245</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/231981"><b>capdjq</b></A> : What is the law at the moment? Is there any penalty for illegal downloads? <br><small>--<br>Religious War - The battle for best imaginary friend</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 18:27:20 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634202</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/833344"><b>Cliffy</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  digitalfutur <A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>If media content has DRM protection, you're aware of that before you purchase it.  So don't complain if the law says that if you breach your purchase contract (express or implied) by rendering that protection ineffective, you're going to pay for it.<br><br>Opposition to this law is all about trying to stop the government from letting you get something for nothing.  There's no free lunch. If you're getting something free without the owner's consent, it's no different than someone skimming your ATM card and taking money out of your account.<br><br>The "me now" mentality does not extend to unrestricted human behaviour, and then fear-mongering if anyone dares impose restrictions.  With rights come responsibilities.<br> </div>Yes we purchase something. And when you purchase something, you should have the right to use it in the ways you see fit.<br><br>If I want to rip a DVD to digital format so I can take it with me, how does that hurt the media company? They got their money, I got a product. I didn't cheat them out of anything, I gave them money. How is that not within a consumers right?<br><small>--<br>there's a fine line between a rut and a groove.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 18:19:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634089</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/172669"><b>digitalfutur</b></A> : If media content has DRM protection, you're aware of that before you purchase it.  So don't complain if the law says that if you breach your purchase contract (express or implied) by rendering that protection ineffective, you're going to pay for it.<br><br>Opposition to this law is all about trying to stop the government from letting you get something for nothing.  There's no free lunch. If you're getting something free without the owner's consent, it's no different than someone skimming your ATM card and taking money out of your account.<br><br>The "me now" mentality does not extend to unrestricted human behaviour, and then fear-mongering if anyone dares impose restrictions.  With rights come responsibilities.<br><small>--<br>All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing - Edmund Burke.  "Walk the Talk".</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:54:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20634003</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1556160"><b>josey wales</b></A> : <b>The Canadian DMCA: Check the Fine Print<br>Thursday June 12, 2008 <br>www.michaelgeist.com</b><br><br>As expected, the Canadian DMCA is big, complicated, and a close model of the U.S. Digital Millennium Copyright Act (Industry Canada provides a large number of fact sheets here).  I'll have much more to say once I've had a careful read, but these are my five key points to take away:<br><br>1.   As expected, Prentice has provided a series of attention-grabbing provisions to consumers including time shifting, private copying of music (transferring a song to your iPod), and format shifting (changing format from analog to digital).  These are good provisions that did not exist in the delayed December bill.  However, check the fine print since the rules are subject to a host of strict limitations and, more importantly, undermined by the digital lock provisions.  The effect of the digital lock provisions is to render these rights virtually meaningless in the digital environment because anything that is locked down (ie. copy-controlled CD, no-copy mandate on a digital television broadcast) cannot be copied. As for every day activities like transferring a DVD to your iPod - those are infringing too. Indeed, the law makes it an infringement to circumvent the locks for these purposes.<br><br>2.   The digital lock provisions are worse than the DMCA.  Yes - worse.  The law creates a blanket prohibition on circumvention with very limited exceptions and creates a ban against distributing the tools that can be used to circumvent.  While Prentice could have adopted a more balanced approach (as New Zealand and Canada's Bill C-60 did), the effect of these provisions will be to make Canadians infringers for a host of activities that are common today including watching out-of-region-coded DVDs, copying and pasting materials from a DRM'd book, or even unlocking a cellphone.  <br><br>While that is the similar to the U.S. law, the exceptions are worse.  The Canadian law includes a few limited exceptions for privacy, encryption research, interoperable computer programs, people with sight disabilities, and security, yet Canadians can't actually use these exceptions since the tools needed to pick the digital lock in order to protect their privacy are banned.  In other words, check the fine print again - you can protect your privacy but the tools to do so are now illegal.  Dig deeper and it gets worse.  Under the U.S. law, there is mandatory review process every three years to identify new exceptions.  Under the Canadian law, its up to the government to introduce new exceptions if it thinks it is needed. Overall, these anti-circumvention provisions go far beyond what is needed to comply with the WIPO Internet treaties and represents an astonishing abdication of the principles of copyright balance that have guided Canadian policy for many years.  <br><br>3.   The other headline grabber is the $500 fine for private use infringement.  This will be heralded as a reasonable compromise, but check the fine print.  Canadian law already allows a court to order damages below $500 per infringement, so the change may not be as dramatic as expected (though $500 in damages is the maximum for private use infringement).  Moreover, it is already arguably legal to download sound recordings in Canada.  