  ilago Premium join:2005-06-28 Australia
·Internode
| reply to norwegian Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship
It is likely it is the ACMA blacklist, the dates and numbers of sites appear to correlate with ACMA's published numbers of sites which is issued approximately monthly with no removals. ACMA claim the blacklist is routinely washed. It may not have been, which would leave greater numbers in the real list. The ACMA figures are then open to question as they are the ones provided to parliament.
It's been cracked out of one of the NetAlert PC filters supplied free by the government until last December. This was the system the blacklist was designed for and it only affects the PC filter suppliers. The cracked list appears to match the wikileaks list.
The censorship regime has not yet started, but the plan was to use the blacklist as the basis on the system.
Senator Conroy and ACMA are damned if they say it is and graciously accept it has been leaked. They are damned if they say it isn't, but we are going to put you in jail for 10 years if you access a link. He is threatening Police investigations and substantial jail time. This would seem to indicate that it is the blacklist anyway.
Senator Conroy can say it isn't all day long, but his credibility is already seriously compromised and I doubt anyone believes him. |
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  norwegian Premium join:2005-02-15 Outback
·WestNet Broadband
1 edit | That's pretty much how I'm reading it as far as the list is. There would be no need for anything in respect to the federal police if it is fake.
As for the issue of having to not look the idiot in this all, the list has to be claimed as a fake, just to save face. This is where I can't understand why so many do this.
We are human and not perfect by any means, we have to go beyond our own transgressions. It would be better to realise you are wrong and ask for help, then loose all face, simply because you can not face up to your own short falls.
We are in a society now where pressures are high and what is realistic, may in fact be false, because you did not look into it more and try to study it, but rather accept it is as it is, simply because someone told you it is.
We have the internet as a powerful weapon for the growth of us, our children and their children's children. We can learn from it's power, and it's short falls, and apply it to make it a better place for us all, simply because we have access to so much knowledge.
Personally private, confidential info really needs to be reviewed if we are to keep the internet alive, but general knowledge is just that, general knowledge. I'm sure an old copy of the Encyclopedia Britannica has info on some nasty stuff, but it was published all the same.
For me if it is the real thing this list, then this issue has just had a wake up call for all of us. Let's hope we learn and apply and help our offspring, not force them into hiding in fear of retribution simply because someone with power believes they are right. And ultimately allow our youth, with a path of learning, exploring, understanding and ultimately growth can then apply it to the next generation because he/she has had the right teaching. -- The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke |
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 Longboard
join:2005-04-13 australia | Didn't see this on the main news tonight on TV, but it was an Item in Lateline on ABC: have to wait and see re newspapers in the Am if they run with this. |
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  norwegian Premium join:2005-02-15 Outback
·WestNet Broadband
| You have to give it a day or so, you may hear on the radio, but papers are already printed is my guess, and I can't see this misdemeanor as front page news that will hold the presses. -- The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke |
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 Longboard
join:2005-04-13 australia
1 edit | Small article in the SMH today ( Friday) haven't checked anything else. Keeps the spotlight on. Obviously most opposition will come from web activists, hopefully editors of the big dailies will focus some attention in the print media. Particularly after this episode. |
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  ilago Premium join:2005-06-28 Australia
·Internode
| said by Longboard :Small article in the SMH today ( Friday) haven't checked anything else. Keeps the spotlight on. Obviously most opposition will come from web activists, hopefully editors of the big dailies will focus some attention in the print media. Particularly after this episode. There wasn't a great deal of broadcast media coverage, although it got mentioned on radio and on Lateline on the ABC. None of the commercial TV channels covered it. Possibly due to the threats of fines and law enforcement action.
You may need to remember that ACMA manages the "censorship", but it also administers and controls the broadcasting media and media licensing. Print media is covered under different law and regulations and isn't licensed the same way the broadcast media is.
There's been heaps of print/online coverage. Much of it edited after publication and threats of prosecution for posting links. The OCAU wiki has a full list of media coverage in chronological order. »www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Aus···Coverage
Today's coverage is here »www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Aus···rch_2009
Scroll up for yesterday's coverage.
Wikileaks was not happy about receiving threats from Senator Conroy. (This is not a link to the leaked blacklist) »wikileaks.org/wiki/Wikileaks_to_···fter_you
Note: wikileaks is under considerable load at the moment. He has also advised by Twitter that he intends to release a more recent version of the blacklist in a couple of hours from now so wikileaks will be hammered again. |
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  Its a Secret Whatever Premium join:2008-02-23 U B Funny
·Shaw
| Yet another view: »apnews.excite.com/article/200903···880.html
Mar 20, 11:24 AM (ET)
By KRISTEN GELINEAU
SYDNEY, Australia (AP) - A whistle-blower organization claims a secret list of Web sites that Australian authorities are proposing to ban includes such innocuous destinations as a dentist's office.
