"Official" email migration thread in DSL Extreme

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 21 Oct 2008 00:52:18 EDT

user_nms : ** Three Problems with POP on DslExtremeGmail **

(1) Google’s ‘sender’ fields spoils sender’s legitimate spoofed ‘from’ field.
(2) Mail sent to self not received on POP/IMAP clients.
(3) SPAM/Virus filter false positives are inaccessible from POP client.

** Details of Each Problem **

(1) Google’s ‘sender’ fields spoils sender’s legitimate spoofed ‘from’ field

Today (and this is not the only time) I found out that a longstanding customer did not receive an important message from me because his spam filter whitelist did not recognize the myaccount@dlsextreme.com address in the ‘sender’ field of my e-mail. IT SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN THERE.

Mail I send with a spoofed but legitimate ‘from’ address, when sent via SMTP and/or via Webmail, now arrives at the recipient’s computer with my DslExtreme address inserted by Google as the ‘sender’. This is NEVER ACCEPTABLE.

My current ISP-based e-mail address (in this case at DslExtreme), which was never known to any e-mail recipient before the recent Google mail server fiasco, is now known to all of them, and to all malware that might find its way onto their computers, and to all recipients of forwarded e-mails sent (intentionally or via malware) from their computers.

It’s particularly infuriating that this outrageous defect is present on an ‘improved’ system that has taken the (clearly beneficial) security step of making me prove my spoofed addresses are legitimate before I use them in outbound mail.

There are numerous legitimate and widely-used reasons for spoofing the ‘from’ address in e-mail, including (to name just a few): auto-filtering incoming replies into different folders based on the incoming ‘to’ address; maintaining the same address and mail appearance when traveling and corresponding from different locations/devices, different types of connections, and even different ISPs; using an address on a temporary basis for a temporary affiliation with correspondents; using a permanent, forwarded address with all correspondents for years or decades while changing locations and ISPs; and using a throwaway address (as almost everyone does) for mail to vendors who will turn a one-time purchase into a lifetime of unwanted e-mails. For DslExtreme and Google to force the transmission of an ISP-specific (and in come cases connection-event-specific) ‘sender’ address to recipients of these e-mails defeats every one of these legitimate purposes.

(2) Mail sent to self not received on POP/IMAP clients

Mail I send to myself (as a TO, CC, BCC, or listserv recipient) via SMTP and/or via Webmail is no longer delivered to me via POP or IMAP. This is NEVER ACCEPTABLE.

This quirk exists because Google has been lazy about reconciling the difference between their arguably-useful Webmail ‘tags’ and ‘thread’ view (which NO e-mail clients support) with ‘folders’ (which ALL e-mail clients support). Outbound mail is tagged both ‘inbox’ and ‘sent’. Google seems to think they have to choose between downloading ALL sent mail back to POP clients as if it is inbound mail, or sending NO inbound mail where the sender is the same as the logged-in client.

They can resolve this problem by considering all fields in the original message header in their (proprietary, non-standard) POP interface (and perhaps IMAP too). The objective is to filter out mail sent via their SMTP or Webmail that ends up in their quirky tag system where outbound messages are tagged both ‘sent’ and ‘inbox’. To do this, they need their POP filter to skip downloading only those messages with the ‘inbox’ tag where (a) the ‘sent’ tag is also set, and (b) the ‘from’ field in the original header matches the logged-in POP account or any of its Google-approved SMTP aliases, and (c) none of the addresses in the original header’s ‘to’, ‘cc’, and ‘bcc’ fields match the logged-in POP account or any of its Google-approved SMTP aliases. When any of these 3 conditions is not met, the message should not be skipped.

(3) SPAM/Virus filter false positives are inaccessible from POP client

Mail others send me that is filtered out as SPAM by the server can not be viewed to check for false positives from a POP or IMAP e-mail client.

The old DslExtreme mail service had a perfectly decent ISP-side SPAM/Virus filter. It still worked with my (Outlook) POP client and my SPAM/Virus software to direct suspected SPAM to the client’s junk mail folder where I could occasionally check for false positives without ever using webmail, and I could do so from my laptop whether I was working online or offline. That the new system can’t do this, at least as a user-settable option, is just NOT ACCEPTABLE.

** DslExtreme, You Owe Your Users a Solution, not an Excuse **

I never purchased e-mail service from Google, I purchased it from DslExtreme. I’ve been paying DslExtreme for it for years. Since October 7, DslExtreme has completely failed to deliver this service in an acceptable way. To outsource part of the service to Google and still provide it in a fully-compatible way, at least as reliably as before, would be no big deal. However to make that change and no longer provide the required functionality in an acceptable manner is another thing entirely.

George (dslx_gm), in your comment on the DSLreports forum, you glibly state “If you attempt to send a message to yourself using POP it won't show up. It is one of their know [sic] idiosyncrasies.” George, what Google provides in their free gmail service is their business. I’m paying DslExtreme to provide reliable fully functional e-mail access (and other services), not to capriciously decide to discontinue it and then, with a shrug and a smirk, substitute a different service laden with Google’s ‘idiosyncrasies’ and no way around them.

Please don’t respond with (totally off-topic) comments such as those suggesting the advantages (for some but by no means all) of IMAP over POP, or about Google’s (utterly absurd) fantasy that Webmail meets all needs and no one ever needs local mail folders or works offline, or about trying the gmail ‘recent’ feature with POP.

Respond with *solutions* that you, DslExtreme (with or without Google’s help), will provide on a permanent basis to fix each and every one of these problems for us, your so-far loyal, paid-in-full, increasingly angry, and increasingly impatient customers.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 17 Oct 2008 14:49:40 EDT

Zak_D_H : Hi n0wherefast.

Give it another try and let me know.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 17 Oct 2008 13:12:29 EDT

n0wherefast : Thank you all for the quick reply's.

Zak...I did try setting up the phone prior to enabling IMAP on my web-mail. I will send you a PM

RangerTX...I also tried 587 but no luck...I guess it had to do with the sequence of setting up the webmail prior to the phone..

Thanks.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:41:18 EDT

81399672 : I have sprint but also use versamail. My incoming is set to 993 and ssl is checked. Outgoing is set to 587 and both ssl and esmtp is checked.
--
i am not a lawyer but I do play one on the internet

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:39:55 EDT

Zak_D_H : n0wherefast,

If you setup the phoe to use IMAP first before enabling IMAP on the web-mail it could have locked the account from accessing the IMAP server. I can fix that problem if you send me a PM/IM with the E-mail address that is having the problem.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:35:42 EDT

MTB :

said by brmehlman :
On another subject, if I send a .exe file from my FreeBSD system to my mother's iMac, please explain who is being protected when you intercept it.

If you use sendmail where is the filtering done?

If you do not use sendmail why not?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 17 Oct 2008 12:16:39 EDT

sded : Port 993 is the correct port for imap; port 995 is for pop. Are you logging in with the full user@dslextreme.com username? Have you subscribed to your imap mailboxes? Do you have a choice of TLS or SSL? Sorry, don't use Versamail but all works with Thunderbird.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 17 Oct 2008 11:43:36 EDT

n0wherefast : Hi,
Ever since dslextreme switched to gmail I have been unable to get my e-mails through my verizon centro phone via versamail.

I get the following error message:

"A connection was made but the server did not respond to the login attempt"

Here is my setup on versamail:

e-mail address: user@dslextreme.com
Mail Type: IMAP
Incoming server: imap.gmail.com
outgoing server: smtp.gmail.com
incoming port with SSL: 995 (have also tried 993)
outgoing port with SSL: 465

Also, I enabled IMAP in my e-mail settings (via PC)

Is there something else I need to do..am I missing something.

Thanks for reading

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 15 Oct 2008 01:49:29 EDT

szann : Well, it's always good to post because right afterwards it all becomes clear.

Seems to be working now.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 15 Oct 2008 00:37:47 EDT

szann : OK, I am the last person on the planet still using Eudora. I am not thrilled with this email "upgrade." Eudora solves a ton of problems for me and is one small bright spot in the dismal sea that is daily email.

I attempted to configure Eudora using setting info for Outlook, alas, it did not work. I'm on a Mac running 10.4.x

The link to "other email clients" is useless. A search for Eudora turns up nothing.

Please help.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 14 Oct 2008 16:20:10 EDT

OZO :

said by cowboy :

I'd like to travel in peace, and not be on the no-fly list,
but, like email, our personal privacy is being sacrificed in the name of war (real or percieved).

What war?

I look at it from a different perspective - for the sake of sacrificing our privacy some are looking for a "the name of war (real or perceived)". Isn't that an easy excuse to strip down people from any privacy (or any freedom for that matter). And it works well, until people realize that and do something.

cowboy - if you don't want to be on the no-fly list, then say it, but do not support it.

Now, back to email, if I do not want to include .exe into my "no-fly list" for email traffic - I have to have an option to exclude it from the list. Just simple like that. I don't like to be "big-brothered" here...
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 14 Oct 2008 15:24:41 EDT

cowboy :

Good question.
To me it's the same as:
If I know how to deal with .exe in Windows please explain who is being protected when you intercept it.

'Tis time to let this dead horse lay in peace... Please stop floggin it.

Many, if not most mail gateways now ban .exe, unless well hidden... Sending executables in the mail is lost due the war on our mailboxes (spam/virus)

There are better ways to move those things, and if you can't avail yourself of them, then rename & 7zip (or other obfuscation dujour) and get on with your lives

I'd like to travel in peace, and not be on the no-fly list,
but, like email, our personal privacy is being sacrificed in the name of war (real or percieved).

for the record, I occasionally fly without issue, and the problem is my name, not something I've done
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 14 Oct 2008 13:48:52 EDT

OZO :

said by brmehlman :

if I send a .exe file from my FreeBSD system to my mother's iMac, please explain who is being protected when you intercept it.

Good question.

To me it's the same as:
If I know how to deal with .exe in Windows please explain who is being protected when you intercept it.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 14 Oct 2008 05:54:08 EDT

brmehlman : It seems that this business of not getting mail to oneself extends to mail sent via a list server. The server sends out the mail with me on the "From" field, and I never see it. Other people on the list get my mail, and I get theirs.

This is a problem, I depend on that copy as a confirmation that the list server is actually working.

On another subject, if I send a .exe file from my FreeBSD system to my mother's iMac, please explain who is being protected when you intercept it.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 21:52:29 EDT

dslx_gm : We are starting the process to disable dual delivery on a per account basis. The first batch of accounts will start tomorrow. Accounts who were part of the first batch would have received the emails and messages.

We will continue with batches of the next few weeks until everyone has been fully moved over.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 20:19:05 EDT

TE : I just received the following on one of my accounts...

The legacy mail services for your account will be turned off on October 7, 2008. For more information and step by step instructions, please visit our website at »www.dslextreme.com/mailchange.

George, Is this shutdown being staggered or will all accounts be shutdown on the 7th?

I've made the move to Gmail using Windows Mail with IMAP.

Edit to add ...

Ok, 5:25pm- I just received a phone call letting me know of the shutdown tomorrow. It was a automated recording. :D

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 17:18:14 EDT

OZO : That's true. If DSLE were not allowing to manage RDNS (effectively blocking SMTP's normal work) - I'd have to switch to another ISP. Let's hope that they'll not go this road...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 17:02:51 EDT

cowboy :

said by OZO :

said by cowboy :

Or go the way I was forced, and run your own MTA/IMAP servers...

You're not the only one... See here. :)

;)

For the record - my domain preceeded the recent gmail changes, I've owned and managed it for years - even before
I became a happy DSLExtreme customer.

I count myself lucky to have an ISP that actually lets me do this (I have DNS elsewhere - I run a hidden primary, and they AXFR from me)... DSLExtreme now even lets me manage the RDNS, nowadays vitally important for proper MTA usage.
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 16:49:47 EDT

OZO :

said by cowboy :

Or go the way I was forced, and run your own MTA/IMAP servers...

You're not the only one... See here. :)
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 16:02:59 EDT

cowboy : jeez guys/gals...

One of my wife's stock lines is:
'You made it look different... change is bad, very bad...'

The world changes, most issues in this thread have now been worked around... and for the remaining, there needs to be one of the following done

1) Get over it, and move on... Many (likely most) SMTP services now scan for AV/spam - and executables/macros are one such casualty... POP isn't as robust as IMAP, most clients do both (with varying levels of IMAP extension support).

