 Link LoggerPremium,MVM
join:2001-03-29
Calgary, AB
kudos:3
 ·Shaw
| reply to Its a Secret
Re: Canadian ISPs Plan Net Censorship Tiered levels based on download caps are an entirely different game and perhaps one area where ISP can make money, but even this isn't going to be easy. Lets all be honest here for a second and ask 'how the hell can someone download so much material that they run into caps' and we all know the answer, copyrighted material such as movies, music etc (I been surfing the net hard since Shaw first offered its service in Calgary and I've never gotten close to a cap (and I've worked from home for years using Shaw). Regardless of what you think about movie/music costs this is one area where the internet provides tangible value to some people (ie they download a cash valued movie/music/etc for free, or what they perceive as free). Now this is a difficult area as of course 'other' companies (and I think we all know who they are) understand this model and would want their slice of that pie or they want that slice of pie to be so expensive that it ends internet traffic of copyrighted material. So as soon as ISP do tiered levels which basically identify and monetize those who are 'likely' downloading large volumes of copyrighted material, then others will want a good sized chunk of that pie (which will ultimately drive that slice of pie out of business).
As for texting, I'm old and have no problem turning that off. From a cognitive psychologist's perspective I'm not sure I've ever understood the concept of texting (its slow, its limited and it doesn't make much sense since you are holding the phone and entering the number, but you chose a far more restricted form of communication then actually talking to someone or at the least leaving a voice message, ie same effort but less results with texting). When I see people texting their brains out I know I'm seeing people with way too much spare time on their hands.
Blake
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Vendor: Author of Link Logger which is a traffic analysis and firewall logging tool |
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| I agree on the texting, I just don't get it. But depending on the caps, I'm not so sure about only copyright scofflaws are hitting caps. I have downloaded many Fedora, Debian, and specialty distro installation DVD's that are 4.7 Gb apiece.
Right now there are not a lot of options with ISP's. My prediction is that we will see specialization in the future. Got kids - use SafeNet. Tinfoil Hatter - use Locknet. etc. |
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Link LoggerPremium,MVM
join:2001-03-29
Calgary, AB
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Shaw
| said by mikenolan7:But depending on the caps, I'm not so sure about only copyright scofflaws are hitting caps. I have downloaded many Fedora, Debian, and specialty distro installation DVD's that are 4.7 Gb apiece. And I download from my MSDN subscription, but the big difference is you might download a distro but once you have it, how long would it be before you needed to download it again as distro's just don't change that fast. So you are dealing with a limited number of downloads combined with a low frequency, hence your not going to have a lot of cap issues. Downloading of copyrighted material is very different in that there is gobs of it out there and gobs new everyday, hence the volume and cap issues.
I'd almost offer a bet that a number of people who are running into cap issue don't have time to even watch/listen/use everything they download. I've seen some people who download behavior could only be described as being a download kleptomaniac.
I think somewhere along the line we are going to see internet addictions, download kleptomania etc are going to be regarded as real social problems because of the negative impacts they can have on individuals.
Blake
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Vendor: Author of Link Logger which is a traffic analysis and firewall logging tool |
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Mele20Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:4 | reply to Link Logger
said by Link Logger:Tiered levels based on download caps are an entirely different game and perhaps one area where ISP can make money, but even this isn't going to be easy. Lets all be honest here for a second and ask 'how the hell can someone download so much material that they run into caps' and we all know the answer, copyrighted material such as movies, music etc (I been surfing the net hard since Shaw first offered its service in Calgary and I've never gotten close to a cap (and I've worked from home for years using Shaw). Blake But you don't have Road Runner. The cap in the test in Texas is at 5GB for standard service. Even if that is upped to 20GB when it goes nationwide, many users who NEVER steal movies, etc off Usenet and who seldom use Bittorrent will go over their caps. I listened to 3 hours of AOL Radio a few days ago while surfing. My usage for that day was 3GB. That is more than one-half the cap for ONE MONTH in the RR test in Texas. Even at a 20GB cap, I will go over that and I don't listen to streaming radio every day and I never do streaming video and may go for months with not using Bittorrent at all. Companies like Time Warner are intent on killing their business. Then there is the Phorm/NetbuAd coming and when that gets here, I will stop using the internet. I am already delaying buying another computer because of the uncertainty of whether I will use it or not. Without the internet, I don't need a computer.
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"The same ferocity that our founders devoted to protect the freedom and independence of the press is now appropriate for our defense of the freedom of the internet. The stakes are the same: the survival of our Republic". Al Gore, The Assault on Reason |
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Link LoggerPremium,MVM
join:2001-03-29
Calgary, AB
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Shaw
| said by Mele20:The cap in the test in Texas is at 5GB for standard service. Wow so much for that saying that everything is bigger in Texas.