Under the proposal, there are exceptions for uploading or posting music online (ie. making available) and even the suggestion that posting a copyright-protected work to YouTube could result in the larger $20,000 per infringement damage award.<br><br>4.   The ISP provisions are precisely as expected with a statutory notice-and-notice system.  However, check the fine print.  The role of the ISP may be undermined by the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement, which the government trumpets in its press release.<br><br>5.   The education community received several provisions that are largely gutted by the fine print.  For example, library materials can be distributed in electronic form, but must not extend beyond five days.  In other words, it turns librarians into locksmiths.  Moreover, there is an Internet exception that educators wanted but it does not apply for any works that are either password protected or include a notification that they cannot be used.  In other words, online materials that are available under a Creative Commons license are fair game (as they are already), but most everything else is still potentially subject to a restriction.  This was precisely what many feared - rather than pursuing the far superior expansion of fair dealing, the education community got a provision that does little to enhance classroom learning.<br><br>I'll have more to say soon, but the takeaway is that the DMCA provisions are worse than the U.S. and the consumer exceptions riddled with limitations as the government promotes a strategy of locking down content and launching lawsuits against Internet users. <br><br> ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:38:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633953</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/594412"><b>GOLFnSUN</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Mashiki <A HREF="/useremail/u/578590"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Write your MP, don't email.  Write, it's free and you don't need a stamp.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://webinfo.parl.gc.ca/MembersOfParliament/MainMPsCompleteList.aspx?TimePeriod=Current&Language=E" >webinfo.parl.gc.ca/MembersOfParl&middot;&middot;&middot;nguage=E</A><br> </div>When I lobbied US congresscritters, I found that using a FAX machine got as much attention as a mailed letter. But nothing beats going in person if you have the time. <br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/bqv2h"><b>My BLOG ..</b></a><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/2a9xcb"><i> .. Internet News ..</i></a><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/yz8xto"><b> .. My Web Page</b></a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:26:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633939</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/998508"><b>Tikker_LoS</b></A> : The Government of Canada has introduced Bill C-61, An Act to Amend the Copyright Act. The proposed legislation is a made-in-Canada approach that balances the needs of Canadian consumers and copyright owners, promoting culture, innovation and competition in the digital age.<br><br>What does Bill C-61 mean to Canadians?<br><br>Specifically, it includes measures that would:<br><br>    * expressly allow you to record TV shows for later viewing; copy legally purchased music onto other devices, such as MP3 players or cell phones; make back-up copies of legally purchased books, newspapers, videocassettes and photographs onto devices you own; and limit the "statutory damages" a court could award for all private use copyright infringements;<br><br>    * implement new rights and protections for copyright holders, tailored to the Internet, to encourage participation in the online economy, as well as stronger legal remedies to address Internet piracy;<br><br>    * clarify the roles and responsibilities of Internet Service Providers related to the copyright content flowing over their network facilities; and<br><br>    * provide photographers with the same rights as other creators.<br><br>What Bill C-61 does not do:<br><br>    * it would not empower border agents to seize your iPod or laptop at border crossings, contrary to recent public speculation<br><br>What this Bill is not:<br><br>    * it is not a mirror image of U.S. copyright laws. Our Bill is made-in-Canada with different exceptions for educators, consumers and others and brings us into line with more than 60 countries including Japan, France, Germany and Australia<br><br>Bill C-61 was introduced in the Commons on June 12, 2008 by Industry Minister Jim Prentice and Heritage Minister Jos&Atilde;&copy;e Verner.<br><br>For more information, please visit the Copyright Reform Process website at www.ic.gc.ca/epic/site/crp-prda.nsf/en/home<br><br>Thank you for sharing your views on this important matter.<br><br>The Honourable Jim Prentice, P.C., Q.C., M.P.<br>Minister of Industry<br><br>The Honourable Jos&Atilde;&copy;e Verner, P.C., M.P.<br>Minister of Canadian Heritage, Status of Women<br>and Official Languages and Minister for<br>La Francophonie ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:24:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633925</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/578590"><b>Mashiki</b></A> : Absolutely.  <br><br>Here's some letters from /. as well if folks aren't too good at writing letters, this should give you some ideas on what to write; or you can probably use this as your own form.  I'd suggest checking the original thread there will probably be others later.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=582147&cid=23770193" >news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?si&middot;&middot;&middot;23770193</A><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=582147&cid=23770289" >news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?si&middot;&middot;&middot;23770289</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:21:22 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633909</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Mashiki <A HREF="/useremail/u/578590"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Write your MP, don't email.  Write, it's free and you don't need a stamp.