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<title>Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship in Security</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r21341775</link>
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<language>en</language>
<pubDate>Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:59:15 EDT</pubDate>
<lastBuildDate>Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:59:15 EDT</lastBuildDate>

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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,23000138</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  munky99999 <A HREF="/useremail/u/987136"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Old news is old. Though from what I'm reading at the end of the thread. It's new once again.<br> </div>Not old news, we have not seen the results from "tests" as yet, due out at the end of this month. The story may have started a while back, but it is still in the infancy stage really.<br><br>You obviously understand what it won't do for us though. :) <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 10 Sep 2009 04:48:40 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22999404</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/987136"><b>munky99999</b></A> : Old news is old. Though from what I'm reading at the end of the thread. It's new once again.<br><br>If you consider the fact that aussies already have HORRID internet connectivity. Add a giant DPI machine infront of it all will only make it so much worse.<br><br><b>"Not only will your rights be at stake, our Internet speeds will slow down by 70 per cent, be mandatory for all Aussies and will not protect us from evil AT ALL", it said.</b><br><br>The reality is though. Those who are evil on there now. Too which you are now blocking. Will either defeat the firewall... or leave the internet. Which guess where they are coming next? That's right. Back to reality with all their knowledge and desires.<br><br>Not only will the firewall not protect anyone. It will infact be far significantly more dangerous for people.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:03:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22998406</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Seems that our PM's site was hit last night in response to the filter proposal. Not quite sure it is the right path to take for protest, however, how did they manage to do it, sounds like someone needs to tidy up the code for the web sites? :)<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,26051698-5014239,00.html" >www.news.com.au/technology/story&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>THE Prime Minister's website has been hacked into in protest over proposed reforms of internet censorship.<br><br>The website, <A HREF="http://www.pm.gov.au/">www.pm.gov.au</a>, was brought down at about 7.20pm (AEST) along with that of the <A HREF="http://www.acma.gov.au/WEB/HOMEPAGE/PC=HOME">Australian Communications and Media Authority</a>, but both were back online about an hour later. <br><br>A message posted on the Inquisitor website by the hacker, identified as Anonymous, stated that the action was in response to a Federal Government proposal to introduce mandatory internet filtering<hr></blockquote><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 09 Sep 2009 19:37:58 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Getting closer to results?</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22976713</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : We are getting closer to the completion of tests it seems. A recent article mentions the govt have mentioned it is near finished, but because of the secrecy around it, there isn't much info to go by. The following was off a news.com.au article of the shadow minister slamming the govt for lack of info as well.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,26016116-15319,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>A spokesman for Senator Conroy said: "The trial is expected to be completed around September with a report to be provided to the Minister following its conclusion." <hr></blockquote><br><br>I did find a small blog by Colin Jacobs of Electronic Frontiers Australia an interesting article, even with the "glossed' comments.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,,26025025-5013038,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>OUR politicians like to describe the internet as the Wild West, implying it's a lawless haven for pirates, pornographers and pedophiles. While a few libertarian nerds and the Russian mafia might favour such anarchy, the implication is clear that it's time a government lawman stepped in to make the place safe for decent, law-abiding, internet-using folks, in particular, vulnerable children. Apparently our Communications Minister Stephen Conroy thinks he's just the man for the job.<hr></blockquote>  <br><br>Also something the blog pointed out, whether true or false in the application if/when it happens is about how the filters will be created. <br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Now the plan is about "enforcing existing laws'' and cracking down on those who distribute violent and illegal material such as that depicting child sexual abuse. It goes without saying that we'd all like to see the trafficking of abhorrent material stopped, but the filtering plan is hardly a silver bullet for law enforcement. In fact, although some details remain unclear, it appears that the scheme will only target a small list of websites, compiled by bureaucrats in response to complaints from the public, not by specialists or police. The government knows, and the police will happily tell them, that illegal material is not distributed on public websites, but by highly secretive and well-organised groups that use technologies such as peer-to-peer file sharing to elude authorities.<hr></blockquote><br><br>For most the fear is that it being controlled by the govt, you would assume the above comment lame.....how ever it is how it is presently done I believe, so why believe it will change from this process? Lack of a referendum, discussion or any other form of communication over what exactly is the reasons for the govt being so strong for this, and secretive at that, really doesn't help the process and the cause they want to pursue.<br><br>I can only hope it all comes about if it does, with a proper research base from more than just bureaucrats and allows those that really know the internet, security and privacy issues to be allowed to help make sure that once in place it is effective, as there is no technology yet that is effective at filtering, simply because sites can open an hour later under another address once it is banned/filtered. <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 22:38:02 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22824717</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I hear you. Posted a little in this <A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r22690329-Child-groups-internet-content-filtering-a-waste-of-money">topic</a> about that which is a little more recent, but the colour of money is still the same.<br> </div>Ooh, sorry didnt see that in that other thread ..the title of which is a given...<br>Might be worth while merging these last few posts as they all refer to the specific aspects of our little baby down here, whilem referencing in general something 'we' all seem to have no trouble grasping .??<br><br>The Clean Feed thread is a wonderful monstrous thing : GOOD.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 11:57:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22824599</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/817075"><b>Kiwi</b></A> : This whole topic is Representative of a failure to understand technology. <i>"I wonder if I could earn a few extra dollars to pay for the kids education here?"</i> Of course, but only if the powers that be understand that technology requires people who know how to manage it. This whole topic would be moot if the end user/network had been managed.<br><br>It's strange really, nobody jumps in car and expects to run without issues, but people certainly do with anything related to PC, networks and software. The whole system would be better served by using the appropriate qualified people, instead of just screaming like somebody standing still and taking a beating.<br><br>I'm not at all interested in any government trying to be parents to citizens. A first step in logic could be to pass a more reasonable law where any business is required to have qualified technicians set their system up, if they use a networked PC's. Now, mate you could get rich  :D]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 11:40:03 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22824084</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <br>I hear you. Posted a little in this <A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r22690329-Child-groups-internet-content-filtering-a-waste-of-money">topic</a> about that which is a little more recent, but the colour of money is still the same.<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 10:03:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22824005</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : You can't make this stuff up, what a joke! Hopefully the backlash from this type of results will spur people to have this shyte ousted once and for all.<br><br>Bloody wankers.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 09:48:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22823978</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : What f'ing bozos. ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 09:43:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22823782</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : Ah yes: the Law of unintended consequences:<br>LOL<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/web-of-confusion/story-e6freuy9-1225755701449" >www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/w&middot;&middot;&middot;55701449</A><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>One site a Year 10 student opened while searching for a type of bird contained graphic sexual material and was only barred on Monday after inquiries from The Daily Telegraph.<br>George Cochrane said his school-aged son and daughter, who study by distance education from their farm in Grenfell, were horrified by the sites they could access.<br>Other educational sites and harmless web pages for the local member of parliament - and even Education Minister Verity Firth's own site - have been blocked by the filter.<br>The Department of Education and Training confirmed that the filter would be used on thousands of laptops for high school students. It is also currently used on all computers in schools.<br>"My daughter typed in 'swallow', as in the bird, and it blocked access to a documentary on swallowing toothpaste but gave you access to a male site talking about inappropriate material," Mr Cochrane said<hr></blockquote><br><br>Just to keep y'all updated as to our techno wizardry DU<br> :uhh:]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 09:06:06 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22618750</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote">said by  Kiwi <A HREF="/useremail/u/817075"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A><br>This Country is so special these days, that the special short bus few actually dictate what happens for the masses.<br><br><b>Kill pedophiles, rapists and remove bureaucrats from the equation; torture the net terrorists, just for fun. Let the rest of the majority get on with life.</b><br> </div>The correct path of action is never taken to sort the issues as you mention. It doesn't count for votes and human rights movements will argue the case for the evil doers.<br><br>What a shambles and what a future to look forward too.<br><br>Edit: correction<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 23:16:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22618351</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/817075"><b>Kiwi</b></A> : The new endeavour will be on the horizon in a few years, just because the internet as it stands has enjoyed a great public freedom from bureaucrats and has always <i>required</i> the will to self govern travels along the net pathways, that won't mean a new standard will not venture out to create yet another formidable method of communication.<br><br>It tis sad though that idiots with regards redirection are spoiling their own and everybody else's future freedoms. Before those happened, it was much the same as television and we see where that atrocity of censorship has gone, lock down breasts and free up Viagra ~ 'Don't think of the kids, many breast feed, but are not yet ready to spawn on a screen.'<br><br>This Country is so special these days, that the special short bus few actually dictate what happens for the masses.<br><br>Kill pedophiles, rapists and remove bureaucrats from the equation; torture the net terrorists, just for fun. Let the rest of the majority get on with life.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 21:34:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22618250</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <br>Keep on creeping?<br><br>They know exactly what they are doing. It isn't anything to do with just filtering "known kiddie porn sites", we know that already. These sites will just move, and I still can't see real research being done either. Once a site is pegged and added to the filter, there will be 4 to replace it.<br><br>And now games? <br><br>Might as well just turn the net off because there will be nothing to view. <br>[sarcasm]You have to feel proud, don't you.<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 21:14:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22614584</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : TahDah: we're still here, headless chickens..hard at work....in the running with China.  Doh.<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.theage.com.au/digital-life/games/web-filters-to-censor-video-games-20090625-cxrx.html" >www.theage.com.au/digital-life/g&middot;&middot;&middot;xrx.html</A><br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>the government's internet censorship regime will extend to downloadable and web-based games that don't meet Australia's MA15+ rating standard.<hr></blockquote><br><br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The government's decision would mean even Australians over 15-years-old will be unable to access websites that sell downloadable or physical copies of video games as well as those that host web-based games,<hr></blockquote><br><br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>"This is confirmation that the scope of the mandatory censorship scheme will keep on creeping," Colin Jacobs of the Electronic Frontiers Australia told the publication. "Far from being the ultimate weapon against child abuse, it now will officially censor content deemed too controversial for a 15-year-old. In a free country like ours, do we really need the government to step in and save us from racy web games?"<hr></blockquote><br><br>Cant begin to express my pride in my Govt.. :p]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 11:11:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22487324</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by OppsNotLogedIn :</small><br><br>  So why hasn't the people of OZ sent a message?  By simply not using the internet providers mentioned in this thread.<br><br>    </div>The government intend this to be mandatory, so all ISPs will be obliged to introduce it if it goes ahead.<br><br>Three of the biggest ISPs have refused to participate. Of the participating IPS, five have a user base that is less than 5000 all up, one is already filtered and run as a non profit by the Christadelphians. Primus is a small-medium ISP and Optus are one of the big ISPs but they are only running limited "tests" on a small part of their user base in two cities.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 03 Jun 2009 03:21:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: May back away from mandatory internet filtering plan?</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22487318</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Does that mean the ISPs could voluntarily use the filtering?<br><br>Or does it mean that the ISPs could voluntarily use the filtering <b>or else</b>?<br> </div>It means Conroy only opens his mouth to change feet. His lack of technical expertise is breathtaking. <br><br>More useful information<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/06/03/1243708489312.html" >www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/06/&middot;&middot;&middot;312.html</A><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.itwire.com/content/view/25388/1148/" >www.itwire.com/content/view/25388/1148/</A><br><br>If you'd like to read a truly spectacular approach to network engineering pilot projects, try this specification with no test criteria, no test methodology and the testing consultant is being paid $AU887,000 to run the ummm "tests".<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.somebodythinkofthechildren.com/live-filtering-pilot-has-no-success-criteria/comment-page-1/#comment-5633" >www.somebodythinkofthechildren.c&middot;&middot;&middot;ent-5633</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 03 Jun 2009 03:15:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22486668</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <br><br>  So why hasn't the people of OZ sent a message?  By simply not using the internet providers mentioned in this thread.<br><br>   Money is the name of the game.  If everyone just not pay their bill for one or two months how long do you honestly think that those internet providers would continue kissing butts of the powers that be ?<br>   Come on now this is not rockets being built. The solution is simple.  Take the money away an you will re-gain control.  But if you don't you already know what can be expected. Money is the name of the game an those ISP needs your money to pay their bills or go bust.   I've fought side-by-side with aussies......they are a  couragous people an should not be subjected to this insult by their own government.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jun 2009 23:31:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>UNWIRED, ninth internet service provider to test.</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22485212</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : It seems we have another to join in the testing.<br>I'm not sure why there is a real need for more to join testing. Surely 1 or 2 ISP's can tell with testing how it reacts?<br><br>At least it is starting to roll, politically wise, for an against vote. Australia was born of convicts, but sometimes I wonder about he powers to be thinking they still have that power over the masses, this is a perfect example. (sorry about the political comment-needed to explain the view).<br><br>Considering all the messed up choices our powers make, I have no faith in anything they implement to secure our children's future in respect to the internet. <br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25571450-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br><div class="bquote">UNWIRED has become the ninth internet service provider to join the federal Government's controversial internet filtering trials as Young Labor rebels against the plans to censor the world wide web.<br><br>Unwired declined to reveal how many customers would participate in the trial, but said inclusion would be voluntary. <br><br>It is the ninth ISP to participate in the scheme, joining Optus, Primus, Highway 1, Nelson Bay Online, Netforce, OMNIconnect, TECH 2U and Webshield. <br><br>The Government hopes to introduce mandatory ISP-level content filtering that would automatically block "refused classification" material matched against a web-page blacklist managed by the Australian Communications and Media Authority. <br><br>"Unwired is an innovative player in the Australian internet market," Communications Minister Stephen Conroy said. "Its participation in the pilot will help ensure the Government obtains robust results to inform the evidence-based development of our ISP filtering policy." <br><br>According to Unwired, its inclusion in the trial was purely to help determine the technical requirements of the scheme.</div>A list by the "Australian Communications and Media Authority".<br>I wonder who's paying the bills there, big movies, music promoters? A question that has to be asked as well.  <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jun 2009 18:42:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22445606</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> :  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Responding to questions from shadow communications minister Nick Minchin on how the government may go about imposing the internet filtering scheme, Senator Conroy said that legislation may not be required and ISPs may adopt an industry consensus to block restricted content on a voluntary basis.<br>&#147;Mandatory ISP filtering would conceivably involve legislation &#133; voluntary is available currently to ISPs,&#148; Senator Conroy said.<br>&#147;One option is potentially legislation. One other option is that it could be (on a) voluntary basis that they (ISPs) could voluntarily agree to introduce it.&#148;<br>In response Senator Minchin said he had never heard of a voluntary mandatory system.<br>Senator Conroy responded with &#147;well they could agree to all introduce it&#148;. <hr></blockquote><br> :uhh:<br>ROFL<br>Idiot and proving it on a consistent basis.  :D]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 12:20:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: May back away from mandatory internet filtering plan?</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22444211</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : Does that mean the ISPs could voluntarily use the filtering?<br><br>Or does it mean that the ISPs could voluntarily use the filtering <b>or else</b>?<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.10</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 07:17:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>May back away from mandatory internet filtering plan?</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22444092</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Seems nothing straight, as far as comments from the powers to be, from the start have changed much, even now after all the feedback from external influences.<br><br>More in link:-<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25542310-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>THE Rudd Government has indicated that it may back away from its mandatory internet filtering plan.<br><br>Communications Minister Stephen Conroy today told a Senate estimates committee that the filtering scheme could be implemented by a voluntary industry code. <br><br>Senator Conroy&#146;s statement is a departure from the internet filtering policy Labor took into the October 2007 election to make it mandatory for ISPs to block offensive and illegal content. <br><br>Responding to questions from shadow communications minister Nick Minchin on how the government may go about imposing the internet filtering scheme, Senator Conroy said that legislation may not be required and ISPs may adopt an industry consensus to block restricted content on a voluntary basis. <br><br>&#147;Mandatory ISP filtering would conceivably involve legislation &#133; voluntary is available currently to ISPs,&#148; Senator Conroy said. <br><br>&#147;One option is potentially legislation. One other option is that it could be (on a) voluntary basis that they (ISPs) could voluntarily agree to introduce it.&#148; <br><br>In response Senator Minchin said he had never heard of a voluntary mandatory system. <br><br>Senator Conroy responded with &#147;well they could agree to all introduce it&#148;.<hr></blockquote><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 05:26:52 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22429871</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <br><br>    Was not sure if this has already been posted....the topic is long and I did not read it all.<br><br>                                 _____________________<br><br>      No Internet Censorship is an initiative of the Australian Democrats to oppose the current Government&#146;s Internet censorship/blacklisting program and develop alternative policy that will provide the cyber safety information and resources parents need to adequately protect their children.<br><br>   &raquo;<A HREF="http://nointernetcensorship.com/" >nointernetcensorship.com/</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 16:35:59 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Trial filtering at Optus underway.</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22426890</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25521790-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>THE nation's second-largest ISP has fired the starter's gun on its live internet filtering trial, a program by the federal Government as part of its bid to censor the web.<br><br>The trial will conclude in early July after some six weeks of testing. <br><br>An Optus spokeswoman declined to reveal how many customers had agreed to participate; residential customers in Sydney and Newcastle have been selected for the pilot but they could opt-out of the exercise at any point, Optus said. <br><br>Optus is the eighth internet service provider to participate in the scheme, joining Primus, Highway 1, Nelson Bay Online, Netforce, OMNIconnect, TECH 2U and Webshield. <br><br>All ISPs have differing start and completion dates for the tests as various factors such as availability of filtering equipment have an impact on their timetables. <br><br>The Government hopes to introduce mandatory ISP-level content filtering that would automatically block "refused classification" material matched against a web page blacklist managed by the Australian Communications and Media Authority.<hr></blockquote><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 08:39:27 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22352418</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/403861"><b>Mele20</b></A> : I like what Freman, one of the responders to EFA is doing in response.  Will he get a notice for a link to a "tinyurl"? It is an interesting test.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://fremnet.net/article/263/the-efa-link" >fremnet.net/article/263/the-efa-link</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2009 07:03:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22352407</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : So here we go again  :uhh:<br>The last paragraph says it all so far.<br>Yay us  :p<br><br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>On this latest evidence, the Australian Government is now light years ahead of the rest of the Western world when it comes to political censorship. Whether a less draconian regime will at some point emerge is now a hot topic for debate amongst Ozzie ISP&#146;s.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/07/oz_link_ban/" >www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/07&middot;&middot;&middot;ink_ban/</A><br><br>I feel utterly dispossessed and 'emptied out' while following this evolving schemozzole.<br><br>Budget time down here: everybody running scared.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2009 06:42:46 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Infrastucture v&#x27;s filters</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22286144</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Very well said.<br><br>The fact remains we are to have this great big <A HREF="http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/08/technology/internet/08broadband.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss">advanced internet</a> built and Sen Conroy seems to be heading it. Going by the fiasco involved with this topic we can only wonder where it is going, or what it really means. Filtration won't be a worry if it becomes govt owned.<br><br>Telstra has basically become a waste of time, energy and resources, too many problems too many issues. The government sold all utilities off and now want to build another utility; read: internet infrastructure, even if we are talking different govt's at the time.<br><br>While realistically Telstra's network just needed upgrading. Considering the money situation at the moment, you would have thought investing in buying back the telco would be better, then allowing the others to hire the lines. Guess satellite has caused the biggest shakeup of Telstra and it's aged telephone line infrastructure.<br><br>Anyway back on topic, while it all sounds a great idea, this internet upgrade, It worries me what sort of locks will be put in place for the general public if they do build it. If the <A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r22282485-Dont-let-the-EU-parliament-lock-up-the-Internet-Urgent">EU debate/vote</a> or the <A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22224023?hilite=france+vote">France empowers film industry vigilantes</a> story shed any light into interpretation the crystal ball, you can start to get a picture of the powers to be do not want the internet to be a free service. Still how do you control a world-wide infrastructure that is out-dated and grown beyond it's initial maker's expectations, exploited etc and push the reasoning as piracy, child pron, etc for controlling it yet can't realistically work beyond your own borders.<br><br>I just can't understand the logic in it all. Money and power, what a wonderful thing, glad I'm flat broke and free of this corruption.   <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 23 Apr 2009 17:57:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: ???</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22284045</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : Optus 'opts in'..<br><br>This stinks of course: if any non-ozzies have been following our Federal govts latest gobsmacking announcement re building a FTTH national network, the stakes at risk for all providers have just gone through the roof.<br><br>Subsequent to the bizarre position adopted by Telstra, championed by that great American bizoid Sol Trujillo, (any of you remember him ??  :uhh: , who has waltzed off home with many millions having watched billions being wiped off the value of Telstra, yes, I have shares )by way of dissing the Govt in a display of absurd hubris that may well effectively destroy Telstra (heh; may not be all bad if some competition comes in) through their tender offer to participate in a national broadband network build; the federal govt has applied immense pressure to all commercial operators who will need access to this yet to be built 'national network'.<br><br>Telstra is running scared at the threat of being broken up.<br><br>Other operators ( read OPTUS) are now keen to play footsie with ANYTHING the Govt might suggest to not cruel their chances or give themselves a leg up at any price.<br><br>There are now even more pressing reasons to hold the line against any govt interference/social engineering wrt control of the network and access.<br><br>The proposal to build this FTTH network is a noble one, but, currently, so fraught with difficulties and wrapped in vapour (putting it mildly) that the implementation of same may well prove impossible.<br><br>No business plan, timetable nonsense, costing utterly unreliable, who will control access... :huh:<br><br>I'm not happy with Telstra's near monopoly of access. I am furious at the management of this really important infrastructure company's behaviour. Their are commercial realities of course, but, the managemnet have imho failed their shareholders and failed to grapple with the bigger picture in any way.<br> >For a dissenting opinion with some merit:   &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.afr.com/home/login.aspx?EDP://20090422000031065518&section=opinion" >www.afr.com/home/login.aspx?EDP:&middot;&middot;&middot;=opinion</A> <br>Whatever, there has been a meltdown.<br><br>The commercial structure of Telcos and ISPs in Oz is ..umm..complex and has been effectively run by Telstra for some time much to the annoyance of other Telcos.<br><br>The govt has signalled its' plan to be the majority owner of this new network..<br><br>The end result is that the govt now has a REALLYBIGSTICK to be swinging about. Conroy of course was totally discredited and stumbling along, now the censorship/access issues are rolled into a much larger bundle of issues.<br><br>That is part of what is so frightening.<br><br>We have been so slow to sort out the whole thing here and now we have no real roadmap at all.<br><br>  ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 23 Apr 2009 11:06:00 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>???</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22283188</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : It will keep the honest crooks out that's about it.<br><br>I can say lots and lots, but it's all been said already.<br><br>I could start up a program that filtered under $4,000 from bank accounts and nothing will be done, because banks consider this worthless to chase up as far as fraud is concerned because of court costs, unless I'm stupid enough to start showing a pattern in my movement or get caught, yet, we will spend a fortune filtering sites only the dubious filth will visit, that they will still be able to visit because they know of other means to get there.<br><br>It has to be a political reason for this, nothing more. Where is the privacy or security value in it?<br><br>Talking to half the people who has computer come my way for tidying up say the same thing, why would they go visit a site filtered in this list?<br><br>It's already a known fact they will be infected by exploitation of ads or infected web sites, way, way before a site that is considered "filterable" will even be visited in the first place. It's already happening.<br><br>Ah, I'm getting horse in the throat, someone else ask the question......................<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 23 Apr 2009 07:32:02 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Update: April 3rd 2009</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22280397</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/195618"><b>rawwhide</b></A> : These people do realize that filtering will not stop anyone determined enough, right?<br><small>--<br>To talk much and arrive nowhere is the same as climbing a tree to catch a fish.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 22 Apr 2009 17:42:32 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Update: April 3rd 2009</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22279185</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br> <div class="bquote">"Customers can opt-out of the trial, even after it starts," he said.</div> </div>It would be very interesting to see the stats on the number of people opting out, both before, and after the tests start.<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"<br>"Nobody knows the age of the human race, but everybody agrees that it is old enough to know better" - Anonymous</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 22 Apr 2009 14:02:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Update: April 3rd 2009</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22277286</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : Thanks for the update.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 22 Apr 2009 07:47:48 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Update: April 3rd 2009</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22277241</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Seems the testing has now extended to to finally include one of our larger ISP's, Optus. <br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25370155-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><div class="bquote"><b>AFTER months of negotiation, Australia's second-largest internet provider, Optus, has finally agreed to participate in the federal Government's live ISP internet filtering trial.</b><br><br>Optus is the seventh participant to receive the green light and will kick-off trials on May 22. <br><br>Other ISPs that are involved include Primus, Highway 1, Nelson Bay Online, Netforce, OMNIconnect, TECH 2U and Webshield. <br><br>The ISPs have different commencement dates but trials should be completed within a few months. <br><br>Optus will only filter the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA) blacklist, which stood at 1000-odd web pages a few months ago. <br><br>"The participation of Optus will help ensure the Government obtains robust results from the pilot, which will inform the evidence-based development of our ISP filtering policy," Communications Minister Stephen Conroy said. <br><br>The nation's leading ISP, Telstra, chose not to participate in the pilot but is said to be assisting the Government with some technical aspects. <br><br>Optus regulatory compliance general manager Gary Smith said the trial will last for approximately six weeks , and will be conducted with residential customers in Sydney and Newcastle. Customers will be informed via email from today. <br><br>"Customers can opt-out of the trial, even after it starts," he said.</div><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 22 Apr 2009 07:27:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Update: April 3rd 2009</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22175500</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Update: Information of events of recent times, for those interested it certainly isn't passing by as quietly as some may have first thought.<br><br>   <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Five things I learned from the Insight episode on filtering</b><br><br>He now claims his plan is to block only material which would be classified as Refused Classification (RC). Well &#145;almost exclusively&#146; Refused Classification &#151; In typical Conroy fashion he has left himself a backdoor with enough room to park a Hummer-sized load of as much &#145;unwanted&#146; content as he or anyone else in government likes.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.somebodythinkofthechildren.com/" >www.somebodythinkofthechildren.com/</A><br><br>   <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Conroy signals Net filter backflip</b><br><br>THE Minister for Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy, Stephen Conroy, has said the government&#146;s controversial compulsory internet filtering policy would be confined to content that had been &#147;refused classification&#148; (RC), in a statement many are interpreting as a backtrack from previously announced policy. <br><br>Speaking on the SBS <A HREF="http://news.sbs.com.au/insight/episode/index/id/59#overview">Insight</a> program, Senator Conroy said the policy would be restricted to RC websites. <br><br><b>Post note:</b> There is a clip of the show at Insight's link<br><br>Under previous leaked versions of blacklisted sites compiled by the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA), R18+ and X18+ sites had also been listed, as well as other legal content such as a Queensland dentist&#146;s site, YouTube movie clips and an astrology site.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://gocebit.com.au/?q=news/conroy-signals-net-filter-backflip" >gocebit.com.au/?q=news/conroy-si&middot;&middot;&middot;backflip</A><br><br>   <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Conroy jumps out of filter fire into iiNet ire</b><br><br><i>Senator Stephen Conroy's watch as Communications Minister seems to be going from bad to worse after publicly making comments that could land him legal hot water. The comments at a public telecoms conference about a high profile court case involving ISP iiNet have been deemed by a number of sources as inappropriate, defamatory and potentially prejudicial to the case.</i><br><br>iiNet, Australia's third largest ISP, is doing battle in the Federal Court of NSW with a consortium of movie studios and a TV network that have accused it of allowing its network to be used to illegally download copyright entertainment. The ISP also happens to be one of Senator Conroy's biggest critics and recently pulled out of his office's much maligned Internet filter trial.<br><br>The public slanging between the Communications Minister and iiNet is hard to find a precedent for in the ICT industry. The CEO of iiNet, Michael Malone, has told iTWire and a number of other media sources quite openly that he believes Senator Conroy is the worst Communications Minister ever and described him as incompetent.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.itwire.com/content/view/24222/1023/" >www.itwire.com/content/view/24222/1023/</A><br><br>also<br><br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>iiNet tests legality of Conroy slur</b><br><br><i>PERTH-headquartered ISP iiNet said it has sought legal advice on Communications Minister Senator Stephen Conroy's public commentary on its legal defence in a high-profile copyright case before the NSW Federal Court.</i><br><br>IiNet managing director Michael Malone said that the comments were a form of retribution against the ISP for pulling out of the Department of Broadband Communications and Digital Economy&#146;s controversial internet filtering trial.<br><br>&#147;We have sought legal advice on this.  It's unheard of for a crown minister to try to influence the outcome of an active case,&#148; Mr Malone said.