2) Get yourself a hosted email solution - you might even be able to call the shots on how it is setup... Or go the way I was forced, and run your own MTA/IMAP servers - when something goes wrong, the guilty party is immediately, and properly larted ;)
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 13:48:26 EDT

OZO : No, I presume the next step will be - DSLE will turn off its own DNS service moving us to something like OpenDNS. And then they will make a deal with Nebuad or Phorm... :(

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 06 Oct 2008 11:07:30 EDT

dickmead : I use Apple's Mail client under Leopard. Using POP, as IMAP is useless now.
Just looked at the web interface to mail (thanks again for the extra work required). (/sarcasm)
The INBOX was holding two replies to messages that had cc'ed my own address. They were 4 days old. Why didn't they get sent to my mail client with the others?
I have to thank the brain trust at dslx for this joyous mail handling event. I was getting bored.
What is next? Perhaps a deal with Nebuad or Phorm?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sun, 05 Oct 2008 19:21:27 EDT

piffy : Opps vista version of outlook express

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sun, 05 Oct 2008 19:20:36 EDT

piffy : vista version of outlook.

I set up an imap account on the vista machine and it downloads most of the mail

but not on the pop account.
In web mail I have both pop and imap configured on the same account.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sun, 05 Oct 2008 15:49:30 EDT

Zak_D_H : Hi Piffy,

What are you using on Win Vista to download E-mail. "Microsoft windows mail"? Are you getting an error when you try to check for E-mail? Does it just say "no new messages?"

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sun, 05 Oct 2008 12:08:15 EDT

piffy : I am sorry if this gets posted twice

I have a few questions and thoughts.
Are most people using Vista XP Os x or ?

First I have a mixed network Mac and pc (vista). As a parent I get all the email of the children. (big parent patrolling)

In apple mail the last version 3.5 I am having problems smtp-ing Incoming is not a problem. Vista seems to smtp fine.

In Apple mail I can receive mail from the same dsl account but not in vista, the email accounts are set as pop. As the Apple mail picks up all the incoming mail from the web mail server, not vista any reason for this? This is mail from non dslextreme places. IE Disneyland.com I have changed the time interval to longer on the apple mail to allow the vista machine a chance to pick it up. It does not seem to make a difference. I thought about Imap for this account.
I have been to webmail and checked all the settings.

Any help would be great

This is the only issue I have called dslextreme on more than once.

Re: Changed subject line

Wed, 01 Oct 2008 19:23:38 EDT

tranle : After having expanded you can click on "show details" link (on the first line of the message) and you should be getting the from, to, sujbect and mailed-by headers.

Changed subject line

Wed, 01 Oct 2008 16:55:51 EDT

shortckt : I know it's a nested view. Using "expand all" still does not show the subject line as sent by the client. In fact the subject line of the response is not shown at all in expanded view, probably because it is the same as the subject line in the original message.

Just another reason to dislike gmail...

Re: Changed subject line

Wed, 01 Oct 2008 09:04:31 EDT

fourboxers : Gmail nests their conversations rather than make a new entry for each one. Your Gmail screenshot shows you sent a message to Deidre, who replied and there are two emails in the conversation. If you open that one it will show a small tab for your original email and Deidre's full reply, to you click Expand All in the top right it will expand to show both full emails.

Changed subject line

Wed, 01 Oct 2008 08:44:38 EDT

shortckt : Why does Gmail change the subject line of received message ?

Majority of mail clients add re: to original subject upon reply. Gmail is removing that.

Confirmed that re: exists in received message headers.

In addition, the Gmail From: field implies that the received message was sent to both me and another recipient, it was only sent to "Deidre".

[att=2]

[att=1]

sample message in TB
sample message in Gmail-web

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 01 Oct 2008 06:40:25 EDT

OmagicQ : During the transition is there supposed to be duplication between the gmail system and the old system? I've been checking both systems and I see the same messages, and have to delete in both places. I don't use pop just the webmail interface.

Differences between dslxg mail and gmail

Tue, 30 Sep 2008 11:26:16 EDT

sded : I note that while gmail does not retrieve messages to myself via pop, it does put them in the inbox shown as (me). In dslxg mail, they just vanish. I am on my own distribution list, and used to use the return copy for my own archives; doesn't work now. Also note that there appears to be no way to get to the dslxg archive if you choose that option for pop mail disposition. Are we final now? These seem to be post-transition issues.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sun, 28 Sep 2008 00:51:50 EDT

mike_f : Great tip, and I should point out that the prefix [Gmail/] is Case Sensitive! {GMAIL/} gives you another root folder in Thunderbird.

Interesting that on my fastmail account all folders show up under Inbox - wierd but not a problem.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 26 Sep 2008 00:10:12 EDT

TE : Just found this trick for Windows Mail at »andreineculau.wordpress.com/2007···outlook/

Recently I have figured out the best way to have Gmail IMAP in Windows (Live) Mail/Outlook (Express).

Other than the usual settings you can do, there is something that it is not specified in the basic configuration. The Gmail IMAP inbox is structured to have Inbox, [Gmail], and other folders which are nothing else than your defined labels.

The way these Microsoft products are built, they do not allow to specify a special folder to point to [Gmail]\X (a subfolder). Therefore you cannot link (tell Mail/Outlook) a special item (sent, deleted and junk) to point to your real folders, residing on the IMAP account.

But there is a.. semi-trick. Something that maybe it is not that obvious to start with. There’s an option that says “Root folder path”, under the IMAP tab of the Account properties window.

If you choose “[Gmail]” for that, deselect “Check for new messages in all folders”, then select “Store special folders on IMAP server” and fill in with Sent Mail, Drafts, Trash, Spam - there you go.. you will see some nice usual folders in your Microsoft E-mail client. The only disadvantage is that you won’t be able to take advantage of labeling (since the label folders are not made visible).

* This has been tried on Windows Live Mail

And from a Responses (If you want gmail labels...)

A small tip: I you do want to use your Gmail labels as folders in an IMPA client. Simply add the prefix

“[GMAIL]/”

before the label in the Gmail webinterface. The next time you refresh the IMAP folders each label with the prefix [Gmail]/ will appear as an IMAP folder.
if you have a label in Gmail named “Work”

Change the label to “[Gmail]/Work”

This will display as folder “Work” in the IMAP client.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 25 Sep 2008 17:03:23 EDT

tranle :

said by cowboy :

Oh, good point ... I did see two trash folders - one was the tbird folder - and that was one I was checking.

I found the relevant link and will re-run and post the results shortly

thanks ;)

I think that I have the same setup as you, tbird with imap.
With the way that google handle their imap folder, to properly delete a message it need to be moved to the "[Gmail]/Trash" folder.

To do that in mozilla thunderbird you need to make sure that your trash folder is specified as [Gmail]/Trash. Some of beta version of thunderbird has a broken gui so you will have manually edit the prefs.js.

The other standard imap options such as "mark as deleted" + compact does not seems to to work with google imap implementation as they only remove the label and leave your messages in "All Mail".

You can remove the second Trash folder by using the webmail interface, use 'Edit Labels', and remove the [imap]/Trash label.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 24 Sep 2008 14:43:50 EDT

cowboy : Close, but no cigar ;(

I followed two links:
»www.howtogeek.com/howto/internet···bird-2x/

»lifehacker.com/software/geek-to-···4574.php

Both are pretty good references... The 1st link has comments at the end which match with my experimentation:

* There is currently no way for the 'Delete message' to move the message to the the 'Trash' folder... If you delete a message it will show backup up in a minute

* You can, however, use thunderbird's right-click actions to 'move to' action to move the message to trash - and it stays there ;)

It isn't clear if this is a thunderbird or gmail issue - I guess an outlook express trial would show for sure (if it allows folder remapping).

Not that any of this really impacts me - I was just curious and that it'd be an easy test.
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 24 Sep 2008 13:32:30 EDT

cowboy : Oh, good point ... I did see two trash folders - one was the tbird folder - and that was one I was checking.

I found the relevant link and will re-run and post the results shortly

thanks ;)
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 24 Sep 2008 12:58:57 EDT

dslx_gm : Hi cowboy -

I don't have Thunderbird installed on this machine so I have not been able to test but I wanted to confirm that you were deleting the mail under the GMail --> Trash etc. The standard trash folder in Thunderbird is different than the one on the server. I believe there was a work around to get Thunderbird to use the server trash folder but it required changing some underlying settings in the Thunderbird config.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 24 Sep 2008 12:45:12 EDT

cowboy : yes, that was, I think, even in my note.

After deleting from the 'All Mail', and then deleting from the 'Trash' folder things look good

Good, that is, until you go back to the 'All Mail' folder and find the deleted messages have mystically re-appeared - their bits reconstituted from raw aether, I guess ;)

I wouldn't have believed if it, had I not seen with my own eyes... I don't know if this is a fundamental design issue, or if, when they implimented the IMAP server, that no-one thought about/discovered the problem
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 24 Sep 2008 11:45:32 EDT

Zak_D_H : Have you tried deleting the message from the "all-mail" folder and then deleting it from the "trash" folder? I do not have an IMAP account setup to test at the moment.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 24 Sep 2008 11:29:20 EDT

cowboy : Well, I'll be darned...

After a refresh, the messaged actually come back to the 'All Mail' folder :(

That means, that yes, the only way to fully delete mail is to use the web interface - and that is 'Broken As Designed' ...
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:59:44 EDT

cowboy : Ok, I just setup a client (thunderbird) - in IMAP mode

I was able to subscribe to all folders, including - and importantly, the 'All Mail' folder.

Now, the confusing thing for most of you seems to be that Gmail doesn't use `folders` the way other places do - think of them more as `tags` on the mail... deleting a mail from the inbox simply removes the 'inbox' tag...

But, you can delete the message from 'All Mail' - and it properly winds up in the trash can - where it will stay until deleted again (unless your client is set to auto empty trash)
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:07:48 EDT

dickmead : Sent MAil, All Mail, Trash... seems google wants extra time to analyze
mail so puts copies in all sorts of places. In addition, I use a client, not
web interface, so why the hell is google putting my mail on the web interface. All my settings in the client (and web interface) say to delete.
When I delete from the client, it should be gone! Not resting in google's
little snoopy bins.

Seems no matter how I try, I am forced to use the web interface to
ensure a message is really deleted and gone. What's up with that?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 23 Sep 2008 00:52:46 EDT

OZO : Thank you, gentlemen. I'd never find header under "Show Original" item :)
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 23 Sep 2008 00:34:20 EDT

dslx_gm : In the drop down menu on the upper right corner of the message select show original. That will show you the full headers.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 23 Sep 2008 00:33:33 EDT

fourboxers : If it's like gmail use the drop down arrow at reply and choose Show Original.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 23 Sep 2008 00:26:22 EDT

OZO : In old DLSE WebMail I can use "View Full Headers" to track how I've got the mail.

How can I get the same in the new Google WebMail interface?

As far as I can find it offers "show details", that shows only from, to and date info.
How to get the email headers?

Even Yahoo shows mail headers...
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 03:14:25 EDT

brmehlman : I was pretty sure I was who I claimed to be. But I suppose I could have been wrong. After all, who am I going to believe, myself or The Google?

Good thing I didn't send myself any personal information.
-------
Added later:

Oops.
Never mind.
I apologize!

That email had a link with a numeric IP in the body. A benign one to be sure, but the system was right to be suspicious.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 02:04:34 EDT

brmehlman : So far, so good. With the new pop and smtp settings, one message out and one message in, and both worked.

I suppose I'd better tell all my usual correspondents that if I don't reply to something they should send it again.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:41:38 EDT

brmehlman : Wish I could say the same.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:39:15 EDT

81399672 :

said by brmehlman :

This could be worse than I thought.

Looking at the new Google webmail, a couple of messages that I did get via POP, and that are still on the old webmail, are missing.

So, will switching just cause me to lose different messages instead of preventing message loss?

I just checked and both of my new (gmail) and old dslextreme mailbox are identical.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:37:10 EDT

brmehlman : This could be worse than I thought.

Looking at the new Google webmail, a couple of messages that I did get via POP, and that are still on the old webmail, are missing.

So, will switching just cause me to lose different messages instead of preventing message loss?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:33:44 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by brmehlman :

So, you're saying the links to discover magazine and dictionary.com aren't ads?

OK.

Those are both feeds. The Discovery one is from the following RSS feed. »dsc.discovery.com/news/topstories.xml The Dictionary.com one is their word of the day feed. »dictionary.reference.com/wordoft···wotd.rss Those are not advertisements but rather feeds of news articles from their sites. It is possible for someone to slip in an advertisement into an RSS feed but from my experience I have never seen one in the default feeds. YMMV
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:23:15 EDT

brmehlman : So, you're saying the links to discover magazine and dictionary.com aren't ads?

