 StewyPremium
join:2007-12-12
Kitchener, ON | [Rant] The Bay denied wind turbines to reduce hydro use Friday, August 08, 2008 - 06:25 AM 570 News
The Bay store in Conestoga Mall in Waterloo wants to go green, but has had its plans nipped in the bud by a city committee. The Hudson's Bay Company had applied to install two tall wind turbines outside its store there, in an effort to reduce energy consumption. City staff say the height of the turbines is against bylaw regulations, and there are also safety concerns.
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Instead of going forward the city of KW is taking a huge step back in my opinion. David Suzuki save your breath pack your bags and go home, until you deal with this anything you say is a waste of time.
This is exactly what's wrong with this province/country when it comes to alternative energy. Massive red tape and moronic safety zealots. What we need is a Canadian Law for the Priority of Renewable Energy similar to what Germany has. The German energy feed in law is one of the biggest success stories for new renewable energies in the world.
The EEG (Energieeinspeisegesetz, energy feed-in law) commits the utilities in Germany to accept any feed in of electricity from wind power and other renewable sources into the electrical net. It furthermore commits the utilities to provide an appropriate electricity network, sufficient to take the renewable electricity. Additionally, the EEG commits the utilities to pay a definite minimum feed in tariff for the renewable electricity – dependent on the kind of renewable source used for its production. The total payment is distributed accordingly to the end users electricity consumption of the utility’s customers. One of its outcomes was the rapid growth of electricity production from wind energy which made Germany the world leading wind energy nation despite its mostly mediocre resource. |
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 donoreoPremium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON | Well, sounds like KW councillors need some emails to me  |
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 ArthurSWatch Those Blinking LightsPremium
join:2000-10-28
Hamilton, ON | reply to Stewy
If I were to be a neighbor to this mall, would I want a wind turbine in my backyard? People get in a tizzy if they even see a cell phone tower close by. Perhaps there's a side to the story we are not hearing? |
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donoreoPremium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON | said by ArthurS:If I were to be a neighbor to this mall, would I want a wind turbine in my backyard? People get in a tizzy if they even see a cell phone tower close by. Perhaps there's a side to the story we are not hearing? Oh yes, the NIMBYs! True, there may be another side. Still, I think they need email!
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The irony of common sense, it is not that common
I cannot deny anything I did not say |
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 DKSDamn Kidney StonesPremium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2 | reply to Stewy
Wrong. Urban areas are not places for wind turbines, Toronto excepted. Dumb idea. Right response by KW Council.
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care. |
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zincPremium
join:2004-02-17
Kitchener, ON | I don't exactly see where they would have the space to build one wind turbine, let alone two, with enough clearance around them. Why don't they put up solar panels? After all, they should have a lot of free roof space... |
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StewyPremium
join:2007-12-12
Kitchener, ON | reply to DKS
said by DKS:Wrong. Urban areas are not places for wind turbines Yea that's what they said about clotheslines 25 years ago.
Yes folks, clotheslines, that's Ontario's plan in renewable energy.
Ontario hydro must also be P'd because energy consumption was down %5.6 because of the cool weather, I guess the rates are going to have to go up again. |
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 HiVoltPremium
join:2000-12-28
Toronto, ON
kudos:11
 ·TekSavvy DSL
 ·TekSavvy Cable
| said by Stewy:Ontario hydro must also be P'd because energy consumption was down %5.6 because of the cool weather, I guess the rates are going to have to go up again. Yeah, stuff like that cracks me up... Rememeber after the Blackout of 2003 they were educating people to use less power, replace standard bulbs with CCFL's, even had programs for freebie ones...
It worked so well that they were not making enough money so they jacked the rates...
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DKSDamn Kidney StonesPremium,ExMod 2002
join:2001-03-22
Owen Sound, ON
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Bell Sympatico
| reply to Stewy
said by Stewy:said by DKS:Wrong. Urban areas are not places for wind turbines Yea that's what they said about clotheslines 25 years ago. Yes folks, clotheslines, that's Ontario's plan in renewable energy. Ontario hydro must also be P'd because energy consumption was down %5.6 because of the cool weather, I guess the rates are going to have to go up again. There is a huge difference between a clothesline and a wind turbine. BTW, drive up #10 north of Shelburne and take a look at the dozens of new wind turbines that have been installed. Want one of those in your back yard? 