<br><br>IiNet&#146;s concerns orbit comments that Senator Conroy is reported to have made at a high-profile communications forum in Sydney.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25280013-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 03 Apr 2009 07:11:45 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Black lists needed in child porn fight</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22136870</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote">Why on earth did this forced idea come from.</div>Ignorance and religion.<br><br>If they could take down the botnets, then the amount of "objectionable" material on the net would be small enough to not be a problem.  And if they do not take down the botnets, no amount of filtering/blocking is ever going to stop it.<br><br>The trouble is that taking down botnets is difficult and expensive, and it is hard to peddle in a political speech.  Using worthless blocklists is a lot cheaper and easier and can be made to sound good in political speeches.<br> </div>It is certainly motivated by the tiny conservative Christian minority. They submitted several petitions to the Senate back in 2006. They are all printed on a form from the same extreme Christian organisation. <br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://blog.websinthe.org/2009/03/15/the-source-of-conroys-mandate-and-how-hes-abused-it/" >blog.websinthe.org/2009/03/15/th&middot;&middot;&middot;used-it/</A><br><br>Of all the petitions submitted, only one, with 15 signatures asked for mandatory censorship. The actual numbers are in the link. Opt-in cleanfeed asked for by around 30,000 people in 2006. The article explains how the numbers worked.<br><br>The botnets and malware infections are probably responsible for much of the innocent exposure to porn. Fear of computers is a bigger issue than I'd realised. There seems to be some groups of parents that think that their children know so much more than them that they are frightened of what their children may access. This rather surprises me as most of the current generation of parents grew up since computers were commonly available at school and then in the workplace so parents have used them. What is it they are so scared of? What is it that they think this sort of censorship will fix.<br><br>There were no computers when I was at school. My introduction to IT was through working with controls systems for plant and equipment (engineering) rather than the traditional IT path. I was burning EPROMs and programming PLCs and installing PCBs in control units and using RS232 to RS422/485 for comms when I had young children. I'm in the "dignified", grandmotherly age group these days and I'm still puzzled about this fear of computers and the internet. It absolutely has to be at least part media hype about awful things.<br> ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 08:34:22 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22136540</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  fatness <A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The Communications Minister, Stephen Conroy, has admitted that Bill Henson images were added to the communications regulator's list of prohibited websites in error, while blaming the addition of a dentist's site to the blacklist on the "Russian mob".<br><hr></blockquote> </div>Don't worry about  Longboard <A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> and the comment on they are knocking at his door.<br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Longboard <A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>.....i have to go now there is a SWAT team  at the door because I have apparently got wikileaks in my bookmarks and am a known frequenter of the site, ...they have killed my dog... beaten my partner... and terrified my children......I might be gone for some time..... </div>Mine is next because I use a Russian A/V??<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 05:02:48 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Hackers attack Classification Board website</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22136533</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Wow, what goes on while your busy at work?<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>A PRANK message has appeared on the Classification Board's official website in a hacking attack. <br><br>The message, posted overnight, replaced the welcome text on the Government body's homepage. <br><br>"This site contains information about the boards that have the right to CONRTROL (sic) YOUR FREEDOMZ," it said. <br><br>"The Classification Board has the right to not just classify content (the name is an ELABORATE TRICK), but also the right to DECIDE WHAT IS AND ISNT APPROPRIATE and BAN CONTENT FROM THE PUBLIC." <br><br>It continues: &#147;We are part of an ELABORATE DECEPTION from CHINA to CONTROL AND SHEEPIFY the NATION, to PROTECT THE CHILDREN. All opposers must HATE CHILDREN.&#148; <br><br>The message was noticed about 8pm (AEDT) yesterday and stayed online for a few hours. <br><br>The Classification website has been inaccessible for several hours. <br><br>A spokesperson for the Classification Board confirmed the attack, and said it was being investigated. The Australian Federal Police are not currently involved.<hr></blockquote><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small><div class="borderless"><TABLE WIDTH=95% align=center border=0 CELLPADDING=4"><TR><TD ALIGN=CENTER VALIGN=CENTER BGCOLOR=#FFFFFF nwrap COLSPAN=3 WIDTH=100%><A HREF="/speak/slideshow/22136533?c=1413260&ret=L2ZvcnVtL3IyMTM0MTc3NS54bWw%3D"><IMG class="apic" BORDER=0 TITLE="52512 bytes" WIDTH=600 HEIGHT=263 SRC="/r0/download/1413260.thumb600~e57d21e3997c23c87db300a4821a7056/0,,6551276,00.jpg/thumb.jpg" ALT="Click for full size"></A></TD></TABLE></div>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 04:52:06 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22135949</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> :  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The Communications Minister, Stephen Conroy, has admitted that Bill Henson images were added to the communications regulator's list of prohibited websites in error, while blaming the addition of a dentist's site to the blacklist on the "Russian mob".<br><br>Meanwhile, the website of the Federal Government's censorship body, the Classification Board, was hacked last night and defaced with an anti-censorship screed.<br><br>The admission by Senator Conroy on ABC television's Q&A program last night casts significant doubt on the Government's ability to filter the internet without inadvertently blocking legitimate websites.<br><br>Q&A was inundated with 2000 questions from the public about the Government's hugely unpopular policy, and the audience last night ridiculed Senator Conroy by laughing at a number of his responses.<hr></blockquote><br><br><A HREF="http://www.theage.com.au/news/home/technology/conroy-uses-russian-mob-defence/2009/03/27/1237657120642.html">Conroy admits blacklist error, blames 'Russian mob'</a><br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 23:27:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Black lists needed in child porn fight</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22131590</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : <div class="bquote">Why on earth did this forced idea come from.</div>Ignorance and religion.<br><br>If they could take down the botnets, then the amount of "objectionable" material on the net would be small enough to not be a problem.  And if they do not take down the botnets, no amount of filtering/blocking is ever going to stop it.<br><br>The trouble is that taking down botnets is difficult and expensive, and it is hard to peddle in a political speech.  Using worthless blocklists is a lot cheaper and easier and can be made to sound good in political speeches.<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.7</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 10:10:50 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Black lists needed in child porn fight</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22131468</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,25249304-29277,00.html" >www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,25&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br><div class="bquote">BLACK lists are needed to combat child pornography, pro-rape and incest websites, Communications Minister Stephen Conroy says <br>Mr Conroy said legitimate Queensland dental websites had to be blocked because Russian hackers had illegally posted child porn on them.<br><br>"It is possible to support a black list and support free speech," Senator Conroy said ABC TV last night.<br><br>But the minister admitted that a PG-rated site, featuring images of children by controversial photographer Bill Henson, was wrongly blocked because of a "technical issue".<br><br>Political lobby group GetUp! says this demonstrated the failure of internet filtering.<br><br>"The minister's comments have proven internet censorship just won't work," GetUp! national director Simon Sheikh said.<br><br>Senator Conroy said the Government's proposed internet filter was not about political censorship.<br><br>"It would go against the fundamental tenets of the Labor Party to suggest we'll block political content, which is the China line and Saudi Arabia line," he said. <br><br>Mr Sheikh, who has been campaigning against the government's proposed internet filter trial, said Senator Conroy's comments supporting the right of political websites showed pro-euthanasia and abortion websites were safe.<br><br>"He's responding to public pressure," Mr Sheikh said.<br><br>"It's clear the minister has watered down his support for internet censorship and hopefully, will see him walk away from internet censorship altogether."<br><br>A black list of more than 2000 websites banned by the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA) was published on the whistleblower website Wikileaks last week.<br><br>Senator Conroy said a black list was needed to tackle pro-rape, pro-child pornography and pro-incest websites, adding it would give parents the choice to block certain internet sites.<br><br>He said ACMA would apply the same internet filtering principles to the internet as the classification board applied to television and radio. <br><br>But Opposition frontbencher Greg Hunt warned there was a danger of the Government encroaching on political freedoms to combat the "worst of the worst" websites.<br><br>"We need to increase the resources to take on people who will engage in child pornography and increase penalties for those acting illegally," Mr Hunt said.<br><br>Three of Australia's biggest internet service providers have withdrawn from the government's proposed internet service filter, including Telstra.<br><br>After news of the leak emerged, Senator Conroy condemned the breach and warned that anyone who published the black list of banned websites risked criminal prosecution. <br><br>"No one interested in cyber safety would condone the leaking of this list," he said.<br><br>A recent Galaxy poll of 1100 people, commissioned by GetUp!, found 86 per cent of respondents were in favour of parents having the primary responsibility for protecting children online.</div>I wonder if I could earn a few extra dollars to pay for the kids education here?<br><br>The minister is grabbing at straws, with a lack of real understanding of the issues involved on the internet.<br><br>We have a site here today, gone tomorrow, then another appears, gone tomorrow, etc, etc, etc. Maybe he could use the knowledge of people like  hpguru <A HREF="/useremail/u/615773"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>, sites like <A HREF="http://www.mvps.org/">Mvps</a>, <A HREF="http://www.bluetack.co.uk/forums/index.php?autocom=faq&CODE=02&qid=16">BlueTack</a> or any site, including now defunct <b>CastleCops</b>, and others such as <A HREF="http://asap.maddoktor2.com/">ASAP</a> and <A HREF="http://secunia.com/">Secunia</a> and the likes of utilising listing/logging services such as <A HREF="http://www.dshield.org/">dshield</a> and <A HREF="http://www.linklogger.com/">LinkLogger</a>.<br><br>I'm sure with all those resources you could come up with a secure, content filtering router for any home that would like the option. <br><br>The only question then is, as most of the sites/members I've just listed would say, is the resources for collective gathering for a filter list simply because what is here today is gone tomorrow with the internet and so many sites.<br><br>Why on earth did this <b>forced</b> idea come from. If one thing of revealing these lists has been learnt, the research needed to engage such a list, and the homework needed to keep it valid, without affecting perfectly legit businesses, that get exploited by vulnerabilities, or bad coding/scripting (excuse my generalization) of web pages on the internet don't stay blacklisted, or even reach a black list at all. Wouldn't a helping hand fixing the exploited pages be better than plain "block". How is that cleaning up the net?<br><br>Enough for our lecture today........  <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 09:46:15 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Another leak?</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22125161</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : To save answering myself much more, I'll just list a few good links that are worth a read.<br><br>&#8226; <A HREF="http://www.somebodythinkofthechildren.com/category/discussion-of-internet-censorship-mainly-in-australia/">Archive for the &#145;Internet Censorship&#146; Category at www.somebodythinkofthechildren.com</a><br><br>(An archive of some of the items on the list and a description and more, no direct link to any list that will incur $11,000 fine).<br><br>&#8226; <A HREF="http://newmatilda.com/2009/03/23/tangled-web">NewMatilda-The Tangled Web</a><br><br>(A public forum has just started that gives great detail and interpretation of what has evolved so far and is travelling around the states debating this issue.)<br><br>&#8226; <A HREF="http://www.techworld.com.au/article/296839/govt_undeterred_by_blacklist_leaks">Govt undeterred by blacklist leaks</a> ; <A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,25240699-5014239,00.html">leaked list of banned websites 'seems like ACMA's blacklist'</a> and <A HREF="http://techwiredau.com/2009/03/a-faith-based-approach-conroy-and-his-filter/">A Faith-Based Approach - Conroy And His Filter</a><br><br>(These are after a public press conference and give some basic details of the minister's reply to the public outcry over the lists)<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 25 Mar 2009 09:21:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Another leak?</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22118678</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : It is getting juicy now.<br><br><div class="bquote"><b>New 'ACMA blacklist' leak claims banned websites list was recently edited</b><br><br>A NEW blacklist of websites has appeared online just days after the Government was left red-faced by a <A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,25210163-5014239,00.html">similar leak</a>. <br><br>Despite previous official denials, the anonymous post claims the list of websites definitely comes from the Government watchdog. <br><br>It also claims the list has been updated since it was first published on whistleblowing website Wikileaks. <br><br>"All three lists come from the same Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA) approved filtering software company source and described internally as the 'ACMA' list," the post said. <br><br>"Between the 11th (of March) and yesterday, the company did an enormous cleanup of the list. No doubt as a result of the list appearing on Wikileaks." <br><br>Wikileaks was brought down by excessive traffic when the first lists were leaked last week. <br><br>The list was allegedly edited after reports that it included innocent content such as Wikipedia pages and a dentist's website. <br><br>"It is probable that the company only added, but never previously deleted, sites from the updates sent by ACMA," the post said.</div>If this doesn't say the Australian people don't want it, nothing does. I just can't for the life of me understand how much dissent is out there on this, because it is not attacking the issue of internet exploitation and only allowing room for secrecy and manipulation from within the ranks of government.<br><br>Oh to really care for the issues out there on the net.......we would all be behind them.<br><br>Edit: More info :-<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://sydneydiver.blogspot.com/2009/03/second-black-list-made-available.html" >sydneydiver.blogspot.com/2009/03&middot;&middot;&middot;ble.html</A><br><br><div class="bquote"><b>Loose thoughts by Bjorn Landfeldt</b><br><br>Wikileaks made a second list available on the 20th of March. The second list is a cleaned up version of the first list that now contains some 1170 entries.<br><br>Since the government threatened to prosecute any Australian involved in leaking the list, Wikileaks responded by threatening the Australian government with legal action since the action is firmly protected by Swedish law and Wikileaks operates within that jurisdiction. Interesting, is there an international diplomatic conflict about to happen as well over this? Perhaps I (as a Swede and Aussie) will have to chose sides, and which army to join after all :).<br><br>It is extremely stupid to distribute a list in cleartext in the first place. I have no idea who at ACMA decided to hand out clear text ASCII files with all the banned sites but it was not a struck of genius to do so. Why did ACMA not simply hash the sites and distributed a file with hashed values? Any filter implementation can still hash each destination URL and compare with the list without the destination address ever being exposed. It is true that there would still be people within the ACMA who would have acces to the original clear text list but the risk of spreading of the list would be much lower.<br><br>Wikileaks apparently also published a simple way of extracting the list from a down loadable software package from the netalert scheme era. Apparently, it is possible to extract a file with the conspicuous name "Websites_ACMA.txt". Well designed security software!! I wonder if the developers had dumbed down 3-year Australian university degrees......</div>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.ozsource.org/source/cleenfeed-acma-blacklist-and-wikileaks/" >www.ozsource.org/source/cleenfee&middot;&middot;&middot;kileaks/</A><br><br><div class="bquote"><b>CleenFeed: ACMA Blacklist and Wikileaks</b><br><br>ACMA&#146;s secret list of banned web pages has reportedly been leaked to Wikileaks.org although it appears the method to derive this list is not as sinister as the mainstream media has made out.  The original leaked list appeared to be 2 years old, full of dead urls and with a couple of new URLs tacked on for good measure.  The second list published on the 20th of March has been explained in a bit more detail by Wikileaks. This <A HREF="http://www.crikey.com.au/Politics/20090323-Escalation-of-the-blacklist-wars.html">Crikey</a> quote explains the Blacklist comes from a group of:<br><br><i><A HREF="http://www.iia.net.au/index.php/component/content/416.html?task=view">Family Friendly Filters</a> and one of those provided free to (a few) Australian families by the Howard government&#146;s now defunct <A HREF="http://www.netalert.gov.au/">NetAlert</a> scheme. Provided you&#146;re reasonably tech-savvy, you can extract a list of URLs with the rather unambiguous name &#147;Websites_ACMA.txt&#148;. Depending on which version of the software you download, you get the August 2008 list as published, or something similar containing more recent material.</i></div><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 24 Mar 2009 06:05:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22115070</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Longboard <A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Did anyone see the references to Conroy's office threatening to 'list' Whirlpool as an undesirable as there seems to be a lot of critical comment there re the net Filter.<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.theage.com.au/national/labors-blogwatch-plan-hits-whirlpool-of-dissent-20090321-951z.html" >www.theage.com.au/national/labor&middot;&middot;&middot;51z.html</A><br> </div>There doesn't seem to be anything specific mentioned at his home page relating to any of this 'monitoring' of web sites. I guess it boils down to words of wisdom. He may be hoping something slanderous or the like is mentioned, in hope it can force 'shut' any opposition to this.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.theage.com.au/national/labors-blogwatch-plan-hits-whirlpool-of-dissent-20090321-951z.html" >www.theage.com.au/national/labor&middot;&middot;&middot;51z.html</A> <br><br><div class="bquote">THE Government will begin trawling blog sites as part of a new media monitoring strategy, with documents singling out a website critical of Communications Minister Stephen Conroy for special mention.<br><br>Soon after Senator Conroy praised Singapore's Government for reducing monitoring of blogs, tender documents issued by the Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy reveal it is looking for a "comprehensive digital monitoring service for print and electronic media".<br><br>The department later attached a clarification confirming the term "electronic media" included "blogs such as Whirlpool".<br><br>Whirlpool, the only blog site mentioned, has criticised Senator Conroy's plans to filter internet content and his handling of the Government's $15 billion national broadband network. It is a community-run internet forum devoted to discussing broadband internet access.<br><br>Senator Conroy this month told a conference in Germany that it was a "really positive sign" that the Singaporean Government had given up monitoring blogs.<br><br>But the documents suggest the Australian Government is just about to start. Senator Conroy's spokesman said it was "only natural" that the tender include services for monitoring relevant blogs.<br><br>"Whirlpool is a long-established online platform for news and information covering a wide range of topics across the telecommunications sector," the spokesman said. "It and other websites provide valuable insight into the industries in which we work."<br><br>Opposition communications spokesman Nick Minchin claimed it was "extreme" and an unacceptable use of taxpayers' money to expand media monitoring to blogs.<br><br>"The minister has been caught out telling an important international audience one thing, while at the same time putting the wheels in motion back home to use taxpayers' money to do the complete opposite," Senator Minchin said.<br><br>A spokesman for the department said it had used Whirlpool as an example of a blog site that might be monitored because a prospective bidder for the contract had asked for a clarification.</div><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 23 Mar 2009 14:26:20 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22114992</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Longboard <A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The whirlpool thread relating to the net filter is now 35 'parts' long, each part can be <u>50 pages of the forum</u> !! <br>Don't think this has been posted b4: current pages:<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1167474" >forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re&middot;&middot;&middot;=1167474</A><br>Whirlpool summary:<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://whirlpool.net.au/wiki/?tag=cleanfeed" >whirlpool.net.au/wiki/?tag=cleanfeed</A><br> </div>I've not seen anywhere yet a topic as large as this at Whirlpool, in the first days alone of the filter becoming public, the site had 4-6 parts long, and has not shown any slowing, talk about response. <br><br>It also seems that even some of the ISP's have had enough.<br><br>IiNet have withdrawn from any options at testing even though they were always willing to test simply to show how ineffective it will be.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25230591-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br><div class="bquote">IiNet yesterday pulled out of the federal Government's internet filtering trials, blaming drawn-out negotiations with the Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy, constant changes in policy, and last week's leak of a secret internet blacklist. <br><br>Chief executive Michael Malone said iiNet only agreed to participate in the trial to demonstrate that the filter was flawed and a waste of taxpayers' money, but last week's blacklist leak was the final straw. "To use Conroy's own words, the internet filter is now a dead parrot and there's no point investing any time or money in this," Mr Malone said. <br><br>"We were going to be there to demonstrate in the wild that this thing has serious problems and that has been self-evidently proven by the department's actions and last week's leak."</div>  <br><br>Telstra had already committed to a "no" for testing back in December, but considering the issues surrounding Telstra and the government at the time, I doubt you could get an answer specific to the filtering, there was a lot of tit for tat regarding the restructuring of the internet service in Australia between the 2.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.theage.com.au/national/telstra-shuns-internet-filtering-trial-20081208-6u1n.html" >www.theage.com.au/national/telst&middot;&middot;&middot;u1n.html</A><br><br><div class="bquote">AUSTRALIA'S largest internet service provider has said it will not participate in trials of the Federal Government's controversial national internet filter.<br><br>Telstra's BigPond said yesterday it would not be part of the pilot, which will run for six weeks from this month, citing "customer management issues".<br><br>It wouldn't say what the issues were but Telstra is believed to be worried about the effect on its reputation of any inconvenience to customers.<br><br>The Government has asked ISPs to test the filter, which will block more than 10,000 sites and has been criticised by the Greens, Federal Opposition, the internet industry, consumers and online rights groups.</div>  <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 23 Mar 2009 14:10:53 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22113582</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : Outrageous: by definition: going beyond all standards of what is right or decent.<br>Undoubtedly dslreports for the chop in Oz for hosting this thread.  :D<br>The whirlpool thread relating to the net filter is now 35 'parts' long, each part can be <u>50 pages of the forum</u> !! <br>Don't think this has been posted b4: current pages:<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1167474" >forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re&middot;&middot;&middot;=1167474</A><br>Whirlpool summary:<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://whirlpool.net.au/wiki/?tag=cleanfeed" >whirlpool.net.au/wiki/?tag=cleanfeed</A><br>Almost an industry in itself, no lack of interest !!<br><br>Thought these are some nice quotes, nothing we don't already appreciate, but well said:<br>"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." ; Benjamin Franklin<br><br>"All censorships exist to prevent anyone from challenging current conceptions and existing institutions. All progress is initiated by challenging current conceptions"; George Bernard Shaw<br><br>"In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist;<br>And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist;<br>And then they came for the Jews, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew; and then . . . they came for me . . . And by that time there was no one left to speak up." ; Pastor Martin Niem&ouml;ller (1892-1984)<br><br>"The Internet interprets censorship as damage and routes around it." - John Gilmore<br><br>@The Janitor and the mods:<br>Thanks for allowing this thread to continue.<br><br>If I might, one more contemporaneous and apt quote from Stella Rimington recent head of MI5:<br>"It would be better that the government recognised that there are risks, rather than frightening people in order to be able to pass laws which restrict civil liberties, precisely one of the objects of terrorism - that we live in fear and under a police state," <br>Regards.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 23 Mar 2009 09:43:52 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22113558</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : From that article:<br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>THE <i>Government will begin trawling blog sites as part of a new media monitoring strategy, with documents singling out a website critical of Communications Minister Stephen Conroy for special mention.</i><br><br>Soon after Senator Conroy praised Singapore's Government for reducing monitoring of blogs, tender documents issued by the Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy reveal it is looking for a "comprehensive digital monitoring service for print and electronic media".<br><br>The department later attached a clarification confirming the term "electronic media" included "blogs such as Whirlpool".<hr></blockquote><br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 23 Mar 2009 09:38:49 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22112105</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : LOL: absurdity on absurdity...<br>Did anyone see the references to Conroy's office threatening to 'list' Whirlpool as an undesirable as there seems to be a lot of critical comment there re the net Filter.<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.theage.com.au/national/labors-blogwatch-plan-hits-whirlpool-of-dissent-20090321-951z.html" >www.theage.com.au/national/labor&middot;&middot;&middot;51z.html</A><br>Unbelievable: Australia really is becoming OZ: cast Conroy as the Wicked Witch of the West.<br>This is now spinning right out of control: keep the powder stockpiled and dry.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 22 Mar 2009 21:42:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22111440</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : You're right. It's a very lazy substitute for serious crime prevention.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 22 Mar 2009 18:54:46 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22109880</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : Plus it is easier to censor I guess than using current laws to catch and put in jail the real sickos creating the material. I do not mean the links per se but the actual creators of the extreme bad stuff. That is just too much work. ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 22 Mar 2009 11:33:43 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22109859</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  fatness <A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Longboard <A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>It's so absurd that the eager beavers who want this "filter" for their "protect us against all evil (and crush the opposition) agenda" in place are so shortsighted they cannot see how it will be turned against them in time.<br> </div>And all it takes is one election for that to happen.<br> </div>Jeez. Elections should be made secret also. This to prevent the bad people from taking control. All results are confidential need to know. All you need to know is they are still in charge afterwards protecting your safety. Those voting against them where blacklisted therefor their votes did not count. ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 22 Mar 2009 11:28:05 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22109548</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Something that may, or may not be relevant, but seeing as the ACMA seem to also be in the limelight because of the idea of using the list??<br>(Nothing factual)<br><br>I wonder where we stand for porn advertising on the TV, be it midnight or not, as it is there at present.<br>I know I don't want my kids seeing it. <br><br>I am just curious if it is relevant enough in an arguement where we are allowed to see porn on tv and influnce our children at home, yet this is all about morality and the internet? How long has TV been around now????<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 22 Mar 2009 09:41:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22103901</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : Yet another view:<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://apnews.excite.com/article/20090320/D971RA880.html" >apnews.excite.com/article/200903&middot;&middot;&middot;880.html</A><br><br>Mar 20, 11:24 AM (ET)<br><br>By KRISTEN GELINEAU<br><br>SYDNEY, Australia (AP) - A whistle-blower organization claims a secret list of Web sites that Australian authorities are proposing to ban includes such innocuous destinations as a dentist's office.<br><br>Australia's government denied that the list - published by renegade Web site Wikileaks.org - was the same as a blacklist run by the Australian Communications and Media Authority, or ACMA. However, a manager at the dentist's office said the ACMA had confirmed her site's inclusion on the ban list.<br><br>Wikileaks' publication of the list this week reignited a debate over whether a government proposal to impose an Internet filter for all Australians could have unintended consequences for innocent businesses.<br><br>The list in question is provided to the creators of Internet filtering software that people can opt to install on their computers. But Communications Minister Stephen Conroy has proposed mandating that Australian Internet service providers implement the list, which would make Australia one of the strictest Internet regulators among democratic countries. Several Internet providers are conducting trials of the filter through June.<br><br> <br>The authority says the list largely contains the addresses of Web sites promoting child pornography and sexual violence, but it has refused to release its contents publicly.<br><br>The proposal has prompted protests across the country, with critics slamming it as censorship. Internet providers argued that a filter could slow browsing speeds, and pointed out that illegal material such as child pornography can be traded on peer-to-peer networks or chats, which would not be covered by the filter.<br><br>On its site, Wikileaks accused Australia of "acting like a democratic backwater," and said "Australian democracy must not be permitted to sleep with this loaded gun." The site - which casts itself as an outlet for "untraceable mass document leaking and analysis," with a focus on exposing oppressive regimes and unethical behavior - did not explain how it obtained the purported blacklist.<br><br>The list published on Wikileaks contains around 2,400 Internet addresses, many of which are clearly for child pornography. But the list also includes a dental office, online poker parlors, a kennel and a school-cafeteria consultancy firm.<br><br>Kelly Wilson, a manager at Dental Distinction in the Australian state of Queensland, said she had no idea her office's site had been blacklisted until a newspaper reporter informed her Thursday. Wilson contacted the ACMA, which she said confirmed the site was on the authority's blacklist. She said she was offered no explanation why.<br><br>The site was hacked more than a year ago, and visitors were temporarily redirected to an adult Web site. The office quickly switched to a different Internet provider and hasn't had a problem since, she said.<br><br>"We're a little annoyed that we're on there," Wilson said. "It's a great Web site."<br><br>Jocelyn Ashcroft, owner of Tuckshop and Canteen Management Consultants in Queensland, whose apparently innocent site was also included on the Wikileaks list, worried that her business could be hurt.<br><br>More at link<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 21:12:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22099681</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Longboard <A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Small article in the SMH today ( Friday) haven't checked anything else.<br>Keeps the spotlight on.<br>Obviously most opposition will come from web activists, hopefully editors of the big dailies will focus some attention in the print media.<br>Particularly after this episode.<br> </div>There wasn't a great deal of broadcast media coverage, although it got mentioned on radio and on Lateline on the ABC. None of the commercial TV channels covered it. Possibly due to the threats of fines and law enforcement action.<br><br>You may need to remember that ACMA manages the "censorship", but it also administers and controls the broadcasting media and media licensing. Print media is covered under different law and regulations and isn't licensed the same way the broadcast media is.<br><br>There's been heaps of print/online coverage. Much of it edited after publication and threats of prosecution for posting links. The OCAU wiki has a full list of media coverage in chronological order. &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Australian_Internet_Filtering#Media_Coverage" >www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Aus&middot;&middot;&middot;Coverage</A><br><br>Today's coverage is here &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Australian_Internet_Filtering_Media_Coverage#20_March_2009" >www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Aus&middot;&middot;&middot;rch_2009</A><br><br>Scroll up for yesterday's coverage.<br><br>Wikileaks was not happy about receiving threats from Senator Conroy. (This is not a link to the leaked blacklist) &raquo;<A HREF="http://wikileaks.org/wiki/Wikileaks_to_Conroy:_Go_after_our_source_and_we_will_go_after_you" >wikileaks.org/wiki/Wikileaks_to_&middot;&middot;&middot;fter_you</A><br><br>Note: wikileaks is under considerable load at the moment. He has also advised by Twitter that he intends to release a more recent version of the blacklist in a couple of hours from now so wikileaks will be hammered again.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 04:50:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22098616</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : Small article in the SMH today ( Friday) haven't checked anything else.<br>Keeps the spotlight on.<br>Obviously most opposition will come from web activists, hopefully editors of the big dailies will focus some attention in the print media.<br>Particularly after this episode.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 22:18:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22094071</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : You have to give it a day or so, you may hear on the radio, but papers are already printed is my guess, and I can't see this misdemeanor as front page news that will hold the presses.<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 09:33:59 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22094054</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : Didn't see this on the main news tonight on TV, but it was an Item in Lateline on ABC: have to wait and see re newspapers in the Am if they run with this.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 09:28:28 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22094044</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : That's pretty much how I'm reading it as far as the list is. There would be no need for anything in respect to the federal police if it is fake. <br><br>As for the issue of having to not look the idiot in this all, the list has to be claimed as a fake, just to save face. This is where I can't understand why so many do this.<br><br>We are human and not perfect by any means, we have to go beyond our own transgressions. It would be better to realise you are wrong and ask for help, then loose all face, simply because you can not face up to your own short falls.<br><br>We are in a society now where pressures are high and what is realistic, may in fact be false, because you did not look into it more and try to study it, but rather accept it is as it is, simply because someone told you it is.<br><br>We have the internet as a powerful weapon for the growth of us, our children and their children's children. We can learn from it's power, and it's short falls, and apply it to make it a better place for us all, simply because we have access to so much knowledge.<br><br>Personally private, confidential info really needs to be reviewed if we are to keep the internet alive, but general knowledge is just that, general knowledge. I'm sure an old copy of the Encyclopedia Britannica has info on some nasty stuff, but it was published all the same.<br><br>For me if it is the real thing this list, then this issue has just had a wake up call for all of us. Let's hope we learn and apply and help our offspring, not force them into hiding in fear of retribution simply because someone with power believes they are right. And ultimately allow our youth, with a path of learning, exploring, understanding and ultimately growth can then apply it to the next generation because he/she has had the right teaching.<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 09:25:22 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22093824</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : It is likely it is the ACMA blacklist, the dates and numbers of sites appear to correlate with ACMA's published numbers of sites which is issued approximately monthly with no removals. ACMA claim the blacklist is routinely washed. It may not have been, which would leave greater numbers in the real list. The ACMA figures are then open to question as they are the ones provided to parliament.