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NetAdmin
CCNA

join:2008-05-22

$700 billion could also...

1. Repair or replace a good portion, if not most, of the structurally deficient bridges and roadways in the US

2. Help halt and reverse coastal erosion and wetlands loss in states like Louisiana, Florida, Georgia, the Carolinas and other areas.

3. Could build Category 5 hurricane protection in areas line Southeast and Southwestern Louisiana, Florida, Texas and other vulnerable areas.

4. It would be MORE than enough to overhaul the deplorable state of health care and mental health services that Veterans and former armed services members get by overhauling the VA and modernizing the facilities.

The list goes on.
--
---
Drilling for more oil is akin to giving a methhead the keys to the meth lab.

dcurrey
Premium
join:2004-06-29

Re: $700 billion could also...

Amazing how the government can't fix roads properly fund schools. Yet suddenly we got plenty of money to give away so they can go on and do it again now knowing the government will bail them out. What a crock. What an example to set.

Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA

Re: $700 billion could also...

But alas, they DON'T have the money. They have to borrow it and pay interest, blowing our already out of control deficit into the stratosphere.

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by Dogfather See Profile :

But alas, they DON'T have the money. They have to borrow it and pay interest, blowing our already out of control deficit into the stratosphere.
The government will do what all governments do when they can no longer borrow money.

They will simply print it.
--
"At the moment of conception."
jc100

join:2002-04-10

Re: $700 billion could also...

While devalues the Dollar on the World market, causing massive inflation. Hence the HUGE increases in food prices, oil, and all facets of life in the past 8 years. Bush added 6 trillion to the deficit. It's like the dilemma we're in now. People borrow and don't want to pay back. Doing so means you got bad credit. The U.S. is in so much debt to the world, thanks to Regan, Bush Sr, and Bush Jr, our dollar is a laughing stock about now.
RayW
Premium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
clubs:
·XMission

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by jc100 See Profile :

While devalues the Dollar on the World market, causing massive inflation. Hence the HUGE increases in food prices, oil, and all facets of life in the past 8 years. Bush added 6 trillion to the deficit. It's like the dilemma we're in now. People borrow and don't want to pay back. Doing so means you got bad credit. The U.S. is in so much debt to the world, thanks to Regan, Bush Sr, and Bush Jr, our dollar is a laughing stock about now.
Yeah, and the Democratic controlled house and senate are pushing hard to spend even more to bail their buddies out. Can't win for losing when you are where we are.

The Dems will push the bill through, which has more pork in it now than a pig farm to bribe all the bodies in the house and senate who are up for election, and Bush will eagerly sign it to say that he did something when in reality the problem could have and should have been solved by the legislative branch a couple of years ago. But, hind sight is 20/20, and politicians have rose colored glasses on that have built in holographic projectors so they can ignore reality.
--
I am not lost, I find myself every time.
jc100

join:2002-04-10

Re: $700 billion could also...

Democrats tax to pay their way. Republicans Borrow. Taxing pays as you go, but as all politicians do, waste waste waste. Borrowing hurts worse though. It devalues the dollar and raises prices. As anyone can tell you, higher prices are something that stick around. People and companies are not apt to lower things, even if the dollar gets better. Therefore, the Republicans sink us into far worse situations. Not to mention, BLS.Gov shows any time a Republican is in Office, Unemployment SKYROCKETS and the Deficit does too. Don't get me wrong, Democrats suck equally as bad at blowing our money. It's just in such a way it doesn't screw up stuff on a global scale.
RayW
Premium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
clubs:
·XMission

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by jc100 See Profile :

Democrats tax to pay their way. Republicans Borrow. Taxing pays as you go, but as all politicians do, waste waste waste. Borrowing hurts worse though. It devalues the dollar and raises prices. As anyone can tell you, higher prices are something that stick around. People and companies are not apt to lower things, even if the dollar gets better. Therefore, the Republicans sink us into far worse situations. Not to mention, BLS.Gov shows any time a Republican is in Office, Unemployment SKYROCKETS and the Deficit does too. Don't get me wrong, Democrats suck equally as bad at blowing our money. It's just in such a way it doesn't screw up stuff on a global scale.
Or in other words, both parties wind up raising taxes and putting us deeper in debt. Just the order changes and the method used to get there.