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Need-based health care not greed-based health care. |
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 MashikiBalking The Enemy's Plans
join:2002-02-04
Woodstock, ON
·Bright House
·TekSavvy Cable
| If I could get a micro-windmill to stick on a 100ft tower in my backyard you bet.
Really I don't give a care what David 'sold his soul' Suzuki says about energy conservation; I would however like to see less red tape with regards to everything from solar panels to micro-turbines. |
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donoreoPremium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON | reply to Stewy
We need more of the story here. How big of turbines? If they are like the one in Pickering or at the CNE in Toronto, then yes they are a little big. However smaller than that is a great idea. I think KW council is short sighted.
This is a good idea.
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The irony of common sense, it is not that common
I cannot deny anything I did not say |
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| reply to Stewy
The Bay opted for the least expensive - most visible "green like" solution. A few solar thermal panels could provide all of the stores hot water needs, and if one considers the flat roofs on commercial buildings, a green roof and many photovoltaic cells would have provided the most practical energy gains. Unfortunately, unless they have a tour of the roof, those items are invisible to the average shopper and therefore provide less green hype for "The Bay".
The typical rural wind turbine costs about two million dollars and range in height between 25 to 55 metres. Bare in mind that these towers are locate in open fields (farmland) with few nearby obstructions and are constructed after a rather extensive study of area wind flow. In an urban setting, such towers would have to be much higher to overcome wind shadowing from other buildings, thus the tower would need to be much stronger, or require guy wires. The other factor concerning urban areas is that cities tend to generate their own weather patterns (thousands of acres of asphalt and concrete will do that) which leads to further problems with strong & steady airflow.
Unless the Bay intends to build a 75-metre high tower, their turbine will just be an expensive bit of green PR and provide very little usable power.
On the other hand, a series of wind turbines located offshore along the Toronto waterfront would be very practical - however getting the approval would be impossible.
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...A bitter ray of sunshine |
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StewyPremium
join:2007-12-12
Kitchener, ON | reply to HiVolt
said by HiVolt:It worked so well that they were not making enough money so they jacked the rates... I remember about 2 years ago here in KW when we had a warm winter and the Record ran an article where Kitchener-Wilmot Hydro was complaining that their revenue was low because of all the warm winter weather. For the life of me I tried and tried and was never able to find that article again.
If I could get a micro-windmill to stick on a 100ft tower in my backyard you bet. I'd do it to but there simply isn't ANY serious commitment to any type of renewable energy. Why even focus on renewables when hydro is a cash cow for Federal, Provincial and Municipal governments.
Another prime example of hydro hypocrisy is my rental water heater, Kitchener-Wilmot KNOWS that they can install a more energy efficient tank but they deliberately don't nor does the city or province force them to do it.
It has nothing to do with energy conservation and more with economics.
Power does what it wants. |
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Reviews:
 ·voip.ms
| reply to Stewy
I'm not sure that a wind turbine on the top of a building where it could be possible for the thing to fall over and cause damage to property or even kill someone is the way to go.
I think the solar panels on the roof is a much safer idea, leave the wind turbines for open areas, build 'em like crazy and zone at least a one kilometre "buffer zone" around any such wind farm to reduce the likelyhood of any accidents and call it a day.
NefCanuck |
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StewyPremium
join:2007-12-12
Kitchener, ON | reply to Stewy
There should be a Law that makes these types of micro wind generators overrule any type of municipal by-law (except in very special cases). Simply get a permit and have a certified contractor come in and install it, period. They should be subsidized and tax free.
These systems are not designed to store electricity in batteries which are not environmentally friendly. It does not connect into any specific product, rather it will when generating supply supplemental power to one or all of the products connected into the electricity supply of the property or simply feed it back into the grid.