</div>You can also go meet directly with your MP, as they often have office hours on Friday that are open for the public to meet with them and discuss issues.  This would be the perfect opportunity for such a discussion.<br><small>--<br>I swear that I will faithfully and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:17:20 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633893</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/578590"><b>Mashiki</b></A> : Write your MP, don't email.  Write, it's free and you don't need a stamp.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://webinfo.parl.gc.ca/MembersOfParliament/MainMPsCompleteList.aspx?TimePeriod=Current&Language=E" >webinfo.parl.gc.ca/MembersOfParl&middot;&middot;&middot;nguage=E</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:14:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: The bill WAS introduced today</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633888</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  GOLFnSUN <A HREF="/useremail/u/594412"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><b>However, with Parliament set to break soon, sources say the legislation is expected to be left to die by the minority Conservative government, which is likely to face harsh criticism from opposition parties, making the bill difficult to pass.</b></div>I've been saying this all along - they appease the copyright lobby and appear to be fulfilling their treaty obligations by introducing the bill, but they do it in such a way that guarantees it dies on the order paper when the session of Parliament ends.  This same thing happened under Chretien and Martin a few times with the exact same type of legislation.  I haven't even so much as batted an eye over this legislation, and the above quote is precisely why.<br><small>--<br>I swear that I will faithfully and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:13:21 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>The bill WAS introduced today</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633865</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/594412"><b>GOLFnSUN</b></A> : &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080612.wgtcopyright0612/BNStory/Technology/home" >www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/&middot;&middot;&middot;ogy/home</A><br><div class="bquote">The federal government tabled new legislation Thursday morning designed to make it easier to track and prosecute anyone caught downloading copyrighted files, such as music and movies, from the Internet.<br><br>Under the proposed legislation, anyone caught downloading copyrighted material online could face a fine of $500. Individuals may still be liable for other types of damages or remedies. The current Copyright Act allows for a maximum fine of $20,000.<br><br>The new bill makes it easier for rights holders to prosecute commercial copyright violators while protecting the rights of consumers, Mr. Prentice said.<br><br>Under the current legislation, a teenager caught downloading five copyrighted movies in her parents' basement could be liable for up to $100,000 in fines, Mr. Prentice said. Under the proposed law, the maximum fine they could incur is $500.<br><br>The act is designed in such a way to punish those who distribute or upload materials to the Internet rather than consumers who download.<br><br>Also, as long as consumers don't attempt to circumvent the digital rights management (DRM) technology, they can transfer media files from their personal computer to their portable device without worrying. The new bill would make it illegal to provide market or import tools &#147;designed to enable circumvention.&#148;<br><br>Under the new Canadian legislation, ISPs would be obligated to inform subscribers when a complaint has been launched against the consumer by the owner of a copyright, however they would also be obliged to keep track of that user's contact information for six months in case that data became necessary for legal proceedings.<br><br><b>However, with Parliament set to break soon, sources say the legislation is expected to be left to die by the minority Conservative government, which is likely to face harsh criticism from opposition parties, making the bill difficult to pass.</b><br><br>The Conservatives are also negotiating with a number of other governments, including the U.S. and the European Union, to establish a new international copyright agreement, dubbed the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement (ACTA).</div><br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/bqv2h"><b>My BLOG ..</b></a><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/2a9xcb"><i> .. Internet News ..</i></a><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/yz8xto"><b> .. My Web Page</b></a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:07:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633490</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/870211"><b>blueeyesm</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by anon3454576 :</small><br><br>I'm sure when this comes into effect there will be ALOT less people complaining about throttling.  <br> </div>I don't thnk for even a moment that Rogers and Bell will cease  port throttling.<br><br>In fact, I'll bet they will be allowed to examine the content of every packet going through their network to your modem, privacy laws or no.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 15:56:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633068</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/953970"><b>wkendhippie</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Last Parade <A HREF="/useremail/u/700598"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Well, good luck enforcing it.<br> </div>I envision the scenario like this:<br><br>The OPP storm troopers will show up at your door, search your residence, confiscate your hardware and any analogue or digital media in your possession. You will be presented with a ticket 500$ per song and a court date on the spot. ('a la Street Racing law ) :uhh:]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 14:40:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20633026</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : I'm sure when this comes into effect there will be ALOT less people complaining about throttling.  ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 14:34:42 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632655</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  shaner <A HREF="/useremail/u/213092"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Well, wait a second. The article says these proposed "laws" and consequences are part of an international trade agreement which doesn't require parliamentary approval.</div>Anything that inflicts penalties inside Canada requires an act of parliament.  This was ruled on by the Supreme Court back in the 80s.  They could technically get you for international trade without an act of parliament and merely on regulations or an OC, but that's a different issue all together.<br><small>--<br>I swear that I will faithfully and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:34:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632557</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/213092"><b>shaner</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Snickerdo <A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  mazhurg <A HREF="/useremail/u/1000066"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Unfortunately, we have a perfect storm. This may well come to pass.</div>Pass the House maybe, but the Senate will give it some long and hard sober second thought.<br> </div>And now why did we want to abolish the Senate? <br> </div>Well, wait a second. The article says these proposed "laws" and consequences are part of an international trade agreement which doesn't require parliamentary approval. <br><small>--<br>I'm laying pipe,<br>all night long,<br>laying pipe, <br>to satisfy that woman. <br><br>- David Wilcox<br></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:21:42 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632506</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  DKS <A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>And now why did we want to abolish the Senate?</div>I have never been in favour of abolishing the Senate.  My preferred choice is a chamber chosen by the provinces (meaning the province can choose to appoint the Senators or have the voters in the province elect the Senators) with long 10-15 year terms that don't dissolve when the House falls and exist across several House of Commons elections.  It would allow for a more democratic selection of Senators, while still preserving the aspect of non-partisan sober second thought.<br><small>--<br>I swear that I will faithfully and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:11:32 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632421</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/700598"><b>Last Parade</b></A> : Well, good luck enforcing it.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632421</guid>
<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 12:58:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632408</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1509933"><b>vue666</b></A> : I don't think anyone in their right mind wants to abolish the Senate. However I'm 100% for Senate reform and electing Senators. Kind of like what the US has...]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 12:55:56 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632352</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/350435"><b>DKS</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Snickerdo <A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  mazhurg <A HREF="/useremail/u/1000066"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Unfortunately, we have a perfect storm. This may well come to pass.</div>Pass the House maybe, but the Senate will give it some long and hard sober second thought.<br> </div>And now why did we want to abolish the Senate? <br><small>--<br>Need-based health care not greed-based health care.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632352</guid>
<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 12:46:40 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20632200</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/870211"><b>blueeyesm</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Reactance <A HREF="/useremail/u/876144"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>So, what about all the music cds people bought a while ago, and don't have receipts to prove it? </div>Then as far as they would be concerned, its illegal and you owe a lot more money than you originally paid. <br><br>What I would just love to have someone check is Mr. Prentices work and home PCs - y'know, just in case he has any kind of media he can't proves he purchased.<br><br>Mind you, he'd find a way to write off the fines as a 'business expense'.<br><br>As far as I'm concerned, any content downloaded could be deemed illegal by said owner at any time. Technically, your browsers cache could be viewed as a method of storage for images you do not own and may not have been given permission to download. <br><br>That sounds extreme, but it would be valid in a court of law, according to this new bill.<br><br>Don't be surprised of we eventually see down the road the whole idea of 'public domain' evapourate.<br><br>So - notice how there was no mention of the revocation of the media tax?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 12:16:16 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20630425</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/876144"><b>Reactance</b></A> : I believe by this law they are going to cause a lot of public aggravation!  :mad:<br><br>So, what about all the music cds people bought a while ago, and don't have receipts to prove it?<br><br><small>--<br>Too Much To Know Too Much To Understand</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 00:51:44 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20630217</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/911204"><b>Devanchya</b></A> : No, it will be illegal to have media you can not prove you paid for.<br><br>And paid for.<br><br>And paid for.<br><br>And rented.