said by Dogfather :

*object*

If we want to promote 'equality' then being gay or lesbian shouldn't be about being separate or in another class.

We wouldn't have a "black" forum or "tall people" forum...I think it's bad enough that we have separate rant filled red and blue forums. Gays and lesbians are people just like everyone else and should slum it in the existing forums with us fine breeders. Being gay isn't an interest. Being a lesbian isn't a hobby. These aren't a choice. It is what it is just like being white is what it is and being tall is what it is.

As far as talking about things only gays or lesbians are interested in I'm not sure what you're talking about. Gays and lesbians have the same interests as everyone else thus should hang in the same forums as everyone else.

Nothing promotes equality and sameness and makes these non-choice differences between us more irrelevant than being together and working together all the time. When we divide ourselves up by these 'classifications', it promotes the opposite.

Forums should be about hobbies and interests, not what color we are or sexual orientation we happen to be.

said by Mats :

You will have no choice. In fact you, and only you, will have to PAY for any new forum that is ever created here..

said by acid343211 :

Will you pay for this new forum don't expect me to. :uhh: :uhh:

said by Johnny :

If they request it, sure.

As I said, there is no logical reason to object to the creation of a new forum. It affects no one negatively.

said by Johnny :

Now see, that shows that you don't get it.

It is not for every discernible group - it is for a specific minority who has a proven record of being harassed, called names, insulted, injured, and killed.

said by fatness :

Well regardless of whether such a forum gets created or not, I think the whole "might cause the site to be blocked" issue is a red herring.

said by EveryName :

If your work blocked a broadband forum that had a gay forum (out of the many hundreds) that would probably be considered discrimination, and they could face a class-action.

said by alphapointe :

No, no, no, no, no, no, and HELL NO!

Being a "right-wing Christian nut" aside, look at how many "Your Moderator At Work" messages have been seen in this thread alone. I'd feel sorry for the mods of such a forum.

As has been said before, there are other places to go for this kind of thing, and I'd rather not have DSLR be one of them.

Ditto on the work filter issues. I work nights and don't know what I'd do if DSLR started getting blocked for stuff like this.

*OBJECT*

said by alphapointe :

No, no, no, no, no, no, and HELL NO!

Being a "right-wing Christian nut" aside, look at how many "Your Moderator At Work" messages have been seen in this thread alone. I'd feel sorry for the mods of such a forum.

As has been said before, there are other places to go for this kind of thing, and I'd rather not have DSLR be one of them.

Ditto on the work filter issues. I work nights and don't know what I'd do if DSLR started getting blocked for stuff like this.

*OBJECT*

said by MPScan :


1. Blue and Red rooms... Pub and Cooler... Health & Fitness... These are but a few of the forums where people who enjoy the site can also find places to chat with other like minded people. The precedent has been set. Nobody can argue that. The issue is how far can we take it...?

Main Argument
2. The idea of this forum isn't to separate people like us, rather it's to have a place to talk about things only we're interested in talking about.

3. You wouldn't talk about setting up a DSL connection in the Digital Imaging forum, right? Likewise, I don't want to talk about the upcoming gay rights support league meeting in the Sprint Mobile Broadband forum...

4. I'm not asking if you agree with me, rather, I'm asking if you agree with the principle of creating a forum that would allow like minded people a place to gather and talk about issues that generally wouldn't fit into another forum.

said by Pentaxian :

Let me guess, and you'll all want to make this a 'members only' forum to keep out the bashing from gay-haters? Freedom of Speech is a real b*tch ain't it?

said by La Luna :

There is no legitimate reason for one group of people to have their own forum.

said by Johnny :

And get flamed/harassed out of existence, as indicated by the poster who had a problem with his wireless. That's the whole purpose of the request.
What people wrote was the usual extreme right-wing mantra about "special rights", which is bullshit.

said by RR Conductor :

They're great people boogeyman, no doubt, they are people just like you and I, I have a few gay and lesbian friends, but I don't accept what they do as normal or moral and I never will, and I don't ask them to accept the way I live or what I do. My first and favorite professor in college was gay, I say was because he died a few years ago of AIDS, he wasn't even 30 :( I don't hate anyone, and you can disagree with how they live and still love them, parents do it all the time :)

I'm still against a new forum though, I don't think it's a good idea, just look at the Blue and Red Room's. However, I think it should be left up to the majority and if they want it, so be it.

said by Mats :

Adults shouldnt sit around with teenagers and give them alcohol.

Adults shouldnt tell teenagers that they are attractive.

Your scenario that you told is wrong and creepy. It has nothing to do with gays.

said by La Luna :

[The topic/s can be handled in any number of forums already here, just like any other topic.

Try reading what people actually wrote. Maybe it's *you* who doesn't understand.

said by Johnny :

It may have been "stated many times" by people who don't understand. It's also been stated many times that the requested forum isn't about health and isn't about fitness and that being gay is not a lifestyle. A lifestyle is something that one chooses.

Try reading the thread.

said by Pentangle :

*object*

As has already been stated many times, topics and issues related to the Gay/Lesbian lifestyle can be handled in the Health, Fitness and Life forum.

said by Weirdal :

You act like it's being given a lot of thought. Everyone knows this forum will never be created.

said by Spensergig :

I don't have a dog in this race.
(Actually, I just don't give a rat's *$$ which way it goes.)