OK.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:17:39 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by brmehlman :

PS. What's with the little ads on the new webmail? Are they going to gradually get bigger and more obtrusive as time goes on? Isn't the sixty bucks a month I'm paying you guys enough?

Those are referred to as web clips. It is like a mini-rss reader of news clips in your email program. For example if you wanted to have the forum posts from the DSLX forum here show up at the top of your email in the clips you can. You can turn them off or customize them as you wish by selecting the settings link and then the web clips tab. They aren't advertisements.
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 01:09:11 EDT

brmehlman : I lost two pieces of mail last night.

Well, not exactly lost, at least not permanently. My email client didn't pick them up and they weren't on the dslx webmail. So I finally accepted the Google TOS (I had my fingers crossed though) and accessed the new and allegedly improved web mail, and there they were.

The bad news for you is that the sender of those emails is nearing the end of an Earthlink contract she hates and has been listening to me laud dslextreme for a couple of years. I'm guessing when I tell her what happened to her mail you won't be on her short list of replacement ISPs.

I suppose if I don't change my POP settings to gmail I'll probably lose more mail, and someday I probably won't get any of my mail. So I guess I have to do it now.

I am not happy.

PS. What's with the little ads on the new webmail? Are they going to gradually get bigger and more obtrusive as time goes on? Isn't the sixty bucks a month I'm paying you guys enough?

Re: Mail being left behind on servers after I download using POP

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 00:17:54 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by RayG :

said by dslx_gm :

There is a setting inside webmail that gives you the option to leave the mail on the server, archive it or remove it from the server.

Care to address the issue of all sent items being stored on the webmail, even though they are sent via the SMTP? See a few replies up for the details.

The servers are designed to save a message in the sent items folders. It appears to be done this way in order to ensure sent items are saved when using IMAP. There doesn't appear to be a way to disable this. I will verify if there is though. I would recommend trying to filter work around that was mentioned above.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: Mail being left behind on servers after I download using POP

Mon, 22 Sep 2008 00:14:54 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by sded :

Webmail is set to delete from server, and appears to do that after first download of headers and deletion of messages. Inbox is empty. But downloading headers again from another computer makes them appear again. Haven't tried it with a third computer, but suspect I would see them again. Could there be an issue with UIDL identification? There is no such problem using gmail.

Ed,

I have not been able to replicate what you described above. I set up an account for POP3 in Outlook Express/Windows Mail on two separate machines. I sent an email to that account and saw that it arrived on the server in webmail. I downloaded it to the Windows Mail client on one machine. I confirmed that it wasn't in the Inbox on the server anymore. I then tried to download it using the mail client on the other machine. I wasn't able to download any messages. I setup the mail client using the default settings other than the ports.

Are you using a different mail client? Maybe it is a setting in the client?

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: Mail being left behind on servers after I download using POP

Sun, 21 Sep 2008 22:11:02 EDT

jadinolf : [ dslx_gm ]There is a setting inside webmail that gives you the option to leave the mail on the server, archive it or remove it from the server.
George, I thought I set it up to delete but my sent mail goes to the the inbox.

I would love for it not to stay on the web mail and would appreciate any help.
--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Re: Mail being left behind on servers after I download using POP

Sun, 21 Sep 2008 21:49:11 EDT

anon :

said by dslx_gm :

There is a setting inside webmail that gives you the option to leave the mail on the server, archive it or remove it from the server.

Care to address the issue of all sent items being stored on the webmail, even though they are sent via the SMTP? See a few replies up for the details.

Re: Mail being left behind on servers after I download using POP

Sun, 21 Sep 2008 20:40:15 EDT

sded : Webmail is set to delete from server, and appears to do that after first download of headers and deletion of messages. Inbox is empty. But downloading headers again from another computer makes them appear again. Haven't tried it with a third computer, but suspect I would see them again. Could there be an issue with UIDL identification? There is no such problem using gmail.

Re: Mail being left behind on servers after I download using POP

Sun, 21 Sep 2008 20:36:01 EDT

dslx_gm : There is a setting inside webmail that gives you the option to leave the mail on the server, archive it or remove it from the server. To update the setting to your preference, you will want to login to the webmail interface, select the settings link at the top right and select the POP/IMAP tab. From there under the POP section change the setting in the drop down to delete the messages. I would change the radio button to download all from now on and then go in and delete the mail in webmail that is currently there. That will prevent it from downloading duplicate messages while clearing what is currently on the server.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: Mail being left behind on servers after I download using POP

Sun, 21 Sep 2008 20:05:48 EDT

sded : I have the same issue. When I review and delete mail from one computer using Popman, it doesn't show up on dslx webmail anymore. But when I go and check email with my other computer, I see it again. Doesn't happen with gmail, just dslx version.

Mail being left behind on servers after I download using POP

Sun, 21 Sep 2008 19:59:04 EDT

sergesret : I'm finding that using POP based programs (Thunderbird and Mailwasher) to download and delete mail from the gmail server the mail is actually left behind on the server. My POP applications don't see it anymore but it's still there. With the old system the mail would be gone. Is there some way to get the behavior of the old mail system back on this. Is there something I am missing?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sat, 20 Sep 2008 23:41:50 EDT

anon : I scanned through the previous pages and didn't see anyone mention the issue I am seeing.

All of my emails sent via the SMTP server are being cached on the webmail in the sent items folder. On the previous system it would only put something in the sent item folder if I sent the email via the web mail interface. I do not want to have copies of my sent emails sitting in the webmail. Please have Google add an option to NOT save copies of sent mail on their servers. And just to be clear, I am not talking about the option in outlook to save sent items. As the tech support people seem to want me to always uncheck that even though I say I'm talking about the webmail!

Just reiterating that which others have said, it is very annoying to go through all of this trying to setup G-mail to act like the previous system. For example, the default option was to keep received emails on the webmail interface. I had to go in and change it to delete... How many of the people out there do not know that potentially sensitive info will just be sitting there for years. Don't assume everyone uses the webmail interface.

Oh and I managed to find a temporary work around for the sent mail issue. I added a filter to delete any new items that originated from my own email address. Now I just need to find a way for it to instantly delete items instead of holding on to it for a month!

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sat, 20 Sep 2008 17:10:44 EDT

giantsfan : The good news is that the Gmail spam filter on the new servers is different and better than the Postini spam filter currently used on the old servers (and, of course, much much better than the dslextreme legacy spam filters). All the false positives that were flagged by Postini were properly in the Inbox on the new mail server and vice versa for spam that was not caught by Postini. Those that are running their own spam filters should seriously consider using the Gmail spam filter instead. Of course, there should be an easy way of turning off the Gmail spam filter for those that don't want it or don't get any spam.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sat, 20 Sep 2008 16:39:58 EDT

giantsfan :

said by dslx_gm :

said by dickmead :

I have just discovered that, apparently, google keeps a second copy
of every message that comes to my inbox, including spam, in a box
called All Mail. Now I have to take the EXTRA step of cleaning that box out. I don't want this extra copy to be kept! I tried to clear it from my mail application (IMAP accessed). But when I checked via the web access, it was still there.

I don't want google (nor did I let your old servers) keep my mail. I
keep it locally. So, how do I eliminate this little issue?

Thanks for all the fun....

I tested this and wasn't able to replicate the issue. You want to be sure to set your email account to delete all messages from the server. I would also select to download all messages, even those that have been already downloaded. That will ensure that it downloads and clears everything. Once you have it sent to that it will download from the Google servers.

I think this issue wans't replicated because it was tested using POP and not IMAP. For IMAP, this behavior is documented:

»mail.google.com/support/bin/answ···er=78755

If you use IMAP and delete a message from your Inbox (or any other folder that you created), it will still be archived on Google's servers in the All Mail folder. You cannot delete messages from the All Mail folder from your email client (which would not be acceptable anyway). You have to go into Webmail and select the messages from All Mail that you want to move into the Trash folder. And then you have to go into Trash to permanently remove the email (or it happens after 30 days). So, if you don't want your email permanently stored on Google's servers, you either have to use POP or spend a lot of extra time using Webmail instead of your email client.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sat, 20 Sep 2008 12:15:10 EDT

anon : Well after poking around in AVG, I found the "scan outgoing mail" option unchecked. This apparently is not enabled by default, and you must have it checked before you can send mail with these new settings. After checking the option my mail went through.

I still seem to have an issue where upon syncing in Windows Live Mail to my three accounts, randomly one of the three will show connecting in the status bar and will eventually error out. Any ideas? Thanks

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sat, 20 Sep 2008 08:27:18 EDT

sded : Try port 587 for sending email; some setups seem to require it vs port 465. Is TLS an option as well as SSL? Sorry; don't use Windows Live Mail or AVG, but ask at AVG forum.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sat, 20 Sep 2008 02:05:42 EDT

anon : So much for this one being an easy fix! :mad: Is there something that looks wrong here? I am able to download messages most of the time. A couple of times it has timed out? And now I can't send any emails??? I am so tired of this email crap! Thanks in advance for any help.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 23:31:45 EDT

anon : Here is the link to get AVG working with GMail when using a pop client. These are the settings for AVG 8.0. Don't try the settings for 7.5 if you have 8.0, they won't work, I tried! :(

»free.avg.com/ww.faq.num-1288

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 20:26:22 EDT

sded : Still waiting for instructions on how to check and delete the spam folder items from TB. Nothing I do seems to make it visible via IMAP like it was in the old system.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 12:18:57 EDT

sded : Take a look at »freeforum.avg.com/read.php?3,25035,108222 , for example. Setting up for dslx seems pretty much like gmail, except you need to supply your dslx email address instead of your gmail address. Haven't done it for AVG myself, but there seems to be an active group of SSL/TLS users on the AVG forum.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 12:09:52 EDT

anon : Thanks sded,

Do you have a link to those instructions? :)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 12:04:15 EDT

sded : AVG should actually be a little easier, because the stunnel functions are built in, according to the instructions on the AVG forum. Avast! 5 is alleged to have that feature also. But in the meantime, many ISPs seem to be switching to secure email, driven at least partly by open wifi users. And Stunnel will support most? email clients in the interim.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 11:50:12 EDT

anon : I see a post for Avast instructions. I am using AVG, and I suppose I can do some scouring to find the instructions. The whole problem for those of us using a pop client to get our email, is all these Mickey Mouse fixes and all this extra time its taking to get our email to work with GMail. I hate to see what happens when the DSLX email servers shut down. I'll bet a majority of people haven't even switched servers yet.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 02:35:59 EDT

cowboy :

said by cowboy :

So, honestly, as a persona non-grata here, (DslExtreme is my ISP, but my DNS and MX are elsewhere - and *I* do my primary/backup MX, web, etc.)

And before anyone asks... I moved back to California a few years ago, after several years of running my setup on dialup and PPP/DHCP based DSL in another state... My choice in Secondary DNS/MX was predicated upon having continuous service before, during, and after the cross-country move.

This isn't any slight against DSLExtreme, other than there (understandable from a business standpoint) choice of Exchange hosting :) (but my Vz phone doesn't use Vz web, either)

I do have to say that I've been around since arpanet/bitnet/vnet (repleat with plenty of !s) addressing and DSLExtreme is far and away, thusfar, the best ISP I have had to deal with...

They give me a pipe to do with as I please - I don't bother them, and they don't cripple me... Try that with anyone else and you're paying 3x the cost for a business account, even to host a hobiest/family setup.

With all the talk about them changing since the acquisition, I fail to see the difference (but, by and large, I support myself)... When they decide to restrict my pipe, then I'll change my opinion

Until such time, I'll just (semi) quietly gripe about the fact that even though DSL Reports says there's a COVAD POP in my area, DSLExtreme says I'm stuck on Vz lines :(
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 02:19:33 EDT

cowboy :

said by OZO :

What you were surprised for is often used as common technique.
If you're concern about how to track a potential SPAM sender back - it's easy. You have logs needed in mail servers of ISP. But, with this setup potential receivers will not SPAM you back using header information, that gmail now generously includes in all its mails. (this is in reply for your potential question that changing "From" field is not possible with gmail, is it)

I'm not sure how common it is, I've been in the periphery of mail setups for > 15 years - from home (full mta & proper MTA setup on Dialup, no less) to designing high-throughput setups to track (as far as possible) mail end-to-end - and some consulting on mid-range setups as well...