Australia's government denied that the list - published by renegade Web site Wikileaks.org - was the same as a blacklist run by the Australian Communications and Media Authority, or ACMA. However, a manager at the dentist's office said the ACMA had confirmed her site's inclusion on the ban list.
Wikileaks' publication of the list this week reignited a debate over whether a government proposal to impose an Internet filter for all Australians could have unintended consequences for innocent businesses.
The list in question is provided to the creators of Internet filtering software that people can opt to install on their computers. But Communications Minister Stephen Conroy has proposed mandating that Australian Internet service providers implement the list, which would make Australia one of the strictest Internet regulators among democratic countries. Several Internet providers are conducting trials of the filter through June.
The authority says the list largely contains the addresses of Web sites promoting child pornography and sexual violence, but it has refused to release its contents publicly.
The proposal has prompted protests across the country, with critics slamming it as censorship. Internet providers argued that a filter could slow browsing speeds, and pointed out that illegal material such as child pornography can be traded on peer-to-peer networks or chats, which would not be covered by the filter.
On its site, Wikileaks accused Australia of "acting like a democratic backwater," and said "Australian democracy must not be permitted to sleep with this loaded gun." The site - which casts itself as an outlet for "untraceable mass document leaking and analysis," with a focus on exposing oppressive regimes and unethical behavior - did not explain how it obtained the purported blacklist.
The list published on Wikileaks contains around 2,400 Internet addresses, many of which are clearly for child pornography. But the list also includes a dental office, online poker parlors, a kennel and a school-cafeteria consultancy firm.
Kelly Wilson, a manager at Dental Distinction in the Australian state of Queensland, said she had no idea her office's site had been blacklisted until a newspaper reporter informed her Thursday. Wilson contacted the ACMA, which she said confirmed the site was on the authority's blacklist. She said she was offered no explanation why.
The site was hacked more than a year ago, and visitors were temporarily redirected to an adult Web site. The office quickly switched to a different Internet provider and hasn't had a problem since, she said.
"We're a little annoyed that we're on there," Wilson said. "It's a great Web site."
Jocelyn Ashcroft, owner of Tuckshop and Canteen Management Consultants in Queensland, whose apparently innocent site was also included on the Wikileaks list, worried that her business could be hurt.
More at link -- "In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal" |
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  norwegian Premium join:2005-02-15 Outback
·WestNet Broadband
| reply to SUMware Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship
Something that may, or may not be relevant, but seeing as the ACMA seem to also be in the limelight because of the idea of using the list?? (Nothing factual)
I wonder where we stand for porn advertising on the TV, be it midnight or not, as it is there at present. I know I don't want my kids seeing it.
I am just curious if it is relevant enough in an arguement where we are allowed to see porn on tv and influnce our children at home, yet this is all about morality and the internet? How long has TV been around now???? -- The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke |
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  no_one
@QWEST.NET
| reply to fatness said by fatness :said by Longboard :It's so absurd that the eager beavers who want this "filter" for their "protect us against all evil (and crush the opposition) agenda" in place are so shortsighted they cannot see how it will be turned against them in time. And all it takes is one election for that to happen. Jeez. Elections should be made secret also. This to prevent the bad people from taking control. All results are confidential need to know. All you need to know is they are still in charge afterwards protecting your safety. Those voting against them where blacklisted therefor their votes did not count. |
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  no_one
@QWEST.NET | reply to SUMware Plus it is easier to censor I guess than using current laws to catch and put in jail the real sickos creating the material. I do not mean the links per se but the actual creators of the extreme bad stuff. That is just too much work. |
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  fatness subtle Janitor join:2000-11-17 fishing | You're right. It's a very lazy substitute for serious crime prevention. |
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 Longboard
join:2005-04-13 australia
| reply to SUMware LOL: absurdity on absurdity... Did anyone see the references to Conroy's office threatening to 'list' Whirlpool as an undesirable as there seems to be a lot of critical comment there re the net Filter. »www.theage.com.au/national/labor···51z.html Unbelievable: Australia really is becoming OZ: cast Conroy as the Wicked Witch of the West. This is now spinning right out of control: keep the powder stockpiled and dry. |
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  fatness subtle Janitor join:2000-11-17 fishing
·EarthLink
Host: Earthlink DSL TekSavvy Forum Feature Requ.. Need Site Help? Rants, Raves, and ..
| From that article: quote: THE Government will begin trawling blog sites as part of a new media monitoring strategy, with documents singling out a website critical of Communications Minister Stephen Conroy for special mention.