There've been almost 500 responses now.
Maybe it's time to let this cool, and allow the moderators and/or administrators to discuss it among themselves.

said by Spensergig :

Maybe it's time to let this cool, and allow the moderators and/or administrators to discuss it among themselves.

said by hopeflicker :

That's not the appropriate place for gay discussion.

said by Fox McCloud :

such topics would fit in the Red/Blue room anyway.

said by Johnny :

Well of course it's open to everyone. How are they going to tell who's gay?

said by Johnny :

Just by the incidence of gay individuals in the population, there should be at least 3% of the registered members who are gay.

said by RR Conductor :

Man, is this thread still going? I though the feeling was overwhelming on a "No" on this one. It seems to have turned more into "if you disagree with gays, you're terrible" rant.

said by rockotman :

It's what us interweb dweebs do best... ;)

said by rockotman :

I objected earlier on the grounds that I don't want DSLR blocked on our work servers. If ya'll are sure that wouldn't/couldn't happen, then I will withdraw my objection.

said by Unit649 :

Is this a technology forum related to internet and broadband, or everything under the sun?

Just wondering, really.

said by Johnny :

If it "causes problems", that's not the fault of the gay people. Deal with those who are causing the problems, namely those who can't seem to resist posting nasty, mean, disruptive, and ignorant statements.

said by 74173943 :

A question just occurred to me about the proposed forum. Would gay people be the only people allowed to post in the forum, or would it be open to anybody wishing to discuss gay issues?

said by la luna :

Other than a couple of unfortunate users, the rest object because they feel the forum would cause problems

said by hopeflicker :

I would like to see all of those that OBJECT stand up and say it's because of their belief.

said by james :

Guess what, I support their rights too. I support their right to be stuck posting with the rest of us in General Talk when they have something to say that isn't related to Internet access.

said by dave :

I think we need a forum where people without a sense of humour can post messages to each other without risk of getting confused.

said by netokc :

Please remember this is a technical site and this is considered is a non-technical topic.

said by james :

The thing that pisses me off most is that your joke proves that you're assuming all those who are against your glbt forum are straight guys who are afraid that everyone will think they're gay if they agree with you. What the hell is wrong with some gay people? I'm not interested in who you have sex with, it's not an issue. (...)

said by hpguru :

But defending someone or some group doesn't make me one of them does it?

said by hpguru :

Sorry but I'm not gay. I didn't think one need be gay to be supportive of their rights.

said by james :

What the hell is wrong with some gay people? I'm not interested in who you have sex with, it's not an issue.

said by hpguru :

Great idea! But before that I would want to see a "Manly Men Forum" where the dudes can get together and discuss all the reasons why they're not queer. :)

said by removed :

... but it seems like you guys are just beating a dead horse now.

said by robbob340 :

I would not mind a gay forum, because I would not venture there to either troll, or make stupid statements, but I agree there are far more appropriate places to do it.

said by robbob340 :

What technical issues are you talking about Johnny that would not the normal person might come across?

said by robbob340 :

What technical issues are you talking about Johnny that would not the normal person might come across?

said by Johnny
** object **
I doubt you'll see this, but the requester wanted to be able to discuss aspects of technical issues in the context of a community in which discussions wouldn't be interrupted by so much flaming and insults.

said by boricua65_nli :

Phew, it took me over four hours reading all 22 pages, but I got through it in between doing my job. I am neutral.

said by netokc :

There are other media and web sites available for this topic. Please remember this is a technical site and this is considered is a non-technical topic.

** object **

said by Weirdal :

*sign* for this. Keep the forum in the closet and adopt a "don't ask don't tell" policy.

said by fatness :

Are there libraries and schools that block sites which feature the words "gay" and/or "lesbian"?

said by Boogeyman :

And to make the rule that you are not allowed to discuss it outside of said forum.

said by Boogeyman :

. And to make the rule that you are not allowed to discuss it outside of said forum.

said by Rombus :

Its hard to tell for sure, since there are so many different tools. And its not the HR/Corporations you really have to worry about, its the schools/libraries, since they usually use off the shelf tools and don't usually look at whats being blocked.

said by hopeflicker :

come on people. The term gay and lesbian is used everywhere on the net. Hell, people have even used it in this thread numerous times. If people are so worried about us using that term, well, the mods better go back and edit out all of those "BAD" words in this thread

OMG!! 10+ pages of gayness: »/nsearch?q=gay :huh:

It's terrible argument for not wanting a gay forum.

give me a break.

said by Mats :

He was 16. That is a kid.

said by Mats :

What kind of "couple" in their late 30's and 40's sits around and has 14 and 16 year olds over and gives them alcohol and starts saying they are attractive.. This has nothing to do with gays, this is just wrong and very creepy.

Your lil story has done nothing but probably make it worse for peoples feelings towards "gays".

said by Boogeyman :

Sorry, nothing to do with the topic really, I just wanted to share and show people that maybe all it takes is a little familiarity with the unknown and you may start to see things differently.

said by Rombus :

Its hard to tell for sure, since there are so many different tools. And its not the HR/Corporations you really have to worry about, its the schools/libraries, since they usually use off the shelf tools and don't usually look at whats being blocked.

And when i said "Overzealous administrator" I meant the administrators of the filter list company. I think that you correct that most Corporate net admins would be smart enough to not block those words.

said by CtrlAltDel :

How about Health, Fitness and Alternative Life Decisions?

said by james :

...and now half the time when I try to find a forum I haven't been to lately, it takes me 20 mins to sift through the forums that are unrelated to broadband

said by james :

I object because if people keep making these seperate forums, they will intermingle less.

said by cacroll :

Have you ever setup or administered an online community? I have.

said by cacroll :

All of those forums - the NUMEROUS forums under "City Chat" and "Talk" and "Current Affairs/Politics", you know, things like "The Watercooler", "The Pub", "Red Room", "Blue Room" - are all bullshit forums, which exist purely to keep the bullshit out of the serious forums.