Anyway, back to your issue - irregardless of how common your abuse (and yes, that is what you're doing) is a technique whos days are severely limited - due to big $ in spam, DKIM/Senderid/etc are going to be the norm (SPF/DK) will fade(IMNSHO)... You will be forced to send mail through a MTA who takes responsibility for each and every domain/mail that passes through it... Which is my current conundrum - sender based next-hop selection (normally based upon recipient).

So, honestly, as a persona non-grata here, (DslExtreme is my ISP, but my DNS and MX are elsewhere - and *I* do my primary/backup MX, web, etc.) You need to pony-up for real support... it was nice it worked for you before, but your issues are so remote that there is no way they could've been forseen or worked around.

If you just want fairly reliable mail handling, with good av/spam - and aren't abusive, you should be able to find decent hosting fairly cheap... Heck, I can even trivially add a few more domains (full dns/mail/web) - but I'd have to pony for more bandwidth first -- unless you can live on the leftovers of a 3m/768 connection :)
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 02:05:41 EDT

cowboy : read earlier in the thread - there's an entry on how to subtrefuge your extant AV/SPAM filters into the new world.
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 00:42:43 EDT

anon : Oh great! Another pain in my neck! Emails are not being scanned with my AV now. Who has the work around for this? This is a joke! Some "exciting change"!

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 19 Sep 2008 00:04:05 EDT

OZO : Yes, I know. I'm using it now.
Thanks

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:59:13 EDT

TE : Maybe George can provide you with another DSLX mail server and allow you to send.

SMTP.dslextreme.com is still up.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:47:23 EDT

OZO : What you were surprised for is often used as common technique.
If you're concern about how to track a potential SPAM sender back - it's easy. You have logs needed in mail servers of ISP. But, with this setup potential receivers will not SPAM you back using header information, that gmail now generously includes in all its mails. (this is in reply for your potential question that changing "From" field is not possible with gmail, is it)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:39:04 EDT

TE : Yes, mail.dslextreme.com is not a open relay but one that, after authentication, will allow you to send 'from' a domain that it does not receive mail for. smtp.gmail.com won't allow you to do this.

Sorry guys ... I don't want to take this thread OT...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:32:32 EDT

OZO : Thank you for wishing me luck.
It's not an open relay at all (nice try though). If you're not authorized (with logon information provided) you will send nothing. I pay for this service and its cost is included in my $60/m contributions.
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:28:40 EDT

TE : Well, you right. I shouldn't have used 'most' but the recommended configuration for a mail server is to not allow any mail to be sent from a domain that the mail server is not configured to receive mail for.

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_mail_relay

I hope DSLX can keep SMTP open for you. Good luck.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:20:49 EDT

OZO : What do you know about the most?
I've been using it with many providers (before DLSE even existed).

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:07:53 EDT

TE : WOW... I'm surprised this setup worked at all. It would seem that DSLX mail servers were mis-configured to allow you to send mail from your domain through them. Most mail servers do not allow relaying like this.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 22:57:53 EDT

OZO : dslx_gm - thank you for replying.

said by dslx_gm :

I assume that you have your domain registrar simply point all email received to your @dslextreme.com address.

You're correct. See details below.

To get around the issue I would recommend that you setup a free Google Apps domain edition account.

And why do I need it now?

You can then forward all incoming mail received to that address to your @dslextreme.com account. All incoming mail would remain the same as your current setup.

That's what I'm doing now with my old setup.

You could then use smtp.gmail.com with your username@domain.com for the settings. When you sent email through those settings the Google platform would see you as authorized to send.

What? Why I do need any authorization from Google? Is Google a new authority in the Internet? I never needed it before DLSE has replaced good working plain email service with gmail.

Your domain and email address would therefore appear.

It appeared well in my old setup with DLSE (BTW, without many sneaky records in mail headers, as it's now with gmail, see details below).

I have been using Google Apps in a similar fashion for my own domains for the past few months and have been very happy.

Well, good for you. Check headers of your email then.

I used to run my own server. Though I had the advantage of hosting it in our data center, it is much less of a headache now to manage and I don't have to deal with updating spam and virus software on the mail server.

Good. I may assure you that I do not need any SPAM and virus software additional to what I'm using locally on my computers. So that's not a problem for my setup. The problem now is how to bypass those extra SPAM and virus filters from gmail. And it looks like with the new setup it's not possible at all :(

I hope that helps.

Thank you. What would really help is - if DLSE keeps its old SMTP/POP service running, as it did until now.

Now regarding to your proposal. Is there anything that I can do now WITHOUT Google?
Sending all emails - via Google SMTP server, receiving all emails only via Google filters (it can't be turned off) and Google pop account, searching Internet - via Google web servers... Now, to keep sending my mails from my domain you recommend me to setup a free Google Apps domain edition account. What else? Should I open new credit card account with Google as well? Do you realize where it leads to?

Up to this point I've never used myacc@dlsextreme.com in my mails. I have several domains and I use them for all my communications. I switched to DLSE several years ago and I keep my old mail accounts. If I'll switch from DLSE to provider that will not sell business to Google and provide with better connection speed (more then 6/700) - I'll not change my old mail accounts too. They are all ISP independent. That's the main point of this setup (and there are many other benefits, by the way).

How it works? (for those users who never thought about it) I've registered my domain name with provider. Domain name provider forwards all mails coming to my domain (e.g. myname@mydomain.tld) accordingly to my simple rules. One of them - forward specific mails to myacc@dlsextreme.com mail account. This way I receive all my emails for my domain. Now, how do I sent mails with my domain in "From" field? It was very simple. In my email client I've set two fields: "User Information" is filled with my domain info and "Logon Information" was filled with myacc@dlsextreme.com mail account info.

This setup was working well for many years (until this "exciting news" - all mail services were moved to gmail). And now gmail made it impossible :( Because the email service is broken I have to apply to Google Apps domain edition account. Looking at how gmail handles so called "additional email address" (they only changed visible "From" field and keeps 6 header fields with myacc@dlsextreme.com mail account - it's a joke, right?) I have absolutely no trust in gmail, and particularly in handling my domain by Google. Thank you. It'd be plain dumb to go this way.

Could DLSE keep the old mail service running?
I'm sure there will be a big pull of happy users...
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 19:27:51 EDT

sded : A test for the new spam filter. ;) Actually just my username here with dslextreme as the ISP.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 19:25:47 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by OZO :

Simply because I assume that DSLE provided smtp/pop server is more reliable than one that I may run in my home environment.
If my DSL line is down (and it happens time to time) - your server is still running and collecting my important mails.

Ozo,

I assume that you have your domain registrar simply point all email received to your @dslextreme.com address. To get around the issue I would recommend that you setup a free Google Apps domain edition account. You can then forward all incoming mail received to that address to your @dslextreme.com account. All incoming mail would remain the same as your current setup. You could then use smtp.gmail.com with your username@domain.com for the settings. When you sent email through those settings the Google platform would see you as authorized to send. Your domain and email address would therefore appear. I have been using Google Apps in a similar fashion for my own domains for the past few months and have been very happy. I used to run my own server. Though I had the advantage of hosting it in our data center, it is much less of a headache now to manage and I don't have to deal with updating spam and virus software on the mail server.

I hope that helps.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 19:23:52 EDT

cowboy :

You're mixing up to completely differrent things here:
1) An Outbound mail origination issue
2) An psuedo inbound store & forward (aka MX)

The failure of the first, in your case, has no bearing on the abilities of the second !

These days, secondary MX has fallen into some disfavour due to the intractability of proper backscatter prevention if not all the MX are under your control (like in my situation). However, some MX capability is needed - though things get a little complicated with a setup like you're attempting.

I run my own outbound/inbound mail - and pay for secondary DNS and MX service (nominal $)... it has suited me fine for many years ;)

I don't see an easy way out, shy of paying for remote hosting - I hear our ISP even does that :)

A change like this was bound to have some fallout - and you happen to be in the worst spot :(
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 19:21:32 EDT

jadinolf : Good info.

I hope that's not your REAL email address.
--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 19:09:27 EDT

sded : OK; since encrypted email is now a general dslx issue, I guess we can discuss it here. Let's start with a simple task-getting avast! to scan incoming SSL pop3 mail for Thunderbird. First picture shows the TB setup-just unencrypted email coming in from localhost proxy port 11110 for a dslx user. Make sure it includes your complete email address. Picture 2 shows the avast! setup, adding the port 11110 to those captured by avast! Picture 3 is the key, and is a copy of the stunnel.conf file renamed to .txt for viewing. Stunnel will intercept dslx email coming in on port 995, decrypt it, and pass it on to avast! to be virus scanned, then avast! will pass it on to TB on port 11110 for the TB user. All of the Stunnel setup for both dslx and separate gmail accounts are shown; others are similar. You can download Stunnel and the OpenSSL library for Windows at »www.stunnel.org/download/binaries.html . If you don't use TB, we can adapt the client similarly.



stunnel.txt 788 bytes

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 18:41:27 EDT

jadinolf :

said by sded :

Visit thr avast! forum for fairly straightforward instructions on how to set up avast! to scan encrypted email. Uses the external program Stunnel, along with the free openSSL library. I have been scanning the usual ssl dslextreme and gmail this way with avast! for several years. Since you can't scan the email directly after it is encrypted by the server, you first decrypt it via Stunnel then scan it with avast! external to your client. Or for outgoing, scan it first and then encrypt it. Technique works with some other scanners also, built into a few. Works for both incoming and outgoing secure email.

I've been looking at that for quite a while.

I think I'm to dumb to do it but I am mulling it over.

I don't suppose you'd consider coming up to tutor me. I'll buy dinner. ;)

Thanks.
--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 18:34:35 EDT

OZO : Simply because I assume that DSLE provided smtp/pop server is more reliable than one that I may run in my home environment.
If my DSL line is down (and it happens time to time) - your server is still running and collecting my important mails.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 18:34:16 EDT

sded : Visit thr avast! forum for fairly straightforward instructions on how to set up avast! to scan encrypted email. Uses the external program Stunnel, along with the free openSSL library. I have been scanning the usual ssl dslextreme and gmail this way with avast! for several years. Since you can't scan the email directly after it is encrypted by the server, you first decrypt it via Stunnel then scan it with avast! external to your client. Or for outgoing, scan it first and then encrypt it. Technique works with some other scanners also, built into a few. Works for both incoming and outgoing secure email.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 18:27:09 EDT

Zak_D_H :

said by OZO :

said by Zak_D_H :

OZO,

There is no way to send through smtp.gmail.com without the from saying your @dslextreme.com E-mail address. If you want it to show as being from your Domain you have to have us unblock port 25 and then send using your own domains outgoing mail-server.

That's a complete show-stopper for me.

I can't use the new DSLE (gmail-based) mail service at all... May I call it an "exciting news"?

Can I return back to my old Outlook settings and use smtp.dslextreme.com again?

Why don't you just send using your Private domains outgoing mailserver on port 25?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:55:18 EDT

cowboy :

Ah, right, I tested from webmail - not client MUAs, I can't do any testing from work (25 outbound blocked), so I'll take your word on this - It makes sense that smtp.dslextreme.com would have no knowledge of webmail settings.

I can assist with a local MTA on most Unix distros - and ssmtp/email under windows if the OP needs help
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:52:33 EDT

OZO :

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:51:08 EDT

cowboy :

Same with avast! and probably most antivirus programs. :(

Indeed - and while a PITA, it is a good thing - or Man-In-The-Middle attacks would be trivial ;)
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:42:13 EDT

Zak_D_H : It would appear NOD32 does not support SSL:

»www.betterantivirus.com/nod32-an···582.html

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:40:12 EDT

jadinolf :

said by Zak_D_H :

wb457,

Do you know if NOD32 is compatible with SSL? If it does not support SSL it will no longer scan your E-mail.

Same with avast! and probably most antivirus programs. :(
--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:36:42 EDT

Zak_D_H : OZO,

There is no way to send through smtp.gmail.com without the from saying your @dslextreme.com E-mail address. If you want it to show as being from your Domain you have to have us unblock port 25 and then send using your own domains outgoing mail-server.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:34:55 EDT

Zak_D_H : wb457,

Do you know if NOD32 is compatible with SSL? If it does not support SSL it will no longer scan your E-mail.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 17:04:03 EDT

wb457 : Just curious. Since the migration NOD32 used to add a footer to received mail that it has scanned. Now there's nothing. Is mail now somehow bypassing NOD32's scanning?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 16:56:57 EDT

OZO : Ok, I've just testes WebMail's way. I've added additional email address, made it 'default' and tested my Outlook client.