<br><br>It's been cracked out of one of the NetAlert PC filters supplied free by the government until last December. This was the system the blacklist was designed for and it only affects the PC filter suppliers. The cracked list appears to match the wikileaks list.<br><br>The censorship regime has not yet started, but the plan was to use the blacklist as the basis on the system.<br><br>Senator Conroy and ACMA are damned if they say it is and graciously accept it has been leaked. They are damned if they say it isn't, but we are going to put you in jail for 10 years if you access a link. He is threatening Police investigations and substantial jail time. This would seem to indicate that it is the blacklist anyway.<br><br>Senator Conroy can say it isn't all day long, but his credibility is already seriously compromised and I doubt anyone believes him.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 08:09:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22093647</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Thanks for keeping us up to date.<br><br>Now I have some questions regarding the reply of the ACMA<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,25210931-5014239,00.html" >www.news.com.au/technology/story&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>"However, the list provided to ACMA differs markedly in length and format to the ACMA blacklist. The ACMA blacklist has at no stage been 2300 URLs in length and at August 2008 consisted of 1061 URLs. It is therefore completely inaccurate to say that the list of 2300 URLs constitutes an ACMA blacklist. "<hr></blockquote><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>ACMA is investigating the matter and may refer it to the Australian Federal Police.<hr></blockquote><br><br>So this list that has been suggested as posted isn't yours?<br>Fair enough, so why the following comments then?<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The watchdog has warned that anyone who republishes the list or attempts to access child pornography sites on it could face up to 10 years in prison.<hr></blockquote><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>t has also warned that linking to sites on the list could incur fines of up to $11,000 a day.<hr></blockquote><br><br>What happens if I want to visit the dentist?<br><br>Why would you say "child pron" and none other on the list?<br><br>Will I get fined $11,000 for posting a list if it isn't your list and I made no comment to it being your list list. I'm therefore not making any slanderous or derogatory statements am I? Will I incur the fine?<br><br>------------------------------------------------------<br><br>Not that I have any need, there is a hosts file, registry file, anti banner, no third party cookies, no referrers in the browser as well.<br><br>I'm still for bringing the price of content filtering to the router and download-able files. I see no qualms with that, oh but that isn't forced control either? And what of proxies via other countries to get access back to sites that are blocked? Will the ISP be able to deal with that? Not that I'm a sicko, but any sicko will end up just VPN tunneling if need be, sure these sick sites will make it possible if you attempt a simple blocked URL. <br><br>And to think If I'm exploited because of a trojan stealing my credentials or my ID because of a script or compromised link, it doesn't matter.<br><br>Put your thinking caps on team, and hit the real issues out there, not some minority sicko sites, but using it for a forced "we control what you view" crap.<br><br>Any way enough of my learning from 15/2/2005 from sites like DSLR, I will have a "better carer" looking after me! <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 06:18:15 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22093347</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : Ah kewl: now it's really in the public eye and well and truly on the nose..<br>Good for the SMH and news (whatever their agenda  ;) )<br>: keep shining the light: that's the way to grind this stupidity up.<br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The Queensland dentist included on the Australian communications regulator's blacklist of prohibited websites has demanded that the list be cleaned up, as he is now being associated with child porn peddlers and sexual violence sites.<hr></blockquote><br>What a howler, hope he sues the shyte out of them for loss of business, slander by implication etcetc and any one else on the list by mistake ( school tuck shops guilty for selling white bread or lollies?? ) needs to get stuck into their local member.<br>LOL, you dont want to upset those dentists... :o<br>The Dental Professional Associations should use this to take a stripe out of the govt.<br>That may be another way to apply pressure to this misinstituted nonsense.<br><br>Sorry, <br>typed that in the heat of the moment: just so many aspects to this series of events that reek of stupidity it's been hard to get my breath: had to go for a ciggie heh heh.<br><br>A list of stuff, Australian Security ??, Conroy demonstrating by his hollow denials he has little or no understanding of how filtering works ??, the absurdity of some sites listed.., I love the spotlight being shone into this little dark hole,  dont screw with the web, use it to your advantage not try and lock it down: duh !! <br>and so on<br><br>I didnt even know about half those sites: and wouldn't even have thought of searching, ?? Wikileaks may have made a mistake by publishing, although I suppose they had to for "proof" , but nice of our govt to supply the perverts with a library  :uhh:<br><br>now I think I know who made some of those sites popular: and I dont like my neighbour or the guy who is competing with me for a contract: guess I'll have to inform on them: changing my nick to STASI !!<br> ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 02:17:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22093317</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : It's finally hit the real life media. Discussions have heated up considerably today. Wikileaks has published a leaked blacklist, presumed to be ACMA's blacklist but may contain some censorware vendor material. I'm not going to post the Wikileaks link. It's easy enough to find and their server has carked under the load. Will be worse if it hits Slashdot. The list contains many very nasty sites (and I'm not checking them) but also includes innocent sites and several quite innocent businesses.<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The Queensland dentist included on the Australian communications regulator's blacklist of prohibited websites has demanded that the list be cleaned up, as he is now being associated with child porn peddlers and sexual violence sites.<br><br>Whisleblower site Wikileaks published the top-secret ACMA list today.<br><br>Websites contained on it will be blocked for all Australians once the government implements its mandatory internet filtering scheme - originally pitched as targeting only "illegal" content - later this year.<br><br>But, as experts have long warned the government, having a top-secret blacklist of banned sites is dangerous because there is a real danger that Australian businesses could be added to the list in error, with little recourse.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/03/19/1237054973414.html" >www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/03/&middot;&middot;&middot;414.html</A><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/03/19/1237054961100.html" >www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/03/&middot;&middot;&middot;100.html</A><br><br>This article attracted over 200 comments in less than two hours after it was posted. Not many were flattering.<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/comments/0,23600,25210163-5014239,00.html" >www.news.com.au/comments/0,23600&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 02:04:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22085790</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Doctor Four <A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>And Australia seems to have jumped ahead of the others in this area. So linking is now thought crime?<br> </div>Not necessarily.<br><br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Other Australian websites and blogs continue to display the location of the banned web page, but ACMA says no action will be taken as "ACMA has not received any other complaints about links to the content concerned".<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25196505-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br> </div>The mandatory censorship scheme is not yet in place.<br><br>The blacklist referred to in these press releases is the current list that is sent to the maintainers of local PC based child filtering systems. The ones like Net Nanny. Until December last year, the government provided these free to any interested parents. The uptake and ongoing use was so poor that this scheme was canceled and the current censorship proposal is supposed to work better "to protect the children". The blacklist doesn't do anything else at the moment.<br><br>The current blacklist is entirely complaint based. By ACMA's own data, less than half the list is related to child depiction or child pornography. The rest of the list is material that would be legal (MA15+, R etc.) if it was in the broadcast media or it is material that has been refused classification. Refused classification material has not been reviewed by the Classification Board. ACMA assumes it would be prohibited if the Classification Board did actually see it. AFAIK none of the blacklisted material has been put in front of a court that would allow the word illegal to be applied.<br><br>If, and when, the mandatory internet censorship scheme is implemented the blacklist will form the basis of the "censored" material. There have been rumours of also using the IWF list or incorporating the IWF list into ACMA's blacklist.<br><br>The censorware vendors all have their own proprietary lists, which are protected by copyright. The censorware vendors are rumoured to be funding the current round of tests of the censorship system. There are people on Facebook with more friends than the participating ISPs have as customers. 5 out of 6 of them are business only ISPs and are tiny. iPrimus is the largest and already offers a "cleanfeed" to interested customers.<br><br>Lobbying by groups such as the Ausralian Christian Lobby (doesn't disclose membership lists or funding sources) and the censorware vendors (undisclosed) have probably influenced the government. <br><br>There are a number of comments left on articles published on line that could only have come from censorware shills. Read this comment &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/communications/soa/Greedy-ISPs-kept-from-filtering-trial/0,130061791,339295460,00.htm#320125875" >www.zdnet.com.au/news/communicat&middot;&middot;&middot;20125875</A> on this article &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/communications/soa/Greedy-ISPs-kept-from-filtering-trial/0,130061791,339295460,00.htm" >www.zdnet.com.au/news/communicat&middot;&middot;&middot;0,00.htm</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:48:46 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22084845</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/195618"><b>rawwhide</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote">..., or linking to sites that have links to sites that are on the secret blacklist will result in you becoming a criminal</div>Then linking to google would be illegal  :D<br> </div>or any search engine. I guess Australians will have to implement there own search engines. <br><small>--<br>To talk much and arrive nowhere is the same as climbing a tree to catch a fish.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 18:15:03 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22084830</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/195618"><b>rawwhide</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  a4nic8er <A HREF="/useremail/u/338826"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Not linking per se, but linking to sites that are on the secret blacklist, or  linking to sites that have links to sites that are on the secret blacklist will result in you becoming a criminal.<br> </div>I guess if you live in Australia, then you shouldn't link to DSLR.  :D<br><small>--<br>To talk much and arrive nowhere is the same as climbing a tree to catch a fish.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 18:13:19 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22084587</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : <div class="bquote">..., or linking to sites that have links to sites that are on the secret blacklist will result in you becoming a criminal</div>Then linking to google would be illegal  :D<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.7</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 17:31:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22084579</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Doctor Four <A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>And Australia seems to have jumped ahead of the others in this area. So linking is now thought crime?<br> </div>Not necessarily.<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Other Australian websites and blogs continue to display the location of the banned web page, but ACMA says no action will be taken as "ACMA has not received any other complaints about links to the content concerned".<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25196505-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 17:30:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22084575</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/338826"><b>a4nic8er</b></A> : Not linking per se, but linking to sites that are on the secret blacklist, or  linking to sites that have links to sites that are on the secret blacklist will result in you becoming a criminal. <br><br>Then again, you could try to protect yourself by obtaining a copy of the blacklist (so you can attempt to check that every site you link to does not have any links to blacklisted sites - too bad if they create the blacklisted link later) but posession of the blacklist will, of course, be illegal too.<br><br>Kafka, Orwell, Heller and Gillam would each be proud to have created such dazzling no-win situation within one of their fictional plots. Full marks to the Australian politicians for attempting to make it reality. Possible proof that sending your unwanted and uneducated away then letting some of them inbreed for 200 years can produce great minds and leaders.<br><br>/sarcasm<br><small>--<br>Live each day as if it is your last because some day you will be be right.<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://SynergyXR.net" >SynergyXR.net</A><br>If laughter can be contagious, why do we never hear of any mirth epidemics?</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 17:29:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22084019</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><b>Doctor Four</b></A> : Funny how all the so-called democracies in the World are going fascist, all the while decrying the same behavior in other countries.<br><br>And Australia seems to have jumped ahead of the others in this area. So linking is now thoughtcrime?<br><small>--<br>"The trouble with computers, of course, is that they are very sophisticated idiots." - Doctor Who (from Robot)<br></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:51:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Banned hyperlinks could cost you $11,000 a day</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22083079</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : <div class="bquote">The Australian communications regulator says it <i>will fine people who hyperlink to sites on its blacklist</i>, which has been further expanded to include several pages on the anonymous whistleblower site Wikileaks.</div>-----------------------------------------------------<br><div class="bquote">Already, <i>a significant portion of the 1370-site Australian blacklist - 506 sites - would be classified R18+ and X18+, which are legal to view but would be blocked for everyone</i> under the proposal. The Government has said it was considering expanding the blacklist to 10,000 sites and beyond.</div>-----------------------------------------------------<br><div class="bquote">The Communications Minister, Stephen Conroy, has repeatedly claimed his proposed mandatory filters would target only "illegal" content - predominantly child pornography.<br><br>"As time goes on, <i>pressure will only mount on the Government to expand the list</i>, while money and effort are poured into an enormous black box that will neither help kids nor stem the flow of illegal material," EFA said.</div>What they're doing is pure craziness.<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 13:26:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Banned hyperlinks could cost you $11,000 a day</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22082881</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : From <A HREF="http://www.smh.com.au/news/home/technology/banned-hyperlinks-could-cost-you-11000-a-day/2009/03/17/1237054787635.html">The Sydney Morning Herald</a><br>March 17, 2009 -' <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The Australian communications regulator says it will fine people who hyperlink to sites on its blacklist, which has been further expanded to include several pages on the anonymous whistleblower site Wikileaks.<br><br>Wikileaks was added to the blacklist for publishing a leaked document containing Denmark's list of banned websites.<br><br>The move by the Australian Communications and Media Authority comes after it threatened the host of online broadband discussion forum Whirlpool last week with a $11,000-a-day fine over a link published in its forum to another page blacklisted by ACMA - an anti-abortion website.<br><br>ACMA's blacklist does not have a significant impact on web browsing by Australians today but sites contained on it will be blocked for everyone if the Federal Government implements its mandatory internet filtering censorship scheme.<br><br>But even without the mandatory censorship scheme, as is evident in the Whirlpool case, ACMA can force sites hosted in Australia to remove "prohibited" pages and even links to prohibited pages.<br><br>Online civil liberties campaigners have seized on the move by ACMA as evidence of how casually the regulator adds to its list of blacklisted sites. It also confirmed fears that the scope of the Government's censorship plan could easily be expanded to encompass sites that are not illegal.<br><br>"The first rule of censorship is that you cannot talk about censorship," Wikileaks <A HREF="http://www.wikileaks.org/wiki/Australia_secretly_censors_Wikileaks_press_release_and_Danish_Internet_censorship_list,_16_Mar_2009">said on its website</a> in response to the ACMA ban.<br><br>The site has also published Thailand's internet censorship list and noted that, in both the Thai and Danish cases, the scope of the blacklist had been rapidly expanded from child porn to other material including political discussions.<br><br>Already, a significant portion of the 1370-site Australian blacklist - 506 sites - would be classified R18+ and X18+, which are legal to view but would be blocked for everyone under the proposal. The Government has said it was considering expanding the blacklist to 10,000 sites and beyond.<br><br>Electronic Frontiers Australia said the leak of the Danish blacklist and ACMA's subsequent attempts to block people from viewing it showed how easy it would be for ACMA's own blacklist - which is secret - to be leaked onto the web once it is handed to ISPs for filtering.<br><br>"We note that, not only do these incidents show that the ACMA censors are more than willing to interpret their broad guidelines to include a discussion forum and document repository, it is demonstrably inevitable that the Government's own list is bound to be exposed itself at some point in the future," EFA <A HREF="http://www.efa.org.au/2009/03/16/acma-censors-australians-protest/">said</a>.<br><br>"The Government would serve the country well by sparing themselves, and us, this embarrassment."<br><br>Last week, Reporters Without Borders, in its regular report on enemies of internet freedom, placed Australia on its "watch list" of countries imposing anti-democratic internet restrictions that could open the way for abuses of power and control of information.<br><br>The main issue raised was the Government's proposed internet censorship regime.<br><br>"This report demolished the Communications Minister's contention that Australia is just following other comparable democracies," Greens communications spokesman Senator Scott Ludlam said.<br><br>"We are not. The Government is embarking on a deeply unpopular and troubling experiment to fine-tune its ability to censor the internet.<br><br>"I agree with Reporters Without Borders. If you consider this kind of net censorship in the context of Australia's anti-terror laws, it paints a disturbing picture indeed."<br><br>EFA said the Government's "spin is starting to wear thin" and it could no longer be denied that the ACMA blacklist targets a huge range of material that is legal and even uncontroversial.<br><br>The Communications Minister, Stephen Conroy, has repeatedly claimed his proposed mandatory filters would target only "illegal" content - predominantly child pornography.<br><br>"As time goes on, pressure will only mount on the Government to expand the list, while money and effort are poured into an enormous black box that will neither help kids nor stem the flow of illegal material," EFA said.<br><br>"If the minister truly believes that children are seeking out, or being bombarded with, child pornography, then there's a dearth of both common sense and proper research in the ministerial suites."<br><br>Already, the head of the Australian Christian Lobby, Jim Wallace, has said he hopes the sex industry will go broke as a result of the censorship scheme.<br><br>Independent Senator Nick Xenophon previous expressed his desire to have online gambling sites added to the blacklist but <A HREF="http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/02/26/1235237810486.html">has since withdrawn his support</a> for the scheme, saying it was dangerous and could be "counter-productive".<br><br>The Greens and Opposition also oppose the scheme, meaning any legislation to implement it will be blocked.<br><br>The Opposition has obtained legal advice that "legislation of some sort will almost certainly be required", but others have said it may be possible to implement the scheme without legislation.<br><br>Speaking at a telecommunications conference last week, Senator Conroy urged Australians to have faith in MPs to pass the right legislation.<br><br>Despite previously saying his scheme would be expanded to block "refused classification" content that includes sites depicting drug use, sex, crime, cruelty and violence, he said opponents of his plan were spreading "conspiracy theories".<br><br>The Government's internet censorship trials are due to begin shortly but critics have said they may not provide much useful data on the real-world implications because none of the major ISPs were chosen to take part.<hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 12:58:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22074469</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Longboard <A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>It's so absurd that the eager beavers who want this "filter" for their "protect us against all evil (and crush the opposition) agenda" in place are so shortsighted they cannot see how it will be turned against them in time.<br> </div>And all it takes is one election for that to happen.<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:24:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22073885</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : Good to see this thread being followed up.<br><br>Agree with everything said:<br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>If you think about it, "may contain links to other websites that may contain 'prohibited content' or 'potentially prohibited content'" covers every site that might be linking to a site on an unpublished list. With the flimsiest of excuses there can be a demand to take down just about anything.<hr></blockquote> !!!<br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>whether one's persuasion is pro-life or pro-choice, are about as far removed as you can get from gratuitous kiddie porn. This moves OZ's censorship practices squarely into the realm of filtering social and political dialogue or debate - the very thing the program's critics have been alarmed about.<hr></blockquote> !!! Eggzactly<br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Anyone deluded enough to believe this censorship is not politically motivated after reading the content is prohibited or potential prohibited content?<hr></blockquote>Perhaps not 'pure' politics, but certainly open to manipulation.<br><br>@Norwegian..what you said: agreed we need to keep resisting any of this abysmal shyte. The potential for abuse at all levels is rampantly obvious: a disgrace, and an affront to all thinking individuals.<br><br>It's so absurd that the eager beavers who want this "filter" for their "protect us against all evil (and crush the opposition) agenda" in place are so shortsighted they cannot see how it will be turned against them in time.<br><br>..price of freedom...]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:21:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22069357</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>"We're a hosting provider. We'll comply with these notices and we have by notifying and working with our customer Whirlpool but no one should expect us to be the content police on the internet. <br><br>"We cannot monitor what our customers' customers or members are doing on the web ... the police aren't liable for the crimes criminals commit, are they?" Mr Modesto said. <br> </div>I find this to be disturbing. <br><br>The govt wish to keep a list secret and allow no one access to it. This has various points of issue.<br><br>1. Because it is secret, how does a user, web site, ISP etc know this. <br>Will it bring legal precedence as in this case and become a daily item, will it become as common as going to the shop for milk? <br>Will it then label the user, site, ISP etc as a 'marked man' syndrome, because they posted something blacklisted?<br>How can you as a moderator of a web site know a site is blacklisted?<br><br>2. Will the ISP need to employ twice, or even more staff to be a policing filter?<br>Why should they? The lists a secret, how do you police this?<br>Why would they start up a crew for monitoring on the basis of a theory?<br>Will they need to double the size of the capital so that there is in place a machine, or program that works on key word lists? We all know using key words as a filter is not necessarily effective as it will block sites not relevant to any 'blacklisted' site.<br><br>3. Even if the filter is in place, it is bypassable. We all know that. <br>How also will an ISP keep a list secret if they need to be the police here? You know the minute a site is listed that is done so to quieten a belief, and no not necessarily a religious or political one, someone will no doubt bring it to the attention of the public, in hope that we as a free nation are allowed to question all and everything about our voted in rulers decisions.<br>Will you be put in jail for speaking out?<br><br>Free speech is threatened by the exact policy this stands to implement.<br><br>There are other rules with families already in place that are similar, the govt can stop you spanking your child for discipline of a bad thing, but if you allow the act, but not punish the child, the govt then hold you liable for your child's actions, I just can't believe the hypocrisy of it all. This is just an example of where by the family unit is not helped, but hindered by the exact policies that are clashing with the basis of the act. While it is a political issue, yes, it is also an issue of freedom of speech, security of the family unit, the future of us as a people, a nation and ultimately the world.<br><br>KISS - Keep it simple silly<br>(You just can't help but wonder where all this complexity started).<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Mar 2009 18:12:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22067961</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : <div class="bquote">This moves OZ's censorship practices squarely into the realm of filtering social and political dialogue or debate - the very thing the program's critics have been alarmed about.</div>Yes, that's exactly the problem.  This censorship is motivated by religious crackpottery, and then peddled under false pretenses as "protect the children".<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.6</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Mar 2009 12:11:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22067013</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>...ACMA issued Sydney web hosting company Bulletproof Networks with an "interim link-deletion notice" for allowing its customer, the Whirlpool internet community website, to post the link to an anti-abortion web page blacklisted by the regulator. ... </div>And abortion issues, whether one's persuasion is pro-life or pro-choice, are about as far removed as you can get from gratuitous kiddie porn. This moves OZ's censorship practices squarely into the realm of filtering social and political dialogue or debate - the very thing the program's critics have been alarmed about.<br> </div>This is a copy of the email from ACMA to the complainant after the site was reported.  <br>  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Subject: Complaint Reference: 2009000009/ ACMA-691604278<br>Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:45:00 +1100<br>From: online@acma.gov.au<br><br>Complaint Reference: 2009000009/ ACMA-691604278<br><br>I refer to the complaint that you lodged with the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA) on 5th January 2009 about certain content made available at:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www" >www</A>. URL REMOVED .htm<br><br>Following investigation of your complaint, ACMA is satisfied that the internet content is hosted outside Australia, and that <b>the content is prohibited or potential prohibited content.</b><br><br>The Internet Industry Association (IIA) has a code of practice (&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.iia.net.au/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=415&Itemid=33" >www.iia.net.au/index.php?option=&middot;&middot;&middot;temid=33</A>) for Internet Service Providers (ISPs) which, among other things, set out arrangements for dealing with such content. In accordance with the code, ACMA has notified the above content to the makers of IIA approved filters, for their attention and appropriate action. The code requires ISPs to make available to customers an IIA approved filter.<br><br>Information about ACMA&#146;s role in regulating online content (including internet and mobile content), including what is prohibited or potentially prohibited content is available at ACMA&#146;s website at www.acma.gov.au/hotline<br><br>Thank you for bringing this matter to ACMA&#146;s attention.<br><br>name removed to protect the guilty.<hr></blockquote><br><br>My bolding of the reason for the action taken. Anyone deluded enough to believe this censorship is not politically motivated after reading <b>the content is prohibited or potential prohibited content?</b><br><br>Note there is no way for that site to appeal the action. ACMA are not subject to any judicial oversight. <br><br><small>Edit: grammar</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Mar 2009 03:15:00 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22066825</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>...ACMA issued Sydney web hosting company Bulletproof Networks with an "interim link-deletion notice" for allowing its customer, the Whirlpool internet community website, to post the link to an anti-abortion web page blacklisted by the regulator. ... </div>And abortion issues, whether one's persuasion is pro-life or pro-choice, are about as far removed as you can get from gratuitous kiddie porn. This moves OZ's censorship practices squarely into the realm of filtering social and political dialogue or debate - the very thing the program's critics have been alarmed about.<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 14 Mar 2009 01:21:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22066358</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : Yup. Kinda like seeing '...and other duties as required...' on a job app.<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Mar 2009 22:53:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22066212</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> :  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The interim notice, obtained by The Australian, stated that on February 19, ACMA received information that a Whirlpool forums page  "may contain links to other websites that may contain 'prohibited content' or 'potentially prohibited content'".<hr></blockquote><br><br>If you think about it, <i>"may contain links to other websites that may contain 'prohibited content' or 'potentially prohibited content'"</i> covers every site that might be linking to a site on an unpublished list. With the flimsiest of excuses there can be a demand to take down just about anything.<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Mar 2009 22:24:17 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,22065721</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Seems the lawsuits are coming out. Take head DSLR for your content. <br><br><A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25181408-15306,00.html">ACMA takes aim at Whirlpool, supplier</a><br><br><div class="bquote"><b>IN an unprecedented move, Australia's communications regulator has threatened to fine a company up to $11,000 a day for indirectly leaking part of its top-secret list of banned internet web pages.</b><br><br>The action by the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA) has wide ramifications for media companies, online publishers, web hosting suppliers and any organisation that publishes feedback from readers or customers on their website. <br><br>On March 10, ACMA issued Sydney web hosting company Bulletproof Networks with an "interim link-deletion notice" for allowing its customer, the Whirlpool internet community website, to post the link to an anti-abortion web page blacklisted by the regulator. <br><br>Whirlpool is a popular website with around 276,000 members who regularly provide comments on the internet and broadband in Australia. <br><br>The interim notice, obtained by The Australian, stated that on February 19, ACMA received information that a Whirlpool forums page "may contain links to other websites that may contain 'prohibited content' or 'potentially prohibited content'". <br><br>According to the notice, ACMA determined that end-users in Australia could access the content on the blacklisted web page. <br><br>ACMA gave Bulletproof around 24 hours to act. <br><br>"Bulletproof must comply with the interim link deletion notice as soon as practicable, and in any event by 6pm on the next business day," the notice said. <br><br>Bulletproof spokesman Lorenzo Modesto was surprised to receive a call, and the notice, from ACMA but decided to comply. <br><br>"We received a call from ACMA's Jaclyn Smith on Tuesday morning. She laid out the whole scenario for us," Mr Modesto said. <br><br>Bulletproof then contacted Whirlpool and a decision was made by the community website to remove the link. <br><br>"We took action and got the link removed as per ACMA's notice because it's the responsible thing to do when you get any such notice from the authorities," Mr Modesto said. <br><br>"The (ACMA) notice stated that if we don't comply we could face fines of up to $11,000 a day. As a business we'd rather avoid that and focus on doing what we do best," Mr Modesto said. <br><br>Mr Modesto said it was the first time the company had received a notice from authorities to take such action. <br><br>However, compliance didn't mean web hosting companies should take on the role of "content police". <br><br>"We're a hosting provider. We'll comply with these notices and we have by notifying and working with our customer Whirlpool but no one should expect us to be the content police on the internet. <br><br>"We cannot monitor what our customers' customers or members are doing on the web ... the police aren't liable for the crimes criminals commit, are they?" Mr Modesto said. <br><br>Whirlpool owner Simon Wright questioned why ACMA chose to slap the notice on Bulletproof instead of Whirlpool since it had published the web page. <br><br>"ACMA should have contacted us first. <br><br>"We felt compelled to remove the link to avoid getting Bulletproof into trouble," Mr Wright said. "Threatening friendships is something mobs do, not governments." <br><br>But there is a twist to the whole saga and the publication of the anti-abortion web page on the internet could be ACMA's own doing. <br><br>On January 5, an internet user in Melbourne, known online as Foad, lodged a complaint with ACMA about "offensive content" on an anti-abortion web page, not the entire website. <br><br>The man did not want his real name published for fear of reprisals. He said his motive was to test the system and show that web pages not showing material connected with sexual abuse of children could end up on the blacklist. <br><br>The web page concerned is the same as the link stated in ACMA's notice to Bulletproof. <br><br>Around two weeks after the complainant contacted the regulator, he received a reply from ACMA informing him it was "satisfied that the internet content is hosted outside Australia, and the content is prohibited or potential prohibited content''. <br><br>As reported in The Australian on February 24, there was no warning from ACMA not to publicise the anti-abortion web page. "I never received any indication from ACMA not to publish it," he said. <br><br>ACMA's response was almost immediately published on the internet on various blogs and forums, including the address of the prohibited web page. <br><br>ACMA said that the complainant had done nothing wrong in submitting the link for all and sundry to view. <br><br>"There is no prohibition on complainants publishing the outcome of their complaints, as has happened in this case,'' an ACMA spokesman said then. <br><br>Today, ACMA said it was merely investigating a complaint it had received about the web page on Whirlpool's website and took action against Bulletproof in accordance with the Broadcasting Services Act. <br><br>"ACMA received a complaint under Schedule 7 to the Broadcasting Services Act regarding a link provided at the Whirlpool page and we must investigate such a complaint unless satisfied that it is frivolous, vexatious, not made in good faith or made for the purpose of undermining the operation of the online content scheme," an ACMA spokesperson said. <br><br>As at January 31, the ACMA blacklist comprised of 1090 web pages including refused classification, X18+ and MA15+ content. <br><br>The blacklist, compiled via a complaints-based mechanism, is being used as a basis for federal Government-backed live ISP filtering trials. </div>I guess I can thank  news.com.au for allowing the posting of the stories here for others to read. I guess I feel a little threatened of retribution.<br><br>Whirlpool being blocked is just what the concern is about in the first place. You step out of line in the eyes of the powers to be and you will be blacklisted. <br><br>Now there was a comment on the threat to children there once, I seem to have lost the link. [/sarcasm]<br><br>Edit: for those that do not know, Whirlpool is a site very similar to this one.<br><br><small>Edit: grammer</small><br><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 13 Mar 2009 20:41:33 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21994652</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Khaine <A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The filter has been unlikely to go ahead since the first outcry.  Senator Conroy may want it, but Rudd isn't about to waste his political capital on it.  With the greens and opposition firmly against it, it will be an uphill battle<br> </div>It's not a given. We've had this debate several times since 1996 under various situations of the balance of power in the Senate. The legislation controlling content on the internet has been "tightened" each time.<br><br>There is a great deal of opposition. Mainstream media coverage is not that good. Most people aware of the issue at all are those that use the internet. Australian politicians aren't noted for technical savvy and don't use the internet well. Many won't be aware of the opposition but will be aware of the vocal minority group. They have also been exposed to extensive lobbying by the censorware vendors over several years. The censorware vendors are unlikely to point out any problems with this level of censorship. Censorware vendors also extensively promote the logging and monitoring capacity of their products. <br><br>If, as citizens, we don't kill this dead, it will appear again in a couple of years for whatever reason, probably a nut job in the Senate. If we don't stop it, it will be part of the network infrastructure and more difficult to remove than it was to install. There are extremists in all political parties and most political situations you can think of. <br><br>There's a fair bit of in depth coverage on &raquo;<A HREF="http://libertus.net/" >libertus.net/</A> including the details of the history of the legislation and changes right back to Richard Alston's time. The site is up to date as of this month and includes most of the current ACMA requirements and current interpretations. The site is well researched and referenced with extensive knowledge of the legislation and the major issues concerned. The site author is a member of EFA which is also lobbying against the proposal.