Now it's my impression that the proposed GLBT (not "gay") forum for DSLR Forums would not be for bullshit, it's intended for real serious issues. And that's why a GLBT Forum would be OT for DSLR Forums.

Real serious non tech discussions belong elsewhere, not in DSLR Forums.

said by fatness :

Hwo many, or what %, of overzealous administrators block the words 'gay' or 'lesbian'? Do you have any idea? I don't, but I'm guessing that, with HR policies being what they are, the number is small.

said by tmpchaos :

Lumberjacks?

said by hpguru :

Great idea! But before that I would want to see a "Manly Men Forum" where the dudes can get together and discuss all the reasons why they're not queer. :)

said by Steve :

Also: I'd like a new Abortion Talk forum

said by PCInTech :

*SIGN*!

But, with the very conditions that are stated above. It should be a private forum w/ conditions that what is said there, stays there, and moderated as a SERIOUS forum. I'm all for it. I also think it shouldn't be limited to G/L, but should be GLBT.

said by Corona :

They could name it "shmushmortion talk" for everyone who is sensitive about that word.

said by Steve :

*Sign*

Also: I'd like a new Abortion Talk forum

said by Steve :

*Sign*

Also: I'd like a new Abortion Talk forum

said by Annmarie :

Gay & Lesbian talk is no more a Lifestyle than hetero talk. Lifestyle implies choice. I never chose my sexual orientation.

A Lifestyle might be something like being a vegan or a nudist - a choice was made.

said by KrK :

it will also draw flamewars, trolling, "heated discussion", insults, and claims of discrimination/demands for site moderator action, and hell, potentially even lawsuits... all the while putting BBR on the radar of "filtering" software and so on.

said by Annmarie :

[Since there is a current effort to encourage the threads within th HF&L Forum - a forum I still think is appropriate for those threads - can you or anyone help me come up with another word? We used "lifestyle" because we had nothing else. My co host and I are at a loss right now for something better suited for all relationship or issues.

Health, Fitness & Life's Challenges ??? hell - that can include router issues.

said by fatness :

We have forums that are specific in subject matter, but are open to all; I gave examples. That is what you were objecting to.

We also have what some are referring to as forums for "protected groups", where the slant of the forum is announced in advance. I don't think you're objecting to that, since you post in one of them.

The request being made is for a forum. It would either be a forum open to all and limited in subject scope (which most of our forums are), or it would be "protected" with the forum slant announced in advance (which a couple of our forums are). So the format of any new forum, whichever example is followed, does not seem to be out of line with anything currently done here.

said by hpguru :

I have already demolished this feeble segregation argument.

said by hpguru :

Oh so you really meant...

Sorry (not really) but this is just too funny since what we really have here is a bunch of homophobes who want to avoid dealing with gays. :D

said by Coolhandler5 :

This whole idea is rediculous. Its pure BS and just another way for the homosexual to push their ways on others.

said by james :

I clarified what I meant. I agree that my wording didn't convey my intended message.

said by james :

Sorry chief, you aren't going to get equality if you keep trying to ... avoid dealing with straight people.

said by dean corso :

Object.

There are too many non-computer related forums here as it is. Takes me forever to find the one I want in the forum list!

said by hopeflicker :

Think of this forum as one of the many that you are not required to go to.

Many people think that the topics will mostly be sexual. I highly doubt that. I can imagine some of the topics: politics regarding gay issues, entertainment, clubs, Sports, Music, etc. Of course many of these topics will revolve around the lifestyle.

said by hpguru :

Just an observation. There are some here which are calling the idea of a Gay / Lesbian Talk forum "segregation". I don't see that. Segregation as a form of discrimination is involuntary. This is not the case here since it will be the choice of each individual whether to participate or not and gays would still have the same freedom to post where ever they like. They would still enjoy the same freedom to be openly gay or to keep it to themselves.

To be honest, I see the "segregation" calls as a form of tacit discrimination which belies an undemocratic desire to keep the LGBT community out of the mainstream consciousness by hiding them in plain sight. The LGBT community is one of the only subgroups within our society for which bigots are willing to go to the ballot boxes and vote to strip them of rights the rest of us enjoy and what's more is these bigots have the ugly temerity to call this "democracy in action". This ought not to be so, not in the whole of American society or in the subculture represented by DSLR.

America is about Liberty for all, not liberty for most. I don't hear gays calling for separating others from common civil rights and privileges. If they were then we might have justification for taking a stand against them. We do not.

said by james :

Sorry chief, you aren't going to get equality if you keep trying to set yourself apart from everyone else.

said by hpguru :

Isn't that a job for Mr. Self Control? Just call on Mr. Self Control and then the Gay / Lesbian Talk forum will be a nice place for civilized discussion, right? :)

said by Kiwi :

My last word on this, it has nothing to do with 'gospel'. It has everything to do with pointing out the obvious...Annmarie already runs a forum that should satisfy the topic matter.

said by cacroll :

This is a forum where forum members are allowed to express their opinions. We are expressing our opinions, as you are.

said by MPScan :

Current State
Blue and Red rooms... Pub and Cooler... Health & Fitness... These are but a few of the forums where people who enjoy the site can also find places to chat with other like minded people.

said by Coolhandler5 :

This whole idea is rediculous. Its pure BS and just another way for the homosexual to push their ways on others.

said by Coolhandler5 :

This is why this shouldn't have been allowed in the first place.

said by Kiwi :

I can't help it, I just have to do this. The thread has gone ballistic.