What a choice coming up, a 1/4 slaver, 1/2 white boy, 1/4 foreigner who claims to be what he is not and has done nothing on his own and an old crony type who has done a lot, but nothing that people I know in Arizona who think like I do like.

Wish we had None Of The Above on the ballot. That would be my choice since the rest of the pack looks like a bunch of fruitcakes to me and Biden I did not care for when I lived in Texas (Obama is NOT for change picking him!). The only one I do not know about is Palin, and she either walks on water or makes Obama and McCain look good. Kind of hard to tell since the reporting is so partisan twisted and it seems she has cramped her style spouting McCain's party line.
--
I am not lost, I find myself every time.
jc100

join:2002-04-10

Re: $700 billion could also...

Well Palin scares the CRAP out of me. I won't vote for her for all the tea in china. I wish we had OTHER choices between the 2 we got. Being we got 2 choices, I can't give McCain / Palin my vote. I don't much care for Obama and I think Biden is a waste. Being that's basically the rundown, I guess for me it'll be Obama. No 3rd party has won in 120 years. It just doesn't pay to vote for one. Then again, as long as Americans are LAZY and consider the first tues in november (30 percent anyway) their civic duty, it doesn't matter who wins. We are such a lazy bunch of people, that once these idiots get elected, we don't hold them accountable for nothing. Then when things get bad, we whine and go about the same routing every 1-4 years. You'd think we'd learn. We don't.

As for Palin:

Troopergate

Belief that Sex Education is Wrong (prob why her daughter pregnant)

Wanting to fire librarians for REFUSING to ban books while mayor.

Worst of all, while mayor of Wasilla, she enforced a lay that charged women 1000 dollars for rape kits.

She's unconscionable. I hate the other 3 on the list, but she disgusts me.

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast


1 edit

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by jc100 See Profile :

Troopergate
So you think cops who taser 10 year old kids, are drunk on the job and make death threats against people should not be fired? Gov. Palin's only fault here was that she didn't have this cop jailed.

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Pub···h_threat
said by jc100 See Profile :

Belief that Sex Education is Wrong (prob why her daughter pregnant)
And you know for a fact that her daughter didn't use any form of birth control? No form of birth control, short of spaying or neutering, is 100% effective. The fact remains that had she abstained, she'd not be pregnant. That proves that abstinence works.

Besides, the state of Alaska clearly shows that some schools do require sex education which discusses birth control other than abstinence.

»74.125.45.104/search?q=cache:mOz···=3&gl=us
said by jc100 See Profile :

Wanting to fire librarians for REFUSING to ban books while mayor.
Except that it didn't happen. The librarian quit. Big difference. Besides, local libraries are funded by local taxpayers, why is it wrong for the elected officials to present the will of the people when it comes to stocking certain books at a local library? And what's this nonsense about "banning" books. How can anyone ban a book? If your library doesn't stock a book, there's nothing stopping you from going to a bookstore to get it or ordering it online, which you can do at a library, using their computers.

»www.fightthepalinsmears.com/smea···brarian/
said by jc100 See Profile :

Worst of all, while mayor of Wasilla, she enforced a lay that charged women 1000 dollars for rape kits.
Wrong again. The town of Wasilla, like many local governments, attempted to bill the insurance companies of rape victims for the cost of these kits.

»campaignspot.nationalreview.com/···ZGEwZDk=
--
"At the moment of conception."
Kommie

join:2003-05-13
East Haven, CT

said by jc100 See Profile :

Well Palin scares the CRAP out of me. I won't vote for her for all the tea in china. I wish we had OTHER choices between the 2 we got. Being we got 2 choices, I can't give McCain / Palin my vote. I don't much care for Obama and I think Biden is a waste. Being that's basically the rundown, I guess for me it'll be Obama. No 3rd party has won in 120 years. It just doesn't pay to vote for one.
Well maybe its about time you started voting third party. With cynysim like yours and the propaganda that a third party vote is a wasted vote its no wonder we have a shitty system. If everyone in America who dislikes the bailout votes for the third party we might have real change.

But then again not like our vote matters anyway.
Gogo1

join:2004-05-27
Brooklyn, NY

said by jc100 See Profile :

BLS.Gov shows any time a Republican is in Office, Unemployment SKYROCKETS and the Deficit does too. Don't get me wrong, Democrats suck equally as bad at blowing our money. It's just in such a way it doesn't screw up stuff on a global scale.
I think the problem is that the interests of politicians do not align with the interests of the populations/countries as a whole.

