Re: This is only the start... in http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r21281527 en Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:14:23 EDT Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:14:23 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21284745 NormanS :
said by Kearnstd See Profile :

For the Children is the most abused method of getting new abuses of...
"For the Children"... I believe one family law attorney as labeled accusations of child sex abuse in divorce proceedings as the "atom bomb of family law".

I am mindful of several latter day witch hunts, including the McMartin Pre-School case in Manhattan Beach, California, the Wenatchee, Washington child abuse scare, and the Satanic Ritual Scare in Kern County, California.

Fighting child abuse is politically safe; being accused of it is the Kiss of Death.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21284745 Fri, 17 Oct 2008 17:09:09 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21284694 NormanS : Finally; somebody who actually has a clue!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21284694 Fri, 17 Oct 2008 17:00:00 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21284547 Airwolf7 :
said by NormanS See Profile :

Does anybody tossing the term "common carrier" about have any clue as to what it really means?
Planes, trains, and automobiles.

It was meant to level the playing field between companies needing to transport goods from one place to another so that one company would not have a competitive advantage over another one due to getting an "under the table" good buddy deal from transportation companies such as the railroad industry.

In the telecommunications industry I believe it applies to the carriers that the ISPs get their connection to the Internet from and not to the ISPs themselves. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21284547 Fri, 17 Oct 2008 16:27:41 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281955 Kearnstd : For the Children is the most abused method of getting new abuses of privacy passed. fighting piracy is another abuse that usually gets extended from a for the children effort.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281955 Fri, 17 Oct 2008 07:54:05 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281817 bzmeteorite :
said by Mike_27 See Profile :

Here's a public standard:
WISPA CALEA Standards (Versions 1 and 2) as produced by the WISPA CALEA Committee and ratified in May 2008.
»www.wispa.org/calea/WCS/

There are also cost effective solutions for small providers:
Netequalizer: »www.netequalizer.com/caleafaq.php
Mikrotik: »wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Calea

HTH,
Mike
I recall some time ago that WISPA was working with the FBI on working on a standard, great to see it's been finished and published.

»www.isp-planet.com/fixed_wireles···faq.html

Edit: I just relooked up OpenCALEA. It seems they have made considerable progress from when I last looked at them. Interesting.

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What happens when you combine common sense and an outspoken personality?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281817 Fri, 17 Oct 2008 06:38:41 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281813 bzmeteorite :
said by NormanS See Profile :

But there seems to be a distinction between "common carriers", and ISP ("facilities-based broadband Internet access providers"), and CALEA classes both as, “telecommunications carriers”.

Does anybody tossing the term "common carrier" about have any clue as to what it really means?
Thank you, I wasn't aware of that. So many intricacies of the laws out there - quite daunting.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281813 Fri, 17 Oct 2008 06:34:43 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281527 Mike_27 :
said by bzmeteorite See Profile :

CALEA seems to be poorly designed in some respects, for one, there is no publicly published open standard out there that I am aware of, and two, the cost burden is completely on ISPs. That may not matter for the large ISPs, but for the smaller ones I'm sure it does.
Here's a public standard:
WISPA CALEA Standards (Versions 1 and 2) as produced by the WISPA CALEA Committee and ratified in May 2008.
»www.wispa.org/calea/WCS/

There are also cost effective solutions for small providers:
Netequalizer: »www.netequalizer.com/caleafaq.php
Mikrotik: »wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Calea

HTH,
Mike]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281527 Fri, 17 Oct 2008 02:25:17 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281384 NormanS :
said by bzmeteorite See Profile :

That is what I have always understood, at least, that seems to be implied by the FCC requiring that ISPs are CALEA compliant, and CALEA labels them as Common Carriers.
Not that this is an authoritative source of any information:

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communicat···ment_Act

But there seems to be a distinction between "common carriers", and ISP ("facilities-based broadband Internet access providers"), and CALEA classes both as, “telecommunications carriers”.

Does anybody tossing the term "common carrier" about have any clue as to what it really means?
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281384 Fri, 17 Oct 2008 01:19:51 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281127 bzmeteorite :
said by funchords See Profile :

said by bzmeteorite See Profile :

Not only that, what does this mean for the common carrier status? I imagine things such as this will endanger the status;
ISPs are not considered Common Carriers, a flaw that is causing a seemingly endless pile of problems.
That is what I have always understood, at least, that seems to be implied by the FCC requiring that ISPs are CALEA compliant, and CALEA labels them as Common Carriers.

If I happen to be wrong, please correct me, I don't like spreading misinformation.
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What happens when you combine common sense and an outspoken personality?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281127 Thu, 16 Oct 2008 23:43:34 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281079 bzmeteorite :
said by Done_Posting See Profile :

said by technick See Profile :

I just took a CALEA training course and its complete bullshit.
The course was, or CALEA was? I'm guessing you meant CALEA since I happen to feel it's a flaming pile of horseshit myself...
CALEA seems to be poorly designed in some respects, for one, there is no publicly published open standard out there that I am aware of, and two, the cost burden is completely on ISPs. That may not matter for the large ISPs, but for the smaller ones I'm sure it does.
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What happens when you combine common sense and an outspoken personality?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21281079 Thu, 16 Oct 2008 23:32:11 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21280905 funchords :
said by bzmeteorite See Profile :

Not only that, what does this mean for the common carrier status? I imagine things such as this will endanger the status;
ISPs are not considered Common Carriers, a flaw that is causing a seemingly endless pile of problems.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21280905 Thu, 16 Oct 2008 22:59:28 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21280435 Done_Posting :
said by technick See Profile :

I just took a CALEA training course and its complete bullshit.
The course was, or CALEA was? I'm guessing you meant CALEA since I happen to feel it's a flaming pile of horseshit myself...

- Tate

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Happiness is an OC-768 in your basement...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21280435 Thu, 16 Oct 2008 21:37:19 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21280087 technick : I just took a CALEA training course and its complete bullshit. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21280087 Thu, 16 Oct 2008 20:35:52 EDT Re: This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21280060 NormanS :
said by bzmeteorite See Profile :

Not only that, what does this mean for the common carrier status?
What, exactly, is this "common carrier" status? I believe this is a sorely misunderstood subject.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21280060 Thu, 16 Oct 2008 20:31:30 EDT This is only the start... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21278803 bzmeteorite : Things such as this are endangering our online rights. That isn't to say looking at child porn is a right, but there are already clear processes for investigating people who are breaking the law. Look at CALEA and the whole warrant process. Oh, wait, that went down the drain long ago.

Not only that, what does this mean for the common carrier status? I imagine things such as this will endanger the status; for as soon as something illegal slips through, one could argue that the ISP has the capability of knowing whether something is illegal or not and that they missed it.

I fear for the future of online privacy and the mom-and-pop ISPs.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21278803 Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:48:24 EDT