»Re: [new forum] Gay / Lesbian Talk

said by Coolhandler5 :

This whole idea is rediculous. Its pure BS and just another way for the homosexual to push their ways on others. Just look at the post, this is getting no where and its obivious why. This should never been allowed to start in the first place. This is DSLreports, you know, talking about connections and bashing ISP, not lets talk about homosexuals!

said by actor90 :

...Now I ****OBJECT STRONGLY*** and may go so far as to delete my account if this forum is created.

said by Annmarie :

Since there is a current effort to encourage the threads within th HF&L Forum - a forum I still think is appropriate for those threads - can you or anyone help me come up with another word? We used "lifestyle" because we had nothing else. My co host and I are at a loss right now for something better suited for all relationship or issues.

Health, Fitness & Life's Challenges ??? hell - that can include router issues.

said by fuziwuzi :

I have a LIFE, not a lifestyle.

said by fuziwuzi :

So now you admit openly you don't even KNOW DSLR, yet feel qualified to make judgments on what should and should not be here? I direct you to the NUMEROUS forums under "City Chat" and "Talk" and "Current Affairs/Politics", you know, things like "The Watercooler", "The Pub", "Red Room", "Blue Room". Those are social forums that have nothing to do with technical issues.

So again, where is your demand that these non-technical forums be disbanded?

said by TheToro :

This is getting ridiculous, we haven't gotten conclussion after over 350 posts, there're 3 kind of people here, those that do support it, those that wouldn't mind and those that are against it.
My questions to those that are against it is, Why do you guys spend so much energy and time for something that you don't want? it won't make you guys gay, I don't understand what you are scared of, none is gonna force your to participate on it.
I'm sure there are a lot of tv channels that you don't even watch, or you find them lame, would you call your cable company to bitch about it?.
I think the administrator of DSLR will have to decide what to do with it, cause this is becoming a big deal.

said by actor90 :

The very response to my objection, proves that there should not be a forum dedicated to people of one sexual preference over another. You know that things are going from bad to worse when thugs like you jump on anyone who objects to the homosexual utopia forum you want. I don't think we need the gay forum or you jumping on anyone who disagrees with you. Oh, and btw, by it's very nature, being a forum for a sexual preference, makes it a forum about sexuality. I did not say it would be a forum about having sex.

Here is a definition for you from Wiktionary:

sexuality (countable and uncountable; plural sexualities):

1. that which is characterized or distinguished by sex
2. sexual activity
3. the concern with, or interest in sexual activity
4. sexual potency
5. sexual orientation
6. sexual identity, gender
7. sexual receptivity

Since, you and others want to make this a bullying effort to shove an unwanted forum down our throats I will change my vote. I objected before, but did not care if you got it. Now I ****OBJECT STRONGLY*** and may go so far as to delete my account if this forum is created.

said by Johnny :

I ask again, what effort are you asking them to make?

said by cacroll :

The other social forums do not exist, and if they did exist, the members would not acknowlege them.

said by hopeflicker :

That wont happen. There's too much ignorance and prejudice in the cournty for that.

said by fuziwuzi :

Nobody said it was a discussion of sexuality. That is your biased and uninformed assumption.

said by fuziwuzi :

I disagree since the issue to which I'm responding is repeated ad nauseum.

said by fatness :

There's no need to post that more times to make the point you've already made. Thanks.

said by fuziwuzi :

I expect to read your demand that the other social forums on DSLR be disbanded forthcoming.

Let's say you mention that you're attempting to get your wife's or girlfriend's computer repaired, is that a disclosure of your sexuality?

said by Johnny :

What "effort" are you asking that they make? Let me guess - it's to not mention that they are gay, right?

said by koitsu :

I'm also left wondering how someone asking for help with their wireless connection resulted in disclosure of individual being non-straight...

said by Johnny :

Go for it. There is no downside to a new forum, as long as there are enough participants.

said by fuziwuzi :

[I expect to read your demand that all of the other social forums on DSLR be disbanded as soon as possible.

said by CtrlAltDel :

The HFL room, with the L standing for Lifestyle covers your request.

said by cacroll :

Object to special equality.

said by Rombus :

Exactly, "United we stand, Divided we fall"

All it seems is you want to Divide yourself from the rest of the DSLR Usersbase.

See how much trouble and turmoil this simple request has drug up? Why cant we all get back to the bashing of the cable companies?

Hetero people will likely accept GLBT people a bit more readily if GLBT people will make an effort to be accepted.

said by actor90 :

*OBJECT*

There are better suited places to discuss sexuality. I would say the same thing if someone wanted to start a religious forum here. Lets not go down this slippery slope.

said by Rombus :

And yet its not hypocrisy to work towards equality but still want a separate forum to discuss your issues?

Hi pot! Your Black! Signed Kettle!

said by cacroll :

Hetero people will likely accept GLBT people a bit more readily if GLBT people will make an effort to be accepted.

said by fatness :

We already have forums for what people are calling "protected classes": the Red Room and the Blue Room. They "protect" conservatives and liberals, respectively. Why aren't some of the objections about "creating a protected class" aimed at them?

said by GercekSeytan :

Can you be more explicit, perhaps with an example using a hypothetical request for a 'Jewish' forum that uses the same rational as the request in this one, as to how that applies in this case? After reading that and browsing this thread yet again, I still don't get it.

said by fatness :

Provider forums are limited in subject matter but not limited to posters who use that provider. Regional chat forums do not exclude those from other regions. If you return to the original request, you'll see that it is for a similar reason --- general subject matter area covered by a forum:

quote:

---

Main Argument
The idea of this forum isn't to separate people like us, rather it's to have a place to talk about things only we're interested in talking about.