The interest of a politician is to get elected in X years time. The interest of a country is to be stable and prosperous over the long term. What a politician needs to do in government to achieve the former, often conflicts with what he needs to do to achieve the later. I wonder which goal these aholes choose.
jc100

join:2002-04-10

Re: $700 billion could also...

Interest for them is how long they can stay in office by feeding us enough lies to get elected. All while doing so, they align themselves with special interest groups who them rape this country blind. Got to love our politics. Crooked as shit, and Americans tolerate it.
Gogo1

join:2004-05-27
Brooklyn, NY

Re: $700 billion could also...

Heh. Its no different in my country.

CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County
I believe the Senate is Republican controlled and they are the ones who wanted the bill redone with tax breaks.
RayW
Premium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
clubs:
·XMission

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by CylonRed See Profile :

I believe the Senate is Republican controlled and they are the ones who wanted the bill redone with tax breaks.
Although Dick Chaney is the Senate President, in reality he is only a tie break vote. The President Pro Tempore (the longest serving senator in the majority party) is the one who handles the day to day work of the Senate.

Majority Leader
Harry Reid
Democrat

President Pro Tempore
Robert C. Byrd
Democrat

Assistant Majority Leader
(Democratic Whip)
Richard Durbin
Democrat

Minority Leader
Mitch McConnell
Republican
--
I am not lost, I find myself every time.

CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County


1 edit

Re: $700 billion could also...

Yet it is the Republicans who pretty much voted down the last bill and there was not enough Democrats in the Senate to override. If the Democrats were truly in power the bill would have passed. The Republican's have pretty much forced the tax breaks thru that the Democrats have generally been against. The Republican's in the Senate forced the House to include measures they did not want in the bill. Hardly the Democrats pulling their power against the President or over the Republican's.

If the Democrats pulled all of the strings - the tax breaks would not be in and the last bill would have passed.

The Republican party in all of the things I have seen - took the accolades with defeating the last bailout package.

EDIT - opps - I see I had my the House and senate mixed up - thinking the Senate defeated the first and second legislation when it was the House...

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

Re: $700 billion could also...

Total BS. The Democrat party has majorities in both houses of Congress. If it wanted to, it could vote for the Wall Street welfare queen plan without a single vote from the GOP.
--
"At the moment of conception."
Skippy25

join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO
You do realize a vast majority of this problem is the result of the Clinton administration, right?

John Galt
Forward, March
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
I wonder how much we could get for Taiwan...??
--
A is A

pog
Premium
join:2004-06-03
Kihei, HI
·Hawaiian Telcom

said by pnh102 See Profile :

The government will do what all governments do when they can no longer borrow money.

They will simply print it.
At the staggering numbers we're talking about, how far away is hyperinflation? What are good hedges?

For those that don't know...
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation
The main cause of hyperinflation is a massive and rapid increase in the amount of money, which is not supported by growth in the output of goods and services.

--
My Site

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

Re: $700 billion could also...

Oh, I know it will be horrible in terms of inflation. I was just making it clear that the government will be printing the money as opposed to borrowing it or redistributing tax revenue.
--
"At the moment of conception."

cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN

said by Dogfather See Profile :

But alas, they DON'T have the money. They have to borrow it and pay interest, blowing our already out of control deficit into the stratosphere.
AH, what's to worry about. My kids and their eventual kids should be able to pay it off...

P Ness
You'Ve Forgotten 9-11 Already
Premium
join:2001-08-29
Mineola, NY
clubs:

said by NetAdmin See Profile :

1. Repair or replace a good portion, if not most, of the structurally deficient bridges and roadways in the US

2. Help halt and reverse coastal erosion and wetlands loss in states like Louisiana, Florida, Georgia, the Carolinas and other areas.

3. Could build Category 5 hurricane protection in areas line Southeast and Southwestern Louisiana, Florida, Texas and other vulnerable areas.

4. It would be MORE than enough to overhaul the deplorable state of health care and mental health services that Veterans and former armed services members get by overhauling the VA and modernizing the facilities.