Soon after Senator Conroy praised Singapore's Government for reducing monitoring of blogs, tender documents issued by the Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy reveal it is looking for a "comprehensive digital monitoring service for print and electronic media".
The department later attached a clarification confirming the term "electronic media" included "blogs such as Whirlpool".
-- goodbye dad |
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 Longboard
join:2005-04-13 australia
2 edits | Outrageous: by definition: going beyond all standards of what is right or decent. Undoubtedly dslreports for the chop in Oz for hosting this thread.  The whirlpool thread relating to the net filter is now 35 'parts' long, each part can be 50 pages of the forum !! Don't think this has been posted b4: current pages: »forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re···=1167474 Whirlpool summary: »whirlpool.net.au/wiki/?tag=cleanfeed Almost an industry in itself, no lack of interest !!
Thought these are some nice quotes, nothing we don't already appreciate, but well said: "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." ; Benjamin Franklin
"All censorships exist to prevent anyone from challenging current conceptions and existing institutions. All progress is initiated by challenging current conceptions"; George Bernard Shaw
"In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist; And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist; And then they came for the Jews, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew; and then . . . they came for me . . . And by that time there was no one left to speak up." ; Pastor Martin Niemöller (1892-1984)
"The Internet interprets censorship as damage and routes around it." - John Gilmore
@The Janitor and the mods: Thanks for allowing this thread to continue.
If I might, one more contemporaneous and apt quote from Stella Rimington recent head of MI5: "It would be better that the government recognised that there are risks, rather than frightening people in order to be able to pass laws which restrict civil liberties, precisely one of the objects of terrorism - that we live in fear and under a police state," Regards. |
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  norwegian Premium join:2005-02-15 Outback
·WestNet Broadband
| I've not seen anywhere yet a topic as large as this at Whirlpool, in the first days alone of the filter becoming public, the site had 4-6 parts long, and has not shown any slowing, talk about response.
It also seems that even some of the ISP's have had enough.
IiNet have withdrawn from any options at testing even though they were always willing to test simply to show how ineffective it will be.
»www.australianit.news.com.au/sto···,00.html
IiNet yesterday pulled out of the federal Government's internet filtering trials, blaming drawn-out negotiations with the Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy, constant changes in policy, and last week's leak of a secret internet blacklist.
Chief executive Michael Malone said iiNet only agreed to participate in the trial to demonstrate that the filter was flawed and a waste of taxpayers' money, but last week's blacklist leak was the final straw. "To use Conroy's own words, the internet filter is now a dead parrot and there's no point investing any time or money in this," Mr Malone said.
"We were going to be there to demonstrate in the wild that this thing has serious problems and that has been self-evidently proven by the department's actions and last week's leak."
Telstra had already committed to a "no" for testing back in December, but considering the issues surrounding Telstra and the government at the time, I doubt you could get an answer specific to the filtering, there was a lot of tit for tat regarding the restructuring of the internet service in Australia between the 2.
»www.theage.com.au/national/telst···u1n.html
AUSTRALIA'S largest internet service provider has said it will not participate in trials of the Federal Government's controversial national internet filter.
Telstra's BigPond said yesterday it would not be part of the pilot, which will run for six weeks from this month, citing "customer management issues".
It wouldn't say what the issues were but Telstra is believed to be worried about the effect on its reputation of any inconvenience to customers.
The Government has asked ISPs to test the filter, which will block more than 10,000 sites and has been criticised by the Greens, Federal Opposition, the internet industry, consumers and online rights groups. -- The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke |
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  norwegian Premium join:2005-02-15 Outback
·WestNet Broadband
| reply to Longboard said by Longboard :Did anyone see the references to Conroy's office threatening to 'list' Whirlpool as an undesirable as there seems to be a lot of critical comment there re the net Filter. » www.theage.com.au/national/labor···51z.html There doesn't seem to be anything specific mentioned at his home page relating to any of this 'monitoring' of web sites. I guess it boils down to words of wisdom. He may be hoping something slanderous or the like is mentioned, in hope it can force 'shut' any opposition to this.
»www.theage.com.au/national/labor···51z.html
THE Government will begin trawling blog sites as part of a new media monitoring strategy, with documents singling out a website critical of Communications Minister Stephen Conroy for special mention.
Soon after Senator Conroy praised Singapore's Government for reducing monitoring of blogs, tender documents issued by the Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy reveal it is looking for a "comprehensive digital monitoring service for print and electronic media".