---

said by brandon :

I never believed that this forum allowed racism. However, if you create a forum whose entire premise is race, and say all are allowed to speak in it, then you have in essence given the green light to racism, until you realize your mistake and then change the rules,

I've been in situations with people both gay and straight where I was not comfortable remaining in close quarters. Are you saying that it's inconceivable that an installer, who would be a stranger, could be legitimately uncomfortable?

said by Johnny :

Plenty of straight people say "my wife's PC won't connect... etc. etc." and I've never seen any gay people complain about anybody "talking about their sexual preference in public" or "shoving your lifestyle down my throat" or anything like that. You're implying that he has to keep quiet where others do not.

said by Weirdal :

haha

said by no waybbbbbbbbbb :

Allow this kind of content and my bookmark for this page will be deleted.

said by jwersan :

While anyone is entitled to request any forum they want, any post on the the topic you mention, is quite unlikely to get "crapped" on like any topic the even HINTS at being "gay", and therein lies the need for such a "safe-haven" type of forum.

You can see it in this topic, why this type of a forum may need to be created.

Many subjects that don't necessarily "fit" into some of the forums they are posted to, get moved or locked. Yet every one of the topics I have seen that deal with anything even remotely "gay", get trashed quickly, locked or deleted.

said by koitsu :

I haven't read all 13+ pages of this thread, so I'm not sure what incident you refer to. If that situation happened, it sounds absurd, and I'd probably end up spanking both the trolls and the forum mods (although I suppose I can see why they locked it -- to keep the trolls from continually to harass). Of course, I'm also left wondering how someone asking for help with their wireless connection resulted in disclosure of individual being non-straight...

But I ask you to take into consideration what will happen if there is a GBLT forum -- you do realise the number of jerks who will visit that forum solely to troll or cause trouble, do you not? Do you think having a separate forum would somehow *decrease* the regularity of said trolling? I would think it would increase, based on how close-minded members of society behave.

I understand your point, but try to understand mine. A separate forum wouldn't instigate equality, it would just provide a central place for harassers to focus on.

(although I suppose I can see why they locked it -- to keep the trolls from continually to harass).

Of course, I'm also left wondering how someone asking for help with their wireless connection resulted in disclosure of individual being non-straight...

said by Johnny :

So do you understand the guy's problem with asking about his wireless and the trolls succeeding in getting his thread locked without an answer? Do you think that's equal treatment for him?

said by fatness :

Where did you get the idea that racist posts are allowed on the site?
There are already places on the site you can see posts like that.

said by La Luna :

Could have sworn you were talking about women, we experience much of what you just said....where's our "Women Only" forum?

where's our "Women Only" forum?

(Off-topic: this is exactly why I'm a strong advocate of equal rights for all genders, ethnicities, sexualities/lifestyles, and am greatly opposed to "special rights" or "one-off rights". We don't need more segregation created in today's society. I'm equally against absurd things like "Proud To Be Straight!" rallies... )

said by La Luna :

Could have sworn you were talking about women, we experience much of what you just said....where's our "Women Only" forum?

said by Johnny :

....What issues do heteros need to discuss? What discrimination, hatred, injury and murder do heteros experience on a daily basis? What laws do heteros need passed, companies they need to boycott, issues they need to publicize that are related to them being subject to constant discrimination and violence? NONE....

said by MPScan :

If nothing else, thanks for the good conversation. I've been enjoying watching everyone go back and forth...



... and I knew it wouldn't fly.

said by Johnny :

Brilliant example. I hope that helps some to understand what the hell we are talking about.

I wouldn't have closed the thread though. I would have just banned all the assholes.

said by Johnny :

Posts about whether gayness is good or bad would be off-topic for the proposed forum. From what funchords listed, the topics have nothing to do with approval or disapproval:

Possible Forum Topics:
- Can my employer block www.advocate.com?
- Installer left, didn't feel "comfortable" with us.
- Spam filter rejected my partner's email, why?
- Verizon and Charter GLBT groups at Pride Weekend
- Report: Gay people more visually attracted to online ads
- Top GLBT-Friendly Technology Companies!
- Where are the online greeting cards for us?
- Mobile company wont put my partner on family share plan.

said by brandon :

Likely outcome: Post is deleted and poster banned. Rules are created that this is a PRO-black forum, not an anti-black forum (or even a moderator-neutral forum). Racists aren't allowed to post. Free speech is limited, but this is the eventual course on private forums.

Where does user FamilyValues91234, with his true belief in the fact that gay marriage will hurt society, go to post?

said by AB :

Hence the site's name: socialchatreports.com

said by Johnny :

The majority already has all the other forums. Again, it's the same as saying there should be a White Entertainment Television.

said by Johnny :

Because they are a minority that faces hate, injury, and murder that hetero people do not face. All minorities throughout history have needed to band together and support each other.

said by Johnny :

I don't think anyone said it wouldn't be open to all.

said by Johnny :

Come on, think about what you just said. Heteros are 97% of the population. What issues do heteros need to discuss? What discrimination, hatred, injury and murder do heteros experience on a daily basis? What laws do heteros need passed, companies they need to boycott, issues they need to publicize that are related to them being subject to constant discrimination and violence? NONE.

said by hopeflicker :

. . this site is no longer a tech site.