The list goes on.
1. blah, should not even cost that much
2. worthless.
3. worthless. no one is paying to protect my house why should i pay to protect yours?
4. blah so much corruption and wasted money..there is already enough in military spending to do this.

NetAdmin
CCNA

join:2008-05-22

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by P Ness See Profile :

1. blah, should not even cost that much
There's a lot more out there than you think.

2. worthless.
3. worthless. no one is paying to protect my house why should i pay to protect yours?
Actually, in both cases, the federal government's policies to oil leases and lax environmental regulations regarding wetlands during the oil boom is WHY the problem exists. The federal government should fix something they created.
--
---
Drilling for more oil is akin to giving a methhead the keys to the meth lab.

Boogeyman
Drive it like you stole it
Premium
join:2002-12-17
Huntsville, AL

Re: $700 billion could also...

Soil erosion is caused by wind and water movement taking away small bits of soil with it. So unless you think that the federal government is God, Allah, Jehovah, FSM, Buddha, Xenu, etc, then no, its not the governments fault.

The noly way I know of for humans to contribute to soil erosion is to remove all plant life from the soil that helps hold the soil in place. And yes, we have done plenty of that. But its not big oil doing it, its big agriculture, big mining, and other industries that tear up large chunks of land. Though I believe the mining companies are now required to fix the mess they make.
--
Im Your Boogeyman, Thats What I Am

NOCMan
Verizon Fios User
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Flower Mound, TX

Re: $700 billion could also...

I'm offended, you forgot the flying spaghetti monster!

Boogeyman
Drive it like you stole it
Premium
join:2002-12-17
Huntsville, AL

Re: $700 billion could also...

FSM = Flying Spaghetti Monster

I would never risk offending His Noodliness.
--
Im Your Boogeyman, Thats What I Am
jc100

join:2002-04-10

Re: $700 billion could also...

All hail the FSM. His Noodly Appendages grace us all.

NetAdmin
CCNA

join:2008-05-22

said by Boogeyman See Profile :

Soil erosion is caused by wind and water movement taking away small bits of soil with it.
Soil erosion, like that caused by rivers and streams, is a far different animal from coastal erosion.

The noly way I know of for humans to contribute to soil erosion is to remove all plant life from the soil that helps hold the soil in place. And yes, we have done plenty of that. But its not big oil doing it, its big agriculture, big mining, and other industries that tear up large chunks of land. Though I believe the mining companies are now required to fix the mess they make.
Look into the coastal swamps and marshes in areas of Texas and southern Louisiana. During the late sixties, seventies and throughout the eighties, oil exploration firms ripped the marshlands to shreds by dredging canals, which permitted salt water intrusion that killed the marshlands. The Corps of Engineers built levees along the Mississippi the Mississippi, which also contributes to coastal erosion in Southern Louisiana. The intracoastal waterway, in other areas, is also causing its own share of problems.
--
---
Drilling for more oil is akin to giving a methhead the keys to the meth lab.

Boogeyman
Drive it like you stole it
Premium
join:2002-12-17
Huntsville, AL

Re: $700 billion could also...

I just moved from Panama City, FL, and let me tell you, it takes less than 6 months for the underbrush and weeds to grow back high enough that you would know it was ever gone.

But yeah, they probably did do that a lot in the 80's, but that was 20 years ago. A lot of stuff has been growing since then. Or someone just built a walmart/condo/housing comunity there.

"Coastal Erosion" is caused by waves removing sand from beaches. PC spent over $3m to have sand dredged out of the Gulf and put back on the beach right before Ivan hit.
--
Im Your Boogeyman, Thats What I Am

NetAdmin
CCNA

join:2008-05-22

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by Boogeyman See Profile :

I just moved from Panama City, FL, and let me tell you, it takes less than 6 months for the underbrush and weeds to grow back high enough that you would know it was ever g one.

But yeah, they probably did do that a lot in the 80's, but that was 20 years ago. A lot of stuff has been growing since then.
Wetlands and coastal swamps are different ecosystems from a beach, so what works on a beach doesn't work in wetlands or coastal swamps.

And no, it has not gotten better. Saltwater intrusion is a process that accelerates. And in 20 years, the problem has gotten worse in the wetlands, putting more and more homes and industry at risk.