I will agree 5GB is just goofy, and if they came to Alberta where everything truly is BIGGER, hooked up with Shaw for example they announced these caps 2 years ago:
Shaw High-Speed Lite - 10 GigaByte; (like $20/month)
Shaw High-Speed - 60 GigaByte (lie $30/month)
Shaw High-Speed (with Xtreme-I) - 100 GigaByte
SOHO - 90 GigaByte
SOHO (with Xtreme-I) - 130 GigaByte
Professional - 110 GigaByte
Professional (with Xtreme-I) - 150 GigaByte
Business - 175 GigaByte
Business (with Xtreme-I) - 225 GigaByte (combined download and upload)
Shaw has all sorts of 'deals' going on so the actual monthly cost might be much lower.
Now I have SOHO (with Xtreme-I) which is 130 GigaByte, but I never get even close to my cap as I got this account because it gave me 5 IP addresses that I use to test firewalls etc and I don't run anything but my Microsoft Home Server from here, as all my 'commercial' servers are hosted elsewhere.
NOTE that none of these systems are marketed based on download cap but on usage type, ie personal vs business so those 'other' companies who would like to get in and suck every $ they can from everyone on the planet can't really make a case to get a slice of the pie.
Now this is tiered service, but tiered very carefully and frankly it works. Sure I pay more then my neighbor but I use my connection far more then he does, plus I make money with my connection so I should pay more as really I treat my internet connection as a business tool (ie good carpenters don't buy consumer grade power tools).
Now at the same point in time, wireless charges here are just goofy when compared to what some of my US friends pay. I would also imagine that being on an island Hawaiian internet users might pay a bit of a premium.
Blake
Now I pretty sure that to get Shaw on my case I'd have to consistently blow my monthly cap in a big way for a couple of months in a row or at least this is what I've heard. Shaw is a pretty good outfit with excellent service and products, hence why I've been with Shaw since they started (Shaw Internet was first offered in Calgary in 1996 but I was an early tester so it might have been 1995 when I started with them, ie I remember waiting for a particular two way switch to be place in one location so they could hook me up).
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Vendor: Author of Link Logger which is a traffic analysis and firewall logging tool |
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 Its a SecretPlease speak into the microphonePremium
join:2008-02-23
Da wet coast
kudos:3 | Blake, you're absolutely correct, us Shaw users have it very good here in Canada. I've been with them since way back as well. However, our friends that have the competition don't have it nearly so nice. I hope Jim Shaw keeps it as it is. He'll gain a lot of business...
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A triple espresso, please... |
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Link LoggerPremium,MVM
join:2001-03-29
Calgary, AB
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Shaw
| said by Its a Secret:Blake, you're absolutely correct, us Shaw users have it very good here in Canada. I've been with them since way back as well. However, our friends that have the competition don't have it nearly so nice. I hope Jim Shaw keeps it as it is. He'll gain a lot of business... My wife had a job with the competition and even with her employee discount I still stayed with Shaw.
I did a dot com company during the boom that showed me exactly how good we had it as our whole development team in Calgary over estimated internet connectivity for North America based on our personal experiences in Calgary, we recovered but wow it was an eye opener.
I remember when they built the original Shaw TV cable system in Calgary and how some people were thinking it was over kill to put in two way switches everywhere as 'its just for TV', but Shaw was planning for much more and we ended up with a pretty good system (some places I did business with elsewhere thought high speed cable meant cable down and phone up as they went cheap and with one way switches on their systems).
Now Shaw has been able to show shareholder growth in other ways (adding phone service etc) so the internet bunch isn't under siege yet, but at some point in time I expect Shaw might try some things which don't exactly endear itself to its customers (I hope not, but shareholder pressure can be a brutal thing and I'm not sure I'd ever take a company public again).
Blake
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Vendor: Author of Link Logger which is a traffic analysis and firewall logging tool |
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 T BellYou Can FlyPremium
join:2003-10-23
Terra Firma | Looks like the USA is safe for the time being:
F.C.C. Chief Would Bar Comcast From Imposing Web Restrictions
By SAUL HANSELL
Published: July 12, 2008 - NYT
Federal regulators are prepared to take action against sellers of Internet access that want to restrict what their customers can do online.
Kevin J. Martin, chairman of the Federal Communications Commission, said Friday that Comcast, the nation’s largest cable company, should be sanctioned because it had interfered with the Internet connections of users who were exchanging files with other people.
Mr. Martin’s recommendation is a strong push for network neutrality, the idea that Internet access providers like Comcast should not be allowed to favor some uses of their networks over others. Internet companies like Google and free speech advocates have backed this approach... (con't)
Read entire article: »www.nytimes.com/2008/07/12/techn···f=slogin |
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