Why cant people understand this? Yes, there a many tech boards here, but there are also tons of social boards.

said by GercekSeytan :

I really don't grasp that. To me, it would be no different than creating 'black' forum which is open to all even though it's a 'black' forum.

said by Johnny :

No, it's not. It's a fundamental concept of how any minority which faces discrimination works. United stand, divided fall and all that.

said by Johnny :

The majority already has all the other forums. Again, it's the same as saying there should be a White Entertainment Television.
Because they are a minority that faces hate, injury, and murder that hetero people do not face. All minorities throughout history have needed to band together and support each other.
I don't think anyone said it wouldn't be open to all.
Come on, think about what you just said. Heteros are 97% of the population. What issues do heteros need to discuss? What discrimination, hatred, injury and murder do heteros experience on a daily basis? What laws do heteros need passed, companies they need to boycott, issues they need to publicize that are related to them being subject to constant discrimination and violence? NONE.
Anything that's not illegal?
Think about what you just said. Do you seriously think there is any need whatsoever to "promote" a support forum for people who need no support? People who are already supported by 97% of the population? What would be discussed in a "forum for heteros?" The hot girl I dated last night? Already discussed in every social forum. The landlord who wouldn't rent to me because I was a hetero? Get real. The punks who mugged me at the community college calling me a "fucking straight?" Doesn't happen. The indignant right-wingers who answer my posts calling my sex with women an "abomination?" Never happens.

said by Rombus :

And yet its not hypocrisy to work towards equality but still want a separate forum to discuss your issues?

said by Rombus :

And yet its not hypocrisy to work towards equality but still want a separate forum to discuss your issues?

Hi pot! Your Black! Signed Kettle!

said by KrK :

And of course, the people who want such a forum are going to ignore the objects, and say "Those people are just haters."

So that door swings both ways....

said by fuziwuzi :

Interesting cop-out, but I'm afraid that doesn't mitigate the underlying hypocrisy.

said by fuziwuzi :

Not really when you reduce the double-talk and irrelevant conjecture and outright untruths. A valid case FOR the group has been made. The objections here are a good indication of just why such a group is needed, because any revelation, no matter how vague, that a poster is GLBT in any other forum illicits a flood of vulgar and personal attacks that have no bearing on the actual issue at hand. For instance, in one forum when I was discussing a problem my partner was having with his wireless connection, instead of getting any assistance on the issue, I got hate mail and religious-freaks bombarding the thread with off-topic insults and bible verses. The thread had to be closed, with no help at all about the issue I wanted. Would you put up with that if all you said was something like "My wife can't get her laptop to connect wirelessly, what should I do?" My mention of my partner in that context is no more about "sex" than would be your mention of your wife or girlfriend.

said by fuziwuzi :

For instance, in one forum when I was discussing a problem my partner was having with his wireless connection, instead of getting any assistance on the issue, I got hate mail and religious-freaks bombarding the thread with off-topic insults and bible verses. The thread had to be closed, with no help at all about the issue I wanted. Would you put up with that if all you said was something like "My wife can't get her laptop to connect wirelessly, what should I do?" My mention of my partner in that context is no more about "sex" than would be your mention of your wife or girlfriend.

said by fuziwuzi :

For instance, in one forum when I was discussing a problem my partner was having with his wireless connection, instead of getting any assistance on the issue, I got hate mail and religious-freaks bombarding the thread with off-topic insults and bible verses. The thread had to be closed, with no help at all about the issue I wanted.

said by GercekSeytan :

There are legitimate reasons for opposition to such a forum which have nothing to do with being anti-gay, -anti-bi or any other anti-.

If one accepts a forum for those of one specific sexual orientation, then any argument by management against any request for a forum for those with some other specific sexual orientation should approved. Disapproval would in and of itself be the height of hypocrisy.

Why must there be forum for one sexual preference?

What is wrong with a forum open to all regardless of sexual preferences (with humans only hopefully and pardon my prejudice) if there must be such a forum?

Why is GLB special? If it is not special, then why not a 'sister' forum for those that are not GLB?

If one must have forums based on sexual preferences, why should there be limits? If there must be limits, what should those limits be?

Can assume that all those that think that a GLB forum is a good idea are equally adamant in the interests of showing that they themselves are without prejudice and would zealously promote a forum for heteros?

said by fuziwuzi :

Thank you!!!
:D

said by CtrlAltDel :

I will donate
2 tool points so that they can start their own site. See »[HOT Deal] GoDaddy Domains for $1.19 (Now DEAD).

said by Boogeyman :

Anyway, I just wanted to point out that many of the objections seem to be grasping at reasons to object. Which leads me to beleive that the reason they are objecting is because they dont like the GBTL peoples sexual preferences. Which is cool, go on hating gays, thats your right. Just dont say they cant have something JUST BECAUSE they are gay.

*sign*

said by signmeuptoo :

I just am not comfortable with this sight becoming a sexual orientation-sex chat home. I don't want to have this site on the pron radar.

Sure, I know that gay-lesbian chat isn't only about sexual things, but let's face it, it is centered around sex, and I personally want to have a site that is family friendly...

said by MPScan :

It's people like me who made this site what it is today. After 8+ years and 5,000+ posts on this awesome site, it's pretty much my go to place every morning. Hell, I even bring up this page while my coffee is brewing at 5:15 AM...

said by MPScan :

This site has expanded way beyond DSL and Cable and FiOS to something much more.

said by Rombus :

I was NOT a member when those forums came to be, hence i had no voice in the creation when/if they were voted on. Since they are successful, I have no right to ask for there removal. I do however have the chance to complain and object to forums like this now.

said by djrobx :

There's an automotive forum for that. ;)

said by PCInTech :

*SIGN*!

But, with the very conditions that are stated above. It should be a private forum w/ conditions that what is said there, stays there, and moderated as a SERIOUS forum. I'm all for it. I also think it shouldn't be limited to G/L, but should be GLBT.

said by koam :

what about Trannies?

said by koam :

what about Trannies?

said by Boogeyman :

Anyway, I just wanted to point out that many of the objections seem to be grasping at reasons to object. Which leads me to beleive that the reason they are objecting is because they dont like the GBTL peoples sexual preferences. Which is cool, go on hating gays, thats your right. Just dont say they cant have something JUST BECAUSE they are gay.

said by cacroll :

I'm sure that there are other forums for black / white / green / blue / paisly / leapord print / middle eastern / hindu / asian / jewish / christian / muslim / mormon / FSM / scientology, but they aren't in DSLR Forums. They don't belong here, neither does GLBT Issues.