This is what I'm talking about, even with something as simple as this and in the home that I live in right now and because of red tape and by-laws I cannot do this. |
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 TrishMIn A MoodPremium
join:2001-12-23
Mississauga | reply to Stewy
For now they could look into this:
»www.bullfrogpower.com/index.cfm
My company is Bullfrog powered, Woofstock was...and many businesses are as well.
What is it? You pay a premium based on your hydro use and Bullfrog takes those funds and gives them to those companies/organizations that do create alternative green power sources.
We also pay a premium when ever our account directors fly - to help reduce our carbon footstep. |
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| reply to Stewy
"O NO...the Giant Windmill is going to kill us all"...or things that won't happen.
Green roofs aren't really usable for most existing buildings to the to weight. They should have gone with solar panels but who knows what they where thinking. |
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 nitzguyPremium
join:2002-07-11
Sudbury, ON
·TekSavvy DSL
| reply to DKS
said by DKS:Wrong. Urban areas are not places for wind turbines, Toronto excepted. Dumb idea. Right response by KW Council. Short-sighted response by KW Council...you say "Toronto excepted" although they are the LARGEST Urban area in ALL of Canada?
Would you like 100 or 1000 Wind turbines which are perfectly SAFE and won't MELTDOWN...and certainly won't "BLOW UP"...
Or do you want more Nuclear facilities just down the road in Kincardine? You want Bruce/Brookfield Power to slap some more up there...
How would you like it if you had a Nuclear Reactor in your backyard?
This kind of Short-sightedness and NIMBYism MUST stop.
Also to the other poster who said it's 2 million to put up a wind turbine, think again...its not even 1/10th of that to place one up.
I've seriously considered moving to strictly Wind Power on my 80 Acres...have dozens of turbines on my land...then as you come down Highway 69...you'll see them alright....
People need to get off their high horse and realize that if we TRULY want to save the planet...we really have to tone down the "awww but the wind turbine is making my view look crappy"...
But...place another Coal or Nuke plant somewhere off in the distance so I can't see it, but so I can go ahead and keep my life powered...that's fine.
I hate double-standards...either pee or get off the pot.
Also, I don't think rates are going to climb at this point...also, Solar panels are more of a novelty than actually providing much power usage up here.
Down south, different story, but we just don't get the intensity of the sun to make it cost-effective. We get tons of wind, very cost effective, that's why you see Wind turbine farms coming up and no Solar Panel farms coming up...it just makes sense.
So yeah, short-sighted on KW part...at least a major corporation was TRYING to do something...thank you bureaucrats.. |
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Robrr
join:2008-04-19
Mississauga, ON Reviews:
·TekSavvy DSL
1 edit | reply to DKS
said by DKS:said by Stewy:said by DKS:Wrong. Urban areas are not places for wind turbines Yea that's what they said about clotheslines 25 years ago. Yes folks, clotheslines, that's Ontario's plan in renewable energy. Ontario hydro must also be P'd because energy consumption was down %5.6 because of the cool weather, I guess the rates are going to have to go up again. There is a huge difference between a clothesline and a wind turbine. BTW, drive up #10 north of Shelburne and take a look at the dozens of new wind turbines that have been installed. Want one of those in your back yard? I would love to except for the moratorium preventing it in Grey County
My mom owns a 100 acres of farmland up there and I would love to be able to tap into the wind that comes across there all the time but the NIMBY people wont allow it. |
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 KoolMoeAw ManPremium
join:2001-02-14
Annapolis, MD | reply to Stewy
Huge, 'typical' wind turbines...I can see the concerns. Consider 'ice throws' as well with the potential dangers. In cold weather, ice accumulates on the blades then, at some point, is hurled off by the motion and can be pretty dangerous.
However, there are plenty of alternative designs for wind turbines - look up 'Vertical Axis Turbine' online and see plenty. I guess not many have been actually well-tested yet, which is unfortunate as many seem to hold great promise.
I'd love to get a couple small ones for my house but we really don't get enough wind with all the trees around (and I like my trees  ).
KM
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Don't Lie - Be Kind - Realize your Potential |
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