heat84
join:2004-03-11
Fort Lauderdale, FL
1 edit | reply to Zoder
Re: Is AT&T removing alt.* newsgroups
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!  Guess I'll be doing all my pirating via BT now. |
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MyFriendGoo
@bellsouth.net
| reply to Zoder
This really blows chunks. 
Taking down the whole alt.binaries.* hierarchy just so it looks like they're "doing something" about child porn. Swatting a fly with a blowtorch and not even solving what small problem might have existed, as a determined abuser has nothing technical stopping him from posting outside the alt.binaries hierarchy!
In fact, the biggest source of abuse is likely to be Russian spammers trying to advertise for pay websites located offshore and using shady networks of credit card processors. Just let the FBI, Interpol, etc., go after the creeps. The spammers wouldn't care what group they post to.
Taking down the entire alt.binaries is a gross overreaction. Agree with those who say the child-porn thing may be just an excuse and the real reason could be RIAA or MPAA.
Many of the posters on Usenet are already outside the U.S. simply because connections in some other countries are so much faster and the U.S. is falling further BEHIND on that thanks to companies like AT&T! So that side *might* hold up (note that AT&T never carried truly humongous groups like a.b.boneless).
Could the next step be that all 3rd party newsgroup providers have to be based outside the U.S.?!
These moves will mean fewer new users discovering Usenet. Some dedicated newsgroup users started years ago posting to discussion groups and gradually learned the ropes about binaries. There's a learning curve, but those who take it on tend to say it's worth it. |
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rob33
@bellsouth.net
| reply to Zoder
I've been using Bellsouth/AT&T for quite a while now. this move caught me by surprise, as for some reason I didn't hear about this development. I should have known something like this was going to happen sooner or later. I find it highly ironic that they yanked the entire alt.binaries. group, rather than just filtering out the offending groups. the really bad thing, is that as of 3:10am in the morning 07/12-2008, a newsgroup titled "alt.bianries (It is spelled this way).pictures.teen-starlets" is still active.(this was found browsing the complete newsgroups list.) what a load of BS |
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nomyth
join:2007-05-18
Winchester, KY
| reply to Zoder
The es.binarios.* groups are still there. 
Coupon codes for AT&T customers: »www.ngprovider.com
The idea of doing it all via BT fills me with dread, and jumping ship to another ISP would be pointless since the only other option here is Time Warner which got rid of its newsgroups last month. I'm leaning toward Ngroups.net: $10 a month (paid quarterly) is tough to beat, and I've had good experiences with their sister site Usenet-News.net. |
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newsreader
@bellsouth.net | reply to Zoder
when using another newsgroup reader can you still retrieve alt binaries? I had tried forte agent but couldn't get alt. binaries I think because my server is bellouth, am I doing something wrong? |
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wolfsmane
join:2003-05-01
Aiken, SC
 ·AT&T Southeast
| reply to Zoder
if i pay $46.xx /month for a service that includes NGs, shouldn't they have to reduce the price/month since their giving less service?
i've been fighting switching to a higher bandwidth (with NGs) from my local cable provider because i just didn't want to go through the hassle.
the cable is cheaper per month, has NGs, faster speeds than xtreme. even if i have to pay for NGs, i'm still saving $$$'s. |
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goldy
join:2000-11-14
Augusta, GA
·AT&T DSL Service
| reply to Zoder
Time for someone to make an updated list of "free" newsgroup servers. alt. binaries astronomy and a few others is why I kept using them , they were pitiful otherwise,
Att dsl top of the line and their newsgroups ran at 1.5 on a good day and their retention of about 3 days.
--
Never chase a dragon with a butterfly net. It annoys the dragon and will probably get you burnt! |
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graysonf
Premium,MVM
join:1999-07-16
Fort Lauderdale, FL | reply to newsreader
The alt.binaries hierarchy is gone. Changing newsreaders won't bring it back.
You'll have to either find another ISP that still carries it, or take usenet service from a third party provider of which there are quite a few. |
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graysonf
Premium,MVM
join:1999-07-16
Fort Lauderdale, FL
| reply to goldy
Your not going to find a free usenet server that offers the alt.binaries hierarchy and offers anything even remotely resembling decent completion rates and speed. It's just not out there.
You may find a server that has a few obscure low traffic groups and does well with them. But any high volume groups like pictures, multimedia, warez, etc. will never be fully usable.
Change ISPs to one who still does well, with the risk of having them dropping/trimming usenet in the future, or take news from third party provider. |
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Zora
@bellsouth.net
| reply to graysonf
I called their tech support to complain and they didn't even know what I was talking about. The guy really had no clue what Usenet even was. He also said that I was the only person that had called to complain about it.