GLBT people want to have equal rights, but they feel that they have to hide to discuss anything. That's called a ghetto.

Object to a GLBT ghetto, as well as to a series of black / white / green / blue / paisly / leapord print / middle eastern / hindu / asian / jewish / christian / muslim / mormon / FSM / scientology ghettos.

I also object to people who imply that anybody who opposes a GLBT Forum is against GLBT Rights. GLBT people have equal rights, as people. They don't have, nor do they need, special rights because they feel threatened by being part of the world.

Everybody is part of the world, and everybody feels threatened by it from time to time. Everybody doesn't get their own forum though.

said by jwersan :

Lifestyle is a "catch all" kind of word, but it can also be misinterpreted by "narrow minded" folks.
We all know we have enough of them on this site. :uhh:

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy seeing someones elses' point of view, even if I think they are NUTS! :D

said by GercekSeytan :

. . A forum for those who prefer their sexual partners fit the hirsute category? No.

said by Annmarie :

Ahem .. the "nuts"? I resemble that remark which in a way I am glad we have the HF&L forum. It is not a public general forum and it can be watched/moderated very closely. There have been some sensitive topics in there that were handled very well with maybe one or two problems within them - seriously.

said by Boogeyman :

To all of you people who say that there doesnt need to be a seperate forum because gblt have the same interests as straight people, well yeah. But they also have issues that us straight people dont, that they might want to discuss with thier peers. Could you imagine if a guy posted one of those "How to ask someone out" threads in the pub and he mentions the person he wants to ask out is another male, how long do you think that thread would stay open?

For everyone that doesnt agree because we dont have black/white/green/blue/paisly/leapord print/middle eastern/hindu/asian/jewish/christian/muslim/mormon/FSM/scientology threads, well, most of them DO have other forums to discuss their problems in without getting flamed.

said by Annmarie :

While understanding lifestyle is NOT the correct term, you have to say, out of all the forums that DSLR currently has - wouldn't relationship threads and topics best be discussed in the HF&L Forum?

There have been a few relationship threads in there.

edited for punctuation

said by Annmarie :

Then that thread was posted in the wrong forum. HF&L is appropriate for such threads here at DSLR.

said by Johnny :

[If they posted those questions in a "regular" forum, the nuts would trash the thread beyond help and nobody would get any answers to their questions.

said by hopeflicker :

some people equate homosexuals to porn

said by Johnny :

Sure - but the request, as I understand it, isn't about relationships but rather a support forum for a minority and their issues. See the sample questions listed above.

If they posted those questions in a "regular" forum, the nuts would trash the thread beyond help and nobody would get any answers to their questions.

said by fatness :

Please stop. Thanks.

said by fatness :

So do I.

said by signmeuptoo :

If such a forum is approved, I demand, respectfully,

said by Annmarie :

While understanding lifestyle is NOT the correct term, you have to say, out of all the forums that DSLR currently has - wouldn't relationship threads and topics best be discussed in the HF&L Forum?

There have been a few relationship threads in there.

edited for punctuation

said by signmeuptoo :

It's all about the sex, so it needs to stay out of here.

said by signmeuptoo :

It's all about the sex, so it needs to stay out of here.

said by Annmarie :

While understanding lifestyle is NOT the correct term you have to say out of all the forums that DSLR currently has = wouldn't relationship threads and topics best be discussed in the HF&L Forum?

There have been a few relationship threads in there.

said by TheToro :

DSLREPORTS has to accept that there are all people here.

said by SK :

What do you mean? You do know that gay people do other thngs besides having gay sex, right? I'm sure posting porn in the new forum will not be allowed.

Also, we already have a porn-sharing forum here, and this site is still not blocked by work filters. If it does, then your work is verifiably homophobic.

said by drew :

I think people here are accepting the gays, however some of us don't believe there should be a separate forum for them.

Because the idea is ridiculous.

said by brandon :

The entire premise is sexual. Everything in the forum will be based on sexuality.

Edit: Decided I better further explain myself, based on your examples.

"What issues do gays face?" (They face issues based on their sexual preference")
"What sorts of entertainment do gays like to listen to?" (Either A) they like the same entertainment as straight people, or B) they like entertainment that caters to their sexual preference).
"What's a good gay club to go to?" (A discussion of places to meet other homosexuals, usually followed by sex!)
"What sports do gay people like?" (Either A) the same as everyone else, or B) Bucknaked bull riding)
"What music do gays like?" (LOLTECHNO)

Regardless of how you spin it, every topic will be based in sexuality. A forum dedicated to heterosexuality might have the same sorts of topics, with the same sexuality tied to each topic.

A forum dedicated to the biographies of porn stars would also be a forum I didn't have to go to, and while many of the topics may be completely unrelated to sexuality, the entire premise of the forum would, in fact, be based in sexuality, hetero or otherwise.

Which is not where DSLR should go.

said by SK :

...we already have a porn-sharing forum here...

said by SK :

What do you mean? You do know that gay people do other thngs besides having gay sex, right? I'm sure posting porn in the new forum will not be allowed.

said by averagedude :

For the same reason as stated above, I must "object".

I demand a 'Straight Lifestyle' forum if this goes into place.

Ugh...

I have a hard time typing that as it sounds so ridiculous.

Just like the request for a gay/lesbian/transsexual/bisexual forum.

said by hopeflicker :

hummm... personal reason... hummm... I wonder what that could mean.

said by averagedude :

For the same reason as stated above, I must "object".

said by averagedude :

For the same reason as stated above, I must "object".

said by rockotman :

Object.

