cscottm
join:2002-05-09
Kent, WA
 ·Qwest.net
| [WA] SR 167 - Hot Lanes
I use SR 167 on a regular basis. I remember reading something on the State's transportation website that said there should be less collisions, etc due to the fact that people can only go into the hot lanes are certain points.
Well I am constantly seeing people passing when its a double white line, & going back & forth. I swear the state could probably clean up on the stretch of hwy especially if they were to use an unmarked car & to make the fine higher then a normal infraction. |
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RR Conductor
'Boarrrd
Premium
join:2002-04-02
Redwood Valley, CA | I've never heard them called that, we call them Carpool Lanes here in CA. It is illegal here to get on or off those lanes except at the designated points, and there are stiff fines for people caught doing it. |
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cscottm
join:2002-05-09
Kent, WA
·Qwest.net
| Well for the most part they are called Carpool lanes, except they are doing a pilot program, in which single occupancy vehicles can use the carpool lanes, but have to pay a toll (from 50 cents to $9.00) The highest I've seen is $2.00, but heard that the highest has been $5.xx.
I should mention that in other areas, they are called Carpool/HOV Lanes |
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sashwa
Pixie Cat
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join:2001-01-29
Alcatraz
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| They've talked about trying something that down here in the SF Bay Area. I don't remember what they called them though. What I remember about it was that anyone could buy a pass monthly and they could use the carpool lanes even by themselves.
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RR Conductor
'Boarrrd
Premium
join:2002-04-02
Redwood Valley, CA
·Comcast
edit:
July 21st, @02:06AM
| »www.dmv.ca.gov/vr/decal.htm
»www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm
I think that's the program here in CA.
"PLEASE NOTE:
All Clean Air Stickers remain with the vehicle they were originally issued to and cannot be transferred to any other vehicle. If you purchase a vehicle that has a Clean Air Sticker you may transfer the sticker to your name.
If you acquire a hybrid vehicle with Clean Air Vehicle Stickers attached, and are a resident of Alameda, Contra Costa, Marin, Napa, San Francisco, San Mateo, Santa Clara, Solano or Sonoma County, you must obtain a Bay Area FasTrak account before you drive as a sole occupant in a high-occupancy vehicle (carpool or diamond) lane.
All Clean Air Vehicle stickers will expire January 1, 2011, unless the law authorizing their use is extended beyond that date.
Carpool lane use may be restricted at any time by state and federal law for all Clean Air Vehicles carrying fewer occupants than the posted minimum requirement, if their presence is determined by the California Department of Transportation to contribute to increased traffic congestion, increased travel times, decreased sustained travel speeds, or other factors affecting any carpool lane or segment of that lane.
Clean air vehicles that meet the posted minimum occupancy requirements for carpool lanes are not subject to the above restrictions"
"California law allows single-occupant use of High Occupancy Vehicle (HOVs) lanes by certain clean alternative fuel and full-electric vehicles. Use of these lanes with only one occupant requires an identification sticker issued by the California Department of Motor Vehicles. These stickers will be valid until January 1, 2011 at which time this access program expires.
IMPORTANT INFORMATION REGARDING HYBRID VEHICLES:
Access for cleaner hybrid vehicles under this program was limited to the first 85,000 applicants. This limit has been reached and there are no further extensions of this program anticipated. Hybrid vehicles listed here are the only models that qualified and there will be no further updates to the hybrid vehicles listed below"
I've heard them called Diamond Lanes too, the HOV thing is new though. |
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RR Conductor
'Boarrrd
Premium
join:2002-04-02
Redwood Valley, CA | reply to cscottm
»www.bayareafastrak.org/static/in···ns.shtml |
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cscottm
join:2002-05-09
Kent, WA | This is almost like what we have, except that single occupancy vehicle can use the lanes (as long as they have a transmitter). |
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tshirt
Premium
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
| reply to cscottm
said by cscottm  :Well I am constantly seeing people passing when its a double white line, & going back & forth. I swear the state could probably clean up on the stretch of hwy especially if they were to use an unmarked car & to make the fine higher then a normal infraction. Call 1-877-764-HERO and turn them in.
it's a $124 fine and a moving violation to cross the double white lines at anytime (unless directed to do so by law enforcement)even if you meet the HOV (carpool requirements or have a "good to go" transponder.
you can only (legally) enter or leave the lanes at the dashed line sections.