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 01 Mar 2009 02:08:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21994485</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><b>Khaine</b></A> : The filter has been unlikely to go ahead since the first outcry.  Senator Conroy may want it, but Rudd isn't about to waste his political capital on it.  With the greens and opposition firmly against it, it will be an uphill battle]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 01 Mar 2009 01:00:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia&#x27;s Internet Censorship Plan Collapsing</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21994195</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : I love it when these idiots bust themselves!  :D]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 28 Feb 2009 23:33:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia&#x27;s Internet Censorship Plan Collapsing</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21994190</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  fatness <A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The Minister reponsible for this, Senator Stephen Conroy, is almost closeted. He has refused to discuss the issue with the media or any public venue open for discussion. In the Senate he has arranged for strategies to prevent the other parties and members asking questions. Every media article, except two since last year, lists him as not available for comment.</div>I suppose his next step could be trying to ban media articles. <br> </div>Don't think he wouldn't try it. His arrogance almost matches his ignorance. He is on record as saying that set top boxes are too difficult for him to manage.<br><br>His office did try to silence one of their critics.<br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>On Tuesday, a policy advisor for Senator Conroy, Belinda Dennett, wrote an email to Internet Industry Association (IIA) board member Carolyn Dalton in an attempt to pressure Newton into reining in his dissent.<br><br>"In your capacity as a board member of the IIA I would like to express my serious concern that a IIA member would be sending out this sort of message. I have also advised [IIA chief executive] Peter Coroneos of my disappointment in this sort of irresponsible behaviour ," the email, read.<br><br>It is understood the email was accompanied by a phone call demanding that the message be passed on to senior Internode management.<br><br>Newton said he found the bullying "outrageous" and Senator Conroy was "misusing his influence as a Commonwealth Minister to intimidate a private dissenting citizen into silencing his political views".<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.theage.com.au/news/technology/biztech/how-government-tried-to-gag-censor-critics/2008/10/23/1224351430987.html" >www.theage.com.au/news/technolog&middot;&middot;&middot;987.html</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 28 Feb 2009 23:31:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia&#x27;s Internet Censorship Plan Collapsing</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21990816</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The Minister reponsible for this, Senator Stephen Conroy, is almost closeted. He has refused to discuss the issue with the media or any public venue open for discussion. In the Senate he has arranged for strategies to prevent the other parties and members asking questions. Every media article, except two since last year, lists him as not available for comment.</div>I suppose his next step could be trying to ban media articles. <br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 28 Feb 2009 09:40:46 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21990515</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I am following this blog<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://droughtresistant.blogspot.com/" >droughtresistant.blogspot.com/</A><br>to keep me informed on the censorship situation down under.<br> </div>I hadn't found that one. Thank you. Seems to be quite a bit of commonsense there.<br><br>For day to day updates, with the full glory of every minor event, this one stays up to speed. The name is TIC, an Australian habit. &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.somebodythinkofthechildren.com/" >www.somebodythinkofthechildren.com/</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 28 Feb 2009 07:11:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia&#x27;s Internet Censorship Plan Collapsing</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21990485</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>A welcome report... Senator Nick Xenophon, good on ya! But if I were living in Oz, I wouldn't for 30 seconds let up pressure on my elected officials against the filtering program. Politics is as squishy as gelatin... and what seems cast in concrete today may be totally reversed tomorrow through totally unexpected political machinations. Freedom requires <i>constant</i> vigilance - plus the time and attention necessary to maintain that vigilance.<br> </div>It's not quite the win it has been taken to be. He is one vote and under certain circumstances he holds the balance of power in the Senate. The assumption is that the opposition party, holding a majority in the Senate will all vote against the proposal. Our two major political parties vote as blocks. There is little or no room for dissent from the party line. There is one minor party and two independents. It is taken as given that the party proposing this will vote as a block because it's built into the way they operate. The party likely to oppose are less rigid, but conscience votes are rare. They can be thrown out of the party for exercising a conscience vote on almost any issue. Since 1950 there have only been 32 issues opened to a conscience vote by both major parties. Outside that, it is extremely rare for an individual member of of either house to "cross the floor".<br><br>I'm not sure we are any further advanced than we were a year ago when this farce started.<br><br>The Minister reponsible for this, Senator Stephen Conroy, is almost closeted. He has refused to discuss the issue with the media or any public venue open for discussion. In the Senate he has arranged for strategies to prevent the other parties and members asking questions. Every media article, except two since last year, lists him as not available for comment. <br><br>Never attribute to malice what could be sheer incompetence. ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 28 Feb 2009 06:53:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia&#x27;s Internet Censorship Plan Collapsing</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21984468</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : A welcome report... Senator Nick Xenophon, good on ya! But if I were living in Oz, I wouldn't for 30 seconds let up pressure on my elected officials against the filtering program. Politics is as squishy as gelatin... and what seems cast in concrete today may be totally reversed tomorrow through totally unexpected political machinations. Freedom requires <i>constant</i> vigilance - plus the time and attention necessary to maintain that vigilance.<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 04:13:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Australia&#x27;s Internet Censorship Plan Collapsing</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21981735</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : From <A HREF="http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/02/26/1235237810486.html">The Sydney Morning Herald</a><br>February 26, 2009 - <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Web censorship plan heads towards a dead end</b><br><br>The Government's plan to introduce mandatory internet censorship has effectively been scuttled, following an independent senator's decision to join the Greens and Opposition in blocking any legislation required to get the scheme started.<br><br>The Opposition's communications spokesman Nick Minchin has this week obtained independent legal advice saying that if the Government is to pursue a mandatory filtering regime "legislation of some sort will almost certainly be required".<br><br>Senator Nick Xenophon previously indicated he may support a filter that blocks online gambling websites but in a phone interview today he withdrew all support, saying "the more evidence that's come out, the more questions there are on this".<br><br>The Communications Minister, Stephen Conroy, has consistently ignored advice from a host of technical experts saying the filters would slow the internet, block legitimate sites, be easily bypassed and fall short of capturing all of the nasty content available online.<br><br>Despite this, he is pushing ahead with trials of the scheme using six ISPs - Primus, Tech 2U, Webshield, OMNIconnect, Netforce and Highway 1.<br><br>But even the trials have been heavily discredited, with experts saying the lack of involvement from the three largest ISPs, Telstra, Optus and iiNet, means the trials will not provide much useful data on the effects of internet filtering in the real-world.<br><br>Senator Conroy originally pitched the filters as a way to block child porn but - as ISPs, technical experts and many web users feared - the targets have been broadened significantly since then.<br><br>ACMA's secret blacklist, which will form the basis of the mandatory censorship regime, contains 1370 sites, only 674 of which relate to depictions of children under 18. A significant portion - 506 sites - would be classified R18+ and X18+, which is legal to view but would be blocked for everyone under the proposal.<br><br>This week Senator Conroy said there was "a very strong case for blocking" other legal content that has been "refused classification". According to the classification code, this includes sites depicting drug use, crime, sex, cruelty, violence or "revolting and abhorrent phenomena" that "offend against the standards of morality".<br><br>And last month, ACMA added an anti-abortion website to its blacklist because it showed photographs of what appears to be aborted foetuses. The Government has said it was considering expanding the blacklist to 10,000 sites and beyond.<br><br>Xenophon said instead of implementing a blanket mandatory censorship regime the Government should instead put the money towards educating parents on how to supervise their kids online and tackling "pedophiles through cracking open those peer-to-peer groups".<br><br>Technical experts have said the filters proposed by the Government would do nothing to block child porn being transferred on encrypted peer-to-peer networks.<br><br>"I'm very skeptical that the Government is going down the best path on this," said Xenophon.<br><br>"I commend their intentions but I think the implementation of this could almost be counter-productive and I think the money could be better spent."<br><br>The policy has attracted opposition from online consumers, lobby groups, ISPs, network administrators, some children's welfare groups, the Opposition, the Greens, NSW Young Labor and even the conservative Liberal senator Cory Bernardi, who famously tried to censor the chef Gordon Ramsay's swearing on television.<br><br>This week, a national telephone poll of 1100 people, conducted by Galaxy and commissioned by online activist group GetUp, found that only 5 per cent of Australians want ISPs to be responsible for protecting children online and only 4 per cent want Government to have this responsibility.<br><br>A recent survey by Netspace of 10,000 of the ISP's customers found 61 per cent strongly opposed mandatory internet filtering with only 6.3 per cent strongly agreeing with the policy.<br><br>An expert report, handed to the Government last February but kept secret until December after it was uncovered by the Herald, concluded the <A HREF="http://www.smh.com.au/news/technology/web/fatal-flaws-in-website-censorship-plan-says-report/2008/12/22/1229794328860.html">proposed scheme was fundamentally flawed</a>.<br><br>Even Labor has previously opposed ISP-level internet filtering when the Howard Government raised it as a method for protecting kids online.<br><br>"Unfortunately, such a short memory regarding the debate in 1999 about internet content has led the coalition to already offer support for greater censorship by actively considering proposals for unworkable, quick fixes that involve filtering the internet at the ISP level," Labor Senator Kate Lundy said in 2003.<hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:43:03 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Web filter debate - Kickstart Forum 2009</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21966757</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Can't say I was close enough to even watch if this was what happened. Sounds exciting enough.<br><br><A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,25100456-5014239,00.html">Conference delegates shocked by display</a><br><br><div class="bquote">DELEGATES at a major technology conference were left slack-jawed and embarrassed after debate over the Government's proposed web filtering system descended into a public slanging match.<br><br>Discussion of the plan got personal when filtering advocate Bernadette McMenamin, chief executive officer of Child Wise, took part in a debate in front of a room full of technology journalists and professionals from Australia and New Zealand at the Kickstart Conference on the Gold Coast this week. <br><br>Ms McMenamin accused filtering opponents of spreading "hysteria" &#150; a reaction that drew a hostile response from the room. <br><br>"Yes, there's been an awful lot of vitriol, there's been an awful lot of misinformation, and certainly I think there's been an awful lot of hysteria, and most of that hysteria is not coming from the child protection advocates, but it's coming from all these anonymous bloggers and people that write to you and just call you every name under the sun, and it's not helpful," she said.<br></div>This one made me ponder on what exactly you are supposed to do in these circumstances.<br><br><div class="bquote">"I certainly don't spend my day in, day out, lobbying and attacking the opponents of the filtering," she said. <br><br>"I think there's probably only a few hundred of you in this country, you're vigorous, you're loud, you're technologically smart, but I still believe that filtering is something we should trial and then leave it up to the public to make that decision." <br><br>An anti-filtering petition hosted by online advocacy group GetUp! titled "Save The Net" has been signed by almost 100,000 people.<br><br>"I don't know why people are so afraid of the trials if you think they're going to be completely ineffective," Ms McMenamin said.</div>This blind/secretive/hidden approach is not helping anyone, what is the point of a select few and public voice to back you up, when most of those dealing with the issue day-to-day are opted out of the discussion to start with?<br><br><div class="bquote">Her comments were slammed by internet service provider (ISP) expert Mark Newton, who said the Government's current trial filtering system was vulnerable to circumvention, reverse-engineering and even blacklist leaks. <br><br>"I think we all agree it won't work, and the blacklist will become public once this thing goes into production, if not earlier," he said. <br><br>"If its contents are as bad as the Minister (of Communications) says, we'll have an anonymously-published official list of child pornography sites and no official means of preventing people from exploiting it. <br><br>"Does that sound like a good idea Bernadette, does that sound like something you want your name to be associated with?" <br><br>Under the Government's plan, all Australian internet providers will be forced to block a secret blacklist of websites maintained by the media watchdog. <br><br>A secondary filter will be created to block material inappropriate for children, but users will be allowed to opt-out of this tier. <br><br>One journalist got so upset he entered into a new debate with Ms McMenamin. <br><br>"(Senator Stephen) Conroy himself said that anyone who disagrees with this policy is a supporter of child molestation," he said. <br><br>"That is so insulting to disregard everyone with a family who works in tech in this country. Why do you think we've all got our backs up? I've got a six-year-old son and he's the most important thing in my whole world. <br><br>"You say you're not a technical expert, you say you've got an open mind &#150; maybe you should start listening to all the technical experts who are saying it won't work to the point of being stupid. Maybe you should start listening to them so you can have an open mind." <br><br>Ms McMenamin responded by saying she doesn't speak for Senator Conroy, and she was "disappointed that you think like that, because I didn't accuse you of being child molesters". <br><br>But both sides of the debate agreed an effective filter system &#150; not necessarily the current one about to be tested &#150; could help solve the issue of child pornography.</div><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:40:54 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21944820</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : I am following this blog<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://droughtresistant.blogspot.com/" >droughtresistant.blogspot.com/</A><br>to keep me informed on the censorship situation down under.<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.6</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 21:13:28 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Primus compares compulsory web filtering to China</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21907969</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : Indeed. A media watchdog...Gov media watchdog? Private? I'll bet dollars to donuts all those that try to access those blacklisted sites will be on another list as well... :hmm:<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:50:15 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Primus compares compulsory web filtering to China</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21907931</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : <div class="bquote"> a secret blacklist of websites maintained by the media watchdog.</div>Look at that phrase. Don't turn away.<br><br>Just look at it.<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:43:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Primus compares compulsory web filtering to China</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21907155</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : I like todays post over at news.com.au. I am smiling in all of this for the first time since it all started.<br><br><A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,25045374-5014239,00.html">Link</a><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>THE Federal Government's internet filtering plan has been compared to censorship in China by one of the participants in its blacklist trials. <br><br>Primus Telecom is the largest internet service provider of six announced to take part in the trial by Communications Minister Stephen Conroy. <br><br>General manager of marketing and products Andrew Sims said while web filtering services suited some families, they should not be made compulsory. <br><br>"We've got instances of that around the world, particularly in China where the government forces filtering upon their population," he said. <br><br>"My professional opinion is I don't really believe that forced filtering is a good option." <br><br>Under the Government's plan, all Australian internet providers will be forced to block a secret blacklist of websites maintained by the media watchdog. <br><br>A secondary filter will be created to block material inappropriate for children, but users will be allowed to opt-out of this tier.<hr></blockquote><br><br>A forced <b>secret</b> blacklist...now, now, you can't push your ideas on the rest of the world if they don't want them.<br><br>The second filter? I thought that was the main issue, according to comments from sources posted on the internet and papers world wide.<br><br>Come clean Steve, we know what your up to!!<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:13:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Mandatory filtering won&#x27;t slow net access</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21904126</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25040381-5013046,00.html">Link</a><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The federal government proposal as it currently stands suggests two levels of filtering: <br><br>&#149; a limited list of websites that will be mandatory for ISPs to block for all users<br><hr></blockquote> <br><br>What no choice, <b>what is</b> to become mandatory once it is in place?<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>  <br>&#149; a more comprehensive, optional filtering level allowing for the <b>filtering of a greater breadth of unwanted content</b>.<hr></blockquote><br><br>Mmmm, no sure what is meant by that? Will it end up where by you pay for viewing sections of the net?<br><br>&#149; First you pay the ISP<br>&#149; They add a little more for the "mandatory" filtering.<br>&#149; Then you pay a little more for each segment of the internet, like pay-tv.<br><br>People your internet is powned, and there ain't a bloody thing you can do about it. Money, big business, governments that are paid too turn an eye, or alternatively, enforce legislation so everyone gets a payout, at our expense, the end user.<br><br>The link also has a blog discussion of this by super bloggers, I am too old too understand, who are super bloggers?<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Nine Super Bloggers will argue for and against filtering and thrash out the technical problems with the project.<hr></blockquote><br><br>emphasis: mine<br><br> <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 12 Feb 2009 03:52:06 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21903582</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1595629"><b>AARRGGHHH</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The <A HREF="http://www.acl.org.au/">Australian Christian Lobby</a>, however, has welcomed the proposals. </div>Amazing ... they've even spread to Australia ... like a freakin airborne virus.  ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 23:27:59 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Optus and iiNet snubbed in web filter trials</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21901737</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : I wonder why none of the 3-4 big boys in internet providers are not being included in this trial? You would think it a better target to test, surely not, some of the 6 I've not even heard of.<br><br><A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,25040817-5014239,00.html">Link</a><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>AUSTRALIA'S three largest internet service providers will not be included in the Federal Government's first trial of web filtering technology. <br><br>Optus and iiNet were both absent from the list of six companies to take part in the trial, announced this evening by Communications Minister Stephen Conroy. <br><br>Both providers had applied to take part in the tests. The country's biggest provider Telstra shunned the scheme last year. <br><br>The six providers announced to take part were: <br><br><A HREF="http://www.iprimus.net.au/">Primus Telecommunications</a>  <br><br><A HREF="http://www.tech2u.com.au/">Tech 2U</a> <br><br><A HREF="http://www.webshield.net.au/">Webshield</a> <br><br><A HREF="http://www.omniconnect.com.au/">OMNIconnect</a> <br><br><A HREF="http://www.netforce.com.au/">Netforce</a> <br><br><A HREF="http://www.highway1.com.au/">Highway 1</a><br><hr></blockquote><br><br>Considering all the secrecy, lack of supported info, and now the top few not even getting a look in, the only words that come to mind are "stench". There is a bad odour about this, call it intuition, or what ever, something just ain't right.  <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:37:45 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21900403</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : From <A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25040645-15306,00.html">Green light for ISP filtering trials</a><br><blockquote>"The Government is committed to take an evidence-based approach to implementing its cyber-safety policy and these trials will provide valuable information to inform our approach," Communications Minister Stephen Conroy said."</blockquote><br><br>1) What are the explicit, exact "rules of evidence" for blocking a site? <br>2) Who makes the specific determination about blockings, and how are they responsive to the public and the electorate? <br>3) What provisions for public hearings/trials are there, with respect to admission of "evidence" and rendering the decision on blocking? <br>4) What operators and sites are on the blocked list; and if that list is not publicly disclosed, how are site operators informed of a blocking decision regarding their site(s)? <br>5) What official recourse do operators of accused/blocked sites have for defense or review?<br>6) Where is the due-process sunlight in all this?<br><br>It seems to this humble farm-boy that there are a lot more questions than sunlight...  :huh:<br><br><i>edited to add the quote</i><br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 13:55:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21900005</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/937688"><b>FunnyBones</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  KodiacZiller <A HREF="/useremail/u/1578887"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Wow.  The Aussies really have a Christian fundie problem -- about as bad as our Westboro Baptist Church in Texas.  If you don't agree with "God's plan" you should be killed.  It seems if Aussies don't agree with Internet filters, they should be killed, according to the Christian whack jobs.<br><br>P.S.  How are my Aussie friends coping with the recent fires?  I hope all is well and wish a quick recovery to you all.<br> </div>While the fires burned this is what they were doing....<br><br>You would have thought they would have postponed this sort of talk but nope they continued to push all the way to the new trial above.<br><small>--<br>Fb:2009 The nightmare men have returned.</small><div class="borderless"><TABLE WIDTH=95% align=center border=0 CELLPADDING=4"><TR><TD ALIGN=CENTER VALIGN=CENTER BGCOLOR=#FFFFFF nwrap COLSPAN=3 WIDTH=100%><A HREF="/speak/slideshow/21900005?c=1399389&ret=L2ZvcnVtL3IyMTM0MTc3NS54bWw%3D"><IMG TITLE="69790 bytes" BORDER=0 WIDTH=600 HEIGHT=382 SRC="/r0/download/1399389~a141c649680d576b9d6150c67ec9c370/au1.jpg"></A></TD></TABLE></div>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:49:00 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21899871</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1578887"><b>KodiacZiller</b></A> : Wow.  The Aussies really have a Christian fundie problem -- about as bad as our Westboro Baptist Church in Texas.  If you don't agree with "God's plan" you should be killed.  It seems if Aussies don't agree with Internet filters, they should be killed, according to the Christian whack jobs.<br><br>P.S.  How are my Aussie friends coping with the recent fires?  I hope all is well and wish a quick recovery to you all.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:23:58 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21899489</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/917630"><b>Cudni</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  fatness <A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  FunnyBones <A HREF="/useremail/u/937688"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>It will test against a blacklist of 1370 illegal web pages, including 674 pages containing child sexual abuse content. The list is managed by the Australian Communications and Media Authority.</div>What are the 696 other sites?<br>Is this list available to the public?<br>Will the "results" of this test be independently verifiable?<br> </div>Why so many sit on the list and why are such sites not terminated as they are found  :mad:<br><br>Cudni<br><small>--<br>"what we know we know the same, what we don't know, we don't know it differently." <br>Help yourself so God can help you.<br>Microsoft MVP,  2006 - 2008</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 11:17:46 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21899077</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  FunnyBones <A HREF="/useremail/u/937688"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>It will test against a blacklist of 1370 illegal web pages, including 674 pages containing child sexual abuse content. The list is managed by the Australian Communications and Media Authority.</div>What are the 696 other sites?<br>Is this list available to the public?<br>Will the "results" of this test be independently verifiable?<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:58:02 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21899052</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/937688"><b>FunnyBones</b></A> : THE federal Government's controversial live ISP filtering trial will finally kick-off with six internet service providers chosen to participate.<br><br>Primus Telecommunications, Tech 2U, Webshield, OMNIconnect, Netforce and Highway 1 have been selected. <br><br>The live tests will last for a minimum of six weeks and the ISPs' customers have the option of taking part in the trial. <br><br>The pilot aims to investigate the efficiency and effectiveness of a mandatory internet filtering scheme -- a key election pledge by Labor. <br><br>It will test against a blacklist of 1370 illegal web pages, including 674 pages containing child sexual abuse content. The list is managed by the Australian Communications and Media Authority.<br><br>ISPs have the option of testing against 10,000 web pages but this excludes actual customers. <br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25040645-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br>Here is a small update and now they will start the new trial of filtering.<br><small>--<br>Fb:2009 The nightmare men have returned.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:51:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21866505</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Seems this is really getting messy. I can't still for the life of me understand why filtering is the best approach. First link references child porn filtering in a blog by Bernadette McMenamin, Child Wise CEO <br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25010836-5013046,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>For over 25 years I have worked in Australia and overseas to prevent the sexual abuse and exploitation of children. One of the most horrendous developments that we have experienced in the last 15 years is the dramatic explosion in the global trade of child sexual abuse images on the internet.<br><br>While you would say it is considered an issue and no one is arguing that, the big picture says we need more than this, a lot more if the internet is to be strong and survive. <hr></blockquote><br><br>Another topic for the same day references someone willing to question and debate this filter and is at threat for saying so.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,25010682-5014239,00.html" >www.news.com.au/technology/story&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>A DEATH threat has been made against a vocal opponent of the Federal Government&#146;s web filtering plan in a grim escalation of the already heated debate. <br><br>Online rights campaigner Geordie Guy received a threatening phone message last month after publicly disagreeing with an article supporting the filtering scheme.<br><br>"I got home from work and found a message on my answering machine telling me to keep my name out of the paper," he said. <br><br>"It said to 'cut the libertarian bullsh&#151;' or I'd be sorry." <br><br>Under the Government's controversial plan all Australians will be served a "clean feed" by internet service providers, with websites on a secret blacklist blocked. <br><br>Mr Guy, a member of online civil liberties group Electronic Frontiers Australia, has been an outspoken critic of the plan and has been regularly quoted in newspapers. <br><br>He said police were concerned as the threat appeared to be made from a public telephone. <br><br>"My wife was very concerned. It was very unfortunate she had to hear that," he said. <br><br>Mr Guy said it was likely the caller found his home number after his suburb was printed next to a letter responding to an opinion piece written by Australian Christian Lobby managing director Jim Wallace in January.<hr></blockquote><br><br>I doubt anyone really is saying leave child porn available, or at least I hope so. The issue is about the big picture of what really needs to be approached and how to effectively deal with these issues.<br><br>Playing some secret, behind the doors ploy just doesn't sound legit....maybe they should have thought more on this with the approach and the public. No wonder they get serious feedback from the ranks. <br><br> <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 05 Feb 2009 10:16:01 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21834055</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  fatness <A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Either you trust the people to make their own decisions, or you don't trust the people. <br> </div>I think the problem is that most people want others left alone, but that an increasingly-vocal minority in several countries wants to prevent others from seeing, reading, or talking about different things. And those people have too much effect on governments. It's really much more emotionally gripping to "Stop Child Pornography!" than to "let people read what they want", so bandwagons of emotion are started to achieve the censorship aims of the minority. </div>I understand your point. I guess however, as I look back across history, I see lots of vocal groups attempting to control details in behavior of those around them... both under despots and under varying degrees of democracy. But what I also see are leaders under both systems willing and eager to use (and sometimes even foment) those vocalizations to solidify their own political objectives and their methods of control over <i>all</i> the people. Hence a major root cause of the pograms under the Czars and the mass exterminations under the Nazis... these did not occur amidst a popular vacuum. Perhaps some of the vocalizations demanding "government control and action" came directly from the beliefs of various agitating minorities... perhaps they were fomented by political forces for ulterior motives. But in any event, they were used by those in power to forge the fetters that politically enslaved the entire populace. I expect that kind of behavior from despotic leaders... I reject that behavior from leaders of a "free" society. <br><br>And it is up to the people as a whole to fight continually against allowing such leadership despotism to develop and expand in a free society. I cannot control my neighbor or much of his behavior - but I can (and must) still exert a degree of common-sense control over my elected leaders... both before, during, and after election. If I and my fellow citizens will not do that, then freedom <i>will</i> die.<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 12:48:01 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21832734</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Either you trust the people to make their own decisions, or you don't trust the people. <br> </div>I think the problem is that most people want others left alone, but that an increasingly-vocal minority in several countries wants to prevent others from seeing, reading, or talking about different things. And those people have too much effect on governments. It's really much more emotionally gripping to "Stop Child Pornography!" than to "let people read what they want", so bandwagons of emotion are started to achieve the censorship aims of the minority.<br><small>--<br><A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1370721~74256f2b8b4b5b881ae82d211fa2c6ad/couch.jpg">goodbye dad</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 09:27:49 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21831997</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : Heh:<br>google:<br>National Geographic sex<br>this page has got it all !! every key word you could want <br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.scaryideas.com/print/5077/" >www.scaryideas.com/print/5077/</A><br><br>Scientific American sex<br><br>Nature Journal sex<br><br>ooh the smutty devils<br>Hopefully our filter will protect us from this rampant filth  :uhh:]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 03:20:03 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21831433</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : Either you trust the people to make their own decisions, or you don't trust the people. If you don't trust the people, as a leader, you will rule over them - not govern as their representative. Thus is the road to despotism...<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 23:54:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21831069</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : I suspect a lot of nasty...reading... :o]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:42:35 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21831011</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  fatness <A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Australia will need to do something about those libraries too. They're full of "unwanted content".<br> </div>LoooL<br>Damn yes: not to worry, next on the agenda...so many things to screw down...pesky book thingies...who knows what might be happening in those libraries <br> :D :D :D]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:33:45 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21830317</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  fatness <A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Australia will need to do something about those libraries too. They're full of "unwanted content".<br> </div>They could always throw a book-burning party... ;)<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 20:37:53 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21830306</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/243195"><b>fatness</b></A> : Australia will need to do something about those libraries too. They're full of "unwanted content".]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 20:35:28 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21830070</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : Still following the relentless frustrations and disappointments expressed here.<br><br>Reminds me a bit of the last great censorship debacle in Australia:<br>The Little Red Schoolbook  :D <br>Anybody even remember that ??<br>At the time the threat to all known values of the community was terrifying  :uhh:<br><br>This absurd topheavy attempt to control the free flow of information is a debacle really.<br>When even those who may stand to gain something suggest that it is wrong, where is the mandate ??<br><br>Great continuing demonstration of how legislators are way off the mark when attempting social engineering.<br>The only real way to stop 'abuse' of/in/and by the www is to keep shining the light, not try and stuff it in a box.<br><br>The absurdity of the possibly one or two term govt attempting to stomp on the web is a sight to see.<br><br>If there is a real issue with tasteless content why not start in Fishwyk.<br>( for any non Aussies Fishwyk is a suburb in our capital Canberra -about 5 minutes drive from the houses of parliament- where literally thousands of Xrated porno DVDs is available in vast 'supermarket' warehouses)<br>There is an unusual confluence of images here LOL.<br><br>the point about secret balcklisting is SO valid and the next step will be compulsory monitoring of ISP logs -if it's not already there under our recently upgraded homeland security equivs which has given our police outrageous powers- then where ??<br><br>Noone seems to have raised the possibility of any content providers fingers in this mudpie: just seems a perfect fit for the DRM models: just wondering  :)<br><br>Norwegian's sig has all we need to know.<br>Keep up the pressure.<br>"When you look into an abyss, the abyss also looks into you" <br>Here, there be monsters.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 19:47:37 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>ISPs clustered for filtering trials</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21829339</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <br>update PARTICIPANTS in the federal Government's controversial mandatory internet filtering scheme will start live trials in batches, instead of en masse.