The department later attached a clarification confirming the term "electronic media" included "blogs such as Whirlpool".
Whirlpool, the only blog site mentioned, has criticised Senator Conroy's plans to filter internet content and his handling of the Government's $15 billion national broadband network. It is a community-run internet forum devoted to discussing broadband internet access.
Senator Conroy this month told a conference in Germany that it was a "really positive sign" that the Singaporean Government had given up monitoring blogs.
But the documents suggest the Australian Government is just about to start. Senator Conroy's spokesman said it was "only natural" that the tender include services for monitoring relevant blogs.
"Whirlpool is a long-established online platform for news and information covering a wide range of topics across the telecommunications sector," the spokesman said. "It and other websites provide valuable insight into the industries in which we work."
Opposition communications spokesman Nick Minchin claimed it was "extreme" and an unacceptable use of taxpayers' money to expand media monitoring to blogs.
"The minister has been caught out telling an important international audience one thing, while at the same time putting the wheels in motion back home to use taxpayers' money to do the complete opposite," Senator Minchin said.
A spokesman for the department said it had used Whirlpool as an example of a blog site that might be monitored because a prospective bidder for the contract had asked for a clarification. -- The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke |
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  norwegian Premium join:2005-02-15 Outback
·WestNet Broadband
1 edit | reply to SUMware Another leak?
It is getting juicy now.
New 'ACMA blacklist' leak claims banned websites list was recently editedA NEW blacklist of websites has appeared online just days after the Government was left red-faced by a similar leak. Despite previous official denials, the anonymous post claims the list of websites definitely comes from the Government watchdog. It also claims the list has been updated since it was first published on whistleblowing website Wikileaks. "All three lists come from the same Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA) approved filtering software company source and described internally as the 'ACMA' list," the post said. "Between the 11th (of March) and yesterday, the company did an enormous cleanup of the list. No doubt as a result of the list appearing on Wikileaks." Wikileaks was brought down by excessive traffic when the first lists were leaked last week. The list was allegedly edited after reports that it included innocent content such as Wikipedia pages and a dentist's website. "It is probable that the company only added, but never previously deleted, sites from the updates sent by ACMA," the post said. If this doesn't say the Australian people don't want it, nothing does. I just can't for the life of me understand how much dissent is out there on this, because it is not attacking the issue of internet exploitation and only allowing room for secrecy and manipulation from within the ranks of government.
Oh to really care for the issues out there on the net.......we would all be behind them.
Edit: More info :-
»sydneydiver.blogspot.com/2009/03···ble.html
Loose thoughts by Bjorn LandfeldtWikileaks made a second list available on the 20th of March. The second list is a cleaned up version of the first list that now contains some 1170 entries. Since the government threatened to prosecute any Australian involved in leaking the list, Wikileaks responded by threatening the Australian government with legal action since the action is firmly protected by Swedish law and Wikileaks operates within that jurisdiction. Interesting, is there an international diplomatic conflict about to happen as well over this? Perhaps I (as a Swede and Aussie) will have to chose sides, and which army to join after all  . It is extremely stupid to distribute a list in cleartext in the first place. I have no idea who at ACMA decided to hand out clear text ASCII files with all the banned sites but it was not a struck of genius to do so. Why did ACMA not simply hash the sites and distributed a file with hashed values? Any filter implementation can still hash each destination URL and compare with the list without the destination address ever being exposed. It is true that there would still be people within the ACMA who would have acces to the original clear text list but the risk of spreading of the list would be much lower. Wikileaks apparently also published a simple way of extracting the list from a down loadable software package from the netalert scheme era. Apparently, it is possible to extract a file with the conspicuous name "Websites_ACMA.txt". Well designed security software!! I wonder if the developers had dumbed down 3-year Australian university degrees...... »www.ozsource.org/source/cleenfee···kileaks/
CleenFeed: ACMA Blacklist and WikileaksACMAs secret list of banned web pages has reportedly been leaked to Wikileaks.org although it appears the method to derive this list is not as sinister as the mainstream media has made out. The original leaked list appeared to be 2 years old, full of dead urls and with a couple of new URLs tacked on for good measure. The second list published on the 20th of March has been explained in a bit more detail by Wikileaks. This Crikey quote explains the Blacklist comes from a group of: Family Friendly Filters and one of those provided free to (a few) Australian families by the Howard governments now defunct NetAlert scheme. Provided youre reasonably tech-savvy, you can extract a list of URLs with the rather unambiguous name Websites_ACMA.txt. Depending on which version of the software you download, you get the August 2008 list as published, or something similar containing more recent material. -- The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke |
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