This was one of the objections raised by the state patrol from the beginning of the HOT program, that without a physical barrier between the lanes, enforcement would be extremely difficult. The best the could get was funding for some dedicated enforcement time. (not nearly enough, but they did write 11,536 for HOV violations last year at $124 + each)
»www.wsdot.wa.gov/Operations/Toll···ault.htm
The state transportation committe loves the Good To Go (RFID) tolling, so be prepared to see A LOT more projects like this. |
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tshirt
Premium
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
| reply to RR Conductor
said by RR Conductor :"California law allows single-occupant use of High Occupancy Vehicle (HOVs) lanes by certain clean alternative fuel and full-electric vehicles. Use of these lanes with only one occupant requires an identification sticker issued by the California Department of Motor Vehicles. These stickers will be valid until January 1, 2011 at which time this access program expires. My sister in law (cupertino) bought a hybrid SUV 2-3 years ago, just so she could get one of those stickers, and used it.........ONCE (according to my brother in law) before recoginizing that since she rarely drives on the freeway and her short comute was opposite the main rush, she doesn't really need it. but like buying the hybrid, it had a coolness factor. (she doesn't need an SUV either since she would never let anybody else in HER car. (could have bought 2+ prius'es for what she payed, and actually saved some gas)) |
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Big Time
Fuster Cluck
Premium
join:2002-10-19
Washington
| reply to cscottm
said by cscottm :Well for the most part they are called Carpool lanes, except they are doing a pilot program, in which single occupancy vehicles can use the carpool lanes, but have to pay a toll (from 50 cents to $9.00) The highest I've seen is $2.00, but heard that the highest has been $5.xx. I should mention that in other areas, they are called Carpool/HOV Lanes I've seen it at the full $9.00. Heading northbound the first sign back in Pacific was 8.75, but by Auburn it was $9.
And nearly daily I see some fool cross the white lines to get in or out of the HOT lane. Even watched someone do it right in front of a patrolman on a motorcycle. He pulled the driver over, I only hope he got popped for $124.
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There are times when I look at people and I see nothing worth liking. |
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mr_slick
join:2003-05-22
Lynnwood, WA
| reply to cscottm
Am I the only one who thinks that this double-line can't cross thing is very dangerous?!?! I have not seen it in action on 167 during heavy traffic, but I have seen in a few other places where slow vehicles try to cross three (or more) lanes of traffic to try to exit (cutting me off in the process).
I realize they need to somehow keep tabs on the transmitters (or lack of) but I think it is dumb the way they are doing it.
I guess we'll always have these issues, however, at least until people stop gravitating to the left lane for no reason (it can be 3:30 in the morning and people get on the freeway going 50 in a 60 and cross three or four lanes to get in the left lane for some unknown reason)
Sorry.... /rant> |
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jinjimbob
Troy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13
Enumclaw, WA
·Qwest.net
| reply to cscottm
The WSDOT has installed signs that tell you when to exit the HOV/T lane for the road exists.
The HOT scheme is a joke, it just proves the car pool idea is a failure. They do not allow reduced emission cars to use it for free here, thanks goodness.
They call the HOT lane here the Lexus lane. Driving will be become a privilege for the elite.
in SoCal they have reduced car pool exit points, in middle California (San Jose), they have a dotted yellow, just like the rest of the car pools in WA. |
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tshirt
Premium
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
| The point is those willing to pay will pay for everyone who chooses to carpool.
as long as A) there is always a free lane, and B) the state fells some incentive to continue improving the "free" (i.e. tax supported) lanes, rather then make them unusable to force people to the pay lanes.
The costs that voters won't pay for are staggering, the cost for not doing something is collapse of the regional economy.
if tolls for speed, help pay for transport for the rest of us, it's a good thing |
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tshirt
Premium
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
| reply to mr_slick
said by mr_slick : ...where slow vehicles try to cross three (or more) lanes of traffic to try to exit (cutting me off in the process). I used to have a long commute, and every day I 'd see the same cars (with the the same A'holes inside) weaving back and forth trying to gain one or to cars ahead (while screwing up the drive for most of us, who recognized the "get in line, do your time, arrive home safe) reality.
The thing was, most days, I'd leave the highway 22 miles later, within one or 2 car lengths of the same car. some of the other days I saw those cars pulled over getting a ticket, or after an accident...
I no longer "feel bad" reporting reckless, impaired, HOV/HOT violators. |
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jinjimbob
Troy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13
Enumclaw, WA
·Qwest.net
| reply to cscottm
Everyone pays taxes for all the lanes, including the car pool lanes that we are not allowed to use.
The point it, the carpool lanes do not work, people use them mostly when its convenient, most do not plan ahead. By having hardly anyone in those lanes, and backed up traffic in the other lanes is actually VERY BAD for the environment. It actually mains environmental sense for the most least efficient cars/suvs to use the less busy lane and the most efficient to use the busy lanes.
I do not think a mother with 3 children that are legally not allowed to drive should be able to use the car pool lane, as they would have taken no cars off the road. Car pool lanes make no sense.