<br><br>Sixteen expressions of interest for the trial have been received from small, medium and large ISPs, and the Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy is considering which providers should be invited to take part in the test. <br><br>It is understood that since the size of the ISPs vary, they could be grouped together in blocks; the start and end date for trials would differ depending on the groupings. <br><br>Live trials will be conducted by Enex TestLab, the Melbourne outfit that conducted the first laboratory, or closed, trials of internet filtering products under the Howard regime. <br><br>Ideally, ISPs will participate in the pilot for a minimum of six weeks..............<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,24975071-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 17:43:56 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21622379</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> :   <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>In a post on his department's blog, Senator Conroy today said technology that could filter data sent directly between computers would be tested as part of the upcoming live filtering trial. <br><br>"Technology that filters peer-to-peer and BitTorrent traffic does exist and it is anticipated that the effectiveness of this will be tested in the live pilot trial," Senator Conroy said<br><hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,24833959-5014239,00.html" >www.news.com.au/technology/story&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br>From that link and a look at the latest blog, I must be missing the comment on peer-to-peer specifically or haven't found the topic he mentions it yet.<br><br>Conroy's Blog - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_for_business/industry_development/digital_economy/future_directions_blog" >www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_&middot;&middot;&middot;ons_blog</A><br><br>Topics so far - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_for_business/industry_development/digital_economy/future_directions_blog/topics" >www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_&middot;&middot;&middot;g/topics</A><br><br>Still I really think it is being approached wrong, very wrong; especially if content is the topic. None of what this plan encompasses approaches exploited/infected sites, the main cause of users concern.<br><br>(Edit: So what is wrong with peer-to-peer, it is a great form of file-sharing!! Content such as cracked/infected software maybe a govt issue, maybe not, but links to free copyrighted music is a legal issue for the initial company, is it not?)<br><br>What happens to a user's bank acct if the passwords/personal info is stolen. ID fraud and other such internet issues are not even considered serious enough to be put above a moral issue of childeren...<b>Bah humbug</b><br><br>You can call me a grumpy old man...   :)<br><br>I can see me going to jail for bypassing what they put in place. Another sole in an over crowded judicial system, simply because of a belief that the filter as it presently stands is wrong and we know it; if this is how it will be implemented.<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 16:40:53 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Conroy silent on web censorship trial</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21569835</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : <div class="bquote">Why the secrecy, while exclaiming on your own site how great it is and then keeping quite to any one who asks.</div>When people bullshit or evade answering a question, it often means that they are themselves ignorant but are trying to give a positive impression.  Politicians are particularly prone to using this tactic.<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.4</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 12 Dec 2008 09:50:07 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Conroy silent on web censorship trial</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21569144</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,24784419-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br><div class="bquote">Last week during question time, Senator Conroy was asked how many participants would ISPs have to enlist for the live trials to be credible. <br><br>South Australian Liberal MP Cory Bernardi also asked if the results of the trials would be independently verified. <br><br>Senator Conroy could not provide answers to both questions within the stipulated two-minute timeframe.</div><b>Minister welcomes advances in internet filtering technology</b><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.minister.dbcde.gov.au/media/media_releases/2008/060" >www.minister.dbcde.gov.au/media/&middot;&middot;&middot;2008/060</A><br><br><div class="bquote">The Minister for Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy, Senator Stephen Conroy today welcomed a report demonstrating advances in internet content filtering technologies.<br><br>&#147;The internet is a wonderful tool that is delivering benefits to increasing numbers of Australian families but the Government wants to find ways to make it safer, particularly for children. This report will assist the Government to deliver on its election commitment to create a safer online environment,&#148; Senator Conroy said.<br><br>Senator Conroy today released the findings of the report by the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA), Closed Environment Testing of ISP-Level Internet Content Filtering.<br><br>The report details the results of extensive laboratory tests into the current effectiveness of commercial Internet Service Provider (ISP) filtering products.</div>It seems through all this, there has been no comment about anything, even a week ago according to the first link. Something I've noticed since the start is the apparent closed reply. Why the secrecy, while exclaiming on your own site how great it is and then keeping quite to any one who asks. Smells fishy, but that is an opinion, not fact you must remember, because of the secrecy about the issue, it is the opinion I have, and it seems many others do too.<br><br>You would think that something you are so happy about, the least you would do if so many are arguing about it's effectiveness, is to say something about it. Every article says there is no reply to any questioning. All we have been told is "a list of known child related sites" will be used, 1300 in total.<br><br>He has created a blog it seems though for feedback.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_for_business/industry_development/digital_economy/future_directions_blog" >www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_&middot;&middot;&middot;ons_blog</A><br><br>Excuse me here, but wanting feedback on a blog won't really give you any more insight than the feedback already out there. 20,000 comments say yes, 20,000 comments say no, that is not an idea of anything more than "I have the numbers". Most ISP's are entertaining the game or saying straight out it won't work. Then again though for it's real function, it may just work, guess we may not find out till it is too late anyway to say either way, because of the lack of information, other than "in-house testing has revealed". <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 12 Dec 2008 04:19:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21525153</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : I can only agree with some of the simple info in this topic on the issue, even some child welfare groups would prefer money spent elsewhere for children if that is to be the excuse for filtering the net. <br><br><div class="bquote">Opponents of the Government's filtering scheme are concerned the system will slow internet speed and accidentally block a large number of legitimate websites. <br><br>In the first of three annual reports made for Senator Conroy's office published earlier this year, the Australian Communications and Media Authority cited studies that had found web filters blocked the wrong content in more than 25 per cent of test cases. <br><br>Anti-censorship advocates are also concerned that a secret "blacklist" of websites to be blocked could be expanded in the future to include political material. <br><br>The Government says an internet filter is necessary to clamp down on illegal material such as child pornography and protect young people on the web, but has struggled to convince all parties. <br><br>Last month it was reported that even some children's welfare groups were opposed to the plan, with concerns that money put aside for a web filter could be better spent elsewhere. <br><br>"This is called a child protection measure yet the vast majority of all serious child abuse does not occur on the internet, it occurs in the home," said James McDougall of the National Children's and Youth Law Centre.</div>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,28348,24750766-5014239,00.html" >www.news.com.au/technology/story&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br>Home page for <A HREF="https://www.getup.org.au/">GetUp!</a><br><br>Home page for the government's <A HREF="http://www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_for_consumers/funding_programs__and__support/cyber-safety_plan/internet_service_provider_isp_filtering/isp_filtering_live_pilot">pilot page</a><br><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 07:25:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21486381</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> :  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Often these 'statistics' are promulgated without source citation. Section 2 of this paper identifies the origin/source of such 'statistics' and documents the history of same where 'information laundering' has occurred (i.e. the source or detail has been changed in the course of repetition). Section 3 provides information about estimates/statistics originating more recently, and which appear more likely to have some connection with reality. Section 4 documents some examples of Australian media misreporting about web sites and police operations which may contribute to false perceptions about the number of web sites containing child sexual abuse material.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://libertus.net/censor/resources/statistics-laundering.html" >libertus.net/censor/resources/st&middot;&middot;&middot;ing.html</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 03:15:50 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia&#x27;s Bizarre Censorship Laws</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21480973</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Quite an entertaining view of what we call home.<br><br>The beginning of Australian history is that, If I can use the word "tyranny" and nothing more. <br><br>People moved here to look after the convicts, virtually in a country bone dry except for the small amount of water ways.<br><br>The fight that was bought out of working hard dry ground has cooked our heads, the whole mess is a shambles and we're too busy having a beer at the pub to really see what the other half does. "Freedom", if I may use the word, was born and then pushed back quite officially at levels that will leave many shudder. I can never understand why such a place as remote as ours could not get some settled ground more often.<br><br>Rather than a blind shunt, with the comment "I will exult myself from comment". The monarchy is in England, not here.<br>Let's get a filtering system if it has to be tackled on the table and bring all of the resources into it so that the best outcome can be arranged, not forced upon us like children scorned. <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 04:36:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Australia&#x27;s Bizarre Censorship Laws</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21476111</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : From <A HREF="http://www.allnewsweb.com/page11125.php">All News Web</a><br>20-11-2008 - <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>In Ireland, that once great bastion of conservative Catholicism a recent attempt to ban pornography by an activist group with some support from a minority of ministers was laughed out of parliament, in Poland another stronghold of the church the President of the nation intervened to quash an attempt by rightists to ban the sale pornographic images. In societies generally regarded as traditional such as Turkey, Greece and Portugal one can freely sell non-violent pornography. In fact the only countries outside of Africa, Asia and the Middle East that ban the sale of pornography are Cuba, a few small Pacific nations and.............Australia.<br><br>This may surprise many readers, and rightly so. Of all places Australia would, at first glance, seem the least likely nation to be a bastion of censorship and suppression of individual rights. Australia appears to be about as &#145;new world&#146; as any country gets, its inhabitants would be close to the least religious population on the planet. On the surface Australia appears to be modern and progressive, however this initial impression is deceiving. To date it is illegal and punishable by imprisonment to sell pornography in all Australian states. The Australian govenment also has developed an appetite for banning video games and much of X-box's biggest titles remain forbidden and out of reach for Australians. Non pornographic films have also been excluded from cinemas by Australia's much feared and notoriously heavy-handed Censorship Board<br><br>The reality is that behind Australia&#146;s slick veneer lies a &#145;redneck&#146; heart. The nations past as a penal colony dictates much of Australia&#146;s democratic traditions:  limited at best. Australia has no bill of rights and freedom of expression is not enshrined in any charter. The traditional apathy Australians have for politics is working to take Australia out of the modern era. It appears the only people motivated enough to get involved in politics are religious puritans: Australia&#146;s new prime Minister Kevin Rudd included, a former Christian youth activist known for his piety. Never mind his recent visit to a New York strip club. It seems he is more than happy to deny Australians the same pleasures. Most puritans tend to work on that basis.<br><br>Sexual misdemeanours in fact are so common within the ruling Labor party that they barely raise an eyebrow. At least two senior ministers from this social justice party have recently been convicted of serious crimes of a sexual nature and there have been numerous allegations regarding other high ranking members. Yet when it comes to censorship of what in any other country would be harmless legal entertainment, the Labor party can been relied upon by small but vocal church groups to take a stand.<br><br>The slightly undemocratic nature of Australian democracy whereby isolated regional backwaters tend to have far more political power has helped the censorship junkies. Tasmania with a population of 500,000 has as many senators as New South Wales with a population of over 7,000 000. It is this anomaly that has allowed censorship to thrive. Much of Australia&#146;s current censorship laws, particularly the ones that forbid Australians to publish pornography on the internet were pushed through by a religious extremist senator from Tasmania by the name of Brian Harradine, who used the pornography ticket to hold up important legislation: he got into parliament with less than 15,000 votes. He also had no qualms aboout forcing his beliefs on people that never would have or could have voted for him.<br><br>This flaw in Australian society whereby a fairly laid back population is governed by conservative elements with little regard for individual rights might prove Australia&#146;s undoing. Presently the ruling Labor party is putting into place a national mandatory internet filtering program, whereby the internet will be censored at ISP level. These measures have been sponsored and promoted by minority right-wing Christian groups who have threatened to block legislation that Labor is concerned with unless their demands are met. No democracy has yet attempted to censor the internet in this way. It appears that all pornography will be blocked, to start with. Having succeeded there the religious groups that have pushed for this development might well end up insisting that any site that goes against their religious beliefs be blocked, and it is hardly out of the question that the government of the day might end up blocking sites that don't suit its agenda. Australia will be joining countries like Iran and North Korea in this latest assualt on freedom of expression.<br><br>Another cultural factor contributing to this culture of censorship harks back to Australia's early days as a colony. Populated by people that were regarded as having a low status within the British class structure Australia was said to be a hotbed of vice, sin and hedonism. Throughout the Twentieth Century the population was encouraged to forget their origins and become 'respectable'. This attitude remains and should any agenda driven religious activist dare mention the words 'family values' Australians will run for cover: no one dares be seen as not supporting Victorian era notions of family. The current swoop on the internet, we are told, is all in the name of 'protecting the children', the famous refrain of history's worst dictators.<br><br>With Australia&#146;s apathy towards civil liberties (anyone remember the boat people who were recently carted off to prison islands?) freedom of expression can be easily sacrificed. Many are predicting the new measures will spell the end of the information age in Australia, some tests are showing that internet speeds will be affected so severely the internet will become unworkable. Australia's communications minister Mr Stephen Conroy is pushing ahead with 'mandatory filtering' nonetheless. Australia has lost touched with modern western values, perhaps partly due to its geographic isolation. It&#146;s traditional apathy for anything beyond sport, property and digging stuff out of the ground and selling it to China may result in the nations demise. Perhaps this type of endemic 'yob culture' is what brought civilizations down in the past. Is it too late for Australia?<hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 08:49:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21475897</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : I seem a bit confused over it all. Seems to be some big changes happening just not sure how, nor what will be the result. We seem to be expected to put up with some big changes it seems, which path though?<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,24696521-5013038,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>We are at a stand-off, at one of the critical digital infrastructure junctions in the nation's history. The bottom line is that the Government may think it knows best in terms of delivering the broadband network to rival network Terria, absent a bid by Telstra. But on Utting's account the voters say otherwise. <br><br>The Government, represented by Communications Minister Stephen Conroy, and Telstra appear to be on a collision course. Telstra is intent on staring down Conroy by not bidding if the minister insists on a wholesale-retail entity break-up as result of any successful tender. Conroy for his part seems hell-bent on going through with an ultimately non-competitive bidding process that may end up with a monopolistic solution to a problem that should have been settled by less prescriptive means.<hr></blockquote><br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,24698279-15306,00.html" >www.australianit.news.com.au/sto&middot;&middot;&middot;,00.html</A><br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Finance Minister Lindsay Tanner says the government will adopt Sir Peter's "package of targeted strategies and actions" to improve the use of ICT in public administration and service delivery. <br><br>"This decision represents the most significant change in the use and management of ICT in the Australian Government to date," Mr Tanner said. "We will act decisively in applying the recommendations.<hr></blockquote><br><br>No wonder I don't understand it.....<br><br><small>sorry for getting off topic</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 07:07:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21455602</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  FunnyBones <A HREF="/useremail/u/937688"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Won't somebody think of the children? <br><br>The way this has been promoted is that it will protect your children but they still have the green light.<br> </div>There is no problem there either. Off your link -<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The scheme will require ISPs to offer a "clean-feed" web service to all homes, schools and public internet access points<hr></blockquote> <br><br>Why not do this as they did with immobilizers, govt subsidises the point and adds a content filter/router/firewall at a reduced price to the point of call. No problem, the internet still floats along happily and the children are looked after by the filters at schools etc. <br><br>As a grown adult if I want to have a w#nk over some barbie doll I'm entitled to it, we still have adult shops, skimpy bars, call girl centres etc etc etc all out in the open, so where is this an aim at keeping us a healthy enviroment.<br><br>Also look at countries where sex is a part of every day life for adults in the same room as children? Are we becoming that scared, cold and fridget that we can't accept our own natural life cycles, surely the 2 dogs across the road don't get filtered for what they do??<br><br>It's a question of what is the real motive, as where does the 60-100 odd thousand malware sites out there get looked at?<br><br>Picking something to start simply on moral grounds allows a door, that as mentioned elsewhere, will not be reopened very easily once the key has been used.<br><br>I hope they do look more at the point of exposure, not at the entry.<br><br>Look at it another way, damming the creek rather than damming some of the strong river flow down stream will restrict everything after, there will be more detrimental long term effects than simply keeping an item of mother nature away from very curious, prying eyes, who will by nature, still find it if they look hard enough.<br><br>An old saying that fits the bill, <br>"A lock will only keep the honest crooks out"<br><br>Filters, yes, just not as they portray it.      <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:08:23 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21455341</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/219811"><b>Hutch</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote">Why they are testing with specifically certain sites with this has me concerned.</div>I take that as an indicator of the degree of ignorance involved.<br><br>If I were an ISP down under, I would make sure that whenever a user is blocked from a page, his/her browser would show a page naming the political party and the cabinet ministers responsible for this blocking.<br> </div> :D :D :D ;)<br><small>--<br>If I knew then, what I know now. I would have still made the same mistakes.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:01:02 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21454240</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/937688"><b>FunnyBones</b></A> : Won't somebody think of the children? This mantra is being used with great effect by the Australian government to increase its control over what Australians see, watch and do - all, ostensibly, in the name of protecting the nation's youth.<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2008/nov/20/australia-internet-filter-censorship" >www.guardian.co.uk/technology/20&middot;&middot;&middot;nsorship</A><br><br>The way this has been promoted is that it will protect your children but they still have the green light.<br><small>--<br>Are you part of the cattle?</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 20:41:48 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21419284</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The more and more i think about the way this is being approached, i can't help wonder what the real motives behind all this is.  <br>...<br>Why they are testing with specifically certain sites with this has me concerned. Are they trying to win over the general populace? Is there something really on the agenda? There just seems to be no real grounds from where they are coming from that I can tell, 1300 blacklisted sites, hell my hosts' file has close to 5 times that and it's a drop in the ocean. <br>...<br>I can't see why filtering of malware sites couldn't be used for the test either, unless they want this to be used as a policing tool as well, in which, yes we all are in trouble of loosing what little freedom we have left.<br>...<br>I know we rely on the govt to look after us and hope they manage funds for the country well, I just seem to be loosing what is democratic and what is communism in it all.<br>... </div>The problem is that, once a censorship machine has been constructed, put into place, and buttressed with legal authority and state sanctions, it's a trivial exercise to later add to the restriction list whatever the powers-that-be desire. The only hope at that point would be powerfully-enforced transparency for what is on (and goes onto) the censored list, with the most severe political repercussions from the populace if that list is "abused". (Which ignores, of course, that just emplacing the censorship machine itself is abuse of freedom of speech in the first place.) You see, if the populace accepts the installation of the machine at the beginning, there's precious little hope they'll have any say (or interest) in how it's used later on.<br><br>Personally, I believe all governments that are left purely to themselves will invariably opt for more and more power to monitor and control their people. It makes the job of governance easier. In Australia's case, the ability to censor web viewing would be "handy to have" for those in power when dealing with other issues that they fear could prove socially 'disruptive' or 'threatening'. <br><br>The government desire to monitor and control is inherently present, so when some perhaps well-meaning interest group comes along with a demand that the government protect society from exposure to whatever named threat (child porn, in this case), the government jumps on that excuse and charges ahead. The named threat sounds legitimate to many, so the band-wagon gets launched and rolling. Later, when things die down and the most vocal criticism has drifted elsewhere, whoever is then in control of government quietly adds whatever <b>they</b> want to the censorship list. And with each new administration, more gets added. And eventually, web viewing - and a part of one's freedom of speech - is fully in chains.<br><br>The American "Founding Fathers" understood quite well that government needs to be kept in chains, or the power-flow involved in government will end up putting the people in chains. That was not a lucky insight on their part... it is common sense about universal truth for any people in any time and all places. Citizens' rights do not derive from the government - <i>any</i> goverment. They are inherent in one's "beingness" as a human. As stated in America's Declaration of Independence, "WE hold these Truths to be self-evident: that all Men are created equal and are endowed <i>by their Creator</i> with certain inalienable Rights..."<br><br>It's up to the Australian citizenry to stand for their rights to speak and view freely... it is up to them to find the appropriate way to do that... and it is up to them to pay the costs of doing that. If they will not do it or pay it, then they will lose that right. History teaches that rights, once lost, are devastatingly costly to recover. I sincerely wish the Australian people well in the challenge... they are fine folks!<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:41:03 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21419259</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>Sorry, I had a moment. Excuse the mini-rant y'all... :huh:</div>Welcome to the club! ;) Not a problem!]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:36:09 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21419188</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : Sorry, I had a moment. Excuse the mini-rant y'all... :huh:]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:24:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21419172</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>IMO, Capitalism is the antithesis of human dignity.</div>Unbridled, yes.<br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>However, as we all know, globally accepted political and socio-economic definitions are full of bunk in many ways.</div>No, they are what they are. Definitions.<br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I can't say Merry Christmas without offending someone these days. They want to change Halloween to 'Black and Orange' day for fear of scarring some immigrant child. WTH?<br><br>If I went to the Mid-East and said I was offended by their celebrating Ramadan, I'd be subject to severe grief. In many ways, I believe the global economy has hurt more people than helped.</div>These personal observations have nothing to do with the political definitions we discussed, nor this thread topic.<br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>But, I digress...</div> True. ;)<br><br>Look, again, I'm in agreement with OZO's and your  positions on Australian censorship and its ramifications!]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 20:22:35 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21418966</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : IMO, Capitalism is the antithesis of human dignity. However, as we all know, globally accepted political and socio-economic definitions are full of bunk in many ways. I can't say Merry Christmas without offending someone these days. They want to change Halloween to 'Black and Orange' day for fear of scarring some immigrant child. WTH?<br><br>If I went to the Mid-East and said I was offended by their celebrating Ramadan, I'd be subject to severe grief. In many ways, I believe the global economy has hurt more people than helped. But, I digress...<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 19:51:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21418897</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>     :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br> What you describe could actually be attributes of an authoritarian, totalitarian, fascist or dictatorial state. </div> Friend, while I agree with your distinction, it's all still the same steaming pile 'o crap, no?</div>I do understand what your driving at and agree that <i>"The wanton violation of humanities rights and freedoms. It seems lawmakers fail to distinguish between porn, and child-porn, terrorism and a fight for rights and justice."</i> are undesirable and misguided elements.<br><br>But no, in spite of the fact that reality offers up sometimes severe deviations from theory, globally accepted political and socio-economic definitions are what they are. Let's not forget that capitalism itself is no guarantor of human dignity. After all, US <i>democracy</i> is only theoretical too, isn't it?<br><br>Again, I agree in principle with the general points that you and OZO are making. We can also be accurate as well. :)]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 19:40:15 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21418856</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br> What you describe could actually be attributes of an authoritarian, totalitarian, fascist or dictatorial state. </div> Friend, while I agree with your distinction, it's all still the same steaming pile 'o crap, no? The wanton violation of humanities rights and freedoms. It seems lawmakers fail to distinguish between porn, and child-porn, terrorism and a fight for rights and justice.<br><br>The scary thing is, all of us here could be deemed 'terrorists' for our belief in security, and the denial of allowing free access to our computers. It may be just a matter of time before that comes to pass...<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 19:30:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21418753</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  OZO <A HREF="/useremail/u/755055"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>   :</small><br><br>One of the basic principles of communism is the belief that government knows how to make people live better and therefore has intrinsic right to enforce it on them. Government is the Big Brother (or rather a Big Father here). It has needed power, resources (given by people) and a will to do whatever it takes to achieve the goal (a better life, whatever it means).</div>Afraid that you've got your "isms" a bit confused.<br><blockquote><A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist">Communism</a> is a socioeconomic structure and political ideology that promotes the establishment of an egalitarian, classless society based on common ownership of the means of production and property in general.<br><br>Communism attempts to offer an alternative to the problems believed to be inherent with capitalist economies and the legacy of imperialism and nationalism. Communism states that the only way to solve these problems is for the working class, or proletariat, to replace the wealthy bourgeoisie, which is currently the ruling class, in order to <i>establish a peaceful, free society, without classes, or government</i>.<br><br>As a political movement, <A HREF="http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761572241/communism.html">communism</a> sought to overthrow capitalism through a workers&#146; revolution and establish a system in which property is owned by the community as a whole rather than by individuals. In theory, communism would create a classless society of abundance and freedom, in which all people enjoy equal social and economic status.</blockquote>In theory, communism is about <i>not</i> having a 'Big Brother' government. In reality the theory was most often subverted and twisted to serve other less admirable purposes.<br><br>What you describe could actually be attributes of an authoritarian, totalitarian, fascist or dictatorial state.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 19:12:40 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21418680</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/755055"><b>OZO</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I hate talking politics, as it all a bunch of lies to suit those that can talk better than others getting what they deem, they need, but for the life of me, since Sept 11, the push towards terrorist activities and monitoring the world as a whole has cut a lot of freedom we once had. I know we rely on the govt to look after us and hope they manage funds for the country well, I just seem to be loosing what is democratic and what is communism in it all.</div>You're making a good point and I actually feel the same.<br><br>One of the basic principles of communism is the belief that government knows how to make people live better and therefore has intrinsic right to enforce it on them. Government is the Big Brother (or rather a Big Father here). It has needed power, resources (given by people) and a will to do whatever it takes to achieve the goal (a better life, whatever it means). Here we see an example of this very policy - Australian government knows better how to protect people from an evil (child pornography) and therefore it will enforce that protection on its own people via complete filtering of the Internet (of cause, it will be done for the sake of poor children). What is new here (at least to me) - now we see it in form of a <i>monarch communism</i> (BTW, is filtering approved by the <A HREF="http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408934?hilite=queen">queen</a>?) :) Good Lord... I never heard of that before and never thought that it's even possible. But people are always creative... ;)<br><small>--<br>Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 18:59:36 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21417514</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>ACMA's blacklist includes 1,300 web addresses and another 10,000 would be added to this list.<br> </div>Why aren't they releasing more info than, "will will use this block of sites, then add more", I dare not ask? I may be incriminated against because a web page I visit has been deemed against govt policy? What policy exactly?<br><br>There is just too much grey area they are not being clear on.<br> </div>They are intentionally not responding with clarity.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 15:27:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21417340</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <br> ;)]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:53:44 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21417338</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>ACMA's blacklist includes 1,300 web addresses and another 10,000 would be added to this list.<br> </div>Why aren't they releasing more info than, "will will use this block of sites, then add more", I dare not ask? I may be incriminated against because a web page I visit has been deemed against govt policy? What policy exactly?<br><br>There is just too much grey area they are not being clear on.<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:52:52 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21417295</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : <div class="bquote">Why they are testing with specifically certain sites with this has me concerned.</div>I take that as an indicator of the degree of ignorance involved.<br><br>If I were an ISP down under, I would make sure that whenever a user is blocked from a page, his/her browser would show a page naming the political party and the cabinet ministers responsible for this blocking.<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.3</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:44:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21417263</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>1300 blacklisted sites</div>ACMA's blacklist includes 1,300 web addresses and another 10,000 would be added to this list.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:38:38 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21417237</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : The more and more i think about the way this is being approached, i can't help wonder what the real motives behind all this is. Content filtering fine, if it is done correctly, I've mentioned this earlier, but it should be an option not a forced item.<br><br>Why they are testing with specifically certain sites with this has me concerned. Are they trying to win over the general populace? Is there something really on the agenda? There just seems to be no real grounds from where they are coming from that I can tell, 1300 blacklisted sites, hell my hosts' file has close to 5 times that and it's a drop in the ocean. <br><br>What can actually be deemed filterable in the first place, attacking specifically certain sensitive sites on moral basis just doesn't seem to cut it. I can't see why filtering of malware sites couldn't be used for the test either, unless they want this to be used as a policing tool as well, in which, yes we all are in trouble of loosing what little freedom we have left.<br><br>I hate talking politics, as it all a bunch of lies to suit those that can talk better than others getting what they deem, they need, but for the life of me, since Sept 11, the push towards terrorist activities and monitoring the world as a whole has cut a lot of freedom we once had. I know we rely on the govt to look after us and hope they manage funds for the country well, I just seem to be loosing what is democratic and what is communism in it all.<br><br>Seems funny that the same countries happily telling other's their political system is up s&#t creek without a paddle, yet force a regime upon their own people seems a tad hipocritical, unless I'm missing something here.<br><br>I'm wandering off topic now, time will tell.<br><br> <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:33:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Australian Technology Industry Fighting Back</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21417150</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : From <A HREF="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/11/12/aussie_firewall_row/">The Register</a><br>12th November 2008 - <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>ISP boss pledges to undermine Great Aussie Firewall<br>Stupid plan is stupid</b><br><br>The Australian technology industry is starting to fight back against the government plan to force all ISPs to filter everyone's internet access.<br><br>Michael Malone, boss of iiNet, an Australian ISP with 700,000 customers, said his firm would take part in the trial, but only in order to show the government how stupid it was. Malone described communications minister Stephen Conroy as the worst minister in the internet's 15-year history.<br><br>The scheme would force ISPs to offer two types of internet access - one filtered for children and one filtered for adult Australians.<br><br>Conroy did not help his cause with <A HREF="http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=OUohfIhFET8">a muddled performance</a> in the Australian Senate. Conroy said the pilot would filter a blacklist from the Australian Communications and Media Authority as well as "other unwanted content". ACMA's blacklist includes 1,300 web addresses and another 10,000 would be added to this list. But he failed to answer Senator Scott Ludlam's question as to what "unwanted" meant.