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20630217</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 23:53:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629963</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225914"><b>leer</b></A> : So let me get this straight...<br><br>Basically,<br><br>It;s going to be illegal to download torrent movies and tv shows in Canada now?]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629963</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 22:58:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629458</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/905108"><b>StEC</b></A> : This is downright nasty & scary I sure hope to hell this legislation dies a horrible death along with the greedy corporate scum who thought it up!<br><small>--<br><b><A HREF="http://www.stecnet.org">Stec-Net</a> Online Community!</b></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 21:35:20 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629449</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  mazhurg <A HREF="/useremail/u/1000066"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Unfortunately, we have a perfect storm. This may well come to pass.</div>Pass the House maybe, but the Senate will give it some long and hard sober second thought.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629449</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 21:32:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629423</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1000066"><b>mazhurg</b></A> : Unfortunately, we have a perfect storm. This may well come to pass.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629423</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 21:29:07 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629237</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/328901"><b>Snickerdo</b></A> : The House will fall long before this bill gets anywhere close to passing the House, let alone the Senate.  This is like the fifth or sixth time various sessions of Parliament - the vast majority of them under Liberal leadership - have tried to introduce something along these lines.  Parliament either gets prorogued or an election is conveniently called before it ever makes it out of committee.<br><small>--<br>I swear that I will faithfully and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.</small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629237</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 20:51:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629220</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/349292"><b>Kalford</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  andyb <A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Keep the american shit out of Canada.<br> </div>Technically speaking that IS what the MPAA is trying to do.  :p<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.abitoftheweb.com/gallery/">Through My Eyes</a></small>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629220</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 20:47:37 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629205</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  GOLFnSUN <A HREF="/useremail/u/594412"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Bell Martin <A HREF="/useremail/u/1486949"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Interesting thing to follow<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=28427" >www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=28427</A><br> </div>Canada is just joining what is going on in the EU; Japan, & S.Korea. It isn't just the RIAA & MPAA. The music and movie industries in other countries are pushing for this too.<br> </div>And who praytell do you think run those movie industries?Its the same damn people.Keep the american shit out of Canada.]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629205</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 20:44:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629195</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/818722"><b>andyb</b></A> : It's alot worse than that article says.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.canada.com/topics/technology/science/story.html?id=ae997868-220b-4dae-bf4f-47f6fc96ce5e&p=1" >www.canada.com/topics/technology&middot;&middot;&middot;ce5e&p=1</A><br><br>More here also<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.boingboing.net/2008/06/11/canadian-industry-mi-1.html" >www.boingboing.net/2008/06/11/ca&middot;&middot;&middot;i-1.html</A>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629195</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 20:42:44 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629189</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/594412"><b>GOLFnSUN</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Bell Martin <A HREF="/useremail/u/1486949"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Interesting thing to follow<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=28427" >www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=28427</A><br> </div>Canada is just joining what is going on in the EU; Japan, & S.Korea. It isn't just the RIAA & MPAA. The music and movie industries in other countries are pushing for this too.<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/bqv2h"><b>My BLOG ..</b></a><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/2a9xcb"><i> .. Internet News ..</i></a><A HREF="http://tinyurl.com/yz8xto"><b> .. My Web Page</b></a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 20:41:56 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Canadian bill to target illegal downloads</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629140</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1486949"><b>Bell Martin</b></A> : Interesting thing to follow<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=28427" >www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=28427</A>]]></description>
<guid isPermaLink="true">http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,20629140</guid>
<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 20:31:41 EDT</pubDate>
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