1) Test message received has the new email address that I've just added in WebMail and not one that I've specified in my Outllok client. That's not what I need. I owe my domain and I need to be able to send messages from it.

2) Test message header contains multiple references to my account mail in DLSE (my actual account address is replaced with 'myacc' here):


Return-Path: 
Delivered-To: myacc@dslextreme.com
smtp.mail=myacc@dslextreme.com
Sender: "myacc @dslextreme.com" 
X-CTASD-Sender: myacc@dslextreme.com
Return-Path: myacc@dslextreme.com

It's completely unacceptable...
And it's completely different from what we had here before this "exciting news"...

Zak_D_H - please provide me with instructions how to use Outlook to send messages from my domain without this WebMail hack, which as you see is not working at all (just a smoke in eyes).

--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 16:10:48 EDT

OZO : It's for WebMail and it requires adding yet another email address there.

As I've mentioned many times - I do not use WebMail at all, I only use plain POP3/SMTP client (Outlook, in particular).

Is there any instructions how to configure POP/SMTP client?
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 15:51:26 EDT

Zak_D_H : OZO,

have you tried the way that Cowboy suggested?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 15:09:19 EDT

OZO : Zak_D_H - do you have any progress in how to configure Outlook POP client to send messages from my domain?

Please let me know. It's extremely important for my mail service.

Thanks
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 10:29:57 EDT

cowboy : Well, it does work - for most things

* changes the From: header (desired id)
* adds a sender: header (dslextreme id)
* does not change the envelope from header (dslextreme id)

the 1st is what was wanted,
the 2nd pretty much follows RFC, but may confuse poor clients
the 3rd will properly direct bounces, but may also confuse
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Thu, 18 Sep 2008 02:14:53 EDT

grumpy3b : after reading this fiasco...and yet being most happy with Gmail, I am THRILLED I never used DSLx accounts for anything important save one email addy. I'll simply change my use to the direct username@gmail.com and completly fogert DSLx email even exists.

I personally stopped using ISP email a decade ago simply because of the endless changes in either server software or space limits or whatever other annoyance might crop up. Everything important is on my own servers where I control the email server.

I mostly like Gmail, except for the periods when, well it doesn't work properly for anywhere from minutes to days on end. Nothing important goes through there either.

While I appreciate DSLx trying to add some value with the access to the Google apps...to my thinking it is a waste as those who want to use them already have Gmail accounts and likely have little need for them rebranded as a xxx@dslextrem.com kinda setup.

So, thanks for trying but, ultimately, no thanks. I am sure some will find it OK the apps while not great are cool enough to many basic users.
--
Using Millenicom? Come visit the Unofficial Millenicom forum here on BBR »Millenicom

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 21:27:04 EDT

cowboy : It is actually fairly easy to add an alternate From: (assuming of course, that you actually own the alternate email address):

1) Select Settings (in upper right hand side, by your email)
2) Select Account (2nd tab)
3) Select Add another email address

This pulls up a spot where you can enter the new email address - a test mail will be sent to that account with a verification code you must enter to validate the address.

Once validated, you can either set it as the default, or select on a compose-by-compose basis (or both)

What little testing I did seemed like things were working
--
Richard Nelson

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 19:22:18 EDT

RockyBB : PM sent.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:06:31 EDT

OZO : Zak_D_H - thank you for replying.

It is extremely important for me to keep my personal domain name in "From" header field ("Spoof", as you've said). That's why I got a low flow of SPAM in my DSLE prime account until recent events... I did it for many years and I need to keep it that way.

Please find out how to make it.

P.S. I'm not using webmail at all. I'm running POP client - Outlook.
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:03:15 EDT

anon : Another annoying caveat for those using a POP client.

Don't be surprised when you send a email and it ends up back in your inbox. When using Google's recent mode you end up receiving a copy of your own email??? You have to set up a rule in your client to delete messages from yourself to avoid this. I hope I never have to send a message to myself because I won't get it now.

This is truly becoming a pain. Every time I think I have my email back to the way it was, another problem shows up. I don't see how this move to Google's GMail was beneficial to me. If I wanted GMail, I would have signed up for a free account. I have never used the web to get my email, so the increased space doesn't matter to me. What were the benefits supposed to be again?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:52:41 EDT

Zak_D_H : OZO,

From what I can tell there is not a way to "Spoof" the from E-mail when sending from a mail client. I had this come up once already and I couldn't find a work-around but I am looking into it.

You can try specifying a different "reply to" address in Web-mail but I am not sure if that even works.
--
Zak

Tech Support

DSLExtreme

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:15:23 EDT

OZO : As I've said earlier - I never used my internal account mail address in "From" field of my mails. I used my personal domain name and account instead.

Now, I'm testing my new settings using recommended 'smtp.gmail.com:995'. What I see that even if I still use the same mail client (Outlook) and use exactly the same settings (except new POP and SMTP servers) I can't get rid of my DLSE mail address (account name) in "From" field of test messages. Perhaps it comes from "Logon Information | User Name:" field, and not from "User Information | E-mail Address:" as it always being before.

How to correct it and use my own domain account (in "From" filed of header) with the new setting?
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 10:57:51 EDT

anon : Thanks to both you fellows that answered. I will try sending them to myself renamed. I'm sure it will work. I guess also that spam is a way of life, and I'll just have to deal with it. My last question still remains...

"Also, does anyone know if the 'migration' is complete? I'm still shy about 200 messages."

I REALLy don't want to send myself all of those, as well.

POP3 mail still not removed from inbox

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 08:38:37 EDT

sded : I use Popman to read the headers and scan the initial text, and when I remove the messages they don't appear in Popman again. But they are still there when I go to Webmail, until I remove them manually. And the "delete from dslextreme mail" is checked. BTW, this works correctly with my gmail account.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 04:05:01 EDT

wb457 : case sensitive for both

"Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 03:50:15 EDT

shortckt : So how are passwords now, does DSLX consider password case or does Gmail ignore case?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 01:04:57 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by darkcrucible :

I noticed what I think is a bug with passwords and case sensitivity. On the DSLEx members page, when I changed my password, I used one with upper & lower case letters and I can login with I think any upper/lower case permutation. Now, in order to use at least IMAP with the gmail servers, I must use the original password with the correct case.

This isn't really expected behavior. Someone might want to look into this.

This has been corrected.
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 00:31:38 EDT

anon : Found my answer with the help of good old Google.

For any others looking to download mail to multiple POP clients you must set your username in your client to "recent:youremail@dslextreme.com" to put GMail in recent mode, allowing all clients, not just the first client to get your emails.

»mail.google.com/support/bin/answ···er=47948

"Official" email migration thread

Tue, 16 Sep 2008 20:14:32 EDT

shortckt :

Yes, I have noticed for years that DSLX webmail, account access and other services are password case-insensitive, however Gmail is case-sensitive. I think Gmail login page even says so.
--
Just valves and condensers!

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 16 Sep 2008 17:57:37 EDT

wb457 :

said by Bad_Boy :

I also appreciate your thoughts about goo and their 'selling' policy. Allright, if it was NOT them, then WHY, oh WHY, do my email addresses that were NEVER used for anything but 'secret' conversations, or work related business replies, (think 10 minute mail)
»10minutemail.com/10MinuteMail/index.html
have SPAM in them now? My main inbox, this morning, had 367 spams, after 10 hours.

One way could be (and I'm not saying this is the case) is from dumb dumbs who may forward email which includes all of the original recipients email addresses, which can avalanche. Also those that get infected with something that have your addy in their address book, etc. etc. Anything is possible.
--
If it ain't broke, pray it never will.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 16 Sep 2008 17:04:42 EDT

altidude :

said by Bad_Boy :

...yes, they were zipped, containing .DOC .PDF and the like. You indicated a workaround...short of renaming the stuff, what can I do?

Yep, one of the workarounds is to rename your files to .jpg or .gif, something like that.

Another is to put the files in a .rar archive. Supposedly Google does not look inside .rar files. Why? I don't know. I have not tried the rar method so I don't know if it works or if Google has plugged that "hole".

Still another workaround is to use a free file hosting service and upload your files to that server. In your email you'll tell the recipient where to pick up the file.

Any of these methods is a pain, in my opinion. If Google wants to scan for virus/trojan, fine (I guess). But to simply block any mail that contains an executable attachment is a bit draconian.

Regarding your increase in spam, I can't explain it. The company I work for (our IT guy is drinking the Google kool-aid) switched to gmail several months back. We are heavy users of email and I haven't seen any increase in spam at all. At work, I get maybe one spam message every other day on average. Also, I routinely send attachments without problems. Excel sheets, Word docs, pdf, ASCII files and zipped files that contain the same file types. I know nothing in this last paragraph helps you, sorry.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 16 Sep 2008 15:15:13 EDT

darkcrucible : I noticed what I think is a bug with passwords and case sensitivity. On the DSLEx members page, when I changed my password, I used one with upper & lower case letters and I can login with I think any upper/lower case permutation. Now, in order to use at least IMAP with the gmail servers, I must use the original password with the correct case.

This isn't really expected behavior. Someone might want to look into this.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 16 Sep 2008 11:24:21 EDT

anon : For some reason when going through Google's servers using POP3 I am no longer able to download the same emails on all three of my computers. Email will download to one, and that is all. I have all computers set to "leave a copy on the server". The emails appear in my inbox on the Google web mail interface, but don't download to more than one pc. This was not an issue with DSLX email servers, as all email would download to all of my computers. Is there a Google setting to correct this? Thanks for any help!

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:48:54 EDT

anon : Hey, Altidue...thanks for replying..I grew up on Arnett street...Loma Vista/Day road area....

Anyway, yes, they were zipped, containing .DOC .PDF and the like. You indicated a workaround...short of renaming the stuff, what can I do?

I also appreciate your thoughts about goo and their 'selling' policy. Allright, if it was NOT them, then WHY, oh WHY, do my email addresses that were NEVER used for anything but 'secret' conversations, or work related business replies, (think 10 minute mail)
»10minutemail.com/10MinuteMail/index.html
have SPAM in them now? My main inbox, this morning, had 367 spams, after 10 hours.

Also, does anyone know if the 'migration' is complete? I'm still shy about 200 messages.

I was a DSLX customer even before Bill Handel started his ads, and now there is severe disappointment.

»www.handelonthelaw.com/search_de···0extreme

Labels instead of Folders?

Missing Mail? Denied Migration? More Spam?

What's next?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:47:57 EDT

dickmead : So, in other words, googles imap ignores my mail client choices, and
I must choose POP instead?

In the old days, there was a bank that advertised you didn't have to think about it, it did it's job so well.

I am certainly "thinking" about dslextreme (and gmail) right now.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 22:46:50 EDT

dslx_gm :

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 22:31:14 EDT

OZO : Then how to explain the phenomena that on my email DSLE account, that no one knows about except DSLE, I start getting a lot of incoming SPAM...

I never give that mail address to anyone. I use my domain account to forward my mails through DLSE account. But, again, no one knows that mail address and I never use it directly (as a "reply to" address).

Now, I'm getting 30 - 50 SPAM mails on that DLSE mail account :(
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 22:21:57 EDT

altidude :

said by Bad_Boy :

"The following message contained a virus or suspicious attachment and was not migrated.
This message has been left on your original mail server"

This has happened to quite of few of my IMPORTANT mail messages.

I will pay ANYONE $100,000 to prove that any of these messages indeed contained a virus or suspicious attachment.

I would also like to know why google has sold my email addresses, resulting in a 5 times increase in SPAM.

DSLX, this was really a BAD move on your part.

Gmail considers any .exe, .com., .dll, .bat or .ocx file to be suspicious and you can't send/receive those, even inside a zipped file. There are workarounds or course, all of which suck IMO. I don't know if any of your files have those extensions but that could be the problem. Or gmail is flagging them in error.

On my main email account (not DSLX hosted) I see the "message left on the server" from time to time but those messages always have a file attached that is really a virus or trojan.

I know you won't believe me or anybody else that tells you this, but Google does not sell your email address to third parties. They make their money on clicks.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 21:45:45 EDT

dickmead : I have just discovered that, apparently, google keeps a second copy
of every message that comes to my inbox, including spam, in a box
called All Mail. Now I have to take the EXTRA step of cleaning that box out. I don't want this extra copy to be kept! I tried to clear it from my mail application (IMAP accessed). But when I checked via the web access, it was still there.

I don't want google (nor did I let your old servers) keep my mail. I
keep it locally. So, how do I eliminate this little issue?