<br><br>The trial will test the impact on internet speeds as well as costs for providers.<br><br>Conroy said the government was aware of technical concerns and happy to have an open debate. He urged the industry to step forward and engage with government.<br><br>For his part Malone said he would join the "ridiculous" trial only in order to show the government that the filter would be simple to bypass, would not check peer-to-peer traffic and would slow network speeds.<br><br>Malone told the <i><A HREF="http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2008/11/11/1226318639085.html">Sydney Morning Herald</a></i>: "They're not listening to the experts, they're not listening to the industry, they're not listening to consumers, so perhaps some hard numbers will actually help.<br><br>"Every time a kid manages to get through this filter, we'll be publicising it and every time it blocks legitimate content, we'll be publicising it."<br><br>The trial is due to start on Christmas Eve.<hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 14:19:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21414919</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : We are getting closer to what is happening, but still getting the run around it seems.<br><br>Guess we will have to wait a little longer for real facts. Lets' hope it isn't after it has been put in place, otherwise it maybe filtered on the grounds of "what is considered public, and what is considered beyond the public ear"!!!<br><br><A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,24641171-15306,00.html"><b>More</b></a><br><br><div class="bquote">THE federal Government has been urged to come clean over grey areas in its internet filtering plan after Broadband and Communications Minister Stephen Conroy pointed to "unwanted content" being censored.<br>On Monday, the Government released details of its long-awaited <A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,24632210-15306,00.html">call for expressions of interest on internet content</a> filtering trials that will involve ISPs and mobile phone operators. <br><br>During question time yesterday, Senator Conroy was unclear on the exact type of content that would be blocked during the trials. <br><br>"The <b>pilot will test filtering specifically against the ACMA blacklist of internet prohibited content</b>, which is mostly child pornography, as well as filtering of other unwanted content," he said in response to a question by Greens Senator Scott Ludlum. <br><br>The <A HREF="http://www.acma.gov.au/WEB/STANDARD/pc=PC_100770">Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA)</a> has 1300 illegal web pages on its blacklist. </div>I dare not say any more here than that due to the following comment on one of the links. How ever it doesn't harm to to look for yourselves. I'm quite an upstanding citizen, but If I find myself in court, you'll hopefully understand why, as I doubt they will be understanding in regards to it.  <br><br><div class="bquote"><small>This work is copyright. Apart from any use as permitted under the Copyright Act 1968, no part may be produced by any process without prior written permission from the Australian Communications and Media Authority. <br><br>Requests and enquiries concerning reproduction and rights, and any enquiries arising from the contents of the report should be addressed to: <br><br>Manager Communications and Publishing<br>Australian Communications and Media Authority<br>PO Box 13112 Law Courts, Melbourne VIC 8010 </small></div><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 06:09:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21409108</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1141361"><b>caffeinator</b></A> : Like any censorship, it only applies to those who wish to abide by it.<br><br>Right, like the guns they want to take as well, eh mates?<br>Like one mans lunacy defines all. Sound familiar?<br><br>Report at once!<br><br>Fooolishness, and self-buggery, if you so do.<br><br>PAH!<br><br>If That is the country I plan to go to to disapear from humanity, perhaps Alice Springs or any other old large rock in the desert may be safe. oh wait, that a tour spot now.<br><br>Surely, it's not just a continent.<br><br>I'm fair well that 1000Km from anywhere, i'd hava damn gun.<br>AND, a GPS, and internet.<br><br>Not that I'd need, but nice to have eh.<br>Nice south sky ya ave....<br><br><small>--<br><br><A HREF="http://www.darkgrid.com/tribute/">My 9/11 Tribute</a>..online since 9/14/01 <br>Need an Avatar? Check out <A HREF="http://www.darkgrid.com/wafen/">Wafen's Avatar Pages</a></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 07:14:03 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408964</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : Yep :huh:<br><br>They have just issued documents for ISPs to do the "filter" testing. The documentation is terrible. It's clear that there is a lack of technical writing expertise in the Department for "All Things Digital":(<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_for_business/funding_programs__and__support/isp_filtering_live_pilot" >www.dbcde.gov.au/communications_&middot;&middot;&middot;ve_pilot</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 04:49:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408941</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : Then maybe the only thing to usurp this idiotic law is to start a grass-roots coalition in the various provinces to strike down this POS legislation. You may want to start with the ISP's, as I'm sure they'd lend a hand, and a voice!<br><br>Bloody wankers! :mad:<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 04:28:59 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408934</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br> Surely there is something in your constitution that prohibits this?<br> </div>No. The Australian Constitution is a document negotiated between six separate British colonies (1901) and it is mostly devoted to trade between states with a few minor additions to do with the process of Government. <br><br>The only protection that might be possible is a High Court decision that clearly states all Australians must be able to access "political" information to enable them to be informed voters. This is usually taken as a protection of free speech. I suspect that it might need a test case before the High Court to decide if it restricted political information. We still have a titular monarch, the Queen. We aren't a republic :(<br><br>Briefly: Our High Court is the final Court of Appeal but its main function is to decide constitutional issues. It makes decisions about restriction of trade and whether legislation may be in breach of the Constitution or on matters of jurisdiction. It can take more than 5 years (and pots of money) for a case to work through to the High Court. <br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.aph.gov.au/SEnate/general/constitution/index.htm" >www.aph.gov.au/SEnate/general/co&middot;&middot;&middot;ndex.htm</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 04:21:30 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408871</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : Maybe it'll take a class-action lawsuit to change some minds ... *sigh* :(<br><br>I've signed petitions to aid this, but maybe a stronger dose is needed. Surely there is something in your constitution that prohibits this?<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 03:21:27 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408844</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Agreed. However, in my mind, the Oz gov is trying to take away these freedoms aka net neutrality by mandating a process deemed 'good and/ or evil'. We all know that, what is repressed is going to go underground, and therein lies the folly of government. Porn, and any (deviant) variation of it will always exist no matter what the restriction. There has to be a better way to do this.<br> </div>If you have any better ideas please post them. I have written soooooo many letters and emails........]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 03:01:19 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408154</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : Agreed. However, in my mind, the Oz gov is trying to take away these freedoms aka net neutrality by mandating a process deemed 'good and/ or evil'. We all know that, what is repressed is going to go underground, and therein lies the folly of government. Porn, and any (deviant) variation of it will always exist no matter what the restriction. There has to be a better way to do this.<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 22:59:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408092</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>This is one of the giant "quenching" effects of all government regulations and laws: they inherently contain a threat of legal harassment for avoidance, real or imagined. </div>Oh, you mean fascism!<br> </div>Actually, my sentence applies to all governments, of whatever form. That's how goverments work - they ask for citizen compliance, but absent that, compliance is achieved by the threat of force. Any governmental rule implies an ultimate recourse to sanction by that government for citizen non-compliance. Which is why <u>all</u> governmental rules in a free society need to be generated sparingly, with <i>very great</i> caution... and why there must be constant attention to the basic foundational citizen freedoms of that land every step of the way. When it comes to impinging on those basic freedoms, "free" governments must tread with extreme care, if at all. What is being proposed in Australia, from this distance, seems to me to abundantly lack such care.<br><br>When it comes to fascism, communism, national-socialism (Nazi), etc., those forms of government are universally less-than-concerned about their citizens' foundational freedoms at all.<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 22:44:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21408006</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>This is one of the giant "quenching" effects of all government regulations and laws: they inherently contain a threat of legal harassment for avoidance, real or imagined. </div>Oh, you mean fascism!<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 22:28:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21407984</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : Something to keep in mind for those down under: it's hard to imagine that, if this is actually implemented as 'mandatory', the enabling laws will not also include criminal sanctions for subverting, end-running, or otherwise getting past the filter. So even if somebody can find methods to avoid the filtering, they would run the risk of being discovered and prosecuted. Whether that avoidance was for nefarious purposes, or merely to keep up their connection speed and performance - or even to unblock legitimate communcations erroneously fouled-up by the filtering. <br><br>This is one of the giant "quenching" effects of all government regulations and laws: they inherently contain a threat of legal harassment for avoidance, real or imagined. As such, they all too often result in criminalizing the actions of ordinary people who simply are trying to preserve their innocent activities and thus become enemies of the state machinery.<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 22:23:31 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21406845</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><b>Doctor Four</b></A> : A little bit of humor is not out of place here.<br><br>Here's something for the Australian government to consider, courtesy of userfriendly.org:<br><br>(original cartoon is at &raquo;<A HREF="http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20081109" >ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20081109</A>)<br><small>--<br>"The trouble with computers, of course, is that they are very sophisticated idiots." - Doctor Who (from Robot)<br></small><div class="borderless"><TABLE WIDTH=95% align=center border=0 CELLPADDING=4"><TR><TD ALIGN=CENTER VALIGN=CENTER BGCOLOR=#FFFFFF nwrap COLSPAN=3 WIDTH=100%><A HREF="/speak/slideshow/21406845?c=1367913&ret=L2ZvcnVtL3IyMTM0MTc3NS54bWw%3D"><IMG class="apic" BORDER=0 TITLE="230053 bytes" WIDTH=600 HEIGHT=431 SRC="/r0/download/1367913.thumb600~2e8d32f5954587faf2333dff48910eeb/aussie_tidal_wave.jpg/thumb.jpg" ALT="Click for full size"></A></TD></TABLE></div>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:35:36 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21406340</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  winsyrstrife <A HREF="/useremail/u/624052"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Anorexia???  :hmm:</div>Anorexia.  :huh:]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 16:48:45 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21406242</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/624052"><b>winsyrstrife</b></A> : Anorexia???  :hmm:]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 16:33:16 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21406041</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <br><A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,24632210-15306,00.html">Canberra calls net filter trial</a><br><br><div class="bquote"><b>THE federal Government has released details of its long-awaited call for expressions of interest on live internet-service-provider content filtering trials.</b><br><br>The Government is asking all ISPs to participate, as their feedback is important. <br><br>Child protection group Child Wise welcomed the news, but a technical group has dubbed the venture a risky business for ISPs. <br><br>BigPond, the nation's largest internet service provider, is reviewing the call's terms and conditions before making a decision. <br><br>The Government, through the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA), has completed closed lab trials of ISP content filtering conducted by Enex TestLab. The live trial, however, is the first step towards evaluating whether ISP-level content filtering is feasible in Australia. <br><br>"The participation of industry is crucial to providing evidence on the real-world impacts for ISP content filtering, including on ISPs and their customers," the government document, released yesterday, says. <br><br>ISPs have until December 8 to submit their applications. <br><br>The intention of the live pilot - also managed by Enex TestLab - is to assess the impact of ISP content filtering on fixed and mobile internet access devices. <br><br>The live pilot is scheduled to begin before the end of the year, but ISPs will be able to start later, preferably before Christmas eve. <br><br>"Ideally, ISPs will participate in the pilot for a minimum of six weeks," the document says. <br><br>"ISPs that commence earlier will have the discretion to participate in the pilot until its conclusion." <br><br>The Government plans to have two streams of filtered content. <br><br>The mandatory portion will adhere to a blacklist of thousands of illegal web pages managed by ACMA and an optional clean feed of URLs that would automatically censor content, mostly adult material. <br><br>"The Government intends to take an evidence-based approach to content filtering at the ISP level and is committed to working closely with industry to address any concerns, including costs and impacts on internet speeds," the Communications Department said. <br><br>"These concerns will be carefully considered during a live pilot of ISP filtering, which will test a range of content filtering solutions in a real-world environment, with the co-operation of ISPs (including mobile telephone operators) and their customers. <br><br>"The outcomes of the pilot will inform the Government's decision-making on the ISP filtering framework." <br><br>A spokesman for Communications Minister Stephen Conroy said the Government had been working with ISPs to develop the call for expressions of interest. <br><br>Telstra, which runs the country's largest ISP, BigPond, has yet to decide whether to participate. <br><br>"We're in the midst of reviewing the EOI document," Telstra spokesman Martin Barr said. <br><br>Sage-Au, a not-for-profit professional organisation representing system administrators, said participating in the live trial at this stage was a big risk for ISPs. <br><br>"It is a very important risk they take, as it is the participants in this trial that are likely to be able to make the biggest difference in discussions after the end of the trial," Sage-Au president Donna Ashelford said. "On the other hand, if the live trial turns out to be a disaster, having their name associated with it - as promised in the EOI document - might be a dual-edged sword." <br><br>Ms Ashelford pointed to technical weaknesses with the EOI, one example being that the live pilot would limit users to a maximum of 12Mbps. <br><br>"Many users exceed 12Mbps right now. Some national broadband network proposals have involved technology that provides speeds up to 50Mbps. <br><br>"How future-proof is the national broadband network supposed to be when filtering systems are virtually guaranteed to bottleneck the resulting network," she said. <br><br>Ms Ashelford pointed to a part of the document on ACMA's role: "ACMA is responsible for maintaining the accuracy of the blacklist and the whole framework requires use of the ACMA blacklist as a mandatory requirement. <br><br>"But who watches the watchers, and what methods are imagined for addressing inevitable inaccuracies in the ACMA blacklist?" <br><br>Sage-Au has also proposed a three-pronged plan to keep the internet safe for families, as it supports any practical initiatives to protect children from viewing objectionable content on the web. <br><br>Ms Ashelford said a family friendly ISP program run by the internet industry association lacked awareness and could do with a big push. <br><br>She called on the Government to invest more in educating parents on cyber-safety. More funds should be allocated to organisations such as ACMA and the Australian Federal Police to identify and remove illegal content, usually hosted overseas, she said. <br><br>Meanwhile, Child Wise chief executive Bernadette McMenamin described the release of the document EOI as "an excellent development". <br><br>"It's a fair and inclusive process that ISPs can be part of," she said. "I wouldn't like to see anything but child sexual abuse sites blocked. <br><br>"I like the two-tier approach of a mandatory, and opt-in and opt-out mechanism." <br><br>However, any form of content filtering would have to accompanied by an extensive education campaign, she said.</div>Still mention of child porn as the main filter. The sleeze bags will bypass this filter no doubt, so why the belief this will stop it. As for what else gets filtered, doubt all the ads will, so what will become the blacklist, who can say. <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 15:57:37 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21392737</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  AB <A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>   :</small><br><br>It's probably still in line.  :(</div>Did you try "Joe the <A HREF="http://www.liquidplumr.com/">Liquid-Plumr</a>"?<br> </div>My bad, I've been reminded that the product is no longer available.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 16:41:00 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21392530</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  AB <A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>It's probably still in line.  :(</div>Did you try "Joe the <A HREF="http://www.liquidplumr.com/">Liquid-Plumr</a>"?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 16:04:31 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21392412</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><b>AB</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  AB <A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>I sent Douglas Holtz-Eakin an internet, but it never arrived.</div>Only one internet? Did you send it in the correct tube? </div>It's probably still in line.  :(]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 15:45:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21392405</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  AB <A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>I sent Douglas Holtz-Eakin an internet, but it never arrived.</div>Only one internet? Did you send it in the correct tube?<br><br>Perhaps it was re-routed through Australia...]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 15:43:56 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21392310</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><b>AB</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><i>Al Gore may have invented the internet, but <A HREF="http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/09/mccain-helped-t.html">it's Republican presidential candidate John McCain we have to thank for the "miracle" of the BlackBerry</a>.<br><br>Asked by campaign trail reporters what McCain's experience as chairman of the Senate Commerce Committee does to help him to understand the economy and lead the country through its current turmoil, Douglas Holtz-Eakin waved his BlackBerry in the air, <A HREF="http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/0908/HoltzEakin_McCain_helped_create_BlackBerry.html?showall">according to The Politico</a>.<br><br>"Telecommunications of the United States is a premier innovation in the past 15 years, comes right through the Commerce committe," Holtz-Eakin said.  "So you're looking at the miracle John McCain helped create and that's what he did."</i> </div>I sent Douglas Holtz-Eakin an internet, but it never arrived.<br><br>ht tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDVoWCZa8hM]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 15:21:52 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21390723</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Link Logger <A HREF="/useremail/u/356416"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>    :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>It's all so sad. This can hardly be what Al Gore envisioned when he invented the Internet.  :D</div>The Internet was just Gore's first act as later he went and invented the environment, is there no limit to Al's abilities, what possibly will he invent next?</div><i>Al Gore may have invented the internet, but <A HREF="http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/09/mccain-helped-t.html">it's Republican presidential candidate John McCain we have to thank for the "miracle" of the BlackBerry</a>.<br><br>Asked by campaign trail reporters what McCain's experience as chairman of the Senate Commerce Committee does to help him to understand the economy and lead the country through its current turmoil, Douglas Holtz-Eakin waved his BlackBerry in the air, <A HREF="http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/0908/HoltzEakin_McCain_helped_create_BlackBerry.html?showall">according to The Politico</a>.<br><br>"Telecommunications of the United States is a premier innovation in the past 15 years, comes right through the Commerce committe," Holtz-Eakin said.  "So you're looking at the miracle John McCain helped create and that's what he did."<br><br>The BlackBerry was developed by Research In Motion, a Canadian company.<br><br>The comment met with immediate derision across the internet.</i><br><br>-<br><br><i>The FWIW Dept.</i><br><br>From <A HREF="http://www.snopes.com/quotes/internet.asp">Snopes.com</a>    <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Claim:</b> Vice-President Al Gore claimed that he "invented" the Internet.<br><br><b>Status:</b> <b><i>False.</b></i><br><br><b>Origins:</b> Despite the derisive references that continue even today, Al Gore did not claim he "invented" the Internet, nor did he say anything that could reasonably be interpreted that way. The "Al Gore said he 'invented' the Internet" put-downs were misleading, out-of-context distortions of something he said during an <A HREF="http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/03/09/president.2000/transcript.gore/index.html">interview</a> with Wolf Blitzer on CNN's "Late Edition" program on 9 March 1999. When asked to describe what distinguished him from his challenger for the Democratic presidential nomination, Senator Bill Bradley of New Jersey, Gore replied (in part):<br><blockquote><small>During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet. I took the initiative in moving forward a whole range of initiatives that have proven to be important to our country's economic growth and environmental protection, improvements in our educational system.</small></blockquote><br>Clearly, although Gore's phrasing might have been a bit clumsy (and perhaps self-serving), he was not claiming that he "invented" the Internet (in the sense of having designed or implemented it), but that he was responsible, in an economic and legislative sense, for fostering the development the technology that we now know as the Internet. To claim that Gore was seriously trying to take credit for the "invention" of the Internet is, frankly, just silly political posturing that arose out of a close presidential campaign.<br><br>If President Eisenhower had said in the mid-1960s that he, while president, "created" the Interstate Highway System, we would not have seen dozens and dozens of editorials lampooning him for claiming he "invented" the concept of highways or implying that he personally went out and dug ditches across the country to help build the roadway. Everyone would have understood that Ike meant he was a driving force behind the legislation that created the highway system, and this was the very same concept Al Gore was expressing about himself with his Internet statement. <hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 09:52:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21390118</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/229001"><b>Pizz</b></A> : As another posted - Maybe when the 'aussie' way of life - finally gets shuttered. Common sense will prevail.<br><br>was this a worthy quote?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 06:14:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21390114</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/356416"><b>Link Logger</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>It's all so sad. This can hardly be what Al Gore envisioned when he invented the Internet.  :D</div>The Internet was just Gore's first act as later he went and invented the environment, is there no limit to Al's abilities, what possibly will he invent next?<br><br>Blake<br><small>--<br>Vendor: Author of <A HREF="http://www.linklogger.com">Link Logger</a> which is a traffic analysis and firewall logging tool</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 06:11:36 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21389951</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : It's all so sad. This can hardly be what Al Gore envisioned when he invented the Internet.  :D<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 03:16:50 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21387754</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><b>AB</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>For maximum efficiency I suggest that the Australian government block EVERYTHING, except for malware, ads, and government approved rubbish. ;) </div>I thought that was the idea already?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Nov 2008 17:24:08 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21387729</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>But it seems to be what this is about, and they will call it an "effecient" system.  :mad:<br> </div>For maximum efficiency I suggest that the Australian government block EVERYTHING, except for malware, ads, and government approved rubbish. ;)]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Nov 2008 17:20:02 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21387668</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : RFLMAO.  :D :D :D<br><br>You have me in stiches now.<br><br>But it seems to be what this is about, and they will call it an "effecient" system.  :mad:]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Nov 2008 17:09:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21387577</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>will it do it's job correctly and filter out all the rubbish? <br><br><b>Advertisements</b> too, which are known can be a source of malware?</div>The filtering isn't designed to eliminate 'rubbish', advertisements, nor malware. It's designed to prevent people from accessing websites and downloading material that the government decides it doesn't want the public to see.<br><br>Malware, ads, and government approved rubbish are just fine.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Nov 2008 16:55:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21387492</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <br>I have been having a chuckle to myself on this.<br><br>If we get content filtering at the ISP level will it do it's job correctly and filter out all the rubbish? <br><br><b>Advertisements</b> too, which are known can be a source of malware?<br><br>I can't help thinking of the implications there!!!<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 06 Nov 2008 16:40:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21382856</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><b>Khaine</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Perhaps what the Aussies should do is get people to cancel their Inet services, or drop to the lowest tier. It seems the only way biz and government listen is when you hit them in the pocket book.<br><br>If enough do it, ISP's will be screaming at the gov to change it. People do have a voice, sometimes you just have to yell a bit louder! ;)<br> </div>The ISPs are already screaming]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 05 Nov 2008 20:02:12 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21382228</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : Perhaps what the Aussies should do is get people to cancel their Inet services, or drop to the lowest tier. It seems the only way biz and government listen is when you hit them in the pocket book.<br><br>If enough do it, ISP's will be screaming at the gov to change it. People do have a voice, sometimes you just have to yell a bit louder! ;)<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 05 Nov 2008 18:12:56 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21381094</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : From <A HREF="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/11/05/aussie_internet/">The Register</a><br>5th November 2008 - <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>We spoke to <A HREF="http://www.censornet.com/">CensorNet</a>, a UK company that provides software that enables official bodies to filter out content in the UK, and which is speaking to a couple of Australian ISPs about this project. Its view is that the slow down feared by ISPs is unlikely.<br><br>However, the firm foresees two issues with any solution. Most filters tackle just the HTTP. But HTTP accounts for an average of 25 per cent of a user's bandwidth, with the rest taken up by other traffic, including email, peer-to-peer and instant messaging.<br><br>CensorNet uses the <A HREF="http://www.rulespace.com/">RuleSpace</a> technology, which automatically classifies web content before filtering.<br><br>A spokesperson for Stephen Conroy&#146;s office tells us that fears are misplaced and nothing has yet been finalised. Rather, they are "in the final stages of preparing an expressions of interest document for ISPs to take part in a field pilot".<br><br>They add that $128.5m has been set aside "for a comprehensive cyber-safety program that focuses on education, research, ISP filtering and law enforcement". The focus will be on material such as "child pornography, cruelty or real violence, and sexual violence" that is "already illegal".<br><br>Their plans are not unrealistic, because this sort of material "is currently being filtered by a number of ISPs in countries such as the UK, Sweden, Norway and Canada with no impact on network speeds or performance".<br><br>This is not strictly true: some minor filtering of web content goes on in these jurisdictions, but nothing on the scale envisaged by the Australian Government.<br><br>In the end, what happens in Australia will affect us all. If their filtering scheme falls flat on its face, expect to hear little more of it. If it is implemented and works in however half-arsed a fashion, look forward to proposals to filter the UK internet in a couple of years time.<hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 05 Nov 2008 14:31:48 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21370006</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : <div class="bquote">I fear what will be the real outcome of this.</div>Short term, there is a risk of censorship.  Long term, your politicians will be dragged, kicking and screaming, into the 21st century, when they are forced to realize that censorship does not make any sense.<br><br>In the meantime, keep up the protests.<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.3</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 16:57:53 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21369896</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote">Just curious if it will affect https?</div>This would depend on how it is implemented.<br><br>Blocking IP addresses affects everything.  Content inspection won't touch https unless in involves some sort of "man in the middle" attack, and MITM would likely cause browser warnings. </div>And that is where the concern lies,<br> <br>1. what will they block, <br>2. what affects will it have on usage,<br>3. content we are allowed to see,<br>4. what costs will become the users bill on a market already considered more expensive than other countries,<br>5. what will be blocked in the future,<br>6. is it hard ware or software(hardware will basically see everything I'm guessing),<br>7. Will they then try to hit peer to peer once it settles,<br>8. How will they get past proxies, VPN etc,<br>9. what of IM scripting bots, or IM issues full stop with users that are not of a savoury character.<br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I guess it could also be done with https if there were some cooperation between the banks and the ISPs to make the information available for inspection.  I'm doubtful that banks would agree to that.  <br></div>I doubt it too, but there is no information out there I can see presently involving this. <br><br>The real concern is why it is so secretive, why aren't we involved in this on a public level to at least try to create a usable filter? <br><br>We all know too well how public servants can be tied by red tape, so how will this become an effective tool, without years of bad times. <br>Just look at Child Support in Australia, it took 15 years for it to be turned around so both father and mother have an almost fair deal.(It still isn't fully sorted). This was forced, no questions asked when it was implemented, some dads committed suicide, taking the kids with them. I realise this is not releated to the internet/content filtering, I just can't see the future being too bright for us users who pay for the internet as a tool/hobby/learning/business infrastructure and we know this will not be implemented correctly either. <br><br>I fear what will be the real outcome of this.<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 16:38:58 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21367517</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : <div class="bquote">Just curious if it will affect https?</div>This would depend on how it is implemented.<br><br>Blocking IP addresses affects everything.  Content inspection won't touch https unless in involves some sort of "man in the middle" attack, and MITM would likely cause browser warnings.<br><br>I guess it could also be done with https if there were some cooperation between the banks and the ISPs to make the information available for inspection.  I'm doubtful that banks would agree to that.  And porn sites using https would be unlikely to agree either.<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.3</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 08:11:06 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21367272</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Just curious if it will affect https? This mention of it at News.com.au has me curious, one of the replies says it doesn't, just how much will affect daily use?<br><br><A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,24575125-5013040,00.html">Filter to cause World Wide Wait</a><br><br><div class="bquote">INTERNET speeds could slow by 30 per cent under the Government's proposed web filtering scheme, even though it will do little to block illegal content.<br><br>That's the warning from technical experts, who also say the plan could expose users' financial details during online banking sessions and see popular websites including Facebook and YouTube banned. <br><br>The warnings came after Broadband, Communications and Digital Economy Minister Stephen Conroy confirmed the Federal Government planned to introduce a mandatory internet filter, shelving plans to allow Australians to opt out of the scheme. <br><br>Internet service providers, who would administer the filter, have been asked to conduct live trials of the filter before the end of the year. <br><br>But System Administrators Guild of Australia president Donna Ashelford said the plan was deeply flawed and would slow internet access down by about 30 per cent according to the Government's own laboratory trials. <br><br>Despite this, the national web filter would only censor web content, Ms Ashelford said, and could not deal with the remaining 60 per cent of internet traffic, much of which occurred over peer-to-peer networks such as BitTorrent and LimeWire. <br><br>"The bulk of internet traffic is over peer-to-peer networks and the bulk of illegal content is trafficked is over peer-to-peer networks," she said. "There is no choke point at which they can block that material. I do not believe this is an issue that has a technical solution." <br><br>Electronic Frontiers Australia board member Colin Jacobs warned the web filter could also unwittingly make the internet unsafe for financial transactions by breaking the secure encryption used by banks online. <br><br>Five of the six web filters tested by the Australian Media and Communications Authority this year were able to filter websites using the secure protocol HTTPS, which would leave financial details exposed to the internet service provider in charge of operating the filter. <br><br>"If they sit in the middle and get between your web browser and the bank's server it really breaks open the security and leaves the details open to attack," he said. <br><br>"Once the chain of encryption is broken you can't say it is secure any more." <br><br>Mr Jacobs said the web filter plan would also face significant challenges trying to block illegal or inappropriate material on social networking sites such as YouTube and Facebook where "one video or one dodgy Facebook profile" could see the entire website blocked from view. <br><br>The national filter would also fail to block material in online chat rooms, Mr Jacobs said, and could give parents "a false sense of security" when monitoring their child's online access.<br><br>The Courier-Mail</div><br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 05:36:32 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21366945</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><b>Khaine</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Its a Secret <A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Khaine <A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br> Most probably think that the government would never be stupid enough to implement.</div>Never, ever underestimate the stupidity of the government.<br> </div>Oh, I agree.  The Rudd government has already shown its incompetence with its handling of bank deposits.  However I do believe the above does indicate the feeling for the majority of people within the 80%]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 00:47:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21366929</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Link Logger <A HREF="/useremail/u/356416"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>There's a lot of resistance. Quite a lot of coverage in the mainstream media as well as forums and the blogosphere. Newspaper and radio on line polls are showing almost consistently that more than 80% of consumers do not want secret censorship introduced.</div>I wonder how many of the 80% have taken the time to call/write/email their local elected government official and convey their opinion and perhaps how this will be a MAJOR factor next election as its funny how much influence that can have.<br><br>I'm not sure how the 'state' can be such a evil thing when the citizens of the state elect it (and if you don't like your choices then run for office and be that choice).  Perhaps with percentages of voting public on the decrease, they get the state they didn't bother to vote for and then ultimately perhaps deserve?<br><br>Blake<br> </div>Not everyone will protest formally in writing. The process looks very daunting to younger people without experience in correspondence. If nothing else a number of people will have learned through this experience that the ability to contact your local representatives and government Ministers isn't as difficult as they thought.