funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC | reply to TKJunkMail
Re: Good but only if it applies to everyone
Fine. Do you know what? The FCC ought to just reissue the policy statement without that in there. Will that satisfy you? |
|
TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·Comcast
| reply to funchords
said by funchords  :Consider this:  Assume this is or becomes enforceable, would conflicting provisions in boilerplate TOS/AUP documents supersede it or be nullified by it? It all depends on how "reasonable" is defined. And Comcast isn't going to leave that up to the FCC. Off to court they go to define "reasonable".
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page
Ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk? |
|
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
 ·Verizon Online DSL
 ·Skype
| reply to hottboiinnc
Consider this:
Assume this is or becomes enforceable, would conflicting provisions in boilerplate TOS/AUP documents supersede it or be nullified by it?
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
|
|
hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| reply to hottboiinnc
RR is a separate company from TWC. RR is the ISP. TWC is the operator. Go read the TOS and the AUP on the RR side. They are separate. You don't call TWC to get RR support. You call RoadRunner Support who is in Canada. Not in your home state. The only thing that is in your home state is the reboot monkeys and Tier 3/Network Operations.
RR uses the same agreement with BH and Insight in the areas that use RR instead of InsightBB or BH Internet.
You just fail to go read the agreements as I have said before. InsightBB and BH also have RR logos on their website but does NOT mean that they are RR.
You people are just stupid and only do what is easy for you to argue about because you're fuckin lazy to go read what the agreements actually say. |
|
hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| reply to Dogfather
RoadRunner does state in their's at help.rr.com what they do. You would know this if you went to read it. But since you don't feel like you should have to follow their guidelines you simply feel that the rules they have don't apply to you; the same as many others on here. |
|
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
3 edits | reply to fiberguy
said by fiberguy :No, I didn't say that. BUT, when it's updated, do you not get the notice from them stating they updated their TOS agreement? When Comcast last updated its agreements, it was a few days before an FCC filing where they defended their case by referring to the changed agreements!
I had software that was monitoring the changes.
They changed the TOS documents and told nobody for about 8-9 days. Nobody mentioned it anywhere in any of Comcast's online forums or on DSLReports. The changes were significant, and there is no way that such a change would go unmentioned by a user or the press.
After waiting to see if anyone picked up on it, I sent e-mail to a contact at FreePress.net telling them about what changed and giving them the diffs. That started a round of press where Comcast essentially called FreePress.net's lawyer a liar or trouble-maker by saying that the TOS was front-page news on Comcast.net (except that it wasn't front-page news, and Google cache confirmed that).
»Comcast Changes TOS In Response To Traffic Shaping Firestorm
»www.savetheinternet.com/blog/200···ination/
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
|
|
Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | reply to funchords
Re: Martin delivers a fart instead of a bomb with his recommenda
Okay...so reruns of Yu-Gi-Oh. |
|
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to Dogfather
said by Dogfather :Or maybe Roberts promised Martin that he could watch all the Berenstain Bears episodes he wanted on the new $22M HD wall. I know, the guy looks so freekin' young! He's 40 though!
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
|
|
fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| reply to funchords
Re: Good but only if it applies to everyone
No, I didn't say that. BUT, when it's updated, do you not get the notice from them stating they updated their TOS agreement?
Where I WILL damn them is if they make changes to the TOS and NOT notify people. I do not agree with those that update their TOS and do so quietly. I do NOT agree that it's up to the user to "review it periodically"... you and I are talking about the word "reasonable" in another thread. Here is a perfect clear example of what is not reasonable. It's NOT reasonable to expect a user to always look over their shoulder.
Just like any other chance, I believe they should have to notify consumer with a "reasonable" amount of time and using reasonable measures.. ie: registered email address, or by mail, or in the bill.
Paypal sends out updates regularly.. and, if the update is serious enough, I have to click to agree or I can't continue. That's fair. |
|
Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | reply to funchords
Re: Martin delivers a fart instead of a bomb with his recommenda
Or maybe Roberts promised Martin that he could watch all the Berenstain Bears episodes he wanted on the new $22M HD wall. |
|
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to TKJunkMail
Sadly, I think Comcast will take it to court, and I think that Kevin Martin thinks that will happen too. The lack of huge fines will make the FCC look like it was being "reasonable." (For some reason, I suddenly feel dirty when I use that word.)
said by Dogfather :LOL. Looks like Comcast's check made it through. Hahahahaha.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
|
|
Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
·Cox HSI
 ·Verizon FIOS
·Cox VOIP
·ViaTalk
·RoadRunner Cable
·MegaPath
·Verizon west (ex G..
