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 ChrisXPUnited We Stand, Divided We FallPremium
join:2002-12-13
USA | reply to fAcEtIOUs
Re: Here's a thought... said by fAcEtIOUs:Because MOST people won't put in the amount of effort required to invent something unless they get PAID for all the work they put in. Which explains why opensource software, by and large, is crappy. I'm just waiting for 7zip to go commercial, as it's one of the most popular freeware (and bug free) offerings at SourceForge (which in itself winds up to be a way to launch a commercial program).
Don't blame them, as folks have to make a living -- and who doesn't dream of being their own boss?
--
Zionism is a crime
»www.jewsagainstzionism.com »www.christianzionism.org | |
 koitsuPremium,MVM
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA
kudos:14 | said by ChrisXP:and who doesn't dream of being their own boss? Ironically, me! I have no interest in being a manager, whether that involve managing finances, people, or a company as a whole. I consider myself a grunt -- you hire me, I apply grease and do the manual labour. I simply don't want the responsibility or moral conflicts involved in being a boss of anything.
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ChrisXPUnited We Stand, Divided We FallPremium
join:2002-12-13
USA | said by koitsu:Ironically, me! I have no interest in being a manager, whether that involve managing finances, people, or a company as a whole. Ah, but that's where the perks are -- with taking the risks.
Those with dreams, and the ambition to make them come true, will seek to be their own boss, not work under the thumb of another. For creative control, for fame, for profit whatever that motivates them to be more than just another spoke in the wheel.
--
Zionism is a crime
»www.jewsagainstzionism.com »www.christianzionism.org | |
 a333A hot cup of integrals please
join:2007-06-12
Rego Park, NY
 ·Cingular Wireless
1 edit | reply to ChrisXP
Deviating from the topic a bit:
I'm hoping that you'll put a sarcasm tag on the post on opensource...
How's opensource crappy? Sure, it's got stuff to improve, but I wouldn't be so quick to label large parts of OSS 'crappy'.
And if you don't like opensource, don't whine and b***h about it, improve it. That's the beauty of it all, if you think there's stuff to be improved, just grab the source and create your own fork of the project. | |
koitsuPremium,MVM
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA
kudos:14
1 edit | said by a333:Deviating from the topic a bit: I'm hoping that you'll put a sarcasm tag on the post on opensource... How's opensource crappy? Sure, it's got stuff to improve, but I wouldn't be so quick to label large parts of OSS 'crappy'. And if you don't like opensource, don't whine and b***h about it, improve it. That's the beauty of it all, if you think there's stuff to be improved, just grab the source and create your own fork of the project. ...which loops back around to fAcEtIOUs  's comment about how most people want to be paid for the work they do. It's a completely circular argument.
Regarding open-source, as someone who's been using it (and writing it) for a good 15 years, the biggest issue I have is with the "shut up or send patches" and "it's free software, you have no right to complain" attitude many OSS authors spout off as an immediate rebuttal. It's narcissistic, and downright rude.
Do you know how many users of open-source OSes or programs **do not** know how to code (and those who can very likely have no idea how to do so properly)? Authors *expecting* users to know how to program is a completely unrealistic viewpoint. People use microwave ovens, automobiles, DVD players, alarm clocks, and light bulbs -- but most of them do not know how they work, how to repair them, or how to engineer one. They're tools -- they were invented to (ideally) make our lives easier.
You see, I was raised to believe in taking responsibility for mistakes I make and things I create/devise -- so the (very few) publicly distributed programs I've written I take responsibility for. I do not expect users of my software to send me patches or fix my bugs (for they are my responsibility) -- but I do expect them to send me bug reports and feature requests. The longer OSS authors continue to defend the above attitudes, the less likely the "real world" will take OSS seriously.
This is the main reason why it's very difficult to convince people in managerial positions that OSS is a valid competitor to commercial solutions -- people want someone to take responsibility for problems/issues, and OSS often totes the "you have the code, you have the problem, you fix it" viewpoint.
I also don't see how people can make money off of OSS. Red Hat is a great example of such -- they've been struggling to achieve this for a very long time, and I can see why. I have a full-time day job which pays my bills and provides extra money for extracurricular things (hobbies), while doing OSS development as a hobby/on the side.
Bottom line (for me): the fact something is free, IMHO, does not diminish the amount of responsibility that is implied by releasing such into the public realm. I wrote it, I released it, I maintain it. That means they're my bugs, my problem, and my responsibility to fix. | |
ChrisXPUnited We Stand, Divided We FallPremium
join:2002-12-13
USA | reply to a333
said by a333:I'm hoping that you'll put a sarcasm tag on the post on opensource... How's opensource crappy? Sure, it's got stuff to improve, but I wouldn't be so quick to label large parts of OSS 'crappy'. I'm a SourceForge junkie. Like testing out new wares. But by and large what's offered are no better than alpha ware (it crashes; it installs with problems; it's interface is so horrid it needs to be redesigned; functions don't run as intended; memory buffer overruns; it's not compiled efficiently [often again with freeware compilers]...and worse upon worse with opensource, too many fingers in the pie, resulting in spaghetti code etc., etc....).
And like the poster below has said, if you offer some HELPFUL suggestions the dev (or it's team) treats you like you're personally insulting their life's work. Commercial software tends to weather suggestions and complaints better, as they're looking for overall stats (they can best judge problems by the volume of complaints; and get suggestions by the same means. Which all in all is a better way of knowing what features are needed, need to be improved, and most used -- that hasn't translated too well in opensource).
There's some great opensource programs out there, 7zip and Paint.Net are two of them (know 7zip the dev actively communicates with those offering suggestions on the SF board). But they are rare, very rare, despite the promise opensource is suppose to offer.
Those who make programs want to make a living. They can't spend 8hrs a day improving their work for nothing. Simple economics kicks in.
--
Zionism is a crime
»www.jewsagainstzionism.com »www.christianzionism.org | |
ChrisXPUnited We Stand, Divided We FallPremium
join:2002-12-13
USA | reply to koitsu
said by koitsu:Bottom line (for me): the fact something is free, IMHO, does not diminish the amount of responsibility that is implied by releasing such into the public realm. I wrote it, I released it, I maintain it. That means they're my bugs, my problem, and my responsibility to fix. Freeware/Open source needs you, and desperately.
More devs that will work with their testers and users = better products.
Wish someone would help out the creator of WinUHA, because that proggy, despite it's age, still can beat 7zip in compressing some files (especially media files). A little competition in the freeware/open source area with file archivers would be nice. As it's the competition that strives the devs to offer better features (like the competition between 7zip and WinRAR).
--
Zionism is a crime
»www.jewsagainstzionism.com »www.christianzionism.org | |
a333A hot cup of integrals please
join:2007-06-12
Rego Park, NY Reviews:
·Cingular Wireless
| reply to koitsu
As to the attitude of OSS authors, YMMV. I wouldn't be too quick to label the entire OSS community unfriendly and hostile. Every bunch of apples has a few rotten ones, and OSS devs are no exceptions to the rule. And you still miss my point, I never debated the fact that bug fixes/patches are developer responsibility, I merely pointed out a flaw in the "free is shit" type of logic that's run amok around here. Your point about bug fixes getting the cold shoulder again, loops back to MY point about the inherent nature of OSS: You have source code. Learn how to program. Use your spare time to make OSS more user-friendly. No one's holding a gun over your head preventing you from forking the project. You're free to do whatever you want with GPL'ed code, heck, even sell it.. | |
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