<br><br>There are many letter templates that have been made available on several websites. <br><br>One of the major issues is that the policy has changed and is no longer the policy that was published prior to the election. In the lead up to the election, any proposed "filtering" was to be fully reviewed and it was to be an opt-out filter. The issue of choosing to vote for such a policy is a not relevant where the policy has changed after the election. <br><br>The current proposal mandates that adults have no access to "illegal" material. Illegal material, as currently defined, is anything over 15+MA (Mature audience only, 15 years and older). That is absolutely ridiculous. With a further layer of censorship on top of that where opt-out it is possible to make the internet "suitable" for 5 years old and up.<br><br>EFA has put a lot of effort into reviewing the proposals and commenting. They have letter templates available for download.<br><br>There is no definition of "illegal". The blacklist restricts some terror-related newsgroups and is already exempt from Freedom of Information legislation under the previous government's legislation as it was brought into law under the anti-terrorist legislation. The blacklist could include anything a public servant is instructed to included with no appeal and no right of review even if a site is incorrectly blocked. They seem to forget the Scunthorpe problem and the Peacefire problems.<br><br>It would take years and a great deal of money to get a case to the High Court where a complainant would probably win but it will be too late.<br><br>More information is available from &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.efa.org.au/FOI/foi_aba_2000.htm" >www.efa.org.au/FOI/foi_aba_2000.htm</A><br>Edit:spelling]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 00:42:00 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21366903</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Khaine <A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br> Most probably think that the government would never be stupid enough to implement.</div>Never, ever underestimate the stupidity of the government.<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 00:33:42 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21366885</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><b>Khaine</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Link Logger <A HREF="/useremail/u/356416"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>There's a lot of resistance. Quite a lot of coverage in the mainstream media as well as forums and the blogosphere. Newspaper and radio on line polls are showing almost consistently that more than 80% of consumers do not want secret censorship introduced.</div>I wonder how many of the 80% have taken the time to call/write/email their local elected government official and convey their opinion and perhaps how this will be a MAJOR factor next election as its funny how much influence that can have.<br><br>I'm not sure how the 'state' can be such a evil thing when the citizens of the state elect it (and if you don't like your choices then run for office and be that choice).  Perhaps with percentages of voting public on the decrease, they get the state they didn't bother to vote for and then ultimately perhaps deserve?<br><br>Blake<br> </div>At the moment, I believe very few of those 80% have wrote to their Member of Parliament.  Most probably think that the government would never be stupid enough to implement, and the rest think it will be blocked in the Senate.<br><br>I do know that a lot of technical people (mainly from whirlpool) have been writing letters and trying to raise awareness]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 00:25:35 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Possible Workarounds</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21366863</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : From <A HREF="http://www.itwire.com/content/view/21451/1085/">ITWire</a><br>03 November 2008 -  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Bypass Australia's internet filters for free</b><br><br>According to the government's own research, the filtering will degrade network performance by between 20 and 75 per cent - which makes a joke of plans for a faster national network. Civil libertarians also argue that censorship is a slippery slope, a concern heightened by the fact that those supporting the filtering are already talking about expanding it to include other stuff they don't like...<br><br>The proposed filtering [will] give a handful of right wing nutjobs the power to control what we can see online. The fact the government wants to keep the list of banned sites a secret, and has tried to censor people speaking out against the filtering plans, should be ringing alarm bells.<br><br>Any school kid will tell you that bypassing internet filtering is ridiculously easy. One simple trick is to use a free web proxy...[do a Google search]<br><br>Another trick for bypassing filters is to dig an encrypted tunnel to the United States. It sounds complicated, but it's free and ridiculously easy to do and neither the government nor your ISP can see what you're up to.<br><br>Two popular free VPN applications are <A HREF="http://www.anchorfree.com/downloads/hotspot-shield">HotSpot Shield</a> (Mac and Windows) and <A HREF="http://www.alwaysvpn.com/">AlwaysVPN</a> (Mac, Windows, Linux). They add an advertising banner to your browser, which is a small price to pay.<br><br>If you're prepared to spend $5 per month for a faster connection you could look at <A HREF="http://www.witopia.net/">Witopia</a> and <A HREF="http://www.vpnout.com/">VPNOut</a>. You don't need to know anything about networking and there's no messy configuration, you run the installers and they just work.<br><br>These applications give you dual citizenship as, with the click of a button, your computer looks like its in the United States. Your digital Green Card means you can access US-only content from sites such as Rhapsody, Pandora, YouTube and Hulu. It also means you're bypassing any content filtering performed by your Australian ISP, and there's nothing they can do about it.<br><br>Australia's plans for mandatory content filtering will screw up the internet and give right wing nutjobs the power censor what we see, yet it won't actually stop people who want to access banned sites.<br><br>If Australia goes through with plans to censor the internet, you can be sure civil libertarians will do everything they can to make bypass software freely available to everyone - as they've done in other totalitarian regimes.<br><br>If you're concerned about the Australian government's plans for filtering the internet, it's time to speak up before it's too late. Visit <A HREF="http://nocleanfeed.com/action.html">NoCleanFeed.com</a>, run by Electronic Frontiers Australia, for information on how to voice your concerns. Do it quickly, before some holier-than-thou git decides you're not allowed to see that site either.<hr></blockquote><br> -<br><br>From <A HREF="http://www.crn.com.au/News/87985,support-fades-for-australian-net-censorship.aspx">CRN Australia</a><br>3 November 2008 - <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Support fades for Australian net censorship<br><br>The Australian government&#146;s plans to censor all web content at the borders of the country looks in danger of coming unstuck.</b><br><br>"I think it's really quite misguided," Senator Ludlam of the Greens told the Sydney Morning Herald.<br><br>Calling the plan &#147;daft&#148; the green party has indicated it will stop the proposals going ahead by withdrawing support for the measure.<br><br>Internet service providers are also up in arms about the proposals, which they say will slow down Australia&#146;s already slow internet speeds to a crawl.<br><br>Businesses too are protesting that the move will hamper their efforts to build an effective online marketplace for Australia&#146;s goods.<hr></blockquote><div class="borderless"><TABLE WIDTH=95% align=center border=0 CELLPADDING=4"><TR><TD ALIGN=CENTER VALIGN=CENTER BGCOLOR=#FFFFFF nwrap WIDTH=33%><A HREF="/speak/slideshow/21366863?c=1365588&ret=L2ZvcnVtL3IyMTM0MTc3NS54bWw%3D"><IMG TITLE="8487 bytes" BORDER=0 WIDTH=168 HEIGHT=168 SRC="/r0/download/1365588~aec33ee6e2970f7e584b5f4605c998e9/ImageResizer.ashx.jpeg"></A></TD></TABLE></div>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 00:15:17 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21366860</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/356416"><b>Link Logger</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>There's a lot of resistance. Quite a lot of coverage in the mainstream media as well as forums and the blogosphere. Newspaper and radio on line polls are showing almost consistently that more than 80% of consumers do not want secret censorship introduced.</div>I wonder how many of the 80% have taken the time to call/write/email their local elected government official and convey their opinion and perhaps how this will be a MAJOR factor next election as its funny how much influence that can have.<br><br>I'm not sure how the 'state' can be such a evil thing when the citizens of the state elect it (and if you don't like your choices then run for office and be that choice).  Perhaps with percentages of voting public on the decrease, they get the state they didn't bother to vote for and then ultimately perhaps deserve?<br><br>Blake<br><small>--<br>Vendor: Author of <A HREF="http://www.linklogger.com">Link Logger</a> which is a traffic analysis and firewall logging tool</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 00:14:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21366715</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><b>Khaine</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by Unknown_Poster :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Khaine <A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>We don't need a bill of rights.  We have an implied right to freedom of speech, and freedom of association and these have been upheld by the high court<br> </div>I don't know if you need a Bill of Rights or not-- but you may need something beyond what's already in place, as it seems your current government is implying that they know best which websites you should be allowed to visit.<br><br>What's been the High Court's reaction to that, so far?<br> </div>The high court only rules on legal matters before them, not being a legal expert I don't know what they make of it.  I can only hope they would strike it down as unconstitutional based upon our implied rights]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 02 Nov 2008 23:21:10 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21365697</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><b>Doctor Four</b></A> : Let's see if it stands up to <A HREF="http://psiphon.civisec.org/">Psiphon</a>. My guess is it won't.<br><br>I see a lot of Aussies using this if the mandatory filtering is ever implemented.<br><small>--<br>"The trouble with computers, of course, is that they are very sophisticated idiots." - Doctor Who (from Robot)<br></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 02 Nov 2008 19:00:26 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362690</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Khaine <A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>We don't need a bill of rights.  We have an implied right to freedom of speech, and freedom of association and these have been upheld by the high court<br> </div>I don't know if you need a Bill of Rights or not-- but you may need something beyond what's already in place, as it seems your current government is implying that they know best which websites you should be allowed to visit.<br><br>What's been the High Court's reaction to that, so far?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 02 Nov 2008 01:55:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362650</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/779741"><b>Khaine</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br><div class="bquote">I would never have believed this possible to be occurring in Australia. It's shocking.</div>Your mistake.<br><br>There is a history of censorship down under.  See <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Australia">this Wikipedia article</a> for some of the details.  They don't have anything comparable to the USA Bill of Rights.</div>Very revealing. Thank you. I'd imagined Australia to be a generally 'liberal' country. From your linked article here's another pertaining to this thread, "<A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_Australia">Internet Censorship in Australia</a>".<br> </div>We don't need a bill of rights.  We have an implied right to freedom of speech, and freedom of association and these have been upheld by the high court]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 02 Nov 2008 01:36:29 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362529</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : Government, in principle, is the one organization in an orderly society possessing the legal "power of the gun" over members of that society. In a totalitarian regime, that power is imposed upon society in areas based solely on government whim; in a free nation, that power is granted by the people to government under selective and defined conditions. If those conditions aren't under ironclad judicial enforcement or upheld by the people at election time, those holding power (elected or appointed) will endlessly expand their powers over the people. There are many reasons for this: power lust, demands of factions within the electorate, arrogance of officeholders, corruption, deeming extra powers necessary to accomplish official tasks (especially during crises), and so on.<br><br>Practical freedom in any land most of the time has far more to do with the people's freedom against the powers their own government may exercise against them, than against the potential exercises of power against the people by foreign entities.<br><br>The unavoidable reality of human nature is that power asserted by government over its own people always tends to an increase. It remains the continual job of the electorate to hold their officials accountable for each expansion of governmental power. That requires each faction of an electorate constantly to exercise restraint and wisdom in not demanding government expansion of power for that faction's advantage at the expense of others in the electorate. Governmental power, once expanded, will almost never be reduced... it will only be redirected and retargeted in new and unexpected directions as governments and factional pressures change in future days. It is also required of an electorate to <i>always</i> be willing to turn out of office as immediately as possible, any leaders and their appointed who would expand power beyond that permitted by national constitution or the expressed will of the people assembled... and to continually remind elected officials of that. If the people are not willing to do these things on principle and constrain their government's powers, then the people do not deserve the freedoms involved.<br><br>Australia, it would seem, does not have an explicit constitutional guarantee of free speech, but its people do exercise that freedom, and its voters have the right to elect leaders who support maintaining a tradition of free speech. The United States has a Bill of Rights guaranteeing free speech, but its voters have the right to elect leaders who all but ignore that concept to the detriment of all. The point is, in both nations we get exactly what we elect, campaign promises notwithstanding. The only remedy to loss of freedom, for both nations, is to make sure the officials we elect actually do support all foundational concepts of freedom for the citizenry and that they would avoid expansion of governmental power over the people. And if those leaders fail in that, the electorate must be relentless in removing them from power at the first opportunity.<br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 02 Nov 2008 00:40:48 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362389</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1393092"><b>Sindows 7</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I would never have believed this possible to be occurring in Australia. It's shocking.<br> </div>I'm not surprised at all......remember this?<br><br> <IMG SRC="http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2006/04/27/weapons_2804_narrowweb__300x455,0.jpg"> <br><br>Guess computers will be next.<br><br> <IMG SRC="http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/Electronics%20Recycling%202.jpg"> ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 23:55:35 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362299</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  nwrickert <A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote">I would never have believed this possible to be occurring in Australia. It's shocking.</div>Your mistake.<br><br>There is a history of censorship down under.  See <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Australia">this Wikipedia article</a> for some of the details.  They don't have anything comparable to the USA Bill of Rights.</div>Very revealing. Thank you. I'd imagined Australia to be a generally 'liberal' country. From your linked article here's another pertaining to this thread, "<A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_Australia">Internet Censorship in Australia</a>".]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 23:30:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362200</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1070900"><b>nwrickert</b></A> : <div class="bquote">I would never have believed this possible to be occurring in Australia. It's shocking.</div>Your mistake.<br><br>There is a history of censorship down under.  See <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Australia">this Wikipedia article</a> for some of the details.  They don't have anything comparable to the USA Bill of Rights.<br><small>--<br>AT&T dsl; Westell 327w modem/router; openSuSE 11.0; firefox 3.0.3</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 23:00:36 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362173</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : I would never have believed this possible to be occurring in Australia. It's shocking.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:52:22 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362164</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Right. User desired and user chosen filtering is not the issue in Australia. Government selected and mandated filtering is.<br> </div>Yes, I'm afraid. That is the basic crux of the issue.<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:48:50 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362110</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>I really can't see a problem with content filtering</div>Great, because in 2 weeks your government will prevent you from visiting this site anymore. You have no choice and no warning. Your government is censoring this site for your own protection (too many potential hackers here, they believe). Aren't you glad that your government is looking out for your best interests?<br></div>You did not understand. I am more than happy to apply something at home, if it is by choice, I use a Hosts' file and other methods of blocking some of the more notorious sites. No where did I say forced content-filtering above my doorway was good. I'd buy a firewall/content-filtering package tomorrow if they came down in price but who can justify that in a budget, when the ISP supply a modem for free if you sign-up.<br><br>Don't mix words. :)<br> </div>You're correct. I did not read you correctly. My bad. Sorry.<br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I doubt anyone would disagree on using a router/firewall with content filtering for use to filter in the home, if a family deemed it needed.</div>Right. User desired and user chosen filtering is not the issue in Australia. Government selected and mandated filtering is.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:34:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362089</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>I really can't see a problem with content filtering</div>Great, because in 2 weeks your government will prevent you from visiting this site anymore. You have no choice and no warning. Your government is censoring this site for your own protection (too many potential hackers here, they believe). Aren't you glad that your government is looking out for your best interests?<br></div>You did not understand. I am more than happy to apply something at home, if it is by choice, I use a Hosts' file and other methods of blocking some of the more notorious sites. No where did I say forced content-filtering above my doorway was good. I'd buy a firewall/content-filtering package tomorrow if they came down in price but who can justify that in a budget, when the ISP supply a modem for free if you sign-up.<br><br>Don't mix words. :)<br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:28:58 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362080</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>there is a chance of a domino effect if a western liberal democracy like Australia can be demonstrated to have a "working" version of this even on a small scale.<br><br>This <b>is a threat</b> to freedom of speech and privacy that could expand beyond Australia :( </div>Oh, yeah. 'Democracy' residing authoritarians, repressives, hard-core capitalists, fascists, totalitarians, extremists everywhere are watching this very carefully and spinning their own little plots.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:27:51 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362059</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>I really can't see a problem with content filtering</div>Great, because in 2 weeks your government will prevent you from visiting this site anymore. You have no choice and no warning. Your government is censoring this site for your own protection (too many potential hackers here, they believe). Aren't you glad that your government is looking out for your best interests?<br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  norwegian <A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Hey one of my little ones downloaded a phone ring tone and wasn't aware of the $5/day/week for usage, now where is the governments stance there?<br><br>Another, my last born, before she was 3 months old, a letter arrived allowing her $5000 on a credit card. What is the governemnt stance on that?</div>In a <i>non-authoritarian</i> state the government would say that you, as the parent, are responsible for the well-being of your own child. And the government would pass and enforce laws to protect all citizens from scams and illegal activities.<br><br>But since your government is an authoritarian state, it easier and more cost effective for them to remove your children from your home and into state custody. End of your problems. Gosh, those authoritarian government people are so helpful.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:20:37 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362052</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : Hepa filters - I usually only see them in hospital and industrial process ventilation systems :)<br><br>There is an interesting read here. I don't always agree with them, but there is a chance of a domino effect if a western liberal democracy like Australia can be demonstrated to have a "working" version of this even on a small scale.<br><br>This <b>is a threat</b> to freedom of speech and privacy that could expand beyond Australia :(<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Australia will join China in implementing mandatory censoring of the internet under plans put forward by the Federal Government.<br><br>The revelations emerge as US tech giants Google, Microsoft and Yahoo, and a coalition of human rights and other groups unveiled a code of conduct aimed at safeguarding online freedom of speech and privacy.<br><br>The government has declared it will not let internet users opt out of the proposed national internet filter.<br><br>The plan was first created as a way to combat child pornography and adult content, but could be extended to include controversial websites on euthanasia or anorexia.<hr></blockquote><br><br>From here - &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=10779" >www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?&middot;&middot;&middot;id=10779</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:18:35 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362044</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <br>Which is why saying $10 mill will cover it is a load of .......!!<br><br>At least the previous govt's option to <A HREF="http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,22218715-15306,00.html">supply filters</a> to the home, and a package of $189 mill was plausible. Nothing in this topic has any back-bone or credit to be a viable option without making the connection an expensive past-time for the elite.  <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:16:59 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21362014</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  AB <A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Here's their A-#1 reason for opposing it:<br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Hackett says that from a technical standpoint, introducing filtering is expensive . . .<hr></blockquote></div>Well, the total cost of purchasing filters has to do with the number of, and diameter of, all those tubes.<br>And also if they're regular or hepa filters, you betchya. ;)]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:08:00 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21361984</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : Quite an informative read Doc. <br><br>I really can't see a problem with content filtering, and as was pointed out in your link, using the ISP is not the answer. The tech support calls would at least triple if that was the method.<br><br>I doubt anyone would disagree on using a router/firewall with content filtering for use to filter in the home, if a family deemed it needed, but present pricing for these are a tad high, maybe the government could help finance, rebate or such to offload the expense of keeping a firewall/content filtering package, including updates. Even a tax offset, there are plenty of ways to tackle this without using a brute force approach.<br><br>Hey one of my little ones downloaded a phone ring tone and wasn't aware of the $5/day/week for usage, now where is the goverments stance there? <br><br>Another, my last born, before she was 3 months old, a letter arrived allowing her $5000 on a credit card. What is the governemnt stance on that?<br><br>Let's realistically look at issues out there and fix them, just don't have this "head stuck in the sand attitude" because of political balance issues that seems to be everywhere. Some one grows some balls please, before we loose sight of reality.<br><br> <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 22:00:09 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21361978</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><b>AB</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Doctor Four <A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The leaders of Australia's three largest ISPs, Telstra, iiNet and Internode, say that ISP based filtering will not work,<br>and they detailed technical, legal and ethical reasons why:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.zdnet.com.au/insight/communications/soa/ISP-level-content-filtering-won-t-work/0,139023754,339292158,00.htm" >www.zdnet.com.au/insight/communi&middot;&middot;&middot;8,00.htm</A><br> </div>Here's their A-#1 reason for opposing it:<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>Hackett says that from a technical standpoint, introducing filtering is expensive . . .<hr></blockquote><br><br>'Freedom Fighters' they're not.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 21:57:49 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21361936</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Doctor Four <A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>The leaders of Australia's three largest ISPs, Telstra, iiNet and Internode, say that ISP based filtering will not work, &raquo;<A HREF="http://www.zdnet.com.au/insight/communications/soa/ISP-level-content-filtering-won-t-work/0,139023754,339292158,00.htm" >www.zdnet.com.au/insight/communi&middot;&middot;&middot;8,00.htm</A></div>Interesting, thanks for the link.<br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  Doctor Four <A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>  :</small><br><br>and they detailed technical, legal and ethical reasons why</div>Quite reasonable and rational. But since when do these factors influence insanity?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 21:45:50 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21361882</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/197199"><b>Doctor Four</b></A> : The leaders of Australia's three largest ISPs, Telstra, iiNet and Internode, say that ISP based filtering will not work,<br>and they detailed technical, legal and ethical reasons why:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.zdnet.com.au/insight/communications/soa/ISP-level-content-filtering-won-t-work/0,139023754,339292158,00.htm" >www.zdnet.com.au/insight/communi&middot;&middot;&middot;8,00.htm</A><br><small>--<br>"The trouble with computers, of course, is that they are very sophisticated idiots." - Doctor Who (from Robot)<br></small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 21:33:49 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21359197</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/723836"><b>33591094</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  BB1984 <A HREF="/useremail/u/1362364"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Almost 250 pages of discussion about this topic over at Whirlpool Forums (AUSTRALIA) - we're mighty pissed-off about this!  :mad:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=967413" >forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re&middot;&middot;&middot;t=967413</A><br> </div>Here's hoping you get something organized to put a stop to this. Don't be sheep and 'take it' - the rest of us are counting on you (why did I just have a Leslie Nielson flashback....)<br><small>--<br>All trolls are equal, but A troll is more equal than others.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 09:13:01 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21359083</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1362364"><b>BB1984</b></A> : Almost 250 pages of discussion about this topic over at Whirlpool Forums (AUSTRALIA) - we're mighty pissed-off about this!  :mad:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=967413" >forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re&middot;&middot;&middot;t=967413</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 08:07:17 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21358479</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : People seem to have such a hard time "getting it". When the government is permitted to be the censor of anything at the behest and encouragement of group "A", it will only be a matter of time until someone of a different political/cultural persuasion takes office and uses those same censorship powers to repress group "A". <br><br>This is why it is absolutely vital for those of both the left and the right to come together at least on this issue, in the realization that when any foundational right or freedom is diminished for one group of citizens, it diminishes that right or freedom for all of us - and we will all mourn that loss sooner or later. If I'm allowed by the present governmental powers to pick your pocket to take your property, then some day another set of rulers will allow you to pick my pocket and take my property. Even more important is the right of free speech, which is perhaps the most critical freedom in any society bearing the label "free", because it is so absolutely important to the free-flowing communication of ideas, information, petitions, and complaints that keep the society free. If government puts constraints on free speech for any reason, ultimately those constraints and their reasons will change as times, governments, and crises change. And the reasons used to block free speech will multiply and distort themselves over time until nobody has free speech about anything... whereupon government will dominate us unchecked - which is despotism.<br><br>The appropriate methods of protecting oneself and one's family from disturbing exercises of free speech are to block it out at the threshholds of our spheres of legitimate personal control - our households, our families, and so on. It can not, should not, <i>must</i> not be made the responsibility of government to emplace limitations on the free exercise of speech. Those limits will ultimately be used against the citizenry in ways none of us on the right or left can imagine or accept... but then it may be too late. The testimony of history is unrelenting about this danger.<br><br>The political leaders in any free land where this kind of control is proposed for any reason should be powerfully cautioned at once by their citizens to not proceed, should be contested in court if they do proceed, and (if they do proceed) should be voted out of office at the very earliest opportunity - with no exceptions - to be replaced by leaders who do understand freedom and who will reverse the errors of their predecessors. Leaders of the left or right must be unmistakably made to understand that such tampering with basic rights for any reason will simply not be tolerated by the citizenry. If we will not do that to protect our freedom, we do not deserve that freedom - and we will lose it.<br><br><i>edit: typo & addition</i><br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 31 Oct 2008 23:52:20 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21357067</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/219811"><b>Hutch</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Protection is the responsibility of the household, not the whole population. The government have subsidized versions of various "Nanny" filter type products available for free from their website. Very few have been installed. Whether that is because very few people are interested I don't know. The are reports that it's difficult to configure and hard to remove. That is simply a technical issue. They could just as easily subsidize an hour for a computer tech to configure the software for the user. That would be by the user choice.<br><br>Most of the current parent population grew up since computers were introduced. Personal computers were unknown when I was in High School and university. I'm in the grandmotherly age group :( I've been on line since way before the World Wide Web right back to 300baud modems. I have never accidentally come across porn of any kind. I have a husband that would be counted as a risky user and will click on anything that looks "interesting" :) Children using my computers have restricted access and limited permissions on their user profiles. I'm a responsible guardian and I don't need the government to do it for me.<br> </div>I agree with you  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>. PC's and Internet awareness begins in the Family Home. Like you, I have my kids PC's locked down and Logging everything the Kids do. They don't get Internet Time if no Adults are home. (I have Teenagers)<br>Can't add much more because you have said it all for me. :)<br><small>--<br>If I knew then, what I know now. I would have still made the same mistakes.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 31 Oct 2008 18:11:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21356824</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/430868"><b>Ender3rd</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  EGeezer <A HREF="/useremail/u/668609"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>On a related subject, Ted Stevens (R-AK) knows what's best for us. He demonstrated his amazing grasp of technology most articulately in his famous <A HREF=""></a> speech. <br> </div>Hehe, <br><br>"I got an internet sent by my staff just yeseterday."<br><br>"The internet is not a big truck it's a series of tubes. When you put your message in and it gets in line, it's gonna be delayed."<br><br>That's just priceless...<br><small>--<br>My Jeep is not an SUV.  Your SUV is not a Jeep.</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 31 Oct 2008 17:16:07 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21353434</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225117"><b>ZzyzxFromOR</b></A> : There is only one way to stop this. Either we vote our representatives (who would implement filtering of the internet for ANY reason) out of office or, overthrow the government in power. Take your pick.<br><br>Part of "The Declaration of Independence of the Thirteen Colonies"<br><br>We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, <b>--That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.</b> Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, <b>it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government,</b> and to provide new Guards for their future security.<br><br>Ah pardon me, there's someone knocking on the front door.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Fri, 31 Oct 2008 00:57:28 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21353078</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><b>AB</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br><A HREF="http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20081030.wgtweb31/BNStory/Technology/home">The Globe And Mail</a><br>October 30, 2008<br>by Ivor Tossell -     <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The Great Firewall of Australia, as folks are calling it, is being built for the most laudable of reasons, including stopping child pornography. But good intentions are a well-documented paving material. Now other Australian legislators are proposing that the system be expanded to block off even legal adult materials (at least for certain subscribers) or online casinos, which are illegal there. <hr></blockquote> </div>Natch.<br>They always start off by telling us how they're going to put the kibosh on child pornography, then that quickly fades into the background as the various agenda-pushers start worming their way onboard-- in this case before any legislation is even actually passed.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 23:12:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21352989</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  EGeezer <A HREF="/useremail/u/668609"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>     :</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  a4nic8er <A HREF="/useremail/u/338826"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br>The "Lefties" never cease to amaze me with their "We know what's best for you" agendas.</div>In the United States, it seems to be the "righties" that are advocating censoring... The "lefties", in the form of the ACLU and EFF, are the ones that are opposing internet control.</div><A HREF="http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20081030.wgtweb31/BNStory/Technology/home">The Globe And Mail</a><br>October 30, 2008<br>by Ivor Tossell -     <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>Censorship is the province of <i>authoritarian</i> states</b> such as China, Cuba, Myanmar and &#133; Australia? This week, we learned that the land down under has been working up plans to censor the Web centrally, and force Internet service providers to make sure that certain content never reaches their subscribers.<br><br>The Great Firewall of Australia, as folks are calling it, is being built for the most laudable of reasons, including stopping child pornography. But good intentions are a well-documented paving material. Now other Australian legislators are proposing that the system be expanded to block off even legal adult materials (at least for certain subscribers) or online casinos, which are illegal there.<br><br>Censoring the Internet by filtering the tubes that connect it together is tempting, whether you're trying to protect children, prevent terrorism or crack down on movie piracy. But while people must be held accountable for their words, they first need to be able to speak without restraint. That's the point of free speech. Filtering at this level prevents free expression in the first place, and if you think it can't happen in a Western democracy, then I've got a large rock in the Outback to sell you.<hr></blockquote><br><small>[emphasis added]</small><br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  EGeezer <A HREF="/useremail/u/668609"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A>     :</small><br><br>On a related subject, Ted Stevens (R-AK) knows what's best for us. He demonstrated his amazing grasp of technology most articulately in his famous "series of tubes" speech.</div><center>You mean this guy?<br><br><IMG SRC="http://blog.wired.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/10/27/seriesoftubes.jpg"></center><br>Oh yeah. I remember him now! This past Monday a jury in Washington, D.C. found Stevens guilty of seven felony counts for violating federal ethics laws, each with a maximum penalty of five years in prison. Right, that guy.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 22:54:41 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21352763</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/668609"><b>EGeezer</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  a4nic8er <A HREF="/useremail/u/338826"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The "Lefties" never cease to amaze me with their "We know what's best for you" agendas.