I think that it was just an excuse to get rid of the bandwidth required to carry the binary groups since a full Usenet feed is quite substantial these days, terabytes a day.
One of the main reasons I switch to BellSouth was Usenet. I have been using it going back 15 years or more. I can remember going there to get new levels for Doom back in the early 90s. I was on Comcast when they dropped Usenet years ago so I voted with my wallet and switched to BellSouth even though they offered slower connection speeds. Now the only option is to go to a 3rd party pay server in my area. |
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newsreader
@bellsouth.net | reply to Zoder
when you say take news from a third party provider do you mean easy news or other such newsgroups or am I just spinning my wheels? thanks for any info |
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blackstarinc
join:2006-01-19
Fort Lauderdale, FL
| reply to Zoder
»AT&T 's Official Newsgroup Announcement
(NOT spam)
Just sharing what I just joined after doing some research. If ATT wants to take away legitimate newsgroups alongside the stuff I never cared for anyway, then why stay?
15% off for life on Newsdemon, best deal I could find. |
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Interesting
@bellsouth.net
| reply to Zoder
For those of you who haven't been reading through the group bellsouth.net.support.news-service, I provide they following very interesting tidbit of info. The part in italics is from someone named sour@dough.com, the latter is from Dennis Crandall...aka Judas. Just kidding, love ya Dennis,..no wait..just kidding. Oh hell just read it.
> 1. There is no court ruling.
>
> 2. This was all negotiated beforehand with the providers and the
> Attorney General.
>
> 3. Until proven otherwise this is what both sides wanted, providers get
> rid of massive bandwidth use and the AG gets to look all rough and tough
> in his bid for the governor's mansion.
>
> 4. So you are correct that "It's all about the children" is phony
> baloney, but it's an excuse that is unassailable because those who
> object must be perves.
>
> 5. Although I have no proof I would not doubt that this also has the
> RIAA and MPAA fingerprints all over it.
>
> 6. As usual the users, the ones paying the bills, have no one at the
> table to look after their interests.
On 2008-07-11, Dennis wrote:
Actually, that is an invalid assertion. There was and still is a group
of people on the inside fighting this decision. Unfortunately, we just
got outplayed from a poliitical standpoint. The game is still not over
yet though.
To prove my point, we did not drop back to big8 only and even worse, get
completely out of the newsgroup business.
There are also points that were made that I cannot tell you about that
could affect the life of binaries in the future.
--
Dennis Crandall
Newsmaster - System Wrangler
at&t SouthEast |
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yzor
Premium
join:2003-01-03
Jacksonville, FL
 ·Comcast
·AT&T Southeast
| reply to Zoder
I have to say thanks a whole lot, knew this kind of bs would happen when at&t took over. First they screw up the bellsouth hosting emails, now this. Geez, not that I use those binaries that much, but I hate the censorship crap, that's just lame. Seems the gov writes laws for everything , pretty soon you wont be able to do anything legally they way we are going.
Censorship and privacy violations , sad sad. |
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Zoder
join:2002-04-16
Miami, FL
| reply to Interesting
There are also points that were made that I cannot tell you about that
could affect the life of binaries in the future.
--
Dennis Crandall
Newsmaster - System Wrangler
at&t SouthEast
I wonder what Dennis means by that. The future on AT&T or the future on the internet? Maybe the speculation that there are going to be big lawsuits against the newsgroup providers by the RIAA/MPAA isn't far off. |
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X_Att_customer
@bellsouth.net
| reply to Zoder
Deleting Alt.bin, under the guise of saving us from child porn is At&t's way of lowering their bandwidth usage at our expense.
The best way an At&t customer could react to this farce is to promptly cancel their accounts and let them know why!
I will be canceling my dsl account on Monday, as well as my local phone service followed by my cellular account.
It angers me to no end that At&t is just bending over and taking it from the governmental agencies who employ people such as Cuomo.. Alt.bin has more to it than just child porn and why wouldn't the people posting this material just move on to another news group...
I was very upset when I heard Bellsouth had sold its rights to my Dsl to a government slave, such as At&t, but I will retaliate with my $$$$$ by going elsewhere!
At&t's actions of censorship is unforgivable and by covering up their actions by trying to save us from Child Porn are insults to our intelligence! |
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graysonf
Premium,MVM
join:1999-07-16
Fort Lauderdale, FL
| reply to Zora
I can believe that many in support don't know about Usenet, but that nobody else complained has to be a lie.
I used a third party news service for many years, starting in 1995 (Altopia.com, previously known as Alt.net - but the server name is still news.alt.net).