Thanks for all the fun....

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 20:44:55 EDT

anon : "The following message contained a virus or suspicious attachment and was not migrated.
This message has been left on your original mail server"

This has happened to quite of few of my IMPORTANT mail messages.

I will pay ANYONE $100,000 to prove that any of these messages indeed contained a virus or suspicious attachment.

I would also like to know why google has sold my email addresses, resulting in a 5 times increase in SPAM.

DSLX, this was really a BAD move on your part.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 14:27:19 EDT

dslx_gm : Hi littlemoon -

No mail should have been lost during the transition process. Have you already switched over to the new platform? Are you using POP or IMAP?

You may want to change the default option under the Settings | POP/IMAP/Forwarding to download all messages (including ones sitting in the Inbox) and remove them from the server if you are using POP.

THanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 13:55:58 EDT

anon : I am concerned about receiving all of my email during this transition. While continuing to use my email client, Thunderbird, I logged onto the new webmail server and found important email that was not delivered to my email client. Oddly, I also found email on my client that was not posted at my webmail. I do appreciate the fact that all the spam has disappeared from both, but I wonder if legitimate communications are also being vaporized.

What should I do to be certain that I will not miss or lose any of my email during this transition?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 12:52:46 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by kenneyb :

I have two @dslextreme.com addresses. The contact list from
the primary address was transitioned on Friday. The second
is yet to be transitioned. Do you have any idea when that will
occur?

Thanks

I spoke with our operations team regarding the contacts. There is one last batch of contacts that is being loaded in the system. Those should be done by tomorrow.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: IMAP migration?

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 12:51:43 EDT

sded : I had to manually add the imap prefix to each of the labels to get TB to see them. Tried also to create a spam folder with no luck. DSLX needs to automatically add the "imap" prefix to all migrated imap folders for TB compatibility. Still don't know how to see and delete Spam from an imap client (TB)-the manual folder I created is empty. How do we get Spam to line up with the IMAP folders? Also tried IMAP/Spam label with same result.

Re: IMAP migration?

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 12:46:40 EDT

dslx_gm : Hi Ed,

Upon refreshing the folder list, those should show up as standard IMAP folders. I assume that you have tried to refresh the list. Have you tried to rename the folders in the webmail interface under Settings | Labels to remove the Inbox/? Maybe that is causing an issue in Thunderbird.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: IMAP migration?

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 12:38:43 EDT

sded : None of these folders are labeled imap and cannot be subscribed to or seen from the Thunderbird imap processor. So something is incomplete. Nothing shows up under imap in TB except the TRASH folder; the Inbox is empty .

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 11:46:42 EDT

kenneyb : George said:

> We are also in the process of migrating any email contacts
> that were stored in the old webmail platfom. Our operations
> team indicated that those should be complete by
> approximately the end of the week as well.....

I have two @dslextreme.com addresses. The contact list from
the primary address was transitioned on Friday. The second
is yet to be transitioned. Do you have any idea when that will
occur?

Thanks

Re: IMAP migration?

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 11:44:40 EDT

tranle :

said by sded :

Attached is the mail folder list for the new DSLX mail via gmail. The INBOX/xxx folders are the IMAP folders, although INBOX/SPAM is missing. The "migrated" folder lists all of the messages that have been migrated to to the INBOX/xxx folders. But only the imap/TRASH folder is accessible via IMAP. Is the intent that the INBOX/xxx folders show up as imap/INBOX/xxx shortly so I can see them, along with the imap/SPAM?

The way I have seen it is that google mail does not have real folder. Each you create an IMAP folder it really create a label and tag your email with that label.

When all your old email got moved to the gmail it got tag with those "IMAP/xxx" tag. You can move them around, (re-label them), or just delete or rename those label if you do not like them.

IMAP migration?

Mon, 15 Sep 2008 09:36:54 EDT

sded : Attached is the mail folder list for the new DSLX mail via gmail. The INBOX/xxx folders are the IMAP folders, although INBOX/SPAM is missing. The "migrated" folder lists all of the messages that have been migrated to to the INBOX/xxx folders. But only the imap/TRASH folder is accessible via IMAP. Is the intent that the INBOX/xxx folders show up as imap/INBOX/xxx shortly so I can see them, along with the imap/SPAM?

Re: Work Around for Spam Filter

Sat, 13 Sep 2008 23:52:33 EDT

81399672 : Thanks george, yes that is pretty simple work around.
--
i am not a lawyer but I do play one on the internet

Re: Work Around for Spam Filter

Sat, 13 Sep 2008 16:59:37 EDT

jadinolf : Thanks George. Can't get in right now--page load error.

I think the SPAM problem is over, at least for me
--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Work Around for Spam Filter

Sat, 13 Sep 2008 15:58:47 EDT

dslx_gm : In search of a creative solution for the "power user" who doesn't want filtered mail, I turned to my good friend Google (No Pun Intended). I found an article and solution from xiirus.net that I have since tested. A very simple work around that seems to work like a charm.

Bypass Google's Spam Filter

1. Login to your Gmail account.
2. Click on 'Settings' near the top right corner of the screen.
3. Click on 'Filters.'
4. Click 'Create a new filter.'
5. In the 'Doesn't have:' text box, type in a long random series of characters. (i.e. "weruhweurhw8328423h23rbf2u3bf8f")
6. Click 'Next Step »'
7. Put a check mark for 'Never send it to Spam.'
8. Click on 'Create Filter.'

Since it isn't likely that a message will match that string of characters everything will therefore by passed from being filtered. This will allow you to download unfiltered messages via POP.

I still recommend that clients use the standard filtering as I truly feel they are very good but if want a work around I would suggest giving this a try.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: New Platform is Live

Sat, 13 Sep 2008 14:46:23 EDT

filmtvdp : There's only three choices for POP mail on the GMail Web interface. Not much to play around with. I'm hoping that when the mail is fully migrated -- the problem will fix itself.

DSLEx is listed with Google as an incentive partner, so no, Google will never give us the option to turn off the spam filters.

The spam filters are Google's transparent excuse to scan every bit of email that goes through their system. Believe me, if enough people start talking in email about Turbo Widgets, Google will pitch Turbo Widgets, LLC to pay for placement on their search engine.

Google also gets a spiff off of the commercial Web Clips that are turned on by default as part of DSLex's incentive partnership with them. Are you starting to understand why DSLEx is pushing so hard to get us to use the GMail Web interface as our primary email client?

Yes Virginia, there is no free lunch.

Re: New Platform is Live

Sat, 13 Sep 2008 14:11:24 EDT

81399672 : Try going to setting and clicking pop mail and playing with those settings. That might fix it for you. As for spam filter, I am hopping George will be able to work something out with Google or find some other way to give people an option.
--
i am not a lawyer but I do play one on the internet

Re: New Platform is Live

Sat, 13 Sep 2008 14:08:45 EDT

filmtvdp : Yo RangerTX.

Yep, that's going to be a huge problem. It's worse on my iPhone, as it just shows up as X amount of mail received, but when I look in the inbox, it is empty, so I can't mark those phantom emails as read or delete them.

I had to go to the GMail Web interface and archive the messages I wanted to keep (move them out of the outbox), delete the others, and then reboot the phone to get them unflagged as unread mail. I've never had that problem before on either generation of iPhones.

The pop.gmail.com server is still not working for me. Yes, I can log in via a POP client, but it is not bringing new mail into ether MailWasher Pro or MS Outlook '07.

I set the POP date in GMail to 9/12 5:00pm PDT to clear up the old mail situation, but mail dated 9/13 showing up in my GMail Web interface inbox as new mail is not being imported as new mail by my POP email clients.

Going back to the mail.dslextrem.com server has fixed that problem for now. Using IMAP is NOT an option for me. Using a Web interface for my email is definitely not an option.

The GMail spam folder this morning contained about a half dozen legit emails from senders who have never been caught by any spam filter before. I have been getting email from Paramount, Warner Bros. and CNN for years and none has ever been marked as spam, but GMail decided it was. So much for the vaunted GMail spam accuracy.

Like I said, a real disaster.

Clue to DSLex, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. The few bucks you are going make off this Google partnership isn't going to make up for the churn rate you are going to experience if these problems are not rectified soon.

Re: New Platform is Live

Fri, 12 Sep 2008 18:16:35 EDT

81399672 : filmtvdp...i was having trouble with gmail on my palm for a while but it started working after playing with it. One thing that bugged me highly is anything that is still in gmail folder that didn't get deleted and got transferred will be downloaded by your phone again as it's coming from different service and seeing it as new mail.

--
i am not a lawyer but I do play one on the internet

Re: New Platform is Live

Fri, 12 Sep 2008 16:07:59 EDT

filmtvdp : What a disaster. Please don't insult us by telling us this is an upgrade for us. This is a financial upgrade for DSLExtreme, nothing more.

I have three home computers, five laptops (not all in use, but they will all have to be reconfigured), and four iPhones using DSLExtreme POP mail -- ALL will have to be updated. Plus there are a lot of DSLEx users that just don't like GMail or Google Apps being forced on us.

In order to use the new system, you have to agree to Google's TOS. There is no way to check the spam folder for legit mail unless you do so (you have to log in to the GMail Web portal to check spam and/or to configure IMAP). You can't do that without first agreeing to Google's TOS.

If I bring in an IT consultant to make the forced on me changes, will I be able to bill DSLEx for those charges?

There is also a lot of conflicting information coming from DSLEx. On SSL, the incoming port is normally 995 (I can't get 993 to work), and at the present time, using either mail.gmail.com or smtp.gmail.com does not work either. Using dslextreme.com does work (and yes, I have already logged onto to GMail to enable POP).

If you are having problems getting POP mail on a mobile device, try using dslextreme.com instead of gmail.com in the server settings and turn SSL on (both) using port 995 for incoming and 465 out.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 12 Sep 2008 15:55:06 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by sded :

Automatic archiving doesn't work. I selected the option to archive by DSLX when accessed via POP. They remain in the Webmail Inbox instead until I select and archive manually.

Hi Ed,

I tested and am not able to replicate that. Typically when it is setup it will POP anything after the time that you selected that it be POPed or archived. Are you still seeing an issue?

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 12 Sep 2008 14:35:41 EDT

wb457 :

said by sded :

Automatic archiving doesn't work. I selected the option to archive by DSLX when accessed via POP. They remain in the Webmail Inbox instead until I select and archive manually.

I was having that problem for a while, but for me it now works. I believe I didn't have it set right before or hadn't selected to save settings or something.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 12 Sep 2008 11:48:28 EDT

81399672 : Is pop gmail down? I decided to make a switch and is unable to log in to gmail using my palm phone. Anyone else having this problem? Yes SSL is on.

edit:I am getting this error message unable to connect to pop.gmail.com, please verify your server name entry.

--
i am not a lawyer but I do play one on the internet

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Fri, 12 Sep 2008 09:54:25 EDT

sded : Automatic archiving doesn't work. I selected the option to archive by DSLX when accessed via POP. They remain in the Webmail Inbox instead until I select and archive manually.

Re: SPF Headers In Mail From DSLX/Gmail

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 20:09:08 EDT

shortckt : Three test messages sent from one of my DSLX accounts to another:
1. 9/6/08 received
2. 9/11/08 12:47 am never received
3. 9/11/08 4:53 am never received

Message #3 was CC: back to sending address and a yahoo webmail account. Received at the CC's but not at the TO: recipient.

At the DSLX recipient mailbox there is no spam folder (on the old system) since this address has never received any spam the system never created the folder. So where did messages 2 & 3 go?

Also, on the sending mailbox, none of the folders I created on the old system were migrated over. I had already archived the messages in those folders and I think they were empty.

edit: lost messages were found in Postini junk mail »login.postini.com/
so I suppose I will need to check daily until this switch-over is completed.

Re: "Official" email migration thread (smtp setup question)

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 13:54:33 EDT

Zak_D_H : Whichever you want. I have found that 587 tends to work better in Microsoft Outlook 200-2007 versions better than 465.

Re: "Official" email migration thread (smtp setup question)

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 13:38:09 EDT

tranle : I have received an email (Your Email Account has been Upgraded ...) where it says to use for smtp:
smtp.gmail.com on port 465 with SSL

But on the online instruction under "settings..." on how to setup an IMAP connection, google says to use:
smtp.gmail.com on port 587 with SSL

which one should we use ?