</div>In the United States, it seems to be the "righties" that are advocating censoring, filtering, monitoring, redirecting and injection of unsolicited data in the name of business, "content delivery models", terrorism and "protecting our children". The "lefties", in the form of the ACLU and EFF, are the ones that are opposing internet control. <br><br>On a related subject, Ted Stevens (R-AK) knows what's best for us. He demonstrated his amazing grasp of technology most articulately in his famous <A HREF="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f99PcP0aFNE"><b>"series of tubes"</b></a> speech. <br><small>--<br>The greatest dangers to liberty lurk in insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well-meaning but without understanding. -- Justice Louis D. Brandeis</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 22:09:43 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21352627</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/338826"><b>a4nic8er</b></A> : The "Lefties" never cease to amaze me with their "We know what's best for you" agendas.<br><br>Some people will always find a way around or through restrictions. All the Australian government will achieve (in the long run) is making law abiding citizens' lives more complicated and expensive, encourage an attitude of subversion, and create a new type of "illegal" activity. Stupid, narrow-minded bureaucrats.<br><br>Roll on Cloud computing, P2P, VPNs, & encryption. <br><small>--<br>If laughter can be contagious, why do we never hear of any mirth epidemics?</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:44:42 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21352456</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : DPI hardware and software is complex and intrusive. Once installed it becomes part of the infrastructure and will never be removed. No politician will ever have the balls to stand up and say it should be removed.<br><br>Protection is the responsibility of the household, not the whole population. The government have subsidized versions of various "Nanny" filter type products available for free from their website. Very few have been installed. Whether that is because very few people are interested I don't know. The are reports that it's difficult to configure and hard to remove. That is simply a technical issue. They could just as easily subsidize an hour for a computer tech to configure the software for the user. That would be by the user choice.<br><br>Most of the current parent population grew up since computers were introduced. Personal computers were unknown when I was in High School and university. I'm in the grandmotherly age group :( I've been on line since way before the World Wide Web right back to 300baud modems. I have never accidentally come across porn of any kind. I have a husband that would be counted as a risky user and will click on anything that looks "interesting" :) Children using my computers have restricted access and limited permissions on their user profiles. I'm a responsible guardian and I don't need the government to do it for me.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:04:55 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21352388</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : It's my belief most of the free world has not considered the downside to this shyte. Everyone wants to feel 'protected', but we all (here) see the downside to the equation. This all boils down to government and corporate control.<br><br>It's time for the general populace to wake up from their lovely (fantasy) dream.<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 20:50:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21352237</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  OZO <A HREF="/useremail/u/755055"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Internet filters will make Australians feel happy when they deal with similar things. Obviously they prefer do not see it at all and put their heads deeper into sand. Good luck with contemporary self-deception now under the umbrella of a fight with child pornography. You've found a good excuse to behave like an ostrich.<br> </div>I'm not sure what you mean there OZO. There is a lot of opposition to this proposal from the mainstream media, even the News Corporation papers have run the story in a negative way, not well, but they have accepted polls that demonstrate over 80% don't want this. www.ninemsn.com.au (website for one of the free to air TV channels) is a major exception. Cable coverage is not extensive here and it's very expensive. The majority of people rely on free to air radio and TV. The only support is coming from the right wing religious lobby groups who are very vocal and get the ears of the politicians. :mad:<br><br>The 2006-2007 figures for internet access show that 5.138 million households in Australia have Internet access. Of these, only 1.782 million or 34.7% have children under the age of 15. The population is about 22 million in 6 States. There are a lot of Australians that can't get dialup better than 9800 bps. Internet access is very expensive here. High fees and poor download limits. Most broadband is DSL. <br><br>The comments from politicians here confirm my opinion that they aren't technically competent and are getting advice mainly from the vendors of these systems.<br><br>The <b>Cyber Safety Working Group</b> has no consumer representatives, no civil liberties groups on it. Microsoft and Google are in the group along with the ISP groups and the heavy handed lobby groups. In Australia it is possible that some of these lobby groups are funded with government grants.<br><br>There are a lot of angry Australians and not just geeks.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 20:23:07 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21350696</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/755055"><b>OZO</b></A> : Internet filters will make Australians feel happy when they deal with similar things. Obviously they prefer do not see it at all and put their heads deeper into sand. Good luck with contemporary self-deception now under the umbrella of a fight with child pornography. You've found a good excuse to behave like an ostrich.<br><small>--<br>Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 15:13:47 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21348230</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1188503"><b>Longboard</b></A> : <b>this is pissing off the joe public.</b><br>Geez: I hope so.<br>The implications for this are so awful and intrusive.<br>Down here we have REALLY ramped up police /search and seizure/detention with out reason/ powers.<br>There have already been several fiascos: wrong house invaded, wrong person detained/ etc etc etc.<br><br>Journalists prosecuted<br>Libraries censored<br>Academics muzzled<br>Public servants silenced<br>Whistleblowers pilloried<br>Our FOI laws are a joke<br>Sports star "role" models behave like barbarians.<br><br>LOL our average CEO salaries went up by >20% as the recession bites.<br>Our pollies vote themselves ridiculous pay rises and pensions while our infrastructure rusts to unusable.<br>Our household/national debt is worse than the USA as a portion of GDP<br>We have put an absurd social engineering response in place to combat the financial meltdown. Unintended consequences everywhere...our dollar punished...pensioners funds frozen ...etc etc<br><br><u>BUT damn it...we will protect the citizens from the evils of a free web.</u><br><br>What a disgrace.<br>Australia used to be characterized by tolerance, respect, gentle self deprecating humour and ironic wit: a reasonable sense of self.<br>That has been replaced by outlandish jingoism, a misdirected sense of self importance, relentlessly boorish behaviour and lack of manners, we are in danger of inserting our heads a long way up where the sun don't shine.<br><br> :) Mini Rant off]]></description>
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<pubDate>Thu, 30 Oct 2008 03:45:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21345919</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : First thing I thought, hackers will win noble peace prizes for cracking what ever is put in place. Who will front the bill for reseaching/updating this filter because of exploits. What other filters will be <b>updated</b> or added along the way?<br><br>Sounds like I'm getting an extra bill before xmas, might need that govt payout they are talking about. <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 18:21:43 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21345890</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>The same thing could be used to protect children at the local PC. Indeed NetAlert is available as a free download from the Governement website for this purpose.<br><br>This is not an opt-out service. Under the current proposal all "illegal" content, mostly X and R rated porn will be filtered for all adults as a mandatory requirement. </div>The only advantage to that would be the infected advertising servers out there throwing pron at us won't. <br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>There is no opt-out from the main filter. :mad:<br><br>The escalation of this mandatory filtering is entirely political and relates to the balance of power in the Senate which is held by non major parties and neither party on its own can win a vote through the senate. The ISP filter is a condition of getting support from <b>one</b> of these independents. Poor excuse for secret censorship regimes.<br><br>There is no publication of what is censored :huh: <br><br>There is a Cyber Safety Working Group that includes Microsoft, Google, ISP bodies, various church groups, public servants. There is no representative for consumers or civil liberties groups.</div>Reminds me of my early days reading motorbike mags and the topics on doctors/govt/volvo putting together plans for the future of the car industry and what was deemed needed for us. I belieive that manual is the <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larousse_Gastronomique">Larousse_Gastronomique</a> of the govt nowdays.<br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>There's a lot of resistance. Quite a lot of coverage in the mainstream media as well as forums and the blogosphere. Newspaper and radio on line polls are showing almost consistently that more than 80% of consumers do not want secret censorship introduced.</div>Quite rightly so, forcing something of this magnitude is going to stir quite a few people up if it is forced. In the news articles, there was a light humour on communism, how funny democracy/communism seems to not be the cold war it used to be.<br><br><div class="bquote"><small>said by  ilago <A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>There's a huge thread on Whirlpool about this Norwegian if you'd like to read more about it.<br><br>This is the link for the first page of part 3.<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1077469" >forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re&middot;&middot;&middot;=1077469</A><br> </div>Thanks for the link. 50 pages and growing strong, might take a bit to read but a short look sounds like this is pissing off the joe public. <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 18:17:05 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21344264</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : The internet- "OUR LAST FREEDOM", once its controlled and taxed-you will never have it free again!<br><br>I am surprised Christians support censorship- they can only be free to practise as they like because the internet is NOT censored at present!<br><br>Internet freedom is just as important as freedom of speech or the press to me, there should be an amendment to the Constitution to guarantee this NOW!]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 13:27:40 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21343422</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1346679"><b>AB</b></A> : A previous Australian government foray into this area:<br><br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/security/soa/Teen-cracks-AU-84-million-porn-filter-in-30-minutes/0,130061744,339281500,00.htm" >www.zdnet.com.au/news/security/s&middot;&middot;&middot;0,00.htm</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 10:46:13 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21343388</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by manofsnow :</small><br><br>deep packet inspection solution from a company named Brilliant Digital</div>More:<br>&raquo;<A HREF="/forum/r21284471-Deep-Packet-Inspection-Plan-Defeats-Encryption-Compression">Deep Packet Inspection Plan Defeats Encryption & Compression</A><br>&raquo;<A HREF="/shownews/Why-Is-NYs-AG-Urging-ISPs-To-Embrace-Spyware-Company-98510">Why Is NY's AG Urging ISPs To Embrace Spyware Company?</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 10:40:05 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21343043</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/403861"><b>Mele20</b></A> : I don't get it. How will this censor anything? It doesn't stop Bittorrent. The more that censorship is pushed the greater the resistance. Everyone who isn't using Bittorrent will start.  ]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 09:30:43 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21342960</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1225580"><b>ilago</b></A> : The same thing could be used to protect children at the local PC. Indeed NetAlert is available as a free download from the Governement website for this purpose.<br><br>This is not an opt-out service. Under the current proposal all "illegal" content, mostly X and R rated porn will be filtered for all adults as a mandatory requirement. There is a further level of filter to make the internet suitable for children from 5 years old. You can opt-out of that filter. There is no opt-out from the main filter. :mad:<br><br>The escalation of this mandatory filtering is entirely political and relates to the balance of power in the Senate which is held by non major parties and neither party on its own can win a vote through the senate. The ISP filter is a condition of getting support from <b>one</b> of these independents. Poor excuse for secret censorship regimes.<br><br>There is no publication of what is censored :huh:<br><br>There is a Cyber Safety Working Group that includes Microsoft, Google, ISP bodies, various church groups, public servants. There is no representative for consumers or civil liberties groups.<br><br>There's a lot of resistance. Quite a lot of coverage in the mainstream media as well as forums and the blogosphere. Newspaper and radio on line polls are showing almost consistently that more than 80% of consumers do not want secret censorship introduced.<br><br>There's a huge thread on Whirlpool about this Norwegian if you'd like to read more about it.<br><br>This is the link for the first page of part 3.<br>&raquo;<A HREF="http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1077469" >forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re&middot;&middot;&middot;=1077469</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 09:05:11 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21342625</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1159554"><b>norwegian</b></A> : You can't help but think this will become one of those "We attempted to help", but failed in the approach ideas that the rest of us have to deal with.<br>Look at piracy, file sharing if you have to (but seeing as legal licences can be bought for software that does this, it seems pointless there) or spam or half the other things that need attention, including getting at least ADSL2+ to everyone. I hear Telstra are looking at finally releasing the network.<br><br>Hopefully, if it is implemented, they approach it with a theory, a filtered limited service while still having a choice for full blown use. I could see the kids in the world benefiting from this approach of limited viewing, schools etc there isn't a problem.<br><br>What the cost would be though with an over priced system already here, who knows. 10 mill wouldn't cover half the hardware/software needed to continue it on after purchase, let alone cover the initial outlay. <br><small>--<br>The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 06:41:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21342441</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <br><br>   Whoaaaaaa, hold that buggy.....whats this..related:<br><br>                 ***************************<br><br>   " deep packet inspection solution from a company named Brilliant Digital. The technology would analyze user packets, comparing transmitted user data to a master database of illegal content. The entertainment industry has been using the threat of child porn as a gateway toward forcing ISPs to act as content nannies, and Brilliant's solution is a major front-runner for the honor. The system, which begins trials this week in ""Australia,"" is being touted as an anti-piracy cure-all """""""<br><br>   &raquo;<A HREF="/shownews/New-ISP-Snooping-Tech-Doesnt-Work-With-BitTorrent-98714">New ISP Snooping Tech Doesn't Work With BitTorrent</A>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 02:52:14 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21342417</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1531837"><b>Its a Secret</b></A> : So it's here. I imagine this will spread like a virus. See my sig...<br><small>--<br>"In the future, that which is not mandatory will be illegal"</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 02:30:04 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21342362</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1163957"><b>Shriyash</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  Blackbird <A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>Once the systems are in place, debugged, and functioning, <br><b><i>then filtering of anything can simply be done on the basis of adding another applique or list of filtering parameters</i></b>... <br>regardless of the nature of that filtering.</div>exactly, not only will we not know what these self-serving interests have filtered, <i>but whats worse</i>,<br><b>we wont know that we dont know</b>.......hence falsely believing that the internet is 'free' and 'unrestricted'.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 01:56:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21342303</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1140294"><b>Blackbird</b></A> : Once the systems are in place, debugged, and functioning, then filtering of anything can simply be done on the basis of adding another applique or list of filtering parameters... regardless of the nature of that filtering.<br><br>Worldwide, we keep on permitting these shackles to be designed, tested, proofed, and installed (perhaps loosely at first). And yet we'll still be suprised when they're tightened, and we can do nothing to remedy it - particularly if we're asleep and unaware of the tightening. But one day, we'll wake to find our ability to exchange information of ANY kind will be enslaved, subject to the whims of the state.<br><br><blockquote><i>Human history 101 --<br><br>Since the dawn of human history...<br>- Lesson #1: any power and means to enslave people, in whatever forms, will always be exercised someday by somebody in authority for some reason.<br>- Lesson #2: it's always easier to prevent the chains of enslavement from being created and put in place than to remove them after they're around one's wrists and lives.<br>- Lesson #3: mankind simply will not learn from lessons #1 and #2 taught to earlier peoples.</blockquote></i><br><small>--<br>If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see...</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 01:29:49 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21341982</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : <A HREF="http://www.itworldcanada.com/a/News/f34c1a8b-4bdf-483d-9d21-b14f7f3fa6fb.html">IT World Canada</a><br>28 Oct 2008 - <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>In Australia's muddy Internet waters, you don't know what's being filtered</b><br><br>An Australian law expert has warned that under the government's proposed mandatory Internet content filtering scheme Australians will have no way of finding out what "illegal" content has been censored and blocked online,<br><br>The warning comes as Greens party Senator Scott Ludlam voiced concern over Communications minister Stephen Conroy's ambiguity regarding exactly what content will or won't be blocked, and who will be able to opt-out of the filtering.<br><br>Conroy's mandatory Internet filtering proposal caused a stir last week when it was revealed a member of his department had tried to censor severely critical comments made on the Whirlpool broadband forum by an Internode network engineer regarding the merits of ISP level filtering.<br><br>Graham Bassett is a barrister at Byron Bar Chambers and has taught Internet Law at Queensland University of Technology. Bassett told Computerworld Australia that under current non-digital censorship laws a schedule of content that has been censored is made available to the public. However no such freedom of information will be available for public access to monitor what is censored and blocked under the government's mandatory Internet filtering scheme.<br><br>Bassett pointed to a Freedom of Information (FOI) application lodged by the Electronic Frontiers Association (EFA) in February 2000 to obtain information about Internet content that had been the subject of a complaint to the then Australian Broadcasting Authority (now ACMA) under Internet censorship laws that came into force on January 1, 2000.<br><br>EFA chair Dale Clapperton told the magazine that the government refused to provide that information and the Administrative Appeals Tribunal accepted the government's argument that making that information public would undermine its work with international law enforcement agencies.<br><br>"The government at some stage along the way actually amended the Freedom of Information Act to say that this type of information could not be FOI'd," Clapperton said, warning that the ramifications of that ruling mean the list of Web sites put on Conroy's proposed blacklist will not be accessible to the public.<br><br>"We're not permitted to know what is on it - essentially we have to take their word for it. That was bad before when the blacklist was just being provided to manufacturers of filtering software, but now that the government is proposing to block access to everything on that blacklist by every Australian, it is unspeakably bad."<br><br>Bassett confirmed that Australians will have no recourse to determine what has been blocked, once it is on the blacklist. "If you have a situation where what is being banned is never made public, then how do we know that there hasn't been an extension beyond material which infringes censorship publication, for example a political party or some people that might be defined as a terrorist organization? The content becomes based upon whatever might be the whims of the people controlling those filters and the services that report to the filters," he said.<br><br>Bassett said the EFA's unsuccessful bid to access the ABA's list of banned online content under FOI laws means that particular legal avenue to establish what falls under mandatory filtering is a no through road. Australians, he reminded, have no explicit freedom of speech within the constitution.<br><br>"There are cases under the constitution where for example there is freedom of speech in relation to political expression, and that's been held in a number of cases. For example, in the future if you did find or were able to get evidence showing that some political group has been added to these filters, particularly at the ISP level that never gets seen by people, there might be some room for challenge there. But if those filters don't get published, how will you ever know?"<br><br>Bassett said the term "illegal" in an online context is ambiguous, where child pornography, defamatory material or content that violates copyright infringement could all be considered "illegal" content.<br><br>Clapperton warned that we are already seeing special interest groups pressuring the government to add so-called "illegal" content to the blacklist. "[Independent Senator Nick] Xenophon has said he wants to block access to Internet gambling sites because they are supposedly illegal; the copyright holders will want to block access to all the Web sites on their sh** list; the Muslim lobby groups will probably want to block access to the Catch The Fire Christian Ministries because they are inciting racial hatred; the Jewish lobby groups will want to block access to Frederick Tobin, any other holocaust-denying Web sites and Hamas; and the Family First Senator [Steve] Fielding has said he wants to block access to "pro-anorexia" Web sites.<br><br>"Every organization with an axe to grind and any kind of political clout will be lobbying the government to extend the blacklist to block access to whatever it is that pisses them off. They don't even tell the operators of a site that it has been blacklisted, which as a practical matter means there is no appeal for these decisions. In the case of a false positive it is really dependent on somebody discovering it by chance," he said.<br><br>Greens Senator Scott Ludlam grilled Senator Conroy during a Senate Estimates hearing last week over the details of what will be considered "illegal" under the filtering scheme, and what level of filtering users will be able to opt-out of. "I'm no clearer than I was before the conversation I had with the Minister last week. What I think they are trying to do is have two levels: One level where everything which is "illegal" would be blocked, and there would be a less restrictive list of material that would be automatically blocked and you can opt-out of that. I don't think they are all that clear themselves how that is going to be technically possible," he told Computerworld.<br><br>Ludlam questioned Conroy's comparison of Australia as following other countries such as the U.K., Canada and New Zealand where filtering of blacklist material had been introduced. "It got really muddy around the subject of what other countries were doing, and what would be considered mandatory and what would be opt-out. He really muddied the waters on the countries that they are trying to compare us to. My understanding is not a single one of them has instituted or even seriously tried to institute mandatory content blocking. As far as I am aware they are all trialling optional content blocking," he said.<br><br>"None of them are really having a proper go at mandatory filtering. When you look at the countries that are attempting mandatory filtering of "illegal" content on the Net, it's a very different set of countries: China, Burma, the UAE and other places."<br><br>One gaping chink in Conroy's filtering armor is its inability to block data transferred over peer-to-peer networks, which is estimated to account for upwards of 60 per cent of all Internet traffic.<br><br>Ludlam believes Conroy's lack of clarity over what will and won't be blocked can be attributed to the government still being at the early stage of trialling the filtering technology, which also explains why no path has yet been set for the mandatory filtering to make its way into legislation.<br><br>"My understanding is that the tests they have conducted to date weren't all that promising; I don't think they know for themselves exactly how this is going to work. My personal opinion is that it's probably going to fail, and if it doesn't fail it's going to be dangerous. In the meantime we should really be spending the money that they are putting towards this on old fashioned law enforcement, and on the education programs that we already have," he said.<br><br>"I'm all for opt-in blocking. If parents want to be able to choose the level of protection in their own homes or if people just basically don't want to run the risk of being exposed to objectionable material they should be given world-class opt-in provisions."<hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:32:44 EDT</pubDate>
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<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21341959</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <br><br>  The Land Of Oz pulling this......good golly Ms Molly....I am sincerely shocked !  I would expect it the U.S. but not in OZ...WoW !  Aussies are some of the nicest people in the world....straight forward.....with a love of freedom......an now this .<br>  Only the most feeble minded don't realize how much monitoring already goes on.  But oh wait....could this actually be placing a "Cap" on internet useage ?  Restricting P2P ?  Look at the Players behind this...who the hell are they to dictate Rules Of The Internet.<br>   An who will be burnt the most...the innocent non-savy internet users.<br>    ________________________________________________<br><br>  Hey Danny, good to see you again before I leave.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:25:39 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21341923</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : More details from <A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,24564687-8362,00.html">The Courier Mail</a><br>October 28, 2008 -  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>New internet filter imposed on all web surfers<br><br>Australian internet users will be subjected to the new nationwide World Wide Web filter, whether they want to participate in the scheme or not.</b><br><br>Web users will only be able to opt out of a secondary layer of internet censorship affecting adults-only material under the revised plan and both web filters will apply by default.<br><br>The admission, aired in the Senate last week, has been slammed by civil liberties and internet groups, who brand the change a "creeping" and "unprecedented" attack on personal freedom.<br><br>The Federal Government announced its ambitious web censorship plan in December 2007, committing $44.2 million and four years.<br><br>The filter was due to be implemented by internet service providers, such as Telstra BigPond and OptusNet, who would block inappropriate material as determined the <A HREF="http://www.acma.gov.au/">Australian Communications and Media Authority</a> (ACMA).<br><br>Following the announcements, ACMA conducted a laboratory trial of six internet software filters, reporting in June that the software had improved in accuracy and speed since a 2005 survey, but still had significant problems.<br><br>The six software filters slowed the speed of internet access down by at least 2 per cent and as much as 87 per cent, the report found. Filters also unnecessarily blocked access to between 1 and 8 per cent of legitimate sites - a glitch that would significantly restrict web access.<br><br>Despite these issues, Senator Conroy told a Senate Estimates Committee last week that the Government was now pursuing "live" trials of internet filters. Large and small internet service providers will be asked to participate by testing different filtering technology - hardware and software - on web-surfing volunteers.<br><br>Conroy says the live trials will be designed to "ensure that we do not have the impact that some wild claims make", although he admits the Government has not set benchmarks for what is an acceptable level of "overblocking" or unnecessarily banning websites.<br><br>The live trials are due to begin before the end of the year, with results due early next year.<br><br>Internet Industry Association chief executive Peter Coroneos says some ISPs are keen to participate in the trials as "they want to know for themselves what the issues are and they want to provide some quality input back to the Government on what the real issues are".<br><br>Senator Conroy says the Australian internet filter will block access to some sites for all Australian internet users, canning the option to opt out.<br><br>"We are talking about mandatory blocking, where possible, of illegal material," he says.<br><br>"We are in the early stages, but we are looking at two tiers: mandatory (blocking) of illegal material and an option for families to get a clean feed service if they wish.<br><br>"In terms of the policy, what we are investigating is whether it is possible to ensure that people can opt out of an ISP filter if they wanted to look at material that is legal, as opposed to not allowing an opt-out for material that is illegal."<br><br>Senator Conroy says guidelines for banned material in both tiers is yet to be determined, with controversial subjects such as euthanasia and pro-anorexia websites falling into grey legal areas.<br><br>Electronic Frontiers Association board member Colin Jacobs says this lack of information over which material will be banned is one of several concerns the civil liberties group has with the Government's proposal.<br><br>Mr Jacobs says the "creeping scope" of the internet filter was a serious cause for concern and would mean that any internet speed decrease as a result of the scheme would be felt by all Australian internet users.<br><br>It is a concern echoed by the System Administrators Guild of Australia, who argue that the scheme will increase the cost of internet access as ISPs pass on the cost of filtering websites.<br><br>SAGE president Donna Ashelford says the scheme will also fail to filter two-thirds of internet traffic, much of which is carried over peer-to-peer networks such as BitTorrent.<br><br>"Aside from the commercial and technical impact such legislation will have on a variety of sectors within the IT industry in Australia, technical Band-aids are invariably ineffective in addressing the root causes of social problems," Ashelford says.<hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:18:25 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21341904</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/0"><b>anon</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>From <A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,24568137-2862,00.html">The Herald Sun</a><br>October 29, 2008 -  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>AUSTRALIA will join China in implementing mandatory censoring of the internet under plans put forward by the Federal Government.</b><br><br>The revelations emerge as US tech giants Google, Microsoft and Yahoo, and a coalition of human rights and other groups unveiled a code of conduct aimed at safeguarding online freedom of speech and privacy. <hr></blockquote>Those two paragraphs would appear to be at odds with each other . . . .<br><br> <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The <A HREF="http://www.acl.org.au/">Australian Christian Lobby</a>, however, has welcomed the proposals. <hr></blockquote><br></div>Uh-oh. That's all I need to hear-- put me down for 'strongly against'.]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:14:27 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21341898</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1163957"><b>Shriyash</b></A> : <div class="bquote"><small>said by  SUMware <A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><IMG SRC="http://i.dslr.net/bb/profile.gif" ALT="See Profile" BORDER=0 WIDTH=16 HEIGHT=11></A> :</small><br><br>From <A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,24568137-2862,00.html">The Herald Sun</a><br>October 29, 2008 -  <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr>The government has declared it will not let internet users opt out of the proposed national internet filter.<br><br>The plan was first created as a way to combat child pronography and adult content, but could be extended to include controversial websites on euthanasia or anorexia.<hr></blockquote></div>This kind of talk and posturing by our so-called governments makes me very nervous.....<br>And who determines what is 'controversial' anyway?<br>Oh thats right, our loving government does.<br>They would never harm us, would they?]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:11:57 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21341854</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/658312"><b>danny9</b></A> : 1984 comes a few years later.<br>I wonder what else they'll chose to censor in the future.<br>I can see China doing this because of the type of government there but Australia kinda surprises me.<br><br>Thanks for the post SUMware.<br><small>--<br> VoicePulse 07/29/04</small>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:03:34 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Re: Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21341842</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/1578887"><b>KodiacZiller</b></A> : It's coming to the U.S. next.   Just wait.....]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:01:24 EDT</pubDate>
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<item>
<title>Australia To Implement Mandatory Internet Censorship</title>
<link>http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,21341775</link>
<description><![CDATA[<A HREF="/useremail/u/634007"><b>SUMware</b></A> : From <A HREF="http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,24568137-2862,00.html">The Herald Sun</a><br>October 29, 2008 - <blockquote><small>quote:</small><hr><b>AUSTRALIA will join China in implementing mandatory censoring of the internet under plans put forward by the Federal Government.</b><br><br>The revelations emerge as US tech giants Google, Microsoft and Yahoo, and a coalition of human rights and other groups unveiled a code of conduct aimed at safeguarding online freedom of speech and privacy.<br><br>The government has declared it will not let internet users opt out of the proposed national internet filter.<br><br>The plan was first created as a way to combat child pronography and adult content, but could be extended to include controversial websites on euthanasia or anorexia.<br><br>Communications minister Stephen Conroy revealed the mandatory censorship to the Senate estimates committee as the Global Network Initiative, bringing together leading companies, human rights organisations, academics and investors, committed the technology firms to "protect the freedom of expression and privacy rights of their users".<br><br>Mr Conroy said trials were yet to be carried out, but "we are talking about mandatory blocking, where possible, of illegal material."<br><br>The net nanny proposal was originally going to allow Australians who wanted uncensored access to the web the option of contacting their internet service provider to be excluded from the service.<br><br>Human Rights Watch has condemned internet censorship, and argued to the US Senate "there is a real danger of a Virtual Curtain dividing the internet, much as the Iron Curtain did during the Cold War, because some governments fear the potential of the internet, (and) want to control it"<br><br>Groups including the <A HREF="http://www.sage-au.org.au/display/SAGEAU/Home">System Administrators Guild of Australia</a> and <A HREF="http://www.efa.org.au/">Electronic Frontiers Australia</a> have attacked the proposal, saying it would unfairly restrict Australians' access to the web, slow internet speeds and raise the price of internet access.<br><br>EFA board member Colin Jacobs said it would have little effect on illegal internet content, including child pornography, as it would not cover file-sharing networks.<br><br>"If the Government would actually come out and say we're only targeting child pornography it would be a different debate," he said.<br><br>The technology companies' move, which follows criticism that the companies were assisting censorship of the internet in nations such as China, requires them to narrowly interpret government requests for information or censorship and to fight to minimise cooperation.<br><br>The initiative provides a systematic approach to "work together in resisting efforts by governments that seek to enlist companies in acts of censorship and surveillance that violate international standards", the participants said.<br><br>In a statement, Yahoo co-founder and chief executive Jerry Yang welcomed the new code of conduct.<br><br>"These principles provide a valuable roadmap for companies like Yahoo operating in markets where freedom of expression and privacy are unfairly restricted," he said.<br><br>"Yahoo was founded on the belief that promoting access to information can enrich people's lives, and the principles we unveil today reflect our determination that our actions match our values around the world."<br><br>Yahoo was thrust into the forefront of the online rights issue after the Californian company helped Chinese police identify cyber dissidents whose supposed crime was expressing their views online.<br><br>China exercises strict control over the internet, blocking sites linked to Chinese dissidents, the outlawed Falun Gong spiritual movement, the Tibetan government-in-exile and those with information on the 1989 Tiananmen massacre.<br><br>A number of US companies, including Microsoft, Cisco, Google and Yahoo, have been hauled before the US Congress in recent years and accused of complicity in building the "Great Firewall of China".<br><br>The <A HREF="http://www.acl.org.au/">Australian Christian Lobby</a>, however, has welcomed the proposals.<br><br>Managing director Jim Wallace said the measures were needed.<br><br>"The need to prevent access to illegal hard-core material and child pornography must be placed above the industry's desire for unfettered access," Mr Wallace said.<hr></blockquote>]]></description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 22:45:05 EDT</pubDate>
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