A bus lane, is a different thing, like they have in SoCal, that could work if they had enough buses using it. |
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mr_slick
join:2003-05-22
Lynnwood, WA
edit:
July 22nd, @04:05AM
| reply to tshirt
Your reply does not really have any relevance to my point, which is to plan ahead and drive safely. It is just plain dumb (and against the law!) to form a huge line in the left lane and "do your time", when the right lanes are wide open. Have you never seen those signs that say "keep right except to pass".
I do understand getting over to the left to get into the HOV lane, but do it safely... either speed up while traversing the passing lane or wait for a safe opening. People just don't seem to care about looking for other cars anymore. They think "I just turned my blinker on a millisecond ago, so I can change lanes... and if someone is there they have brakes don't they?"
Also to clarify, I am not talking about when the freeway is a parking lot (rush hour-- almost all day now  ). I am referring to when traffic is open enough so that I can reasonably expect to be able do the speed limit (11pm).
Edit: I do not consider myself to be one of those a-holes that weave in and out, but since I am almost always forced to pass in the right lanes, you may see me as such. Why would a person drive 55 in the left lane? Are they a foriegner? Did they not take a driving test/course? If the state patrol would ticket these fools, then everyone would be safer.... and I will gladly take a ticket for weaving if the trooper deems that I deserve one. |
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tshirt
Premium
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
edit:
July 22nd, @06:28AM
| i Guess you missed that I totally agreed with your post.
I was refering to those drivers so self obessed, so unsituationally aware that they block/cut others off, ride the left lane by habit.
I was very happy to see the WSP start a campaign to enforce the "stay right, except to pass" law and to target distracted drivers as well as aggresive drivers.
with relitively few trooper per capitia, the WSP has struggled to try to enforce and educate drivers to drive safely and effectively. Since the nice guy reminders haven't worked well, they are switching to the tough guy/make it expensive to drive poorly model. the tickets aren't cheap, but the real cost is what happens to the multiple offenders insurance rates.
Still there are not enough officers to catch ALL the bad drivers ALL the time. |
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tshirt
Premium
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
| reply to jinjimbob
said by jinjimbob :Everyone pays taxes for all the lanes, including the car pool lanes that we are not allowed to use. The point it, the carpool lanes do not work, ........ Actually HOV (carpool) (and maybe the HOT) lanes work very well. between buses, vanpools and carpools they move 3 times as many people per hour, per lane mile, during rush hour, as compared to a general purpose lane and remove about 30% of the cars from the freeway, even though they appear to be somewhat empty (higher gas prices are making them work even better, as people fill the buses to capacity, and transit agencies add more buses)
removing the HOV from a 4 lane freeway would just end up with 4 stop-n-go lanes rather then 3 plus a speedy HOV
The real conflict has been getting those carpools and buses across traffic and in/out of the HOV safely.
now that more of the flyovers( direct access ramps) that allow HOV access directly to the left HOV lane are being completed. (many of which are paid for by Sound Transit 1) we are beginning to see how they were intended to work.. the HOT lanes which adds some capacity based tolling traffic to the HOV system, rates change according to the speed/traffic in that lane. (in theory, if the HOV traffic fills the lane to capcity/speeds slow too much, the toll signs will say the lane is closed to additional toll drivers)
It is an experimental system (4 year experiment in 167's case, because the realize it takes time for people to change their habits/patterns, to determine how well it works here.
Look at the Tacoma narrows Bridge, during the first few months 6-7% of drivers failed to pay the toll ,considered very low in the tolling industry, national average is 10-15% (I was shocked by that number, even allowing for the start up glitches with the Good to Go electronic tolls, and people learning the new system.) after a year, a lot of tickets that # has dropped to 2% or less.
The HOT is the same idea, it allows them to charge off some of the cost and maximize lane useage. if it works, the DOT wants to run it all the way up 405 with 2 HOV/HOT lanes from north renton to Bothell with flyover access only in most of the 2 lane sections (make enforcement easier and avoids the problem of entering exiting from high speed lanes into stop-n-go traffic in the GP lanes.
What it all comes down to is more lanes are needed and general, gas/cartab, and over special taxes are maxed out, so tolling (point of use) is the next step. This is alot better then toll booths on every on ramp. |
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mr_slick
join:2003-05-22
Lynnwood, WA
| reply to tshirt
I did miss your agreement... now that I re-read your post I can see it. I guess I am as self absorbed on the net as some of these drivers 
I humbly apologize and am glad to see that I am not the only one that feels this way  |
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MotherNature
Chile peppers are my heroin
Premium
join:2002-08-23
Fontana, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to tshirt
said by tshirt :Call 1-877-764-HERO and turn them in. Those signs have always disturbed me.... equating snitching to heroism.
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It's not nice to fool Mother Nature. |
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