Re: SPF Headers In Mail From DSLX/Gmail

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 11:07:43 EDT

Zak_D_H : You may get bounce-backs when sending from @dslextreme.com to @dslextreme.com because of how we have our duel delivery system setup. For other domains we have already migrated those issues went away when the old mail system was turned off.

In many cases the E-mail will be delivered even with the bounce-back message.

SPF Headers In Mail From DSLX/Gmail

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 03:26:26 EDT

shortckt : I wonder if this is going to be a problem for spam filters going forward?

Sent a message from one of my DSLX accounts via Google webmail to another of my DSLX accounts. Received message header contains:

Delivered-To: x@dslextreme.com
Received: by 10.141.78.9 with SMTP id f9cs61770rvl;
Wed, 10 Sep 2008 23:20:27 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.151.147.16 with SMTP id z16mr3431493ybn.102.1221114026716;
Wed, 10 Sep 2008 23:20:26 -0700 (PDT)
Return-Path:
Received: from mail-gx0-f21.google.com (mail-gx0-f21.google.com [209.85.217.21])
by mx.google.com with ESMTP id 4si10998803yxq.9.2008.09.10.23.20.26;
Wed, 10 Sep 2008 23:20:26 -0700 (PDT)
Received-SPF: fail (google.com: domain of y@dslextreme.com does not designate 209.85.217.21 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.217.21;
Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=hardfail (google.com: domain of y@dslextreme.com does not designate 209.85.217.21 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=y@dslextreme.com
Received: by gxk14 with SMTP id 14so15356069gxk.9
for ; Wed, 10 Sep 2008 23:20:25 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.103.172.7 with SMTP id z7mr1566799muo.40.1221114024847;
Wed, 10 Sep 2008 23:20:24 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.102.247.11 with HTTP; Wed, 10 Sep 2008 23:20:24 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID:
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2008 23:20:24 -0700
From: "y @dslextreme.com"
To: x@dslextreme.com
Subject: test fr google
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_Part_42459_9423102.1221114024850"

------=_Part_42459_9423102.1221114024850
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

test from google.

------=_Part_42459_9423102.1221114024850
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

test from google.

------=_Part_42459_9423102.1221114024850--

edited: Post title.

Re: Google Apps Update

Thu, 11 Sep 2008 00:44:37 EDT

dickmead :

said by dslx_gm :

Dick -

I have done some extensive testing on your main account and was able to replicate the issue. I tested with one of your secondary usernames and was able to connect via IMAP without any issues. It appears there is an issue with your primary username authenticating via IMAP. I will need to escalate the issue with our operations team. I will follow up with you tomorrow. In the meantime you can continue to use webmail or our old servers.

Thanks

It's working now, finally. Thank you.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 21:59:28 EDT

tranle :

said by tranle :

Question for other user that have multiple gmail accounts.
I have a user@dslextreme.com and user@gmail.com and now when I logon to user@gmail.com in the "All Mail" folder, I also see the mails from my user@dslextreme.com account.

It is supposed to happen ?

Oops false alarm, It was my fault. I had moved some of my messages to the wrong folder on the wrong account. (Yes you can do that if you use an IMAP client).

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 21:49:24 EDT

tranle : Question for other user that have multiple gmail accounts.
I have a user@dslextreme.com and user@gmail.com and now when I logon to user@gmail.com in the "All Mail" folder, I also see the mails from my user@dslextreme.com account.

It is supposed to happen ?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 21:14:39 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by MsGeek :

I see that HTTPS is not on by default.

Actually HTTPS is enabled by default. It is a forced global option that we were able to get enabled.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 20:15:46 EDT

MsGeek : All I can say is that this is the first time I've used DSLX Webmail and LIKED IT.

I see that HTTPS is not on by default. Not good. If you are concerned about the cookie hijacking vuln, I suggest everyone using the new GMail-based DSLX webmail should use Firefox to access it and install the Customize Google plugin. You can force all Google services to use HTTPS, not just Gmail.

Still...improved. Impressive. Most impressive.
--
Online since 1987, thinking different since 1995, Linux-friendly since 1997, Broadband since 1999. Where do I want to go today? Wherever I want!

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 18:02:15 EDT

kenneyb : George:

> Good question, I apologize that I missed that in my initial
> explanation.....

Kool then I'll leave the contacts list in Gmail open for now

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 14:34:09 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by sded :

Spam folders appear in new/old webmail and via IMAP. Problem is that they are now empty except for new webmail. The other problem is that there are IMAP folders that do not appear in the new webmail. I still use them via IMAP, and they exist in the old webmail also, So not a client synch problem but a server synch problem. And don't delete my old IMAP folders to make them match!

It is likely that your email that is stored on the old platform has not been migrated yet. Once your mail has been migrated those folders will show up in IMAP list. You would need to reset the list in order for them to appear.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 12:59:13 EDT

sded : Spam folders appear in new/old webmail and via IMAP. Problem is that they are now empty except for new webmail. The other problem is that there are IMAP folders that do not appear in the new webmail. I still use them via IMAP, and they exist in the old webmail also, So not a client synch problem but a server synch problem. And don't delete my old IMAP folders to make them match!

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 12:13:11 EDT

wb457 : Thanks for that explanation, George.

Any thoughts on how to have downloaded mail deleted from the server when using another email client? Thunderbird's settings regarding this haven't been changed.
--
If it ain't broke, pray it never will.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 12:07:03 EDT

dslx_gm : The Google platform relies heavily on messages IDS when downloading mail using a POP client. Because of this if you attempt to send a message to yourself using POP it won't show up. It is one of their know idiosyncrasies.

Email issues was always one of our biggest call drivers to the call center. Though we are anticipating a heavier call volume over the next few weeks we are confident that once the migration is complete that the call volume will drastically decrease as the new platform will be much more reliable.
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 11:58:27 EDT

wb457 : For Thunderbird, »https://www.dslextreme.com/Support/KB/Ar···id=11144 states to use outgoing server port 465 for a DSLX address.

»mail.google.com/support/bin/answ···er=86400 states to use port 25 for a gmail address. When I first configured Gmail for Thunderbird use originally quite a while back, it also had read to use port 465 (which I haven't changed & it still works). Thought that was peculiar.

Also, after doing various tests emailing myself from different email addresses, all work well except when I send an email from my main DSLX account to itself, it doesn't show up in Thunderbird or Mailwasher... BUT it does show up in Webmail. I thought that was strange as well. Also, I can't seem to get mail deleted from the server after it's downloaded from Thunderbird, like I've always had it set before.

On a side note, I can't even remotely imagine the onslaught of tech support calls from the average Joe Schmoe regarding any of this email migration biz. :huh:
--
If it ain't broke, pray it never will.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 11:52:17 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by kenneyb :

Exporting e-mail addresses from old system

Is there a way to export a CSV file of addresses
from the old e-mail system so that you can import
them into the new one? Otherwise it's a tedious
task.

Thanks

Good question, I apologize that I missed that in my initial explanation. We are also in the process of migrating any email contacts that were stored in the old webmail platform. Our operations team indicated that those should be complete by approximately the end of the week as well. Address book entries that you had in the old webmail will therefore automatically be transferred to the new webmail.
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 11:34:37 EDT

Zak_D_H : A post had already been replied to.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 11:32:51 EDT

Zak_D_H :

said by sded :

Can't review SPAM via IMAP anymore. No longer distributed to IMAP SPAM folder. Went to new webmail and enabled IMAP there, but still only shows up in webmail interface.

Have you tried re-synchronizing the folder? If you can see the folder on the website but not in the mail client you typically just need to sync the IMAP folders again. If that doesn't work you can remove the IMAP account from the mail client entirely and set it up again and usually it will catch the E-mail.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 11:25:31 EDT

kenneyb : Exporting e-mail addresses from old system

Is there a way to export a CSV file of addresses
from the old e-mail system so that you can import
them into the new one? Otherwise it's a tedious
task.

Thanks

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 11:25:01 EDT

Zak_D_H :

said by dslx_gm :

You will need to use SSL for both the incoming and outgoing servers. You will also have to update the ports. The outgoing port is 993. The incoming port for IMAP is 465. Also make sure that you are using your username@dslextreme.com for the username.

Thanks

This is a Typo. The Outgoing port is 465 and the incoming port is 993.

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 09:17:35 EDT

sded : Can't review SPAM via IMAP anymore. No longer distributed to IMAP SPAM folder. Went to new webmail and enabled IMAP there, but still only shows up in webmail interface.

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 03:02:04 EDT

81399672 :

said by dslx_gm :

said by 81399672 :

You seem to have either on purpose or by accident skipped my question. I don't usually use webmail, if i don't agree to google term of service, will my email continue to work?

I apologize that I missed your question. Though keeping things in one thread is great sometimes things can get lost in the mix. You will need to accept the terms. I believe that technically your POP email account will continue to work and accept messages though.

Thx for the info.

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:54:20 EDT

jadinolf :

said by dslx_gm :

We don't have specific setup instructions for SeaMonkey. The setup instructions for Windows Mail will have all of the pertinent information in it though. You can find the IMAP ones at: »https://www.dslextreme.com/Support/KB/Ar···id=11146

You will need to use SSL for both the incoming and outgoing servers. You will also have to update the ports. The outgoing port is 993. The incoming port for IMAP is 465. Also make sure that you are using your username@dslextreme.com for the username.

Thanks
OK, George, SSL did it. I wish I had been told before. That's why you get the big bucks. :)

I don't see any provision for IMAP but not a problem.
Next see if you can get Google to relax the SPAM filter.

Thanks for everything.

Now--four computers to go.:)

--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:40:28 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by 81399672 :

You seem to have either on purpose or by accident skipped my question. I don't usually use webmail, if i don't agree to google term of service, will my email continue to work?

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:36:55 EDT

altidude :

said by dslx_gm :

said by OZO :

I need a way to completely block the filtering. Please, let me do it!

Though I have found the spam filtering to be very accurate, if you are concerned with a legit message being caught by the filter, I too would recommend using IMAP.

I've been using gmail for quite some time just for the excellent spam filtering. Even before DSLX made this change I was pulling down my email from DSLX into a gmail account via POP3 just to filter out the spam. I do the same for my main email address, a domain that I own. I would pick up my mail from the gmail account via POP3 on my desktop PC.

The gmail spam filtering is so accurate that I don't even bother checking the spam folder at gmail anymore. I don't know how Google does it but they have the best spam filter in the business, IMO. I don't remember the last time I had a false positive.

My main email address has been around for a long time. I get at least 2,000 spam messages every month at that address. The gmail filter just takes care of it, no problem. I think most DSLX users will be happy with this change given time.

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:36:28 EDT

81399672 : You seem to have either on purpose or by accident skipped my question. I don't usually use webmail, if i don't agree to google term of service, will my email continue to work?
--
i am not a lawyer but I do play one on the internet

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:27:17 EDT

dslx_gm : We don't have specific setup instructions for SeaMonkey. The setup instructions for Windows Mail will have all of the pertinent information in it though. You can find the IMAP ones at: »https://www.dslextreme.com/Support/KB/Ar···id=11146

You will need to use SSL for both the incoming and outgoing servers. You will also have to update the ports. The outgoing port is 465. The incoming port for IMAP is 993. Also make sure that you are using your username@dslextreme.com for the username.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:03:51 EDT

jadinolf : George, I am using SeaMonkey for mail. I am using the proper user name and smtp.gmail.com I don't know if SSL is required. Wasn't told.

I would love a link to the step by step instructions. What I found was the old info.
--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 02:01:01 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by OZO :

I need a way to completely block the filtering. Please, let me do it!

As mentioned above the spam and virus filters are enabled by default. There is not an option to disable those.

Though I have found the spam filtering to be very accurate, if you are concerned with a legit message being caught by the filter, I too would recommend using IMAP. In webmail there is also an option to mark a message as spam or not spam. If you get a false positive I would recommend marking it as not spam in the webmail interface.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 01:55:16 EDT

dslx_gm : jadinolf -

What email client are you using? Did you follow the instructions inside the Knowledge base? What error are you getting? Did you set your username to your username@dslextreme.com?

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: Google Apps Update

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 01:41:55 EDT

dslx_gm : Dick -

I have done some extensive testing on your main account and was able to replicate the issue. I tested with one of your secondary usernames and was able to connect via IMAP without any issues. It appears there is an issue with your primary username authenticating via IMAP. I will need to escalate the issue with our operations team. I will follow up with you tomorrow. In the meantime you can continue to use webmail or our old servers.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: Google Apps Update

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 00:42:48 EDT

dickmead : All IMAP. Messages on the web mail inbox are still there.