For purely selfish, personal reasons.

If this site gets flagged as being any way related to any type of sex or porn or whatever, the filters at work will block it, and I will no longer be able to browse the forums during nmy lunch break.

I am selfish like that. ;)

said by lev :

*object*

I can empathize with wanting a place to put a forum up for those things with which you most identify, but there's really no difference between a gay broadband user and a straight one.

The only differences I perceive are when the discussions turn to with whom and how gays have sex and to matters of tolerance, but both have no place on a tech board.

*object*

Let's keep our sexual lives to ourselves. There are plenty of other places to go to discuss things like this.

said by Rombus :

So why have a separate forum for them?

said by ptrowski :

Do I think there could be a forum here for the LGB? I sure do. But I shudder to think about the amount of trolling that would occur. I would think it would turn into a moderator nightmare.

I wonder if it could be implemented like the Lifestyle forum, where you have to gain access. Maybe.

said by Johnny :

And on the other issue, there's no need for a "straight lifestyle" forum for the same reason there is no White Entertainment Television or National Association for the Advancement of White People or United White College Fund.

said by Rombus :

Then im confused, Why should there be a GLBT forum on a tech site then when there is no straight equivalent?

said by Johnny :

That's exactly what I am saying.

said by Rombus :

I thought one of the points the GLBT community makes is that they also did not choose to be that way?

said by Johnny :

That's exactly the point. The reason it sounds ridiculous is that it implies a choice, and every straight person knows that they made no such choice.

I have a hard time typing that as it sounds so ridiculous.

said by drew :

The official name of the forum is Health, Fitness, and Lifestyle

which indicates it's not just there for health and fitness.

said by Johnny :

As I said, why would it matter to you? Don't put it on your favorites list, and don't follow any posts in it.

Votes on new forums only matter if they are from those who want to have it. DSLR has a million members; if 2000 want a particular forum, does it matter if the other 998,000 "object" to it? No. It's ridiculous.

said by nokiatech :

Oh good another forum that has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH BROADBAND OR COMPUTING.

Sounds like a great idea. We need more of those.

Not.

Object.

said by Rombus :

David and rockotman have a GREAT point here by the way:
Its going to be near impossible to keep a forum like that from causing a filter to block DSLR

said by GeekNJ :

What about a forum for gay black jews that were previously in the military and married white muslims and adopted asian children?

said by hopeflicker :

But hey! it's a tech site, whey even have social forums? Let's remove what we have now and be a true tech site.

said by Rombus :

When was the last "Social" forum approved by this forum?

said by Pacrat :

You are correct in you assessment that there is already a "Health & Fitness" forum... but you conveniently avoided or inadvertently missed the entire title of that forum:»/forum/healthfit

Lifestyle is already included in that forum... and there have been postings regarding same sex lifestyle choices and activities.

Your request for a new forum really isn't valid... or necessary. Please avail yourself of those features that already exist. :)

And, for the record... *object*

said by macaholic :

And while its ok to have other non-technical forums suddenly its not ok for for LBGT one??

said by GeekNJ :

What about a forum for gay black jews that were previously in the military and married white muslims and adopted asian children?

said by GeekNJ :

What about a forum for gay black jews that were previously in the military and married white muslims and adopted asian children?

said by drew :

I could pontificate on the problems with such a forum, but I don't really feel like it this evening.

I simply object to this forum unless they make me a forum for married, heterosexual, Christian white men.

Sounds ridiculous, doesn't it?

said by drew :

I could pontificate on the problems with such a forum, but I don't really feel like it this evening.

I simply object to this forum unless they make me a forum for married, heterosexual, Christian white men.

Sounds ridiculous, doesn't it?

said by GercekSeytan :

Military forums? No.

The hypothetical forum suggested? No.

A forum for asians? No.

A forum for blacks? No.

A forum for Jews? No.

A forum for Muslims? No.

A forum for whites? No.

A forum for those who prefer their sexual partners fit the hirsute category? No.

The only reasonable answer could and should be...No.

*object*

said by Vathral :

He's not. He is just stating that if a forum for Gay/Lesbian were created, might as well cater to the other criteria out there.

said by hopeflicker :

Many people think that the topics will mostly be sexual. I highly doubt that. I can imagine some of the topics: politics regarding gay issues, entertainment, clubs, Sports, Music, etc. Of course many of these topics will revolve around the lifestyle.

said by hopeflicker :

Think of this forum as one of the many that you are not required to go to.

Many people think that the topics will mostly be sexual. I highly doubt that. I can imagine some of the topics: politics regarding gay issues, entertainment, clubs, Sports, Music, etc. Of course many of these topics will revolve around the lifestyle.

said by Phil :

Nice choice of words.

As for the forum suggestion:

*Object*

said by ptrowski :

Torn on this one.

said by dvd536 :

it should be like the health/lifestyle forum where you have to apply for access.

said by TCub :

Ive been a member of this site for 3 days already and I've already recorved hate messages in my I'm box... I couldn't even imagine the offensive posts in an all gay forum.

said by CtrlAltDel :

*object*

Let's keep our sexual lives to ourselves. There are plenty of other places to go to discuss things like this.

said by horsemouth :

"DSLReports, Not DSLAndEveyOtherForumUnderTheSunReports"
Are you paying for the bandwidth?

said by nokiatech :

Oh good another forum that has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH BROADBAND OR COMPUTING.

Sounds like a great idea. We need more of those.

Not.

Object.

said by CtrlAltDel :

*object*

Let's keep our sexual lives to ourselves. There are plenty of other places to go to discuss things like this.

said by J Sun :

I think my proposition of a Flashlight forum would hold more ground as it could be a subforum to Electronics.