·Time Warner VOIP
| reply to TKJunkMail
said by TKJunkMail :LOL. Lots of noise about how TOUGH Martin was going to be. Well he has released his recommendation on Comcast: - No fine. - Stop P2P blocking before year end. Something Comcast already said they were going to do. I guess he doesn't think he has any real power given his recommendations are already what was going to happen. I wonder if Comcast will take the FCC to court over this anyway if the FCC even issues this weak order. The news story says they will. Story: » money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/art···UNE5.htm LOL. Looks like Comcast's check made it through. |
|
TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
| reply to funchords
said by funchords :Personally, with all of the lying and deception to the FCC and the public, I'm surprised about no fines. But if the FCC wants to make their future job difficult and encourage lying by imposing no penalties for doing so, then I guess that's up to them. Just my humble opinion. But it looks like Martin doesn't have much confidence in his cause. And he is trying to look like he is doing SOMETHING while hoping Comcast doesn't call his bluff by going to Federal court.
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page |
|
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to TKJunkMail
Well it seems to me that if the Commission gives an order and Comcast disobeys, then bring on the fine for disobedience of the order.
Comcast is complaining that the FCC never told them what is reasonable. The order will tell them that blocking P2P uploads isn't reasonable.
Personally, with all of the lying and deception to the FCC and the public, I'm surprised about no fines. But if the FCC wants to make their future job difficult and encourage lying by imposing no penalties for doing so, then I guess that's up to them.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
|
|
TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
|  reply to Dogfather
Martin delivers a fart instead of a bomb with his recommendation
LOL. Lots of noise about how TOUGH Martin was going to be. Well he has released his recommendation on Comcast:
- No fine.
- Stop P2P blocking before year end. Something Comcast already said they were going to do.
I guess he doesn't think he has any real power given his recommendations are already what was going to happen.
I wonder if Comcast will take the FCC to court over this anyway if the FCC even issues this weak order. The news story says they will.
Story:
»money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/art···UNE5.htm
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page |
|
KnightAR
join:2004-04-22
San Marcos, CA
·Cox HSI
| reply to funchords
Re: Good but only if it applies to everyone
That's what I'm trying to say tho, That is why Cox is getting a pass. I didn't say it made it right ... It just seems that it's better to admit what they are doing then to try to deny it and try to keep the truth a secret.
I mostly download from people on dedicated servers on Bittorrent ... so Cox's blocking doesn't bother me much ... eventually any isp doing this will get whats coming to them. |
|
Anonymous_
Anonymous
Premium
join:2004-06-21
127.0.0.1
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable
·Time Warner Cable
·Time Warner VOIP
| reply to hottboiinnc
see image |
|
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
1 edit | reply to KnightAR
said by KnightAR :Cox does throttle Bittorrent Traffic but it's only for Uploads, AND they ADMITTED they do ... and they have limits you actually know about. Comcast throttled both Download & Upload 1. Cox's day is coming
2. In P2P, everyone's upload is someone else's download
3. Admitting doing wrong doesn't make it right
and said they did no such thing which was a obvious lie ... which I think is worse then actually doing it without admitting they are even when it was proved.
Right. On a technical and real level, Cox and Comcast did precisely and exactly the same thing.
On an investigative level, both kept it secret. But when directly confronted, only Comcast denied, deflected, diverted attention in order for people to get confused. Cox got a pass from the public's anger when it simply confirmed the allegation.
I haven't tested in a while, but it seems that both companies continue to do this, apparently. (I haven't heard otherwise.)
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
|
|
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to fiberguy
said by fiberguy :Please explain how anything is "hidden" in an agreement. Are these terms written on white paper in white ink? Do you need a magic decode ring to decipher the encrypted symbols to turn them into English letters? Do they hide them behind bushes in the agreement? what? So every time you start your web browser, you re-read your service "agreement" to see if someone has changed it without notifying you?
(And what kind of an "agreement" is it really if you have to check it to see whether or not you've agreed to something new?)
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
|
|
Cheese
Premium
join:2003-10-26
Naples, FL
clubs:
| reply to hottboiinnc
said by hottboiinnc :TWC DOES NOT DO IT! RoadRunner does who is the actual ISP. Go read your TOS and AUPs from the help.rr.com site. You agree to both their AUPs as well as Time Warner's. RR has the right to do what they want to you since they "own" the network, TWC "leases" it according to the AUP and the TOS. The same with BH customers and anyone else who leases their lines to RoadRunner. TWC = Roadrunner I believe |
|