I try to set up the Apple Mail mailbox, when I give it the login info
username@dslextreme.com and the password, it attempts to login,
but fails. Yes, I am using the right name and password, just as used to login to the web mail.

Yes, I am using imap.gmail.com and smtp.gmail.com and the steps as outined in the frugal help.

The mere fact I have to do anything at all is unacceptable. DSLX should have made all changes transparently to the user.

Re: New Platform is Live

Wed, 10 Sep 2008 00:30:48 EDT

jadinolf :

said by TE :

I'd like to suggest using IMAP with your mail client. With IMAP all your folders including the SPAM folder will be shown in your local email client. This would eliminate the need to check the web interface for messages in the SPAM folder.

I wish that someone would tell those of us who are technically challenged how to make this thing work.

Like what IMAP is and how to use it? Sure wish we didn't have to use that web mail. Looks like more trouble than it's worth.

Still waiting for tech support to call and it's 9:30 P.M. I'll stay up all night if necessary.

I called again and the email configuration will not work for me. I am back on line with an estimated wait time of 30 minutes.
--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:57:49 EDT

81399672 : I clicked on take me to new google email and before i could get to that it asked me to agree to google privacy statement. So here is my question, what will happen if i refuse to agree to google privacy statement, will my email stop being delivered till i do agree?
--
i am not a lawyer but I do play one on the internet

Re: New Platform is Live

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:47:17 EDT

TE : I'd like to suggest using IMAP with your mail client. With IMAP all your folders including the SPAM folder will be shown in your local email client. This would eliminate the need to check the web interface for messages in the SPAM folder.

Re: New Platform is Live

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:42:11 EDT

jadinolf :

said by OZO :

said by jadinolf :

said by jadinolf :
Spam and Virus filtering is on by default and can not be disabled.

I'll be darned, if the SPAM filter is that bad, I'll have to check webmail several times a day to move the "SPAM" to my regular email.

Wow! Checking daily "SPAM" folder is not an option for me!!!

I need a way to completely block the filtering. Please, let me do it!

I agree.

PLUS, I called tech support for "step by step instructions" :D on my email setup and we changed my info to gmail and neither send nor receive worked. Fellow said he would call me back when he figures it out.
--
This post printed on 100% recycled bytes

Re: New Platform is Live

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:35:36 EDT

OZO :

said by jadinolf :

said by jadinolf :
Spam and Virus filtering is on by default and can not be disabled.

I'll be darned, if the SPAM filter is that bad, I'll have to check webmail several times a day to move the "SPAM" to my regular email.

Wow! Checking daily "SPAM" folder is not an option for me!!!

I need a way to completely block the filtering. Please, let me do it!
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: Google Apps Update

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:27:45 EDT

TE : Are you using POP3 on any system? If so, if you haven't told it to 'keep a copy on the server' you will not have any message on the server that has already been downloaded using POP3.

Your passwords should be the same unless it doesn't meet Google requirements. Someone correct me if I'm wrong... Min length - 8 chars...

Re: Google Apps Update

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:11:11 EDT

dickmead : Well maybe so, and maybe not.
I used the web mail interface and see items in the inbox. Using Apple Mail (Leopard) I see nothing when I use either the old dslx or the new gmail servers.
I enabled imap under my dslx usename on gmail.

Now do I use my old dslx passwords, or my current gmail passwords.
They were obviously different.
The mailbox nicely goes offline. Not too useful.

If I hear I have to delete and recreate accounts, I won't be happy.

Re: Google Apps Update

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:04:01 EDT

TE : Shouldn't be a problem as your domain will stay the same.

you'll have something@gmail.com and something@dslextreme.com.

Re: Google Apps Update

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:01:10 EDT

dickmead : I already have existing gmail accounts with the same usename as 2 of my dslx accounts. Has your move just given me a headache?

How do I address this little issue?

Re: New Platform is Live

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:37:08 EDT

jadinolf :

said by dslx_gm :

said by jadinolf :

I thought that this would also affect our "regular" email (pop/smtp)

Am I wrong?

Well, I switched over a found email in my SPAM folder which is not SPAM. I do not get SPAM at this address. Can the filter be turned off? Didn't find a place. Thanks.

In order to connect to the new servers you will need to update your connection settings in your email client. Our knowledge articles have been updated with the new settings. You can view them by going to the following link and selecting your email client type.

»https://www.dslextreme.com/Support/KB/Ca···d=1N5M1V

Spam and Virus filtering is on by default and can not be disabled.

I'll be darned, if the SPAM filter is that bad, I'll have to check webmail several times a day to move the "SPAM" to my regular email.

I've had gmail for 4 years and the SPAM filter there works great. They can't be the same.

Thanks for the link. I will update my mail settings.
--
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Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:27:36 EDT

dslx_gm :

said by knightdark0 :

Why can't I find the folders I previously created on the web mail? The new platform only has the regular folders such as inbox, sent, etc. The folders and the emails I put in them got lost.

Could someone help take a look?

Although mail is active for all clients on the new platform, the process to migrate the old mail has not yet been completed. Since we are migrating messages from thousands of users with thousands of messages in them to the new platform this process can take a while. To date we have migrated approximately 1/3 of the physical email to the new platform. That process will continue in the background over approximately the next week until it completes. Your old folders and messages will show up as labels once your box has been migrated. If you need to check a message that is stored on legacy servers you still have the option to login to those until the migration is complete.

In glancing at some of the migration data I saw a client with over 127,000 stored on our server. Those obviously can take some time to move over. :)
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: New Platform is Live

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:22:02 EDT

dslx_gm :

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 22:00:31 EDT

knightdark0 : Why can't I find the folders I previously created on the web mail? The new platform only has the regular folders such as inbox, sent, etc. The folders and the emails I put in them got lost.

Could someone help take a look?

Re: New Platform is Live

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 21:25:14 EDT

jadinolf : George, I'm confused. I thought that this would also affect our "regular" email (pop/smtp)

Am I wrong?

Well, I switched over a found email in my SPAM folder which is not SPAM. I do not get SPAM at this address. Can the filter be turned off? Didn't find a place. Thanks.
--
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New Platform is Live

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 19:35:48 EDT

dslx_gm : I am excited to announce that we have pushed the new platform live! When you login to webmail you will now have the option to use the new interface.

Additionally we have updated our setup instructions in our Knowledge base with the new information. You can find the setup instructions off of our Google Help Center.

You can feel free to start using the new platform and update your settings if you use an email client. We are still migrating users email over to the new platform. Once your physical email has been migrated you will receive an email advising you of this. You are welcome to start using the new platform in the time being as all new mail is being delivered to both platforms.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 01:06:02 EDT

dslx_gm : We have pushed forward with migrating the second batch of email into the system. Though we anticipated launching today, we opted to move forward with getting another batch of clients physical mail loaded into the new platform prior to announcing. Depending on how quickly that batch is migrated we will move forward with launching. Once the new webmail is launched on our site, setup instructions will also be available on the website. I will let you know as things progress.

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Tue, 09 Sep 2008 00:50:04 EDT

t1292 : When are we going to get the setup instructions?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 20:23:36 EDT

jadinolf :

said by TE :

Lost? you couldn't select the box and click 'deliver'?

Yes, I did. It turns out they were not lost, they just took a long time to get to me.

We got Postini dumped on us with absolutely no explanation. I had never even heard of it. Who assumed instant knowledge? What's going to happen to people who don't even know this forum exists.

Anyway, those 14 emails were not SPAM. To solve that problem, I turned off the SPAM filter.

What's next?
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Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 19:50:33 EDT

TE : Lost? you couldn't select the box and click 'deliver'?

Re: "Official" email migration thread

Mon, 08 Sep 2008 02:58:56 EDT

jadinolf : My gracious, I went to Postini and found 14 emails going back to 9/4.

Well, they are lost now. :(

Any reason for that?

When do we get the instructions for setting up our email?
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Re: "Official" email migration thread

Sun, 07 Sep 2008 23:07:45 EDT

giantsfan : Looks like the filters only caught spam at my email address. The Positini quarantine center only has entries starting from Friday, though, and none from Thursday. It also had fewer messages than I would have expected but that could just be due to normal fluctuations in spam level.

Re: Google Apps Update

Sun, 07 Sep 2008 18:47:58 EDT

TE : Thanks George and Thank you Sashwa.

George, I just tried to check my four DSLX E-mail accounts at »login.postini.com/ and was only able to login to one. Looks like I'll have to wait to receive more mail before I can login to check the three.

Anyway, I wanted to report that it is catching legit messages. Specifically, one from a family friend who is @roadrunner.com. I'm going to use the 'Junk Email Settings' link and disable Postini filtering. If this was going to be long term, I'd configure the white list or adjust the filtering options but from your post I think it's only for the short term.

Edit: Make that two legit messages. The other one from @Cox.net

Google Apps Update

Sun, 07 Sep 2008 18:24:24 EDT

dslx_gm : Thanks for helping keep everything organized sashwa . I am sure I speak for all of the members of the forum when I say that your involvement is greatly appreciated.

Though I have mentioned it in some of the other threads, I will provide a quick up here as well for everyone’s benefit. Mid last week we started the dual deliver process. Dual deliver works by delivering messages to both the new platform and the legacy platform. This is done to ensure that clients have time to update their settings on their mail clients and make the transition for an end user relatively seamless. Shortly after the change we saw a rise in the queues for our legacy platform. This was due to the new platform forwarding all mail to the legacy platform. Since the mail was now all coming from the same source IP (the new platform) the high level spam filtering on the legacy platform which filtered mail on a global level now could not be utilized. The legacy platform had to therefore process and deliver a much higher amount email. This caused the queues to rise and caused a delay in some messages from being quickly processed and delivered on Wednesday. Although the platform functioned properly, in order to take advantage of the dual delivery process we needed to make some adjustment in the process. As I explained above, dual delivery is necessary as it allows mail to be delivered to both platforms and doesn't require everyone to change their settings at one time. Spreading out the migration by utilizing dual delivery makes the transition process easier. In order to implement the proper changes, on Wednesday afternoon we re-pointed new mail directly back to the legacy platform.

After much testing Wednesday we enabled Postini spam filtering for DSL Extreme email accounts on Thursday. IKANO is one of Postini’s largest clients and has a great deal of experience with Postini who subsequently is now part of Google and is used in conjunction with the Google Apps platform. The mail was pointed from Postini directly to our mail servers which allowed us to monitor the load on the legacy servers. The Postini filtering performed extremely well and helped significantly reduce the load on our system.

On Friday we then turned dual delivery back on and began routing messages through the new platform. Since Friday morning, mail as been routing through the new platform which has perform extremely well. We then started the migration process to transfer clients mail from the old platform to the new platform on Friday afternoon. As of this afternoon we are about 1/3 through the migration.

On Monday we anticipate starting to announce the new platform to clients whose mail has been migrated. We will also put live the option to login to the new webmail platform for all clients. At that time all clients can update their settings and start using the new platform. If your mail has not been migrated up to that point, it would be migrated within the next week or so depending on how long the migration takes.

Thus far everything has gone extremely well for a large migration such as this. Kudos for our operations team and the Google team for working hard to make everything extremely smooth! We look forward to putting the new platform fully live tomorrow and having all of our clients move to it in the upcoming weeks.

I mentioned above that we will be temporally using the Postini filtering platform to help overcome the limitation with the legacy servers. Although the filters have proven to be extremely reliable and I haven’t seen any false positives, if a client would like to login to check their filtered messages they can do so by going to »login.postini.com. From there you will login with your username@dslextreme.com. Please note that three valid (non spam) messages must be received by an account before you can login to Postini. As I mentioned this is a temporary solution that will be used while dual delivery is turned on. Since Google Apps has the spam filtering in conjunction with Postini built into the interface that works extremely well, that extra step will be disabled once dual delivery and the old platform has been turned down.

Thanks for your continued support!

Thanks
--
George
General Manager
DSL Extreme
Will work for reviews. ;)

"Official" email migration thread

Sun, 07 Sep 2008 14:24:38 EDT

sashwa : Seeing that we are beginning to see problems with the new email system, I thought it would be a good idea to have 1 thread for any migration problems. Hopefully this will help George and Zak keep track of the different problems happening so they can be corrected.

Feel free to post your problem here. If you are having a problem unrelated to email, start your own topic/thread about your problem.

If you have already posted about your email problem, there is no need to re-post about it in this thread as George and Zak are already aware of those particular problems.
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TH ~ NE ~ EPN ~ NC ~ TD