"Coastal Erosion" is caused by waves removing sand from beaches. PC spent over $3m to have sand dredged out of the Gulf and put back on the beach right before Ivan hit.
Coastal refers to much more than waves removing just sand from a beach and is not always repaired with the simple task of pumping sand in.

Like I said, research the topic.
--
---
Drilling for more oil is akin to giving a methhead the keys to the meth lab.

doc69
Premium
join:2004-08-01
·Insight Communicat..
·Comcast

said by NetAdmin See Profile :

said by P Ness See Profile :

1. blah, should not even cost that much
There's a lot more out there than you think.

2. worthless.
3. worthless. no one is paying to protect my house why should i pay to protect yours?
Actually, in both cases, the federal government's policies to oil leases and lax environmental regulations regarding wetlands during the oil boom is WHY the problem exists. The federal government should fix something they created.

If the government created something it was an accident. If they destroyed something it was on purpose.

sansri88
Go digtal you analog laggards
Premium
join:2005-12-17
New York, NY
clubs:
·Comcast

You aren't a civil engineer, are you.

My dad is one. He's worked in the NYC area for 20+ years in the industry.

Many bridges are in terrible shape, and to fix them would require replacement, not rehab. Just look at the deficient Tappan Zee Bridge. $6 billion just to replace the bridge.

The costs are staggering, and are not as cheap as you may think they are.
--
Sriram Satish
Comcast of NJ II sucks. Period.
25 HD channels compared to the average 32 or so.
Skippy25

join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO
1.) I would support that.
2.) Its nature, leave it alone.
3.) See #2. Same with morons that live in flood plains.
4.) For veterans and seniors only. The rest get what they or their parents earn for them.

NetAdmin
CCNA

join:2008-05-22


3 edits

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by Skippy25 See Profile :

2.) Its nature, leave it alone.
It may be nature, but it is a man-made problem that was created by irresponsibility. Man-made problems should be cleaned up and fixed.

-- edit --

Just realized that I should be more specific, as I'm talking about wetlands loss/erosion, not natural BEACH erosion.

-- /edit --

As for those "morons" who live on flood plains, those flood plains are the gateway to the regions largest energy reserves. If those "morons" didn't live there, you wouldn't have access to that energy. Nor would you have access to the materials and supplies that flow through the ports and waterways. Flood plains are also where the best soil for growing (used) to exist, so without those "morons", you wouldn't have affordable food.
--
---
Drilling for more oil is akin to giving a methhead the keys to the meth lab.
Skippy25

join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

Re: $700 billion could also...

Any erosion period is natural. It is the way the world works and has worked for millions of years before we were here. Leave it alone and let it take it's course. WE can work/live around it without it having to cost billions of dollars to support everytime a perfectly natural thing happens.

You obviously missed the point of my post. People utilizing flood plains is one thing. Grow crops and do what ever to utilize the resource. But people living there and/or government building levies so people and businesses can build there are just plain stupid and they should pay the price everytime they are flooded. Not us tax payers.

You want to live in an area that has hurricanes or a "bowl" of land that the Mississippi can easily flow into, then feel free. But you do it at your expense and when it is destroyed YOU rebuild it without my tax money.

NetAdmin
CCNA

join:2008-05-22

Re: $700 billion could also...

said by Skippy25 See Profile :

Any erosion period is natural. It is the way the world works and has worked for millions of years before we were here. Leave it alone and let it take it's course. WE can work/live around it without it having to cost billions of dollars to support everytime a perfectly natural thing happens.
And I will rebut this claim again... The wetlands erosion along the Texas, Louisiana and other coastal regions is a man-made problem. It is anything BUT natural. Like I told the other poster, research wetlands loss and get the facts before you claim it is a natural problem and shouldn't be fixed.

You want to live in an area that has hurricanes or a "bowl" of land that the Mississippi can easily flow into, then feel free. But you do it at your expense and when it is destroyed YOU rebuild it without my tax money.
Considering the amount of tax revenue from those areas, which are major ports and huge energy producing areas, which the federal government has made billions in tax money from, the government should funnel some of that tax money back to those areas.

Non-oil producing states, like Missouri, are benefiting from the oil and gas revenues the federal government collects from states like Teaxs, Louisiana and other coastal states. Perhaps the money from those oil and gas revenues should stop flowing to any state that doesn't produce.
--
---
Drilling for more oil is akin to giving a methhead the keys to the meth lab.
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