Bellsouth had a period beginning around about 1999 where the news service was the worst I have seen anywhere. Completion in binary groups was approaching zero for all multipart posts. They never got it solved, choosing themselves to go to a third party provider, Usenetserver.com. They were hugely better but still had major problems dealing with the sudden load that can come with the dominant ISP in a nine state region. That relationship lasted a few years, but before it even began I left Bellsouth DSL for other smaller ISPs. Most did a great job with news, some didn't, but I wasn't into it enough anymore to need a third party news service.
I agree, the binary portion of the spool is crushing everyone trying to serve it, even those who do news and only news. It was _only_ about 400GB/day when I got away from it.
Providing binary news content is well on its way to being something an ISP just isn't going to be interested in, and yes, it will soon be a third party only thing. |
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check1212
@bellsouth.net
| said by graysonf  :I can believe that many in support don't know about Usenet, but that nobody else complained has to be a lie. I can confirm that support does not know anything about the recent change in newsgroups offerings. I just called in, and got a tech in SE Asia, he had no idea what I was talking about. He barely knew what Usenet was and alluded to the idea that newsgroups are a free offering, unlike email/web services, and that I should just be happy with what I get.
Why would AT&T not alert their tech support call centers of this change. Certainly newsgroups are more obscure and unpopular than the web and email but this thread is proof that there are a good amount of users who care about it.
What a joke, I'll be calling the billing department promptly Monday morning. If they don't concede some sort of reduction in my monthly payment I' gone. The can kiss my ass, I'm not going to sit on my hands about this. This is outright censorship and has little or nothing to do with any children. |
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Zoder
join:2002-04-16
Miami, FL
| reply to graysonf
This post by Dennis just shows how idiotic AT&T's upper management and legal department is.
On 2008-07-12, Dennis wrote:
>
> "Dennis Crandall" wrote in message
> news:Bl3ek.14004$1I.13276@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
>> On 2008-07-12, Dennis wrote:
>>> Does this mean reading only newsgroups will still be available, like this
>>> one for example? I guess that should read 'text only' newsgroups.
>>>
>>>
>>> td
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> Hey td,
>>
>> We will continue to carry every group that does not have alt.bin* nor
>> alt.bain* in their title.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dennis Crandall
>> Newsmaster - System Wrangler
>> at&t SouthEast
>
> Including these?
>
> a2000.erotica.binaries
> alt.hillary-c.newt.binaries.pictures.erotica
> alt.pictues.binaries.erotica
> alt.sex.binaries
> alt.sex.binaries.erotica
> alt.sex.binaries.erotica.teen
> alt.sex.binaries.pictures.erotica.fetish.barbie
> alt.sex.binaries.pisctures.erotica.bears
> alt.sex.binary
> dk.binear.erotik
> dk.binear.erotic.film
> dk.binear.erotic.film.repost
> dk.binear.erotic.nordisk
> es.binarios.sexo
> free.uk.binaries.porn.general
> hr.alt.seks.binaries
> hr.alt.seks.binaries.video
> hr.alt.sex.binaries
> it.binari.x.erotismo
> it.binari.x.erotismo.amatoriale
> it.binari.x.erotismo.animazioni
> it.binari.x.erotismo.cremera
> it.binari.x.erotismo.scanseries
> japan.binaries.pictures.erotica
> japan.binaries.pictures.erotica.aidoruotakaragazou
> japan.binaries.pictures.erotica.anime
> japan.binaries.pictures.erotica.boyoyon
> japan.binaries.pictures.erotica.lolita
> japan.binaries.pictures.erotica.loose-socks
> japan.binaries.pictures.erotica.repost
> japan.binaries.pictures.erotica.shota
> japan.binaries.pictures.lolita
> japan2nd.binaries.pictures.erotica.lolita
> korea.binaries.erotica
> korea.binaries.warez
> sex.binaries
> sex.binaries.oral
> udm.binaries.pictures.erotica
>
> Seems like enough for the people seeking porn, especially if
> they don't insist that it be labelled in English.
>
>
I was handed an order from a team of lawyers telling me to remove all
groups that start alt.bin* and alt.bain*. That is clear enough. If
there are "other" groups available, that would not fall under this
edict, right? So it is ok to carry the porn as long as it's not under the alt.binaries hierarchy but anything non porn related has to be removed. |
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Zoder
join:2002-04-16
Miami, FL
| reply to graysonf
said by graysonf :I agree, the binary portion of the spool is crushing everyone trying to serve it, even those who do news and only news. It was _only_ about 400GB/day when I got away from it. Here are the stats according to Dennis.
"Just before pulled the trigger on removing alt.bin* and alt.bain*, Userland was at 1.4Gb/s of throughput and peering was 1.8Gb/s in both directions." |
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